#that was definitely lan xichen's idea

[acequinz]

Once again bound by meng yao demons.

I want to squeeze him till his head pops or bite his head off...

Is this how NMJ felt?

NMJ just be there confusing the absolute urge to kiss the mess meng yao is with wanting to kill him.

Maybe the reason was that LXC also has extreme kissing thoughts about Meng Yao but they are much gentler.

So NMJ was like- oh i probably just want him dead.

Like nah. You all should have fucked.

Maybe lxc was trying to get NMJ and meng yao to fuck it out by forcing them into sworn brotherhood.

[mostlikelytofangirl]

Heyo imagine JGY is getting fucked by LXC and "daddy" just spills out

LOL talking about awkward xD

To LXC's credit, he must have been giving JGY one hell of a dicking if he managed to make the guy forget himself like that, but the mortification would be automatic bc JGY was either so lost in pleasure that he reverted to his daddy kink and now he has some serious explanation to do, or... he was thinking about someone else

Either way, LXC is in for a ride lol

[oneeyedoctogod]

Gods this fandom sometimes, I swear. I'm sorry I read two deeply bad takes back to back, and I have to rant. I'm sure others have said it better than I, but really. Come on. I actually have to wonder if people who talk about the extras actually read them because...

Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji didn't leave the cultivation world in canon. They elope, and then they come back. The fact they're not involved in the bigger politics is... pretty much to be expected, but they very much do participate in the day to day lives of the Lan sect. They go where the chaos is to night hunt, they teach, Lan Wangji comforts his brother in his seclusion, and Wei Wuxian meets some new Lan disciples.

As for the cottage fantasy... Again, I honestly have to wonder if the people talking about it actually read the extra it's in? Because it's just that. A fantasy. A dream. It's basically a representation of Wei Wuxian's wants for a domestic life, something he definitely has now! He's always been characterised as someone who wants to help others and who loves cultivation. Why would you think the dream is to be taken literally?

And the idea that Wei Wuxian has 'several important relationships just floating there', that he's not dealing with... Where? Which ones? He teaches the juniors and grows closer to Jin Ling. He doesn't exactly interact with Lan Xichen, but he asks after him. He meets Mianmian again and wishes her well. He asks after Wen Ning after Lan Sizhui comes back then has some father-son bonding moments with him!

Nie Huaisang and Wei Wucian aren't close. They were friendly once, but they didn't ever meet after the lectures. I don't see how that qualifies as an "important" relationship, especially with Nie Huaisang never openly admitting to his part in Wei Wuxian's resurrection. But even then, Wei wuxian says he'll be keeping a close eye on him, so one can imagine they meet again at some point.

As for Jiang Cheng... what more do you want Wei Wuxian to do exactly? Even if you want a reconciliation, why can't Jiang Cjeng be he one to actually grow up and do the work for once? He's the one who never apologized. He's the one who is still openly hostile in the extras. If Wei Wuxian wants to move on and not interact with him, he's well within his right to do that, given how Jiang Cheng treated him. Hell, he's more generous than most since he encourages Jin Ling to talk to Jiang Cheng. If I'd been treated by someone like Jiang Cheng treated Wei Wuxian and saw him hit our nephew several times, I certainly wouldn't encourage them to meet. (But that's Wei Wuxian for you, the moral ideal and better than all of us.)

Anyway, I really don't understand why people insist on making Wangxian have a sadder ending than the one they actually did. It's a HEA for them, sorry guys. And yeah, maybe Wei wuxian has some trauma to work on... but the whole point of the character is that he doesn't let his trauma define him. That he wants to forgives, forgets and moves on.

(Also, just because he doesn't have a breakdown or the cultivation equivalent of therapy in the extra doesn't mean he's not working on them? He finally is at peace, with a solid support network. Maybe he does talk about his past hurts with Lan Wangji - Lan Wangji certai ly knows when to comfort him when he needs it. But the narrative point of the extras is to show they're moving on from the past! And you know what, sometimes the beat thing to do to heal is to do just that. They're living their best lives, deal with it.)

And finally... shit did you really read the whole book and come to the conclusion Wei Wuxian should have 'learned to accept help'? Who the fuck offered help? Who did he refuse?

(Don't say Lan Wangji. 1) I love him, but "Come back to Gusu" is very much not an obvious offer to help, and when Wei Wuxian understandably misunderstands him, he never manages to correct it.

And 2) once Wei Wuxian tells him explicitly he's not leaving the Wen remnants behind, Lan Wangji understands and backs off. He approves! I'm sure he'd do more if he could, but just like Jiang Yanli, he can't!)

Jiang Cheng literally said, 'No one will help you, no one is on your side' (and then made sure that was true by saying Wei Wuxian was the enemy of the cultivation world). Jin Zixuan chose to ask the one who was ambushed to disarm rather than the 300 cultivators attacking him and lunged at him when Wei Wuxian refused to comply (because he'd be killed if he did!!). How is that help?

Who else tried to help? Whose help did Wei Wuxian reject?

Wei Wuxian was presented with a series of bad choices and took the best he could, the ones aligned with his principles, accepting he'd have to face consequences at some point but also knowing it was still worth it. He's not the one who failed or made a fatal mistake or betrayed his word.

