#13 children of jaehaerys and alyssane

[hotd-brainrot]

On thirteen children of Jaehaerys and Alyssane and why I think they were shitty af

I want to preface this by saying this is only my opinion on the matter and you are free to disagree. Also that I do think they were decent rules but they were pretty bad parents, specifically to their daughters. However while I do see a bit part of the fandom hate on Viserys(rightfully), I feel like many people forget/don't know much about Jaehaers and Alyssane. So let's break it down, shall we?

So, their first child Aegon, dies merely days after being born, so he isn't relevant to this discussion. Daenerys, their second child, while she also died young, at only the age of 7, Jaehaerys already started showing his sexism towards her. Alyssane considered her an heir to the throne since she was their eldest at the time, but Jaeherys did not, preferring Aemon as his heir, through the male line.

To appease Alyssane, he he suggested they marry them so they could rule together, rendering Daenerys to queen consort. It did not come to pass because of Daenerys dying of the shivers.

Now for the topic of Aemon and Baelon I will say that for the most part, their parents seemed to have treated them fairly. Do I suspect it was because they were men? Yes. Will I give them some credit for it anyway? Sure. Non trumatized children were hard to come by in Targaryens it seems.

Next, we have Alyssa, who was also Baelor's wife. By Targaryen tradition, she should have married her brother Aemon, but due to how much she trailed after Baelon, Queen Alyssane decided she was going to let them marry. It is also important to note Alyssa was the only one of their daughters that was allowed /able to ride a dragon.

I do suspect Jaehaerys didn't think his daughters needed to learn how to ride a dragon and because they planned on marrying them off, to not take the dragon with them. -insert bombastic side eye-

Maegelle was another one of the "easy" daughters for them to deal with. She was descirbed as very pios and later became a septa. She also bridged a gap between Jaehaerys and Alyssane during their Quarrels.

Vaegon was...well. He was certainly not described to be a pleasant person and while it was planned for him to marry his sister Daella, he never seemed to be interested. Here we see first sign of neglect on Jaehaerys's part imo. While Alyssane said it seemed Vaegon and Daella don't seem to be well match, he continuously shrugged her off. Until Vaegon insulted Daella to tears by saying she can barely read and all she is good for is giving some lord dumb children. After that bethroal was broken.

He also never claimed a dragon of his own, which I find interesting with how only two generations later we have so many dragons, even with "less Targaryen blood". But I digress. He went to the Citadel and refused the title of the Prince of Dragonstone after Baelon died.

Now, Daella. She was pretty heavily autistic coded and likely had some developmental disorder as well as anxiety. (Which considering the amount of incest is probably a wonder it's that rare but I disgress) This is where I believe showrunners got the idea for how they wrote Helaena in the show. She was described as shy and often frightened. Her sister Saera loved to prank her and leave a cat in her room, of which Daella was deathly afraid of.

Now, Daella is one of the reasons I truly began to hate Jaehaerys and Alyssane. After her disastrous engagment to her brother, it was "difficult" for her to find a husband. There were several suitors but she didn't like them for one reason or the other.

Once she turned 16 though, Jaehaerys put his foot down. He told Alyssane to give her a choice of who to marry but that she must get married by the end of the year.(Because god forrbid she actually waits for the age when she may survive childbirth)

In the end, Daella choose Rodrik Arryn out of three suitors. Rodrik was 36 years old and Daella who was 16, was his second wife. She got pregnant two years later, in 82 AC and died giving birth to Aemma Arryn. (Daella also knew she was going to die as soon as she became pregnant which is why some speculate she was a dragon dreamer)

After that, Alyssane and Jaehaerys had their First Quarrel. Alyssane didn't understand why Daella was forced to be married so young despite clearly being such a sensitive child. Which tells you how fucking bad that was.

Next up was Saera. And oh boi, was she a lot. It is said her first word spoken was no and that she continously used it after that. It also seems she wanted more attention than Alyssane wanted to give or be able to provide because she often screamed until she got the attention. Alyssane even remarks on how difficult she was even as a child.

