#another reason i think this type fits clover is bc it is my type too

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Clover's personality (in-depth)

This thing turned out way longer than intended. As promised, I wrote my opinions in regards to Clover's mbti; I also wanted to include the enneagram but figured it would be too much, so I'll do that separaretly. For those who wanna get straight to the point, just scroll to the end of the post for a pic of the functions I think Clover has. But if you want more details, read the whole thing. Probably not many people will wanna do that, but I had fun, lol. Please excuse me for nerding out

Analysis

Even before they got into the Underground, Clover thought to themselves "Ok, this is a dangerous mountain and I ain't coming back, I'm probably gonna die and therefore not live to see the rest of my life play out BUT I'm gonna follow my values anyway. They're worth the risk." To me, right off the bat, that's Fi over Ti (aka inner values and morals over inner facts and logic).

I've done some research on this stuff and found out how "Fi knows the value of something not by analyzing it but by feeling it deep inside themselves that it is how it should be" Ti has to be as objective as possible, Fi doesn't. So I sat down and thought about how exactly Clover approached situations.

I feel like their main reasoning for being in the Underground were their inner values and beliefs of finding out what happened to the children. That's why I'd say they're an introvert rather than an extrovert (it's not because they're quiet and reserved, although they are, but because Clover's inner world affects their outer world). Now, both Ti and Fi look inward, and those inner thoughts and feelings affect how they interact with the external world. The real question is: is Clover objective enough to be considered a dominant Ti user?

We can see in the Vengeance route that Clover is stubborn with their beliefs and refuses to look at things from a more... logical POV: "Asgore killed five humans. Is it fair to wipe out every other monster in my way who gives me even the slightest reason to do it?" Martlet was the only exception because she was the only one who had tried to be nice and understanding. Clover's dark side is that they're tunnel-visioned and see morality as black and white (don't look deeper as to WHY the monsters do what they do), and blindly follow their own beliefs over what objectively makes sense. Just like Ceroba, who I'm positive is a feeler (she only considers how she felt about Chujin and not how skilled of an engineer he actually was, even when there's clear proof he wasn't the best at his job). 

Objectively, it's not fair to kill so many monsters after only five humans were killed. If Clover wanted fair vengeance, they would have stopped after five monsters were killed. But no. According to Clover's own logic, everyone morally imperfect, everyone who's hurt them, who tried to hurt them, or messed up somehow, must die. So, Clover isn't thinking about what makes sense; they're thinking about what makes sense to THEM, and stubbornly hold onto that till the end (again, like Ceroba), even after Martlet's warnings. She says how the Royal Guard will be after them.

The logical (T) thing to do would be to STOP before things become even messier, but once again, no. Clover doesn't care about the consequences, only fulfilling their mission that is driven by their own set of values. No matter which route you choose, you will be presented with Clover's own version of what "justice" means. It's not the objective truth, it's not what's the logical thing to do; they follow their own framework based on their (our) choices.

"If unhealthy INFPs are dealing with threatened values or viewpoints that oppose their own, they can go the other way and imagine that others are all corrupt, thinking badly of them, and deluded. They may see themselves as the only people who see “the truth”, or the only people who really care to make a difference in the world. They can become especially harsh and critical of others and take on a martyr role, gradually secluding themselves from other people". - this feels like geno Clover; they thought they were the hero but they were playing the villain all along

Now that I think about it, the logical thing to do, the one that makes the most sense, would be never to have entered Mt. Ebott in the first place. And if vengeance was what Clover wanted to do, it is fair and makes objective sense to kill only five monsters (since that's how many humans died). But as explained, Clover didn't follow that logical conclusion, but rather their own twisted sense of justice. The same goes for neutral. It's Clover who chooses who gets to live and who gets to die based on their own beliefs and feelings, which are not backed up by facts. Everything they do they do because they themselves feel like it should be done. They are the one who decide who gets to live and who doesn't based on their own opinion/how severe they think the misdeed of the final boss is. This counts for the regular monsters who attack them, too; again, THEIR own subjective decision.

