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dragonsarecats · 10 months

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I'M SORRY FOR WORDING IT LIKE THAT I played the Golden Deers, some of my favorite queer ship are with Deers and some of my favorite character are among the deers! My favorite deer ship is probably Leonie x Lysithea ( She litteraly say Leonie would make an incredible partner! Why do their support stop at B again?? ) and my otp is Hilda x Edelgard ( do not judge me I have REASONS ). And also, one of my favorite queer headcanon is trans aro-ace Claude! So I genuinely love the Deers as queers!

However, for me the deer and the diverse queer content around them is heavily a fandom thing. When I say the deer are "too straight for me", I meant it for the game directly. Like you have the Black Eagles where not only litteraly every characters is canon queer/has heavily subtext but has also its whole narrative drenched in queer metaphor! You have the Blue Lions where, while there's less "canon queer", you litteraly cannot say most of its members are straight with how heavy the subtext that's barely even subtext anymore is: there's 0 straight explanation for Felix crying more at Dimitri death than his wife, or him dying the same day as Sylvain because they can't live without each other.

But for the Deers... You have Hilda/Marianne and Claude/Lorenz as the most popular one but while their relationship are so fascinating, when you only look only at the game, they feel too platonic? Especially compared to a Dedue/Dimitri ( like a family in private. took up a post at his grave for the most of his days. BURIED BESIDE EACHOTHER ) or a Ferdinand/Hubert ( rare A+ support, with blushing, their own little surname, Ferdinand/Edelgard support changing just to mention Ferdinand drinking coffee ). Otherwise you have Leonie/Lysithea which stop at B. You have Raphael/Ignatz where they decided to just push the relationship to make their ending all about Ignatz with his sister.

Like really, the Deers manage to have less in game queer moment than the Church of Seiros, Rhea aside, of all things! We were so robbed! The rainbow house deserve better. I'm a lesbian and after all my playthrough Verdant Winds was my only route where I had to marry a man, all I wanted was a lavender wedding with Claude while I have a passionate romance with Leonie :(

To sum up: Lysithea and Leonie should kiss, Intelligent Systems are fucking cowards

For the fandom I'll have to disagree, I think the Deers have a lot a queer content and it's amazing :] My only thing might be how Claude has become the first character you think of when talking about bi fe3h character which is kinda telling how wlw are dismissed in the general fandom, but its better than some people insisting he's totally straigh so eh ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

( Also I big agree on Hilda support being gem, she's such a great character and one that's much more complex than given credit for!! )

Oh and I think I disagree with Deers being the more family found-esq ( saying that bc it's a great subject of I discussion and I want to hear more about your opinion on the matter )

The Lions is the family where they all stick together through thick and thin, following Dimitri to hell and back, but their relationship are complexe and not always healthy ( mostly at the beginning with like Dimitri & Felix or Ingrid & Sylvain ).

The Eagles are the found family where a lot of them bitch about each other at first but they end up with deep relationship where they take care for each other and stand together against the world, even sticking together during the time skip ( also because they kinda all killed each other dad ).

The Deers are for me more like an actual close group of friend: their life are not going to revolve around each other like it does with the other houses, but they won't hesitate to come for that 5 years reunion to see the other. It's kinda like you say they're so normal in a good way! They tease each other but they don't hate each other in the way of a Dimitri/Felix, a Caspar/Petra, a Ferdinand/Hubert ( except for Lorenz but like, it's Lorenz ). They won't kill the other dad, but they'll sure as hell support each other like Lorenz and Ignatz or Marianne and Raphael. They might not start a revolution together but they will listen to the other even when it’s total heresy ( Leonie & Claude, such an incredible support :’) ) and help the other to reach their goal… I do agree with you it’s linked to not knowing each other before, but on that, isn’t knowing each other before more of a Lion thing than not knowing being a Deer thing? I don’t know, the BE are kind of a middle ground.

( Sorry for my ramblings- It's so fun talking about the deers )

AA anon thank you for the long ask!! Okay I'm gonna take this point by point under the readmore!

"My favorite deer ship s probably Leonie x Lysithea ( She litteraly say Leonie would make an incredible partner! Why do their support stop at B again?? )"

INCREDIBLY fair and based of you, lol, I read Lysithea as gay and it's 100% because of the support conversations she has with Leonie and Hilda (which to me implies an ADORABLE crush--Lysithea seems to genuinely respect and admire Hilda which is not something you'd expect from like, a surface level reading of their characters).

I'm gonna admit my own bias here in terms of canon text endings--my favorite Lysithea ending is her paired ending with Lorenz. It really reads like a queer platonic relationship to me--I don't really get romantic vibes from either of them (gay as they are) towards each other, but the commitment and care they have for each other genuinely warms my heart. Especially the fact that like, Lorenz is SO determined to ensure Lysithea takes care of herself and the ending doesn't really imply that she dies young (only that her health is delicate/poor) in comparison to others, and she and her family get to live the quiet life they want. Of course, as an aro/ace disabled person, I think it probably hits differently for me than people who aren't just because of the fact that after the most recent time I saw their support chain/got their ending I teared up a bit (and also why I'm now adoring your trans-aro-ace Claude).

ANYWAYS, I agree IS are cowards and that's why Edelgard is the only Lord who can romance both male/female Byleth.

"For the fandom I'll have to disagree, I think the Deers have a lot a queer content and it's amazing :]"

I probably didn't word what I meant completely lol correctly-- it's not that the Deer don't have a lot of queer content, it's just that overall, they have less content in general made for them then the Black Eagles and Blue Lions.

I do ALSO love so much of the queer content made for the Deers! The Three Houses fandom is amazing.

"My only thing might be how Claude has become the first character you think of when talking about bi fe3h character which is kinda telling how wlw are dismissed in the general fandom, but its better than some people insisting he's totally straight so eh ¯\_(ツ)_/¯"

Okay, so I was kind of dancing around saying this to your last ask but you hit the nail on the head lol. I genuinely think the reason why the Deer might come across as less queer is because the "main ship" for them, so to speak, is the WLW pairing Hilda/Marianne.

Ironically when I think about bi fe3h characters my first thought is consistently Lindhardt?

"Oh and I think I disagree with Deers being the more family found-esq ( saying that bc it's a great subject of I discussion and I want to hear more about your opinion on the matter )

Okay so I definitely agree with you that they're all found family, explicitly in the text lol. What I meant in my statement that they're the most found-family-esq is that you get to see the development of ALL their relationships and becoming that family together on screen.

The Lions (a mess, and I love them), are pretty heavily involved with each other at the beginning of the game. A lot of the intrigue with them is the fact that they all have backstory stuff going on with each other (save for Ashe, I think, but we kill his dad on screen so). Mercedes and Annette went to Sorcery School together, Felix/Sylvain/Dimitri/Ingrid are all childhood friends with intense complications, and the trauma and deliberate kindness that brought together Dimitri and Dedue makes me emotional.

Similarly to them, the Black Eagles all have a history with each other (save for Dorothea) as well. There's the insane and amazing devotion between Edelgard and Hubert, Lindhardt and Caspar's childhood friendship, the onesided rivalry going on between Ferdinand and Edelgard since they were kids and Hubert's judgement of Ferdinand for it. Petra and Bernadetta, technically don't have pre-established relationships with the others, but in ways that are deliberately intense. Petra is blatantly a political hostage in the Academy Era in a way that really informs her relationship with Edelgard and Hubert even before they get to know her. Additionally Bernadetta's isolation creates a kind of infamy between her and the other nobles.

The Golden Deer, on the other hand, don't really have as many intense bonds going in (and thus, in my opinion, makes it easier for Byleth to integrate amongst them as an eventual equal). There's the preestablished dynamic of Lorenz being suspicious of and wanting to best Claude, but it's a recently developed dynamic, as Claude only appeared a year ago. This would be a bigger personal issue if he was leading a house like the Blue Lions or the Black Eagles (noble heavy as they are), but it's barely an issue in the Deer and not just because of the commoners. Hilda, Lorenz, Lysithea, and Marianne are not close. In all his supports with the three of them, Lorenz is the one reaching out because of his belief that their time in the Academy should be used to form better and closer connections with other nobles. There is nothing to imply that there was any substance to their pre-existing relationships. The only two who have anything to their relationship before the game starts, are Raph and Iganatz, who haven't spoken in years, mostly due to guilt on Ignatz's behalf for what happened to Raphael's family.

So as a result, you get to see the bonds being formed and deepened with the Golden Deer from scrap. Obviously some development happens off screen during the time skip, but other than that the Deer's found family forms and develops completely on screen, which is why I think it's the most found family-esq of the three.

