#Mormon Folk Healing

[brightgnosis]

Good evening! I’m a new follower and I have been really enjoying the takes on your blog. As an ex-Mormon, one thing that caught my eye was that you describe yourself as a Mormon folk practitioner. Do you mind elaborating either what that means to you or what that may entail? Only if you feel comfortable, of course! (Also, I sincerely hope you feel better soon!)

Hello! Your comment on one of my posts was very sweet, thank you! And no, I don't mind talking about Mormon Folk Healing at all! I think it's actually a really important part of our history that's been stolen from us that more people deserve to know about.

A lot of people are unaware that Mormonism is a syncretic religion that blends Christianity, Ceremonial Occultism, and English (and Welsh and Irish variants of) Cunningways. And as a part of that, they are likewise unaware that Old Mormonism had a rich healing practice which sat at the center of the faith until actually quite recently.

Mormon Healing was a blend of Indigenous and Old Word Herbal Healing + Prayer, Baptisms, and Oil Blessings based on Biblical scripture + English / Irish / Welsh Cunningways. And it formed two major lines of practice: A robust Temple Ritual and Liturgy practiced by both Lay and Clergy alike (predominantly centered around Nauvoo) -- and a robust Folk Healing Practice participated in predominantly by the Lay People (especially after Nauvoo was decentralized); neither were seen as superior, but the later rose out of the former based on accessibility as the Mormons moved Westward, and the Church actively supported both variations of the practice.

Originally it was practiced by all genders within the Church, and all were ordained with both Healing and Prophetic abilities during their Priesthood Blessings. As time progressed, though, it became the primary domain of Mormon Women even within the Temple variants- with them being the ones to not only perform Bathings and Baptisms, but also to even pass on the remaining liturgy to other women. Eventually, however, it was near-completely abandoned and the (by that time) two remaining rituals were consolidated under the male Priesthood entirely in the 1920's; the primary of those two remaining rituals is the Pouring of the Oil ceremony- which is a ceremony Elder DO has openly spoken about, at minimum, at least as recently as the 2010 General Conference.

If you're interested in learning more about the really interesting (and now nearly erased) magical syncretism of Mormonism and its rituals, I have quite a few suggestions and links floating around here as I putter about my own research into the topic- including 'Visions in a Seer Stone: Joseph Smith and the Making of the Book of Mormon' by William Davis and 'By Our Rites of Worship: Latter-Day Saint Views on Ritual in History, Scripture, and Practice', by Jonathan Stapley (my Library has more books on Mormonism in the "Abrahamic" category), plus my "Mormon Folk Healing" tag. There's also a lot still left in my que, since I'm actually still in the process of moving over content from my old blog.

I'm an ex-Mo Apostate, however. My name has been formally stricken from the records, and it took me a lot of time to get that formalized. So while I do practice these rituals, I don't personally do so as a Mormon- but from a historical perspective as someone whose Ancestors were some of the first Mormons and therefore claims Right-to-Magical-Inheritance. And I practice all of my Christian syncretic magics (including my likewise unsanctioned Braucherei) in the names of HaShem, Adam, and Chava, in honor of my Jewish ancestors from Ukraine.

Thank you for the well wish <3 I really appreciate it! If you have any more questions about it, feel free to ask them!

[whatbigotspost]

What I wish I could get people who didn’t grow up in highly controlled, abusive environments to understand is that when the very people who are forming you are really fucked up and bad, you are FULLY incapable of knowing that as a kid.

You’re not capable of “damn my dad is really not ok” or “mom is toxic” for a long time. It’s years and years of “this is life. That is my dad. That’s my mom. It’s just how it is.” It often takes PAINFUL moments of realization to get to even questioning if your life isn’t normal. In fact, in my experience, it takes many painful moments to eventually get you there. Someone at school making fun of your parents, for example. Or some outside caring adult noticing things they seem worried about w/ you. Or a particularly extreme incident of abuse that shakes you. Or reading/hearing someone recount abuse they survived and you get the sick realization it’s like a mirror for you.

When your primary caregivers are your means of survival, your brain wraps you in many many many protective layers of denial and whatever the fuck else it needs to so that you can get through it. Many folks like myself will spend more time healing ourselves as adults from our childhood than we spent in the childhood of trauma itself.

Also, let’s be real, an implication I’m making here is that a lot of folks don’t even pick at the thread of “was I abused?” because it’s too overwhelming all together. Or even “was my childhood kinda fucked up?”

Spoiler alert. If your childhood was kinda fucked up, it’s better, in the long run, to acknowledge and address that. Anyway, this is my characteristically long winded way of wanting to recommend some books on the subject that I have found deeply relatable and meaningful:

•Jeanette McCrurdy’s memoir I’m Glad My Mom Died: If you’d be up for an unflinching look at a deeply difficult childhood that includes physical, sexual, and emotional abuse and neglect and disordered eating in the Disney-universe, this is your read. Thinking about what McCurdy has had to overcome chills me to my core but the feelings she shares in words felt deeply relatable and I know they will help many.

•Ashley Ford’s memoir Somebody’s Daughter: I’m biased to love her because she’s a fellow Hoosier but you will love her too. Incredibly well written and deeply moving, Ford’s memoir covers her childhood with an abusive mother, a father in jail for rape, and survivorship of her own rape, as well as her place thriving now. She offers us such meaningful processing of her story. (And just writing style wise, this one is a mega fave.)

•Grace Cho’s memoir Tastes Like War: this one is a deep dive into Cho’s upbringing with a mother (who like one of my parents) has schizophrenia. I found her account of having a first hand seat to a parent’s mental health decline too relatable. The components of her story that focus on her mom’s experience of war and immigrating from Korea and the role that Korean food plays in their lives, are moving beyond words.

•Tara Westover’s memoir Educated: having been raised in a very isolated, survivalist Mormon family and tiny community in Idaho, Westover shares her personal story of a quest for escape and education. Although my family was nowhere nearly so unusual and isolated as Westover’s, I feel what she chronicles will highly resonate with anyone raised by someone who seeks to keep you away from “mainstream influences” or who is any level of survivalist.