Rant over. Sorry about that.

[jiangwanyinscatmom]

And also on the idea of Lan Love Curse: I don't like this being used to describe Lan Xichen's situation because Jin Guangyao most definitely was not the love of his life and him dying isn't what shook Lan Xichen up.

What shook Lan Xichen's entire foundation of life was that he was unwittingly passive to actual disgusting actions that took place by a vile man, because he kept putting off the red flags exhibited by that man, and kept trying to reason he had so much tragedy and accusations put upon Jin Guangyao and thinking of it as such was disrespectful.

He is very willing to cut his ties to Jin Guangyao while wanting to retain his humanity by not just killing him out of respect for a friendship that he was severing ties to, and the man was dying anyway. It was kicking a dog down to do anything else to Jin Guangyao, until he was once more tricked in having his hand make the final blow so Jin Guangyao would be kicked down once more very humiliatingly.

He wasn't upset that Jin Guangyao died when he was already a dead man walking, he was upset at his own lack of insight despite his pride in being known for that and promoting good, and the hypocrisy of his own actions.

Basically it was a conga line of humiliation coming to roost for him within less than 12 hours and him being forced to see what his own lack of wanting to commit to his doubts that were proven true, that could have saved a lot of troubles.

[veliseraptor]

for the AU ask meme: /waves my magic wand, jin guangyao, su she AND xue yang make it to dongying! what happens next?

the mental image of su she and jin guangyao just fuckin...dragging a dis-armed, half-dead xue yang along with them on their dongying escape, though. that alone.

I feel like su she might be dealing with this situation best? jin guangyao is dealing with the collapse of everything he cared about, and xue yang is dealing with losing the last shreds of hope for getting xiao xingchen back (which is all he's cared about for a while) and while su she is also dealing with the loss of a lot I feel like (a) he still has jin guangyao, which is a big deal, and (b) he's stubborn enough and determined enough to be like "OKAY, STARTING OVER"

and also channeling his upset into pissed rather than despairing, which puts him at least motivationally ahead of his two companions.

xue yang and su she bicker. a lot. partially this is tactical on su she's part (keeping xue yang annoyed is a way of keeping him from lapsing into the pit of despair) and partly because su she needs someone to channel his pissed off at and xue yang can take it (he can, all else being equal it's almost reassuring; I think that their relationship has always involved some amount of...not antagonism but sniping, albeit historically usually it's xue yang needling su she)

jin guangyao is...he's not exactly coping but he is, you know, alive, and he's not going to take that for granted. and jin guangyao's a survivor! he's not going to give up just because he's lost everything! but it's...hard. and the pining for lan xichen in particular is real.

which is rough for su she even though he's never going to make that jin guangyao's problem. but it's just like. he's still here! lan xichen ultimately gave up on jin guangyao and he didn't! and he won't! ahhhh. but again, he's not making this jin guangyao's problem at all, ever.

I like thinking about them building a small and not very exciting or glamorous but still okay life as a weird social unit together, though. they're not making any waves or drawing much attention, and it's definitely a come down for both su she and jin guangyao from their previous statuses, but again, at least they're alive. I think if I wrote this it would be about that: the three of these people in the wreckage of their lives rebuilding something from the scraps.

this is actually a really fun idea and I'm sort of tempted to write something for it

[enby-axels]

probably my most unpopular mdzs opinion ever is that lan wangji is trauma bonded to lan xichen. and i mean that in the truest sense of the term in which a victim feels emotionally attached to their abuser, not referring to the distorted, pop psychology definition of two people bonding because they experience trauma together.

i know people wont like this because they cling to the idea of lan xichen being made of idk sunshine and sparkles. but you can be a superficially nice person and also enable horrific violence; this is literally one of the main points mdzs is making about his character. similarly, you can love someone and want what [you think] is best for them, but also harm and, yes, abuse them. this too is true of lan xichen, who — in his position as his clan's leader — punished lan wangji nearly to death for the crime of protecting the love of his life, who himself was just trying to protect war refugees from collective punishment. and then let his clan participate in the murder of said refugees and also the love of his brother's life. (yall: lwj injured 33 of his clan's seniors! me: and who put him in that position. why were they following him in the first place. do you seriously think he would raise his sword against his own clan unless he had no choice)

and like you can make up a million excuses for lan xichen, tell yourself it wasnt that bad or that it cant possibly qualify as abuse even though there's an established power imbalance and a violent exploitation of said power imbalance which lan wangji is in no position to defy, even by the end of the novel. and im sure lan xichen himself made similar excuses to himself to justify his actions so he could sleep at night, but the fact of the matter is that mdzs the novel is naaawwwwt condoning his actions. there's a clear perpetrator of violence here, and also a clear victim

all this to say that lan wangji's relationship with his clan and his direct blood relations is much more complex than popular interpretations acknowledge. as if this isnt clear enough from him being the second jade, the spare to his brother the heir, the politically less important brother who was sent to the wen indoctrination while his older brother fled, the secondborn son whose truths are repeatedly subordinated to his clan leader's lies. twin jades of lan is an ironic title, in the same way twin heroes of yunmeng is ironic. theyre not twin anythings. they were never equals, in moral character or political power

so yeah, lan wangji does love and has probably even forgiven his brother. but what other choice does he have?