In fact, it's a huge part of Claude's story. It's something you don't really notice in his route, but it's really clear when you don't pick him. While Edelgard and Dimitri kind of can't function and literally can't without Byleth's support, Claude has probably the highest survivability rate when you don't choose him of any character save technically Marianne. He survives the Blue Lions route, the Black Eagles route (if you spare him), and is implied to have survived the Silver Snow route. When he doesn't have Byleth, he still survives, so not choosing him isn't as dramatic. But it's easy to see that without Byleth as a teacher, he doesn't open up enough to the Deer. Dimitri and Edelgard have assured loyalty from their houses (even Ferdie and Felix) becuase of these pre-established relationships and positions, but Claude has to earn it. That's why Hilda, despite being his vassal, is recruit-able so long as you don't choose Black Eagles (the only route where he can die). Without Byleth, although the Deer do grow close, they don't do it as quick or as closely as they do with the Professor. Claude is a character who's never been able to truly rely on others, even if they care about him, and being able to rely on Byleth allows him to open up and rely on the Deer and truly trust them. I mean, Claude's two most relied upon people in the Deer (as seen in 3Hopes when he goes against Dimitri) are Hilda and Lorenz. I don't think people talk enough about how insane it is that Claude trusts Hilda Goneril with his life, considering he's an Alymran prince.

That's also why I think the Deer are so good for Byleth. I don't think any of the other route's are bad for Byleth at all, but I think the deer provide something to Byleth that neither the Lions or the Eagles can bring to her: a single of equivalency. Byleth is only slightly older than her students in the Academy Era and is in fact younger than most of them in the War Era, and yet it's only really with the Deer that she feels like she's amongst peers (whether it be because of the commoner/noble ratio or that she's as much of a stranger to them as they are to each other.) I mean, Claude is literally the only character who doesn't call refer to her by her Profession.

Anyways, TLDR: I think they're the most found family because a huge part of the Golden Deer route is them getting to know and love each other from scratch, and being a found family is a much bigger thematic aspect for them then it is for the other two houses.

"However, for me the deer and the diverse queer content around them is heavily a fandom thing. When I say the deer are "too straight for me", I meant it for the game directly. Like you have the Black Eagles where not only litteraly every characters is canon queer/has heavily subtext but has also its whole narrative drenched in queer metaphor! You have the Blue Lions where, while there's less "canon queer", you litteraly cannot say most of its members are straight with how heavy the subtext that's barely even subtext anymore is: there's 0 straight explanation for Felix crying more at Dimitri death than his wife, or him dying the same day as Sylvain because they can't live without each other."

"But for the Deers… You have Hilda/Marianne and Claude/Lorenz as the most popular one but while their relationship are so fascinating, when you only look only at the game, they feel too platonic? Especially compared to a Dedue/Dimitri ( like a family in private. took up a post at his grave for the most of his days. BURIED BESIDE EACHOTHER ) or a Ferdinand/Hubert ( rare A+ support, with blushing, their own little surname, Ferdinand/Edelgard support changing just to mention Ferdinand drinking coffee ). Otherwise you have Leonie/Lysithea which stop at B. You have Raphael/Ignatz where they decided to just push the relationship to make their ending all about Ignatz with his sister."

Okay, so I definitely agree with you that those things are canon queer and subtext, and that it's a shame they don't push the Raphael/Ignatz stuff and focus on Ignatz and Raph's sister (which is admittedly adorable to me).

Again, I'm aro/ace, so for me, queerness doesn't necessarily require romance as a prerequisite? Which is why I like Lorenz and Lysithea's ending, lol.

Hilda/Marianne in no way reads platonic to me, so I really disagree with you there. Hilda treats Marianne completely differently to how she treats everyone else in game. Their support chain is focused on how Hilda, who manipulates her way out of doing anything she doesn't want to, chooses to consistently over and over again do things for Marianne that she can't, and refuses to let Marianne feel bad over it. She leverages this into Marianne buying her pastries and them having a lunch date together. Their A support consists of Marianne questioning their regular dynamic of doing this and Hilda reassuring that she enjoys it so much she'd feel odd if it changed. They compliment each other to the point where Hilda starts to get a little flustered, and Hilda's even able to poke fun a little at Marianne and get Marianne to poke fun at her back. Marianne laughs at Hilda, and Hilda textually thinks it's adorable and can't even get mad at it because it's so cute. Marianne seems so genuinely happy and herself (even in negative ways!) with Hilda, and can rely on her in a way that doesn't make her feel inadequate or a burden.

I can understand as being able to view Claude/Lorenz as platonic, especially since I will never diverge from my Claude/Byleth endings, but I think they can also still be read pretty textually clear and potentially romantic. Part of this is Lorenz, who just, is very clearly gay to me? But again, part of this is the fact that a huge part of the Lorenz/Claude dynamic is them being viewed textually as equals, which is something that will and can never happen with Edelgard/Dimitri and their rival characters. Their support chain is all about getting to know and respect each other as they grow to care for one another, and while it isn't explicitly as romantic as Marianne/Hilda, I think their paired ending really speaks a lot for itself, in that Claude trusts Lorenz to be Fodlan's face of diplomacy towards Almyra. He trusts Lorenz to help him achieve his dream in the most direct way possible, something I think you can absolutely compare to his relationship with Byleth in their S-Support. Additionally about their support chain, their A-support really is about affirming to the player how close they've become, how fond they are of each other, and how neither of them can imagine the future of Fodlan without the other one in it. While there isn't a lot of direct text between Claude/Lorenz, I think there is absolutely enough subtext that you could read them romantically, especially from Lorenz's POV. The hard thing with this game is that each character needs to be able to be paired with Byleth, so they can never be textually obviously/blatantly in love with another character save for Byleth until their paired ending, and I think that absolutely holds doubly true for Lord characters, which is why I think Claude/Lorenz relies more on subtext.

I do think it's a shame that Lysithea doesn't have any A supports with women in her own house. Leonie like you mentioned is an adorable one, and I think Lysithea has a huge crush on Hilda in the ones with her, and there is definite potential in the one she has with Marianne (which in my opinion is a kinder, more gentle version of her supports with Ignatz).

I also think there's a few other support chains where there is a queer romance blossoming, they just don't get the chance to have an ending. A big one for me, personally, that I think deserved more, is Ignatz and Lorenz. I also think Leonie and Marianne's support chain was very cute, and deserved an A.

This is kind of what I was saying when I answered your last ask, I think, wherein the Deer have queer romance, but because the don't have a big blow up mlm ship (Claude is more often shipped with Dimitri + a lot of people aren't as fond of Lorenz as I think they should be lol), they kind of get sidelined as their big queer ship is WLW. And unfortunately in most fandoms, wlw ships are rarely as popular or have as much pushing force.

And also, I think, that the deer are queer without having as much romance. Their romantic pairings are far less set in store then the other two houses, I think, and part of that is because a lot of their endings read really queer platonic to me. Plus, a lot of the heavy romance lifting in the explicit text for a lot of supports tends to happen in the A/A+ region, and a several of the wlw/mlm golden deer pairings only go to B, which I think is a shame and forces them to rely more on subtext.

Additionally, because they're not the revolutionary or chivalry aligned House, a lot of their endings aren't written as...dramatically? Like I adore Felix/Sylvain to death (I have a print of them hanging next to my Claude one lol), but their childhood promise is very much the product of living in Faergus, similarly to how Hubert and Ferdinand's relationship is defined by them living in the Empire. I think because the Alliance politics are far less dramatic (or are far more dramatic in a visibly different way) the subtext for Claude and Lorenz's Romeo/Juliet for politics thing doesn't come across as huge as two characters who promised to die with each other as kids and keep it (insane I love them).

That's why in my original post I talk about loving how normal the Deer are, and I think ultimately a part of that comes from their setting: the Alliance. In my first play through, I specifically chose having my loyalties lie (in the initial meeting with the Lords) with the Alliance, because to me, someone who had no real context for the game, the Alliance was the closest thing to a democracy from what little we'd hard of each nation. Politics informs almost every aspect of the Golden Deer; sure it's played for angst and importance in the other two routes (Duscur/Sylvain's Crest Complex/Felix's problem with the chivalry system for the Blue Lions--with the latter two never being things that are textually resolved in the Kingdom's government--and Enbarr/those who Slither in the Dark for the Black Eagles), but Claude actually has to balance what other lords want in the War phase, and it's his ability to be so good at politicking that enables the Alliance to consistently remain neutral in the war. So a lot of the subtext stuff comes to fruition through the realm of politics in a way it doesn't entirely through the other two, if that makes sense. It's a huge gesture of love that Claude can trust Lorenz with his dream.