Obviously, these are heavy reads and DO NOT check them out if you don’t feel in the right headspace. Each one moved me to tears multiple times. But if your awful/strange childhood and leaving it (them) behind makes you feel alone trust me YOU ARE NOT ALONE ❤️

I also recommend these reads for anyone who wants to see at an anecdotal level what are experiences of people raised in highly abusive environments and/or raised by parents struggling with mental illnesses and/or people raised in high control situations. Chances are you know/love someone who fits that description and you may gain helpful insights.

[idreamtofmanderleyagain]

The thing that I'm not a fan of when it comes to discourse surrounding monsterfucker or adjacent media (particularly when we are talking about pre-2000s media) is that I feel like a lot of the subtext of social transgression gets erased.

I think some of this comes from this misconception that we are a sexually liberated society, or from young folk's lack of cultural memory of sex as a much bigger taboo than it is now, particularly for women and queer folks. Because so many of these monsters in pop culture were sexy in subtext for a reason. We lived in a society where sex = danger, particularly if it's not the kind of sex or desire approved by white christian heteropatriarchy.

I don't know if the more wholesome image of the monster lover that people try to sell now is really a symptom of us healing from that. Because it's clear that we have absolutely not healed from our sexual anxieties, we've only focused that anxiety on heavily policing images that we feel "represent unhealthy or abusive relationships." And sure, sometimes these images do. However, in some ways, it feels like that effort translated into this image of the non-dangerous monster, which unfortunately feels like a monster that is made to be acceptable to the status quo.

All the best stories I have experienced about monster lovers (or stories that dance around that subtext) are stories with monsters that are vicious, frightening, unapologetic. Stories with blood and gore and/or a primal darkness, hedonism, etc.

Monsters in fiction are not DnD creatures. Monsters are more often metaphors for something society fears.

To be honest, I often don't see much of a difference between fandom's monster lovers and the deeply Mormon Edward Cullen in his khakis and a volvo, preserving his virginity until marriage. It's a repackage of sexy monsters into something acceptable and unchallenging. But like Edward Cullen, I don't know that defanging our monsters really ultimately avoids the problem of abuse at all.

[demoisverysexy]

Spongebob has fallen prey to the theological black hole in which he frames justice as people getting what they deserve, rather than getting what is needed. If justice is framed as returning good for good and evil for evil, then there is a moral imperative to do evil! This is a perversion of justice, which robs it of its force to do good in the world, and this version of justice is one that has been used to justify some of the worst crimes in human history, from the crusades to the holocaust, and by the most oppressive regimes in history, from queen Isabella's spain to reign of terror france to Soviet Russia. This mode of thinking, while common amongst religious folks, is not particular to christianity, and is common in most societies. What we need instead, I posit (following in the footsteps of Mormon theologian Adam S. Miller) that rather than viewing justice as a way to doll out punishment upon those who deserve it, to view justice as the moral imperative to do good in response to evil, always. It is a commitment to do what is needed rather than what is deserved (as though suffering is ever deserved!). When one does good, then what they need from me is for me to act in love to them. When one does evil, then what they need from me is still for me to act in love to them. This frames moral questions in a more useful way, as rather than viewing moral questions as a way to punish the wicked, it is viewed as the mechanism by which we can love others and to help them to do good themselves. This is a harder, more challenging form of morality, as it doesnt provide easy answers to the many competing problems that present themselves in the world. The work of figuring out how to act with good in response to the many things around us is not easy, and we will likely come up short. But it will give us the tools we need to heal the world, as opposed to perpetuating its hurt.

[valiantamm]

Sunday thoughts for Tumblrstake 10/8/2023

Hello folks. Couldn't sleep last night so hard that it became this morning. But I took the opportunity to do a little bit of study along with some extra things this afternoon.

Since I think you can get a lot out of studying on your own terms instead of just listening to my conclusions, I decided I'd just like to share some of the stuff I've been reading and listening to today:

TW for racism, systemic issues, etc.

Instagram/TikTok posts: (all from James Jones of Beyond the Block): On "thinking celestial"... What the Black Menaces teach us about idolatry "The sin next to murder" Mormon Stories Podcast Praying the gay away as a Mormon teen Stacey Harkey on “leaving” the Mormon Church

Dialogue Journal Truth and Reconciliation: Reflections on the Fortieth Anniversary of the LDS Church’s Lifting the Priesthood and Temple Restrictions for Black Mormons of African Descent (much less scary a read than the length of this title would lead you to believe) ---

My messy summary

Deuteronomy 5:9-10, KJV (italicized for emphasis)

9 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto [idols], nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me, 10 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments.

I always felt uncomfortable about this verse. Mentions of God as a jealous god feel harsh to me and others with a generally universalist perspective on salvation -- we have a desire for others to be able to be happy now and in the eternities.

Even further bothering me has been the generational guilt that is implied here -- a curse upon someone, their children, and their children's children. But today I see it not as a curse but an explanation of how familial trauma and societal inequality persist.

In the Truth and Reconciliation article I shared, our author brings up that the church might try modeling a truth and reconciliation intiative similar to the one which was used in the country of South Africa after the abolishment of Apartheid.

Obviously, a truth and reconciliation initiative is more complicated when those needing to ask for forgiveness may not have been guilty of the transgressions themselves but may be the present-day representatives of those persons, policies, and institutions responsible for the wrongs. Nevertheless, it seems that they must take the risk of responsibility if true healing is ever to take place.

As modern-day generations, it falls on us -- particularly us in positions of privelige and power, but also to anyone who feels "called to the work" -- to right the wrongs of the past. We may bear no personal blame for the events of the past, but without our own efforts, inequality and unkindness will persist.

I hope I (and you!) can believe and remember this quote from Nelson Mandela:

No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin, or his background, or his religion. People must learn to hate, and if they can learn to hate, they can be taught to love, for love comes more naturally to the human heart than its opposite.

