#Julie probably would though. do you understand. there's nuance 2 how I think characters would conceptualize

[clannfearrunt]

'did u seriously name your sapphic character yuri' no she was named after the flower bc my real life grandmother also was and I've always been like damnnn that really is a good fucking name. And then she decided she wanted to kiss a girl several days after the fact

[popculturebuffet]

Of Moons, Millionares and Mothers Part 3: Storkules in Duckburg! aka THE INCREDIBLE STORKULES TERRIBLE BUT WELL MEANING ROOMATE OUT OF MYTH

Hello all you happy people! And welcome and welcome back to Of Moons, Millionares and Mothers, my look at the season 2 arcs of Ducktales! This arc was paid for by WeirdKev27 and I truly enjoy his support. if you want to know how to commission your own reviews or to get a guarnateed review of me of your choice from me a month, stick around to the end. I realized that shoving all my plugs in up top may be driving people away and while I DO make them because I want to make a living off this, i’ts not fair to those of you who simply can’t afford to buy a lot of extra shit like myself to keep shoving it in your face. 

Previously on the Louie Inc Arc, Louie, after believing he had no skills and it was a matter of when not if he ws going to die, found his talent: seeing all the angles and thus being Sharper than the Sharpies. With newfound confidence and a chip on his shoulder from Scrooge saying he could one day be a bigger success than Scrooge himself, founding Louie Inc as a result. But what is Louie Inc? Does he actually have a plan or a bunch of buzzwords. And what does STORKULES, MANLY GAY OUT OF MYTH have to do with any of this? Join me under the cut to find out. 

We open with Louie giving Scrooge his sales pitch that is essentially...

Naturally Scrooge buys none of it. I mean he’s somewhere in his hundreds, he’s probably seen about 80 thousand pitches that amount to “I have no plan but give me money anyway”. There’s a reason there’s a Butch Hartman shaped crater on the lawn from where he threw his ass out. 

Scrooge does mentor the lad, or at least attempt to pointing out he needs an actual product or service (Louie rejects the idea of a lemonade stand as too easy), or as he puts it “Find a problem and create a solution”. 

While the basic PRINCIPAL isn’t bad, find something people want or need and provide it, phrasing it that way sounds like “find a problem people are having and exploit the shit out of that problem for fun and profit.” Granted that IS a guiding principal of business, it’s just not something an uncle should be teaching his kids. They should be teaching them about the anime and cartoons they grew up with as I do with my niece and nibling. 

He does show him a valid example of this in action in the form of Donald. Turns out Donald has found a good way to make money while he looks for a job, can relate: since Duckburg is facing a housing shortage, likely because several square blocks probably get destroyed by Scrooge’s Adventures, Glomgold’s Schemes, Superhero Battles, whatever creation went horribly wrong for Gyro, etc at least once a week. So he’s taken it upon himself to offer up the spare room to whoever can rent it.. and to steal Scrooge’s chandelier which even when caught he still takes anyway. Scrooge.. you called the guy a god-damn moocher in the season premiere, despite the fact he lives there soley because YOU offered and because he’s you know, being responsible and staying by his boys so they have their father figure around. So yeah I feel he’s doing this partly out of spite as is the McDuck way. I mean if your going to call him a freeloader just for being a responsible parent, then he’s going to take it up a damn notch.

Scrooge proceeds to laugh off Louie wanting a million dollars and gives him a dime instead because of course he was. Seriously Louie there are two other billionaires in town who are FAR dumber and far more easily swindled. Just go get star up capital from them. Hell with Glomgold all you’d have to do is tell him it’d upset scrooge and he’d literally throw money at you. Or give you a shark full of money. He needs the shark back though. He’s family. 

Meanwhile Donald prepares for his new tenant and finds.. THE INCREDIBLE STORKULES! Who to his mounting horror as he realizes it, IS the new tenant. And who throws him into the sun. Cue credits. 

So after Donald somehow survives being thrown into the sun, Storkules explains why he’s here: Zeus responded to his son playing the lute a lot like any rational reasonable 

No of course he responded to the “crime” of “playing his instrument a lot” with sending a swarm of harpies on the town then blaming Storkules for it and casting him out. What’s most shocking is not the action, this is honestly him staying the course of being a fucking disgrace, but that Zeus somehow ISN’T the biggest asshole i’ve dealt with this week. No that honor is reserved as always for this bitch:

Keep in mind she manages to be this obnoxious in only TWO scenes. Also keep in mind I had to put up with Julie for a MUCH larger chunk of the previous two volumes I covered before volume 5 yesterday for my Scott Pilgrim Retrospective and she is ALWAYS like this and you now feel my pain. 

This does create a problem though: Zeus casts Storkules out until he’s a responsible adult.. and thus paints Storkules as the bad guy... in a situation where the only other person in the story sent a swarm of HARPIES down at him for simply playing his music too loud. It just dosen’t work as a catalyst: Storkules objectively did nothing wrong. The only person he annoyed was a person who clearly dosen’t love, respect or like his son in any way shape or form anyway and essentially assaulted him and a bunch of innocent people via harpie and then cast him out. Zeus is an abusive asshole and i’ts weird the narrative sides with HIM and not our well meaning doofus. Zeus being an asshole with harpies is not a bad catalyst for the episode, and the harpies being unleashed is used well.. it’s just not a good catalyst for THIS story to try and portray an abuser as in the right. And make no mistake Zeus is a domestic abuser: he had his son mind controlled to try and MURDER innocent people, something Storkules begged him not to do, sent a swarm of creatures after him for the crime of playing his music too loud and in his next episode manipulatives Storkules sad emotional state for personal gain. Why would you try and paint THIS jackass as in the right?

Speaking of painting this jackass in the right sadly.. this episode does not do my boy donald justice. In most episodes he’s pretty nuanced and i’ts fair enough he’d be frustrated by Storkules as a roomate. Storkules has little sense of personal space, breaks his stove thinking theirs hydra in it, makes a mess of the kitchen making them a meal, and in general clearly dosen’t know how to live with a roomate much less in modern society. He has valid concerns and the episode COULD have used it that way.. but he’s also horribly impatient with Storkules. He refuses to get the guy just hasn’t had to live in a modern society and dosen’t know HOW to function in it and instead of helping him just gets mad again and again and gets really pissed when it’s clear Storkules dosen’t have a job and didn’t consider paying rent. He’s not WRONG to want him to pay Rent, despite what ironically the musical Rent would try and have you believe, but he dosen’t have any patience with the guy. And stork isn’t nearly coming on as strong as he normally does. The worst he does is cook the guy lunch and bring his donald fan art with him. Which we don’t see but I am assuming is mostly naked. What i’m saying is for once that while still bombastic, Storkules isn’t trying to force a relationship/friendship on him and simply wants to learn t be an adult from his best friend.. and Donald isn’t bothering teaching him.

Asking for rent or for him not to destroy the stove is fine, but not explaining WHY he needs either of those things or why he needs boundaries, he makes a roomate list, isn’t helping the guy. And this would be fine... but the episode dosen’t call Donald out on it for no real reason. It feels like it’s setting up for a “you should learn to wokrk with someone instead of just screaming at them aseop” that never comes and like with Zeus takes his side because shutup. I’d also LIKE to say this is the only time the writers reduced one of the cast to a caracture of themselves.. but I can’t.  Several episodes in season 3 forgot Louie’s character development and another episode in season 2, The Duck Knight Returns!, somehow reduced both Scrooge and Dewey to parodies of themselves with Scrooge SOMEHOW, despite Della as stubborn as she is being in his care and by his side for decades and Movies bein ga huge business, not having seen a movie since the 1920′s and not knowing how they work and Dewey being reduced to just hyperactive moron. It isn’t as common as other shows like say Regular Show, The Loud House or, for the exact reason I lost intrest, Rick and Morty, but I still expect better, especially since they went into this season KNOWING Donald would be gone for half of it and this would likely be one of his only spotlight episodes. 

Back at the good part of the plot, Louie is having a company meeting aka already treating Huey and Webby like his employees. Webby of course is glad to sign on, if little help in actually coming up with a product while Huey just wants to nope out. And if your wondering why Dewey isn’t involved Louie outright says he’d make a bad employee and while Dewey rises from his bed to object.. he stops halfway to opening his mouth and concludes he has a point. Best gag of the episode. Louie being louie easily cons Huey into staying by making Webby his charts officer. 

So the three have a corporate retreat at Funso’s... granted they don’t have a product but Louie figures this might help. Huey.. still wants out of this and suggest since they already spent what they had on ski ball “Company over?”. It’s clear that Huey just sees this as another one of Louie’s short sighted schemes... and while he’s not ENITRELY wrong, Louie has genuine ambition.. he just has no earthly idea what he’s doing and is shooting way too high.. but for understandable reasons. 1) He’s 11 at this point. 11 year olds aren’t great at business strategy or reinging it in. 2) he wants to live up to what Scrooge said to prove he can be successful and really be worth something like his mom was. 

But sometimes fate throws you one and the harpies bust in. And while Louie wants to do nothing and hope they go away Huey and Webby spring into action.. as does Storkules, who had to leave but warns donald there’s Orzo in the slowcooker and to not open it “LEST THE PASTA FAIL TO ABSORB THE BROTH!” Which is just.... Chris’ best line dleivery the episode. He says it like he’s saying the title of an old Stan Lee and Jack Kirby comic, i’ts wonderful.

So our heroes defeat them and Louie steps in to charge for the service and quickly comes up with a company idea and name “Harp-B-Gone” (A Subsidary of Louie Inc). Louie hires Storkules on the spot. Storkules proudly tells Donald he has a job the next day and goes off to it. What follows is our heroes hilarously shooting a commerical with Storkules playing a baby to promote themselves so they can help who needs it. They just need to find out what they want.. and thanks to the JWG and the harpies stealing it find out they go after people’s most treasured posessions   Cue Ghostbusters-Style Montage

And this isn’t just me saying thing. The Rewriting History Entry (Which as a series weirdly stops around mid-season 2 and I don’t get why frank hasn’t gone back and finished it since) states they specifically based this whole operation on ghostbusters and the entire sequence of our heroes cleanin up the town reminds me of it. The highlight of it is a glomgold cameo where he’s kidnapped.. and refuses to pay so Louie just lets him go. And were this an innocent person who couldn’t afford it, i’d call him a monster.. but it’s glomgold. he brought this on himself.. and also sues himself for it. Wonder if he won. 

So with their stars rising, our heroes get booked on the hottest show in town: Dewey Dew-Night! I had honestly forgotten there was a Dewey Dew-Night segment in there, and delighted I get to talk about this recurring bit.  It’s one of the shows funniest runners and just perfectly FITS Dewey: of course the most egotistical and energetic of the kids would not only want to be a late hnight host but make up his own show. I also love the slow evolution of it: it started as something everyone clearly knew about but he stlill tried to keep hidden, slowly escalated to him allowing the rest of his siblings (Webby very much included) and the giant man who stalks his uncle in, and by later this season he’s putting the show online in the web shorts and gladly shooting it into space, with Season 3 having him spend the first half of let’s get dangerous making a documentary that includes an episode of the show featuring Darkwing. It’s a small thing sure, but it’s the little things like this that make the show special. 

The show does reveal a problem though as it turns out they’ve GOT all the harpies and while Storkules merely wanted to help, Louie points out they need more to keep a buisness going and naturally never bothered to ask Storkules just how many there were. They need SOME plan to get going. Webby submits a legitamte and great idea, training the harpies as she’s been trying to do in the background of the episode and aside from a hole in the floor they are starting to listen. But Huey is an ass about it and not only shoots it down saying let’s keep the dangerous creatures contained, even though A) he has no idea WHERE they’ve been kept so he can’t verify it’s safe, and since i’ts Donald’s Closet no no it’s not. and B)There’s no where he knows of to keep them. He isn’t aware of the other bin till next season. and C) it’s not ehtical to keep creatures locked up forever epsecially since while the harpies are dangerous they arent’ MALEVOLENT and are clearly acting on instinct. oh and for D) at least she has a plan to keep the company going instead of just wanting to end this and cash out. 

Which Huey tries to.. but naturally Louie spent all their money on...

So their broke.. and Storkules has no rent money and feels like a failure despite having done NOTHING wrong. We do get a clever little nod to Disney’s hercules though “I”m not a hero, i’m a zero”. Webby rightfully glares at Louie who decides to fix it... by sneaking into Donald’s house that night to free the harpies. 

Though to the shows credit it’s a VERY bad idea, and Storkules coming in mid attempt and congradulating Louie when he lies about checking the door gets the kid to come clean. And it’s a nice character moment: He could still go through with it.. but it’s clear he realizes just HOW low he was about to sink to save his own skin and that as much as Storkules WANTS a paycheck and deserves one, it’s not worth hurting people to get it. Louie tries to justify after this.. but can’t. 

Unforutnately Donald took a lot of stupid pills this episode, yells about his no pets rule and frees them instead of you know, THINKING for five minutes.

So yeah NATURALLY Donald is an angry shit about it , refusing to actually TALK to Storkules about this or maybe admit this is partly HIS OWN FAULT. Yes their both at fault, Storkules shoudln’t of shoved a bunch of harpies in a closet. That’s a classic blunder. But Donald still opened it and isn’t called out on taking zero responsibility. Huey sees the fracas and just takes down their days without an accident placard, good stuff and he and webby arrive to help. Donald fights with Storkules and Storkules worries about loosing his friend.. lead to them going after the thing he values most aka donlad and hyjacking the house boat, though the kids manage to get aboard. 

As Storkules saves Donald, Louie realizes the most precious thing he has is  his merch and willingly gives it, and his buisness up to save everyone. It’s good character stuff and shows that despite his problems with greed, Louie IS a good kid and will do the right thing. It’s what seperates him from the Rouges Gallery the family faces: He has FLEXIBLE morals but he has morals when it comes down to it. So everyone tosses the stoff to help direct the hapries and make it home tying them up. Donald has a heart to heart with Storkules and agrees to help him find another place, but still considers him a friend and they hug. Awww.  One intresting thing I DID find out from rewriting history is they originally fully intended to have Storkules STAY on the houseboat. He was going to be a permenant member of the household, at least as far as Season 2 was concenred and plans were made for several episodes down the road: the whole bit with him in “The Golden Spear” was simply because he lived there, he was going to be the one Della met in the houseboat, obliviously guilting her about what she’d missed, and he was going to set off the kids subplot in “Whatever Happened to Donald Duck?��

This ended up not happneing for logistical reasons: Frank, and I swear this was the term he used, felt they already had the perfect Himbo in Launchpad and it was just too much HImbo energy for the two to coexist without one taking the others screen time or neither getting a lot. 

The next reason was having a god around simply broke the story: He cited the gilded man from “Nothing Can Stop Della Duck!” as a specific example. There were just too many hoops to jump to have him not break any story he should be around for.  Finally with Della being added to the cast soon there simply wasn’t room in the main cast. Della brought it up to 9, Storkules would make it 10, and as i’ve gone on about the show already had trouble ballancing it’s cast, something Frank admitted to. Adding him would both be too big a stiatus quo change and be one on top of the massive one of Della joining the cast. So he was dropped back to recurring and only showed up one more time. And while it was the right call I am dismayed he didn’t show up for the whatever happened to donald duck subplot and it does feel very weird he never adresses Donald being gone despite, at least for season 2, apparently living in Duckburg. Otherwise though as funny as this wouldv’e been.. yeah it was the right call. 

Scrooge returns... having been absent all episode because otherwise it wouldn’t work and easily saw Louie loosing it all coming.. but gives him a can of lemonade for his troubles and comforts the boy. The heart of htis arc and what makes it work at it’s best.. is these two. Scrooge GENUINELY wants to help Louie see his potetial successor in buisness: oh sure adventure wise he’s throughly covered.. but Webby, Dewey and Della all are more focused on the addventure part and that’s where their passion and talent lies, Huey’s better at science and given his close frinedship with fenton and how much that part of things seems to truly inspire him, i’ts what he was born for, and Donald just wants a regualar life and can’t manage his own life much less a company. 

Louie is the only one in his family whose the right fit to inhereit that part of his legacy and I feel that’s why he takes a special intrest in him and webby over the other two: While he loves all of them and will clearly again leave a piece of his fortune and empire to all of them, Webby is the most like him, as we later find out not coincidentally in the slightest, when it comes to adventuring and curosity and a love of exploration. But Louie is the most like him in other ways; He’s cynical, money driven and passionate. Scrooge simply wants him to be as good a person and buisnessperson as he can be and is trying to push him in the right direction. And does so here by pointing out that failure isn’t a huge problem..it happens, comes with the terriotiry and as we’ve seen with life and times, even with portions of it clearly not happening in this universe, he failed a LOT to get here. What matters is that he tries and tries to do it the right way. 

