#and it needs to be a subplot ofc

[musclesandhammering]

Idk I feel like they could’ve made a really interesting plotline out of the fact that angels are mostly bound by bloodline when it comes to vessels, Jimmy Novak’s body keeps failing Cas, and the next vessel in line for him would’ve been Claire. It feels like there’s something unexplored there.

[befuddled-calico-whump]

So what if Ander had kept a journal when he first got to the place. And what if it were in the library. And Joy had found it, and read it. It has no mention of him being Sahota, but it does have “Ander” written at the front. What if Joy came up to Sahota and asked “Who is Ander?” What then?

as the resident Brooding Guy he'd probably answer with "Ander is dead."

...which isn't entirely a lie, symbolically speaking. He'd try to redirect further questions, but if she pushed him enough, he might give some more vague details that only make Joy more curious.

She might theorize with the rest of the crew, and talk about the possibility of a third teammate who was mysteriously killed, probably by Vic, possibly on purpose. Of course this would drive everyone up the wall if they ever found out that Ander is Sahota.

[username0204]

It's either Byler or just shitty writing - viewing the show as GA

At first I want to point something that I think is not talked about enough... The fact that Maya makes fun of how absurd it would be to have a canonically queer character fall in love and then sacrifice themself so their crush can live happily ever after in a het relationship is soooo funny to me, I literally couldn't believe she got away with it xd bc that's EXACTLY what anti-bylers think Will's arc is set up to be...

I'll get back to that later but first I'd like to share my journey with Byler as I was watching the show without interacting with the fandom... I started out probably similar to most people believing that Will is most likely gay and assuming Mike is straight and the writers are just handling Mike's and El's relationship very poorly since the beginning of S3 and I simply couldn't root for them ever since.

It's not a deep dive analysis of the subtext/parallels/queercoding, there are already plenty of it and you probably already know as much or more about it than I do rn. It's simply my experience as a member of GA (at first ofc, I'm here now after all, right? xd) and my thoughts on El<-Mike->Will dynamic as I was watching casually and how the only thing keeping me from being a Byler-truther was my general lack of trust in media when it comes to queer stories.

So if you're feeling some Byler-doubt and think that maybe you're overthinking Max's rainbow sleeves and it all might mean nothing then give it a read :) Maybe I can convince you that it's actually much simpler.

______________

Ok, here we go, that was my thoughts on the spot while watching:

S1 & S2

Nothing much to say here tbh... I just thought that both Mike/El and Mike/Will relationships are cute. I liked Mike, he seemed like a true "heart" when it comes to his friends. I liked how caring and protective he is of Will and kind to El (despite the few lash-outs but they are totally understandable in his situation). The cliff-jumping scene still haunts me though... what was that about and why they just never discuss it after?? It's true that when it comes to Will (both S1 and S2 plots were about Will tbh), Mike is always the first one to care or the one that the narrative focuses on, but back then I just assumed it's because he's the protagonist not because it's about Will specifically.

His admiration for El is totally understandable - she comes out of nowhere and helps with rescuing Will and "dies" protecting them - how can you not fall for that? Their "romance" seemed a little forced tbh, but they're cute so it's fine... it's TV, they need to sail the "ship" after all I guess. I just hoped it wouldn't outshine the friendships later on and... well jokes on me

S3

Although Mike's and El's relationship in the beginning of S3 is pretty realistic (given their age etc) and this season heavily leaned on the comedy part (not the best decision for some of the plots but that's just my opinion), the break-up part was really off... It's not how you handle "the break" in an endgame couple, not even in sitcoms!! The most famous being Rachel and Ross (not that they should have been the endgame but that's not the point) - their break-up is sad and emotional and they even had to introduce a comedic subplot of the rest of the gang bc without that it wouldn't be a sitcom episode. It was just really off how they portrayed Mike's and El's break-up as comedic... And I'm happy they broke up and the show itself seems to be happy about it too, I guess? Weird choice for an endgame couple... At the beginning of S3 I thought to myself "God, I really wouldn't like to be in a relationship with someone like Mike if that's how he is to his girlfriend" and that thought stayed with me till the very end of S4.

In contrast I really liked how serious they were about Will's and Mike's fight. The "it's not my fault you don't like girls" was a shocker - if he knows about Will being gay that's just homophobic (from S1 we know he stands up to homophobes so WTF writers?) and if he doesn't know... well that's just sus to me... overcompensating/projecting much? Maybe that scene was suppose to be more about hinting at Will's sexuality but it's still a weird choice for Mike's character... Both that scene and the Castle Byers scene broke me... But overall at that point I was just glad that they decided to put so much value on that in contrast to (what seemed to me as) "girl/boy crazy" phase of teenagehood. Let's be real, we all lost friends to that disease xd

But then they ended the season with Mike and El supposedly getting back together??? At that point I was sooo over it already and relieved that Mike at least didn't seem too into that idea, despite the fact that Byler as a possible canon romantic ship haven't crossed my mind yet.

S4

And then comes S4 and oh boy... At that point I still believed that the writers want Mike and El to be the endgame and are just horribly shitty with writing it. They are fake with each other, lie to each other, have nothing in common (except for fighting the evil from another dimension) and have the most ridiculous "obstacle" possible of Mike not being able to say "I love you" and gaslighting El about it. It just seemed to me like they couldn't come up with an arc for Mike and settled for the worst option possible. I remember thinking - if that's your endgame couple, you really fucked it up... how am I suppose to root for them if the obstacle is not some miscommunication (Mike and Will), trauma (Lucas and Max) or external factors (Nancy and Jonathan) but the very core of a relationship - to love and to feel loved? If they at least introduced some type of reason as to why Mike is not able to say that, I would be happy not to immediately assume that he just doesn't love her that way. But they didn't. Same thing happened between Nancy and Steve but we all know that already.

Mike's interactions with Will were super weird as well all season and didn't make much sense to me at that point. He's distant and I guess it can be explained by the fact that they didn't stay in touch... but even with that the whole airport hug and "we're friends!" seemed very harsh - similar to the "it's not my fault you don't like girls" from S3. Again I assumed that maybe Mike knows about Will being gay and (as most "I'm not homophobic but..." kind of people) just tries to make the "no homo" between them very clear. But once El is out of the picture Mike starts to act very different with Will (all of their heart-to-hearts, being open and vulnerable, the stares etc) and that theory just doesn't make sense anymore... if he was so "no homo" before, what changed?

And then the real kicker... unlike most here (I'd assume) I wasn't happy with how they handled Will's sexuality making itself undeniably canon with the van scene. It broke me and I hated that. Till that point I could just be misinterpreting his crush on Mike but the van scene??? They could have confirmed his sexuality in many different ways... TV has done it many times in many ways! And it's not just in media targeted towards queer audience... Shameless confirms Ian being gay in the very first episode with his brother finding gay magazine clippings! Or they could have introduce a new love interest as they did with Robin but nooooo - Will is confirmed gay by being in love with his best friend while trying to repair said best friend's relationship with his girlfriend. At that point I was really like "damn, those writers must really hate Will". I don't know about the GA but I really don't find the "gay-boy-heartbreak-suffering" that entertaining... If they really need to tick off the "gay-boy-character" box it's the worst way to do that... it's not giving depth - it's just torture at his point, he's been though enough to throw an "unrequited queer love for a bestie of 10yrs" on him as well.