[aftonfamilyvalues]

My mother was an abusive narcissist. Basically she knew I was being sexually abused by my father and was too afraid to leave him/hated me for the fact he was gross towards me and denied it, both parents spread lies to hide the abuse.

Once I was an adult and I’m 21 being threatened by my father over making a savings account, yea I’m reaching out to social workers (who ended up not believing me/took advantage of me as their new cash cow/I’m on disability…. Benefits initially went into my mother’s account. Guess that made her like a pimp I mean she didn’t work, stealing my benefit… they never had any intention of giving it to me.)

Talking to regular women and feminist women online is what got me out of that situation. Like telling me my rights and what resources.

I planned no contact. Father was stalking me via proxy and his police position. I was glad when she died. She obeyed him. She as an obedient slave, I would’ve had a stalker for life.

When my mom died, my Father made comments like “she won’t have to worry about wrinkles now. “ and “she was only 110 pounds.” Or “I’ll have 2 wives in the celestial kingdom now.”

I use to fantasize about killing them both. Sometimes I feel like I killed my mother, like I was her oxygen, she claimed I had special needs ; mormon church says women need to get married? But I’m too scared my father will violate me for having a bf/I dare in secret then ghost because I’m terrified he’s clearly painting a message that I’m “his.” Just tell everyone I’m autistic and don’t like to be touched and may never get married.

I feel anguish and sad I never experienced romantic love, wish I did as a teenager (because obvious men are unsafe, ) but murderous rage that basically my father felt entitled to my body, and humiliated about what that must say about me and my own mother didn’t care but she died because she was scared of folks finding out she was a horrible mother; nothing showed in the autopsy. Prior to her death she manically went around asking if I was talking about me, read my diary, started hitting me, etc.

This feel violated and my therapist suggested I needed romance to heal which makes me cringe because she didn’t get it, the concept of romantic love to me growing up was the concept of “pure” verses damaged Good’s. I did feel “clean” when I’d engage in sexuality at one point, (and the froze up and ghosted and felt guilty for hurting his feelings but I was scared/conscious I was being abused/had been molested and could go through that again, during intimate touching/never lead to sex or kissing because j froze. I feel a sense of sadness and regret and regret of never experienced a healthy sexuality or been the gate keeper of my own sexually.

I basically can never heal cause it all happened while I was developing. They claimed I was developmentally delayed.

My mother carried it to her grave but I think she died because I started telling the truth. I feel betrayed and angry even at her dying to preserve her image, as if she died on purpose.

I don’t think I’ll ever have a healthy sexuality, or ever feel good enough, and hate that I never got to grieve cause Instead seen as crazy for grieving/ evidently I just need to get over it and be “normal.” As if I even ever got to be normal in the first place.

I’m glad my mom died, somehow I always felt it was my job to save her when she abondoned me, constantly wanted her to like me, but she didn’t , felt guilty about going no contact, and scared, but it was a massive relief. And angry, cause now there no closure. I wish I had let her hit me, let her beat me, she couldn’t hid it anymore so she died.

this is one of the most awful things ive ever read, im so sorry you went through all this

[limeade-l3sbian]

Am I crazy or have men gotten… meaner? Like idk it feels so much worse to me.

I miss my innocence and I think there’s an increased loss of it in society in general.

I told this therapist I was sad I had not experienced romantic love. She dismissed me and said it could happen at any age which was frustrating because men are abusive.

My father would sexually abuse me and tell me “this is how guys are” and it traumatized me.

I was raised Mormon and confused by the fact I felt like if I dated someone who was also Mormon it would have to be in secret… which was confusing because I was taught by church and community that that my role as a woman was to get married. I was attracted to the idea I think of being “rescued”. He’d say “this is how guys are” but I dated someone in secret off and on/he wanted commitment I couldn’t give it /was scared I was being threatened.

Now I’m no contact in free and feel violated and disgusting I’m traumatized. I miss my innocence and I think it’s honestly triggering seeing how nasty men are because that’s how my father said they are and I miss the fantasy/hope of someone decent and I just feel numb by the gaslighting by how men are I’ve had therapists judge me for being single and suggest something I’d wrong with me.

I got dismissed. “It can happen at any age.” Men are terrifying they’re triggering to see online. Rating women /asking women to rate themselves; j make sure to,/have to take care of my mental health by not reading their comments. I often make my mental health worse when I engage. I do think they’re bad for mental health.

I feel frustrated that in therapy spaces they refuse to hold space for the trauma and suggest there’s “good men out there” I really think they’re more cruel now. I get negged more often. (I was constantly called beautiful growing up, the cruel comments as I’ve gotten older feel like a betrayal.)

I worry my sexuality can never heal. I know not to engage with men for my mental health. It never feels safe to grieve the betrayal because there’s a denial of male violence. Like “it can happen at any age” was what I was told, my therapist judged me as pitiful for being single. Frustrating.

I miss when I was Mormon, some folks really didn’t watch porn/ I didn’t realize I was being abused till I realized I didn’t believe sex before marriage was immoral, as long as it was loving; I realized what I was going home to was sexual abuse. I was not safe, so I pulled away after initiating. I feel traumatized. I never got to be an innocent child. Never had had someone hold space for me before and felt loved so initiated but there was like a mutuality in that and I feel anguish and rage and I’ve felt it ever since that day; I don’t trust anyone anymore. Not since I was 15.

My own father wanted to rape me my mother hated me.

I am so triggered by the misogyny, I know how men think because of how I was raised and in seeing politically and on social media (I was isolated I spent most my time on social media, since I was a teen, trying to reduce it in my early 30’s,) and I’m just feeling like it’s gotten so much worse. From TRA shit to the normalization of Bdsm and porn. I feel scared and unsafe most days.

The best thing that I can offer you in terms of your fears that things with men have gotten worse and that you have a feeling of unsafety is that you are not crazy or even, really, wrong. With the addition of your undeserved abuse suffered from your father, men have become significantly more aggressive in their attempts to control and "dominate" women.