"The Deers are for me more like an actual close group of friend: their life are not going to revolve around each other like it does with the other houses, but they won't hesitate to come for that 5 years reunion to see the other. It's kinda like you say they're so normal in a good way! They tease each other but they don't hate each other in the way of a Dimitri/Felix, a Caspar/Petra, a Ferdinand/Hubert ( except for Lorenz but like, it's Lorenz ). They won't kill the other dad, but they'll sure as hell support each other like Lorenz and Ignatz or Marianne and Raphael. They might not start a revolution together but they will listen to the other even when it’s total heresy ( Leonie & Claude, such an incredible support :’) ) and help the other to reach their goal… I do agree with you it’s linked to not knowing each other before, but on that, isn’t knowing each other before more of a Lion thing than not knowing being a Deer thing? I don’t know, the BE are kind of a middle ground."

I both agree and disagree with what you've said here!

I think it's true, that in any route where you don't choose Byleth, the Deer are textually viewed much more as just close friends rather then found family, whereas I think if you chose their route they end up much closer (as I said above). I think the Black Eagles and Blue Lions have their lives, by nature, revolve around each other since they're literally all Nobles and thus part of the governning system of this world (with the exception of Dorothea). I think the Golden Deer have to make it a much more deliberate choice, and I do think it's something they do after the War in any route (assuming the majority of them have been allowed to live) because that sort of thing just forms a life long bond between people that's hard to shake without deliberate effort I can't imagine any of them truly wanting to put in.

They are normal! None of them hate each other! They don't have that sort of intensity, but they do have a lot of complexity that lends itself very well to found family. I think a big part of that complexity lends itself to the lack of killing (although I don't really think any of their parents deserve to be killed whether they've alive or dead?). The fact that Lorenz's dad has Claude's uncle killed (which when combined with Hilda, again, being a fucking Goneril is INSANE my man's two best friends are people who have reason to kill him for BOTH SIDES OF HIS ANCESTRY) and thus gets Raph's parents killed is something truly heartbreaking, and yet I think it's because there's no violence amongst each other or against the previous generation that characters like Claude (has had violence perpetuated against him for his heritage), Marianne (has had implied violence perpetuated against her for her crest), and Lysithea (has had violence perpetuated against her to get her second crest) are able to feel safe amongst the Deer. Violence is an intense choice, but I think lack of violence should also be viewed as something deliberate and chosen, esp. in the world of Three Houses. I mean, throughout Verdant Wind Claude is constantly complaining about the perpetuation of violence caused by the War! He's someone who deliberately chooses direct harm reduction. Although, to in fact speak of violence, I think it's absolutely insane that Hilda "I refuse to die for my friends" Goneril will willingly die for Claude "DO NOT DIE FOR MY SAKE FLEE PLEASE I'M BEGGING YOU RETREAT" von Riegan's sake.

I do think that the Golden Deer are the most similar to a modern queer friend group and thus would be the easiest to make a 1:1 comparison, but again the events of the game do kind of necessitate that they are found family because they go through a war together. Their group dynamics are probably the most influenced by Byleth (Dimitri and his relationships with others while "mad" of course, aside), and it's really hard to make generalizations about them because again, the fact that she is not there to facilitate these close bonds makes it a lot harder for them to be as close as they are before the war as they end up being, although even without Byleth I still think they're exceedingly close. But yes, I agree, they do not live in each other's pockets, which does not make them any less found family, but does, probably, make them healthier in modern context lol.

(As a side note about Byleth and the house leaders: I think what she visibly provides to Edelgard and Dimitri is a lot more obvious than what she provides to Claude. She helps the both of them in maintaining themselves and not loosing themselves to the burden of leadership and trauma. Claude, however, is a character who has been handling both of those things alone, and we are shown that he is capable of handling them alone without massive cracks appearing in Three Houses. Claude does not need Byleth to live, as the other two directly do. Byleth gives Claude someone consistent and trustworthy to rely on, which opens him up to being able to do it with the other members of his house far easier then he's able to otherwise.)

Anyways! I think the Golden Deer are very queer, just more subtextually so then the Black Eagles and Blue Lions. I personally view a lot of the straight endings, so to speak, as queerplatonic (again Lorenz/Lysithea and honestly Leonie/Ignatz). Romance is a pretty easy metric to view queer storytelling through, but I don't think I'd see Sylvain as any less of a queer character if he didn't have his paired ending with Felix because of how his story is written. In a similar way, I think characters like Ignatz (wanted to be a painter, but it's not what his family wants for him; yearns to be creative and is self conscious about people thinking it'll interfere in his duties and has to learn to accept himself and his true dreams) and Marianne (sees herself as a monster that other people won't accept if they knew the true her and what she's hiding) are also queer without needing to be in romances, which is why the fandom gets a lot out of them subtextually.

Acceptance, I think, can be viewed as a very queer theme, and I think it's a prominent one within the Deer.

#twila talks #the golden deer #fe3h #verdant wind #claude von riegan #hilda valentine goneril #lorenz hellman gloucester #marianne von edmund #ignatz victor #raphael kirsten #leonie pinelli #lysithea von ordelia #claurenz #marihilda #thank you again for the ask anon I really enjoy discussing this with you!!#I don't think we necessarily disagree so much as have different interpretations of the text and i've enjoyed hearing yours and sharing mine #we needed more wlw stuff in the golden deer supports!!! in the game!!!#everyone should be bisexual in fire emblem it's a dating sim first and sexy chess second skdfhskjdfh

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cloud-somersault · 7 months

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I think it has to do with multiple things. For Wukong by himself, he's tall because he's strong. To some, him being short would negate his strength. They also correlate it with his growth as a person. He's a better person now, so he's taller.

For Macaque, specifically, some people like to characterize as a gremlin, so he has to be short. They also use his to empathize how no one listened to him, i.e. everyone towering over him and not taking him seriously. Or they correlate it to his death and regression caused him to shrink.

For when shadowpeach together, it mostly has to do with their dynamic. Some people like the dumb and tall with the suave and short dynamic. Others like what it says about their their relationship. Wukong looking down on Macaque with Macaque having to look up to Wukong. There's also the top and bottom stuff.

And sometimes it just makes the brain go brrrr... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

(For me personally, most of these are reasons for their heights to be inversed. Being taller does not correlate with being a better person. That's just me though)

I think connecting physical traits to personality and characteristics is a big no-no for multiple reasons....and that's how we get into dangerous territory when it comes to common stereotypes/archetypes/etc. that could be harmful, even if it's unintentional....

And it's also just not realistic or based in reality...there are plenty of strong short people...there are plenty of lean tall people...

Also, we don't need to use physical characteristics to convey something about someone. "Macaque's short to signify how everyone looked down on him" you could do that with certain framing in an art piece or the tone in a piece of writing. You could use introspection to make Macaque and the reader feel that oppression and disrespect, and then it's not connected to his height. Because, what? If he's tall, then that feeling goes away? If he's tall, does he feel like he's being listened to? No! it has nothing to do with his height; it has everything to do with his character and personality.

Azure and Peng don't give two fucks if Macaque is four feet or six feet tall -- they are not listening to that mans!!!

The only two I can understand are the dynamics which also goes with making the brain go brrrr, and I like to give others the benefit of the doubt when it comes to things, so I'm gonna go with it being brain worms. I just get suspicious when I see so much of the same thing in a fandom, like there's almost always a reason for that.

And it probably is linked to top/bottom discourse, but if that's the case? Then people have no idea how sex works. BDSM and sexual positions are different things. I don't have time to go into this and I can't on this blog because it's not NSFW, but connecting position to height is................not the move, needless to say.

I think I'm gonna chalk it up to "It's personal preference!! And the majority of the fandom agrees with this preference and there's nothing else going on"

and i'll just sit in my "weird takes/strange opinions and headcanons" corner and play with my little dolls because. Yeah.

#ask #anon #not even gonna talk about how in jttw wukong's a scrawny little thing but anyway #have fun tall wukong enjoyers #thanks for listing out reasons i just find it a bit odd but anyway! moving on!