And Mike's "confession" to El? Tbh I was over them long before that... I didn't even care. It was cheesy and off and forced and didn't make any sense whatsoever, I actually cringed the whole time - but I wasn't surprised at all, I just assumed once again that they just can't write them properly... whatever. But then the cabin scene... similar to S3 ending I was just glad that El was distant bc she had every right to be, I'm glad that me and El seem to finally be on the same page here. Funny that the love confession that apparently was the direct solution to "you don't say you love me" conflict didn't fix things and seemed to only make it worse. But on the other hand if I had to go though the same arc all over again in the next season I'll just loose it xd

______________

So that was my initial thoughts while watching the show...

I didn't read too much into it. All I took from it was "the endgame couple is horribly written", "Mike is weird to both Will and El", "apparently the writers decided that Will hasn't suffered enough already". With how queer or queercoded characters are treated in media that are not specifically targeted towards queer audience I really don't have much hope usually... I logically knew that Byler just would make more sense narratively and for the characters but I thought it's too good to be true.

But then I stumbled upon some edits and people pointing out all of Mike's queer coding throughout the series... Most of the "plot/narrative evidence" I was able to pick on myself but just blamed the writers. It's the soundtrack and the set/costume design that really sold it for me. There is no way that the "you're the heart", "in the closet", "one-way" sign and that ridiculous triangle pocket and many more are just a coincidence when you put it next to the writing. There is no way that the show can be so detail-oriented and fuck-up the writing so bad at the same time.

So what if all the stuff I interpreted as simply "bad writing" and my thoughts and feelings towards El<-Mike->Will are actually exactly what the writers intended? Funny thing that in S4 we see Mike from Will's perspective so it wouldn't be so crazy that the GA interprets Mike the same way Will does... the only exception being that the audience knows exactly what the fight between El and Mike was about.

If the rest of the crew is so talented maybe the writers are as well? Damn we already saw that with Robin and Steve in S3 - how they masterfully subverted every expectation and made it so much better than anyone imagined! They not only subverted expectations, they subverted queerbaiting and turned it into "straightbaiting". That's a true skill right there. And all the other relationships (not just romantic) are well written as well... only the El<-Mike->Will dynamic is so weirdly written... or is it on purpose? There is no way that a skilled team of writers could fuck up the "main couple" so bad and make you feel bad for the third-wheel for being so hopelessly and selflessly in love on accident.

It's true that some authors can accidentally make things seem not exactly how they intended... or simply just queerbait the shit out of it. But that's not the case here - it's not just the writers team, it's every other team that works for the show as well... so they just collectively misinterpreted the plot? It happened before with HP3: PoA where the director and actors assumed two besties to be gay for each other upon reading the source material - but that was a book adaptation and the story was not written by the people creating the adaptation (unlike the Duffer Brothers). It doesn't seem like queerbaiting as well... there is too much attention to detail here in subtext + they already subverted this with Steve and Robin, while usually the classic "queerbait" relies on 2 characters just having good chemistry and some sus dialogue or scenes that are usually also acknowledged by other characters (Sherlock I'm looking at you) but are usually portrayed as "straight" outside of their dynamic - and definitely it's not common for one of the party to be canonically in love with the other! (Supernatural was the worst about it and everyone knows it)

Also the social-media/PR part... that's where we come full circle to the interview from the beginning of this waaaay too long post xd There are a lot of sus posts from the official accounts that lean into Byler as well as some quotes from interviews... I won't go into that bc this is too long already. The point being, they know what they're doing... it's subtle enough not to be a spoiler but it's there, so it's not an accident. Also it's hard to believe that out of all people we will be queerbaited by an actual queer person (Noah being THE Byler shipper xd).

______________

Overall there are "theoretically" 4 ways Will's romantic arc can end in S5:

Will comes-out and learns that he is accepted and loved either way Well duh obviously but I don't think that will be all there is to it, he already knows that his family is accepting and Finn said in one of the interviews that Mike will probably accept Will... if that's the whole arc then it's already spoiled and they wouldn't let it slide in an interview, so there has to be more to it...

Will dies (aka bury your gays) Well... no xd Multiple people of the cast said that Will's ending will be happy + that would just mean that Maya's crazy idea applies to Will (which again, like with Finn, they wouldn't let it slide if that was the plot even if it applies to a different character - the only 2 canonically queer, mind you - so it's not hard to connect the dots) and it just shows how ridiculous and out of "the show's spirit" it would be. The fact that the cast makes fun of that arc should be proof enough that it just won't happen.

Will has a new love interest Unlikely... they said that there won't be any new crucial characters introduced in S5 (ofc they could be lying) but that just makes the whole "Will is in love with Mike" absolutely pointless plot-vise. Seriously what was the point then? And there's simply not enough time for the "painting shenanigans" resolution, rejection, getting over Mike, meeting someone else and falling for them. Especially since Mike and Will will be most likely teamed up in S5

Will's feelings are reciprocated by Mike This narratively makes most sense. Will is already canonically in love, Mike and El are not ok and she seems to be sooo done with his bullshit (me too sis), Will's confession makes Mike feel loved and he looks at Will the way I'm not sure I've looked at anyone ever tbh. Mike reciprocating the feelings would also explain all of his weird behavior in the previous seasons. El is finally out of a relationship that makes her feel like a "monster/garbage/someone's pet" and free to define herself for herself and not some "random nerd" - just like Max taught her (the first one to see El as her own person and encouraged her to find and be herself mind you... god I love this duo <3)

So out of all of these 4 ways only the last one actually addresses the "writing issues" and makes sense plot-vise and arc-vise. Any other solution will just prove that the writing is actually shit when it comes to this trio, especially if they keep El and Mike together as a couple.

TLDR: Byler is endgame... ...or the whole ST crew really fucked up - writers hate Will and all of the sudden can't write characters when it comes to Mike and also can't write romance when it comes to Mike and El but by some magical coincidence the set/costume designers, editors, PR, music composers and cast didn't get the memo about the plot from the writers while the directors are nowhere to be found to make it all make sense xd

[randomthefox]

I was just thinking that any other author would have added a little subplot with Tenna, in that he would have kept misgendering Kris because he had known them since they were a kid (and is also very 90s coded so ofc he wouldn't understand concepts that became mainstream much more recently), and people would have told them "no silly, Kris is neither a boy nor a girl!", or something like that, and part of Tenna's development would have been him coming to terms that Kris has changed. A scene to confirm once and for all that they're nonbinary to the embodiment of nostalgia and clinging to the past.

But instead Tenna calls Kris "they" with ease ("They were one of my first watchers!"), because it doesn't matter. Kris has always been ambiguous in their gender. And people can interpret this choice how they want, maybe they're canonically nonbinary, maybe it's because Kris still keeps the same ambiguous traits as Frisk such as the bright yellow skin, but the point is that Toby never raises attention to these details, because his purpose is not to shine the spotlight on representation, even less to pat himself on the back. He just writes what he wants. This is why his games are so lovable.