This is done as a feeling of lack of control. Women have been gaining more and more, not just rights, but independence in thought, expression, and defiance. They know that as women, we are no longer beholden to their exception-filled contracts of marriage. You can fully be an independent woman who never needs the help of a man again, and that enrages them.

The "not all men" trope from therapists is a common one. It is their "job" to remain impartial and sit on the fence of such things. But just by feeling frustration from it, it's obvious you see how reductive this is.

That you have pulled off no contact and seek to heal is something that takes INSANE strength. Like, an insane amount of strength, anon. I hope you don't take all the steps you have already taken lightly. These are things that most people can only dream of pulling off, be that because they literally can't or they don't feel strong enough to.

It is okay to grieve the time you should have felt innocent. It was taken from you, no question, by a monster who used religious doctrine to insinuate that it was somehow a lesson on the real world. And if no one in your life has ever told you that they're sorry that these things happened to you or that you deserved better, I hope you hear me loud and clear. You did NOT deserve those horrors and I am so, so sorry that you were given the burden of such trauma. I am so sorry, anon.

So, what can you do?

These feelings of having not been cared for, having been loved, and not having someone hold space for you. These are often close associated with romantic relationships. I think that a way to continue your healing is to find groups of women to connect with. Whether that is through a sort of therapy circle of your past traumas, a group of women in which you share similar hobbies, etc..

I can't stress enough to you how connecting with women, face to face, healed a great deal of my own trauma. We spoke so freely with one another and there formed such a quick sisterhood. The feeling is unreal. I think this would be an amazing step for you. Social media picks and chooses what to show you to evoke shock, rage (rage-baiting has gotten so much worse), or laughter.

Even if it is also Tumblr, it would be best to step away from it. ESPECIALLY Tiktok and Twitter. I don't know if you use these, but they are cesspools of rage-baiting and causing stress. I took a break myself because the things the app was choosing to show me were meant to make me angry, and it did.

I've learned a lot about the ugly side of therapy from a lot of gyns on here, so I no longer feel right simply saying "and find a better therapist!" because that search might be traumatizing on its own. I understand the desire for love and to feel that special connection with someone. But it might be best, with you feeling so much internal turmoil, to focus on the wellness of your mind rather than the desires of the heart.

I wish I had more profound ideas and thoughts that could heal you as soon as you read this, but I'm just a silly little blogger woman trying to figure things out myself lol. But I wouldn't mind figuring all these things out with you and every other gyn here. <3

If you ever want to talk, I keep my DMs open at all times and if you just want to message through Ask, that's all good too. I wish you the absolute best of luck, anon.

[bookish-bi-mormon]

Question, what exactly do you mean when you say you’re a witch? I’m LDS too, but isn’t witchcraft not something we believe in/condone-? I’m not asking in a judgemental way. I just really like all of the witchy stuff that’s rising right now, but I can’t make myself believe that it does anything. I don’t want to do witchy things “for the aesthetic” or just for the intentions, because that seems disrespectful to the people who do think that magic is real. Thoughts? (Sorry if this is totally incomprehensible.)

Hi! This is a fantastic question, one I was asking myself just a few months ago (and honestly am still asking myself, cause I'm still figuring everything out)

A couple things you have to understand about me first:

My relationship with Mormonism is weird. I'm bi and nonbinary, and there are a few BIG tenets of the LDS Church* that I don't subscribe to. So what I have to say on the subject is definitely not church sanctioned. I still go to church pretty regularly but I'm planning my queer wedding right now, so my future with the church as an organization is a little uncertain. (I see from you're bio you're also a "progressive latter-day saint" but I still felt this disclaimer was important)

I just started researching Witchcraft in March, so my knowledge of the craft is extreeeemely limited. Witchcraft is a very complex, almost "create your own" buffet style kind of spiritual path. There are a few things that you need, but there a lot of different paths to follow and ways to be a witch, and I have just barely scratched the surface of all that.

So basically take everything I saw with a grain of salt, or two. Or like twenty handfuls of salt. I'm just trying to figure stuff out.

But I feel like the core of your question is "is being a witch contrary to Heavenly Father's commandments and/or can you practice witchcraft while not believing the same as other witches"

More under the cut cause this got LONG

I first got interested in the idea of "Mormon witchcraft" because there is a man named Josh Baird who is creating a Mormon Tarot deck (each card has figures from Mormon history). On his Patreon there is an article that mentions the "folk magic" that was common among early Saints in Josephs' day.

I found a book called "Early Mormonism and the Modern Worldview" by D. Michael Quinn that explores in depth these "magical" practices. Lucy Mack Smith was a palm reader. Seer stones, tarot cards, folk healing, etc was believed in by many.

There are a lot of things inherent to Mormonism that make it more "magical" than other protestant Christian religions. Namely: Patriarchal Blessings (fortune telling), Ordinances for those who have passed (affecting the afterlife), as well as other aspects of Temple worship (signs and marks). I've always felt the Priesthood was a kind of Magic.

The Temple Endowment was reportedly somewhat inspired by Joseph Smith's membership with Freemasonry, which I don't know much about but I know most of the world sees them as a kind of "occult" group.

I already know a lot of members of the church who practice Tarot and no one seems to think much of it, so why not branch out into other "witchy" practices?

I have felt the spirit more strongly in my life since I've started learning about the way witches think about the world, nature, and energies, and I've had a few tarot readings that I truly believe were led by Our Heavenly Parents.

Will it offend other witches?

Witch beliefs come in all shapes and colors, there are agnostic and atheist witches, who practice spells with a belief that the intentions and energies have an affect on themselves and the world around them, without any kind of divine intervention. Witchcraft is open to any kind of belief system (although, I suppose you do have to believe that the magic will do something, if only to yourself (like help you be more confident etc)).