[whetstonefires]

Very fun thing actually about Jin Guangyao is he spent so much time and energy passing himself off as normal. The Normalest Guy, Look How Normal I Am. The Very Best And Most Skilled At Normal Things, Like Being Normal And Having Normal Opinions.

Which is great because on the one hand it reflects how he was kind of aware he absolutely was not. (And that by default this isolated him and this was Very Unsafe.) But on the other you see, with all the times he falls into the typical mind fallacy under stress and projects weird shit onto people, he also on some level believed everyone was doing this.

That being a Normal Person who had Normal Reactions to things, like being appalled by brutal violence, was an elaborate social lie everyone had to maintain to keep up the facade of civil society, and actually everyone was basically the same as him deep down. He was just better at it, and also the smartest.

Which is a very long way to say his character arc is heavily tied up with his evolving relationship with and skills at masking. I'm not gonna armchair diagnose him because that's beside the point, the point is that he is trying so fucking hard to be normal, but without a particularly well-developed definition of what's abnormal about him to begin with, resulting in some misfires.

And then you contrast him to some other characters and it gets more fun. One of his direct foils is Nie Mingjue, who literally does not know how to mask at all, not the slightest bit, but is fortunate enough to have been born the exact kind of weirdo his position in life demands, with special interests in 'saber training' and 'destroying evil.'

(He explicitly, per narration from wwx being inside his head, has no other interests and doesn't really understand the idea of having more than one activity you care about, do not tell me Nie Mingjue is walking around with a normal brain.)

So he is (jgy has a point about this, although he actually makes it about the luxury of having moral compunctions) free to totally embrace the conviction that everyone should basically be their authentic selves at all times, and just not do evil things about it.

On the other hand, and this really illuminates their relationship for me, Lan Xichen is absolutely trying to be normal. Like, he does try to excel, he wants to be best and he knows he's good, but as a person he is also trying to be as normal as circumstances allow.

He understands 'being normal about things' as a goal not in jgy's terms as an elaborate social fiction but as aspirational shaping of the self; if everyone is normal about everything then there won't be needless conflict. Living as normally as possible will optimize your mental health and your respect for others, and it's just a good baseline from which to be good.

Which is fine as far as it goes, but means harmless eccentricity (including gay) is to be tolerated and swept under the rug rather than really supported, and prejudices him to instinctively side with Jin Guangyao and anyone else who is pushing for Let's Be Normal About This, even when the people being weird are in the right.

(This is also to a non-zero degree a trauma response behavior; what Lan Xichen experienced as the largest existential threat to him growing up was something along the lines of being perceived as a selfish disruptor of norms, like his father.)

And then contrast that to Jiang Cheng and Lan Wangji, who are both very concerned at least initially with how things and people and they themselves are supposed to be, and feel some responsibility for ensuring this supposed-to is reflected in reality.

But neither of them makes any particular attempt to be normal about it.

And then ofc Wei Wuxian, another jgy narrative foil, never attempts to pass himself off as normal. He will sell 'I'm better than everyone ever' and 'I'm scum of the earth' in the same breath before he will try for normal.

Except that he genuinely seems to think his most virtuous traits, his throw-himself-between-victim-and-weapon impulses, are basically normal. If not everyone (who isn't a total shithead) does it, it's because not everyone has his insane confidence they can pull it off.

Which in a good mood he would say is fair, because he is in fact awesome and really good at winning. (In a worse state of mind he would definitely hate on all the selfish cowards.)

Nie Huaisang is probably the most genuinely normal human being in the main cast, probably even more normal than Jiang Yanli, and he's very happy to play that up and present himself as actually even more normal and average than he is, in order to keep expectations down.

Up until his whole life gets fucked and this little pretense turns into the most elaborate and successful mask in the entire book.

[askew-d]

i want a modern wangxian au where the story doesn’t finish when they get together. i want chapters and chapters of their dynamics while in a relationship.

i want to see wangxian going in a cinema date and wei wuxian kissing his boyfriend to the point of leaning down to his pants until lan wangji has to forcefully stop him because there are people nearby. i want them discussing over to eat at a fast food chain or at a healthy restaurant friday evening and lan wangji folding when wei wuxian pouts, so they end up with a veggie hamburger, a big mac and a mcflurry on their table (the mcflurry belongs to lan wangji).

i want them giving goodnight kisses to their bunnies before going to sleep. i bet lan wangji likes his showers cold, wei wuxian likes them burning hot, and they always hug each other from behind after it just to annoy the other because of their body temperature.

i want to see lan wangji glaring at jiang cheng from the other side of the dinner table and only showing a nice demeanor when it's jiang yanli who directs her words to him and that infuriates jiang cheng so much that he calls out for memories of when lan wangji used to reject wei wuxian's advances just to be petty. lan wangji hates when they remember how he used to ignore his wei ying.

i want wei wuxian burning their kitchen with a recipe and lan wangji running back home worried wei wuxian got hurt (he just got a slight burn, but he's all pouting about it anyway, and lan wangji showers him in love and care even though their stove definitely got the worst of it and they'll need another one urgently).