Scrooge also sympathizes as he was buying a lemonade company in cape suzette, giving Louie the can as a present... but laments there’s no cheap effective way to deliver the lemons. Louie notices the harpies going after the can after he throws it and Webby controlling them with it and muses that theyd idn’t think about what THEY wanted.. nad rightfully gets punched across the lawn by Webby, whose had to spend an entire episode having her surrogate brothers talk down to her and ignore her valid ideas. She dosen’t even open her eyes she just bops him one.

So we end with Scrooge having enlisted the hapries, Louie trying to take credit again and both realizing they might just steal the lemons instead of work for them. Ha ha ha their going to get so sued. 

Final Thoughts: This one was mediocre. It has some good points, Louies arc continues to fascenate me, Huey’s done with this shit attitude is hilarous, and Storkules is at his best in this episode: his crush on Donald is toned down from this..

To this

To the point I could see shipping them off this one if Storkules episode didn’t have him do eveyrthing short of .. well see above.  So it’s not WITHOUT merit: I love me a ghost busters style plot, there are great jokes and Chris Dimatopolis is a gem as always. Glad he’s getting work after this show on Invincible and hope he gets to play Darkwing again some day. But the Donald stuff and the fairly predictable plot drag this one down. I’ts fairly obvious they’ll run out of harpies, Louie will have spent the money and they’ll somehow get free. It’s not a terrible episode but it’s it’s sandwiched story wise between two straight up classics on both sides: the previous two episodes were even better than I remembered and the next two are incredibly good: Whateve Happened to Della Duck?! is one of their finest hours and The Outlaw Scrooge McDuck, while not making my best of list for the series as a whole is still one of my favorites for the season.  It’s just disapointing this one wasn’t nearly as good as I remmebered and it’s understandable why I forgot almost all of it, unlike the previous two episodes. Thankfully as I said better’s over the horizon.

NEXT TIME ON OF MOONS, MILLIONARES AND MOTHERS: I’m taking a break for a week. One of two weeklong breaks for the arc, the other being the first week of July where i’m on vacation anyway (Though i’ll be doing the episode I would’ve done for that week the week before to keep the pace up, so no worries),

 As for why, it’s my utmost honor to announce GOOF WEEK! Goof Week is a weeklong celebration of Goofy’s birthday. The idea came about because as I do for the big three, I intended to just do a shorts special. But Kev , the guy who made this very review possible, suggested doing the two part Goof Troop pilot. And since kev pays for a house of mouth episode a month anyway and thaks to you lovely people I hit my patreon stretch goal to review the goofy movie, I figured “why not make a week out of it. Hence Goof week. So next week we’ll have a review of the two part pilot for Goof Troop, the special Sports Goof, the House of Mouse episode Super Goof, your regularly schedule shorts spectacular, with The Goofy Movie for the grand finale! yaaahoooooieeee! 

When we come back i’ll be shuffling episodes around slightly so I can do the Della comics from the Ducktales Tie-In Comic before her debut and in time for Donald’s own theme week in June, i’ll be saving “Whatever Happened to Della Duck?” for the week after Donald Week. Instead next we get a fun wild west adventure as Scrooge tells a story of his outlaw days, his tension with goldie and his encounter with a certain robber baron as John D Rockerduck FINALLY makes his screen debut. Yee-Haw!

If you liked this review, subscribe and follow for more and consider joining my patroen, patreon.com/popculturebuffet. I have exclusive reviews, my most recent duck based one being an obscure carl barks story about wigs and the boys attempting to murder a guy with a blow gun, and your contribution helps me reach my goals and thus gets everyone, patreon or not, a bunch of neat new reviews. If you get me to 20 dollars a month, i’m currently at 15, EVERYONE will get a monthly darkwing duck reviews, reviews of the two remaning ducktales 87 mini series including the origin of GIZMOOOODDUUUUUCCCKKKK, and a review of the Danny Phantom movie The Ultimate Enemy. And with the month running out NOW’S the time to join. YOu’ll also get to pick one of the shorts for my Donald Duck birthday specail next month, so if you want to join in NOWS the time. But wether you can or you can’t, thank you for reading, i’ts been a pleasure. 

[bestofblackwidow]

The "Let me go - it's okay," she told him the last time we saw the Black Widow, it was - to say the least - emotional. "Let me go - it's okay," she said to Hawkeye, plunging to her death on the arid planet Sleeping in Avengers: Endgame for the ultimate sacrifice to save the world. While the deaths in the Marvel Cinematic Universe go on - sorry, Iron Man - there was probably no more heart-stopping moment, since the former SHIELD spy who became Avenger gave her life to recover the Soul Stone.

Still, it left the MCU in a bind. For years, a Black Widow film had been mooted, right back to 2004 at Lions Gate Entertainment before the rights reverted to Marvel. When Scarlett Johansson first appeared as Natasha Romanoff - the former KGB assassin with a very particular set of skills - in 2010's Iron Man 2, it didn't take long before questions were asked about a solo outing. Marvel Studios conductor Kevin Feige even held discussions with Johansson, who was then only 25. But there was a caveat, he said. "The Avengers comes first."

While others - Thor, Captain America, Black Panther and even Ant-Man - had their moments in the spotlight, the Black Widow was forced to wait. And wait. And wait. Not that Johansson thought that her character demanded the same treatment; if she was going to be in front of a Marvel movie, there had to be a reason. "Is there anything exciting to do creatively, as an actor?" she says. “Will we be able to do something extraordinary and strong? And something that stands on its own? "It's what makes the independent Black Widow an intriguing prospect: an inauguration of Phase 4 of the MCU promises to step back in time before her dramatic death to answer the provocative questions that still hover over her Crucially, the script transports audiences back to the events right after Captain America: Civil War, after that huge internal confrontation of the Avengers.

Without relatives or an organization that employs her, the Black Widow is alone, says Johansson. "It gave us the opportunity to really show her when she's kind of out of her game, you know? Because of that, anything was possible." The actress was there "from the start" at the script meetings, as they began to figure out how to delve into Romanoff's origins. "You are trying to map all of this ... which is extremely stressful," she laughs, "because there are no guidelines."

Fortunately, Johansson was not alone. In another inspired choice for the MCU canon, Feige recruited Australian director Cate Shortland, best known for discreet dramas like Somersault and Lore. While she was surprised, Shortland was encouraged by the creative freedom that Marvel was offering. “They allowed me to be myself and encouraged me to make a movie that I was passionate about,” she says. "We were allowed to have a lot of nuances and make a character-oriented film."

After several Skype sessions with Johansson, who also receives producer credit, Shortland worked with a Russian researcher to embody Romanoff's dark story: "the red in my ledger", as she told Loki in 2012 in Os Avengers. As she sings in the trailer, "We have to go back to where it all started" - the promising teaser clips of Romanoff as a young man (played by Ever Anderson, daughter of Paul WS Anderson and Milla Jovovich) in a childhood that seems far from idyllic. That's what makes Black Widow a family reunion of the kind that only Marvel would have the courage to conjure. Joining Romanoff is Yelena Belova, a sister-sister and fellow murderer who trained alongside her in the so-called Red Room, the punitive Soviet facility that produced 'Black Widow' spies.

"Their stories intersect," promises Shortland. "They clash." Played by Lady Macbeth's British star Florence Pugh, Belova is more than a physical match for Romanoff. Still, emotionally is where it really matters. "What Yelena does is kind of point to Natasha's pain," says Pugh. “She is part of Natasha's story. And I think that's why we have an opportunity to look at Natasha's story, because Yelena has been knocking on the door and says, 'Hey, let's deal with this pain. ”As Johansson comments, Belova is not just a carbon copy of his own character.

"She is completely alone. She is strong and different. She is so different (from) Natasha." Beside them are Melina Vostokoff (Rachel Weisz) and Alexei Shostakov (David Harbor), two father figures whose own stories intertwine with Natasha and Yelena. "This is the coolest thing with this whole group of people. They all had parts of their past that they regretted," says Pugh. “They’re older. They’ve had more life experience. They know more about the system, about this world they’re all living in.” Harbor, the Emmy Stranger Things nominated star, managed to put an indelible mark on the muscular Shostakov, better known as the Red Guardian super soldier, the Russian equivalent of Captain America. "There is a gangster quality to him," the actor smiles. "And he's covered in tattoos. He's got a beard and those gold teeth. He's crazy." But after years of making bad decisions, he's also full of remorse.

"He's in a bad situation," adds Harbor. "And he needs redemption." Weisz's character, Melina, is another who experienced the rigors of the Red Room, a place that put her in contact with Natasha and Yelena. Marking his first dive at the MCU, Weisz acknowledges that the film addresses the idea of ​​discovering his favorite family. "It's definitely about finding out where you belong and where you came from, and what your background story was, and who you really are, and what matters to you - your ideology, I think." Along the way, Feige made reference to The Kids Are All Right - the 2010 Lisa Cholodenko film about a same-sex couple raising two teenagers. "Which is so weird," laughs Johansson. "You would never expect that from a Marvel movie." no it was the only strange nod to the film. Harbor speaks of Shostakov in terms of Philip Seymour Hoffman's drama teacher in the dramatic black comedy The Savages.

Or even expressing "the pathos of a small town, independent, family-run, weird movie... like Little Miss Sunshine". More understandable cinema references include "things like Logan and Aliens and The Fugitive," says Shortland. "We saw movies like that." Certainly, it's easy to see comparisons between Sigourney Weaver's determined Ripley, from James Cameron's masterpiece Aliens, and Johansson's Romanoff, an Avenger who has no superpowers. "We saw it as a force," says Shortland, "because she always has to dig really deep to get out of shit situations." According to the director, everyone in the production invested in deepening Romanoff - even Scottish composer Lorne Balfe (Pennyworth, His Dark Materials), who replaced Alexandre Desplat's original choice. Balfe looked at the character's origins, says Shortland. “He said, 'I want to put it on the ground, because it has been dug up in the movies in the past. I want to give her that flesh and blood. 'And he created this soundtrack that is really Russian."

However, perhaps the real blow here is to recruit Shortland, the first female director to face the Black Widow (and only the second, following Captain Marvel co-director Anna Boden, to enter the MCU). "This film would not be what it is without Cate Shortland," says Pugh. "I think having her eye, and having her mind with this script, has taken her to a whole different realm." Johansson agrees. "" You can feel it was made from a female perspective ... cooked there. "Although Ray Winstone's casting as Supervisor of the Red Room Dreykov (whose daughter contributed to the abundance of red in Romanoff's book, according to Loki) add more to the psychological battleground that the Black Widow will explore, it also deals with victimization, a very pertinent topic in the current climate. The Red Room itself is where trainees are brutally sterilized. "You will see that these women are hard working and strong, and they are murderers - and yet they still need to discuss how they were abused," says Pugh. "It is an incredibly powerful piece."

Judging by the 2020 Oscars, where Pugh and Johansson had their own private relationship session on the red carpet, the two actors got along very well. "She has a really beautiful career ahead of her ... she's a very special person," says Johansson, excited when Pugh's name is mentioned. More specifically, Pugh may well have more Marvel to chew on, if it is rumored that her character will take on the 'Black Widow' mantle for new adventures. By learning Parkour, kickboxing and knife fighting for role, Pugh can safely cut things physically, though she's reluctant to claim that the Black Widow is just a setup for future outings. "Even though it is obviously where everyone wants to go and want to think - think about what comes next - this film never really seemed to be what he was trying to underline." According to Johansson, however, test the audience who saw the film thinks otherwise. "Her character and her performance are so dear." Now, after more than a year of pandemic-related delays to July 2021), it will not be just a few lucky spectators who will be able to see. Black Widow will even be the first Marvel movie to debut simultaneously on the Disney+ streaming site (with a 'main hit' fee), an understandable move considering the uncertainty that still exists around the world. And in fact, after the success of the Marvel TV shows WandaVision and The Falcon And The Winter Soldier, it doesn't seem like such a strange home. Johansson believes that fans will respond to Black Widow, with this flashback of an earlier part of her life, bringing more poignancy to the Endgame's outcome. "Our goal was for them to be satisfied with this story; that maybe they could have some solution, I think, with the death of this character, in a way. It seemed like people wanted this." Shortland agrees. "We felt that we should honor his death," she says. And the Black Widow will surely honor him.

[allthefilmsiveseenforfree]

Wonder Woman 1984

The first 3/4 of 2017’s Wonder Woman was my favorite film of that year. The last 1/4 was my least favorite film of that year. What can I say, I have a complicated relationship with the DCEU, and the part I keep getting disappointed by is the big smash-em-up, explosions everywhere, muddy mess of orange/blue filter in the “climactic showdown” between hero and villain. I just don’t have the patience for it anymore, and I was so hoping that the Jazzercise vibes of Wonder Woman 1984 would do something different. 

As it turns out, this movie was trying to warn me like so many stories that have come before - be careful what you wish for. Just how badly did my wish go bad? Well...

I’d already heard some questionable things about the movie before I tuned in, so my expectations were tempered but I guess it was on me. I should have known better than to wish for a story with reasonable pacing, some kind of consistent tone, villains with discernable motivation, or a Wonder Woman movie that was actually about fucking Wonder Woman. I’m not even mad as much as I am puzzled. That and tormented by Pedro Pascal’s manic televangelist energy in my dreams. 

Some thoughts:

I have never wanted to go anywhere as much as I want to in 2020, and the place I want to go more than any other is Themyscira. Love this first sequence. Why is the whole movie not about Themyscira??

If the Olympics were like this whole long Amazonian warrior triathlon, I would be WAY more into track and field. 

Also I legit don’t understand the problem with her taking the short path? Like, it’s there for a reason? She just caught up to her horse? Someone explain this to me.

So this mall...basically the hub of American commerce in the 80s that was practically printing money, it made it so fast...is secretly a front for antiquities trading on the black market? And these unorganized-ass dipshit criminals who seemingly just walked in off the street and decided to engage in some light robbery today are after antiquities? Sure, Jan.

Ohh I miss Waldenbooks so much!

This thwarting of crime sequence in the mall feels so...cheesy. Schlocky, almost. Like a 50s comic book come to life. I dunno, it just doesn’t feel like the tone I was expecting. In the context of the whole film, we really blew our action load in these first 2 sequences, and also this is the last point in the movie in which Diana actually resembles her character from the first film.

I would also be stammery and blushy when talking to Diana Prince for the first (and second) time, but I’m kinda getting a gay vibe from Barbara. This meet-cute + date is definitely playing up romantic vibes. Kristen Wiig is so good at characters like these - in less than 2 scenes, I have such a clear picture of who Barbara is, what she wants, what she fears, and that’s all down to Wiig’s choices. [ETA: This makes it all the more infuriating when Barbara suddenly is like “I want to be an apex predator” when nothing about her character’s reaction to getting positive attention indicates she would want to start shitting all over everyone else.]

Pedro Pascal is skeeving me out as our villain Max Lord, which really just shows his range, because normally I love him and find him wildly charming in everything. But he’s playing this oil baron creep to the max, as they would say in the parlance of the 80s, and it makes my skin crawl. 

The mechanics of how Steve Trevor returns are wildly confusing. Why is this other guy involved at all? Are we supposed to be ok with the idea of Diana fucking *some other dude’s body* without his consent just because Steve’s spirit/consciousness/whatever is inside the guy? Also that guy DEFINITELY got fired from his job after going AWOL for a whole week, right? 

I am thrilled with Steve’s clothes montage. One of my favorite things in any 80s film, and his enthusiasm really sells it.

I do really like Diana and Steve playing detective, following clues, crafting theories. In spite of the absolute dumbassery of how Steve came back, Chris Pine and Gal Gadot have incredible chemistry and I do find their scenes together delightful. 

I think that’s why it’s so frustrating to me the way their entire relationship was handled. If the whole point of the wish going bad is that it has a cost, wouldn’t it have been better, instead of making Diana weak, to have Steve slowly start to be more and more of an asshole - aka not the Steve Diana remembered and loved? Make her realize that the Steve she knew and loved is really gone and she has to stop letting his memory hold her hostage. Maybe his last moment of self-awareness would be realizing that this wasn’t who he really was, and she was better off just remembering who he was and moving on rather than trying to hold on to this thing that isn’t good for her? 

