#The Talamasca

[dykesynthezoid]

Daniel being like hello supernatural intelligence agency WHY did you not tell me I was fucking Armand for a decade. Did you not think it would be, idk, relevant? And the Talamasca are like well, first of all the files were all right there, you just never looked at them, for some reason. Second, we just record, we don’t interfere (me when I lie). Third, we thought it might make it harder for you to work with our agents if you knew they’d seen pictures of you getting rawdogged in the 70s. Fourth—

[alwynwitch]

The Talamasca in AMC IWTV: Raglan, Marius, Daniel, Rashid and Sam

Earlier I wrote a post (and an older one) about why I think Raglan James is actually Marius de Romanus or he is Raglan but sent by his superior Marius. @romaroy also made an excellent post about this (and I know @nalyra-dreaming and @chicalepidopterareblogs talked about this theory as well). Now we know vampire Sam Barclay was also working with the Talamasca and I'm connecting the dots.

In summary, in the books the Talamasca is secretly founded by vampire Teskhamen and two spirits. They are the secret elders, guiding it. I think in the show Marius will have this role. And he is already present in the story and watching Armand with the help of Sam and Rashid. There are visual clues that Rashid is actually working for Marius (the painting). Marius probably helped publishing Daniel's memoir (at Roman Weiss Publishing House) and maybe the book Interview with the Vampire.

I will elaborate on these points under the cut.

1) The Talamasca is founded by vampires and spirits and led by them as secret elders

So, in the books vampire Teskhamen and spirits are the secret founders and elders of the Talamasca, who are leading them from the background (without the humans knowing). I think the same will be true in the AMC show, because it is shown that Sam, a vampire, is working with them. This is what Prince Lestat and the Realms of Atlantis says about how vampire Teskhamen is leading them:

"The Order is stable now, quite harmless to you. But we've never stopped watching over them. [...] We know everything. We watch them as they watch the supernatural phenomena of the world. [...] When it comes time for the Talamasca to die, we will dispatch it."

So, the humans who watch the vampires are not the ones in charge, the vampire who is secretly leading them is. 3D-chess game! They guide the humans who watch the vampires:

"They are pitiful mortals, simple mortals, honest mortals, scholars and nothing more. [...] We are guiding them. I told you."

Who is Teskhamen? He is the maker of Marius. And the other founder? Gremt, a spirit who follows spirit Amel (who started the vampire race by going into Akasha) to earth. There he meets Pandora who gives him her philosophical vision that becomes the mission of the Talamasca. Who is Pandora? Marius's first fledgling and his great love.

And the reason why the Talamasca is founded? It is heavily motivated by watching the spirit Amel who is in Akasha. So basically, to watch Those Who Must Be Kept. They are already mentioned several times in the show... (just as the Great Conversion, which is also connected to this!) and Marius is their Keeper. Which leads to...

2) Speculation: in the AMC show Marius will be the secret founder/elder of the Talamasca

Character-wise it makes a lot of sense. The AMC show is very much character-driven and the books have simply too many characters to flesh them all out. Teskhamen is not fleshed out well in the books. So it makes sense to give Marius this role. (And hopefully, Pandora can have a role as well!)

Marius is known not only for being a nerd, bookish and scholarly, but also for spying on others and invading their privacy and boundaries. When Marius is introduced for the first time, in The Vampire Lestat, he tells Lestat he knows every detail of his life and has been spying on him:

"How do you know what's been happening to me?" I asked. Again, he smiled. He almost laughed.

"I know things that happen to our kind all over the world. [...] There are moments when I can hear what is happening with our kind in Rome or even in Paris. And when another calls to me as you have done, I can hear the call over amazing distances."

"And I've heard of you from others. And sometimes you and I have been near to each other – nearer than you ever supposed – and I have heard your thoughts."

"Then you know all that, too." "Yes, everything," he said, dismissing that.

And in his own book Blood and Gold Marius says he is also spying on Armand:

For though I had spied upon Amadeo more than once, I saw nothing in him, but the same heartbreaking sadness that I had known in Venice. 

Yeah, Marius is a Total Creep. And guess who else is creepy? The Talamasca. Their motto is: We watch and we are always there. Marius would fit perfectly with them. He could have placed agents Sam and Rashid near Armand. Big Marius is watching you.

3) The role of Marius and the Talamasca by Daniel's books

Raglan James (Marius?) told Daniel that the Talamasca can publish his book but other publishers would reject it. At the end of 2x08 we see this happening. Daniel's book is published by the Talamasca. And Daniel complains they have been heavily editing it. Why? I think because they want to control the narrative about what will be publicly known about vampires.

Has this happened before? Yes! Daniel's first memoir was published by Roman Weiss Publishing House. Roman Weiss seems to refer to Marius. And the memoir is heavily connected to Daniel's memory loss regarding Armand and Louis. So this is an important clue that not only Daniel and Marius have met before, but also that Marius and his publishing activities are connected to the Talamasca. Because Marius is the secret founder/elder? I think so!