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pauls1967moustache · 9 months

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hi, i'm new to the beatles fandom so forgive me my ignorance but in a lot of the fanart i've seen they tend to draw paul mccartney very effeminate and smaller than the others, when isn't he the tallest? from first glance it does kind of seem like a homophobic caricature, though again i might be missing something. is it something to do with the cartoon? which also seems kind of unflattering. sorry, i keep wondering why paul seems to get more distorted than the others by fans, i'm not expecting you to be an expert or anything, but i was hoping you could offer some insight. thanks and have a nice day!

ah, i don't really see that much. not to say there aren't artists who do that, but if there are, i certainly have not been following them ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

idk if there's any insight i can offer. it's kind of an age old fandom cliche: artists drawing m/m pairring with one being the "girl" one. same as like, fanartists drawing men in their 40s to look like 20 year old anime twinks, or drawing fat people as curvy with a flat stomach and skinny face, etc. this isn't even exclusive to m/m ships; i once saw egregious fanart for the bear where they drew the main character to be a giant buff dude compared to the main girl even though the actress who plays her is like the same height as him irl. people just do it. you could call it a homophobic caricature, but i don't think it's that nefarious. i think people just internalise the typical heterosexual imagery of every day life in their heads, and paul usually ends up being the "girl" one in that situation. i don't think it's meant to be unflattering. if anything it's being done because those artists probably find that attractive in paul (there's a reason he is the most feminised in fanfiction).

if it bothers you to see that kind of art, my advice would be to simply ignore/block the artists you don't like and follow the ones who don't do that - of which there are plenty, i prommy!

#asks #look i'm not an artist. i don't wanna start ragging on people for putting their time and care into making something i couldn't do you know #i don't think anyone's doing it out of maliciousness towards paul. we just all have our weird biases.#i'm sure i have biases that pop up in my fic without me noticing and i would much rather people gave me grace with that #then read into the worst possible conclusion #and we all enjoy paul with huge magical girl eyes and ridonculous eyelashes every once in a while. it's fine.#jim gave him gay eyebrows irl. it's not the artist's fault.

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skaruresonic · 5 months

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someone on youtube mentioned that they like seeing Sonic discourse because they don't actually have any stake in it, so they're just watching from the sidelines pretty much.

They also said that one of the things they're invested in has a fandom that also loves to discourse, and that people my complain about it but a lot of them actually like to engage in it. I think that may apply to the Sonic fandom at large lmao

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ We all have our hobbies, ig. As long as they're not trying to portray themselves as superior for spectating from a distance. IMO, the folks who like to watch on the sidelines while feigning an ironic disaffectation ("why are you arguing over a blue cartoon hedgehog? lol touch grass") are perhaps even more insufferable than discoursers. Because it's like why passing judgment from your high horse, then. If you really didn't care, you wouldn't have bothered commenting.

I will admit that, for as much as I like to opine on Sonic discourse, there are some topics that strike me as superfluous. One time there was a big kerfuffle on Twitter about how game purists apparently want Sonic to only be represented by the wind and I went "Nope, not touching that one."

Another time, I saw an enormous thread that began "I don't actually like SA2." I was like "cool story" and went on with my day.

So it's not like I'm incapable of walking away. I'm just opinionated, lol.

---

This phenomenon is not just limited to Sonic fandom. The nature of social media is such that you're at risk of seeing an opinion that you deeply disagree with at any given time.

The thing that gets me in the context of Sonic discourse is the additional dimension of everyone in this Chili's operating from the underlying assumption that Sonic as a series is deficient, to the point where they speak to you as though you believe the same as they do.

It'd be one thing if folks were like "yeah, this is just my opinion," but you rarely find sentiments couched in those terms. It's always with this authoritative tone which does not broker argument, at least not without a whole lot of ad hominem flung your way. The games are inconsistent (read: not worth engaging with) and my claims are self-evident (that's why I'm not pulling up any sources).

And it's not even the inaccuracy that necessarily gets me so much as the confidence with which people insist 2 + 2 = 5. Like, folks balk if you dare say "This is factually wrong," because how dare you say my fanon is less than those inconsistent games? My fanon was supposed to be equal to or better than the games. I cannot be wrong, you're just a canon purist with a huge stick up your ass for something that's not even worth all that much.

I often feel the inaccuracy is a sign of carelessness or disregard toward the games. It's as though you (general you) think so little of them that you can't be bothered to double-check that the things you claim happen in them actually happened. And I'm honestly hard-pressed to find another fandom that treats the source material as this worthless and disposable.

Part of the reason my posts get so ungodly long is I have to take the time to do research. Most of the time I can rely on memory, but in those cases that I can't, I try to Google it. (sidenote but Google images has become such utter trash omfg you can't find anything you need)

You can imagine what it feels like, then, when you go to all that trouble only to have non-fans with a superiority complex tell you you're overthinking it. Or for another fan to act as though your research means nothing and their uncorroborated claims are worth the same as or even more than canon.

In both cases, it stems from an attitude of entitlement. Of taking the games for granted.

Not to be a doomer, of course, but the series' creators are not going to be around forever. Who's going to helm the ship when Sonic approaches its 50th anniversary? What is the franchise going to look like if folks keep revising the past into something it's not?

It's easy to think this stuff is insignificant - and to be fair, most of the time, it isn't that deep. I could be doing more productive things with my time than to painstakingly point out the obvious, but I do it anyway precisely because I care about the series so much. It's worth the same amount of consideration every other fictional franchise with a sizeable fandom has; being based on speedy zoom zoom hedgehogs doesn't negate that inherent worth.

And so, I think, even if my words are not always the softest or kindest, if my attempts to provide a reality check can make someone out there feel a little less crazy, a little less of a wet blanket, a little more grounded amidst the madness, well. My time can't have been wasted.

#asks #long post

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haleigh-sloth · 2 years

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(1) I’ve largely erred on the side of not saying this because I don’t care to rain on anyone’s parade, but since you mentioned feeling like the friendship between Tomura and Spinner can get blown out of proportion, I can think of at least one concrete reason for why that disconnect might exist. I obviously don't blame people for taking the official translations at face value, but I feel like Spinner's line about "bonding" with Tomura over games is another example of sentiments getting

Ahhhhhh lot of good stuff here

Putting a cut for length but also people who just don't wanna see this type of response

I feel this way about a lot of peoples' interpretations of the League and their interactions. Not just Spinner and Shigaraki, but all of them. I feel like a lot of gestures get blown way out of proportion. Shigaraki's "I just want them to be able to live how they see fit" does not equal "Their happiness is my priority, and I'm going to work to create a world where they can be happy". I'm sorry but those two are not the same thing, and I haven't seen Shigaraki act in such a way either. Those two goals may point in the same direction (they don't because he's a fucking liar to his own face and so is Toga to her own face), but that kind sentiment did not suddenly mean that he is prioritizing their happiness and wellbeing above all else. If that was the case, well, they wouldn't have formed a giant ass army to take on the world at war and risk dying (which one of them did) and Spinner wouldn't be in the situation he is in now ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ .

I don't want to rain on people's parades either, but my opinions are pretty clear and have been for a while and people have had plenty of time to block/unfollow me as they see necessary. So at this point, I don't hold back (I try very hard to avoid being super negative though about any character in general). I used to hold back my not so popular (in the villain corner of the fandom) interpretations on the League up until recently. As we've gotten closer to the end, I've decided that I'm just gonna put my opinion out into the void even if many people--specifically in the little circle of blogs I occupy--don't like it. And many don't, and that's okay. My opinion doesn't change unless the manga gives me a reason to change it.

Spinner and Shigaraki--I have a lot of issues here, MAJORITY of it due to fandom hyping them up as more than they are. And look, I don't care when stuff is clearly fanon or headcanons. Posts that are meant to be taken that way are usually pretty clear about it. But these are whole analyses based off of this overblown bond/friendship that literally only Spinner seems to acknowledge/be so attached to.

I don't doubt Shigaraki views everyone in the League as a friend in some capacity. I don't doubt that at all. I don't doubt that he cares and genuinely wants them to live how they want. However, I would like for someone to show me where he pays the same type of special attention to Spinner that Spinner gives to him. Imo, Shigaraki treats them all pretty equally--Spinner included.

I didn't know that about the Japanese, and yet, I still felt this way. Assuming that someone who has a good understanding of Japanese can correct your statement, I'm gonna take your word for it since I can't say shit otherwise lol. But cool--yeah that particular line is used quite a bit. And I get it! It's fun especially if you ship the characters or just enjoy their interactions.

But I feel like people overlook the fact that Spinner's idolization and attachment is literally negative and is a challenge in his arc, not some cute uwu friendship that was just about video games (when would they have played video games in canon??? WHEN????).