There are Christian Witches who follow Jesus Christ and adapt wiccan/witchy** beliefs to their Christian life. If other Christians can do it, why not us? (I have a book by a Christian Witch that addresses the general Christian aversion/condemnation of witchcraft and I'd be happy to share their explanation with you, it's long though and this post is already super long

What is the difference between a prayer and a spell? A prayer is me connecting with God, thanking him, talking with Him about the things I need and want, and asking for His guidance. A Spell is very similar, it just also uses the physical elements of this world that Our Heavenly Parents created, to help ground and specify our desires and intentions. Spells can be used as a way to give thanks or a way to ask for things we feel we need. Tarot is one way to ask for guidance and get a more tangible answer (for me that helps a lot). It still takes intuition, and listening to the Spirit's voice. I don't believe that my intention and spells have any power to go against the Will of God, any more than my regular prayers do, but it does help me to feel more involved in the process.

Keep in mind I've done like 2 spells. And they were both about helping myself emotionally. Like I said, I'm pretty new at this.

Many witches will warn you of the need to purify, cleanse, and protect when you are doing spells. I don't have much experience with this, but I always say a prayer when I'm attempting anything magical. I ask Our Heavenly Parents to be with me, and I always close in the name of Jesus Christ. If there are malevolent spirits that can harm you while doing magic, I believe these prayers protect me. (please do more research on this I don't know, I need to do more research before I do more complex spells).

Feel free to DM me if you'd like to know more! I have a few books and discord servers I can share if you're interested. Learning is always good, even if (and maybe especially if) you discover this isn't the right path for you!

*I use "Mormon" and "LDS church" separately, one to mean the belief system set in motion by Joseph Smith in general, the other to specifically refer to the institution run from Salt Lake city, although I'm currently a member of both I find myself pulling from historical Mormon beliefs that have been out of practice in the church for a long time, so "Mormon" feels more apt to me. I know we were asked to stop using it but I'm not sure how else to refer to my belief system when it stretches outside of the Church's definitions.

**Wicca is a specific religion with a theology and covens and specific deities. Wiccans are witches, but not all witches are Wiccan. There are witches who follow norse, greek, egyptian, celtic etc. pantheons, among many many other types.

[exmormondragon]

I often spend time thinking about my parents and what they believe. Despite everything, I still want to get them out of the church and onto something else, almost literally anything else.

They’re important to me, after all. I know there’s people out there who join the church and use it to justify their abusive behaviors, who cherry-pick (as the Gospel is meant to be cherry picked, after all) so they can always be in the right and never be in the wrong.

But I also think there are people who are really, dearly trying to do the right thing, and also just stuck in a cult that tells them the right thing is to believe in guilt and repentance and the Mormon Afterlife. And they believe that and then they do the best they can within those terrible rules to teach their children and make the people around them happy. Somehow, despite the church I was raised in, my parents still managed to teach me to ask questions and think about the other side and be considerate and really try to understand other people. Ironically enough, that’s what eventually led me to leave the church, was trying really really hard to understand the people around me.

Specifically, I’ve been thinking about my dad, and how he talks about the ‘personal proof’ he’s been given, of the countless small things that add up to God but can never be proven to someone else. And I think about my mom’s own experiences with what was supposedly the devil in her room, a dark feeling that she told to get behind her and then she felt relief.

And how do I explain to them that I just… the gospel itself, the doctrine and the popular folk beliefs, the fact that you can never Prove God or else the Test is Invalid.

It just means that in the end, it doesn’t matter, does it?

If good things that happen to you because of the Gospel aren’t any more statistically likely (because then it could be proven that believing in God means you get in less car accidents or whatever)

If the bad things can’t be prevented to any reliable degree

If I can never know for certain that something I ask for will be guaranteed, if a prayer or a blessing will never for certain heal the sick or move a mountain or make you happy

If there’s not a single thing I can attribute solely to God, as opposed to the kindness of strangers or my own ability or random chance

Not a single thing that will be different aside from what I attribute good things to

What’s the point?

[fairy25]

I hope it’s ok to ask for advice? I’m heterosexual, but a separatist due to being a CSA survivor and most men being insecure porn losers…. And I don’t think my therapist supports separatism and lives in whimsical fantasy land because I don’t understand why I can’t just have my feelings without an assumption attached that being sad about something =wanting something back. Men are not good for my mental health, I only engage with them when I am looking to be harmed (self harming… ) and I want to stop doing that. I think I need a new therapist but the break up is hard.

Those links were really helpful, especially the “you don’t need sex or a man to be happy” thanks for that. I’m still grieving the loss of my innocence, my sexuality, and childhood… so I told my therapist I was sad I didn’t experience romantic love (ex Mormon but my father sexual abused me, didn’t want me to have eternal love or happiness, would humiliate me and assert dominance, he wanted me fully dependent on him like a mini wife, and made the false claim to everyone I was autistic and couldn’t live independently and had my mother complicit with that and would gaslight and abuse me…. He would claim this is how guys are and threaten and humiliate me privately, and humiliate me publicly, if a guy do much as talked to me or gave me any kind of attention and if I engaged ir like him or the attention.

I almost had my first kiss, but froze up and was scared because of my father… we were intimate for a moment and it felt loving, before getting close to kissing. I never felt loved before, I always wanted to feel loved for real. My heart is broken and I’m so but I know I don’t need that to be happy. That I can create my own happiness.

My therapist didn’t see my grief just protected her idea of what she finds happy and fulfilling (she’d a grandmother,) that “it can happen at any age” when I said I don’t experience romantic love.

I’ve been passive aggressive towards her ever since because I feel like In order to heal, I need to center myself and de-center societal expectations such as having a bf or husband, and having kids, and jusf center me because when I center myself I am happy, but I’m scared to be happy… scared I can’t be happy again. I need to de-center men because they don’t make me happy, I need to de-center their opinions and beliefs and thoughts and center me. Worrying about what they think of me and what others think of me being single and as a person is not helping me move forward. Im scared of being raped, scared of being hurt. I feel the pressure that in order to be worthy of love and respect in this world as a woman you need to be in a relationship and have that status and be beautiful and accomplished an I hate it.