The sequence with the fireworks made me emotional. The only time I’ve ever been on a plane on the 4th of July was when I was coming back from a visit with my uncle in Dallas. He had flown me, my mom, and my grandma down for a whirlwind trip, and we flew back the night of the 4th. I got to see fireworks from above for the first time, and it felt so magical. My uncle passed away 2 months ago, and feeling that magic again (via Diana and Steve) made me miss him and all the adventure he brought into my life something fierce.

Am I supposed to be like...anti- the idea of Barbara absolutely kicking the shit out of this drunk catcaller who attempted to assault her earlier in the movie? It feels like the film wants us to be like “oh no that’s bad” but my empathy goes on vacation for attempted rapists. 

Like...did anyone do ANY kind of fact-checking on this script? The Maya haven’t been “wiped from the face of the earth” there are still 6 million of them living in Central and South America. Escalators were invented in the 1890s for fucks’ sake. PLANES IN THE 80S DONT WORK LIKE PLANES IN 1918. YOU DON’T KNOW WHAT ALL THOSE SWITCHES DO STEVE. Also...just because the plane is invisible doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist anymore. Isn’t the whole point of radar to detect things that you can’t, y’know, SEE? Seriously, how many people fiddled with this script until it turned into an incomprehensible mess?

Did I Cry? OK yeah, I did when Diana and Steve had their conversation after they escaped the White House. But I feel like I should have cried more then, as well as earlier when Diana tells Steve that she only wants this one thing. I love Gal Gadot in this role, but I do wish her acting expressed a little more emotional depth and honesty for the moments like this that should really tug on the heartstrings.

I know Wonder Woman is bulletproof, but are we saying she’s also...immune to electricity? 

If there’s one thing that living through a global pandemic has taught me, it’s that we can’t rely on the inherent responsibility of every individual person to do the right thing in order to save their community (or the world). So the climax of this film really feels like a big ol’ fictional FUCK YOU to every person who has been quarantining since March as the US government twiddles their thumbs and relies on personal choice to lower infection rates. I know they made this film during 2019 and had no idea what would be coming, but this entire sequence was the most horrifying, short-sighted, offensive way to have good overcome evil I could imagine for a 2020 movie. “Just count on people to do the right thing and everything will be fine!” We’re WELL FUCKING PAST THAT, Diana. 

And maybe this is my debbie downer pessimistic ass, but the message “the world is a beautiful place the way it was” feels like some real bullshit. Do you mean the world is a flawed, complicated place where beautiful things exist DESPITE all the violence, inequality, and poverty? Ok, that I’ll buy, for sure. But “Everything was fine the way it was!” is uhh not what I would have gone with. That’s a first draft edit if ever I heard one. Seriously, how did this make it through MULTIPLE studio drafts and no one thought to point this out?  

I literally had to go back after the credits were over and rewind to figure out what happened to Pedro Pascal at the end. If I not only don’t care, but also can’t remember what happened to the villain at the end of the movie, that’s a big motherfucking problem.

I was giddily delighted by that first post-credits scene though! Probably the biggest moment of joy I felt during the film.

For being a Wonder Woman movie, it feels like there’s so little actual Wonder Woman IN the movie. The first film is rooted firmly in Diana finding her place in the world, understanding and coming into her power. This feels like she’s a bystander in her own life, and her most significant moments are always in the context of someone else’s narrative arc. And there’s nothing that comes even close to the breathless wonder of that No-Man’s-Land scene, aka one of the best superhero movie moments of all time. 

This doesn’t have the knowing wink of Aquaman or the nuanced character arcs of Birds of Prey. It doesn’t have the childish glee of Shazam! or any of the nonsensical grimdark bullshit of Zack Snyder’s entire ouvre. It feels like Wonder Woman 1984 suffers the same fate as its protagonist - a profound lack of presence or drive. Sure there are some fun sequences, and the actors are doing the best they can with a weak script, but it’s just not enough to save it. In a year where I saw so few contemporary films (focusing more on catching up on past films I’d missed), I can’t think of one that disappointed me more. 

[infinite-xerath]

Runeterra Retcons 2: Aatrox and the Darkin

I did another one. There’s one more character I have in mind to do, but then I’ll probably take a small break from these))

Aatrox is an interesting case; while I don’t necessarily believe his current lore is BAD per se, I think he’s more-so a case of missed opportunity and wasted potential. Aatrox, to me, reeks of a case where Riot gave zero forethought to the future of this character when they created him. To fully understand why I feel this way, we’re going to have to take a step back and analyze some of the history of League itself, as well as some characters connected to Aatrox. So, with that all said, let’s look back at the history of this angry red swords and see if we can make sense of the changes given to him over the years.

Aatrox was released into the game back in 2013, under the title “The Darkin Blade.” Now, what’s a Darkin, you ask? Well, at the time, we didn’t really know, and it kind of became obvious that Riot didn’t either. Let’s have a read of his original lore, shall we?

I was always a fan of Aatrox’s original lore: an ancient, mysterious figure who shows up to help you turn the tides of a war, but only after you’d effectively surrendered your own humanity for the sake of victory. The fact that there was an entire race just like him became the center of fan speculation of years, and countless theories cropped up as to who and what the Darkin even were. Some assumed that they were related to the Seven Deadly Sins, while others thought they might be akin to the Horsemen of the Apocalypse. Some thought they might just be a dying race, and that some might actually be benevolent, unlike Aatrox.

Unfortunately, Riot wouldn’t give us an answer for quite some time. All we knew was that Aatrox was a Darkin and that he looked a lot like typical modern depictions of demons. That does raise the question though: why didn’t they just make Aatrox a demon? He helps turn the tides of conflict with no apparent goal beyond just prolonging the chaos and suffering brought about by war. A lot of his voice lines even painted him as a psychotic “artist” of sorts, prior even to Jhin, that viewed conflict and bloodshed as elegant. Well, to better understand the full picture here, we need to take a step back and examine the broader picture here.

Now, admittedly, we’re delving in some speculation territory here, as it’s impossible to really say what Riot’s original plans for the Darkin were, if any. That being said, the inclusion of something like a demon would have had a lot of implications back in the day, as the Runeterra as we knew it then didn’t really have a “Heaven” or “Hell.” Sure, we had “angels” with Kayle and Morgana, but they were treated more like how Asgardians are treated in Marvel: more like a race of super powerful aliens than actual divine entities (keep that in mind for later.) If anything, what little we knew of an “afterlife” in League came from Yorick’s old lore, in which he acted like a psychopomp similar to Charon from Greek myth.

It wasn’t until Tahm Kench came out in 2015 that Riot properly introduced demons as a concept in the lore, retconning several other champions like Evelynn and Nocturne into being demons. For a bit of context: in Runeterra, demons are effectively malevolent spirits from the spirit realm that feed on negativity: fear, pain, hatred, and so-forth. When other characters started getting turned into demons, a lot of people, myself included, thought that Aatrox would meet the same fate. After-all, they hadn’t actually DONE anything with the “Darkin” outside of Aatrox’s bio, and he functioned in a manner similar to them. Some even theorized that the Darkin would be made to represent a specific breed of demon, and this theory gained even more traction when Tahm Kench was given special voice lines for taunting near Aatrox.

Then, on July 12, 2017, we got Kayn, and with him: Rhaast. Rhaast is the second Darkin character added to the lore: a talking scythe with an eye that possess its host. Kayn is able to hold back Rhaast’s influence, keeping it to a single arm through the use of shadow magic, but depending on your actions in-game, you can see what happens if Rhaast manages to win their struggle and take over Kayn’s body completely. With Rhaast’s introduction, it pretty-much cemented that the Darkin were living weapons that took over the hosts of their wielders, which made sense given that Aatrox’s sword was always hinted to be alive and have a mind of its own. In fact, the idea of the Darkin being living weapons, or at least being bound to their weapons in some way, was one of many fan theories raised since Aatrox’s release all the way back in 2013.

Unfortunately, the new champion’s bio didn’t give us a lot to work with. Rhaast was the weapon, but Kayn himself is the Champion, so a lot of his bio tells us more about Kayn’s backstory: how he joined the Order of Shadows, how he acquired Rhaast in the first place, etc. While this isn’t exactly a problem, it gave us no further information on the Darkin; what they really were, where they came from, and why there are only five left in existence all remained mysteries for the fans to speculate about. It still wasn’t even clear if the Darkin were connected to demons, or if they were something else entirely.

Now, it’s around this time that another theory began to start blowing up in popularity; technically, this was another old fan theory, but now that we had a general idea of what the Darkin actually were, there was another Champion wielding a living weapon that fans started to speculate might be connected to them: Varus. Varus is an old character, and though we won’t be deep-diving into him too much into this video, allow me to give you a tldr of his original story.

Varus was an Ionian archer set to guard the Pit of Pallas, a giant hole where his people had long ago sealed some unexplained corrupting purple entity that seemed like it maybe should have related to the Void somehow but didn’t. Varus resisted the entity’s influence for years until Noxians one day showed up and started slaughtering his people, wanting to get their hands on Pallas so that they could use it as a weapon because of course they did. Varus was faced with a choice: stay and guard the temple built around the pit or go back to his village and help his people fight. Varus chose the former and was apparently SUCH a badass archer that he single-handed kept the invaders at pay with his arrows, though this choice came at a cost: when Varus returned to his village, everyone he knew and loved was dead, including his wife and son.

Enraged, Varus returned to the pit and struck a deal with Pallas: he would allow the entity to inhabit his body in return for vengeance against the Noxians. Varus proceeded to wander the world with a bow made from the entity’s own solidified essence in the hopes of finding and killing… Basically every Noxian he could. Yeah, Varus wanted nothing short of full-on genocide, starting with the surviving soldiers that attacked his village. There’s a lot to go into there, but you’ve probably figured out the relevance of this by now: Pallas turned itself into a bow for Varus to take his vengeance in exchange for possession over his body. Not too dissimilar a living sword and scythe who also possessed people and had an insatiable hunger for death and destruction, right?

Riot seemed to agree, and in 2017 they released a music video along with a comic and an entirely new bio for Varus. Together, these updates served to not only retcon Varus’s backstory (a topic for another episode) but finally give us an update as to who and what the Darkin were. In a word: they were aliens.

In short, the Darkin were a race from another planet/dimension drawn to Runeterra for its abundant use of magic. They tried to conquer the planet, causing the Great Darkin War, which ended only when the races of Runeterra figured out how to seal the Darkin in their own otherworldly weapons. Varus, Aatrox, Rhaast, and two others were trapped in their weapons, which an unnamed warrior queen (possibly an Aspect) used to drive back the other Darkin and seal the portal to their world. The five that were imprisoned in their weapons were then scattered and hidden across Runeterra.

This, at last, brings us back to Aatrox’s new bio:

“One of the ancient Darkin, Aatrox was once a peerless swordmaster who reveled in the bloody chaos of the battlefield. Trapped within his own blade by the magic of his foes, he waited out the millennia for a suitable host to wield him - this mortal warrior was corrupted and transformed by the living weapon, and Aatrox was reborn. Though tales of the darkin have now passed into legend, he remembers only too well the destruction of his race, and wreaks his vengeance one sword blow at a time.”

So Aatrox was made into a general for an alien race who sought to finish what his people started by having the Runeterrans fight and slaughter one another in a series of bloody conflicts… For a few months, at least. Literally the next year in 2018, Aatrox finally got his visual and gameplay update, turning him into the World Ender we know today. Along with this came entirely new lore for him, as well as the Darkin.

Insert lore here

So… The Darkin are no longer invading aliens, but Ascended who went nuts and were trapped inside their own weapons. In other words, the Darkin went from being a race to being more of a derogative term for fallen demigods. What’s more, Aatrox received a VERY substantial alteration his character and personality: he went from being a war-loving “artist” who causes conflict for the sake of it to being a tortured soul who wants to die so badly that he’ll end all of creation to do it.

Now, like I said before: I don’t think this backstory is bad. I don’t hate it. It does a lot to flesh out Shurima as a region, gives us more info on the Ascended, and it adds a bit more nuance to Aatrox as a character. Imagine being trapped inside a weapon, losing all access to your senses. Imagine that the only chance you get to move is when you take over someone else’s body, transforming it into a warped version of your own former glory, only to realize that you’re on a time limit and the only way you can continue to walk, talk, see, hear, or feel anything is by slaughter’s people and consuming their blood. Imagine spending CENTURIES trying to find a way out, only to repeatedly learn that any means to free or even kill yourself ends in failure. Imagine being SO desperate to rest that you’re willing to end all of existence just to find peace.

I like Aatrox’s new story. I do. Honestly, the only real complaint I have is that Aatrox doesn’t exactly have a PLAN for how he aims to end existence? Like, he calls himself a World Ender and a god-slayer, but we only know of one god he’s actually slain (Pantheon) and given that Runeterra is still around, it seems like his world-destroying count is still at zero. Honestly, if he wants to end all of existence, I feel like turning the Void, a reality-consuming threat that he has FOUGHT BEFORE would kind of be the obvious solution? Honestly, I imagine that just chucking the sword into the Void would be a good way for him to end his own existence, but I’m getting ahead of myself.

So, if I like Aatrox’s new lore, why am I rewriting it? Simple, really: even if I overall like his current lore state, I feel like the road we took to get here was… Kind of long and unnecessary. It seems kind of obvious looking back that Riot didn’t have a clear long-term plan for Aatrox or the Darkin, as years of unanswered questions followed by multiple retcons kind of entails. From being the last survivor of an ancient race, to MAYBE being a demon, to being an alien, to finally becoming a fallen demigod. Aatrox’s history is practically a whole story in-and-of-itself, and I’ve long wondered how things might have turned out if Riot had, you know, picked a direction and gone with it a bit sooner?

So, here’s the basis of my rewrite: I’m gonna try and incorporate elements from all of Aatrox’s various backstories into a single, coherent biography. Can I manage it? Well, I’ll leave that for you all to determine…

When the skies are blackened by the flames of war and the earth is dyed red with blood, Aatrox draws near. For as long as conflict has existed among the races of Runeterra, the Chaos Blade has manifested to those deemed worthy, turning the tides of battle in exchange for the flesh of whoever wields it.

The true origins of the Darkin have long been lost time. Some say that they are the first weapons ever forged, corrupted by the malice of those who have wielded them over ages. Others claim that the Darkin are a rare breed of demon, of whom only five remain. Only one thing is certain: the Darkin exist only to bring death and destruction, and none embrace this more than Aatrox himself.

Tales of a wicked blade manifesting amidst the heat of battle exists across all cultures, from the frigid north to the blistering south. The sword is said to appear before warriors on the cusp of defeat: those who would give anything, even their own lives, for the sake of victory. Those who wield the Chaos Blade are granted inhuman strength and endurance, often haled as heroes for turning the tides of battle. With every foe slain, however, the Chaos Blade grows stronger, consuming the mind of its wielder and warping their flesh. In time, the hero becomes a mindless vessel, slaughter all in its path until slain. When its host falls, the Chaos Blade returns from whence it came, waiting for the moment that another might heed the sword’s call.

For ages this cycle persisted, until the day the sword manifested before a warrior of Shurima’s Ascended Host. After the Fall of Icathia, the Sunborn were called to face the encroaching threat of the Void, wielding celestial might and magic great enough to crush a hundred mortal armies. Before the Void, however, even the mighty Ascended began to falter.

The horrors summoned by Icathia steadily pushed north, consuming everything in their path and twisting the earth into maddening shapes. As their numbers dwindled, many Sunborn called to retreat, hoping to regroup within the capital and think of a plan. As some fled, however, the Ascended general Aatrox stood his ground. Pushing his draconic form to its limits, Aatrox struck down one abomination after another. When his great blade, soaked in the Oasis of the Dawn itself, was wrenched from its grasp, Aatrox fought with tooth and claw. Even if he were to fall, Aatrox would do everything in his power to slay as many Voidspawn as possible, resigning himself to death so the other Sunborn might rally their forces.

It was then, amidst the sea of madness woven by the Void, that Aatrox saw a sword embedded into the twisted earth. The blade seemed to call out to him, and Aatrox took it without question. In an instant, the general was filled with unimaginable strength and fury, and his allies watched in amazement as Aatrox fought with strength of ten Ascended warriors. Inspired by his newfound fury, the Sunborn rallied, their fighting spirits renewed at last.

When the conflict against the Void drew to a close, Aatrox was haled as a hero among heroes, though many of his former allies became wary of him and the wicked sword he now carried. Some suggested that the blade should be destroyed, while others, such as Aatrox himself, argued that its power would be instrumental if the Void ever returned.

