#a lot smarter writing

[jheselbraum]

Nintendo is stupid here's my new better timeline:

Skyward Sword

Legend of Zelda

Adventure of Link

Minish Cap

Four Sourds

and it's sequel Four Swords Adventures

A Link to the Past

Link's Awakening (edited, whoops)

A Link Between Worlds

Ocarina of Time

The Hero is Defeated Timeline: Oracle games and Triforce Heroes that's it.

Child Timeline: Majora's Mask and Twilight Princess, as usual, easy peasy, for once no notes Nintendo

Adult Timeline: Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass, and Spirit Tracks once again pretty easy, no notes

11. Breath of the Wild 12. Tears of the Kingdom

[judyalvqrez]

Lately I’ve been obsessed with how feral and animalistic Scratch (and by extension the Dark Presence) is portrayed in Alan Wake 2. In the past Alan has said that it’s hard to personify the Dark Presence because its behaviors and motivations go beyond what human psychology and emotions can express, but it’s interesting to me that some behaviors and emotions usually associated with feral animals like wolves seem to fit this version of the Dark Presence/Scratch better. In the same way Alan is the owl and Saga is the deer, Scratch is the wolf. I mean, he constantly bares his teeth and growls. In the Dark Place the Dark Presence hunts Alan, while in the real world Scratch hunts Saga, both stalking their prey. Saga also gets repeatedly attacked by shadow wolves, who at one point kill a deer when she solves a nursery rhyme. And I absolutely love how the old saying about how animals are most dangerous when they’re cornered and/or wounded can be applied to Scratch in multiple situations, but especially when the Cult of the Tree attacks the lodge. At that point the Dark Presence was still weak from joining with Alan, but now they’re under attack, Casey is gone, and cultists are coming to kill them. Even though we don't actually see it and Alan doesn’t remember, it’s obvious Scratch managed to come out. And Scratch doesn’t just kill the cultists, but fucking rips them apart, judging by the piles of bodies and gore and hanging entrails. Don’t even get me started on The Bad Boy in Number One Fan, where they practically take the wolf motif and beat us over the head with it all under the guise of funny jokes and fanfiction tropes. 

As much as I love the old portrayal of Scratch in AWAN, this much darker and feral version of Scratch is just so fascinating to me. Anyway, TLDR:

[birchlogz]

[writingwife-83]

My husband keeps assuring me that Ben will be back in the upcoming Rey movie. Am I saying he has some sort of special insider knowledge? Well… No. 😆 But he is very often right about stuff. So yeah, just thought I’d share lol.

[quaranmine]

On Wednesday before I gave my presentation I confessed to a new employee that I was worried it would be too long and she brightly told me her life hack was to just let AI rewrite things for her. She said I should put in all my talking points and ask ChatGPT to give me a five minute exactly presentation. I was like....how is the most polite possible way (since this is a new colleague I shouldn't get off on the wrong foot with) that I can express that I will Not be taking this advice. Ever. I told her that I didn't think we were allowed to use ChatGPT at this job (we most certainly are not, it is a nightmare for any type of protected information) and also that I prefer to write all of my own work. Despite my best efforts the last part of that was still passive aggressive, lol.

Something about being a writer makes it so that it's almost offensive to me for someone to suggest I use AI to do my work instead? Like, the day I reach the point where I let AI write something for me is the day y'all need to be checking me for brain damage because clearly I'm losing it

[problemstarchild]

“It is a virtue to know what you want, Your Majesty,” Kabru replies after a moment. “Moreso to be confident in asking for it.”

Words: 97,923, Chapters: 16/?, Language: English

Fandoms: ダンジョン飯 | Dungeon Meshi | Delicious in Dungeon

Rating: Not Rated

Warnings: Graphic Depictions Of Violence

Categories: M/M, Multi

Characters: Laios Touden, Kabru (Dungeon Meshi)

Relationships: Kabru/Laios Touden, Marcille Donato/Falin Touden (Background), Falin Touden & Laios Touden (Background), Falin Touden & Thistle (Background)

Additional Tags: Body Dysmorphia, Hurt/Comfort, Canon-Typical Sexual Violence Metaphors, Post-Canon, Slow Burn, Trans Male Character, Canon-Typical Fantasy Racism, Canon-Typical Slavery (Background)

[thatsrightice]

Lemmens finds out one of his crew can’t read very well, so he decides to introduce him to Crosby. Croz was a nice guy, very gentle and not at all intimidating, especially to a massive grounds crew worker. And before the war he was in a masters program studying literature with the hopes of becoming a professor.