It seems that with all the children running around most of them were left with wet nurses and servant so they most ran around. Saera's pranks and jokes were often cruel, especially concerning her sister Daella, who was already often scared. Instead of addressing it properly or considering "oh shit maybe we should pay more attention to our 'problem child'" Jaehaerys and Alyssane ignored it.

Until she was revealed to have slept with three of her favorites, Ser Braxton Beesbury, Lord Roy Connington, and Jonah Mooton and declared she could marry all three of them like Maegor.

Jaehaerys' brilliant solution was to lock her up in her chambers and tell Alyssane he is disowning her. When Saera tried to escape by claiming a dragon, he improsoned her in the tower and later sent to the Silent Sisters as a punishment. (I do find it interesting that was enraged him the most was her trying to claim a dragon). And like. Yes, she was obviously wild at this point but for someone to be this wild at age 17, you must have really, really done something wrong.

Saera ended up escaping from Silent Sisters, and her time there sounds like torture, including shaving her head, beating her for when she broke the rules, etc. She killed a septa during her escape and became a prostitute.

Jaehaerys' answer to all that? "She has always been a whore." Wonderful parenting. I wish Alyssane had poisoned him right then and there.

Then, we have "problem daughter" number 2, Viserra. She was described as very beautiful, vain, and while also being very high spirited like Saera, she didn't scream for attention but got it in different ways.

She liked to make boys fight to her attention, one time notably telling two of them that whoever put a head in dragon's mouth could have her hand in marriage. Thankfully, dragonkeeper intervened before anything happened.

The only one she wanted to marry was her brother Baelon, though, who was widowed after the death of Alyssa. Alyssane thought she wanted to be queen rather than truly love Baelon. So she made a match for Viserra when she was only 15, to Theomore Manderly. I couldn't find his exact age, but Viserra would have been his 4th wife and 14 years prior his daughter was one of Alyssane's companion. It's safe to say he was not of appropriate age for a 15 yeat old.

To try and stop the betrothal, Viserra snuck into Baelon's room and laid on his bed naked. When he found her, he sent her away.

A day before she was supposed to be shipped off to her new husband, she snuck out again to have "one more night of fun and laughter". She and her friends had a horse race, in which she collided with another horse, fell off her saddle and broke her neck.

It seems Alyssane hated her daughters being even a bit ambitious, to a point where she marries them off waaay too young just to get them away from court. And I genuinely don't understand? Especially in terms of Viserra. She was only 15. The only explanation to me is that Alyssane was really scared she'd suceed and replace her as a queen one day, which is fucking ridiculous.

I will also take a moment to give Jaehaerys another point for being shitty here, since after Viserra was born, Alyssane told him she doesn't want to have any more children. Due to her health being influenced after giving birth 10 TIMES! Jaehaerys' answer? Our mother gave birth in her 40's! Their mother, who died in childbirth after giving Rogar Baratheon his second child, against advice of maesters. They also literally watched her die so. Extra point! Really, someone should have murdered this guy at this point.

Next, we have Gaemon, who was born prematurely and died only three months later. Which is not surprising considering my previous point. But did Jaehaerys stop trying to impregnate his wife? No!

So, next child was Valerion, who was another premature baby and died before his first nameday. Alyssane was left bedridden for 6 months after giving birth fo him.

Did Jaehaerys stop here? Also no folks! Because their mother gave birth at 46 years old before she died so surely Alyssane can too? Despite being pregnant for almost 12 years of her life at this point?

Their last child was Gael. She was described as "winter child" both because of being born in the winter and because the Queen was well past her spring years when she gave birth to her. She was frail and followed her mother everywhere. When she was 19, she disappeared. Some say ahe died from the fever, some that she had her heart broken by a traveling singer, who impregnated her. In that version of the story, she drowns herself after giving birth to a stillborn.