Resentment and suspicion began to grow amongst the Sunborn, and the cracks only grew larger as Aatrox aided the other Ascended in summoning weapons similar to his own. The warriors of the Ascended host began to distance themselves from one-another and the capital, taking up posts across Shurima’s vast empire. They remained united only in the shared goal of protecting their empire.

And then the Sun Disc fell.

Following Xerath’s Ascension and the death of Emperor Azir, years of growing tensions erupted across the desert. Some Ascended raced for the chance to fill the now-vacant seat of power for themselves, while others insisted on finding a means to restore the royal dynasty. Debate soon turned to bloodshed, and Shurima was engulfed in a war that lasted centuries. It wasn’t until the Aspects of Targon intervened that the war was finally brought to an end.

Those wielding Darkin weapons were bound to their armaments with powerful magic, in-turn trapping the wicked weapons in the physical realm. The Darkin were scattered across Runeterra, and yet the souls of the Ascended persisted, stripped of bodies and senses.

For ages, Aatrox stewed within the sword that had become his prison, his soul slowly being corrupted further and further by the Chaos Blade until the two had become a single being. Ages passed and the sword was slowly forgotten, until a band of thieves broke into the Darkin’s prison in search of ancient treasure. When the thieves’ leader touched the sword, his mind was overwhelmed in an instant, his body transformed into a twisted likeness of Aatrox’s Ascended form. The Darkin slew the other thieves in an instant, drawing strength from their blood before breaking free of his long confinement.

Aatrox emerged into a frozen landscape with but a single goal: to bring about a war so violent, so destructive, that it would be the end of all things. He would be the World Ender, herald of a conflict to end all others. With every foe he slays, with every swing of his sword, Aatrox sews the seeds for violence and carnage, drawing one step closer to his magnus opus.

So, what did you think? As stated before: my primary goal this time around was to try and combine Aatrox’s various origin stories into a single narrative. Admittedly, I could only manage to do this by adding an air of mystery to the actual origin of the Darkin; maybe they’re demons, maybe they’re aliens, maybe they’re something else entirely. I know that might seem like a bit of a cop-out, but a large part of what made the Darkin so interesting to the community in the first place was the air of mystery surrounding them, and the room it offered for speculation and theorizing.

Another main concern, though, was that I wanted to find a way to blend old Aatrox’s personality with his new one. The thing I miss most about the OG Aatrox was that, despite being obsessed with war and bloodshed, he wasn’t just another rage monster. He was calm and composed, and a lot of his lines hinted at a deeper philosophy toward the inevitability of conflict rather than just “I wanna kill everything because I’m angry!” League has way too many of those, in my honest opinion. I thought that, by combining his mind with a semi-sentient sword that brings about carnage because that’s simply its PURPOSE, a little but of that old Aatrox might shine through.

But, as always, this is all just my opinion; how I, personally, would have gone about reworking the character. If you prefer Aatrox as he currently is, or think my version of the story is inferior, that’s fine! Feel free to share your thoughts and comments, but please, let’s try to keep it civil. After-all…

The last thing we want is to start a war over this…

[queermediastudies]

Blue is, in fact, not only the Warmest Color, but her name is Emma - Alec Thomas

Blue is the Warmest Color is a 2013 film adaptation of a comic series of the same name, made by Julie Maroh in 2010. This film follows a French teenager named Adele, who is what seems to be very introverted and unsure of her place in the world. Adele dates a boy named Thomas at school, but when they eventually have sex for the first time, Adele is left unfulfilled by Thomas, realizing there might be more to her sexual identity than she knows, and decides to break off their relationship. Her openly gay best friend Valentin hears about her confusion, and decides to take her out to a men’s gay bar. Adele leaves Valentin and wanders off to a neighboring lesbian bar, where she ends up meeting Emma, the blue haired girl who is also a graduating art student. The two have resounding energy off one another almost immediately, and they become friends quickly. It isn’t long after that they kiss for the first time during a picnic, before they bloom into a full relationship with one another. Emma’s family is very welcoming of Adele’s presence and relationship, while Adele’s more conservative parents are told Emma is a tutor for Adele’s philosophy class at school.

The film fast forwards a few years, and we see Adele and Emma living together while they continue their jobs. While Adele finishes school and gets a job teaching at an elementary school, Emma tries to further her painting career by throwing parties to socialize among her art peers. It’s at one of these parties that we meet Lise, a pregnant old colleague of Emma’s. Emma makes fun of Adele’s current job choice, saying that her writing could do exceptionally well, and Adele asserts that she’s much happy with where she’s at now. It’s here where we see some disparities come to light, as it seems like Adele and Emma don’t share that much in common even anymore, and out of loneliness, Adele sleeps with a male coworker. Emma finds out about the affair, and subsequently and ferociously kicks Adele out, ending their relationship. 3 years pass before they end up meeting again, only to find out Emma is now in a relationship with Lise and has a family with Lise’s daughter, while Adele still cannot overcome her heartbreak. Adele expresses how in-love she is with Emma, and despite their strong connection, Emma declines, but tells Adele that she’ll always have an “infinite tenderness” in her heart for her. More time passes before we see the two convene one last time at one of Emma’s art exhibits, where the two meet, but don’t really connect. It’s clear that Emma would rather tend to all her patrons and guests at the party, so Adele congratulates her before quietly leaving the exhibit. The film ends. I argue this film is a generally a great depiction of a heart wrenching love tale between two women, which effectively explores themes of sexuality and queerness explicitly, in order to create a film that leaves audiences wanting more among an ambiguous ending.

This movie definitely connects with some of the talking points we’ve discussed in class. Probably one of the easiest examples we see coming to light is in one of the first scenes in the film, where Adele’s friend group displays some signs of heteronormativity. In the clip above, we see Thomas staring at Adele from afar, with Adele’s friends insisting they’re “so obviously into each other”. Adele then begins to tune out of the conversation as the rest of the group starts discussing other cute boys, while Adele remains silent, clearly uncomfortable to some degree. It’s clear here that Adele’s friend group is using heteronormativity in the sense that they believe Adele is straight, despite no context being added whether they’ve discussed this before. Seeing as how the rest of the film pans out, they clearly haven’t discussed this. “For queer theorists, sexuality is a complex array of signifiers, social codes and forces linked to institutional power which interact to shape the idea of normal or deviant, good or bad, and which has the function of including and excluding people,” (Andersson, 2002, p. 3). In this scene, Adele is unsure of her sexuality, but it is clear how it should be demonstrated among the institution of her school in the ways of heteronormativity. This environment excludes any notion of queerness existing normally, which is reinforced by Adele’s friend group. This becomes problematic for Adele, as it feels as though Adele is almost pressured into going out and sleeping with Thomas because of her friends' heteronormativity enacted upon her. She is then only left to be unfulfilled, simply because she wasn’t attracted to men it seems at this point.

The above clip happens once Emma and Adele start spending more time together, and Adele’s friend group at school seems to pay attention to this fact. They all begin to grill and question her about where she met this girl, only to find out it was at a gay bar. Her “friends” then start getting heated with Adele, begging her to “fess up” to being lesbian, and to “just admit it”, while another girl starts making remarks about how she doesn’t care if Adele is lesbian, but that she’s slept naked in her bed a few times and seen her checking out her ass, calling Adele a “whore”, and then asking the question “Does your bitch have a blue p---y?” before Adele starts to fight. While this is clearly homophobia, it’s carefully inserted into the film to show some of the general public’s opinion on gay or lesbian reception, those of which lines match pretty well with Adele’s parents ideals. You could compare this to a time where “homosexuals” were compared to Communists in the U.S. “Communists bore no identifying physical characteristics...Homosexuals too could escape detection...Because most people confronted with accusations of homosexuality during these witch-hunts quietly resigned, it is impossible to determine the number of careers and lives that were destroyed.” (Gross, 2001, p. 22). This scene almost plays out like an interrogation or a witch-hunt of Adele, which I think draws on some lines on queer folk having to “admit” their queerness publicly, while cisgender folk never have to admit their sexuality in the same way. This part especially demonstrates queerness in a real world lens. To me, this scene was put into the film in order to demonstrate the harsh world that queer folk often experience. It’s made for the audience to have a better understanding of Adele’s current position, and therefore allows the audience to become more compassionate with Adele’s struggles along her life, for simply choosing who she wants to love.

Another dominant theme we see arising out of this film is sexuality and pornography. That being said, I wouldn’t recommend watching this film with your parents in the same room, because boy, you would be in for a trip. The film’s graphic sex scenes are all pretty exposed for Adele and Emma, leaving almost literally nothing to the imagination of the audience. I think this is done in the film because it wants to show the raw and unfiltered bodies of the two lovers, and more obviously done to display queer love on screen. “Queer film study, then, understands cinematic sexualities as complex, multiple, overlapping, and historically nuanced, rather than immutably fixed...queer film study explores how and why the fluidity of all sexualities relates to the production and reception of cinema.” (Benshoff & Griffin, 2004, p. 2). We especially see this sexual fluidity occur within Adele, when she sleeps with Thomas at the beginning of the movie, along with her fling with a male coworker that ultimately ended her relationship with Emma. Adele’s sexuality isn’t ever exactly defined, which leaves it ambiguous to the audience, therefore showing that even Adele is still discovering what her sexuality is exactly. While the sex scenes are explicit, to me, I wouldn’t qualify them exactly as porn, because they are also increasingly dramatic with expression. In a way, if we didn’t have these scenes, I don’t know if the audience could even understand the level of obsession that Adele and Emma have for one another. It’s in these scenes that we get just a glimpse of what it means to love as humans, and how sex is one of many facets to deepen our love for one another. 

For myself, the above clip is one scene in particular where I think the movie doesn’t really hit the nail on the head. In the scene as discussed in the intro paragraph, it features Adele and Emma in a restaurant, a few years after they’ve broken up, with Adele confessing her deep love for Emma again. Emma declines Adele’s love, citing that she’s with someone else now, and thus leaves. Before Emma is able to do that however, there’s a pretty lengthy portion of the clip where the two begin to passionately make out with one another, even getting to literal third base blatantly happening at the dinner table. Don’t get me wrong, my issue isn’t at all with any of the pretty graphic sex scenes in the movie, but this one in particular stands out because it’s literally in public. Literally a waitress confirms an order for coffee before the scene starts, and then the camera even pans out at the end of the scene to witness two other customers dining a few tables away. I felt like this part ran into a few problems, since both Adele and Emma completely ignore everyone else in the room in order to sexually fulfill one another, which for me not only feels a bit insensitive to not only the other people in the restaurant, but a bit unrealistic and hypersexualized. I think this part is more damaging to queer identities, in the sense that the ideal is being pushed that when it comes to sex, they are completely unable to control themselves for their lust for one another. You also get a sense of the power of looking at these characters by the minor characters in this scene, which pins them as public interpretations of sexuality inside the restaurant unfairly. They are more than just the objects of lust being viewed upon by other customers and work staff, but this scene doesn’t help that argument whatsoever.

Much like most things in the movie, the ending is completely ambiguous. You see Adele walk off around a street corner, to supposedly never talk to Emma again. We see this love come together, fall apart, and have a smidge of possible recovery, only to be let down again. Shortly put, I wanted more out of this story, because it felt like it wasn’t over. Maybe the reason it ended was to show that things don’t always have a “Happily Ever After”, especially when it comes to real life. Overall, for myself as a cisgender white straight man, I think this film is great in terms of queer media exposure. I think white and straight people have been given too much in terms of amount of privilege, especially when it comes to roles in love stories in cinema. I was forced to be critical when it came to my analysis of this movie, simply because I wasn’t the identity featured in this movie. I had to interpret information from a queer lens, which made me more objective and honestly a bit uncomfortable - but in a good way. I was forced to feel and see the things these characters were experiencing, in the exact same exposed ways they were seeing them. In a way, I think that made me more drawn to the story, simply because I was experiencing something that I had never gotten the chance to see anywhere else. The fact that the entire film is in French plays a big role as well, as I noticed I was using a lot of nonverbal cues in order to determine how a character might feel at any point in time. To conclude, I think this movie does a mostly great job on representing queer identities in order to create a love story that is unequivocally matched to any other story you see. It hits on the realistic parts of life and love that humans experience, in order to show how rough love can truly be.

References

Andersson, Y. (2002). Queer Media? In E. Kingsepp (Ed.), Media Research in Progress. Stockholm: Stockholms University. 

Benshoff, H., & Griffin, S. (2004). Queer Cinema the Film Reader. New York, NY: Routledge. Taylor & Francis Group.

Gross, L. (2001). Up from Invisibility: Lesbians, Gay Men, and the Media in America. NEW YORK: Columbia University Press. doi:10.7312/gros11952

[eclecticanalyst]

We’re Expecting You...To Boldly Go [part 2]

In my last post, I expounded on the similarities in the general premise and structure of The Love Boat and Star Trek: The Next Generation, two shows that on the surface seem not to have much in common but on closer examination have some unexpected similarities. In my follow-up post on this theme, I will be drawing parallels between the main/regular characters of both shows. The crew lineup on each ship can be broken down into six character functions/profiles: The Captain, The Captain’s Confidant, The Big Brother, The Two Buds, The Chick, and The Kid.

The Captain

Star Trek TNG: Captain Jean-Luc Picard

The Love Boat: Captain Merrill Stubing

“The Captain” is...the captain! Beyond his role as the primary authority figure, he can be characterized in the following ways. Being the one to whom the rest of the crew reports, he is a bit socially removed from the rest of the main characters. While they can pal around with each other, they still treat him with a bit more deference even as he comes to be just as integral a part of their found family as the rest of them. The Captain can be rather intimidating at times—especially in the early days, when he had a tendency to be overly gruff with his crew. Part of that gruffness is the fact that he has very high standards for the people who serve under him. At the same time, however, he cares deeply for those people and is willing to put himself on the line for them, even bending the rules a bit in order to help them out of a difficult spot. He’s full of thoughtful advice should one of his crew ask for it, and is the most likely of the crew to give speeches about moral responsibility. He also has a playful streak, which he keeps under wraps but uses to mess with his crew from time to time. In terms of appearance, he’s older than the rest of the cast and he is bald(ing). He’s played by the best actor of the cast—Patrick Stewart is, of course, Patrick Stewart, I don’t think I really need to say more there, and Gavin MacLeod was a veteran actor (probably best known at that point for his role as Murray on The Mary Tyler Moore Show), able to handle both the comic and the dramatic whenever needed.

The Captain’s Confidant

Star Trek TNG: Dr. Beverly Crusher

The Love Boat: Dr. Adam “Doc” Bricker

I could have called this character profile “The Doctor,” following the same pattern as “The Captain,” but there was another aspect to Beverly and Doc that I wanted to draw attention to, beyond their being the respective healers of their crews. Both Beverly and Doc have a slightly different relationship with the Captain than the other members of the crew. They are a bit closer to the Captain, able to address him easily as a friend instead of as a superior officer if the situation calls for it. Notice that when working, Beverly will address Picard as “Captain” and “sir,” but when it’s just the two of them chatting in a more intimate setting she calls him “Jean-Luc.” Beverly is also one of the few people on board that Picard is comfortable with opening up to regarding his own insecurities or worries, while he takes more care to maintain his “self-assured captain” persona with everyone else. The same dynamic plays out between Stubing and Doc: there are several instances of Doc addressing his friend as “Merrill”—which none of the other members of the crew would even consider doing—and the power difference between the two is not as pronounced as it is between the captain and the other crew members. Whenever Captain Stubing has a personal problem, he goes to Doc for advice, and vice versa. Dr. Crusher and Captain Picard have a history, having been friends long before he took command of the Enterprise. In the same vein, Doc seems to know Captain Stubing’s past more intimately than the rest of the crew, as there are a few episodes in which the two of them discuss Captain Stubing’s alcohol addiction and current status as a teetotaler as if this is something Doc has always known about Merrill.