[queenoftheimps]

Guys what's the over-under on whether or not Real Rashid survives this season

Because I'm realizing Armand & Louis STILL don't know about the Talamasca files yet and it's gonna be a real quick search to figure out who told them Daniel was in Dubai to begin with

(especially since they notably only made contact with Daniel AFTER Real Rashid came back to the penthouse, I'm realizing)

Daniel has not -- so far -- actually told the Talamasca anything (and for purely story reasons, I doubt they'd kill him off), but if they find out about Real Rashid's involvement they're gonna be piiiiiiiiissed

[gothiccharmschool]

Please oh please let this be the quality of Interview with the Vampire, and not The Witching Hour.

[cbrownjc]

The Talamasca and the publishing of the IWTV book (EP 2x06)

My eyes raised at what "Raglan James" (whom I still haven't ruled out actually being Marius yet) said about that. But the fact that they want the book published has me thinking . . . they might be a bit more involved in the working of this book than we've realized.

Because we know Daniel's research assistant is a woman. And I thought this when their gender was given last episode, but I'm thinking it even more now, that Daniel's assistant is actually Jesse Reeves.

We already know The Talamasca are getting their own show. Setting up Jesse's character now would be a perfect time to do so, especially given that -- in just one or two more episodes -- the show is going to be bereft of (living) female characters. Sure, we're going to get Gabrielle in Season 3, but we don't know if or when we'll see her in the present day. I think bringing in one of the female characters from the book into the modern-day part of the story would help to offset things in the modern-day part of the story too, and Jesse is the perfect character for that.

So yeah, I think Daniel's assistant is Jesse. She's helping with the research for the book -- and if you know about Jeese's reaction to the IWTV book in Queen of the Damned, that would be a little twist, but also a setup for later wrt her character too. But yeah, I think this is a small setup for Jesse, and I'm going to think that until proven otherwise.

[desertfangs]

Raymond Gallant was probably insufferable at the Motherhouse after he got a letter from Ancient Vampire Marius de Romanus. Like he even says in his reply to him:

"I must confess to you that I am the envy of my brothers and sisters that I have received your communication. I shall not let my head be turned by this. I am in awe of you and with justification."

And I just picture him walking around going, "Sorry, I cannot speak right now, I must file this letter I received. Why? Oh, see, it was written by an actual vampire! Yes, a vampire touched this paper. I suppose you can look at it but don't touch it, I don't want your greasy mortal fingers all over my vampire correspondence." And "You saw another ghost! How fascinating. Did I mention I received a letter from a vampire?"

Like just impossible to have a conversation with him without him bringing up at least once. "Ah, yes, I'd love to have tea but I have to check to the mail to see if my vampire pen pal has sent a new missive."

[suzieloveships]

Really hope that the Talamasca spin-off is about Jesse, Gabrielle and Claudia's ghost going ghost hunting of something. Because I need more of Claudia and Claudia needs her revenge

[cooperhoward]

The Immortal Universe is expanding. Coming to AMC and AMC+ in 2025, Anne Rice’s #TheTalamasca follows the organization responsible for protecting the world from witches, vampires, werewolves and other creatures.

[eclecticelectriceccentric]

WHY did the talamasca care so much about breaking loumand up

[dykesynthezoid]

Coping with Claudeleine’s impending doom by indulging the little thing I’ve invented entirely in my own head where Jesse is definitely Daniel’s assistant and also she’s funny and gay and ends up making out with one of his daughters. Daniel goes “missing” bc vampires and he’s like well at least my family won’t end up being dragged into this. And meanwhile Jesse has already started a podcast about his disappearance and is definitely going to kiss his daughter on the mouth and drag her into a mess of illegal data retrieval, trespassing, breaking and entering, vampires, and one very confused and exhausted supernatural intelligence agency

[dorkydegeneracy]

The first 12 minutes of the show are chock full of just the right amount of pettiness. Armand is the odd man out!

[30yearsadevilsminion]

I’m just gonna say it:

I think it’s bullshit Real Rashid isn’t the star of the Talamasca series.

[talamasca-caste]

Downtown Abbey’s Elizabeth McGovern will play Helen in Anne Rice’s Talamasca on AMC and AMC+

Helen is described as, “a seasoned veteran of the Talamasca, and the leader of its New York Motherhouse. She has long suspected that London’s Motherhouse has fallen under the influence of traitorous elements, and a mysterious death prompts her to recruit Guy Anatole, who will become her protégé.”

[cbrownjc]

Today's episode was a lot wow.

I do not believe that Armand turned Daniel out of spite, there's definitely some history there. Also if it indeed went like that, Daniel would be way angrier and not so easygoing about his vampirism.

