#burning-curious snake primary with lion and badger models/somewhat burnt badger secondary with bird model

[wisteria-lodge]

lion primary + burnt secondary (bird secondary model) (badger secondary performance)

(note to OP - this is an ask that I substantially restructured in order to answer it properly. Everything's still here, just in a different order than how it was submitted.)

hope i’m not bothering you too much, but I was curious on your input from what i could be. i’ve been pretty torn these days on my sorting, but i think i’ve finally cracked the code somewhat w the help of your acc (ESPECIALLY the sort me asks. don’t even get me started…)

i think i’m a snake (maybe even burnt??) primary and burnt-ish??? lion secondary. i’m not sure what my models are—but i do get a badger feeling.

~ SECONDARY ~

i’m not a good decision maker. i usually ask “well what do you want” when going out w someone for food, or if i’m pressured to suggest smth, i’ll say smth generic i’m feeling for. 

if the people i love, or at least the people closest to me, don’t agree w smth i chose, then i’ll be like?? okay i guess i’ll just choose what you think… like the last time i went out w my best friend, i was getting dippin dots and chose banana split, but then my friend and our other friend (who works there) were baffled and said that was the worst flavor. i was like wait fr? huh… then… what do you guys recommend… they said chocolate. i got chocolate. i don’t rlly regret it bc it ended up tasting good, and i also got their approval in a way, i suppose.

Okay. Coming out of the gate with an "I hope I'm not bothering you" and then going into "I'm not a good decision maker," and THEN describing just being extremely passive... I'm thinking burnt Secondary. It's like you're not trusting yourself to problem-solve at all. It's possible that some of this inertia and tendency to gauge what the people around you are doing is coming from a burnt Primary... but it's just all so specific, small scale and practical that I'm leaning secondary for now.

(and thank you for the really specific, low-stakes examples, they will make things easier.)

i never rlly ask for anyone’s opinion tho. it feels bothersome to them, vulnerable to me, so rarely do i confide in someone’s thoughts. if i do, it’s at first subtle, and if that doesn’t work, fine, i’ll just awkwardly straight up say it. but that’s the last resort. usually i just try to rely on myself.

This rules out being a Burnt primary. Feeling like it's wrong to ask for help, bother people, take up space... that's a Burnt Secondary. I'm not sure what's underneath the burning now. You don't like asking for help (the Badger thing), you don't like asking subtly (the Snake thing) and you don't like just straight-up saying it (the Lion thing.) And that's really what a Burnt secondary means. Problem-solving methods don't bring you joy.

this comes a lot from my mom criticizing me when i try to ask for smth. i can hardly say anything to her without it being some comment. it’s so tiring. in the end, when i do have to, i’ll ask for help—but i try not to. and yet, i feel the right to ask for help sometimes, rlly only when it’s a matter of “you didn’t teach me how to do this, how should ik?! but you think i should somehow!” which is stupid. idk how you can expect someone to just instantly know how to do smth as if coded into them as a baby.

Yeah. This is how you burn a secondary. I'm sorry. From just this description, it sounds like you might be a Prep-work Secondary (Bird or Badger) and your mom might be an In-the-Moment Secondary (Lion or Snake.)

i feel bad when don’t do something my mom is asking me to do, like chores. i don’t particularly like washing dishes, but i do it in the end bc i think “mom would want me to, i have to help her,

I think this might just be a human thing. It could easily be coming from any primary.

ik she would hate it deep inside even if she represses any sort of emotion, blah blah."

That's an interesting thing to say about your mom, that almost certainly has bearing on her sorting. I'll keep that in mind.

i think another big example is continuing my college education on behalf of my mom bc i would just feel bad to let her down. i want peace. studying and having things shoved at you to do is not peace

Okay, college is a much *bigger* thing than just dishes, and tells me a little more about you. But what it tells me is just more burnt secondary stuff. If you don't know what flavor of Dippin Dots you want, you probably don't have any strong opinions about what you want to study, and you sadly seemed to be trapped in a cycle where everything is... kind of a chore, and a grind.

whenever i’m in public, i put on a cold exterior. better that people stay away from me and don’t bother me. the less for me to deal w the better. so, i’m generally p stoic, unless i absolutely have to plaster on a fake persona. it’s so hard to do tho, definitely rarely wanna ever keep up. very few people know my warmer side.