The Big Brother

Star Trek TNG: William Riker

The Love Boat: Adam “Doc” Bricker

So this is cheating a bit because I already have Doc listed under a character profile above, but TNG’s main cast has more people than that of TLB, so a one-to-one mapping wasn’t going to happen anyway. Doc’s “Captain’s Confidant” role deals with his relationship with the captain, and his “Big Brother” role deals with his relationship with the rest of the regulars. The fact that Doc is a bit older than Julie, Isaac, and Gopher means that even though he, like the rest of them, is under the supervision of the captain, he has a slight position of seniority over the other three. He balances the by-turns mischievous and responsible aspects of an older brother figure—he’ll tease Julie about her latest infatuation, and set up elaborate pranks to mess with Gopher, yet whenever Gopher and Isaac get swept up in some not-well-thought-out scheme, he’s the level-headed one who tries to point out that they’ve gotten carried away—or sometimes refuses to get involved altogether. William Riker is, of course, first officer of the Enterprise, and therefore has the same seniority-among-underlings position (in a more official chain of command capacity than Doc does). His big-brother-ness manifests as the poker-playing, jazz-loving guy who will do things like give Worf’s son music recordings that he knows Worf will hate one day but get actively upset and almost personally offended at the idea of Data getting hurt the next.

Not necessarily related to the “Big Brother” role, but another little parallel between Doc and Riker that I would like to point out—they are each the designated ladies’ man of their ships, yet both are able to completely switch to focusing solely on their job responsibilities the moment it is called for. (Honestly, Doc always struck me as going beyond “ladies’ man” and skirting dangerously close to “creep” territory at times, but I did appreciate how he would always drop everything the instant there was any sort of medical issue on the Princess.)

The Two Buds

Star Trek TNG: Geordi La Forge and Data

The Love Boat: Isaac Washington and Burl “Gopher” Smith

Although both the TNG and TLB crews form a group of close friends, The Two Buds are best friends. They are the two most likely people to hang out together in their down time, the two who understand each other the best, the two most sympathetic to each other’s problems and most likely to indulge the other long after everyone else would have put their foot down. When Gopher gets some conspiracy theory into his head about a passenger, Isaac will hear him out and sometimes even help him investigate. When Data wants to do some questionable experimentation on his positronic net, Geordi is there with a tricorder making sure the whole thing doesn’t go completely haywire. Data once said that he didn’t know what a friend was until he met Geordi, and Isaac once told Gopher that he (Gopher) is the only one Isaac would resign in solidarity for. All four men/androids have a tendency to get a little too wrapped up in their obsession of the week—see Isaac’s novel-writing attempts, Geordi’s holographic Leah Brahms, Gopher’s conspiracy theories, and about half of anything Data does.

Each pair also consists of one white guy and one Black guy. (Obviously, Data is an android and therefore is not technically any human race or ethnicity, but he’s played by a white guy and his artificial skin is paler than anyone else’s skin on the senior staff.) The white guy representatives, Gopher and Data, are almost polar opposites—Data is calm and logical, and Captain Picard trusts him implicitly, while Gopher is a goof who freaks out easily and who is often upset with the way Captain Stubing dismisses him (those dismissals are especially prominent in the first few seasons—Gopher does mellow out later on). But they do have some similarities, one of the most striking being that they both struggle with appropriate social behavior as well as their own emotions. This is more readily apparent with Data, of course, who is literally not human and is trying his best to understand the nuances of things like humor and love, constantly asking his friends to explain behaviors they take for granted. Gopher’s struggles are more understated—he has a tendency to make comments and observations that the rest of the crew find slightly tasteless, he goes into several anxious tailspins over the course of the show, and he at one point believes his emotional attachments to his friends compromise his ability to fulfill his job duties. Both Data and Gopher use their respective best friends—each of whom are the more level-headed of the pair—as a steadying force.

Now for the characteristics shared by those respective best friends. The Black guy’s job responsibilities root him in a specific place and often set him slightly apart from the main action. While Geordi can and does go up to the bridge on several occasions, as Chief of Engineering he spends most of his time hanging around the warp core, communicating with the bridge over the com system. Meanwhile, Isaac can be seen wandering hallways and so forth, but he spends most of his time behind the bar, whether that’s in the Acapulco Lounge, on the Lido Deck, or in Pirate’s Cove. The rest of the crew, despite having nominal work stations like the Enterprise bridge or the Pacific Princess purser’s lobby, are seen to roam more extensively. (I’m pretty sure we never see Julie’s office.) Isaac is busy serving drinks in pretty much every episode while Doc and Gopher are chatting and dancing with passengers on the dance floor of the Acapulco Lounge. The Black guy also gets the short end of the stick in the romance department. When you see a Black guest actor on the opening credits of The Love Boat, it’s a good bet that Isaac will be involved in their storyline. If it’s just one Black woman, there’s a 99% chance that Isaac will be involved in her story, and his involvement will be as her love interest. I remember one particularly glaring example of the show going to extreme lengths to avoid even hinting that Isaac could potentially do something vaguely romantic or sexual with a white woman—Julie’s hosting her high school reunion on the ship, and there are a few scenes where everyone is discoing in the Acapulco Lounge. Isaac gets out on the dance floor, and conveniently some random Black woman appears out of nowhere as his dance partner. This woman is not named or acknowledged at any other point in the episode. Over on the Enterprise, Geordi isn’t restricted along race lines like Isaac, but I find it highly suspicious that the one Black guy is the least successful in romance out of everyone on the senior staff. Geordi struggles to even start up a conversation with women he’s attracted to, let alone flirt with them. Data has a better romance track record than Geordi does, and Data usually ends up in a romantic entanglement by accident! It’s as if the show was afraid to let Geordi enjoy those kinds of relationships to the same degree as the rest of the crew, which is a different kind of restriction than Isaac’s, but still a restriction nonetheless.

The Chick

Star Trek TNG: Deanna Troi

The Love Boat: Julie McCoy

The standard lineup for both TNG and The Love Boat consisted two female main characters, thus allowing the ladies to gossip about “girly” things in keeping with gender stereotypes, but Vicki was a preteen/teenager and Beverly had a sort of matron vibe going on, which left Julie and Troi to be the respective sex appeal characters out of the main cast. The Chick has non-standard dress that sets her apart from the others and their status as officers. While Doc, Gopher, and Captain Stubing wore nautical stripes and white uniforms (and Isaac usually had a variation on this outfit, wearing a red or blue jacket), with very little in the way of costume changes whether they were greeting boarding passengers, chatting on the Lido deck, or dancing in the Acapulco Lounge, Julie had no stripes to speak of. She would wear a (feminine) uniform at boarding, switch to a casual outfit during the rest of the day, and was always wearing a gown of some sort in the evenings. Deanna Troi for her part cycled through purple jumpsuits and asymmetrical dresses, her Starfleet badge precariously pinned to her neckline. We didn’t even get to see the pips indicating her rank until she was finally given (in story, ordered into) a normal uniform in season six.

The Chick gets saddled with way too many romance plots, some creepier than others. Giving Troi something substantial to do in an episode usually consisted of making her the love interest of whoever happened to be boarding the Enterprise that week, like the ambassador with the telepathic interpreters or the quarter-Betazoid interplanetary negotiator. Deanna also got her mind invaded by a man who was interested in her, prematurely aged by a man who took advantage of her, and kidnapped by Ferengi (who have a disturbing species-wide infatuation with non-Ferengi women). I’m not as upset about Julie having several romance-related plots, as romance was the name of the game on The Love Boat and the men on the crew had their own share of romantic entanglements—but I do find issue with the fact that when Julie was in love she always seemed on the verge of getting married and leaving the ship, which was a vibe we didn’t really get from, say, Doc or Gopher when their love lives turned particularly intense. In terms of creepiness, Julie had to deal with fending off the extremely aggressive advances of Captain Stubing’s uncle, a computer programmer who rigged his dating algorithm to ensure he matched with her, and a college acquaintance of Gopher who actually came to her door to badger her as she was getting dressed.

The Kid

Star Trek TNG: Wesley Crusher

The Love Boat: Vicki Stubing

For some reason, both of these shows thought it necessary to have a preteen/teenager in the cast whose character has way more responsibility than is realistic for either a cruise ship or a pseudomilitary starship. Instead of Vicki wearing a uniform and checking in guests on the Pacific Princess, we really should have seen Julie’s or Gopher’s staff fulfilling check-in duty (Doc and Isaac were also too often seen checking in passengers, which I will say again is a duty that on a real cruise ship would definitely not fall to either the ship’s doctor or chief bartender, but we’re talking about Vicki at the moment). Wesley, meanwhile, was made Acting Ensign on the Enterprise, saving the ship way more than he should have and probably earning the ire of all the official ensigns who actually went to Starfleet Academy and were losing precious time at the conn due to Picard’s favoritism.

Speaking of Picard, The Captain has a paternal relationship with The Kid—literally in Vicki Stubing’s case, emotionally in Wesley Crusher’s. He is very concerned with imbuing The Kid with strong morals, and has a vested interest in The Kid’s upbringing and making sure The Kid has a bright future. Meanwhile, the rest of the main crew are like an assortment of aunts and uncles, being the cool, approachable sources of advice when The Captain’s not around. In fact, The Kid hardly seems to have any friends their own age. Instead, they hang out with the adult crew members and get involved in their social drama, which may or may not have always been appropriate.

Isn’t there someone you forgot?

The TNG fans among you may now be thinking to yourselves, “What about Worf?” Alas, there seems to be no satisfactory Worf counterpart on The Love Boat. After all, there isn’t really any need for a tactical officer on a cruise ship, so a warrior-type personality is not represented on the Pacific Princess crew. Other Worf characteristics would be that of an outsider, or one who is occasionally not sure if they truly belong on the ship, but everyone on the Princess seems pretty happy to be there. I guess in a pinch I could say Ace, the late-addition ship’s photographer, might serve as Worf’s counterpart, but other than the fact that Ace’s family is rich and it is established that he doesn’t really need a job on the ship to get by, I’m not sure there’s much of an “outsider” status brought to the table here. I also haven’t watched enough Ace episodes to have a really good read on his character.

 Thus ends my Love Boat/TNG comparison! It was nice to finally get this analysis out of my head and onto the page.

[sciencespies]

How Viruses Evolve

https://sciencespies.com/nature/how-viruses-evolve/

How Viruses Evolve

The unusual cases of pneumonia began to appear in midwinter, in China. The cause, researchers would later learn, was a coronavirus new to science. By March, the infection began to spread to other Asian countries and overseas. People were dying, and the World Health Organization issued a global health alert.

But this was 2003, not 2020, and the disease was SARS, not Covid-19. By June, the outbreak was almost gone, with just 8,098 confirmed infections and 774 deaths worldwide. No cases of SARS have been reported since 2004.

Contrast that with the closely related coronavirus that causes Covid-19 today: more than 13,600,000 confirmed cases as of July 16, and more than 585,000 deaths.

Why did SARS go away while today’s coronavirus just keeps on spreading? Why, for that matter, did both these coronaviruses spill over into people at all, from their original bat hosts?

And just as vital as those questions is another: What happens next?

As we face the current pandemic, it will be important to understand how SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes Covid-19, is likely to evolve in the months and years ahead. It’s possible the virus could lose its lethal character and settle into an evolutionary détente with humanity. It might end up as just another cold virus, as may have happened to another coronavirus in the past. But it could also remain a serious threat or perhaps even evolve to become more lethal. The outcome depends on the complex and sometimes subtle interplay of ecological and evolutionary forces that shape how viruses and their hosts respond to one another.

“One thing you learn about evolution is never to generalize,” says Edward Holmes, an evolutionary virologist at the University of Sydney, Australia, and author of an article on the evolution of emerging viruses in the Annual Review of Ecology, Evolution, and Systematics. “It depends entirely on the biological nuance of the situation.”

Steps to viral success

Many of the scariest viruses that have caused past or current epidemics originated in other animals and then jumped to people: HIV from other primates, influenza from birds and pigs, and Ebola probably from bats. So, too, for coronaviruses: The ones behind SARS (severe acute respiratory syndrome), MERS (Middle East respiratory syndrome) and Covid-19 all probably originated in bats and arrived in people via another, stepping-stone species, likely palm civets, camels and possibly pangolins, respectively.

But making the jump from one species to another isn’t easy, because successful viruses have to be tightly adapted to their hosts. To get into a host cell, a molecule on the virus’s surface has to match a receptor on the outside of the cell, like a key fitting into a lock. Once inside the cell, the virus has to evade the cell’s immune defenses and then commandeer the appropriate parts of the host’s biochemistry to churn out new viruses. Any or all of these factors are likely to differ from one host species to another, so viruses will need to change genetically — that is, evolve — in order to set up shop in a new animal.

Pandemics — disease outbreaks of global reach — have visited humanity many times. Here are examples.

A recent mutation alters the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein to make it less fragile (the altered bits are shown as colored blobs). This added robustness appears to make the virus more infectious. Three sites are shown because the spike protein is composed of three identical subunits that bind together.

(DOE/Los Alamos National Laboratory)

Host switching actually involves two steps, though these can overlap. First, the virus has to be able to invade the new host’s cells: That’s a minimum requirement for making the host sick. But to become capable of causing epidemics, the virus also has to become infectious — that is, transmissible between individuals — in its new host. That’s what elevates a virus from an occasional nuisance to one capable of causing widespread harm.

SARS-CoV-2 shows these two stages clearly. Compared with the virus in bats, both the virus that infects people and a close relative in pangolins carry a mutation that changes the shape of the surface “ spike protein.” The alteration is right at the spot that binds to host cell receptors to let the virus in. This suggests that the mutation first arose either in pangolins or an as yet unidentified species and happened to allow the virus to jump over to people, too.

But SARS-CoV-2 carries other changes in the spike protein that appear to have arisen after it jumped to people, since they don’t occur in the bat or pangolin viruses. One is in a region called the polybasic cleavage site, which is known to make other coronaviruses and flu viruses more infectious. Another appears to make the spike protein less fragile, and in lab experiments with cell cultures, it makes the virus more infectious. The mutation has become more common as the Covid-19 pandemic goes on, which suggests — but does not prove — that it makes the virus more infectious in the real world, too. (Fortunately, though it may increase spread, it doesn’t seem to make people sicker.)

This evolutionary two-step — first spillover, then adaptation to the new host — is probably characteristic of most viruses as they shift hosts, says Daniel Streicker, a viral ecologist at the University of Glasgow. If so, emerging viruses probably pass through a “silent period” immediately after a host shift, in which the virus barely scrapes by, teetering on the brink of extinction until it acquires the mutations needed for an epidemic to bloom.

Streicker sees this in studies of rabies in bats — which is a good model for studying the evolution of emerging viruses, he says, since the rabies virus has jumped between different bat species many times. He and his colleagues looked at decades’ worth of genetic sequence data for rabies viruses that had undergone such host shifts. Since larger populations contain more genetic variants than smaller populations do, measuring genetic diversity in their samples enabled the scientists to estimate how widespread the virus was at any given time.

The team found that almost none of the 13 viral strains they studied took off immediately after switching to a new bat species. Instead, the viruses eked out a marginal existence for years to decades before they acquired the mutations — of as yet unknown function — that allowed them to burst out to epidemic levels. Not surprisingly, the viruses that emerged the fastest were those that needed the fewest genetic changes to blossom.

SARS-CoV-2 probably passed through a similar tenuous phase before it acquired the key adaptations that allowed it to flourish, perhaps the mutation to the polybasic cleavage site, perhaps others not yet identified. In any case, says Colin Parrish, a virologist at Cornell University who studies host shifts, “by the time the first person in Wuhan had been identified with coronavirus, it had probably been in people for a while.”

It was our bad luck that SARS-CoV-2 adapted successfully. Many viruses that spill over to humans never do. About 220 to 250 viruses are known to infect people, but only about half are transmissible — many only weakly — from one person to another, says Jemma Geoghegan, an evolutionary virologist at the University of Otago, New Zealand. The rest are dead-end infections. Half is a generous estimate, she adds, since many other spillover events probably fizzle out before they can even be counted.

Getting nicer — or nastier

SARS-CoV-2, of course, is well past the teetering stage. The big question now is: What happens next? One popular theory, endorsed by some experts, is that viruses often start off harming their hosts, but evolve toward a more benign coexistence. After all, many of the viruses we know of that trigger severe problems in a new host species cause mild or no disease in the host they originally came from. And from the virus’s perspective, this theory asserts, hosts that are less sick are more likely to be moving around, meeting others and spreading the infection onward.

“I believe that viruses tend to become less pathogenic,” says Burtram Fielding, a coronavirologist at the University of the Western Cape, South Africa. “The ultimate aim of a pathogen is to reproduce, to make more of itself. Any pathogen that kills the host too fast will not give itself enough time to reproduce.” If SARS-CoV-2 can spread faster and further by killing or severely harming fewer of the people it infects, we might expect that over time, it will become less harmful — or, as virologists term it, less virulent.