i want wei wuxian pranking the juniors he got at work. i want lan wangji or wei wuxian unintentially going viral regarding something stupid. i want lan xichen being the one who takes candid pictures and who appears by surprise in the apartment during moments they're not ready for it.

i want wei wuxian to have ongoing fights with every neighbour: a competition with the upstairs woman who thinks her sex's life is better than theirs, the university student who thinks he can pull a rock song louder than wei wuxian's favorite ones, the left-door hag who thinks she can still hide a dog even if there are explicit rules in the building forbidding it (wei wuxian specifically chose that building because of this rule and he will not let her get away with it), the right-door lady who thinks she can flirt with wei wuxian's man without consequences (nothing that some disappearances of some of her mail can't solve though), and the neighbour at the front door who's definitely into some drug scheme (wei wuxian helps the police out with that).

these are just stupid ideas, but you get me. i want everything about this couple. i need especially this. i need it like the air i breathe. like the sun. like food.

[dr-duckie]

soooo has anyone thought of a mdzs x svsss transmigration au with shen jiu and meng yao?

i’m not going into detail over their similarities but most people get the idea— brothels, yqy/lxc, spite, villainous antagonists that didn’t deserve what they were put through as a child, late start in cultivation, cunning personality, etc etc

yea.

let me start: shen jiu, one day, is gifted a high quality book set from one of his brothel jiejies when visiting them. at first, shen jiu had no plans to legitimately read them (mostly due to a lack of leisure time), but he eventually got to reading it when he was on a qian cao-mandated break after a qi deviation.

he gets hooked. when SJ is nearing the end of the novel, his thoughts are as followed: JGS deserved to get castrated and his limbs thrown to the endless abyss— WWX, although he was absolutely shameless, he was at least competent— LWJ was a fool for being so in love, but he was moral and loyal— and lan xichen…

an ache forms in shen jiu’s heart whenever he thinks about him. lxc, a man with a gentle, pacifistic, amiable personality who believed in what was right all the way until the end. he wholeheartedly supported and trusted his sworn brother, jin guangyao, until he couldn’t anymore.

shen jiu was touched. lan xichen, that man, had wasted all his efforts on an irredeemable monster. in a similar fashion, yue qingyuan was doing the same.

as for meng yao… shen jiu resented him. he had a loving mother, one who worked so hard for his happiness, only to squander all her efforts. meng yao… had what shen jiu envied the most in the newest disciple he just brought in. luo binghe. imo, it would be a clear sign of shen jiu’s self hatred projected onto meng yao. he sees the two of them as the hopeless scum of society, too broken to be loved. they were “charity cases” that couldn’t be fixed, no matter what.

soon after shen jiu finishes the novel, he falls into a qi deviation (the very same one that shen yuan transmigrated into) and dies. through some time space dimension jumping, shen jiu lands into the body of one 14 yo meng yao. and that’s just the beginning of his story.

shen jiu starts out by practicing cultivation in secret. meng yao’s body, although he is no prodigy, would definitely benefit from practicing from a younger age. then he gets to planning. with how shen jiu is, he would not step a foot in the karp tower, with a system or not. like, just no. i believe he’d set JGS on fire if he ever had to see the guy. the only plot point shen jiu intends on fulfilling is saving lan xichen, and then living a comfortable life away from the jianghu.

but within a year of living with meng shi in the brothel, shen jiu grows attached to her. he *wants* to make her proud, even if he wasn’t her real son. he was a total impostor. but even so, he didn’t want her legacy to be tainted by the actions of jin guangyao— who was now still meng yao, who is now shen jiu. but he doesn’t want to go to the jin sect. after an arduous process of actual communication with someone for a long time, meng shi realizes that the jin sect wouldn’t be good for her son, and jin guangshan wouldn’t help her *or* meng yao. the night before meng shi dies, she tells shen jiu that she loves him, regardless of whether he may fulfill her dreams.

aaaand, after that, shen jiu buries meng shi. he makes enough money as an artist (in secret, with his skillset from qing jing) to give her the proper burial rites. after that, he runs away. shen jiu finds a job as an assistant to an artist who sold fans and paintings in caiyi town. through his job, he meets NHS first, when he’s on his first year of being st the cloud recesses. surprisingly, shen jiu and nie huaisang have a friendship that… isn’t too bad. shen jiu is amiable, shows off the different fans he’s painted, and nie huaisang eagerly buys all of them. nie huaisang also buys out shen jiu’s other works, like his poetry and short stories. that day, with shen jiu’s qiankun pouch full, he treats himself to tanghulu.

the second encounter with nie huaisang brought along jiang cheng and wei wuxian. at that point in time, they were investigating the waterborne abyss problem. shen jiu, a year older now, shows nie huaisang his “new” invention: the war fan. wei wuxian is absolutely delighted at the new invention, and jiang cheng, although less excited that WWX, is considerably impressed as well. as for NHS, well, words can’t describe his happiness. shen jiu, on a whim, gifts it to him for free— mockingly thanking NHS for being such a generous patron. nie huaisang, unable to contain his excitement anymore, jumps on shen jiu and embraces him dramatically. this causes such a commotion, lan wangji comes over. with his brother.

