#I’ve probably read more non-radfem theory than actual radfem theory honestly

[purpleradfeminista]

"Why is this kind of treatment never even CONSIDERED for a trans person?" cause dysphoria sufferers are considered non-responsive to talk therapy unlike BDD/anorexic patients who can enter remission. Maybe if you actually stepped out of the radfem bubble where y'all theorize out of your butts and did actual reading about older writings on transition you would know, duh. Read about John Money, Harry Benjamin, Magnus Hirshfield, Havelock Ellis, Virginia Prince, Lou Sullivan. If you truly care ofc

Ok sure I'll bite.

John Money: was a New Zealand psychologist, sexologist and author known for his research into sexual identity and biology of gender and his conduct towards vulnerable patients. [bolding mine] He was one of the first researchers to publish theories on the influence of societal constructs of gender on individual formation of gender identity. Money introduced the terms gender identity, gender role and sexual orientation and popularised the term paraphilia. He spent a considerable amount of his career in the USA.

Recent academic studies have criticized Money's work in many respects, particularly in regard to his involvement with the involuntary sex-reassignment of the child David Reimer, his forcing this child and his brother to simulate sex acts which Money photographed and the adult suicides of both brothers.

--I haven't read any of Money's work directly, but I have read the book that is about his patient victim David Reimer, who was surgically "turned into a girl" shortly after birth and used by Money to try and justify his opinions about gender reassignment. Reimer reports that "when living as Brenda, [he] did not identify as a girl. He was ostracized and bullied by peers (who dubbed him "cavewoman"), and neither frilly dresses nor female hormones made him feel female."

Harry Benjamin: seems to at least not have been a pedophile, and I suppose is best known for his treatment of Christine Jorgensen, but I find it significant that he only stepped in to help patients after other therapies had failed.

Magnus Hirshfield: I'm sort of puzzled as to why he's on your list, as his major body of work is about sex, and gay sex in particular, and his only contribution to what you're talking about appears to be some vague writing he did about "transvestitism".

Havelock Ellis: worth first noting that he was a eugenicist....but aside from that he appears to have been the first, or one of the first, to acknowledge that autogynephilia exists and is often a factor in the male desire to "transition".

"Aware of Hirschfeld's studies of transvestism, but disagreeing with his terminology, in 1913 Ellis proposed the term sexo-aesthetic inversion to describe the phenomenon. In 1920 he coined the term eonism, which he derived from the name of a historical figure, Chevalier d'Eon. Ellis explained:

On the psychic side, as I view it, the Eonist is embodying, in an extreme degree, the aesthetic attitude of imitation of, and identification with, the admired object. It is normal for a man to identify himself with the woman he loves. The Eonist carries that identification too far, stimulated by a sensitive and feminine element in himself which is associated with a rather defective virile sexuality on what may be a neurotic basis.

Ellis found eonism to be "a remarkably common anomaly", and "next in frequency to homosexuality among sexual deviations", and categorized it as "among the transitional or intermediate forms of sexuality". As in the Freudian tradition, Ellis postulated that a "too close attachment to the mother" may encourage eonism, but also considered that it "probably invokes some defective endocrine balance"."

Virginia Prince: I am honestly surprised that current TRAs even want to claim this person, as she seems to be like....completely saying the opposite of everything that TRAs claim to believe about their "gender identity".

"Prince helped popularize the term 'transgender', and erroneously asserted that she coined transgenderist and transgenderism, words which she meant to be understood as describing people who live as full-time women, but have no intention of having genital surgery. (bolding mine) Prince also consistently argued that transvestism is very firmly related to gender, as opposed to sex or sexuality.Her use of the term "femmiphile" related to the belief that the term "transvestite" had been corrupted, intending to underline the distinction between heterosexual crossdressers, who act because of their love of the feminine, and the homosexuals or transsexuals who may cross-dress. Although Prince identified with the concept of androgyny (stating in her autobiographical 100th issue that she could "…do [her] own thing whichever it is…"), she preferred to identify as Gynandrous. This, she explained, is because although 'Charles' still resides within her, "…the feminine is more important than the masculine." Prince's idea of a "true transvestite" was clearly distinguished from both the homosexual and the transsexual, claiming that true transvestites are "exclusively heterosexual... The transvestite values his male organs, enjoys using them and does not desire them removed." (bolding mine)

By the early 1970s, Prince and her approaches to crossdressing and transvestism were starting to gain criticism from transvestites and transsexuals, as well as sections of the gay and women's movements of the time. Controversy and criticism has arisen based on Prince's support for conventional societal norms such as marriage and the traditional family model, as well as the portrayal of traditional gender stereotypes. Her attempts to exclude transsexuals, homosexuals or fetishists from her normalization efforts of the practice of transvestism have also drawn much criticism.

Lou Sullivan: was an American author and activist known for his work on behalf of trans men. He was perhaps the first transgender man to publicly identify as gay, and is largely responsible for the modern understanding of sexual orientation and gender identity as distinct, unrelated concepts.