Crosby is more than willing to help, pretty excited to help by doing something he knew he was actually pretty good at. Not to mention that he knew what it felt like to feel embarrassed and incompetent at something, so he knew exactly what to say and do to encourage the man.

They don’t have lessons often with how both of their schedules are irregular, so sometimes Crosby comes out to the hardstand and when he gets a break they quick do a lesson. Crosby loans him some books to read in the meantime like “Of Mice and Men” and is ecstatic to hear how much he liked it.

He’s not the only guy who struggles with reading and brings a couple friends one day, who bring a couple of their own friends, and so on until there’s a mini classroom outdoors during their breaks fixing planes. Sometimes Crosby just reads out loud for a while, the men occasionally interrupting to ask what a word means.

[carpathiians]

i feel like if you did the slow blink at javier hed just intuitively know what it means

[skrunksthatwunk]

yakuza: dead souls - american vibes, bigass guns, and why zombies are super weird to have in ryu ga gotoku thematically/ideologically speaking

so i've been playing dead souls recently (hell yeah hell yeah hell yeah) and although i'm having the time of my life with it, there was something about it that kinda felt off to me, and i think i've figured out what it was, but i'm gonna have to walk you through a bit of my thought process to get there.

my first instinct was that it felt... american? and upon further examination i think that boils down to a couple of things:

everyone suddenly has lots of guns and also way way bigger guns

high emphasis on individual heroism (this itself is quite typical for rgg, but it manifests differently here; more on that in a bit)

military/government incompetence, which must be solved by the right individuals having the biggest and bestest guns

[for the sake of transparency i will note that my experience with zombie media is pretty limited and skews american (and i myself am american), so that may create bias. however, the 'this feels american to me' instinct is a rare one for me even in genres where i have seen little/no non-american media, so i think the fact that it did occur to me is notable. what about dead souls triggered that response when little else has? that's why i examined it and, truthfully, i think there's merit in the idea itself.]

the first point is pretty self-explanatory. america's got more guns than it does people, and its gun worship is infamous. japan's ban on guns (aided by its being an island state) means there's far fewer guns in the country, as well as far fewer people with guns (and likely far fewer guns per gun owner, excepting arms dealers/smugglers) than somewhere without such a ban. obviously, there are guns anyway. due to their illegality they are clustered within the criminal population, which explains their presence within organized crime within the series. very few guns will be sitting around in the homes of otherwise law-abiding citizens.

and yet, when the zombie outbreak hits kamurocho, plenty of civilians suddenly have access to quite an arsenal. everyone has the knowledge they need to aim, fire, and reload smoothly and quickly; ammo is infinite for certain guns. characters we've never seen using firearms before suddenly have shotguns under their couches (looking at you, majima). it's not only very different from reality, it's very different from guns' place within the series up until this point, when they were limited weapons used primarily by the enemy.

and they're making a zombie shooter, so of course they would have to do this. it has to be unrealistic to be simultaneously in this setting and in this genre, in the same way that yakuza solving their problems with bareback fistfights instead of guns is itself both unrealistic and necessary to being the kinds of games rgg are.

my point is that this is a kind of focus on and valorization of gun ownership and competency unusual for the series and setting. further, it serves as an argument for why an armed, competent populace is crucial typical in american media.

which brings us to the third point (we'll get to 2 in a minute). guns are often marketed as self-defense weapons. the implication is that the government's defense of the individual (via law enforcement or the military, but particularly the former), are insufficient. this is objectively true. if someone pulls a gun on you at the gas station, will a cop manifest out of thin air to intercede? no. that's impossible. but if you have a gun, or if some bystander has a gun, you or they may be able to do something with that gun to stop the armed person. thus, there is an undeniable gap in the effective immediacy of such responses.

many gun advocates also point to the incompetence or insufficiency of law enforcement, even when they are present to stop an armed aggressor. the fact that law enforcement do not have a 100% success rate in protecting the citizenry is also objectively true.

so, when you are in danger, arming yourself increases your chances of being able to put down (or at least take armed action against) a present or potential threat. whether it is viewed it as a supplement to or a replacement for law enforcement, it is meant to make up for the shortcomings of the government's ability to completely protect all its citizens. it's a safety net for state failure.

back to dead souls. rgg has always centered political corruption in its stories, including politicians, the police, and sometimes even the military, though usually the former two. sometimes this is treated sympathetically (i.e. tanimura, a dirty cop, whose dirty-cop-ness allows him to work outside/against the law to help disadvantaged people, not unlike how kiryu views being a yakuza), and other times it's simply a matter of greed or lust for power (i.e. jingu).