This kind of evolutionary gentling may be exactly what happened more than a century ago to one of the other human coronaviruses, known as OC43, Fielding suggests. Today, OC43 is one of four coronaviruses that account for up to a third of cases of the common cold (and perhaps occasionally more severe illness). But Fielding and a few others think it could also have been the virus behind a worldwide pandemic, usually ascribed to influenza, that began in 1890 and killed more than a million people worldwide, including Queen Victoria’s grandson and heir.

After rabbits were introduced to Australia, their population exploded. “They are very plentiful here,” says the handwritten inscription on the back of this postcard from around 1930. Scientists eventually introduced the myxoma virus to control the rabbit plague.

(Photographer Paul C. Nomchong / National Museum of Australia)

Scientists can’t prove that, because no virus samples survive from that pandemic, but some circumstantial evidence makes the case plausible, Fielding says. For one thing, people who were infected in the 1890 pandemic apparently experienced nervous-system symptoms we now see as more typical of coronaviruses than of influenza. And when Belgian researchers sequenced OC43’s genome in 2005 and compared it to other known coronaviruses, they concluded that it likely originated as a cattle virus and may have jumped to people right around 1890. They speculated that it may have caused the 1890 pandemic and then settled down to a less nasty coexistence as an ordinary cold virus.

Other evolutionary biologists disagree. The pandemic certainly faded as more people became immune, but there’s no solid evidence that OC43 itself evolved from highly virulent to mostly benign over the last century, they say. Even if it did, that does not mean SARS-CoV-2 will follow the same trajectory. “You can’t just say it’s going to become nicer, that somehow a well-adapted pathogen doesn’t harm its host. Modern evolutionary biology, and a lot of data, shows that doesn’t have to be true. It can get nicer, and it can get nastier,” says Andrew Read, an evolutionary microbiologist at Penn State University. (Holmes is blunter: “Trying to predict virulence evolution is a mug’s game,” he says.)

To understand why it’s so hard to predict changes in virulence, Read says it’s important to recognize the difference between virulence — that is, how sick a virus makes its host — and its transmissibility, or how easily it passes from one host individual to another. Evolution always favors increased transmissibility, because viruses that spread more easily are evolutionarily fitter — that is, they leave more descendants. But transmissibility and virulence aren’t linked in any dependable way, Read says. Some germs do just fine even if they make you very sick. The bacteria that cause cholera spread through diarrhea, so severe disease is good for them. Malaria and yellow fever, which are transmitted by mosquitos, can spread just fine even from a person at death’s door.

Funeral for a U.S. soldier who died of influenza in Russia in 1919. The 1918-1920 pandemic killed an estimated 50 million people worldwide.

(U.S. National Archives)

Respiratory viruses, like influenza and the human coronaviruses, need hosts that move around enough to breathe on one another, so extremely high virulence might be detrimental in some cases. But there’s no obvious evolutionary advantage for SARS-CoV-2 to reduce its virulence, because it pays little price for occasionally killing people: It spreads readily from infected people who are not yet feeling sick, and even from those who may never show symptoms of illness. “To be honest, the novel coronavirus is pretty fit already,” Geoghegan says.

Nor are there many documented instances of viruses whose virulence has abated over time. The rare, classic example is the myxoma virus, which was deliberately introduced to Australia in the 1950s from South America to control invasive European rabbits. Within a few decades, the virus evolved to reduce its virulence, albeit only down to 70 to 95 percent lethality from a whopping 99.8 percent. (It has since ticked up again.)

But myxoma stands nearly alone, Parrish says. For instance, he notes, there is no evidence that recent human pathogens such as Ebola, Zika or chikungunya viruses have shown any signs of becoming less pathogenic in the relatively short time since jumping to humans.

“Everyone has influenza,” reads a headline in a French publication from January 1890.

(Wellcome Collection via CC by 4.0)

The ones that went away

The faded nightmares of our past — pandemics that terrorized, then receded, such as SARS in 2003 and flu in 1918-20 and again in 1957, 1968 and 2009 — went away not because the viruses evolved to cause milder disease, but for other reasons. In the case of SARS, the virus made people sick enough that health workers were able to contain the disease before it got out of hand. “People who got SARS got very sick, very fast and were easily identified, easily tracked and readily quarantined — and their contacts were also readily identified and quarantined,” says Mark Cameron, an immunologist at Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland, who worked in a Toronto hospital during the height of the SARS outbreak there. That was never going to be as easy to do for Covid-19 because people who don’t show symptoms can spread the virus.

Flu pandemics, meanwhile, have tended to recede for another reason, one that offers more hope in our present moment: Enough of the population eventually becomes immune to slow the virus down. The H1N1 influenza virus that caused the 1918 pandemic continued as the main influenza virus until the 1950s, and its descendants still circulate in the human population. What made the virus such a threat in 1918-20 is that it was novel and people had little immunity. Once much of the population had been exposed to the virus and had developed immunity, the pandemic waned, although the virus persisted at a lower level of infections — as it does to this day. It appears less lethal now largely because older people, who are at greatest risk of dying from influenza, have usually encountered H1N1 influenza or something like it at some point in their lives and retain some degree of immunity, Read says.

With the new coronavirus, Parrish says, “we’re sort of in that 1918 period where the virus is spreading fast in a naive population.” But that will change as more people either catch Covid-19 or are vaccinated (if and when that becomes possible) and develop some level of immunity. “There’s no question that once the population is largely immune, the virus will die down,” Parrish says.

The question is how long that immunity will last: for a lifetime, like smallpox, or just a few years, like flu? In part, that will depend on whether the vaccine induces a permanent antibody response or just a temporary one. But it also depends on whether the virus can change to evade the antibodies generated by the vaccine. Although coronaviruses don’t accumulate mutations as fast as flu viruses, they do still change. And at least one, which causes bronchitis in chickens, has evolved new variants that aren’t covered by previous vaccines. But at this point, no one knows what to expect from SARS-CoV-2.

There is, at least, one encouraging aspect to all this. Even if we can’t predict how the virus will evolve or how it will respond to the coming vaccine, there is something all of us can do to reduce the risk of the virus evolving in dangerous ways. And it doesn’t involve any complicated new behaviors. “Viruses can only evolve if they’re replicating and transmitting,” Streicker says. “Anything that reduces the replication of a virus will in consequence reduce the amount of evolution that happens.” In other words, we can do our part to slow down the evolution of the Covid-19 virus by behaving exactly as we’ve been told to already to avoid catching it: Minimize contact with others, wash your hands and wear a mask.

This article originally appeared in Knowable Magazine, an independent journalistic endeavor from Annual Reviews. Sign up for the newsletter.

#Nature

[j4nn4s]

rules:

always repost the rules

answer the questions given to you by the one who tagged you!

give 11 questions

tag 11 people

i was tagged by @isakvdhflorenzi, ty miss lorena <3 1. Is the social media presence of the characters important to how you view the quality of the remake/show?

hm well skam nl is my favorite and their social media game is trash LMAOOO so generally No but i do feel like remakes who DO have such a good presence kind of elevate the show and i think it’s pretty heartwarmin to see some remakes go sm farther than skam with social media and puttin out educational and IN CHARA resources like skames does this so well and i feel like in that way, the team is really really spreadin skam’s spirit via these resources (like joana’s billion bpd awareness ig accounts and lucas rubio’s yt channel)

2. Least favourite clip of the show? Why?

tbh there are definitely some duds but probably one of the clips with sana gettin herself into a hole in s4 just bc some were hard to watch cus cringey or yikes .... idk i cant think of others LMAO

3. Which character did you feel the most connected to and why?

ijeoiqjiwoij even tho even is my all time fave skam chara, i have to say isak for all of these reasons 

4. Your least favourite part of every season?

season 1 - tbh even though i really enjoyed this season, it does take a while for it to build up like i rmr at first not being that interested until ep6 maybe ?? which is hard when you’re trying to get your friends to watch but they have to wait until ep6 before shit starts RLLY buildin up and gettin wild

season 2 - hm ig noora chasin after william ??

season 3 - bro NOTHINGGG call me a purist but its such a refined masterpiece like the pacing is good the characterization is so good ugh i deadass cant think of anythin

season 4 - i always felt a little ??? w noora being sana’s bff ig bc from s1-s3 it didn’t Feel like they were that close like even in noora’s pov, sana wasn’t really a part of it that much ?? like eva was more of noora’s bff ?? so i feel like it would have made more sense if maybe sana spoke more with chris or vilde bc sana and vilde eventually seemed to get closer esp with kosegruppa and chris has always been by sana’s side ?? idk that always confused me

5. What is your opinion on the cast’s participation on social media? Do you prefer it when the cast aren’t that involved like the Skam cast, or do you like a lot of content like the Fr cast do?

tbh i don’t care much abt the casts LMAOOO if anythin it kind of brings more harm as seen with the harassment axel and maxence get and also can bring more controversy like with irene (which honestly is p sad considerin how much i love skames bc now i feel super :/ watchin it like she shouldve just had private accts at this point)

6. Favourite song you found from Skam or the remakes?

OMFGGG love this question .... def doorman by slowthai and mura masa bc its one of my fave songs now and i got it from skam nl <3 ugh taste

7. If you could decide which characters from Skam got a season, who would you choose?

OOOHHH ugh torn bc i like isak’s pov but also i want even’s so might have to forfeit isak season for even season ....... hm so probs vilde, sana, even, noora (maybe not w william tho) and honestly maybe jonas too ??

8. Are there any moments that you liked in the show that everyone else seems to hate?

IJXDWQOIJJ yes .... remakes-wise, people hate skam nl s2’s last half but i enjoyed it for the most part ... i think the pacing was off for the last ep but personally, clip 50 made up for it and is p god tier imo ..... and also don’t think the first half of ep10 is enough to discredit the entire season bc i rlly loved seeing liv’s pov and have sm fave moments from the season 

but skam wise, omg might get a lil controversial w this one IM SORRY !!! im bein honest and its Just my opinion ok 

personally s2 got me more invested than s1 and i don’t think its a super bad season like i didnt really say many problems wrong with it until i got on tumblr wiejioqjoiqjq i was sort of interested in the questions that the noora/william dynamic brought up which is, as expressed in william’s war speech to noora, that nothing is ever black/white which i feel was a huge message and feeds into the ‘you never know what ppl are going through’ theme of the season ... like i like the idea of someone like noora, who can have a black/white mentality (as seen in the first clip of s2 when she tells vilde that they can’t have the tannin company as their sponsor bc they objectify women or smth but misses the context and what it could mean for the bus monetarily bc shes caught up in bein ‘woke’) having to break out of that and see more than one side ... and i think remakes like skam austin expanded on this idea well like when zoya was like ‘must be so nice being right all the time’ which i Do feel like is an important for youth to know today .... bc i think its so easy to get caught up in the idea of being so objectively right and morally superior that people lose sight of the more nuanced characteristics to life ... (omg long ramble BUT)

also LMAOOOOO this one might be more controversial as it pertains to bench scene s4 ok oops again doNT GOTTA AGREE !! ........ but i feel like the scene had a lot of good intentions ... i was def kind of cringing a bit tho bc i understand the subject’s sensitivity and how these topics are hard to talk about but i genuinely feel like they both made Some points and should listen to each other .... like as Hard and as maybe ‘unwoke’ it is to admit, unfortunately you sort of do have to answer the tough questions bc that way we learn from each other .... and i perfectly understand why some ppl wouldn’t want to do this and i certainly am tired abt havin to answer shit abt my sexuality or stupid male questions abt women but if u dont answer them, people do go lookin for answers still and the internet is such a shitty place that its pretty easy (esp with youtube’s algorithm) to lead you to ignorant ppl and perhaps radicalization .... questions help us to better understand our community and sometimes they can have good intentions too but we have to ask and answer them or else people will make up answers (which ive literally seen and its honestly worse to see fake as shit and UNINFORMED answers bc ppl did not want to ask you or ppl of ur identity, esp when they’re already startin from a place of hate .... but i rather have ppl ask me patronizing questions than have them spread false info bc that can do much more harm in the long run) however i DO think that isak should also consider sana’s side and i sort of wish we saw him conceding more bc they both have smth to learn from one another, like sana shouldn’t just be learnin from isak, isak needs to learn from sana too

PHEW SORRY QWIOJQWIO girl i just got opinions on some things this is when my desc rlly comes in handy .... oqjdwqioj

9. What did you learn from the show?

omg honestly too much to write here tbh ..... but if it says anythin im (very slowly) in the works of a three part skam essay about basically how skam teaches us to be better humans and how to better treat the people we care about diowjqioj essentially the three biggest themes of the show: you never know what someone is going through so always be kind, always communicate with your friends, and no person is ever alone and i feel like these are definitely rlly good messages to live by (also livet er nå BITCH !!!)

10. What is your favourite headcanon about your favourite characters?

omg tbh i could not tell u at all how the skam charas are doing except i hope even is okay thats all im thinkin of ok .... OIWXIOJX omg remakes wise tho ..... honestly im so bad at this girl IDK !!!!! LMAO i have to really think i have a bit of vdh and dutch even but thats bc we know like Zero abt them so its easier oijwiojqio idk liv and noah bein cute as shit ..... OH WAIT personally i feel like janna got a bunch of pansexual energy so my BIGGG hc is that she’s pan also bc she’s one of my all time fave charas and my fkn url so itd be dope if she was pan ok boom

11. What is your opinion on fanfiction in the fandom?

tbh i don’t read skam fanfiction but i don’t mind reading some from the remakes (tho still its rare) ... eiojeioqw i just don’t trust anyone but julie to write skam charas bc i think that’s how precious the show is to me LMAO like idk everything ive seen of skam fanfiction and ficlets and one shots, i could never get into bc the tone is just so out of character or there will be lines that just take me out of the fic bc im like this !!!! is not !!! how the chara acts !!!! so yeah idk not rlly a fan bc of my purist ass but i dont mind others reading it

Questions:

1. Favorite quote of the show?

2. Which country would you like to see have the next remake? Do you have any headcanons?

3. Which season would you rewrite and how would you rewrite it?

4. What clips do you personally like or don’t mind, but others hate?

5. Which songs do you think SKAM or the remakes should have included? For which moments?

6. Who would you give SKAM season five to and what topics and themes would it cover?

7. What moment spoke to you or touched you from SKAM the most?

8. How did you find SKAM? How did you feel about it right after watching?

9. Have you shared SKAM with any friends in real life? What did they think of it?

10. Of the remakes, which characters are your favorite of their SKAM counterparts? (Ex. who is the best Vilde remake? Eva? etc.)

11. How do you feel about the SKAM (and remakes) tumblr fandom?

I tag: @smileykeijser @whatadaze @queenofpurgatoryx @itlukey @skamyeets @shaykeijser @megeliz01 @isakcijser @wackpainterkid @axelauriantblot @kar-d-momme

(omg ik some of yall have been tagged so just ignore if u dont want to do it ok im srry it was in the RULES!)