You're sounding very Actor Bird secondary here (or at least Bird secondary model.) You've got your armor, Stoic!You who is... safe. And Fake!You, which is a (presumably more cheerful, Badgery) performance that you hate.

when it comes to family, i just don’t wanna disappoint them mostly. there are moments where i will sacrifice myself, like when my cousin comes over sometimes to watch stuff w me, even if i’m tired, or don’t feel like it, i feel the need to follow through w it so i don’t let her down. i’d end up feeling guilty if i did.

Not wanting to disappoint your family is a feeling that can come from a lot of places. But in this case, it's not even lack of boundaries, it's more just 'not worth the fight.'

it always baffles me when my badger best friend is able to constantly put on a mask when she’s forced to socialize. and she’s forced to socialize a lot bc of her family. it would drive me insane.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure that you have a Badger performance that you absolutely hate.

i suppose i’m also scared of forming new attachments in general. i’m scared if i’m saying anything inappropriate, if i’m not fun, if i’ll possibly lose that person ig, and yet, i can cut off relationships quick, in a non direct way.

And here it is. There's a lot of fear, in both Burnt primaries and Burnt secondaries. And what you've got going on here... seems to be a version of 'if I do not try, then I cannot fail.' If you've got a persona designed to keep people away, then you don't have to worry about not being fun enough, not saying the right thing, not having to cut off the relationship (before they cut off you?) That sounds like it really, really hurts. I'm sorry.

~ PRIMARY ~

idrk what i want myself. it’s not like i don’t want to continue getting an education—i just don’t know what to do, so it feels pointless for the time being. but if not for college, i would feel more aimless, and i’d have to deal w any unwanted consequences from not going, whether it comes from my mom or the external world.

You feel very Internal to me. The only place the external world is making an appearance is as something that you occasionally have to *deal* with. The wanting connection, but feeling like it's too unsafe to go out and get it could point to Burnt Snake primary... or this sort of "pointless" but not necessarily unpleasant could point to a Lion primary who hasn't been *inspired* by anything yet.

in general i can be influenced by my people’s agenda and follow through w it. i would feel bad if i didn’t. like selfish. at the same time, i can be a selfish person. the person i care for most besides anyone else is me. i care about me, me, me. self-preservation is the biggest part of me, i think. i think another trait of snake primary is not caring for the general public. i don’t. my biggest priorities are myself, my care, and whoever i choose to care for at the moment.i’m just not someone who can serve [people] constantly, especially random people.

Fair enough. I would argue that everyone's first priority ought to be themselves, because if you're not doing that, how can you be doing much good anywhere else? If you're not taking care of yourself, that just means someone else is going to have to show up down the line to take care of you, probably after things have gotten much worse.

That said... I'm seeing the Snake. Feeling selfish that you're not adopting your loved one's "agenda" but very much not being a Badger.

i’m used to being alone and i like being alone… i’m someone who drifts from relationships easy. i don’t think much about it. sometimes i do feel a little guilty for not talking to some of my friends much but not rlly. it’s just something that… happens.

And then you say something like THIS which honestly sounds... so Lion. Of the four primaries, Lions are easily the most comfortable being loners. And when they're in a bad place (like if they've got a very burned secondary, for example) their instinct will be to get by themselves, and spend as much time alone as possible, in order to reconnect with themselves and heal.

but i’m getting sidetracked—i can be direct if something that tickles my morals seems off. even to the people i love. if my parents do smth i don’t agree w, i legit can’t help it, i burst out.

Um. That's Lion.

it’s a bit of a bad habit and gets me into trouble. i did this a lot as a kid too. i was actually a bit nasty as a kid, i think….

this happens more often than not w my family doe. i’m not nearly as explosive w anyone else. if someone does smth that messes w my morals, i act more calm about it, although most of the time, i just don’t bother to bring my thoughts.