however, something that's almost never touched on so clearly is government incompetence. when the government fails to help people or hurts them or does corrupt things, it's usually due to a competent, malicious bad apple who is removed from power by the end of the game. this implies holes in the system because it keeps happening all the time, but that's on a series-wide scale, a pattern ignored by the series in favor of the individual game solution of "this guy's gone now :) yay".

but in dead souls, the SDF's barracades fall, their men are killed, they are unable to help protect the people outside or inside the quarantine zone. they are weak in a way the government usually isn't in these games. and who is stronger than them? our individual good guys with guns. so we need to be armed because the government is weak and can't protect us. boom. america.

returning to point 2, i'd like to say that dead souls is not particularly more individualistic than any of the other games in the series (other than, perhaps, y7). rgg is an incredibly individualistic series, actually. its protagonists are usually men who defy, oppose, and skirt around the law as a way of helping others and doing what is truly right (with a few exceptions, like shinada and haruka). the romanticized view of the yakuza as a force for helping the community in the face of government incompetence is a real one, and one that tends to manifest itself most in kiryu and how the series treats him. it shows us yakuza who aren't willing to kill, yakuza who cry about honor and justice and humanity and brotherhood, yakuza who never dip their hands into less palatable crimes, or only do with intense regret (and only ever as part of their backstory). the beat-em-up style emphasizes this as well. i mean, what's more individualistic than a one-man army?

put more clearly, this series is about men defying legal and social laws and expectations to live in a way that feels right to them, and about making themselves strong enough to combat those who would get in their way. the individual is placed before the society in importance, (though generally in a way that benefits the community, because they are good guys who want to use that agency and power for good).

all of this is true in dead souls as well, technically. those who live on the outskirts of society are the ones who actually save the day, and the ones who go in there and save people rather than just walling them off and pretending like they don't exist. they have the guns, which are illegal and mark them as criminals, but this broken law is what gives them the power to save themselves when the government will not, and to save their community if they so choose.

where dead souls differs is in the nature of that strength.

rgg places a lot of emphasis on self-improvement, both of one's body and of one's character. do both of these, and you will be strong enough to back up your ambitions. what allows someone to carve their own path in life is the ability to put down ideological and physical resistance by having resolve and the ability to tiger drop whoever won't be swayed by your impassioned speeches. you make yourself a weapon. you make yourself strong. in dead souls, that strength comes from an external, material possession. strength is something you buy (or that you take from someone else). who is able to survive the apocalypse comes not from the heart, nor from rigorous training, but from who has the most, the biggest, and the most bestest guns. it's an intersection of capitalism, militarization, and individualism. simply, deeply american.

[when i was talking myself through this a few days ago, i spent a lot more time on the capitalism + individualism stuff, but i think i'll keep this moving. consider this aside the intermission]

dead souls also differs for a few other interlocking reasons. it can be described with this equation:

zombification of enemies + lethality of guns = loss of emphasis on redemption

if your best friend turned into a zombie, could you shoot them? or your child? or your lover? it's a common trope, but it's a damn good one. watching your family, your neighbors, your town, everyone turn into a husk of themselves, something that looks like them but cannot be reached, is deeply tragic. it's even more tragic when these husks are trying to kill you. unable to be reasoned with and unable to be cured, you must incapacitate them before someone innocent is hurt--or hurt, then themselves made dangerous; each loss adds to the number of threats surrounding you. your life is seen as more valuable than that of your zombified friend, not only because the zombie is attacking you and it's self defense, but because they are no longer a person to you. to be a zombie is to no longer be human; zombification is dehumanization.

and so in a series so focused on connection with one's community, on saving innocent civilians, often on saving kamurocho specifically, one would expect similar tropes to occur. even if one's friends aren't turned, perhaps the cashier at poppo you chat with sometimes is. it's the destruction of that community and of the members one has tertiary relationships with that i expect would occur most within a kamurocho zombie story, since they are likely unwilling to axe anyone more important than that, even if dead souls isn't canon. i'd especially expect to see that in the beginning, before the need to kill zombies rather than contain or redeem them becomes apparent.

this does not happen.

i cannot speak for the entire game, but i can speak of gameplay choices that affect this, and ones i think will not be subverted throughout, even if they are somewhat contradicted by plot events i am presently unaware of.