Clearly my therapist thinks you need sex and a man to be happy… she did help me get my autonomy back (economic extortion and financial abuse…. I’m on disability folks threatened and intimated me in social agencies from become independent too, they profited off of me…)

I just don’t trust this therapist with my feelings anymore and when I try and talk to her about it I don’t feel better; how do you gracefully break up with a therapist? I haven’t broken up with her because I’m afraid if I do she will take it personally and reject me if I ever want to seek her services again… I have a bad maternal abondonment wound, hence why (especially being taught it was the plan of happiness,) I really wanted a bf as a girl…. And it devastated and traumatized me that my father viewed me as “his” his property and would get threatened and anger and jealous and it also makes me feel so much rage I want to shoot him 27 times but I can’t cause that’s illegal. He completely robbed me of an innocent happy childhood. He is a misogynistic pedophile. I really wanted a bf because I wanted to feel loved and wanted to he loved and happy so bad. It made me suicidal.

I still get euphoric recall from that limerence fling I had with someone in my Sunday school class because I was so repressed and depravity, that they smallest gesture of tenderness had such a physical and emotional effect on me.

I just want to grieve and let go, and center myself, but I don’t know how, and if she doesn’t support separatism than I think that’s a deal breaker for me.

You need to find a new therapist. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to be a female separatist as a heterosexual woman, she shouldn’t be suggesting you need to find a man or have children to lead a full and happy life, and you don’t need to worry about being rejected by this therapist in the future. It’s her job to help you and if she’s not helping you right now, it’s not doing anyone any good. My therapist usually ends each session with “so next week then?” or something similar, you can just say you need to take a little time off from therapy or simply decline a next session. Say you’re busy, who cares. If you’re autoenrolled in sessions you should be able to cancel it and you probably don’t even need to provide a reason, if you do just be vague. You don’t owe them anything other than basic human decency, they’re there to help you and improve your quality of life, like that’s literally their job. That said, it sounds like you have some trauma to process and I think you could really benefit from speaking to a different therapist that specializes in complex sexual trauma. I was also molested by my father in a religious household, I understand the unspeakable impact that has on who you are and how you see the world. Working with a therapist can be really helpful if they actually ‘get’ you but it’s not so easy to find a good therapist. I’m sorry, I wish it was easier. Take some time off from therapy if you want to. I took several years off and honestly most of my experiences were bad before my current therapist. Doing my own research really helped me, just learning everything I could about how and why this happened to me. I read about it and wrote about it for years and years. I painted portraits of my grief, I wrote songs to it. I still do. It’s ok to grieve and it’s going to take a lot longer than you think. Let it. … Anyways, I sincerely hope you are able to heal and find peace. Sending all my love & strength.

[whumpthefifth]

“Okay, you know what I don’t understand about the anti-drug agenda? They’re never anti-alcohol. Using their arguments against milder recreational substances such as weed, LSD and shrooms, you could argue alcohol has the same “dehabilitating” effects of these substances — Hell, I’d say worse. However, I see very few anti-liquor anti-drug advocates. What’s the deal? (PS: I’m not anti alcohol, just don’t respect the fact WOD advocates aren’t consistent with their views.) “

(Im shadow banned, I think it’s a glitch cause it always happens, so an ask instead Lol)

But ugh thank you for saying that! Exactly! I use cannabis, and I use to go to AA (they’re a cult; claim you have a ready disease and only god can save you, and they tell sexual assualt survivors to accept responsibility /own their part in it… likely because AA has lots of male sexual predators so they blame women… just like Mormonism… other ways to get sober outside AA so I left but,) I use to go to AA because I have AUD. I think abstinence is the only way for me when it comes to alcohol.

I had a lot of members act like me using weed was worse though 🙄I use weed for chronic pain and chronic fatigue. I also use it recreationally. If I’m using it too much to the point I build a THC tolerance I’ll take a 2-4 week break, but I have 0 intention of quitting weed. I don’t have a problem with it, but a lot of folks who did wanted to project on me that I did, and suggest I wasn’t really sober. 🙄

People act like weed, which has a lot of medicinal purposes, is worse than alcohol, which is a damn carcinogen and depressant.

Weed to me is such a benign drug compared to other drugs, even SRI’s; SRI’s caused me memory problems, I’ve never had weed give me memory problems…

I am a big advocate of plant based healing; plant based diet, plant based drugs. (I’d love to try shrooms someday. I think they should be legalized.) alcohol is extremely addictive and bad for your organs, a lot of people drink it and will compare weed to crack and heronin, drives me just a little insane.

exactly. Weed is a genuine medicinal substance — why prohibit that, while tobacco, a rampant carcinogen that is openly advertised to children and ex-cigarette addicts (Im talking about vapes, so much for Smokefree) and alcohol, which is as you said also a carcinogen and a depressant and leads to irresponsible drinking habits that cause many young people to get themselves injured, incarcerated and even killed. For my country alone, 44 percent of fatal crashes in NZ through 2019-2021 have been caused by alcohol, and 1 in 4 kiwi drinkers have developed hazardous alcohol dependency — You don’t see that happening with cannabis, and yet God forbid we legalize the “devils lettuce”. It just doesn’t make sense.

[brightgnosis]

Day 3 Jasmyne Ambrosia's 28 Day Witchy Challenge: Create A Home Protection Ward -- except I know better; don't share active wards & protections on the interwebs, kids … Plus, I just redid my wards at New Years. I don't need a new one- or to redo any.

Instead, I used today's prompt to kick me into finally making a Home Blessing I've had an idea for, for nearly a year now; it's based in traditional Mormon Folk Imagery, and Psalms 128 & 129 + Proverbs 21 --- featuring Willow Branch, Fern Leaf, Blackberry, Rose, Bees, and a Beehive that hides the blessing:

🕯️“ Say I: The craving of laziness is eternally fatal, for lazy hands always refuse labor. But diligent hands always lead to abundance; those who are hasty only want.