And that, folks concluded 13 children of Jaehaerys and Alyssane! It seems to me they did an okay job up until Alyssa and then things went more and more downhill. The sheer amount of mortality rate is insane, even for medival times. Like infants died yes, but grown children? The fact that Saera lived the longest simply by running off to a brothel is insane.

If you read up until this part, I appriciate it. God knows how fucking long this is. If anyone has any more question on any of them, my asks and dms are open

[writingsofwesteros]

https://www.tumblr.com/writingsofwesteros/757358229918564352/httpswwwtumblrcomwritingsofwesteros757343973

Mmmm after being fucked and bred by him all night long after his arrival, she starts to realize that her brother really is a dragon despite his bastard features. She won’t admit it by she loved how he used her for his own pleasure, the poor boy hadn’t see or been inside a cunt since he left her. Even after she passed out from the amount of pleasure, he continued fucking her, she’d forgive him tho since he at least cleaned his mess

Not before ensuring her cunt was filled with his seed

Perhaps if he continues to fuck her this good, she could can a change of heart but only privately ofc. She still loves the way she gets in his head when she teases him in front of everyone.

Jace won’t stop until she starts obeying him, even if it means for them to rival Jaehaerys and Alyssane’s 13 children

Jace took hours to calm down as he pushed deep one last time; his cum flooding in before leaking down his thick length when he pulled out.

She snuggled into his chest and he could not help but watch over her as she slept peacefully. His hands stroking her sides before he found himself drifting off too.

[lemonhemlock]

https://at.tumblr.com/lemonhemlock/who-do-you-think-aegon-and-helaena-would-have/fbwmjy6fnfsf

Tbh if trying to keep a monopoly on dragons is the problem for Targaryen princesses marrying outside of the family, then maaaaybe you could marry Helaena to one of the Hightower boys? Since the Hightowers are already backing up the Greens, then marrying Helaena to them keeps the dragons within the side, so to speak. And since cousin marriages are acceptable, then they wouldn't have problems with the Faith.

Another option could potentially be Helaena with the Starks? A marriage pact was part of the reason why the Starks eventually sided with the Blacks, so I could maybe see the Greens offering a marriage in the hopes they could get them on their side. It depends on who exactly is available at this time, however, and it does mean giving dragons to the North, which could be risky.

If we're talking about Aegon and his brothers, other options include the Lannisters (although since they're so ride and die for the Greens already, so maybe a marriage with them isn't essential) the Baratheons (definitely need to give them one of the Targtower boys), the Riverlands, or one of the other major Reach houses like the Tarlys, perhaps. Marriages with them could potentially pull them into the Greens' side and give them an easier time in the upcoming war.

Tbh if trying to keep a monopoly on dragons is the problem for Targaryen princesses marrying outside of the family, then maaaaybe you could marry Helaena to one of the Hightower boys? Since the Hightowers are already backing up the Greens, then marrying Helaena to them keeps the dragons within the side, so to speak. And since cousin marriages are acceptable, then they wouldn't have problems with the Faith.

They could, but while it keeps the dragons "in the family" for this generation, it creates potential problems down the line. Who knows what happens in 2-3 generations? The Velaryons proved very tricky to handle, so idk if Viserys (he still gets a say) would acquiesce to this. The green children also already have only 50% dragon blood (yes, I did feel like a eugenics scientist typing that). Jace and Luke have a bit less, but they get convenient betrothals with dragon-riders Baela and Rhaena.

I know this issue of "diluting the blood" sounds fucking ridiculous, but there is a twisted point to it. The Valyrians also intermarried and most likely not for shits and giggles, but to keep their dragons in the family. It's very likely that, in order to bond themselves in the first place, they resorted to blood rituals and human sacrifice. So, to not have to repeat that every other generation, it's easier to just resort to incest. Also, by the time of the Targaryens, it's possible this knowledge was lost, so incest is really all they have left.

It's interesting to note that the Targaryens sort of abandon this practice AFTER they lost their dragons, so it becomes less important, I guess. BUT it's also convenient that George brought this practice back both for Dany's parents and grandparents (perhaps to, forgive me, "strengthen her blood"). There is also a compelling theory that Dany's three dragon eggs belonged to her family anyway (they're Dreamfyre's eggs).