(okay, i’m done writing for today.)

[yoyowrites]

as i read mdzs, i had a hard time wrapping my head around lan xichen. he was so kind but for whatever reason i didn't trust him. honestly, until it was explicitly said that he was being held captive and forced to seal up his cultivation that i trusted he wasn't a part of meng yao's scheme. then, it hit me.

lan xichen parallels yue qingyuan. they are both outwardly kind, of high status, and powerful. they both have a soft spot for questionable men and that soft spot leads them to ignoring the men's unsavory sides.

the same way yqy definitely knew that something was up with how shen jiu treated lou binghe, lxc had to have had SOME idea that meng yao was untrustworthy. not just meng yao, listen i love nie mingjue but the reason meng yaoi's plan was so perfect is because nmj had already been seen as so volatile. nmj was respected, yes, but he was also feared. he had a huge temper. lxc was used to looking away when poor behavior occured in favor of having a more positive view of the person

[expertnuerodiver]

MXTX headcanons no one asked for!

Xue Yang, Shen Jiu, and Qi Rong would buy the last thing on the shelf if it meant someone else would have a bad day.

SVSSS

Shang Qinghua (Airplane) is either really good at math and was in math olympics as a kid or so bad he has to count two plus two on his hands, no exception.

Shen Yuan was a nerd in middle and high, no one can convince me otherwise. (He was bullied hardcore for it, most likely Pokemon, Yugioh, and D&D.)

Sha Hualing and Liu Mingyan are op in Just Dance.

MDZS

Nie Huaisang would LOVE Johannes and Michael’s.

Xue Yang would love any candy store, especially 5 and Below with all the cheap candy.

Modern day Wei Wuxian most definitely put a whoopee cushion on Lan Qiren’s seat back in his teen years and it worked. (Everybody holding in that laugh, even Lan Wangji and Lan Xichen.)

Jiang Yanli would have an aesthetic Pinterest account

Mo Xuanyu would LOVE Grindr

Xue Yang would have one of those secret candy stashes that kids have as he got older.

TGCF

Xie Lian in the modern world would love goodwill and thrift stores.

Qi Rong would be addicted to watching Rupaul’s Drag Race. (Probably where he learned how to do make up and come up with those snarky comments)

Shi Qingxuan also watches Rupaul’s drag race but only to think of designs and makeup ideas. (Unlike Qi Rong)

Hua Cheng would take as many language classes as he could

Xie Lian would LOVE creative writing courses

Pei Ming would LOVE Tinder

Xie Lian would accidently put diesel inside of a gas car (Rip)

If one of the gods hosted a decade party, probably Shi Qingxuan, Xie Lian would mess up the decade (E.G. 1880’s vs 1980’s)

[letteredlettered]

I've always found the umbrella scene in the rain in CQL a little hard to swallow. Both WWX and LWJ have seen the Wen remnants abused over and over again. WWX has now discovered a whole camp of them not only being abused but murdered, and the murder includes a friend of his who helped him during the war. WWX decides to do something about these atrocities and save a bunch of women and children and elderly people, and . . . LWJ protests? Does he even know what's going on? Why does he want to stop WWX from doing the right thing?

My interpretation of this scene has always been that while LWJ is aware of the abuses they have witnesses together, he was not aware of what specifically happened at the camp and with Wen Ning. However, he is aware that WWX is turning his back on the cultivation world, and he believes that there is another way to handle this without WWX suddenly becoming enemy number one. My interpretation is that LWJ thinks that surely this can be handled through negotiation--or, if resolution with the Jin Sect can't be reached, then an agreement can be made between the other sects that will force the Jin Sect to handle this a different way.

Still, it really does look like he's there to protest protecting the innocent, so it isn't a scene that I love. As I've stated elsewhere, I have no idea what we're supposed to think about fucking Lan Xichen sitting around while the Wen prisoners are so sorely abused, other than that the show can only have one hero, which seems silly to me when WWX does such bad things.

My understanding was that LWJ was not there when WWX absconded with the Wen remnants in the book, so I was eager to read the book's explanation. As I've stated elsewhere, the handling of the Wens' abuse is much, much easier to understand in the book, because no one is really seeing it. The Jin Sect knows it's happening, but my impression of the book is that even Jin Zixuan would object to the abuses of the prisoners, much less Lan Xichen. It's easy to believe that Jin Zixuan and even Lan Xichen think that WWX just went crazy and really took the Wens to start his own sect or create an army. It's possible to understand that JC doesn't understand why WWX would bother (though I gotta say that the aid WN and WQ render to both WWX and JC in the book feels even more risky and monumental, so while it's understandable that JC wasn't super aware of their help at the time, it definitely comes across as pretty awful that JC can't look past their names).