kamurocho is not a community to protect, nor is it filled with your fellows. it is a playground filled with infinitely respawning, infinitely mow-downable, infinitely disposable zombies. you are meant and encouraged to kill them by the thousands, and never to hesitate or consider whether they may be cured or who may be mourning them. who may be unable to identify their loved one because you were trying to reach a headshot goal from hasegawa. you are not meant to consider them as human, nor beings that were once human, nor beings that could be human again, in the eyes of the zombie shooter. they are merely bodies, targets, and obstacles.

the zombies are contrasted with the true humans, those barricading themselves within the quarantine zone or those living in ignorance outside it. humans are meant to be saved, zombies are meant to be killed. the player character is the only one who can truly help with either of these goals, because the other humans are cowardly, ignorant, or unarmed/helpless. you must be their savior. to be a savior is to eliminate zombies, who are less than human.

the black and white nature of this is also emphasized by another gameplay characteristic: the lack of street encounters. when you traverse the peaceful parts of kamurocho, you are never attacked. you are also never directly attacked by the humans within the quarantine zone. kamurocho feels very different without its muggers and hooligans, but it's because this is a zombie shooter, not a beat-em-up. in a normal rgg title, you'd subdue threats by punching, kicking, and throwing them. you'd use your body in (supposedly) nonlethal ways. dead souls does not have a combat system meant for civilians. you have your guns. you subdue threats by shooting them, preferably lethally. the game doesn't want you to do that to humans, so you never fight humans. this furthers the black and white divide between the salvation-worthy, noble humans and the death-worthy, worthless zombies. combat is only lethal, and only used against the inherent other.

this leads me to the part of dead souls i find most conflicting with the ethos of rgg broadly, and perhaps its greatest ideological/thematic failing.

because the enemy are incurable, dangerous, and inhuman, you must kill them to protect yourself and others, others who are still human. humanity is something that is lost or preserved, but never regained. once someone's gone, they're gone, and you not only must kill them, it is your duty and your right to kill them. you should kill them.

in dead souls, there is no redeeming the enemy.

and that's a big problem.

rgg is about a lot of things, but a key one is the ability of people to change for the better. its most memorable, beloved villains are those who see the light by the end and change their wicked ways (usually through some form of redemptive suicide, though that's another essay in itself). its pantheon of characters is full of those who come from questionable backgrounds struggling to be the best people they can be, to live as themselves authentically and compassionately. it's about the good and the love you can find in the moral and legal gray zones of life/society, and the potential/capacity for good all of us have, no matter how far we may have fallen. it is a hopeful series. it is a merciful series.

this is something bolstered by its gameplay. countless substories are resolved by punching a lesson into someone until they improve their behavior, either out of fear or genuine remorse/development. the games don't just discourage killing your enemies, they don't allow you to (yes, we've all seen the "kiryu hasn't killed anybody? umm. look at this heat action" stuff before, and while they've got a point, i believe it's the narrative's intent that none of this is actually lethal, based on how laxly it treats certain plot injuries (cough cough. y7 bartender) and the actual concept of taking a life, the gravity it is given by the text, particularly when it comes to characters crossing that threshold into someone who has killed. explicit killing is not an option open to you, even when you're being attacked by dozens and dozens of armed men. conflicts are resolved by simply beating up enough guys in this nonlethal manner.

but dead souls is a shooter. to avoid conflict with the series' moral qualms about letting its characters kill, the enemies cannot be human. furthermore, the zombie shooter genre can only fit within the series if its zombies are completely inhuman. this means their pasts as humans cannot be acknowledged, nor the possibility of a cure, nor the characters' own potential conflicts about killing them; or, at least, not in a way that impedes their or the player's ability to gun them down afterwards.

if you can't kill humans in your series, then it cannot be possible to save (in this case, rehumanize) zombies. this is especially true in a game where you are unable to fight humans, and thus human lives are universally more valuable than zombie lives. because if you kill a zombie that can be cured, you are, in a way, killing a human.

and so, in a series where you should always assume your enemies (and everyone, for that matter) are capable of reason, compassion, change, and redemption, and where they are always worth that effort, even if they reject it in the end, dead souls' enemies are irredeemable and only worth swift, stylish slaughter. there are only good guys and bad guys. good guys must be protected, lest they be turned irreversibly into bad guys. good guys are only protected by killing bad guys, and the only way to save good guys is to kill every last one of the bad guys. do not spare them, and do not ask whether or not it's right. only kill.