So, when it comes to Aegon & Helaena, I think the overriding fear here is that the greens have so few dragons to begin with, so their no 1 priority would be to acquire more of them. When Aegon & Helaena are betrothed, the greens have at most 3 dragons vs Rhaenyra's veritable fleet. If the betrothal happens before Helaena claims Dreamfyre, then they have 2. They must have hated those odds; if I were Alicent or Otto, I'd be shitting my pants.

Marrying two Targaryens does not automatically mean that their offspring would also be dragonriders (look at Jaehaerys' and Alyssane's children - 3 dragon-riders out of 13; on the other hand - 100% of Rhaenys' children were dragon-riders). But it does increase the odds. The eugenics scientist would also point out Aegon already has less dragon blood than Rhaenyra to pass to his children with a non-related bride (Aemma was also half-Targaryen). So, what I'm trying to say is that while a Hightower marriage for Helaena could theoretically work (for this generation at least), the odds of her and Aegon producing dragon riders are much better.

As for Aemond & Daeron, since there are no sisters for them to marry, yes, Lannister & Baratheon marriages are a must. The Lannisters are green stans no 1, they might feel offended if they pick the Tullys over them for a royal marriage, esp since Jason has 5 daughters. I'm not sure if the Tullys even have girls of marriageable age. Cregan Stark only has a young son.

Hope this helps!

[lemonhemlock]

About the f!aemond au - wouldn’t it be more likely that aemma is left alone and they don't immediately marry her off to daeron because her family might want to use her and daeron as bargaining chips for marriage pacts in the future? Wouldn't alicent (and otto) think it'd be a "waste" to just marry them to one another and basically throw away a potential ally? instead maybe daeron is the one who gets betrothed to one of the baratheon or lannister girls. And the fam can try to marry aemma off to somebody else for an extra alliance (im not sure who the potential suitors would be tho) . Overall tho I don't doubt that they (aemma/daeron) would get along and be a generally pleasant couple.

For funsies: what shall we name the aemma/daeron baby!!? We got a whole other parallel universe going on here folks

greetings & salutations, anon,

for your first point - i generally believe that targaryens do all they can to avoid marrying their dragon-riding princesses outside the family, because that would mean they have to give away their dragons as well. it also creates the very real possibility of creating another dragon-riding house, at least for a couple generations

thus if aemma married outside the family, it's possible her children would be dragon-riders as well, a la rhaenys and corlys. rhaenys marrying into the velaryons was always a huge headache for the targaryens, since she basically created a rival faction with 3 other dragon-riders. if she had more children, she'd have had more dragon-riders. she can just give them eggs herself (meleys is female). compared to house targaryen, they only had measly syrax and daemon's caraxes, who is a rogue element anyway. that's 3 to 2(1).

similarly, vhagar is female. aemma can just give her children and grandchildren eggs from vhagar & then what? they get along now, but a few generations down the line, who knows?

also (this is going to sound very slytherin-ish), but one of the main reasons targaryens are obsessed with the purity of their blood is because it's directly linked to their ability to control dragons. so, whenever possible, they intermarry (i.e. whenever there are enough princesses around). which is why, since both aemma & daeron are dragon-riders, the chances that they would produce other dragon-riding children would increase. bear in mind that this is not necessarily a given - jaehaerys & alysanne had 13 children, out of which only 3 had dragons. therefore, i think targaryens would like to maximize those chances as much as possible.

for your second point - names! well!! hmm!!! well, it can't be aegon or jaehaerys, since those are taken. it can't be visenya since that's cursed. it can't be viserys for obvious reasons. no rhae- names because there are a tonne of those already.

honestly, why not just base it off alicent's name. alyssa/alyssane if it's a girl (maybe even alys could work lmao) and if it's a boy there is the canon name aelyx, a targaryen from the century of blood 😎