[lightsandlostbells]

what would be your ranking of each season? (love your all your recaps btw, they have given me insight to stuff I didn't notice before and made appreciate s3 a lot more) <3

Thank you so much! ❤️❤️❤️ Gonna put my ranking of Skam’s seasons under a read-more since I go into some criticisms and I’m long-winded as always:

1. Season 3. Probably obvious from my recaps, lol. Literally everything about it not just works, but soars. Like I remember watching in real time and expecting the show to stumble at some point, because even shows I love generally have aspects that I don’t care for. And instead this season kept ascending. The acting is top notch and the chemistry between Isak and Even is really something special. The writing is tight and nuanced - no scene feels unnecessary, and the use of symbolism is excellent. The music is perfectly chosen. They did some of the best social media work this season. You can tell Julie put so much thought into this story for a long time. It has no major flaws for me, like I can only think of one quibble and it’s more of a “I wish they did that” instead of something that really cuts into my enjoyment of the story. I feel totally OK saying S3 is a fucking masterpiece because I can prove it (I mean, art is subjective, lmao, but if you asked me to defend this season artistically I would have zero problem.) 2. Season 1. Also amazing. It’s more low-key and understated; I can see why people would find it slow, especially in the beginning. But I love it. Eva’s journey is raw and deeply personal. Lisa Teige is fantastic and makes Eva warm and sympathetic. She’s so natural and pulls you right into Eva’s struggles. (I can respect that remake Evas have worked better for some people, but I will go to the mat for original Eva. She’s incredible.) The themes of the season are established well and tell a story that often feels overlooked. There are a lot of subtleties about navigating relationships as a teenage girl and feeling adrift, and some truly gorgeous scenes. In some ways this is a “test” season but it’s still powerful, well-acted, and well-written, with a lot of Julie’s vision for the show apparent from the start. Adore it.3. Season 4. So while I prefer S4 to S2, in some ways I think S2 is better as a narrative. S4 suffers from a lack of focus, and S2, whatever you think of Noorhelm, has that story to anchor it and not drift too much. S4 would have benefited from a tighter story rather than trying to wrap everything up, because we ended up with like 3-4 storylines and none of them had a completely satisfying conclusion, IMO.  Iman Meskini was wonderful this season and much of the good qualities of S4 were from watching her get to shine. The Sana/Yousef relationship, what we did get of it, was fantastic and made for many of S4′s best scenes. However, it was only one part of the plot, and other parts weren’t as engaging. Too much time spent on the bus and Pepsi Max girls who no one cared about. Filler scenes. I don’t think Even needed to be a major part of the story but I disliked the way his mental illness was portrayed in S4, especially after S3 did a good job with it. Overall I think Julie made less interesting choices for drama when there were more obvious ones that would have made for a richer story - for instance, the Noora/Yousef plot was a shallow conflict that could have been resolved with one conversation, and took time away from the real conflict for Sana and Yousef, which was being an interfaith relationship, an issue that has no neat resolution or “right” answer but would make for tons of complex drama and dialogue (as it did when it was the focus). Or how the bus storyline focused on Sara and Pepsi Max when we could have focused on Sana and Vilde’s relationship and their clashing over the bus, which would have been way more interesting. 4. Season 2. I’m not going to go into a full breakdown of it but my main issue is that some of S2′s positive messages and good qualities are undermined by other aspects of the story that are like … direct contradictions. You can probably guess how I feel about Noorhelm. Even outside of Noorhelm, though, William as a character needs a rewrite because I feel like we know barely anything about him as a person? Not what has happened to him but who he is, like what does this guy even like to do in his free time, what are his interests, what are his goals? He’s also weirdly endorsed by the narrative even when it doesn’t make sense (like why is Sana stumping for him and breaking down William’s reasons for smashing a bottle over his head when … she doesn’t know him at all … how would she know … ) The pacing of this season can drag. The Yakuza storyline feels like something out of Riverdale or Gossip Girl rather than Skam and is also underdeveloped (William: totally has good reasons for fighting and Noora needs to understand his motivations, we need to see other’s POVs because war starts from misunderstandings and prejudice. But those Yakuza guys are just violent nameless punks beating up people for the hell of it, don’t think too much about it.) I felt like Noora’s personal arc is not that clear other than falling for William and choosing to be with him - it’s not like with Eva or Isak where they had clear arcs and personal development regardless of their love interest. Or well, I think she has some personal development but a lot of the later episode big drama comes from William having to make choices, not Noora, so it felt like less of her story in the end. Even with Sana whose story is also muddled and whose arc wasn’t handled as well as it could have been, there was more of a personal journey outside of Yousef. Good things about the season: the girls, especially Noora and Vilde’s relationship, the handling of Noora’s assault for the most part, Eskild and Linn’s introduction. Some good symbolism and motifs. 

[britesparc]

Weekend Top Ten #495

Top Ten Non-MCU Post-Credit Scenes

Oh look, two MCU-related posts in a row! Delightful. Well, kinda. Because this week is a fake-out; it’s not really about the MCU! In fact, it’s almost anti-MCU! How wicked! Because ever since its inception, one of the quirks of the Marvel Cinematic Universe – something it’s become famous for, in fact – is its use of a post-credit scene. From the moment Nick Fury stepped out of the shadows to mention the “Avenger Initiative” after all the names had scrolled on by in Iron Man, the ongoing films were almost defined by their last-second teases and delights. You can tell, in the cinema, the fans and non-fans, as they get up and clear off, leaving the True Believers in their seats, wondering how these people could possibly vacate the theatre without really seeing the ending. In fact, as the franchise has gone on, the number of people staying put has – in my own rough reckoning – increased considerably, to now be about fifty percent of the audience. And why not? You’re really not getting the full picture! As these entangled narratives have unfurled before us, we like the connective tissue of the end-credit tease; the reveals of new characters or locations, the subtle hints at what’s to come. Loki has possessed Selvig! The Collector has the Aether! The ant’s playing the drums!

“To challenge them would be to court Death!”

Anyway, MCU films have post-credit scenes. But of course they’re not the only ones. Having a scene after the credits – or, sometimes, during the credits – is fairly common in the history of cinema. I think it’s become a lot more common this century, partly because of Marvel popularising it as a storytelling device or method of connecting disparate films in a franchise, but also (I believe) because CG animated films have often used it as a comedy trick. I’m not sure why or where this really began in earnest, but I think the old Pixar “out takes” was partly to blame, as was the whole “Shrek Dance Party” phenomenon. Anyway, as you will see, there are a few here that fit that bill.

Because that’s what this whole list is! It’s films that have great post-credit scenes, but aren’t Marvel! Or, at least, aren’t officially part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Some of them are classics of the form, thirty or forty years old; some are newer and fall into the categories I’ve mentioned above. Some follow a similar pattern to most MCU end-scenes – comedy skit or tease an upcoming movie, but stuck at the end of the credits – whereas some interfere with the credits throughout. I’ve been wary of scenes which aren’t really post-credit, but if we all the “mid-credit” scene in the MCU – or the multiple scenes from Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 – then we can allow some of the ones below.

So there we are! Nowt more to it. Let’s roll the credits...

Airplane! (1980): early in the film, our hero Ted Striker (Robert Hays) leaves his cab just as a fare gets in the back. Telling said fare to wait, Striker dashes after his girlfriend Elaine (Julie Hagarty), ends up on her plane, and, well, the rest of the delightfully silly and surreal plot unfolds. The film ends, the credits roll, and then we cut back to the abandoned cab, where the poor unfortubate fare is still sat in the back seat. “I’ll give him five more minutes,” he says, looking at his watch, “And that’s it.” I mean, it’s just sublime.

Deadpool (2016)/Deadpool 2 (2018): where to start? Whether it’s the first film’s Ferris Bueller-aping dressing gown skit (delightfully informing us that Cable will be in the next film) or the sequel’s multiple time-hopping gags – including undoing the film’s unfortunate fridging of Vanessa (Morena Baccarin) and killing Ryan Reynolds (“you’re welcome, Canada”) – this series really knows how to keep you engaged until the very last second. Can’t wait to see what he does when he’s part of the MCU.

Young Sherlock Holmes (1985): it’s funny, but looking back, I can probably trace any interest I have in Sherlock Holmes to this film and Basil the Great Mouse Detective. Anyway, this is a seminal film by any yardstick, featuring as it does one of (if not the) first example of a CGI character interacting in a real environment. But the end credit sting! The film’s Big Bad (Anthony Higgins), having somehow survived, checks himself into a hotel under the name of – you guessed it – Moriarty. This was, arguably, the first example of an end-credit scene teasing a future film! Setting up the Young Sherlock Holmes Extended Universe! Sadly it was a bit of a flop and they didn’t make any more.

Masters of the Universe (1987): Young Sherlock may have been interesting, but I’ll be honest, other people had to tell me who Moriarty was for me to understand the significance. The ending of Masters, however… well, it’s not quite as nuanced or revelatory, but the seemingly-dead Skeletor (Frank Langella) popping his head back up to yell at the camera “I’ll be back!” was a fantastic and exciting shock. We were guaranteed more He-Man! There’d be another film! There was not another film. Still cool, though.

A Bug’s Life (1998): I alluded to this earlier, and we’re only tenuously in “end-credit” land here (these scenes play over the credits, technically), but it still merits a mention. For A Bug’s Life was the film that began the (actually very short) Pixar tradition of showing us “outtakes” from the movie. And some of these first ones are among the best, with characters corpsing or forgetting their lines; subsequent films would lean more towards practical jokes and outright gaggery, whereas I personally prefer those that further the “it’s a movie being filmed” illusion. Anyway, the legend began here, not a sentence you can often say in relation to A Bug’s Life.

Frozen II (2019): in recent years Disney have made end-credit gags a tradition, and they’re pretty good at it. Moana’s fourth wall-breaking catchup with Tamatoa nearly made the list, but I’m giving the spot to Olaf. After recapping the plot of the first film earlier in the runtime, he’s now telling the story of the film you’ve just watched. The kicker? He’s telling the story to Marshmallow and the creepy little snow-brothers! From the first Frozen! And Frozen Fever! They’re at the ice palace, remember? It’s not only a funny bit, it’s also a nice nod to those kids (and their parents) who’ve mainlined anything Frozen-related for the past couple of years.

Winnie the Pooh (2011): a very underrated little gem, this; just so charming. One of the plot threads is the apparent disappearance of Christopher Robin, who leaves a note saying he’ll be “back soon”, but which is misread by stuffy know-it-all bird Owl, and leads to an amusing song of fright and alarm Pooh, Piglet and the gang all believe old Chrissie Rob has been abducted by a monster called a “Backson” (“They use their horns to put holes in your socks!”). Obviously this is a misunderstanding, it’s all resolved, happy endings all round. But then, at the end of the credits, who should rock up, but an actual Backson (who turns out to be very nice). What’s great about this, other than it just being a neat gag, is that it’s playing with the expectations of a young audience; it’s introducing them to a kind of comedic rug-pull. I can attest to the fact that nippers find it very entertaining.

Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse (2019): I’m a bit concerned about being too superheroic (I nearly had the Flash/Superman race from Justice League in here, actually, which I like because it’s one of the few moments in either version of that film where the characters act like the characters I know). I’m also wary of leaning into the whole “sequel tease” thing. But hey, this one’s fun; it feels like a sequel tease, another alternate version of Spider-Man voiced by a famous actor. Then it warps into the classic sixties Spider-Man, and references the whole “pointing” meme to boot. It has its cake and eats it, and it’s great.

Gremlins 2: The New Batch (1990): the Gremlins films are great at breaking the fourth wall and poking fun at themselves, and this is no exception. The great Daffy Duck – who introduced the film, and whose anarchic style is a great precursor to the Gremlins themselves – pops up several times to comment on how long and boring the credits are, before finally asking the audience, “Don’t you people have homes?”. There should be more Daffy in movies.

Shrek 2 (2004): there were a few things I could have included in this list: Crank’s 16-bit game homage is quite fun; the Ferris Bueller bathrobe bit is iconic, although personally I find Ferris so unappealing as a character that I wouldn’t want to include it. So we have Shrek 2, one of the first of a whole raft of CG animated films to have a funny scene at the end. And the reason I’ve included it is because, well, it’s quite weird. Basically you find out that Donkey and Dragon have had babies that are, er, half donkey and half dragon (“Look at our little mutant babies!” says Donkey). I mean. There are connotations here that I’d rather not mull over.

So there we are. Now I didn’t want to include this as it’s not really a scene, and if I’m just doing “funny things in the credits” then we’re going to get onto stuff like the Naked Gun movies and all sorts of other weirdness, but I do want to shout out to An American Werewolf in London’s “any resemblance to persons living, dead, or undead” legal disclaimer at the end of the credits.

[vetivervelvetviolet]

Yuri!!! on ICE Dub Review: a Translator’s (in training) Perspective

As promised, here's my review of the Yuri!!! on ICE dub by @funimation. In case you are new to my blog (which will be 5 years old this July, yay), I'm currently in graduate school for a Master's in Japanese Translation. I've been studying Japanese since 2005, and I've been watching anime and/or reading manga for a little bit longer than that. Some of the points I’m going to make are based on translation theory and practice facts, some are educated guesses about a dubbing process I had no part in, and some are just personal opinions. Please keep this in mind.

Strengths

Overall I was truly impressed with this dub, especially given that the episodes would have been translated, subtitled, and re-recorded on relatively short notice, and that there would have been increased pressure on the actors to get their lines in a few takes since the episodes were being released on Crunchyroll only a week after they premiered in Japan. Josh Grelle was an excellent voice match for Yuuri and carried this show, Jerry Jewell's Viktor was charming and funny, and Micah Solusod did an admirable job as Yuri P., doing what I think might have been his first Russian accent (at least as far as I have seen), and generally playing the motivated little asshole part very well, once again proving that sweet guys tend to play the best douchebags.

The side characters also had very good English voices, in terms of suiting the character type. I'm in love with Joel Mcdonald's Phichit; his voice is 110% believable coming out of Phichit's mouth. Joel seems to have the "kindhearted boy voice" corner covered. JJ's voice actor was great, and conveyed the character's outrageousness over to English superbly. Lastly, I love Chris Sabat's Christophe. I love him. That is my boy right there. Sorry haters, you can't change my mind. I hope Christophe gets some more backstory next season. In all, the choices of actors in the dub were excellent.

・The Asian characters didn't have accents. This subtle decision was a very thoughtful move in terms of maintaining how Yuuri, a Japanese person, would perceive his fellow skaters in an English-dubbed environment. You know how people talk about "a director's director" as someone who makes movies that appeal to directors, this was a translator's translator’s decision.

In Japanese culture, Chinese and Korean people are not considered gaikokujin, per se, despite being foreigners from a legal standpoint. These countries and cultures have heavily intertwined histories, so it makes sense that Japan would consider them sort of in-group. In recent years, too, perhaps as a result of globalization and increased contact, this foreigner-but-not-really-a-foreigner status is also sometimes given to Southeast Asian people. Europeans, Africans, Pacific Islanders, people from the Americas, and people from the Middle East are still gaikokujin, and are seen as Other from a sociological perspective. Although I obviously wasn't in charge of translating the Japanese script, writing the English script, or hiring the actors, this is the only logical reason I can come up with for why Phichit, Guang-Hong, and Seung-Gil didn't have accents, but everyone else (save Leo who is American) does. JJ even said "eh?"  and pronounced his vowels a little differently in the first episode he appeared in, just in case you didn't catch that he was from ~Canada~. Intentional or not, I was really impressed by this decision and hope it is a sign of movement towards more nuanced dubbing.

・No one's name was gravely mispronounced *is still not over the D. Gray-man dub*

・Yuri P. was adequately rude; he didn't sound toned-down or forced (like how I felt about some moments in the Attack on Titan dub) 

 ・I think Minami sounded equally gender ambiguous in the English dub as he did in the original. Apparently his seiyuu was the protagonist in Haikyuu. I have not seen that series, but I can say from what I have seen of the art that that character is much more obviously male, and perhaps people who were familiar with Haikyuu and that actor knew right away that he was a guy, but it was not obvious to me in the the original! Minami’s character design is not terribly masculine, nor is his behavior, and if Trina Nishimura hasn't dubbed him, I honestly would have expected Greg Ayres, what with that hair, personality, and snaggle tooth.

Weaknesses

・Why did Celestino have an Italian accent? Even his Japanese Wikipedia description clearly says he's イタリア系アメリカ人, which means he is an American of Italian descent, as in, his parents/grandparents/etc. were from Italy. He is not an Italian immigrant/expat who lives in America. 

 ・I think Stephane Lambiel's guest appearence was handled clumsily in the dub. Considering how thoughtful the American crew seemed to be in regards to dubbing just about everyone else, I couldn't understand why they didn't either 1.) Keep the original audio of Lambiel, himself, speaking his few lines, or 2.) If that wasn't possible, record someone else speaking his lines in French. There were only a few, and with no lipflap to match, it seemed doable for someone who isn't necessarily a professional voice actor, but is either French or speaks French fluently. Granted, if they had re-recorded French audio, they would have needed to overlay English subtitles around or over the already-present Japanese ones which would be visually awkward, butttt... which for some odd reason they still had in the dub??? I don’t doubt that they --the dub crew-- probably also thought that this was less than ideal, having two sets of subtitles on the screen simultaneously, but I found it supremely distracting, for one, and absolutely unnecessary in the case of the English ones, since the dub actor was already speaking in English.

・One of the international skaters (either Guang-Hong, Emil, or Leo, I can't remember which), in his first appearance, was clearly dubbed by someone using a completely different mic or recording system than the majority of the cast. I lack the proper technical terms to describe his voice for those lines, but it sounded fuzzy or clouded, not like someone was speaking to me in real life. By no means did this ruin the entire episode or something for me, and it was probably a result of the time crunch ("you can't make it in today? okay, sure, you can record from home and send it in, so long as we have it by the end of today"), but it was noticeable.