Spinner decided to seriously devote himself to Shigaraki (which in itself is a weird not great thing to do) during MVA, because it looked as if Shigaraki had made progress and overcome a barrier and become this all powerful destructive god who can make dreams come true (dreams for someone who wants to lash out at least). But MVA was not any of that. MVA was Shigaraki doing exactly what AFO wanted him to do--get worse emotionally, spiral more mentally and become even more unstable, and hate himself to the point that he sees no point in thinking or hoping for change for the better. Perfect, all according to keikaku. And THAT is when Spinner was like "FUCK YEAH THIS GUY". I know Spin didn't know that, but come oN guys THE TIMING OF IT IS SO FORETELLING.

AND IT WAS. Because look now. What has turned me completely off to this dynamic is the fandom hyping it up as a pure devotion that isn't stemming from a lot of self-worth issues and negative idealization. Spinner associates Shigaraki with destruction, rage, anger, and misery. That's also what Shigaraki associates himself with, and that's exactly what AFO wants. And man, he sure got it out of both of them.

And I'd like it if people acknowledged that more for what it is, but it's just reduced down to "two gamers that AFO groomed and took advantage of". And I feel that is just super oversimplifying what actually happened. AFO didn't groom Spinner from the age of 5, he took advantage of a vulnerability he was able to pinpoint super quickly after Spinner made it painfully obvious.

I like Spinner more on his own, and I like the potential for him to face the reality that him ignoring his gut instincts in favor of that dream of destruction he associates with Shigaraki eventually led to him making things worse for Shigaraki--unintentionally. I mean he hasn't made shit hit the fan YET--but man if things aren't looking ominous as fuck right now. AFO is counting on Spinner? Oof. But the potential for drama here is exciting, and I'm ready for it.

But yeah. I agree--it's overblown imo. It has become a plot point in Shigaraki's arc in a negative way. So I feel people miss the mark when they focus on how devoted Spinner is to Shigaraki during all of this mess, because that's exactly why things look the way they do lol.

#bnha #boku no hero academia #bnha asks #anonymous #bnha spinner #shuichi iguchi #shigaraki tomura

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sasukesun · 1 year

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About jjk is it worth watching? Like I know the animation and fights are amazing from the gifs i see but like, what about the story and characters? Is it worth it?

i think i’m biased to talk about jjk because well… i read the manga so it’s obvious that i enjoy it. jjk starts very typical shonen imo but it changes drastically after the shibuya arc. for example, i don’t think gege cares much about his story having a main character, sure yuuji shows up a lot but the story does not revolve around him, especially after shibuya, there isn’t this typical shonen hero narrative you find in… basically every other shonen, not that he isn’t important, but he’s just a piece of it in a much bigger picture.

jjk has very compelling and interesting characters and themes, and i also believe is more self aware, since it shows how corrupt and terrible jujutsu society is and, as far as the manga is right now, doesn’t try to sweep things under the rug. it’s also refreshing sometimes. with all of that being said, there was a part of the manga post shibuya with pointless and boring battles imo, not all of them, but some, maybe in my mind that part was longer than it actually is because i read the manga weekly, though i wouldn’t tell anyone to not read the manga because of those parts, especially since you don’t have to wait an entire week for a mid chapter right now… actually the manga is in one of the best parts ever at the moment (a mindblowing battle btw). also, if you ask someone else, maybe they won’t like jjk because of the same reasons as i do, for example, megumi is a fandom popular, yet, i do not get why, i actually don’t really care much about him, i’m much more interested in a lot of other characters that have a strong hold on me, i guess that happens in every fandom, though ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

#ask #anonymous

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1randomperson15 · 1 year

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Hey, I've been questioning if I was autistic for a while now, and I am unable to get an official diagnosis (and tbh dunno if I want one), so here is a list of traits that may or may not be autistic traits and if you could go over them that would be great! (just ask if you need clarification for stuff, and if you have additional questions feel free to shoot)

Hates jeans

Hates seat belts

Hated a scratchy blanket everyone else thought was fine

Hated bras and avoided wearing them for the longest time, still Does Not like them

Will take them off as soon as I get home

Wouldn't wear them if people didn't care

Comfort & convenience >>> Looks (don’t really care about them, don’t really understand people who think otherwise)

Am agender

Plays same music over and over again (changes maybe every 1.5 years)

Wears same clothes each day (gets upset when can’t)

All basketball shorts and a shirt

My parents had to fight to get me to get new clothes even when my old ones were clearly too small

Gets upset when my haircut isn’t the way I like it (full on sobbed when it was really bad)

I was usually upset after every haircut until there was a stylist who did it the same every time

Hate surprises - I already put out things to prepare food, but Ma wanted to make something else for me

When trees were massively trimmed I was saddened - I never thought about those trees before

Same with the bushes in front of our church parking lot

When I couldn’t find hot chocolate powder where I thought it’d be, I started tearing up and getting unreasonably angry and felt like throwing a tantrum

Tears up when I don’t understand something/gets really frustrated

Cried when I got into slight trouble with my Bio teacher

Doesn’t take criticism well (non quantifiable that is, anything other than numbers) (anything that you can't objectively prove ie math)

Monotone (ish) voice (have been called emotionless/cold, need to be more expressive in presentations; when asked some people say I do, others say I don’t so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯)

Speaks more formal -ish? I think anyways

Copied characters/youtubers a lot when I was younger

Poor volume control (especially when excited)

Don’t know when to jump into conversations

Kinda feel like I’m just there, not part of it (outsider looking in)

It’s seems like a 50/50 if people tune me out

one on one is easier than group

Don’t know how to make friends

Can’t tell if I’m friends with people/if they care about me/would miss me

Have “obsessions” (ie. constantly think about Thing, read boat loads of fic about it, and talk if I feel I’m allowed to)

I have a bunch of nonsensical ramblings written out, and much more my sister was forced to listen to

Usually only have two interests at a time (1 youtube community, 1 fandom)

death (of others) is weird, feel empty for several days, then don’t feel anything after that

I hate alarms/repetitive noise

Sometimes have to adjust volume others don’t need to

Sometimes the volume is too quiet to hear but when I turn it up slightly it's painfully loud

Mornings - take a bit to put on socks & eat breakfast, don't like verbally communicating (it's not like a coffee thing or whatever, usually it just takes time until I'm able to do things - might just not be a morning person)

Also, I used to not eat breakfast, until my parents found specific foods I would eat, and then they'd give it to me until it'd taste bitter and make me want to throw up and the cycle continues and now there's quite a few foods I used to love that I now Do Not eat

I used to just speak in mumbles and grunts a lot which my sister could mostly interpret to my parents

I would often feel angry for no reason/not know what I wanted when I was a child and took it out on my parents - I was very difficult

Once I couldn't communicate with my Dad that I needed a longer break between rounds of badminton and he kept insisting so I just sat there and was mad at him for the rest of the day

An English a teacher would add questions in our essays as genuine questions, but for the longest time I just assumed that meant I was taking my reasoning in the wrong direction, not that I was supposed to dive deeper

I don't usually speak unless someone explicitly asks me to bc I don't want to be annoying (in gcs and usually irl too)

I have spent 6 hours doing a spreadsheet...twice

am very blunt (people typically know if I don't like them, I don't try to be rude, just clear)

#actually autism #autism #actually autistic #my stuff #irl #I'm sure there's more shit but that's what I can think of #I dunno how much of this is relevant but might as well just in case it is

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compulsivereaderluc · 2 months

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My brain decided to give random plot bunny and decided to make it so fucking random 😂😂😂

While I think I can't write it as complete fic I can make it as thread here lol

So, it's MDZS+Gintama fandom.

Part 1

Gintoki was reading shounen jump while laying sideways on the sofa when he suddenly pulled into other space by Toyako hermit.

Toyako hermit then explain the reason why he pulled him into that space(MDZS's world consciousness crying to Gintama's world consciousness, to avoid getting pestered by MDZS's WC, Gintama's WC have the idea to chuck their protagonist to other world to help, afterall the Gorilla still on hiatus and Gintoki have free time (Gintoki: Oi! Gin-chan is actually very busy everyday!)), throw him into another world, de-aged him and then shove the plot point and common sense along with the local language of MDZS in his head.

Not only that, afterall the world of MDZS have different power scale so MDZS's world give Gintoki golden fingers, a working golden core and spiritual blade weapon. (So Gintoki have two swords here, lake touya and this new blade. As for why, the reason I give him this golden finger is because I want him to be able to fly with the sword lol)

It's just that maybe the way Toyako hermit throwing him was wrong or Gintoki just that unlucky, but not only he was de-aged when he land in MDZS world but his gender change into female ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (Gintoki(Ginko): fuck you author!)