It's funny how most Other Media or fandom culture has been irony poisoned by stuff like that. So much of queer media is just entirely revolving around being queer, about the struggles with your sense of identity and how you define yourself, about "coming out" and other people's usually negative reactions to it and their arcs being based around a journey of acceptance. It's like imagine if every single story that even featured a black person just spent every single line of dialog whenever that character was on screen going "HEY, YOU'RE BLACK! ISN'T THAT CRAAAAAZZZYYY? HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH ALL THAT RACISM, MISTER BLACK PERSON?" that's what it's like whenever there's a queer character in any other piece of media.

But with Toby Fox's stories it just isn't a big deal. Nobody cares. Kris being they/them is as natural as them being a brunette. It doesn't even warrant acknowledging.

Now I do think, at least at first when chapter 1 was made and he probably didn't have much of a plan yet for where the story was going, that Kris was meant to be ambiguous for the sake of a player projection; the person playing the game could be someone of any gender, so he doesn't want to exclude their ability to project onto the character by using specific pronouns. But at this point Kris is CONSISTENTLY referred to by they/them pronouns by everyone in the cast. And considering the themes of character agency vs player avatar status, that's definitely a PART of Kris's character at this point. What it MEANS is certainly ambiguous. But it is undeniably a part of Kris's character.

Kris is they/them. And everybody just instantaneously knows that upon meeting Kris. There's no scene of needing to explain their fucking pronouns to people. There's no dumbass scene of some fuddy duddy going "but what's in your pants?" There's no weird implications of Toriel or Asgore viewing Kris as their assigned at birth gender deep down and accidentally slipping with how they refer to them. There's no drama. It's just normal.

Which, you know. For me. I thought was maybe kind of. THE POINT? OF THE LGBT MOVEMENT? To NORMALIZE ourselves? So that it ISN'T special or weird or unique? So that we can just EXIST and not have to worry about it? And this whole obsession with labeling ourselves is antithetical to that goal?

No one uses labels in Toby Fox's game because nobody fucking cares. Alphy's has a crush on Undyne AND Asgore, there's no quibbling over whether she's bi or pan or a lesbian since she ultimately ends up with Undyne. Susie and Noelle's relationship drama is based entirely around the juxtaposition and contrast of Noelle being a preppy rich girl daughter of a politician and Susie being a crude poor bully from the wrong side of the tracks, there's not even a hint of Carol throwing a snow storm over it because she's homophobic or whatever.

It's just not a big deal. Some people are queer. Just like some people are tall and some people are short. Nobody cares. Nobody thinks it's something to commentate on or take issue with or need to be explained to them. Nobody fusses over labels. People are just people, and they like different things and are different ways.

Speaking for myself, that's the way I think it should be.

[catboylister]

GNC/nonbinary lister is so powerful I love it. do you have any thoughts on his Awakening or how he expresses his gender beyond raiding rowan’s closet lol

YESS HI thanks for asking :]

so lister genderfluid hc came abt so i could project when i was still kinda questioning gender stuff lols, love him for that. it also got added as a little subplot to a frowan fic i drafted way back 2022 (and ive lwk forgotten most of it atp mb ledgend)

but the main thing was the ark working on the soundtrack for a universe city adaption, like a movie or something like that. and ofc, they meet aled and frances and i just thought it would be fun to see aled and lister interact since they're such opposites. scottish and welsh duos are peak and i am not biased at all.

anyways in terms of listers realisation in this, it happens when he keeps rambling to aled about how he thinks the mc (do they have a name? i can't remember at all, its been a while since i read rs) is really relatable to him and its nice to see something like that, and aled thinks that lister means in terms of gender so aled is just being polite and says he didnt know lister was nonbinary and asks what his pronouns are 😭

so lister just kind of sits there and has to think for a few minuets because no one has ever asked him that and hes never thought about it too much. like he understands a fair bit about being trans and gender expression, but obviously not everything. like he's never considered the idea hes not cus because he doesnt have gender dysphoria so bad he can never look at himself, and he doesnt hate being a guy. he hasnt really considered the idea that he was allowed to experiment with all that since hes always been a bit apathetic to it.

so like after that conversation i can imagine he gives it a deeper thought and tries to drop a few hints to jimmy that he wants to talk about it with him. except jimmy does not pick up on hints at all so that goes no where, and instead he turns to aled for advice and yeah :)

as for gender expression i think a lot of it is small subtle changes for a while. like using make up for fun rather than just because he has to for shows, and ofc his sense of style changes a bit too. in terms of coming out i think he jusy adds any pronouns to the twt bio one day and waits until fans take notice lols.

one of the things i felt a lot back then was that i didnt really "look" or "seem" like i was "actually" trans. so i kinda projected that a bit, in my head he doesnt feel the need to transition physically, he finds a lot of confidence in himself after figuring it all out and he doesnt care abt what other people think.

[gingergofastboatsmojito]

This rabbit hole

Is the key to everything. The Groundhog Day curse of the wizard-ess is OVER.

I might as well delete all my meta and just leave this one in my #Gingerpovs folder.

Let me explain:

She placed a curse, just like in the movie Groundhog Day. Storer steals ideas from his favorite screenwriters, sneaky lil sadist.

Later on, I will go over why that´s great Sydcarmy news, but first, hear me out:

The curse created a time loop that opened up in S2 when he threw his phone:

That´s when Carmy himself "activated", for lack of a better word, the curse, when he heard the words "I-I really love you," because not only is love a curse in Carmy´s life, but also because he had already decided by then that there was no place in his life for love, or -amusement or enjoyment-, and he was A-OK with that.

And this curse and time loop ended in S3, AKA: the "anticlimactic and very underwhelming" season.

Ofc C is the catalyst of it all. In the movie the "ex GF" is a tacit character and that subplot was never shot to begin with, it was just in one of the drafts of the original script for the studio executives only, who demanded an explanation to why Phil was stuck in a time loop (I´m sure Storer was aware of this trivia bc he´s a movie nerd, especially of movies from this era, in which he finds lots of inspo). On the show, she was unfortunately NOT TACIT at all.

C is the catalyst of it all because she said the cursed words.

A curse takes a wizard to place it (the accurate term for female wizard is "wizardess" or "witch"), and Michael described her as such in S2:

A few weeks ago, I pointed out that the basic concept of the show was that it was a circle. I have already talked about the many analogies of the show´s main plot with the circle of life (AKA the wheel) and the endless cycles, as in the consecutive seasons of a year (they are still in 2023 on the show for a reason and that should change in S4, which Sugar´s baby´s head already foreshadows in the trailer) that are the different phases of the series, being the next one: THE SPRINGTIME, because it´s what comes after Carmy´s Blue period, etc.

I had already noticed that the time had been RESET in 03x10, it was pretty obviously depicted HERE, actually.

But what I hadn´t noticed till now is that 2 circles form a LOOP:

We are talking about 2 seasons here. Seasons 2 and 3 were the loop, and now S4 is the springtime, the season of love. Clearly S3 was the winter metaphorically speaking. So S4 can´t be anything other than the next season.