Sullivan was a pioneer of the grassroots female-to-male (FTM) movement and was instrumental in helping individuals obtain peer-support, counselling, endocrinological services and reconstructive surgery outside of gender dysphoria clinics. (bolding mine) He founded FTM International, one of the first organizations specifically for FTM individuals, and his activism and community work was a significant contributor to the rapid growth of the FTM community during the late 1980s.

From what I've read I don't know, it kind of sounds like Lou might have agreed with me that counselling should be a first step before handing out hormones like M&Ms. But unfortunately I can't ask him since he had the misfortune to decide to live as a gay man at the height of the AIDS epidemic.

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Ok I spent some time researching all those folks you mentioned. None of them seem to say, or have the opinion, that counselling is useless for people with gender dysphoria. So my question remains......why is it not considered as an option? You are telling me that it "doesn't work", but not one piece of the "research" you told me to do bears that out, and there is actually quite a LOT of research showing the reverse, that many folks who identify as transgender, especially young children, will eventually desist if supported with counselling but not given a social or physical transition. So. My question is still hanging out there. Thanks for providing me some interesting reading, however!

[azurowle]

It’s very telling that after I responded to her comments/reblogged, this person proceeded to clam the fuck up and not respond when I asked her to back up her assertations regarding the highlighted:

So! Maybe someone else can enlighten me.

In regards to what I’ve been recommended for “other options” for dealing with my dysphoria other than transition, here’s what I’ve been recommended and the result.

Claim: There are other treatments for gender dysphoria that are better than transitioning.

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Recommendation: Examine the root of my discomfort with being “female.”

Result: I have talked about this extensively with my therapists, even before I was aware I was a trans man. It never resolved the depression, lack of energy, mood swings, uncontrollable fury, or feelings of worthlessness I felt. I am damn well aware of some of the non-biological causes of my depression and anxiety. Turns out? Those started clearing up once I started taking testosterone, because SURPRISE! Depression and anxiety are comorbid with dysphoria! (The details of “why i am uncomfortable with being female” are none of your fucking business, because trans-exclusionary radfems love twisting words and drawing conclusions they have no damn right to draw with relation to trans men.)

Recommendation: Reading radical feminist literature and theory, both on Tumblr and from actual radfem academics.

Result: I got through about two and a half books from Dworkin, honestly the part where she implies bestiality and child-parent incest are necessary to break down gendered barriers was disgusting, plus she supported transition for trans folks (she also exploited the “Deep Throat” actress without fair compensation). Margaret Atwood is explicitly supportive of trans women, as is Kimberlè Crenshaw. By extension, I believe Margaret Daly and one other explicitly anti-trans radfem were Catholic nuns prior to becoming radfems, and apparently didn’t think ALL of their erroneous, prejudiced beliefs were worth examining in a critical light.

Recommendation: Exercise more/“eat right”.

Result: Oddly enough, a very ableist thing to say to someone who can barely find the strength to make it through the day for longer than a month! And, ironically enough, something that I can now do since I have the energy and clarity of mind to give a damn! 

Recommendation: Don’t drink alcohol or do drugs.

Result: Drinking was the only thing that would help me cope with the pain sometimes. Going without it still caused dissociation and complete and utter rage and self-loathing - and yes, it was just as bad as when I was drunk. 

Recommendation: Stay out of transgender circles.

Result: And what, talk to detransitioners? To other trans-exclusionary radfems? I went to the tags all the time looking for resources that were peer-reviewed, referrals to doctors, hell, even experimental ones. There was never anything in those tags - just a lot about how ~~happy they were~~ to be out of that situation and how the ~~evil nasty transieses~~ tricked them. I mostly leave detransitioners be unless they decide they want to get in on bullying trans women and trans men (at least when they’re not pressuring the trans men to detransition and become lesbians, political or otherwise), but they were just as harmful as the outright toxic trans-exclusionary radfems to me when I was struggling, even if they were some of the few people to show me anything even remotely resembling compassion.

Recommendation: Embrace being a lesbian (because clearly trans men are just confused lesbians /s).

Result: I’m bisexual, Karen. And even then my interest in women is purely sexual, not romantic. And a lot of that is probably a trauma reaction to the way that your side treated me when I was hurting and looking for help. Because now I’m always going to be questioning if a woman I’m dating or sleeping with actually sees me as a man, or just as a confused lesbian who needs to be saved from “her”self.

Recommendation: Pretending that I’m a Jedi and using “The Force” to cure my dysphoria. (Yes, this was an actual article I saw while traversing the detransition tag a few years ago. I should have screenshotted it.)

Result: Wat.

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Conclusion: Despite the (alleged) good intentions of the parties involved, there have been no other therapies that have specifically worked for me thus far other than transition.

And while people’s mental health and sexuality/gender are unique to them, to propose there are other alternatives when you have NO proof or solid platform, believing shit like this from people who weren’t psychiatrists nearly got me hospitalized.

So by all means, maybe there’s some peer-reviewed, official guidelines or resources to deal with dysphoria without transitioning. I haven’t found it yet and haven’t been looking, because looking while I was still in denial broke me.

So by all means, please. Enlighten me.

Because past me would have loved to have had anything. Recommendations to therapists in my area. Official and unbiased medical resources. Things like that. Instead I have scars in my breasts and a whole lot of trauma I’m still trying to sort through.