Yeah, because you've got a pretty burnt secondary, so you'll be boiling over inside and still not DO anything... presumably until it gets really desperate, at which point you'll lash out with anything you think will work. Which at the moment mostly seems to be Lion secondary?

i think what confuses me the most is my rebellious nature. there are times where i will listen to my parents, and then those times where i will go against their beliefs. it’s an internal fight sometimes.

It is literally a fight between your primary and your secondary. You can hear your Lion primary say "DO THIS!" But your secondary says "we can't." And then if you feel the situation is important enough, the Lion primary finds a way to whip the burnt secondary into doing something. But it hurts.

i have a bit of a “don’t care” attitude. if there’s something i want that they don’t agree w, oh well.

"Sounds like a them problem, not a me problem." Very Lion.

this tends to come from my aesthetic. i like the darker side of things, which seems weird to my mom, and she always says “people won’t think you’re normal, you shouldn’t dress this way, it’s not right” but… i don’t care about what other people think… so why should i take that into consideration? some of our arguments come from this. what people think of me is not my problem. and what she thinks… sometimes… is also not my problem. this trips me up bc it’s rlly dependent. sometimes i care about what people close to me think and sometimes i don’t. sometimes i’m assured in myself, and a LOT of the times, i’m not. 

This also sounds like a Lion primary thing to me. Lions don't care about everything equally, they'd go crazy if they did. And it can be sometimes be unpredictable and surprising just WHAT will give you that "I guess we're doing to die on this hill" Lion primary PING. But without it pushing you along... it doesn't seem like you have much to fall back on.

earlier, [Mom and I] argued on how a wife should know how to do basic chores, and well, everyone should, but my mom said it to be exclusively to a woman, and how her husband will not want her if she can’t even do smth so simple. like washing dishes. my first thought is—why does it have to be the wife? and can’t the husband clean the stupid dishes himself if he cares so much? he should know too. basic chores are important to know, but setting it exclusively to one gender is so stupid. she ended up using me as an example bc of my distaste for washing dishes, saying that my future husband would say i’m not a real woman and would leave me. and my thoughts are that, well, he can leave, if i’m ever caught w someone like that! in fact, i wouldn’t ever be searching out for someone like that ever. gross. my mom is a badger primary confirmed??? maybe that’s why a lot of her beliefs are so off putting to me…

I mean, could be. That focus on tradition and the way things "should be" can be very Badger primary. Although if she's bottling up her emotions, could be a pretty extreme model.

(and yes, obviously everyone should know how to do basic chores like washing the dishes.)

 i follow through w my skincare routine even on a time crunch and my mom wants me to hurry up. it’s just too important to me—i might try to rush a little, but it’s gonna take an apocalypse to make me give up on any part of it.

You know, it's funny. But I've figured out who you remind me of. You're Stede Bonnet, from Our Flag Means Death. Trapped in a very traditional this-is-how-things-are-done environment, and with a secondary so burned that he just goes along with everything... but his primary still does assert itself in his love of dark things (pirates) and his love of clothes.

i also do what i want when i  want. like rn, technically i COULD be doing college work, but… meh. i don’t want to. but then eventually i’ll feel pressure to do it anyways. i’m usually on time w assignments even if i start them somewhat late, bc i hate to think of the consequences i’d be dealing w if i didn’t do anything.

I mean, that's how it can be with a Burnt secondary. You don't *want* to do the thing. But eh, I'll do it I guess.

i think, if i had one argument to be made against lion primary (if it counts as one), it would be that, while i don’t mind praise, it’s not smth i’m actively thinking of or searching for. i’m just not used to it. if i get it, i’m like, oh, thanks! it’s nice, but… idk… i don’t think it’s a huge part of me if a part at all.

Lion primaries are not out here searching for praise, unless they're very exploded. At the end of the day, I don't think anyone can run entirely on approval coming in from outside yourself. Not for long, anyway.

am i interesting? it’d be cool if i was. or just a classic?

You are interesting, actually. It's unusual to have such a strong, loud primary and such a burnt secondary. It makes me think that you're going to be just fine, especially when you finish school and get out on your own. The fiery Lion primary seems pretty clear to me, and I *suspect* you might have a Prep-work secondary... but unfortunately, at the moment. Too burned to tell.