Storer´s writing tends to be a full-circle kind of writing.

In S1, he started with a bad dream, and then by 01x08 he wrapped it in a pretty bow, with a dream-like vision. A good dream.

Each season is a circle for Storer

Seasons 2 & 3 overlapped, and none of those seasons went full circle, so a loop was created in storytelling terms. Not all cliffhangers are open endings per se. S1, for instance, ended in a way in which, if there had been no S2, that ending could have worked by itself just fine, and it was open enough to continue on in a next season if the show was renewed, which he didn´t know at the time of writing that season, so he gave S1 a full circle kind of season finale, a finale that could have worked on its own as a series finale, if need be. Although he obviously did it in a semi-open ending way, which gave him the chance to reopen the circle and resume the storytelling, if needed.

He reset the timer in S2,

He did that to start telling a whole new story, not the story of Carmy, Michael´s brother, who is this Carmy:

but the story of Carmy, the man, that is why all the flashbacks that gave us a glimpse of what Carmy´s past looked like were included in S2. We saw a lot of Michael and the whole Berzatto family dynamic from Carmy´s perspective, specifically.

There´s a reason why S2 opened with this other monologue where he talked about his family life:

So, S2, more precisely S2´s season finale, was the beginning of THE LOOP, which went on all throughout S3, till it finally closed in 03x10.

So this loop Carmy "walked into" began when he heard the L word in the walk-in

and ended when he said the T word.

Those words came from a very vulnerable place Carmy was at that night, he was raw, after this:

I always called S3 the Loop Season, the symbolism of the L opening and closing it made it quite obvious for me but technically that loop started when this song/score started playing in 02x10  and it continued playing all throughout 03x01 → APPENDIX META (read all of it because it´s more than just about the music). *can´t post another vid here, so I included an appendix for audio purposes.

S4 The Love Season

This season of love or springtime that will blossom in S4 is, like I said, metaphorical and symbolic, not literal, of course, because it will take place in the fall and the winter in the beginning. There is a chance that by 04x10, the TL has progressed enough to put the characters in the spring season of the following year (2024), but that´s not even that important. What´s important is the philosophical meaning of that season, which is the season that symbolically all the characters are going to go through in S4 and thus, complete the full cycle of nature, of the 4 seasons.

The springtime is CRUCIAL because JAW mentioned this movie:

*Correction: It wasn´t cut out of the film; it wasn´t even ever shot in the first place.

I also explained this in the appendix because I wanna loop back into this concept over and over, LOL! Read both pls.

Moving on:

The Groundhug day tradition is all about the winter (blue period/S3)

And the springtime is all about love and starting over (rosé period/S4). In other words, since the Groundhog Day ended on the show, as JAW confirmed, what follows is the springtime, the season of love.

Carmy´s shadow

Carmy´s shadow can´t be seen in the walk.in because the lighting is casting it exactly where the camera is, so we can´t see if he saw his shadow, making winter longer, meaning stepping into the wintertime that his blue period was, but what we can safely say is that symbolically Carmy did have a close encounter with his own shadow in that walk-in that night. He fought his own shadow and lost that round. That is why the man got stuck in that walk-in, and the one that walked out was the beast, The Bear, the name of that very episode, btw.

Of course, this was a whole process. The last glimpse of humanity we saw in Carmy was when he smoked his last cigarette in the back alley.

Groundhog Day is not a celebration, but a time loop in the cult movie. A curse, even. Plus Rita Syd, also has her own loopy behavior that needed to be overcome in S3.

Such a time loop ends when Phil Connors delivers his sincere monologue on the beauty of Groundhog Day, and his curse is lifted.

Phil was excellent at what he did as a weatherman, and that EXCELLENCE is what made him vulnerable to this curse in the first place.

Once stuck in the time loop of the curse, the ex GF, THE WIZARD/witch, placed on him, he symbolically relived the same second over and over in the middle of what he was doing

The point is that Phil only escapes once he begins using his powers/talents, for good instead of evil. Meaning: Once he realizes what his real purpose as a chef is.

The final act of winning Rita's heart—not through scheming, screaming

but through goodness—is what broke the cycle, as I also mentioned in the appendix bc why not?

My point is that now that Groundhog Day is over for Carmy and for "Ayo" as JAW said in the interview, we, Sydcarmy truthers should have NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT, because we already know what´s next and how it will end, whether that´s in S4, as I predict or in 5. I´m pretty sure S4 will be the Sydcarmy endgame going canon season finale and S5, if it exists, will be actual Sydcarmy established relationship that may or may not include a break up and subsequent reconciliation because, let´s face it, working together at a Michelin star restaurant and making a relationship work, and all the baggage, etc, can´t be easy.

Bonus track 1: DUH! Even Clairmy stands admit the show is about this:

Bonus track 2: The Star Dish, as I predicted LAST YEAR. The S4 poster either hides the star dish in plain sight as I predicted HERE (which is what I think is the most accurate prediction), OR the Plan B could be even better, because what if that is the Sydcarmy canon catalyst dish? Meaning: What if they lose the star the first time around, with that dish, Will Guidara EMP style, as I mentioned in the APPENDIX but since, as I explained in that meta about that sketching scene of S3, Carmy was thinking about the menu/Syd when he created it and made a sketch of it, as per usual when he thinks about THEIR MENU, and eventually in S4 he confesses SHE WAS HIS MUSE to create that dish and she goes: AWWWW and the transition to canon goes from there and that is why Storer put it on the poster of the season when that´s gonna happen? Wouldn´t that be 1000 times better? Probably... IDC how it happens, but this could be a cool and very Storer-friendly way if you ask me. I still believe they will win the star with a dish they create TOGETHER, either that one when they tweak it together, or the Coca Cola braised ribs with risotto that, with his help, will finally get the right amount of acid and be well balanced.

Credits, Sources & inspo:

Extra TV

Entertainment IE

TV Obsessive

Lady

Loop Lab

Danny Rubin himself

Remember to follow my tag #Gingerpovs 💋 & #Gingerpredictions

[orangepopsicles444]

i think bridgerton should add a few more episodes into the next seasons after s3 because it’s getting a little confusing with all these plots:

- benedict and lady tilley arnold

- kate and anthony (who we saw for like 10 minutes)

- francessca and john

- colin and pen ofc

- violet and lady danbury’s brother

- lady danbury and her brother

- eloise, cressida and penelope

- featherington’s traditional money problem schemes

- the mondrichs

im only pointing this out because they won’t be able to fit all of these and more (as more siblings come out) into 8 episodes. i think they might need to extend it to 12 to fully explore the subplots they try to put in the storyline.

buuuuut i’ll still be watching anyways 🫡🫶

maybe i just want more bridgerton and im just sad they only gave us four episodes i need more

[animalsalvationassociation]

I’ve caved & now the ASA Au is pivoting!!! 😅😘

(Please read to the end and vote on the poll!)