For example, they might see Dalv's actions as acceptable/forgiveable and spare him, but not Starlo's and kill him. Objectively, both characters are messy in their own way, but Clover gets to be the "judge" and decide their fate, not objectively looking at the situation, but subjectively. In short, according to them, Dalv may deserve to live, but not Starlo. 

And even if they're a dominant Ti user, which I don't think they are, Clover is more past and future-oriented than present-oriented (N over S). As mentioned, they thought about how much they'd risk by going down Mt. Ebott (potentially dying, and definitely never seeing the surface ever again, or their family) but they followed their heart's desires; to them, morals and ethics (their own morals and ethics) were more important than what the more logical thing to do was (stay on the surface where it's safe).

In other words, they could already "predict" what would happen in the future, while in the present moment (the beginning of the journey).

And right before sacrificing their soul in pacifist, they think about how their death would affect ALL the monsters in the future, whether they had directly met and befriended them or not, even though they wouldn't be there to see it.

Clover seems to be able to easily move between the past, present and future, unlike sensors, who are mainly in the present moment (this is what I've heard somewhere at some point and remembered it, dunno how true it is). They can easily recall the past, and what they remember are things that moved them on the inside.

I've heard some of my friends say that Clover's character arc was to become a kinder person (develop their Fe), which, honestly, I don't think is the case. They simply acted on their inner views of what justice truly means, without further analyzing whatever they believed justice to be.

In pacifist, they're naturally selfless and kind and forgiving: a bit of a prankster, but they're one of "the best souls" according to Martlet. Just look at the ACT options that they used to befriend monsters. Quietly listens to Decibat, offers Dalv a handshake (and friendship), easily forgives Martlet, Starlo, and even Ceroba (+ gives her a hug), endures so many hardships yet keeps their heart pure and selfless. 

They were always driven by something bigger than themselves (like Chujin, who I also think is a N user).

ISTPs are more adventurous and independent and flexible and focused on current problems in the present moment; Clover has been future-oriented from the start; they depended on Toriel to take care of them, and didn't try to immediately "adapt" to the monster world. Their 1st reaction was to stay safe and cozy. ESTJs (yeah, at some point I thought Clover could be one) are more "ruthless" in their pursuits, they "force" others to adopt their inner values. Clover doesn't do this in any route; they simply act upon their own beliefs, but aren't demanding that other monsters to have those same beliefs.

That's why I think they're an INFP.

Functions

Fi (dominant) – "If something goes against their moral code, they will not go through with it." It went against Clover’s moral code to spare monsters in genocide and abort the mission, so they didn’t, regardless of Martlet’s warnings.

"Fi dominants are inclined to speak up against beliefs or actions that go against their personal values or express disapproval of certain behaviors." I can't find the screenshot, but in the Mines, if you interact with the character who's in the same room as one of the puzzles, Clover will find out how that character pulled a prank on that guy who later got a promotion in the pacifist end credits (I need to reply the game to find the screenshot). But basically Clover was upset that their own morals weren't met and gave them a "disapproving look" or smth

"Ti dominants most often feel compelled to speak out when people are acting inconsistent (ie: contradicting themselves) or when people are being illogical from the Ti user’s perspective." I think Clover reacted to the above situation as a Fi user

"Unlike Fe users, Fi users are very blunt and direct. Fi and Te creates a person who is brutally honest about their opinions and feelings. If they don’t like a person, they will let that person know." Not a person in this case, but an example of this are the options we get for Martlet's questionnaire. Clover will have no problem honestly giving her the lowest scores for both questions; we also also get the chance to honestly tell Ceroba that we're not into Starlo's training. There are these cases where they're direct as well:

...and blunt:

they would have given at least a smile or a thumbs up, but no, their honest opinion is their honest opinion

"They appear cold and withdrawn, but tend to warm up as they get to know a person."