Happy are those who adore HaShem, and who walk in his ways; you shall eat of the fruit of the labor of your hands, and you shall be happy and prosper. Let your household [then] say to any who attacks you: 'None have prevailed against me yet, for my Lord is a righteous King; may all those who set against me be shamed and turned away'. Then may HaShem bless you in the world to come.

May we see the everlasting prosperity of Olan Ha-Ba. Amein. „🕯️

It took me weeks to complete the piece I did for Adam and Chava, with the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. Given that, I was honestly just going to be happy if I even finalized the sketch today. But I was incredibly surprised how easily (and quickly) this piece came together- and with how little Neuropathy, too.

It still needs color, of course. But I'm beyond happy with it (and with its new home on my fireplace mantle).

This account is run by a Dual Faith «(Converting) Masorti Jew + Traditional NeoWiccan» & «Ancestral Folk Magic Practitioner» with 20+ years of experience as a practicing Pagan and Witch. If that bothers you, don't interact.

[troughtonmedia]

Script #53

Who we now know as the biblical Antichrist didn't just get there in a day. His presence had been predicted for over 2000 years and many prophets, priests, and other people had been chiseling out the details for a long time. He knew he would be welcomed by the world after making extreme promises like world peace. Some folks would say he was full of hate and extremism but the Antichrist was trying to prove them wrong.

You see, in his eyes nothing new was happening on planet Earth. War was raging through the land, drought and famine were exhausting our resources, not even rain water was safe to drink anymore! It was as if the world was making him do it so for that reason he couldn't stop.

The Antichrist or as some called him the Anti Messiah would reign for 7 years just as predicted by the word. There would be an assassination attempt after 3.5 years that would cost him an eye. Many prophesied he would try to become God but in reality he was a puppet of the devil. All this fell upon the lord's hand to bring back Jesus Christ.

Christians, Catholics, and Mormons all believed Jesus Christ was coming back to rapture them and when I say rapture I mean bring them home with God. You see, the Antichrist had trouble figuring out life and death because so many religions promise life after death. Another reason why Danny thought it was him. He wasn't a bad guy but he become fascinated with the role after he learned about biblical end times. Was it really gonna happen in our lifetime?

Danny did the best he could. Honestly there weren't too many expectations for the Antichrist in the year 2022. Most folks had forgot about the prophecies plus there were a whole bunch of Atheists that pretty much laughed themselves to death! We thank Danny for his work because he helped us reach the next level of humanity. We finally came to realize how stupid war is and we finally got our acts together and started healing the Earth from some serious abuse. We also built a lunar fortress to start our interstellar travels! The next chapter is here.

END HERE

[demoisverysexy]

An Open Letter to the Person who Blocked Me for Being Mormon

For context:

If you’re reading this, I hope it finds you well.

This letter is mostly for me, so I can get my feelings out. I’ve already talked about this with a few of my friends, and I’m feeling better than I was than when you blocked me. I’m still upset. Mostly because of general trends I see on tumblr of hatred for Mormons. A lot of it comes from ignorance and misunderstanding. Some of it comes from a place of genuine hurt that can’t go unaddressed. I don’t want to be dismissive of those who have faced trauma at the hands of my church. I am one of those people, and I know how deeply pain associated with my church can be. After our interaction, I felt that talking about it would help me process this.

Before I go on, I must be clear that this is not an attempt to get you to unblock me. As nice as it would be to be able to see your blog again – you’re very witty, and I enjoy your content! – I can live without it. This is more a response to the trend on tumblr specifically of hatred against Mormons, and assuming that they’re all bad people who are complicit in every single bad thing that the church does. You just happened to force me to be a little introspective about my church and my relation to it. Thank you for that.

First, however, I would like to clear up some misconceptions:

Your initial joke that prompted me to tell you I was a Mormon was a joke about Mormons and polygamy. The largest two organizations that can be classified as “Mormon,” The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and the Community of Christ (which incidentally allows for gay marriage and has female clergy, though I am of the LDS sect), both disavow polygamy. There are other, smaller offshoot Mormon groups who do still practice this, which is where horror stories of polygamists marrying teenagers arise. These people are also Mormons, though I wish they weren’t, in the same way that problematic Christian groups are Christian, though many Christians wish they weren’t.

I do recognize that mainstream Mormonism has been labeled as a cult by many people, though the reasons people provide generally don’t hold up. Often the proof that people provide of my church’s cult-like nature is to take note of corruption that can be found in almost every church. These issues – such as racism, homophobia, and misogyny, to name a few – while real and important to address do not a cult make. Sometimes the proof is to point towards practices that are demonized in my church, but are practiced in other religions with no comment, or even celebration. Other times people will point to their own experiences with toxic church congregations, and while those issues are very real, they are by no means universal. My experience growing up Mormon was a lucky one in many ways. I personally don’t think that most people who study my church from an academic vantage point would call it a cult. I would consult them on this matter. After all, someone in a cult is rather hard-pressed to be able to tell whether they are in one or not.

Another point often levied against Mormonism is how it leaves its queer members with religious trauma due to its homophobic teachings. I understand this well. I have experienced deep religious trauma associated with my political stances in favor of LGBTQ+ rights (though that wasn’t the whole story). I won’t go into detail about this right now, but suffice it to say, I had a very traumatic time on my mission that led me to a very dark place, and ended with me contemplating choices I would never be able to take back. I’m fine now of course, but I carry those memories with me.

So why would I stay despite all this? Is it because I’m brainwashed? You would have to ask a psychologist about that, but I would say probably not. I knew, and know now, that the ways I was being treated were unfair and wrong. I don’t have time to go point by point to address every grievance I or anyone else has with my church and explain my position on it, as much as I would like to clear the air once and for all on this topic so there is no misunderstanding. Here’s the reasoning that has kept me here so far:

I think that every person of faith must, at some point, deal with the problematic aspects of their church’s history and doctrine. This comes with the territory. Whether it be disturbing stories in scripture, imperialist tendencies, doctrines that chafe against us, or problematic leaders, no person of faith is exempt from wrestling with the history that accompanies their faith. I have studied my church’s history in depth. Many of the horror stories I heard were provably false. Many were true. Where does that leave me?