So I mentioned before that I wanted to go a more scientific route with my Octonauts Au, just because my writing usually delves into the fantasy/magic genres (I mean I write other things like Sci-Fi & Murder Mysteries, but there’s usually still a supernatural element to it).

However, this morning I found a lot of amazing inspiration that derives STRAIGHT from not only mythology but cryptozoology. I’ve talked it over with a moot and I believe I have a good idea of how I want to go about it.

So the story is going to be changing slightly. Ofc we’re gonna have our silly goofy Octonauts with their science fun, but I believe a criptid/monster subplot is just what we need!

Imagine a world where certain species have been believed to have gone extinct, only to find that most of those species exist and they’ve evolved. This will delve deeper into the scary/suspense aspect I’ve been looking for, allowing us to see if Kwazii’s monster tales might be telling some truths after all . . .

(Poll below)

PG-13: Mentions of Blood/Injuries, Violence, Use of weapons, Skipped Death Scenes (as in they’re mentioned but not included in the actual story), Scary/Suspenseful but not horribly traumatizing. (Think Superhero movies)

PG-14: Vivid Death Scenes (Most often they will be based off of memories), Heavy Weaponry, Horror Aspect (as in certain scenes are a little bit scarier than what they would be in a regular story, there’s more suspense and stakes), Lingering on the “edgier” side (idk how to explain it, it’s PG-14 for crying out loud) — (Think . . . Idk—Netflix has PG-14 which is on the cusp of being “Mature”, so go off that I guess)

Note:

Unfortunately in order to create the story I want to tell (even if it is a kids show) it has to feature at least some of these. However these two rating are literally based on violence only.

I don’t usually have swearing in my stories (it makes me uncomfortable to write unless it’s literally the only way the sentence flows/or it makes sense for the character, I only have a few exceptions however like Hell/Damn even then I still don’t use them often)

However keep in mind, we can have certain aspects of both. If you want a scarier story in the eyes of PG-13, we can do that. I’ll just be careful how I approach the subject.

(This is the only way I can actually explain how the story will play out by literally rating it. By giving it a rating most people are going to understand what it means and will judge based on their interests/age. Please be responsible and respectful. I am not responsible for your choices, especially if you are under the age of 13.)

[soymilkdoom]

i cant sleep so im going thru th free youtube movies n at first i watched marie antoinette (again) but now im watching this DUMBASS 80s movie thats basically the OG “shes the man” HELP MEEEEE NOT THE SOCK 😭😭😭 n this mf is always wearing button downs a vest n a tie … bro is like super ultra passing too with the fake deep voice .. LIKE TH GIRLS WANT HER .. BUT ALL TH GUYS IN THE GYM CLASS CALL HER “TULIP” … but ofc this shit has th romance subplot there has to be so is this lik mulan shit where its like gay-but-not-really-we’re-not-going-to-elaborate-on-that …. ALSO HOW DID THIS BITCH ENROLL IN A TOTALLY NEW SCHOOL BY HERSELF FAKING HER IDENTITY LIKE??? WHILE HER PARENTS R AWAY?? HOW TF DO U JUST DO THAT?????? its so late but i need to see this stupid shit thru

[angelsdean]

you probably noticed this but: right after dean finishes telling the CBGB story, he says “john friggin winchester” and takes a shot, and the jacting joices in that moment are… god. i mean the jacting joices are there the entire time ofc but they kinda give *overemphasizing this as a ‘cool john’ story* to me at first, but in that final moment—dean purses his lips, he shifts in his seat, he stares into the distance… he looks bitter. it’s like dean allows himself to feel bitter about this story for just a second, when sam and cas are no longer looking at him ://

(the exact moment i’m talking about is in a gifset you reposted recently)

Yea there's definitely a vibe throughout the whole thing that he's like, telling it as this "funny anecdote" but underneath there's more feelings brewing about this story. Like the story itself comes up because Sam prompts him to tell it, so it's not even Dean's first thought.

Even Cas asking them "You loved your father?" and Dean's response, "With all I had" is like, on the surface you can take that as a positive statement but it's also pretty vague when you really poke at it. It's like, okay and how much love for your father DID you have? It's not the same as a resounding "Yes, of course!" It's more, "I loved him as much as I personally could, given everything." And I do think Dean loved his father. Dean is full of love and he cares even when people might not deserve it. But, we also know he's no stranger to criticizing his father (as he literally says in the next breath that John was not winning any Dad of the year awards) and acknowledging that he was put through shit he did not deserve at way too young of an age.

Even him saying "damn if he wasn't there when we needed him" it's, I mean, he's literally criticized John for being a deadbeat and leaving them and not answering the phone and putting them in danger before so this line immediately rings hollow. And in the context of the scene it makes sense that he'd say this to Cas because Cas is specifically asking them about John as a way of understanding what a father is supposed to do. He prefaces his questions about John with the fact that HE never knew his father and thus has little experience with this whole Claire situation. He's looking for guidance, so it makes sense that Dean would over-embellish a little and want to paint John in a better light for the sake of telling Cas that "yea a good dad is there for their kids." Which we Know John wasn't always there for them. (Side note but all of this ALSO ties into Rowena and Crowley's subplot this episode, how she abandoned HER kid, wasn't there for him, left him vulnerable but is trying to be there now etc etc. Thematically it's an episode abt imperfect parents and their children). And the fact that Sam prompts the story to me says that Dean was probably just going to leave it at that, simply giving his advice to Cas that good dads are always there for their kids.

But anyways, all this to say, I can definitely see Dean feeling bitter about the story at the end there. Especially as the happy little mood drops and he's no longer trying to "give advice" and is reminded of the case, Claire, and how his own experiences actually relate to hers. It's like he finishes telling the story Sam prompted him to tell in the first place and he remembers, "yeah and that was fucked up. and dad might've been there THEN but what about all the other times he left us vulnerable and open to be preyed on. and now Claire is in the hands of this pseudo-guardian who is also putting her in dangerous and vulnerable situations, and and and."

[ovakinddarling]

Hihi!

I could have asked you this in the discord but why not share the wisdom with everyone???

So, as an upcoming artist and a producer of two big projects (that I KNOW are gonna be bangers) what tips do you have to give when it comes to story writing?

My biggest issue is inconsistency and way too many sub plots (hence the delay of the project iykyk wink wonk), so I'd like to see how you deal with similar issues.

Omg!! Ofc! I thought you’d never ask!!

*cracks knuckles*

So for Born Yesterday, I already settled on a story focusing on Jin and the way she handles her grief + Taking care of rescue vehicles. To keep consistent, I would highlight the importance of her grief since it’s the focus, then figure out how it would impact the rest of the characters and episodes.

But trully to keep this in mind, I just write it down in a way I don’t forget about it!

My non RCP project (Fly Trap) was a bit more of a hassle to create since I’ve been developing it for nearly a whole year, plus has its own magic system and all. But for this, I basically made the world and system first, characters second, since the characters are gonna be the ones making an impact in the world they’re put in.