Ne (auxiliary) – "Ne views a situation from multiple angles and motivations" I feel like this is best seen in pacifist; this is exactly why Clover decided to give up their soul in the end; they saw all the motivations of the monsters, from many different angles. On the flip side, in the vengeance route, it’s the complete opposite situation: Clover only looks at things from their own pov, completely disregarding others. That’s the thing about the INFP dark side: INFPs become "disillusioned or stuck in their ways." This 100% describes Clover at their worst: stuck in their ways is already explained, while we can say they were disillusioned when even Martlet turned against them/gave up on them (in Genocide). That was enough of a reason for Clover not to feel bad about finishing her off. They never liked her, but they definitely liked her more than anyone else, so I’d say it counts.

"Creative, open-minded, and able to think outside the box" We can say Clover’s creative when they build Axis’ robot companion, solved the two puzzles in the Mines, they’re also most likely into role-playing just like Starlo, based on their clothes (and they seemed into the whole larping thing with him), and how they seem to be into drawing; open-minded, definitely (Clover with everyone; the pacifist route in a nutshell); able to think outside the box (this goes hand in hand with them being creative: I forgot to mention the many creative ways they found to befriend monsters)

"Ne lives in the present like Se does but makes connections to past and future." Imo, this is exactly what Clover does (their sacrifice in the future, and all the things other monsters had said to them in the past; however, they DO interact with the present world at the same time. This is what I meant when I mentioned how they "jump from and connect all 3")

Si (tertiary) – "happy in their comfort zone" Is this Clover? Yeah. Initially, this was their "default" reaction/behavior: with Toriel. They subconsciously became more independent thanks to good old Flowey. As I said, their values led them to take the risk and come into the Underground in the first place, not adventure/excitement (the way I see it). Were they also seeking the truth? Yeah again, they wanted to know the truth behind the whole situation, but I think it had more to do with how they had found the fact that no other humans bothered to look for the kids immoral.

"Si users may draw on their past experiences to guide their present actions and decisions" Example, how the detailed lines they remembered everyone said in true pacifist, influenced them to make the decision to die in the present moment. Or when they asked Ceroba if she would date Starlo, after hearing and remembering Crestina mention his crush on her beforehand, wanting to set them up.

"Si users have a strong memory for past experiences and details" Yep, explained above. Also, dunno if this counts as noticing details, but we can make them beat the Shufflers’ game with ease.

"Si users are typically practical and realistic in their approach to solving problems" The Snowdin mini-quests come to mind (although they use past information here too to figure out what each character needs to be helped). Also, how they fixed the elevator by using a pickaxe (most practical & realistic choice). They’re also pretty rational while dealing with Guardener, and in general, while dealing with enemies.

Te (inferior) – I guess this is why I suspected they could be an ESTJ.

"seen as leaders" By everyone.

"Come up with ideas quickly" Pretty much throughout the game. They’re more low-key about this than ESTJs though.

"Ruthlss and domineering" This is them in vengeance route

"Extraverted Thinkers recognize the emotional content, but then they set it aside to focus on the facts" I feel like this inferior function of theirs is mostly seen in flawed pacifist. They recognized Ceroba’s emotional situation, but chose to be fair and just instead.

"Te users are logical" Recognizing the dangers of the Underground and deciding to stay with Toriel. We can also say it makes sense that Clover attacked those who attacked them first, and finished Ceroba off (Te is what is objective, but from the external world)

"Though they are generally free spirits, they like to have a certain order in their lives. They do enjoy structure, just as long as it does not intrude with their feelings/morals/ethics/etc. They like to be the ones to create the structure, not to have the structure to be created for them."  Vengeance route and Clover’s "mission" come to mind. Basically, the structure is that, whoever Clover sees as morally flawed, gets to die. And they stick to it

tl;dr this picture pretty much explains the way I see Clover's functions in a nutshell ↓

[kibaes]

Z please~

Z - Just ramble about something fan-related, go go go 

Ah I’m in too many fandoms, I’ll rant about the main thing on my mind (If you want a specific one feel free to send another ask!)