So from the outside its look like ten years old kid with exotics features living on the street. But people who think she was easy picking are courting their own doom. Afterall even if the gender is changed its still Gintoki with enchanted power of golden core. As long as she doesn't meet cultivators of mid to upper strength of the world no one can beat her.

In two year, she have the reputation of rogue cultivators who does everything, from fixing the roof and helping farming to killing fierce corpses and yao. Somehow the nickname White Yaksha come up in that time.

Of course to get the plot going Gintoki get to meet the yunmeng duo in some night hunt in the mountains. Because their target is the same and Gintoki knew the strength of this two guys she began to slack off while saying that she would give up the hunt but in exchange to see them kill it.

The duo after some internal discussion agree and they began to tracks down the Yao. In the journey they began to know each other and become familiar with Gintoki because of her carefree attitude, to the point that they can call each other by their names.

The night hunt while not smoothly solved, are concluded successful. With the duo new appreciation of the strength Gintoki has.

Gintoki on other hand just patted her butt and collect the free money she got about that commission.

Not long after she then meet some relevant character except from the Wen main family. Like NHS and how they talk about porns, the JZX and how she scams some gold from him and his entourage and the Wen siblings and saving WN from some bullies.

The last is actually meeting LXC and saving him from night hunt gone almost wrong.

After that time Gintoki somehow coincidentally meet LXC in higher frequency. To the point that she was invited to become guests disciples in GSL. Gintoki accepted because she was curious about the canon plot that happens there and GSL thousands rule.

"Then I hope the GSL can meet Madam Bantian's expectations." LXC smiled so brightly that Gintoki need to squint from the shine.

"Oi, can you tone done that smile, A-yin(Gin-chan)'s eyes can't afford surgery here."

LXC laugh sheepishly at that, but Gintoki feel that the smile actually got brighter.

(Because of translation, the name Sakata Gintoki in MDZS's become Bantian Yinshi, Gintoki who hear it thought that they call her Sakata Gintoki while the local thought she introduced her name as the Chinese version of that name. It's only her name that has that treatment tho, every name still the same)

#mdzs #mxtx mdzs #gintama #sakata gintoki #it's really random but it's grew on me like clinging cat #totally want to ship LXC with Gintoki but feel a bit cruel to LXC #let's see how it's goes in the next part then

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trekkele · 8 months

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How much violence do you think Batman should be able to get away with while still remaining as "one of the good guys"?

There are times where he is way more brutal than necessary to just your average crook. Threatening someone with crushing their skull with the Batmobile (Arkham games), to beating people senseless and unnecessarily risking them dying (some choices in the Telltale Batman game), to cutting a cannibal's finger off for threatening only Bruce himself and no one else's life (although obviously he killed some people already) (a Batman/Catwoman comic), breaking criminals' bones as an intimidation tactic before and/or after they told him everything (comics, games, movies,...), etc.

Like that's some really unheroic things to do and Bruce sometimes admits to liking dishing out this kind of punishment. But then he turns around and preaches to everyone how they went too far for breaking ONE bone, especially to the Robins. How many people really know this vicious and cruel side of Bruce, I wonder...

How would you imagine the Batkids reacting to a video of Batman calmly and in a calculated way torturing information out of someone, almost like a real villain? And his cruelty rivals that of Jason during his utrh and rhato days where he was the most mentally unstable and that's like a Tuesday for Bruce? And what if that video is a few years old, and shows a little Robin (Dick or Jason, maybe) being sent away to stake some place out or to return to the cave just a few minutes prior? Obviously they'd be horrified, but what then? Do they go looking for what happened after the torture and maybe find out it was for vital information that relsulted in stopping the city from getting blown up and that the victim was then rehabilitated and now works for Wayne Enterprises.

Just, Batman's methods were horrifying but it was enough to shake/scare this specific person out of a criminal life style, then give him a well-payed job in one of the branches of WE in another city without Batman, now having built a family with kids and the guy looks the happiest he's ever been. And this case isn't the only one, and a majotity of criminals end up like this, with only a few ending up the same as before or worse.

Like, how are you supposed to react to that??? This is the same man that's upstairs working on a charity project for orphans and cancer patients right now! You're going to be sitting at the dinner table together! The man's a father figure to most of them! What. The. Fuck.

I mean i have an answer but i dont think youre going to like it.

I think a Batman that is unnecessarily violent/cruel, or is for the sake of being violent/cruel, is a Batman that is out of character.

And i think the fact that he does enjoy being Batman, is part of it. He knows he’s violent, he knows violence is cruel, he knows he enjoys it a little more then he should. That the reason he has such a tight leash on … literally every aspect of being Batman.

Also, scolding the Robins for being too violent is obvious? Those are kids, they’re still being trained. I know fandom likes to paint every bit of parenting Bruce does as hypocritical or overbearing, but cmon on now. Being capable of something doesnt mean you have to go through with it. His kids were always meant to be better then him, and that means keeping their hands as clean as possible.

Also torture is proven to be ineffective, and if Batman is anything efficient. So thats out of character too ¯\ _(ツ)_/¯

(And Jason wasnt mentally unstable during UTRH or RHATO. He ran a criminal empire bbyboy was very stable.)

What your real question is is “Does the end Justify the means and if so to what extent” and the answer is both “no” and “it depends but probably also no”.

Also is there a reason you sent this verbatim to @frownyalfred and then to me right after i reblogged one of their posts or is that just a fun little coincidink

Edit: that last question sounds very accusatory, its not! Im just curious because this is a pretty well thought out, thorough ask, so like it does make sense that you would have copy-pasted it, but also the timing was pretty pat. Im also not expecting an answer so im not sure why i even asked.

#asks #i dont like this ask ill be honest #not just because i havent interacted with any of the things cited as sources but also because #theres a lot of reasons Batman is shown as overly violent #none of them are for character reasons tho #violence is a tool #cruelty is not #so that answers that #as for the robins being scared of bruces violence. that depends.#has that violence ever been turned on them?#if you’re like me and that answer is ‘no and if it was written i dont fucking care it is wildly out of character’ then i suppose that and #that

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alligatorjesie · 1 year

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The fuck is it with you complete bellends and fucking going outside? I assure you I've spent more time outside in the past week then you have in 3 fucking years with how you stupid fucks are terminally online and I know this because I'm one of the few people in my community who gorilla gardens to help remove all these invasive fucking plants in my area.

I'm typing most of this outside while I'm dealing with my walking onion plot.

Yes, that is poison hemlock. I've never seen an anti do half the good a deadly toxic plant does and the plant isn't nearly as offensive. At least this plant's flowers make food for the bees.

I'd much rather hang out with a toxic plant than you shitty ass toxic antis.

Not only that but one of my main hobbies outside of the furry and reylo fandoms is gardening, so I'm already outside a lot which thank fuck for that shit because ya'll drive me up the fuckin' wall.

How about you fix those fucking tags and get the fuck out of this fandom space? You ever fucking think about that? You ever stop for one fucking moment and realize you're posting harassment into a fandom's tags that you're not fucking welcome in?

No?

Just sailed right past you?

Well, shocker there.

You stupid pricks can't figure out how the fuck to stay out of a fandom space you hate but feel the need to tell me to go outside more like that's going to stop you from being an absolute shitass to everyone else here?

You gonna tell every reylo and furry to just go outside? That gonna solve all your problems there chucklefuck?

I made a whole post to another anti who regularly posts death threats into the fandom I'm in how they could take all that negative energy and use it for something far more useful instead of telling people in my fandom to die.

A real thing they do pretty regularly.

youtube

And then after I went through all that effort to make them their own video and wrote up detailed instructions on how to identify and remove the invasive ecologically destructive plant bush honeysuckle, they told me all this shit:

Which, rude.

Telling a whole group of people to eat shit and die then more graphically that they would like to see my throat slit just for being apart of a community they hate is some nazi shit ya know?

And this isn't the first insult that has been thrown at me for being in a fandom or a community by the hateful fucks who dislike it.

I'm a member of the LGBTQ community too and I've been told the same crazy shit by hateful fucks like you as I've been told being in the reylo and furry fandoms.

Just a few weekends ago I spent over 5 hours getting yelled at by a hate/death cult church who spent that time telling everyone attending a local dragshow we was gonna burn in a lake of fire and IDK that kinda sounds like some nazi shit too.

So I did something good for my community and counter protested the protest.

There's this little sliver of sidewalk that the church regularly sets up in so I blocked the entire space and stopped them from doing that. By the time they were set up on that flatbed no one in the bar could even see them.

Which, you know, Good.