Kinda mentioning this since BY and Fly Trap have different writing styles ahaha

But what I would do about the many subplots plus the inconsistencies is to roughly write it all down in order, all the arcs and everything on one sheet, sometimes even sketch out the key scenes of the story (which I did for BY). Once everything is put on paper, triage the scenes that aren’t really needed, the ones that don’t help the narrative or the ones that are a little repetitive. As you write, some ideas might come and others might go and thus you’ll find the product that will make the cut! Mostly how I found mine ahaha

I can’t show the stuff I’m writing cuz secrets /jjjjj

But for the scenes that’ll stand out the most in episode 1 for examples, I have made rough thumbnails of.

Another thing that helps is looking for patterns or recurring themes in those subplots. Sometimes, you can merge similar subplots or weave them into the main plot to tighten the story. And don’t forget to highlight the emotional beats. Pinpointing the scenes that carry the most weight can help you decide what’s worth keeping and what’s extra.

[jellyfish-grave]

GUYS!!!!!!!!!!!! I created GGG OCs ofc I did. Whatever. They're self inserts who wouldve thought. But i liked them sm i made them into actual lil guys independent of me and my bf. Ok look ::)

That's them together at least. Concept art!!!

The idea of them is that they have directly conflicting themes!!!! Lilian, the God of Misteries, enjoys making people forget connections between events, creating confusion and misunderstandings. But it's never really out of ill will! Usually, the intention behind it is to get Snipdoodle, the God of Collage, to stitch things back together and create beautiful endings!

At first, they were rivals and such, but eventually they found solace and purpose in each other's presence. ::]

But unfortunately...in their letter to Snipdoodle, King implies that Lilian truly prefers ignorance and confusion over everything, and that Snipdoodle is simply annoying them by solving every little issue they create! So Snipdoodle decides to leave his needle away and let Lilian create a bigger mess. But from Lilian's side...she becomes convinced that Snipdoodle doesn't want anything to do with her anymore!!!

It's your job, Godpoke, to solve this misunderstanding...and clear out the paths that Snipdoodle and Lilian have destroyed or blocked in between the multiple locations of their town! The civilians are unable to talk with them, and they need your help!

(YES there is a subplot about aromanticism that fits into the subplot of the entire game. NO I don't know if I'll ever actually put it into words. Goodbye and ty for reading my word vomit. Also feel free to ask about them.)

[pluckyredhead]

It's time for more Fourth World thoughts! Previously I've covered the comics of the 70s, 80s, and 90s. Now let's talk about the 2000s.

Orion (2000): AHHHHHHH. If you read no other Fourth World book (besides Kirby ofc), please read this one. It is so good and it is so epic and Orion makes so many well intentioned bad decisions and suffers so much. I devoured all 25 issues in 2 days and immediately wanted to reread it. Writing and art are both Walt Simonson and he gives this book such tragic grandeur. He also does my favorite thing which is multiple slow-burning subplots, some of which lasted so long that I was afraid they wouldn't be resolved, but no, every loose end is wrapped up in a satisfying (ish) way by the last issue and I love everyone in this bar. And the art! THE ART!!!

So basically, Orion kills Darkseid (again lol) and becomes the new ruler of Apokolips, and decides he is going to drag this planet over to the side of good kicking and screaming, which...doesn't work out so well for him. Ultimately he winds up semi-accidentally in possession of the Anti-Life Equation, which allows him to completely control people, so he uses it to force people to be good, which...baby, no. This series is like 40% Orion whump, 35% Orion being a badass, 5% Lightray and Orion being blatantly in love, 5% Scott and Orion making dramatic gestures of brotherly devotion, and 5% Orion wearing a stupid hat that I unironically wish I could buy and wear.

It looks like his helmet! I NEED IT.

Also, during his Stupid Hat Era, Orion briefly acquires an orphan girl sidekick, and like...look at my icon. This is my GREATEST WEAKNESS. Simonson, why did you come for me like that???

I have only two quibbles with this series:

1. It's the early 2000s so the only female characters of any significance (besides the aforementioned orphan girl sidekick) are femme fatales who are drawn in ludicrously skimpy outfits and sex inch heels. Now to be fair, Darkseid wears a miniskirt, but the degree of cheesecake of these two characters was ridiculous.

2. The last issue reveals that Scott possesses the Anti-Life Equation naturally, and he once accidentally killed dozens of people with it, and he's tormented by both of these things. Which...the actual issue this story is told in is really good, and I think it's a really interesting idea to have Scott possess the Equation, but I don't love the idea of weighing down this optimistic character who values freedom above all with such a traumatic history of, uh, accidental mass murder. He already grew up in a torture orphanage! Hasn't he suffered enough?!

But honestly, the overall series is so good that I'll let it slide. PLEASE READ ORION (2000). THANK YOU.

Seven Soldiers: Mister Miracle (2005): This is part of a set of miniseries Grant Morrison did: there was Seven Soldiers #0, and then 7 4-issue minis, one for each of the Soldiers, and then the whole story concluded in Seven Soldiers #1. I only read Seven Soldiers and the Mister Miracle miniseries because I'm a ridiculous person when it comes to reading comics, but I'm not going to read 24 issues that have nothing to do with the Fourth World.

Anyway, the Mister Miracle mini is actually about Shilo Norman, not Scott, and it's pretty good, even if Shilo should know perfectly well who Darkseid and his entourage are. The surrounding issues were incomprehensible, but maybe they would have made more sense if I had read all the other minis. On the other hand, maybe not...this is Morrison we're talking about, after all. Anyway talk about making comics as inaccessible as possible. Great job, everyone.

Death of the New Gods (2007): I knew right away this comic was going to be dogshit because of a) the title and b) the fact that it's a tie-in to the worst event DC has ever published, Countdown to Final Crisis, but hoo boy, it is DOGSHIT.

Basically, some mysterious being starts murdering New Gods, starting with Lightray and Barda, the latter of whom is murdered in the kitchen - you know, where women belong. Scott then dons a truly idiotic goth version of his costume and the rest of the book is mainly Scott, Orion, and Superman flailing around aimlessly and failing to figure out who the killer is while everyone from New Genesis and Apokolips is slaughtered. It's a truly godawful murder mystery in which implausible suspects are accused at absolute random (the Forever People, the pacifist hippies! Orion, the least sneaky being in existence!) even though Superman deduces the killer (sort of) in #5 and tells the other characters, so there's no reason for them to still be trying to solve it.

Anyway at the risk of ruining this comic for you (impossible, it comes pre-ruined), the killer turns out to be the Infinity Man, but he's actually being piloted by the Source, which is eradicating the New Gods and harvesting their energy in order to create a Fifth World. In #7, a horrified Scott is like "But I've worshiped you all my life! Don't you care about any of us?" and the Source is like, "Eh." The most spiritual and reverent aspect of the Fourth World, and Jim Starlin came along and just dropped a little turd right on top of it (after, of course, blatantly copying Darkseid when he created Thanos).

The art (also by Starlin) is hideous, and the plotting is atrocious, as he desperately tries to stretch six issues of story at best into eight, plus dragging each issue out over 30 pages instead of the normal 22. Everyone is wildly out of character. The only vaguely good thing about the book is that Scott and Orion finally get to spend a significant amount of time together, but given the context, I really don't think it's worth it.