So I’ve said this before but I’ll say it again: Black Clover is criminally underrated. People saw one or two episodes and immediately decided it was shitty because Asta screams a lot. Obviously, if that’s something that bothers you then you don’t owe the show to keep watching it, but just the way people treat it in the anime fanbase is annoying. One of the things that’s most annoying (that I’ve also said before) is that while Black Clover is considered trash (Western fanbase), BNHA is considered the best anime ever. BNHA is so popular that even non-anime fans watch it! Don’t get me wrong, I freakin’ love BNHA, but it gets too much-undeserved praise. So again, I like both shows a lot, but in this rant, I’ll explain why BNHA isn’t much better than Black Clover (heck, I prefer Black Clover).

 I’ll start with the most obvious and talked about reasons- the way female characters are treated in each show. Some people praise BNHA for how they treat female characters, which I really don’t get. Other than an episode and a half where you kind of see Momo’s insecurities and her getting over them, the female characters don’t get any development or focus. Even Uraraka, the main female protagonist, doesn’t have much of a personality other than liking Deku, which by the way, is another annoying trait that too many characters in BNHA have. Now Asta also has his own harem which makes no sense at all (why would Mimosa like Asta when YUNO IS RIGHT THERE?), but unlike Deku’s harem, the characters in Asta’s harem have their own development and personalities, the most notable being Noelle, the main female protagonist. Noelle started off as a snobby rich person who deep down was unconfident and didn’t believe in herself, but throughout the anime/manga, she overcame (some of) her fears and managed to control her magic and acquire new spells. Having said that, Asta helped her overcome her fears, making her crush on him make some sense, while Uraraka’s crush on Deku doesn’t really make sense. BNHA uses the same excuse that Deku made her realize she can become a better hero or something like that, but this doesn’t really make much sense because it’s not like she wasn’t planning on doing that before. You can say she used to want to be a hero to earn easy money, but that’s not entirely true, and I think it’s safe to say Uraraka’s crush on Deku comes out of nowhere, especially when you compare it to Noelle’s crush on Asta. Uraraka’s crush on Deku is more like Rebecca’s crush on Asta- kind of pointless and doesn’t develop the plot or the characters in any way. Again, I have nothing against Deku x Uraraka and heck I even ship it, but when that’s all the main female protagonist is amounted to you can’t say it has strong female characters. In addition to that, most of the female pro-heroes in BNHA use their sex appeal in one way or another to defeat bad guys or make themselves more popular. In my opinion, it’s fine if there’s one character like that, but having 90% of the female characters do that just makes it uninteresting and annoying. On the other hand, I can’t think of any female character who uses her sex appeal to battle (maybe Vanessa a little, although she uses it more to persuade Finral to fight). There’s Charlotte who’s really cool and strong, and her crush on Yami is adorable (you can say it takes away from her character and her main trait is liking Yami the same way Uraraka likes Deku. I personally disagree but can see why someone would say this, but then again Charlotte isn’t the main female protagonist like Uraraka), and if you don’t think she’s a good example of a strong female character, read the manga and wait for Mereoleona, who’s quite possibly my all-time favorite female characters. Another small addition to this point can be their outfits- BC has much less revealing outfits than BNHA has. Plus too many of the revealing outfits worn in BNHA are worn by young girls, some who aren’t even comfortable in them! Long story short, BNHA definitely doesn’t deserve praise for the way it treats female characters, especially when you compare it to a show like Black Clover, who does so much better.