My theory:

1) DM chase happened in the 70s, and then they broke up for some reason.

2) After Loumand's breakup, Armand decides to stalk daniel again, while he's writing his book.

3) Meanwhile, Daniel gets sicker from Parkinson's, and that's when Armand turns him, tied up like in the book because he doesn't want to live without him.

4) Armand can't stand the sight of another loved one leaving him, since he thinks that maker-fledglings relationships are meant to crumble, so he decides to run away.

5) Daniel now searches for him, angered by the fact that he left him.

Well, I already gave my long opinion about some of this in my episode review. So I'll just keep my answers as paired down as I can:

1.) Because of what happened in the finale, The Chase could have only happened in the 1970s now. Especially if they ever want to say that Armand turned Daniel out of love and not spite. And I have no problem with it having happened in the 1970s, since I've been saying since Season 1 that The Chase happened back then.

2.) and 3.) The Talamasca publishing the book makes a chase impossible to happen in the modern day IMO. Because Daniel would have been working with them as he wrote it. They would have known flat out if Armand was chasing him around the world as Daniel was writing the book and working with them to have it published.

Plus, Daniel running around the world with Parkinson's during a still ongoing pandemic? No. Especially when you tie that in with #3. Daniel getting sicker wrt Parkinson's means he loses his mobility. Hell, depending on how sick he got, he wouldn't even be able to eat on his own, let alone walk. Even transferring himself via wheelchair would be near impossible after a time.

Me knowing how Parkinson's works because of observing it firsthand with my mom always made the idea of Daniel doing The Chase in the present day quite unbelievable to me. And the idea that he could do that if his health was declining while also writing a book too? Nope. No way.

Also, the whole point of The Chase was to have Armand fall in love with Daniel as a human and have Daniel knowingly fall in love with Armand as a monster. That is the narrative reason for The Chase to exist in the first place -- for the two of them to have time to fall in love with each other. Otherwise, none of the rest of it works -- including Daniel being turned. Even as far as in the books, the IWTV book was already accepted and in the works before the chase has even begun for Armand and Daniel. The book was published still towards the start of it.

In the show, Daniel -- as a vampire -- is going on a book tour. Giving the publication of that book a generous 2 years, that is very little time to squeeze in Daniel writing a book while his health is declining and Armand still chasing him around the world long enough to fall in love with him.

I'm sorry, but I just do not see it.

4.) Armand isn't going to abandon his only fledgling, even with his fear of it not working out. Armand fought tooth and nail to not lose Louis he was so afraid of being alone, but he's just going to give up Daniel super easy? His one and only fledgling, that he only broke his vow to never turn someone for because he loved him so much? Personally I think I would hate that even more than what I already disliked wrt the implication the show laid out about them in that ending scene. Via the Tulane archive, we know that it was Daniel who initiated their break up in the books (and Armand himself alludes to this, that it was Daniel, in his own book as well).

Armand just running off after turning Daniel with Daniel maybe not wanting him to go? Again, no. Not if the show is in any way trying to keep to the heart of what their relationship is and is supposed to be.

5.) Daniel didn't seem the least bit hurt by Armand not being around IMO. Slight annoyance and that's it, IMO. And this actually goes into something I talk about in my longer review about how he was acting during that whole ending scene, so I won't do so here.

So in conclusion I do agree that Armand didn't -- or wouldn't -- turn Daniel out of spite. Not if the show is in any way keeping to the heart of the Devil's Minion relationship is. But aside from agreeing that The Chase did happen in the 1970s, there are too many plot holes for the other things to have happened IMO, at least in my view of it. Again, if they want to keep to what the heart of this relationship is, or is like.

[confirmeddead]

The Talamasca cast is looking qwhite interesting so far!

[pulitzerootoo]

Your "friend" has access to your fridge, yet he has not told you of your past? Tsk tsk. Curious.

Do you remember this?

--

D:01.05.76 

T:7:34PM

L:BOSTON\THE_COUPLEY

[BRIEF: Subjects entered separately, VA showing up first, about 30 minutes before DM came down from his room to the dining hall. Meeting was not arranged beforehand.]

VA:

"I didn’t know what you wanted".

[pause]

"So I ordered everything they had".

[DM sitting down at the table]

DM:

"You think you can drive me crazy, don't you?"

[pause]

"Well, you can’t. Let me tell you. Every time I lay eyes on you, I realize I didn’t invent you, and that I'm sane!"

--

I could... set up a little file drop to your laptop, but you know how this works. Nothing comes for free. 👁

It's funny. You had access to this file before. You just never looked in that one particular folder :)

- Nin

Y'know this is all public, right? I mean I don't give a shit if random internet users read what they think is a joke. But I assumed the Talamasca might care more. Especially considering there are multiple other vamps on the site.

There's a private message function, apparently. But I doubt you'd use it.

I don't remember it. But I'm not paying whatever you want in return.