But I'm actually even more confused about LWJ in the book than I am in the show. In the show, you really feel like "okay, so LWJ just disagrees and is unwilling to walk the narrow bridge," fine. But in the book--like, what is his opinion on what WWX did? After the NIghtless City massacre, LWJ says he doesn't know if WWX is right or wrong, but he's willing to suffer the punishment for WWX's crimes with WWX. And you could apply that to this situation and say that LWJ doesn't know whether it's right or wrong that WWX absconded with the Wens--but the other half of the statement, that he's willing to accept WWX's punishment with him, seems he really should had just gone to the Burial Mounds when WWX took the Wens there and helped him the whole time. Is it that LWJ doesn't know whether absconding with the Wens is right or wrong, but that he'd not yet willing to suffer punishment with WWX for his crimes?

Does he think WWX doesn't need him? I can see LWJ convincing himself that WWX is powerful and doesn't need help. I can also see LWJ telling himself that WWX has rejected him time and time again and so would not want him at the Burial Mounds. But idk, LWJ goes to Yiling and WWX doesn't reject him at all. Plus, LWJ sees what's happening there, that there are just a bunch of people farming and trying to make a living. If he is so upright and just, why wouldn't he help? And if he doesn't know whether helping would be upright and just, isn't he in love? Why wouldn't he help?

I think the only argument that can be made is that LWJ hasn't accepted his own love and doesn't until WWX goes mad at Nightless City. But I think it's still weird that this character who is supposed to be so good and noble doesn't see that helping the Wens is right, and if he does see it, doesn't stand with WWX against the world.

See, what works for me in CQL is that LWJ actively regrets the past. He clearly states that he thinks he wronged WWX. And that makes a lot more sense to me than MDZS!LWJ, who ...well, never says much. So, now I'll tell you my interpretation of the book--my Doylian interpretation, since I can't make a Watsonian one make much sense.

My interpretation of the book is that MXTX wants LWJ to be noble and good and just, but it's actually hard to make anyone turning their backs on WWX at the Burial Mound look good, which is why we never get even a whiff of what JYL and LWJ think about the Wen remnants or WWX's little settlement near Yiling. Because MXTX wants WWX to be noble and good and just but also rejected by the world. Imo, the case with JC is made much more strongly; JC sees what's going on at the Burial Mounds and gets that WWX is being a hero, but is frustrated by it because JC has his own things going on and is drowning and needs help. Meanwhile all JYL has going on is a wedding and all LWJ has going on is...WWX, so you really can't say much about what they think about everything or the plot kinda falls apart.

It's very frustrating and has made me come to love the umbrella scene a lot more.

[drama--universe]

Lie Detector Curse

Requested by anonymous: Hi, I picked up some idea from the foreign stories and came up with an idea for a request: How would Meng Yao, Lan Zhan, Zewu Jun and Wen Ning react to a reader who has something like a ''useful'' curse? Anyone near the reader lies, gets caught, gets hit out of thin air, has colored hair, longer nails, or has a colored aura around them...how would they react to a reader with this curse? Would they appreciate it or take it badly? Thx!

Pairing: Untamed boys x reader

Warnings: none, I think

Lan Zhan:

You can see auras of people

which leads to being able to see if they're dangerous or not

and also when someone is truthful or not

Lan Zhan is concerned about this

and honestly, I think he'd take it badly

because he thinks that you sacrificed something to gain such powers

it's not every day that you meet someone that can sense if someone is lying or not by seeing auras

it isn't until you explain that you had been cursed by someone else, that he somehow feels better about your powers

not fine really, because you still got cursed

he doesn't worry about them perse, he never lies

but he surely will ask for your help with some of his work that includes socializing with people

he's not good with people

and they tend to lie to him when he asks questions

and thus you follow

it makes his life much easier

and his journeys significantly shortens in time

so it definitely grows on him after time

just give him awhile

Lan Xichen:

your hair changes color depending on who you talk to

it depends on emotions

red for anger, blue for sadness, yellow for happiness, green for envy and black for nothing

but when someone lies, it turns to white

Lan Xichen definitely finds it peculiar

he isn't sure what to think

even after an explanation

he's mortified that someone would curse a child, mostly

he, honestly, finds it a bit funny at times

because you can't fully control it

which means that your hair changes at any time

even if you're talking to someone you barely know

and they always tend to run off after

he tries his best to hide his smile

but he's always quick to make sure that you don't take it to heart

he usually doesn't ask for your help regarding your curse/gift

only when it is absolutely necessary

which is often only when you jump in on your own accord

he's one of the four who really wouldn't care much in the end

Meng Yao:

you're a bit like Wen Ning

your appearance changes and your eyes turn black when someone near you is dangerous or lying

(you change immediately when you see him)

nonetheless, he never really lies to you

he learns that your powers don't take in account when he just leaves certain things out to avoid the actual truth

he finds a way to use your power for his benefit

because it makes his plans easier

he asks questions to people while you hide away

you can later tell him if it was the truth or a lie

he enjoys your powers to the fullest and you know this

hence why you stay by his side

because other people get frightened when they see you

Meng Yao never asks how you got your powers

because he honestly doesn't care

he's not here to be your best friend, he just needs your powers

when you couldn't help him out, he'll discard of you

maybe not, if you're lucky

Wen Ning:

your powers basically flip a person upside down if they lie

you can control it, you just have to look at the person as they talk

they lie?