Or like the one time I was at a furry convention that got chlorine bombed by an actual nazi fur who was banned from attending the event for, you know, bein' a nazi.

A real fucking thing that really happened by the way.

19 people had to go to the hospital from breathing in chlorine from the chlorine bomb.

Some of them have permanent lung damage.

So, you know, having dealt with actual real nazis in the past I kinda know what they look and act like and if it walks like a duck and acts like a duck well ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

the term 'Anti' is new but being an anti isn't fucking new. People have hated other people for some dickass reasons since before written time.

I compare antis to nazis because y'all act like fucking nazis, down to the death threats.

If ya'll had it your way you probably would shoot us down, god knows there's plenty of you twisted fucks with guns who have threatened it.

Weird that someone with this kinda history with both antis and nazis would have some kinda negative reaction to seeing hateful people post hate in their spaces.

Almost like we don't wanna see your fucking asses here and you can fucking leave whenever.

Also, who the fuck is proud of being a anti? Like I'm just a furry and a reylo mostly because I love the porn and just found myself really enjoying the community, but what lack of love and attention in your home life brings you to a group of people who hate so thoroughly as antis do?

Great, your a massive pile of shit who is apart of a community that regularly tells me and my friends to fucking die for enjoying the harmless shit we enjoy.

GIF by gollumjuice

I'm not hurting anyone for being in my fandoms. I'm not hurting anyone for attending a drag show with my friends for funzees. I never hurt anyone because I love drawing furry cocks. I'm not hurting anyone because I like the idea of seeing the two main characters in one of the most popular movies of this century smooch.

I don't go into anti tags and I don't interact with you nasty fucking people.

UNLESS

you post hate in my spaces.

Which you did and are still doing because you tag like dogshit.

How about for once in your fucking life you stop being a hateful cunt and do something good for your community instead of whatever this fucking shit is?

There's a food bank that probably needs you help. There's a pride event that could use your assistance to keep protesters away. There's a old man in your neighborhood who would probably appreciate you pulling a few fucking weeds for him, whatever gets you off this fucking website and out of the anti community and maybe learning to just accept that people will enjoy shit you maybe ain't into but if that enjoyment ultimately isn't hurting anyone it ain't a big deal if you don't fucking like it, you can just ignore it.

I don't give a flying what What you do, just do something besides This Hateful Shit.

If someone here needs to go outside and touch grass it's you @watchingtheearthrise because you're kinda fucked up if you think this level of hate you feel for a fictional fucking vanilla ass enemies to lovers CANON ship is fucking normal.

(it's not)

#anti talk #fandom wank #reylo fandom #furry fandom #lgbtq related #anti anti #purity wank #ya'll are horrible people who tell me and my friends to die a lot and I don't see a difference between you and the actual nazis I've met #I've been told to die over 900 times by antis #and one time a nazi did actually try to kill me #Youtube

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hellofeanor · 3 years

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Fëanorian Quenya

Hey friends! Do you like elves? Do you like the Silmarillion? Do you like Fëanor and co? And most of all, do you like spending hours thinking about minor details pertaining to made-up languages??? If so, boy do I have a treat for you! Let’s delve into the weird world of Fëanorian Quenya and explore some history and mechanics of why they talk Like That.

I’ve seen a lot of posts joking about the Fëanorian lisp, which is about as funny as a joke about a speech impediment can be. 👍 It’s important to understand, though, that this IS a joke. No, they didn’t really speak with a lisp. Yes, they did pronounce some S sounds as TH. That’s the critical disclaimer here: SOME. It’s not a blanket pronunciation. There’s a lot of background research that goes into determining which words would be pronounced with S and which would be TH, and that’s what we’re going to look at.

So if this is something you’ve come across in fandom and you’re not totally sure on the details, or if you ARE sure and just want some more in-depth info, read on.

The stuff probably everybody knows already

For anyone who’s been hanging around the Fëanorian corner of the Silm fandom for more than three minutes, there’s about a 100% chance you’ve heard of Fëanor’s penchant for retaining an archaic TH pronunciation after the majority of the Noldor went ahead and started pronouncing this sound as S instead. You may also know that this sound is represented by the letter thorn (Þ) in HoME, but since thorn doesn’t exist in modern English orthography and it’s a pain to keep typing the ALT code, I’m sticking to TH here. Anyway, all this was due to the fact that Fëanor was a huge mama’s boy, and his mom Míriel Therindë (later called Serindë, which made Fëanor want to punch walls and possibly also fellow elves) was an outlier who retained the TH after it fell out of use. Her son Fëanor, in turn, kept this up to honor her. Now, whether or not he would have bothered if this sound hadn’t literally been a critical part of her name is debatable, but that debate is outside the scope of this essay.

Fëanor continued to use the TH pronunciation until his death, and required his sons to use it as well. Finwë, however, switched over to S after the death of Míriel and before his marriage to Indis. Fëanor, reasonable and level-headed as he was, took this as a personal insult and decided that anybody who rejected TH likewise rejected him. So presumably, his loyal followers would have obeyed his totally reasonable demands not to give in to the seductive S-shift.

Why tho

Why did the Noldor decide to alter their pronunciation from TH to S? Great question. Nobody really knows. For the hell of it? IDK. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ But the important thing to understand is that elves, and especially Noldor, were really committed to making sure their language sounds cool. This is why it changed so much and so comparatively quickly for an immortal population: they were actively invested in changing it. They liked inventing new words and exploring new sounds and messing around with grammar.

So at some point some influential Noldo might have been like, hey y’all, let’s stop saying TH and say S instead! And everyone (except Míriel I guess, who was known for her elegant manner of speech and didn’t want to muck that up by changing pronunciation of a whole letter) was like, whoa, capital idea my good egg. And they went with it. Previous ideas along these lines included ‘hey y’all, let’s stop saying KH and say H instead’ and ‘hey y’all, let’s stop saying Z and say R instead’, and those went over swimmingly. Nobody could have foreseen the problem this TH to S business would cause.

Now here’s a fun fact. There was another change to Noldorin pronunciation that happened AFTER Fëanor’s birth, that he himself was involved in. This one was all about bilabial to labiodental F. And those sure are some words, so if you don’t know what I’m talking about (I don’t blame you), BILABIAL is a more whispery sound that happens when you say F using only air passing through your pursed lips, and LABIODENTAL is when you say F with your top teeth touching your bottom lip. Going forward I’m going to use PH to represent the bilabial sound, and F for the labiodental.

So F got on the radar of the Noldor via the Teleri, who used this sound in their language. And ol’ Fëanor figured it would be awesome to incorporate it into Quenya because he thought the PH sounded too close to HW, and the two were getting confused by lazy speakers. Why did he care? Because of his dad’s name and his own, of course. If people started to get lazy in their pronunciation, we’d end up with Hwinwë and Hwëanáro, which would be terrible and stupid and unacceptable. He accused the Vanyar of leaning down that road, and he wanted to stop that kind of shift before it happened to the Noldor. How to do that? Why, by instigating a different shift from traditional Noldorin PH to Telerin F!

“Hey y’all, let’s stop saying PH and say F instead!”

“Whoa, capital idea my good egg.”

Moral of the story: Fëanor is only concerned with Quenya pronunciation insofar as it affects his own name and the names of family members he likes. He does not care whether it’s staying the same or moving to a new sound so long as it personally makes him feel good and his name sound cool. Therefore the true way to piss him off would be to call him Curuhwinwë Hwëanáro, son of Serindë.

Okay so here’s how it works

Now that history is out of the way, let’s get back to how TH was used by the Fëanorians. As I mentioned earlier, TH wasn’t a blanket pronunciation. It all depended on the original form of the word, and whether the root had a TH or an S. And some very similar-sounding words come from different roots, so this can get tricky. A great resource that’ll give you this information is Eldamo: Quenya words where the S was originally TH are marked out with the Þ (thorn) symbol in the wordlist.

Some examples:

Súlë (spirit, breath) comes from the root THŪ, which means it would be pronounced with a TH. Silma (white crystal) comes from the root SIL, so it and related words like Silmaril would be pronounced with an S. No Fëanorian would say Thilmaril. Isil (moon), however, is a similar-sounding word that comes from a different root: THIL. Olos (mass of flowers) comes from the word LOTH, but: Olos (dream) comes from the root LOS. Fëanorian pronunciation would immediately differentiate between these two words.

While Fëanorians may have retained the distinct pronunciation of TH vs S, other Noldor can still differentiate between original S and S-that-used-to-be-TH in their writing. There are specific tengwar to use depending on the word’s original form. Silmë (the one that looks like a 6) is used for original S, while súlë (or thúlë, the one that looks like an h) is used for original TH.