I believe that God is bigger and better than us. We make terrible, awful mistakes all the time. But I don’t think that makes God less willing to work with us. If anything, I think it means he wants to help us more. He wants to help us move past our histories and become better. My church has a long way to go in this regard. For too long we have been silent when it mattered, and people have been wounded by our silence. Or even the words we have said out loud! If you look at my Mormonism tag on my blog, you will see some examples of what I am talking about. I have been wounded by the things my church has said and not said. It hurts awfully, and I ache for those who have been wounded more deeply than I.

But at the same time, I cannot deny the healing my faith has brought me. Whatever problems my church has – and it has many, deep and pressing issues – it is because of my faith that I am the person I am today. I can draw a straight line from my religion to the positions I hold today. Because I am a Mormon, I became a Marxist. Because I am a Mormon, I became nonbinary. Because I am a Mormon, I became a leftist. I cannot ignore that my religion, flawed as it may be, has led me to where I stand now. I am at the intersection of the hurt and healing the church offers. It is a difficult line to walk. But I hope that in walking it, I can bring healing and love to those who hurt in the ways I do. To let them know that they are not alone, and that they have a friend who can help them wherever they choose to go.

Yes I am queer. Yes I am a Mormon. I am here because I am trying to fix things. If at some point in the future I realize that I cannot change things, perhaps I will leave. I hope it does not come to that. And things are changing. They have changed before, and they can change now. I am confident that my God is willing to lead my church where it needs to go. I hope I can help speed things along. We shall see.

But spreading unequivocal hatred and disdain for Mormons does not help those of us who are Mormon who are trying to fix things. Yes, those who have left Mormonism due to trauma need a safe place to be away from that, and acknowledging the church’s many faults can be helpful to those people. I myself have criticized my church quite vocally. But refusing to listen to the stories of those of us who choose to stay, telling others that we are evil or stupid or what have you, is also quite traumatic to us. We are people too, with thoughts and feelings. It is easy to dismiss us out of hand if you assume we aren’t.

I try to be open about my religion and political stances on my tumblr. See for yourself: It’s a mix of Mormonism, LGBTQ+ activism, Marxism, and pretty much every other leftist political position you can find. Along with all the furry stuff, of course. But despite all this, I am still terrified every time someone follows me to tell them I am Mormon. More than I am to tell them that I’m queer. Tumblr is not representative of how things work in the “real world,” of course, but I have received hatred for being a Mormon there as well. And it’s mostly other Christians. So on the one hand I’m hated by LGBTQ+ folks, on the other hand I’m hated by my church for being queer, and on the third hand (as apparently I have three hands), I am hated by other Christians. I do not face hatred to the same degree from other Christians. I saw it most on my mission. But still, it exists.

(Incidentally, Evangelicals, who you seem to have problems with, and perhaps rightly so, though I have not done a study of the matter myself, largely despise Mormons, from what I have heard. Something to consider.)

I want allies. I want help. I want understanding. If I am to push back against bigotry in my church, I need your help. I need everyone’s help. Fighting bigotry wherever we see it is a worthy pursuit, I think. And if we can succeed, we can make the world a better, safer happier place. I want to fight off the ghosts that haunt my church. You don’t have to fight them with me, but I would appreciate it if I could have your support. It would make my job much easier.

We aren’t enemies. At least, I don’t think you’re my enemy. We both have been hurt by homophobia and bigotry. We live in a capitalist hellscape where police brutality and racism are on the rise. Fascism is looming over the political backdrop, along with the ongoing threat of ecological disaster. I think we would be better off helping each other than going after each other. I ask that you please listen to us when we say you are hurting us. The Mormons you blocked knowingly followed you, an openly queer person who calls out racism and bigotry and pedophilia. Yet you assume we are in favor of those things. Someone can at once be part of an institution while recognizing it’s flaws. (Aren’t we both Americans? Why not move if we hate it so much?) And perhaps we have used the “No true Scotsman” fallacy to justify why we stay. I don’t believe I have. I don’t feel I need to.

I hope that you consider what I’ve said here. I hope we can work together. And I hope that no matter what, you find peace wherever you end up.

Yours truly,

Demo Argenti

[catsnuggler]

Anecdotally, I've noticed most exmos fall in any one, or maybe more, of the following categories:

folks who leave because of homophobia, transphobia, misogyny, or maybe racism

folks who aren't, like, oppressed, at least not in the formerly-mentioned ways, but are abused by the church

folks who leave simply because of historical evidence proving it's made-up, and that Joseph Smith was unoriginal and a pedophile; a sub-type of these are of the stereotypical "new atheist" variety, the kind who don't care about oppression and laud how they're too intelligent to believe in a "sky fairy" or whatever, often found on, like, /r/exmormon

folks who leave because it's boring as hell

folks who leave because it's weird. the kind who want to fit into "normal" american society, and likely don't really care about anything else here. they tend to be conservative and often become protestants or evangelicals, *maybe* catholics

and that's all valid, I'd say, aside from the conservatives and reddit brain subtypes, but most seem to be liberal, at best, and think broader American society is so much better. additionally, despite how colonialism is foundational to mormonism, few seem to leave with colonialism as, like, one of the main reasons. the main reasons I left were because of oppression, colonialism one of the ones at the forefront of my mind, and its investment in nationalism to the point that mormons are supposed to always, always follow the law, no matter their country, no matter how bad things get. I was also turning to anarchism - in fact, for a brief time after I'd already turned to anarchism, I was still mormon. that's mainly because i was terrified of the supposed consequences for apostasy, but still. that didn't last long, though, just like a month or so, before I continued (and continue) to believe in anarchism, free of the cognitive dissonance of trying to hold onto mormonism, as well, because i dropped that shit like yesterday's trash. then I was PIMO, until I was finally able to leave the church at age 19.

anyway... i wish more exmos left due to colonialism, or at least would turn to anti-colonialism at some point after leaving as they'd heal from the cult.