they get thrown in the air and hung upside down

it isn't pleasant

you often don't look at people because of it

until you meet Wuxian

who loves it and lies on purpose

through him, you meet Wen Ning

who loves to see another person like him

cursed

he's practically a puppy as he talks to you

if he had a tail, it would be wagging left and right

always smiling near you

doesn't dare to lie, not that he ever would lie to begin with

he gets you more comfortable with eye contact again

soon enough you hold eye contact with everyone again

(Wuxian loves watching as you talk, waiting for someone to flip up again)

Wen Ning is just glad that you can go back to "normal"

at least conversation wise

he'd also make sure that you don't hate your gift

he calls it a gift, even if you don't agree fully

because he feels like it is a part of you and you can't hate yourself

[youhideastar]

WujiWatch: CQL Rewatch Episode 10

 Two things stand out to me in this episode: the question of conflict between the sects, and the question of the pros and cons of being outside the system.

So, first, conflict between the sects. It’s interesting, for a long time I assumed that serious conflicts—like, deadly armed conflict—between the sects was rare. In fact, I assumed that the last sect war was the war against Xue Chonghai (which occurred “thousands of years ago” according to Nie Mingjue, “hundreds of years ago” according to Lan Yi, and “a hundred years ago” according to Lan Xichen—amazing), and that since that time, the cultivation world has basically been at peace. Cultivators’ martial training was for fighting yao, mo, guai, and gui, and also taking down individual baddie cultivators, not for making war against large, organized groups of other cultivators.

But then, in this episode, when Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan are asked to help our heroes with their quest, they refuse on the ground that they don’t get involved in inter-sect conflicts. Not “we don’t want to get involved with this inter-sect conflict,” but “as a practice, we do not get involved with inter-sect conflicts ever,” which sure seems to imply that there have been others, in their lifetimes. Like, for abstaining to be a practice, there needs to be something to abstain from, you know?

And as I’m pondering this, the camera cuts to the first shot of the Unclean Realm, and my question is very definitively answered for me—because nobody builds fucking twenty-foot high stone walls with ramparts and a fucking portcullis because they’re scared of individual demons or ghosts, or even scared of a small group of the cultivational equivalent of bandits. You only build a fortress if you’re scared of an army.

(When you start seeing the sets this way, you realize that Cloud Recesses (at the top of a mountain accessible only by one narrow staircase), Jinlintai (another stone fortress accessible only by a staircase), and Nightless City (ditto, at the top of a mountain) are also all built to withstand a siege. Only Lotus Pier, wide-open and unfortified, is vulnerable. Easy pickings.)

This is important because I’d previously been pretty judgy about Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan refusing to be involved in dealing with the Yin Iron – I’d thought, “Sure, you don’t want to get involved in petty squabbling—but this is a big deal! Wen Ruohan is kidnapping random cultivators and turning them into zombies! How can you say you’re devoting your life to justice and then sit this one out?” But their decision makes a lot more sense if the sects are frequently at war with one another – this would, at this point in the plot, just look like more of the same. And I, too, would find it exhausting constantly getting asked to pick a side in bullshit wars waged by people more interested in acquiring power than using it to protect the people who they’re supposed to be protecting.

Okay, second thing: the idea of rogue cultivators. One of the interesting things about the drama introducing Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan this early is that it sets up this theme of Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji both yearning for that kind of free, roving life, and in fact, bonding over that shared longing. Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan sure make that life look very attractive. (Not just because they’re gorgeous, but that helps!) Prioritizing shared principles over bloodlines, going where the greatest need is, opting out of petty, grasping sect power struggles—it makes total sense that our heroes would go starry-eyed like they’re meeting celebrities; that Wei Wuxian would earnestly and awkwardly tell Xiao Xingchen that he and Lan Wangji have been trying to do the same thing with their Yin Iron quest; that Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji gaze longingly after Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan’s departing forms and then share a wistful look with each other.

But the price of that life, as the drama shows—also using Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan—is how powerless it makes you. Xue Yang’s capture would not have been possible without sect cultivator Wei Wuxian tethering him to keep him from running away. More importantly, only sect cultivators have a prison in which they can keep Xue Yang – if the sect boys hadn’t come along, Xiao Xingchen would have had no choice to either kill Xue Yang immediately—something that characters in this show are shockingly (to this Western viewer) loathe to do—or let him go. Xiao Xingchen tells our heroes that they can call on him if they are in need… but when Lan Wangji, practical boy that he is, asks how they can get in touch with him, Xiao Xingchen’s answer is basically, “You can’t,” because he doesn’t have a home base. So it’s a pretty empty promise. The vast and manifest injustices that will soon unfold in this story—from the Wens’ massacre of several entire sects (the very crime for which Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan sought to bring Xue Yang to justice) to the post-Sunshot torture, imprisonment, and murder of the Wen Remnants—will do so without a peep from these two righteous cultivators. The sects have corruption, and war, and hypocrisy—but they also have infrastructure, resources, and networks.

Xiao Xingchen and Song Lan show what happens when someone makes a principled decision to opt out of those resources and networks.

Meng Yao is about to show what happens when someone has those things stripped from him, against his will.

[veliseraptor]

>>> because Jiang Cheng never wants to force people to choose him, even 'for their own good' - this is actually one of the sharpest divergences I think between Wei Wuxian's approach to problems and Jiang Cheng's approach to problems, but that's another post.