In conclusion: "rocks fall, everyone dies" turns out to not be a good idea for a story! Who knew!

Final Crisis (2008): Well, after 16 years of successfully avoiding this story, I finally read it. You win this one, Morrison.

I have avoided Final Crisis since it came out because it felt so emblematic to me of the worst of late 2000s DC: literally constant crossovers with histrionic stakes, characters being slaughtered left and right, whatever the fuck they did to Mary Marvel in this story. I know it has a good reputation, and if I'm being honest, I do think the first 5 1/2 issues of it are pretty good. On the other hand, if I wasn't very familiar with 2000s DC, I think this would be a very confusing book to read, the final 1 1/2 issues dissolve into incomprehensible, self-indulgent nonsense full of obscure characters and OCs randomly dropped in just to make it all harder for the reader. I'm sorry, I know many people consider Morrison's habit of writing comics that you need a companion volume, twenty Wikipedia tabs, and a Reddit forum to understand to be a feature, not a bug, but it infuriates me. It's like the structure of the Seven Soldiers series(es) up above. Aren't comics impenetrable enough? Must we gatekeep with every page?

Anyway the New Gods stuff: they're all dead, but all the evil ones managed to land on Earth as disembodied souls, and are possessing various humans. The only good one is Orion, who dies at the very beginning when he is shot by Darkseid in the future shooting him with a bullet that travels back in time. I love goofy comics shit but for some reason this one strikes me as real dumb. Also Orion literally died twice in the comic that was about all the New Gods dying, so...hm.

Anyway the evil New Gods take over the planet with the Anti-Life Equation, and again, the pacing and storytelling are actually really good for most of this. But there's also all the worst the late 2000s had to offer, like Mary Marvel in the WORST costume of all time and Supergirl flashing panty shots at the reader while they beat each other up and call each other sluts, or Tawky Tawny being beaten to a pulp before ripping out Kalibak's entrails. Tawky fucking Tawny. SIGH. Also they keep miscoloring Shilo as white. NOT GREAT.

Honestly at this point I'm like begging for the New 52 to happen and put me out of my misery, so...good job, DC? I want to go back to Orion (2000), that was great.

Next up: the 2010s! Which is all the New Gods books, they haven't had a series yet this decade. We're almost done, gang.

[getouyuri]

subjecting u guys to my nausea-fueled ramblings so if this doesn’t make sense it’s cos im trying not to hurl 🤍

but basically I was really torn up over the bridgerton au with geto…

(everything here in parentheses is irrelevant to the rest of this post cos im just talking about my struggling. Anyways if I made him king of england I’d have to wasian-ify this man. ofc I could just go the edo period route for simplicity’s sake and make him the emperor of japan to make things more accurate considering he’s japanese but I reaaaaally wanted to stick with the whole england high society nonsense with the gossip and the ton and the dresses and whatnot. so again I was like omfg I. Have to wasian-ify him???&4 but then rmbred that I Don’t need to follow the exact footsteps of the george/charlotte bridgerton subplot duh. so now he’s a duke from a family that moved to london cos that makes more sense WHATEVER)

… until I figured it out and now im going the duke!geto route. i’m mostly intertwining his lore with george’s cos i want him and reader to be somewhat like george and charlotte but not like. an exact copy ofc cos i don’t just wanna copy scenes and call it a day LMAO

for those that are not in the know (read: haven’t watched the queen charlotte spinoff), basically geto’s situation will be this: he’s nobility. was born prematurely and wasn’t expected to live, but ofc he clearly pulled through. due to the time period it isn’t exactly possible for him to get a diagnosis (plus mental illness was. Well. frowned upon and whatnot) but he has some sort of illness where he often has extreme fits of mania, inexplicable terror that ‘the heavens are watching him,’ convulsions & seizures, bouts of depression & ‘insanity,’ incoherent ramblings, and more. since this illness of his would be frowned upon by the general public, geto is often kept out of the public eye to protect his family’s image and not allow anyone to discover his mental illness. he craves a simple life so he often farms in his free time and dresses down to mingle unrecognized with the public.

with that all put out there I can talk about the x reader aspect… you essentially take the place of charlotte in this situation. you’re dragged from your hometown simply due to the fact that you have an ‘even temperament’ (not really lmfao) and no interest in politics. in reality you’re very fiery but that’s not my focus point in this post. on paper you’re the perfect match for the duke, geto, so they’re thrown into an arranged marriage. geto is the more unwilling of the two because he hates the confines of his title and doesn’t want to accidentally reveal his illness to anyone

in bridgerton george and charlotte meet on their wedding day when she tried to run away but immm thinking that you run away on the day that you’re supposed to meet him before the two of you are forced into a courting stage Before the marriage in a few months…

you and your family arrive at the geto estate to speak with geto’s mother, geto himself nowhere to be seen, and you run off. you stumble into geto who’s atop his horse and he questions why you’re running, you rave on and on about how you’re convinced that your betrothed must be a beast/troll since no one will tell you anything about him. he just chuckles, dismounts and helps you up since you’re battered from running from the undergrowth in a dress and falling into a stream, and tells you that he’s not a beast. cue your embarrassment cos omfg you just dragged him. to his face

and then the fic goes on from there

[lafcadiosadventures]

Gladiator ii thoughts

i feel for Paul Mescal, alone in a green screen, fighting imaginary 3d monkeys

we get the fallacy of the good emperor vs the power abusers that ruin the imperial experience for everyone :(

the scrpt’s need of a white protag as a victim of imperialism (paul mescal is good, just pointing out a trope)

denzel is loads of fun

the gladiator riding a rhino carrying ancient rome boleadoras?!?!! 🥴 (not to mention the newspaper guy, but everyone saw that)

some scenes dealing with the transformation of submission and conquer into spectacle Rome (and others less ancient) had going on are actually good, (i liked hanno and macrinus’s exchanges, and the scene that ends with hanno reciting virgil) but sadly there’s a lot of effort to make the fights actually fun and engaging to the audience of the movie which, undermines that stance

scene borrowed from Spartacus (when Hanno attacks the emperors’s box from the arena! the walls of the spectacle blur and reach the untouchables!)(kubrick did it better. better editing, faster, less predictable)

Symbolic lavander sniffing (I actually like that, makes Lucilla look kiinda hypocritical)

i support Denzel Washington, giving it his all living his own shakespearean subplot (and for what)

(actual good scene between him and lucilla where he reveals he was Aurelius’s slave, apparently dismantling the myth of the good tyrant for a second)(but for what, it doesn’t last)

Hanno forgetting his anti imperialism and consequent hatred of his own lineage bc he learns the lesson you can be a Good Imperialist™️

all of hanno’s virtues being explained in hindsight bc of his noble lineage (oh ofc he was a natural leader, it was in his blood, he inherited all of that from marcus aurelius, lucilla and maximus)

finally, hanno’s final speech to the gladiators is very annoying, masses of pocs portrayed as followers of a charismatic member of the imperial power

[twinge-of-cosmicangst]

I have a half a Detty story arc for the reunion mini series that will never happen.