i love dead souls. it's a silly game. i like seeing daigo in decoy-drag and majima gleefully cartwheeling his way through zombies and ryuji with his giant gun arm prosthetic. it's fun. but when i was trying to figure out what felt off about it to me, one of the words that came to mind (besides american) was indulgent. that, too, felt odd, because i love indulgent media. i am not one to scorn decadent, hedonistic, beautiful high-calorie slop type media. if dead souls was just fan servicey, that wouldn't really bother me. i am a fan and boy do i feel serviced. it rocks. but i think my problem is in what dead souls is indulging.

i think dead souls indulges in the desire to cut loose, and to see these characters cut loose. thing is, they're cutting loose all over kamurocho, and all over the bodies of people they used to (at least in concept) care for. with lethal weapons. it is catharsis via bloodbath, not by pushing your body and mind to the limit in man to man combat, but by pulling a trigger before the other guy can hurt you, or even think about hurting you, for the crime of existing as the wrong kind of thing.

and i just don't think that's in line with rgg's beliefs.

yes, it's probably fair for dead souls' characters to kill zombies. i'm not against that. i'm also not against games letting you do purposeless violence. i spent a good amount of my elementary school years killing oblivion npcs for shits, like. that's not what bothers me about dead souls.

rgg as a series has always taken a hard stance in both its game design and narrative choices against killing and for the potential for redemption in its enemies. and i think the lengths to which it goes to promote that despite the probably-lethal moves you do and the improbability of a harmless do-gooder yakuza is one of the most endearing things about the games. so for this one entry to disregard that key theme for the sake of a genre shift that flopped super hard, well? i dunno. it feels weird i guess. it's out of place not just because it's a dramatic shift in gameplay and style and also zombies are only a thing here (and the supernatural/fantastical are thus only prominent here), but because of what those shifts imply.

so, uh. yeah. my pre-dead-souls thoughts that dead souls wasn't that out of pocket bc rgg's just kinda weird? turns out it was actually super weird to have a zombie shooter in there, but for way way deeper reasons than anyone gives it credit for.

(footnotes in tags)

[coolspacequips]

Have been reading this sci-fi romance and like UGH u ever really wish a book was just at least a little better??? There's stuff in this that's interesting but also a lot about it that's so... Juvenile and kinda undercooked lol...... But it's so hard finding good romance bc for a lot of romance readers this is enough, except even then not really since they prolly didn't fuck nasty enough in this book for the ppl that just need the merest pretense to read smut (which is fine if that's what u like there's just an oversaturation of this, esp when you can have a light plot/heavy smut story with slightly better writing and internal world building without having to explain and describe the 'boring' parts 😅)

[optiwashere]

I liked doing this last week, but it will get kinda repetitive in the coming weeks. So I'm not sure if I'll do it often while I'm posting the modern/band AU, but oh well!

It's another Saturday morning in a blanket with new music. Truly all I could ever need to write.

Here's what I've been working on...

Modern/band AU is fit and ready to start posting this upcoming week. Chapter [redacted] is complete, and I'm now far enough ahead that even a few weeks of busy life won't stop a regular posting schedule. And if I keep up writing then I'll be able to post around Xmas without needing a break!

Chapter [redacted+1] has an opening sentence, which is often the hardest part.

The outline for the AU has been modified a little. Combined three chapters into one, split out another chapter into two. Probably lots of consolidation to be done otherwise. There's a weird bit in the outline that's kinda fuzzy, but I'm sure I'll knuckle my way through it since it's not thematically deep. Might even be another chapter consolidation. This fic is definitely going to be longer than the 40k I was hoping it would top out at...

Editing the previous chapters has been a fun exercise in trimming the fat! I still want there to be scenes that are just ~vibes~ but I axed 1k words and the whole thing is cleaner for it.

More Minthara/Lae'zel is in the works, but it's mostly only the skeleton of an idea as I've had to rework it multiple times. I've a little under 1k actually written, and I'm not too convinced of what it is at the moment either. Quite frustrating.

Another seedling of an idea for non-smutty Asheera/Shadowheart fics. But it's really just "Shadowheart meets Asheera's parents" and boy I'm not ready for the mixed emotions Shadowheart's going to feel in that one. You know it's not just going to be fluff.

The Gauntlet/Nightsong segment for my core Shadowheart/Asheera series has a skeleton of an outline now. The POVs have been picked, the core beats are there, and I know it's going to hurt like a motherfucker to write some of this.

[glittertimes]

I think I finally understand what’s at the root of all my weird little problems and why I have such a hard time connecting with my body.