I don’t suppose you’d be willing to make that other post? (Hopeful)

you know what, I feel like sticking my hand in a bear's mouth today, so sure.

one of the things that Wei Wuxian does kind of a lot, and most notably in the instance of his golden core (but also other places) is make decisions about what is best for other people. Wei Wuxian has the thing that many smart people do, where he has very definite ideas about what is the correct decision in given situations, and a belief in his capability to make the correct decision, and will make the choice to make that decision above somebody's head if he thinks they're not going to make the same choice as he would for reasons he thinks are bad. in the situation with Jiang Cheng, his reasoning (valid or not, and I'm not interested in adjuticating that) goes basically "Jiang Cheng can't die > if Jiang Cheng doesn't get his golden core back, he will die > I can give him my golden core > if I told him I was doing that, he wouldn't accept it > so I won't tell him about it and will give him my golden core and go from there.

I think you see it with the way he interacts with Jiang Yanli and Jin Zixuan, too - in his view Jin Zixuan is clearly undeserving and not good enough for Jiang Yanli, and could never make her happy, and therefore, regardless of the effect on Jiang Yanli, he acts according to that conviction. And also with what he chooses in novelverse specifically (with Lan Wangji) to tell/not tell Lan Xichen about Jin Guangyao, out of a conviction of what is best for Lan Xichen. Wei Wuxian is decisive and strong-willed and very confident in his skills of all kinds, and part of what comes with that self-confidence is the assurance that sometimes he knows better than the people around him, and maybe they don't realize that yet, but they will eventually, or else they just never need to know about the choice he made for them.

and then there's Jiang Cheng, who is...he's not conflict-avoidant, obviously, but what he won't do is interfere with somebody else's decision, or argue with them about it (past a certain point; the amount he argues with Wei Wuxian over his "defection" is, I think, unusual). when Jiang Yanli decides to marry Jin Zixuan, he accepts her leaving in a way Wei Wuxian struggles to do; when Wei Wuxian tells him to cut him off Jiang Cheng does it, as clearly as he doesn't really want to. when it's made clear to him that someone else, particularly someone he loves, has made a decision, even if he perceives it as harmful, even if he doesn't like it, he'll step back and let it go. obviously this has reams to do with his parents' relationship and the number it did on him watching their dynamic (and experiencing its consequences) - Jiang Cheng has internalized the message of "if you try to make decisions that other people don't like, even out of love, they will just end up hating you anyway."

(Wei Wuxian, I would argue, has the message of "regardless of whether people like your decisions or not, they might hate you anyway" which probably informs his thought process.)

I'm not saying this in a "Jiang Cheng respects peoples' agency, Wei Wuxian doesn't" sort of way (though I think that's kind of true, it's just not as 'this one good, this one bad' as that sounds), just in the sense of...if Wei Wuxian errs on the side of "I know best and can make decisions even if others don't like them" (to his detriment), Jiang Cheng errs on the side of "I have control over very specific things and will not overreach past those lines, even if it runs contrary to what I think is best."

[littlesmartart]

DRAWTOBER #24 - Point of Contact by carriecmoney

Jonathan’s life was fine. He didn’t need other people. He studied them instead, like fire ants on the abandoned edge of the playground; carefully, with a stick and good shoes, watching their patterns and keeping his observations to himself, figuring out which ones to leave alone and which ones would make good surprises in bullies’ backpacks. Other people were tools, in the multiple definitions of the word. He used them. He didn’t like them. He didn’t need them. He was fine. All in all, it wasn’t difficult to stay a virgin until he turned thirty. A JGY-centric, Cherry Magic-inspired AU.

this was a fic that I added pretty late in my planning - I had most of my list together, then I noticed this fic was complete and I DEVOURED it all in one day, and immediately had to shuffle my whole drawtober list around because I absolutely had to get it in. I normally avoid fics that use english names for these characters purely because I find it kind of jarring, but this fic really uses it to great effect in a way that felt - to me, anyway - like it reinforced ideas we get in the canon universe re: how privilege allows you to express your real self, compared to poor JGY who must always adapt himself to be more palatable and acceptable to others.

the characterisations are just absolutely stunning in this fic, especially as we get to see the external versions of them vs their inner mind that JGY sees when he touches them. I love the contrast between kind, calm Dr Lan vs Sappy Horny Brain Lan Huan, I love how Mingjue's mind house reflects the state of his mental health, I love flighty goofy external Huaisang hiding his super fast shrewd Quebecois inner monologue, I love how JGY's relationship with Zixuan and Yanli grows, I love his (temporary lmao) solidarity with Wangji, and I love all the flashbacks to JGY's childhood. as someone who really enjoys creating visual imagery for conceptual ideas in my own writing, it was such a delight to read about how JGY experienced everyone's minds as physical spaces. what I've drawn doesn't really necessarily encapsulate the vibe of the fic, but after seeing this INCREDIBLE animation I realised anything I was gonna draw would just wind up being a copy of that, so I went for something a bit different, showing one of my favourite moments and the, ah, mixed signals JGY gets in his journey to dating Xichen and Mingjue...