I do think Daniel and Betty would’ve married and had kids 100% but as they were only ever hinted at and not fully canonised, seeing them happily married would be anti climatic, but we can’t see them get together, because it’s been too long, so I think they’d be getting back together…

So I think it should start with Daniel in New York because as his mom is older, he has come back to lead Meade corporation. Wilhelmina is still editor and chief of Mode, and Marc with Willy’s old job, which was creative director I think. Tyler runs Player, he’s married to Amanda and they have a daughter (called Faye ofc) Amanda is now a full time fashion influencer on TikTok and Instagram. DJ has moved to New York and Daniel got him a job at mode as Mode app manager or something, he sleeps around a lot like Daniel did when he was younger (except he’s bi, because I say so) Wilhelmina but especially Marc are annoyed by DJ’s presence, and Marc sneerily refers to him as Mini Meade. Justin has been in quite a few broadway shows, but that doesn’t pay enough for New York rent these days, so he also works as a seamster at Mode and helps maintain the Mode’s closet. DJ and Justin are friends, even though Justin finds DJ to be entitled and slightly immature, they are also friends with the Mode’s current donut girl, as well as Daniel’s assistant, and there could be subplots with these guys, to appeal to the younger audience or whatever. At one point DJ will want a favour from Justin, and DJ will be like “Please we’re practically cousins” and Justin will be like “No we’re not” and then DJ will say “We’re cousins by marriage, cousins in-law?” and then Justin sighs and says “Even if that does count, we wont be for much longer, Daniel and AB are on the verge of divorce” and DJ insists that they won’t go through with it, and is actually weirdly defensive about it, Justin notices, and DJ confides that he spent a lot of time in London with Daniel and Betty, and they seemed liked the perfect couple, when he was a kid “If they can’t make it” he says “Who can?”

Daniel and Betty decided to go long distance but by the time the show starts, Betty said that they should separate, she didn’t really want to, but she was upset and angry, she did not want Daniel to go in the first place, Daniel can can see her and the kids quite a lot though because of use of a private jet (At some point in the season Betty will call Daniel out for his private jet usage because of the environment and they will have an argument about it, because that’s so them)

Betty takes a trip to New York with the kids to see everyone but it’s also a business trip, because as the publishing industry is failing, she needs investment, one of the investors she meets up with is Matt, who has taken over from his dad, which annoys Daniel, Daniel and Matt see more of each other these days then either of them would like, as they share a brother: Tyler, Tyler wants both of his brothers to get on, so he occasionally invites them both to football matches or to dinner, but they do not get along. Matt is married and there is no longer romantic feelings between him and Betty, even Daniel can see that, the real romantic rival is of course… Henry.

Betty bumps into Henry, because of course she does, and they agree to hang out as friends, somehow both Matt and Daniel hear about this, and Matt makes Daniel even more anxious then he already is, reminding him that Henry was Betty’s first love, that she always had a soft spot for him, and that she kissed him while she was dating Matt leading them to break up. This leads to Daniel confronting Betty, and Betty says it wasn’t a date (she is telling the truth, she actually talked to Henry about wanting to patch things up with Daniel) but his accusations anger her and she reminds him, he’s the one who left and moved out so she can date if she wants to. After their fight Daniel starts dating again out of spite, Betty hears about this probably via Marc.

Betty hears “I got you babe” on the radio, while working at home, she gets this look on her face and gets a taxi into the city centre”

Daniel is on a date with a model when he gets a call from Betty, he excuses himself then answers.

The fact that the last time they spoke they had a massive fight doesn’t seem to faze her and she says to him “Do you remember that time you fell for Sofia Reyes and then she publicly humiliated you on national television telling the whole of America, your whole relationship had been a farce, in aid of an article for her magazine”

Sounding confused and put out Daniel replies “I’m hardly likely to forget that”

“God, we hadn’t even known each other a year back then, I was miserable as well, I had fallen for Henry but I saw him kiss a model at the Christmas party”

“Did you call me up just to pine over Henry?” Daniel says sulkily.

Betty sighs “I’m not talking about Henry, I’m talking about us, Henry is just context, as is Sofia, she really did a number on you. Luckily for you, you had a wonderful assistant who booked you a date with Gisele, to cheer you up”

“No you didn’t” Daniel laughed.“I think I would remember if I had dated Gisele”

“Don’t you remember? She stood you up”

“Well if she stood me up I’m hardly going to remem-“ but then he pauses recalling “Wait, is that the night the paps were outside and you had dinner with me instead?”

“Mmhmm, except the restaurant was only selling that awful micro food that was popular at high end restaurants at the time, so we went to a place that I knew”

“And then you got me to sing for half off our dinner”

“Yep” Betty replies and then they both say ‘I’ve got you babe’ at the same time, then are both silent for a couple of seconds.

Daniel breaks the silence “Then we got drunk and got chips and went to Brooklyn bridge” he sighs “God how long ago was that?”

“Almost 18 years, a lifetime”

“It feels like yesterday”

“You said something to me that night”

“That you were better than any model”

“Yes, but you said something else, you said if I ever needed anyone to talk to, to come back to the bridge and call you, and you’d meet me here”

“Hey, you never took me up on that offer”

“It’s not too late is it?”

Daniel makes a shoddy excuse and abandons his date to meet Betty.

When he gets their Betty offers him some chips, he takes some “Someone’s feeling nostalgic tonight” he smiles.

“They’re stone cold” Betty says apologetically

“Still good though”

…………………………………………………………………………….

Sorry I’m getting a little carried away with that scene, Daniel and Betty make up at the bridge but don’t get back together because it’s not practical right now, throughout the mini series they both are dealing with various career issues, I don’t know about all that, I’m just here for the romance bit, they are both stressed out but especially Daniel as he struggles to run a major media empire which is struggling to adapt to modern times but then…

Betty gets a call from Daniel Junior towards the end of the season, he’s in tears “It’s Uncle Daniel he collapsed, they’re saying he’s had a heart attack”

If you think that sounds too dramatic, rewatch the show this is ugly Betty we’re talking about, someone needs to almost die, and Daniel in his 50s, whose father died from cardiac arrest is the perfect candidate.

So Betty rushes to the hospital, Daniel is in a induced coma, Betty is in tears, thinking he might die, she talks to him while he is in the coma “Shortly after your dad died you asked me his last words, I told you he asked for you mother and then his last sentence was asking me to get him some water, that was true but there was something else he said between asking for Claire and asking for water, he talked about you, us, I’m so sorry I didn’t tell you, but I was just your assistant back then, well friend too, but I was embarrassed, because he said I had to stick by you, that you needed me, that you’d be lost without me, it took us both a while to realise it, but he was right, he realised before us, but one thing Bradford didn’t know, what it took me even longer to realise, is that I’d be lost without you too” she takes Daniel’s hand and he wakes up.

………………………………………………………………………….

So happy ending they have a the kiss we’ve all been waiting for when Daniel recovers, both their career issues are sorted out etc…

Obviously the ‘Ugly’ in Ugly Betty was taken out in the series 4 finale but ‘Betty’ is bit boring so I was thinking the mini series would be called ‘Betty: Back in New York” or something.