I do so much work to read and be smart as a defensive mechanism because I’m a really kind caring person and that makes me a little naive and I look a lot younger than I am so I feel like people think I’m easy to manipulate.

But then there’s a part of me that feels like it’s not safe to be smart, and that sounds so weird and counterintuitive but I realized it’s because I’m terrified of being seen.

Like if I’m smart I’m going to have to act on it and challenge people and that’ll bring attention on me that I don’t want to deal with so I’ll continue to be the kind naive nice girl even if people are mistreating me because it’s not safe to be seen it’s not safe to be smart.

Like my body will not use basic protection methods like setting boundaries, saying no or standing up for myself because that requires me to get over that fear of being seen. Like my body fears being seen more than it fears being mistreated and that’s kind of terrifying.

[memes-saved-me]

I miss season 3 Robin

[arainesque]

I'd love to jump into the head of someone who is more emotionally aware than me. (I'm not smart, please don't interpret this as that) but I've always intellectualized things (always) for as long as I can remember.

I'd just love to experience the world from a perspective where you know what you're feeling.

[ichiharas-familiar]

Below the cut for discussions of fictional abuse/violence, my own sexuality, sadomasochism etc. Nominally about chainsaw man discourse but really about all discourses that claim to be able to determine whether something is horny by how much it hurts to watch.

If I see one more post claiming that Makima being hot or being intentionally sexualized is in diametric opposition to her being truly evil and harmful to Denji I am going to scream. Makima is a sexualized figure BECAUSE she is evil. The suffering is the point. The cruelty is the point.

There's been some normalization of BDSM (and also of course an ensuing backlash) but a lot of it has laundered D/S and S/M desires through an idea of 'really all of these are about wanting to be strongly desired' or 'really all of this is about wanting to avoid guilt for your sexual desires'. I don't think this is surprising, those motivations are strong for a lot of people! But this forgets that for some people the pain and distress are the point *in and of themselves*.

My evidence for all of this? Sadism is a fundamental part of my sexuality, i have my own mind and discussions with other sadomasochists to go on. I'm not going to get into it too much but believe me when I say that a large part of sadism can in fact be an eroticization of the long term damage and suffering of the subject. For me, and for most sadists I would assume, this desire is largely limited to fantasy, fiction, and roleplay (IE I would feel massive guilt if I actually caused a partner this sort of long term harm). There are masochists like this as well (See: Chainsaw Man's erotic appeal). Portraying something as deeply physically/emotionally/psychologically damaging to the person affected does not preclude an erotic reading. In fact, it often enhances it. I feel like this is an extremely obvious point but it seems to disappear a lot in discussions. Maiden Rose is not *not* sexualizing rape and abuse because of it's extreme focus on physical pain, bodily harm, guilt, shame, and suffering, those are the things it is sexualizing.

And simultaneously, eroticization does not preclude an intention to provoke empathy or facilitate catharsis for people who read these series. Again, I feel like this should be obvious- I have read series including eroticized suffering that have also made me *sob* (while being hot).

And also honestly I really resent the idea that erotic pleasure is fundamentally different from other pleasures. Moving into live action, Martyrs is one of my favorite movies of all time. One of the reasons I think it's so brilliant is that it is designed in such a way that almost all of the pleasure one might normally obtain from portrayals of violence (think of most horror or action movies here) is removed. It is not beautiful, it is not cut in a way to build anticipation, the perpetrators of violence are mostly incredibly nondescript, they never seen to enjoy what they do, and the movie forces you into a place of extreme empathy for the protagonists- who are the victims of truly awful torture. I would still say that watching it is a 'pleasurable experience' for me. I get no glee from it, no sexual arousal, no adrenaline. But I am still enjoying watching a portrayal of another person's suffering! If I didn't enjoy it, I would only have watched it once. The pleasure is the intellectual pleasure of watching a well constructed piece of art, the emotional pleasure of *controlled suffering* that you know is not actually happening to you or anyone else and will end when the movie stops. These are real pleasures, and they are just as motivating in seeking out stories for me as erotic pleasures (in fact they are far *more* motivating most of the time). I think people hesitate to call these feelings pleasure when they come from something with such an intense subject matter, but they are pleasures.

[biff-adventurer]

btw i am VERY embarrassed of all the stuff i write p much all the time even when i share it so it's like... you either share it b/c you feel the need to put it out there, or you keep it to yourself b/c you don't feel it needs to be out there... simple, easy... post and then hide under your desk, that's what i do