Now for a more personal opinion- Asta is much much better than Deku. People like to praise BNHA saying it’s progressive because it’s not like other Shounen shows. One of the main differences I see between BNHA and other Shounen shows is Deku. While most Shounens have an overpowered goofball who eats a lot as the main character, BNHA’s Deku is pretty different. Personally, I don’t even like Deku, so him being the main character is a big turn off for me (he did get better in season 3 but in the manga, he continues to annoy me). Now let me explain my point better. There’s a reason most Shounen main characters are similar- ITS GOOD. I’m not saying having something different is bad (I’ll come back to this), but the stereotypical main characters Shounen’s have are adorable and always loved. A lot of people dislike Black Clover because Asta screamed too much. First off, he screams less later on, and it actually becomes funny later (characters in the show itself address it). Also if that’s the only problem you can try to read the manga. Like I said before, these types of main characters are popular because they’re successful. They’re the type of character that goes around influencing people to be better without realizing it (Asta, Luffy, Naruto, Natsu). Deku fits the role of the unconfident kid that later is inspired by one of these characters, rather than being the one that does the inspiring. Deku gets so much attention just for existing- in the beginning, he did risk his life despite not having any quirk which was cool, but later he just does what anyone else (or at least a few other characters) would do in his situation. We’ve seen many characters put their lives in danger, and just because Deku just happens to conveniently be in places where he gets to show that he’s willing to risk his life, he gets all the credit. Adding to this, I’ll never get over how All Might picked a random kid he saw trying to save his friend (which by the way, Deku still considering Bakugo a friend is baffling to me because of how he treated him. Get a clue!) over freakin’ Mirio!!!! Mirio fits the main character role much better than Deku- he has a quirk that seems useless but after hard training, he managed to make it one of the best quirks out there. He also gave up so much to save one little girl (which by the way, Deku stole all the attention in the end and now Eri likes him for no reason). Anyways, I know most people do like Deku so these points might not seem too strong, but I can’t really see how a character like Deku can be main. He’s pretty boring and I think he fits the role of a side character much better. Something that could’ve made BNHA more interesting to me (with Deku as the main character) is if he never got the One For All. Obviously, it’d make for a pretty different show, but it’s pretty boring when you know the main character already has the strongest power ever and he will become the best superhero because of it. You can even compare this to a show like One Piece- Luffy has the Gum Gum fruit, sure, but no one ever said that’s the strongest devil fruit there is, we know there are stronger ones. Plus it’s never been confirmed Luffy will become the Pirate King (although it’s pretty safe to assume he will be). A better example is how we don’t know if Asta will become the Wizard King. He probably will, but there is still some element of mystery whereas in BNHA one of the first lines is Deku confirming he’ll become the strongest hero, which as I said before, isn’t a big surprise considering he has the strongest quirk there is. Personally, I think Deku staying quirkless and overcoming hurdles that way is much more interesting (again, would make for a different show but still), which is exactly what happens in Black Clover with Asta which is one reason I really love BC. Asta manages to become a strong magic knight despite his lack of magic and how everyone always ridicules him. Plus it never gets old to see a bad guy making fun of Asta for not having any Mana and then Asta destroying them. Anyways, Deku still can’t control his powers which is a big focus of the show which is good, since if he could control them there really wouldn’t be any point, but the fact he has the strongest quirk makes him becoming the strongest hero pretty obvious and anticlimactic. To conclude this segment, everyone hates on Asta for being an annoying main character while they praise Deku for being different. Different does not equal good, they gave up on Asta too quickly in my opinion, and personally, I just don’t like Deku.

Another reason people dropped Black Clover was because the story is pretty generic. I agree that at first when I heard Asta wanted to become the Wizard King, I thought it was pretty silly, but once Yuno and Asta leave the village, it becomes much more interesting. Plus, there is an actual bigger plot like in BNHA which most people didn’t even reach before they decided to drop the show. If you aren’t a fan of Shounen shows, then I get why you might’ve dropped Black Clover (no offense though why did you start it? It has ‘Shounen trash’ written all over it) but if you generally are, I really really recommend to give it another try!

Now a short list of other things I love in BC more than in BNHA that I can’t really backup: the art style, the openings (fight me) and focus distribution (the amount of focus each character gets).

Despite all the shit I said, I LOVE BNHA!! It’s a great show with an awesome plot, cool fighting sequences, characters, character interactions, and pace. I’m just tired of seeing it put on a pedestal while Black Clover is considered bad. I just pointed out things that I believe BC is better at to put things into perspective, but they’re both great shows I highly recommend!