Which other elves used this sound in their speech?

Fandom has really latched on to this TH as a Fëanorian thing, but it wasn’t that exclusively. The TH sound was actually ubiquitous in other elven languages, and in Valinor, only the Noldor dropped it. It was still used in Telerin and in Vanyarin Quendya. The Vanyar retained the TH not because of anything to do with Míriel, but just because they were a little more conservative and their language didn’t pick up on all the changes that the Noldor made. They also noped out of the Z to R shift the Noldor initiated, opting to keep the Z around.

When Indis married Finwë, she stopped using the normal Vanyarin TH and switched over to S as a gesture of loyalty to him and his people. Finarfin, however, out of love for the Vanyar and Teleri, switched BACK to TH. I like to think about how much it would have annoyed Fëanor that his snot-nosed kid brother was speaking correctly, but for the wrong reason. Go down one more generation, and Galadriel very specifically did not use TH. But this time it was absolutely a choice made as a glaring middle finger to Fëanor.

What this means for your fanfic or whatever

The big takeaway here: you can’t just have Fëanorians replace every S with TH and call it a day.

If you’re inventing names for your Fëanorian OCs or coming up with phrases for them to say, it’s important to look into the history of all Quenya S-words you end up using to determine if they should be S or TH. If Fëanor got mad about somebody saying Serindë instead of Therindë, he’d get equally mad about somebody saying Thilmaril instead of Silmaril and assume they were mocking him. Remember: this is a dude with no chill. (On the other hand, if you WANT somebody to be mocking Fëanor, Galadriel would 100% do this because she has an equally negligible amount of chill.)

It’s also important to note that the TH isn’t a true shibboleth, since pretty much all elves EXCEPT the non-Fëanorian Noldor use it. And even the S-preferring Noldor would still be able to pronounce the TH. Those who went into exile would go on to use it commonly in Sindarin, and those who remained in Valinor would still encounter it among the Vanyar and Teleri. So if you’re writing a scene where somebody has to pronounce a TH word to prove their loyalty… yeah, everyone can pass this test. And in the opposite direction, you can’t use TH to prove somebody’s an evil Fëanorian, either. They might just be Vanyarin or something. Or, like. Really Old.

Would the sons (and followers) of Fëanor keep using TH after his death? Oh hell yeah. This is an entire family unfamiliar with the concept of not dying on hills. They will keep using it unto the ending of the world. Actually, with Sindarin becoming the common language of Middle-earth from the First Age, probably not a lot of change happened in exilic Quenya. It became a lore language: a piece of living history. It would have been preserved as it was when the original speakers left Valinor.

(And then, thousands of years later, Galadriel finally returns home to Tirion like, Long have mine eyes awaited this most blissful of sights, and ne’er hath my sprit soared with such grace, for I am returned! And all the Amanyar Noldor stare at her like, whatchu bangin on bout, eh? Because they had nothing better to do in the peace of Valinor than push Quenya to brave and frankly questionable new horizons.)

Anyway, there you go: a somewhat brief history of Fëanorian Quenya. I hope you found this informative and useful, or at the very least not boring. Obvs this is super condensed and, uh, not particularly scholarly, but I promise I know what I’m talking about. I have a university degree! (Not in anything even remotely related to what’s written above, but I hardly see how that’s relevant. It’s still a DEGREE.)

Questions? Need clarification or want more info? My asks are always open!

#feanor #silmarillion #quenya #tolkien #middle earth

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abeautifulblog · 2 years

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If you're still taking these, I'd be interested in your thoughts on a/b/o! (personally, i always thought it was a reflection of most fanfic being written by women who date men at least some of the time, ie writers whose own intimate relationships involve gender-based hierarchies, and who found a way to reintroduce that element into same-gender relationships in order to explore it in slash fiction. But I'd be curious to know what you think about it!)

At first I found it off-putting and uncomfortable—and sometimes still do, depending on how the author chooses to play it—but after enough years of exposure therapy, I've become inured to it, and it's basically value-neutral to me these days. When I'm cruising for fic and something looks interesting, seeing that it's tagged A/B/O isn't going to affect whether I click on it or not.

I enjoy it as a vehicle for porn, because heat/rut/hormones/etc lets authors ramp up the intensity of how scorchingly horny the blorbos are for each other, with a truly gratuitous number of orgasms involved. (As an aside, I prefer it when omegas are intersex, so that writers can hand-wave the trickier/less hygienic aspects of butt-sex. And so I'm not forced to imagine butt-birth. 😖)

But I've read very few fics that actually put interesting ideas into the worldbuilding, and thinking about the broader effects that omegaverse dynamics would have on society, because seriously, that would change everything. Instead, it frequently just gets overlaid atop stories that... have no reason to be omegaverse stories? Again, not like fanfic needs to justify itself beyond “I wanted to,” but I'll admit, I don't really understand why this concept has such lasting and widespread appeal.

As you say, I've read meta theorizing that it allows (predominantly female) fanfic writers to explore gender dynamics and gendered expectations in a way that doesn't hit quite so close to home—that it's easier and more enjoyable to explore those themes at a remove, in a fictional scenario that can be informed by their own experiences, but doesn't have to be constrained by reality.

Maybe that's true, or true for some people—I am not qualified to say. Or maybe it's as fruitless as trying to theorize why some people are into kink, when the answer is just “some people are,” and there's not much rhyme or reason to it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Personally, what turns me off about A/B/O fic is extreme feminization of the omega character. That is 1) decidedly not my kink (I'm getting flashbacks to the heteronormativity of early-aughts yaoi; google 'yaoi hands' if you want to traumatize yourself), and 2) on a narrative level it makes me go, Why didn't you just write genderswap fic? o_O When the anatomy, the clothes, the demeanor, the social expectations are not genderqueer, but all unambiguously female, and the only nod to it being omegaverse is male pronouns... why? In those cases, the A/B/O elements are doing nothing but making me viscerally uncomfortable.

(And mpreg is soooo beyond not-my-kink. 😬)

That said, there is no moral component to my discomfort—a philosophy that modern fandom could stand to reacquaint itself with, along with the term “squick.”

I, personally, find male characters being feminized* off-putting and uncomfortable—I am squicked out by it, if you will—but that isn't any sort of objective judgment on the trope itself, that's a me-thing. You don't have to come up with excuses for why Trope X is immoral and gross and problematic in order to justify not enjoying it. People just like different things.

Anyway, fic recs!

OMEGAVERSE FICS WOT GREMBLE ENJOYED, and don't @ me if they include things I just said I'm not into.

The Ties that Bind, by Odsbodkins – Captain America: Winter Soldier, Steve/Bucky. The fact that I still remember this fic, even though I'm well out of this fandom, should tell you something. The author does possibly the best job I've read of exploring the wider context of A/B/O dynamics, and how that plays out in social norms and pop culture.

Intent, by tnico – The Witcher, Lambert/Aiden. Have you ever heard of an omegaverse fic in which one of the leads was a beta? Now you have, and you're welcome, because tnico writes the best Lambert in the whole damn fandom.

(Now back to your regularly scheduled Geralt/Jaskier recs -- and there are plenty more that I enjoyed, I just have a memory like a sieve. Feel free to rec more in the comments!)

A New Drink, Honey-Sweet, by GreenBird

basically all of suzukiblu's fics in that trope

Ballad of the Bride Surprise, by greyduckgreygoose

Rare Bird, by spqr

Fingers Crossed, by grassylampshade

And an actual books rec: the Wraeththu series, by Storm Constantine. It's not exactly omegaverse, but it hits the same genderbending buttons—humanity is being supplanted by a race of hermaphroditic humans who are all gorgeously androgynous and very queer with each other. Dark fantasy, similar vibes to Anne Rice and Tanith Lee, with moody gothic opulence and rarefied homoeroticism. The first in the series is Enchantments of Flesh and Spirit, and I despise the protagonist in that book, I want to slam his head in a car door, but fortunately all the subsequent books are centered on other people.

* This is completely unrelated to trans AUs or trans headcanons for a character, those don't bother me. Trans women are women, and so it is just and proper for them to wear women's clothing, but putting male characters in corsets or lingerie or whatnot is going to have me pretty much instantly back-buttoning out of a fic. Which, it occurs to me, makes me kind of a raging hypocrite, because I'm fine with cross-dressing when I do it.

idk, man. brains are weird and contradictory sometimes.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

#omegaverse #asks #trope game #this really does open the door to a broader conversation about gender nonconformity in fic

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