Addressing some issues and qualms brought up by other fans

・"Jerry Jewell's Russian accent wasn't flawless/he sounds like Gru from Despicable Me". I know next to nothing about Russian, so maybe it was horrible, but it wasn't so horrible that I could tell. But more over: TIME CONTRAINTS. Funimation had to find a veteran voice actor who could reliably get lines done in a few takes (given not just the time contraints, but the fact that Viktor speaks a lot in every episode) and could also do a passable (to Americans) Russian accent. I cannot imagine that there are too many people in the Forth Worth-Dallas area who meet both of those requirements. Second, if you can sit through the Minions, you can suck it up and deal with a just-okay Russian accent. 

 ・Which brings us to my next point: the time element. You cannot reasonably expect something, any sort of product for consumption, to be flawless, fast, AND cheap/free. Going too fast in translation, including subtitles, almost always results in errors. Hence there were minor flaws in the subs (as @fencer-x has noted; she has better listening comprehension skills than me, and I trust her ear) , and since the dub script was not terribly different than the subbed script in this series, I'm going to guess that those errors carried over. I don’t have time to go back and analyze the places where the mistranslations occurred, though, so I am not 100% sure. They did not affect the plot or the characterization of the characters, though, so I do not consider them serious. 

 ・Some time ago @fencer-x responded to a comment about jokes/references/lines being moved around. I don't remember what she said, but here are my two cents:

Moving around jokes/references/lines is normal in translation, especially when you need to match lipflap. There may be many reasons why, and they will vary depending on language pair, but they can all be said to be necessary to meet target culture norms, and in the the case of dubbing, meeting target culture mouth movements. Although technically up for debate in academia, I am of the persuasion that some loss of linguistic and cultural content is inevitable in translation, even in literal translation, sometimes (linguistic relativity). A good translation attempts to make up for some of that through "compensation", though. This could explain why some characters reactions or quirks (*cough*Christophe*cough*) are more extreme in the English dub than they appear to be in the original. I for one found the humor funnier in English, and the touching moments, like the ring exchange, more touching in the dub.

・I get the sense, not just from this particular dub,  but from the dub vs. sub way of thinking of some fans have in general, that there is a severe misunderstanding about subtitles and their relation to translation and language. Also, that some people do not understand that what is being said, as in literal words being used, is not the same thing as what is being conveyed/what they meant by those words....

SUBTITLES =/= EXACTLY WHAT IS BEING SAID IN JAPANESE, BUT 'JUST IN ENGLISH'

Subtitles are not literal (hopefully) or "pure" translations. There are no such things as "pure" translations. Subtitles are not necessarily any closer to what is being said, or what is being conveyed in Japanese (or any source language for that matter) than dubbed scripts. Subtitles are not magic language decryption.

・For example, subtitles, like any translation, frequently make use of techniques called transposition and modulation when going from Japanese to English. Transposition is "a change of one part of speech for another (e.g. noun for verb) without changing the sense" {Introducing Translation Studies, Munday}. Modulation is a change "in the semantics and point of view of the [source language]". In many cases, when coming from a language so linguistically different from English as Japanese, using these techniques is basically mandatory if you want the resulting English to sound 'normal', or as we say in academia, unmarked. Combined with the concept of linguistic relativity, the moment you translate even quite simple sentences, phrases, or words from Japanese to English, you have irrevocably changed them. Theoretically speaking then, no matter if the subs or the dub say "My name is Meghan" or "I'm Meghan", they are both 'correct' translations, but entirely DIFFERENT THAN "メーガンです". 

 ・Subtitles often include adaptations of what is being said in Japanese on screen. This means that cultural references, in-jokes, and the like are changed to be relevant to English-speaking audiecnes. This is an instance where what is being conveyed outweighs what is literally being said in importance. That is, if the translator or script writer didn't change them, the joke or reference would be meaningless, and thus, pointless, supposing the necessary cultural information doesn't also exist outside of Japan.

In conclusion, I was very impressed with the Yuri!!! on ICE dub. I am definitely going to buy it on DVD. As a longtime fan of anime, I appreciate quality dubs, and can relate to fans who want to see dubbed episodes as soon as possible. I am also, unfortunately, familiar with how a poorly chosen cast can ruin a show--which obviously did not happen here. However, as a translator, I am now more aware of what goes into the translating and dubbing process, and I firmly believe that the dub crew gave it their all here. I also have the firsthand experience to say that, hell yes, being rushed sets you up to make mistakes, which seem to have happened in some places in the translation process of this series. However, as I said earlier, those errors did not affect the plot overall, or the characterization, or my understanding of the story, so I can still confidently give the dub a thumbs up.

See you next level!

[placetobenation]

With such a large history to play with, discovering the beauty of Bob Backlund’s charisma or the connection of Bruno Sammartino to the MSG crowd was a new development throughout this project similar to rewatching The Godfather and On the Waterfront to rediscover the genius of Marlon Brando. WWE may not have always been YOUR promotion but for the better part of 50 years, it was THE promotion in the United States and transformed the pro wrestling landscape. This project serves to praise the individuals that best helped shape the vision of Vince McMahon Sr. and Jr. Place to be Nation is proud to present to you a ranking of the Greatest WWE Wrestlers Ever.

– Chad Campbell

Note: Results of this list are based on 118 ballots received between May and December 2017. Voters were asked to submit their list of the 100 Greatest WWE Wrestlers of all time and consider only their WWWF/WWF/WWE career. Ties were broken based on 1) number of ballots a wrestler appeared on and 2) high vote. 

Every wrestler who received at least one vote will be recognized in the coming weeks. Please stay tuned to Place to Be Nation as we reveal all of the honorable mentions right through the cream of the crop. Read the other installments, both written and audio, of this project here.

39. Scott Hall Total Points: 6,149 Total Ballots: 112 Average Rank: 46.1 High Vote: 14 Low Vote: 94 High Voter: Andy Halleen

Nuance: Razor Ramon was with the WWF for four years, and his return as Scott Hall lasted only a few months, so his longevity is limited. He worked as both a heel and a babyface and was effective in both roles. He had limited tag team work, but did team with the 1-2-3 Kid on and off. Whatever the “It” factor is, Razor Ramon had it. The Bad Guy oozing machismo was cool, which was undeniable and something wrestlers generally either have or don’t.

Jump Up Moments: His upset loss to Kid was one of the biggest moments in the early years of Raw, and led to a nice story arc where he would feud with, team with and feud with Kid again. His biggest bouts were excellent ladder matches against Shawn Michaels at WrestleMania X and later SummerSlam 1995 over the IC Title. Ramon challenged Bret Hart for the WWF Title at Royal Rumble 1993 in a good match. He had a memorable feud with Goldust before leaving the company in 1996. Ramon was a four-time Intercontinental Champion.

Promos/Character: The Bad Guy was a fantastic character, colorful enough to fit in with the cartoon world of the early 90s WWF, but gritty enough and realistic enough to stand out. He was oozing machismo, dripping with gold (from his neck and often from the IC title) and a dead-eye shot when flicking his ever-present toothpick. Razor was introduced to WWF fans through a series of well-done vignettes, based on the Scarface character, where Ramon would talk encourage fans to “Look at me, mang” and see how he was about to take the WWF by storm. Razor was a good talker, but may have been hancuffed a bit by the gimmick when it comes to delivering his promos. Still, the character is one of the most memorable of its time (or any time really) and it’s impossible to picture anyone besides Scott Hall doing it effectively, even if the WWF tried that once.

Workrate: Razor was a good, solid worker, always capable of delivering a strong match. He was very athletic for a man of his size, threw good punches and had a cool, unique and effective finisher in the Razor’s Edge. Unless he was backdropped over the ropes trying to hit the move. Which happened every match, but we digress. Ramon could occasionally climb to higher heights as a worker, as he did in the two ladder matches with Michaels. He also had a tag team match teaming with Kid against Shawn Michaels and Diesel that was fantastic as well.

Staff Thoughts: The Bad Guy was one of the coolest characters the company ever did, mang! The vignettes, the gold chains, the toothpick, the accent, it was all very memorable, and undoubtedly led to countless eye injuries from errant toothhpick flips of fans trying to ooze machismo. His match with Kid on Raw was a great surprise moment and led to a cool story arc between the two characters. His ladder matches with Shawn are fantastic and were revolutionary at the time. We’ll just forget about the NWO run on his return, even though it did lead to a WrestleMania match with Steve Austin, shall we? You can hear JT and Aaron talk about the Bad Guy on this Making the Cut podcast.

From the Voters: “Memorable character who was good on the mic and in the ring. Threw the best punches in the history of the business. Ladder match with Shawn is an all timer. Liked his matches with Bret too at Royal Rumble and King of the Ring 93. Even his matches with Diesel were pretty good I thought. If not for personal issues he easily could’ve been World Champion, but still didn’t do too shabby as he was the IC Champ a lot. Only thing against him is longevity as his Razor run checked in at only a little under four years.” – Wade Ferrari, June 2, 2017

“Razor is someone that kept me interested during a down time in the WWF, he came in strong in late 92 and really had a great run through 1995 and pretty much owned the IC division his entire run. Worked well with Bret, Jarrett, all the Clique guys, and had some fun squash matches on those early Raws, probably a middle of the list guy for me.” – Sean Zern, June 9, 2017

“Razor seems like a good ‘short run’ candidate. He wasn’t around all that long, but I think he’s a very memorable character, I like him as a worker, he has some memorable moments (losing to Kid, ladder match), held the IC title 4 times when that meant something, and was very over once he turned babyface. I think he would have been accepted as world champ in 95. It’s a back end kind of resume, but I think he merits serious consideration.” – Andy Russell, July 19, 2017

38. Ultimate Warrior Total Points: 6,437 Total Ballots: 105 Average Rank: 39.7 High Vote: 8 Low Vote: 100 High Voter: Andy LaBar

Nuance: Ultimate Warrior and nuance go together like water and a grease fire. Warrior is pure, unbridled insanity. A man, no, myth from Parts Unknown who had one job – destroy in an Ultimate way, use his energy for great applause, to get in and out and be unbeatable. Warrior came in in 1987, and was gone in 1992, and the less we pretend to care about his 1996 run, the better. He was muscles, rope-shaking, and gorilla press slams. Warrior was a Rob Liefeld comic before such a thing existed, like no one before him nor after him. The problem is, when you create someone who is unbeatable, who is literally not of this world – you put yourself into a corner that is hard to come out of. His tag team runs were fun, if unmemorable.

Jump Up Moments: The Warrior lacked nuance because he was one jump-up moment after another. A candle that burned so bright, it went out entirely too quick. From the moment the guitar riffs of his music hit and Warrior ran out to the ring, shaking the ropes, spinning around, pointing at the sky, there are few things in wrestling more iconic from a imagery standpoint as that. He worked jobbers and squash matches for a year, before surprising the crowd at SummerSlam 88 by destroying the Honky Tonk Man and ending his lengthy IC title run. He wrestled Andre the Giant on SNME, Ted DiBiase in Tokyo, and he’s beaten Randy Savage, Rick Rude, Andre the Giant and Hulk Hogan as well. He BEAT Hogan in an excellent main event at WrestleMania VI, was given the ball to run with and blew it. Lastly, as morbid as it is – the way that Warrior died is as much myth as anything, and seems to be the only way this BEING could go out. Returning to the company after two decades, being inducted into the Hall of Fame, showing up at WrestleMania XXX, giving a promo at Raw and then dying the next day – intense and unreal – just like his life.

Promos/Character: “DIG YOUR CLAWS INTO MY ORGANS! STRETCH INTO MY TENDONS! BURY YOUR ANCHORS INTO MY BONES FOR THE POWER OF THE WARRIOR WILL ALWAYS PREVAIL!”

“NOW YOU MUST DEAL WITH THE CREATION OF ALL THE UNPLEASANTRIES IN THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE AS I FEEL THE INJECTION FROM THE GODS ABOVE!”

“I WAS SENT IN A CAPSULE FROM A PLACE NOT FROM HERE AND I CAME HERE FOR ONE REASON: TO ATTACK AND KEEP COMIN’. NOT TO ASK, BUT JUST TO GIVE. NOT TO WANT, BUT JUST TO SEND.”

“NORMAL PEOPLE, PEOPLE THAT WALK THE STREETS EVERY DAY, WE CANNOT UNDERSTAND!”

Come on!

Workrate: Say what you will about the Ultimate Warrior as a technical wrestler – he had almost nothing in that category, but due to this energy, the Warrior was one of the best big match wrestlers of his era. So while one would be hard pressed to point to little things here and there that make the Warrior great inside the ring, his matches that are highly thought of are amongst the best of the early 90s in WWF. He has legit four-star matches with Rick Rude, Randy Savage and one of the biggest Main Event feel wars of all time with Hulk Hogan. Watching Warrior is like reconfiguring your definition and notions of what “workrate” is. He obviously has stinkers, but to the idea that he is one of the worst of all time is unfounded – he has some of the most memorable matches in company history.

Staff Thoughts: Yeah, I’ve gushed here. And I’ll get this out of the way here, even as the high voter on Warrior – he was a real piece of crap human outside of the ring (and perhaps even inside), but as laid out in the “Andy and Chad talk the GWWE” podcast, Warrior is the purest distillation of 80s and 90s excess – a character that was unlike any that came before (or that capitalized on all those that tried), and one that will forever be impossible to do again. Warrior came at the perfect time, lasted the perfect amount of time and will go down as one of the most memorable wrestlers in the history of wrestling. The facepaint, the tassles, the music, the promos. There is no humanity within the Ultimate Warrior – he is escapism, pure and simple and that’s something we could stand to value a little bit more in wrestling. Oh, and the match with Savage at WrestleMania VII is STILL the best story the company has ever told.

From the Voters: “Ol Jim was a sack of shit. I love warrior. I think his best matches are among the best in wwf/e history. I love his promos, his look, nostalgia or not. To this day, I get excited when Warrior is on tv. It’s the ultimate unreality, the ultimate distillation of what wwf tried and tried and tried. I expect to be the high man on Warrior.” – Andy LaBarr, November 3, 2017

“To me a prime example of what the WWF was best at in the late 80s and early 90s which was creating larger than life characters. He will go down in the lure as one of the more colorful people in WWE history. To me that has to be in consideration, I feel the in ring hurts his cause to be more of a threat but still should be on the list.” – Danny Louis Kuchler, June 7, 2017

“He is a top performer worthy of this list. Sure, his amphetamine-inspired promos were difficult to decipher as a child. To his credit, he worked his tail off to get his character over, which is what the WWF during the Federation years demanded.His in-ring style against enhancement wrestlers were difficult to watch, but when it was time to shine on major shows, he hardly disappointed. He got over every time. I was never a mark for the Ultimate Warrior, but he will have a strong showing on my list.” – Jeffrey Thomas, June 7, 2017

37. Randy Orton Total Points: 6,548 Total Ballots: 105 Average Rank: 38.6 High Vote: 9 Low Vote: 98 High Voter: Brad Faulk

Nuance: Randy Orton’s been around forever, debuting with the company in 2002, so he’s definitely got the longevity box checked. He’s worked as both a babyface and a heel, primarily as singles worker, but with notable tag team runs with Edge and the Wyatt Family, as well as being in stables like Evolution, the Legacy and the Authority. If you could create a prototype for a pro wrestler it would look like Randy Orton, but whatever the extra “It” factor that connects a wrestler to the audience seems to be at worst missing, or at best inconsistent, from Orton.

Jump Up Moments: Orton had strong early heel work, from his RNN updates when he was returning from his shoulder injury to joining Evolution, becoming The Legend Killer and winning the IC title. His feud with Mick Foley was a definite hit and their match at Backlash 2004 might still be Orton’s best. He became the youngest World Champion ever, defeating Chris Benoit in a very good match at SummerSlam 2004. He moved to SmackDown and feuded with the Undertaker having memorable matches at WrestleMania 21 and SummerSlam 2005, before teaming with his father to defeat the Deadman in a handicap match and then lock him in a coffin and set it on fire. They would then battle at Armageddon 2005 in a Hell in a Cell match. In 2006, he joined with Edge to form Rated RKO, feuding with D-Generation X and captured the World Tag Team Championship. Orton had a good triple-threat match for the WWE title with Triple H and John Cena at WrestleMania XXIV. Feuded with the McMahon family, punting Vince and Shane and RKO’ing Stephanie and then won the 2009 Royal Rumble to set up a match with Triple H for the title. In 2011, Orton had a great series of matches with Christian feuding over the World Heavyweight Title with matches at Capitol Punishment, Over the Limit, Money in the Bank, SummerSlam and matches on SmackDown, including a steel cage match in August. He then feuded with Mark Henry during his hot 2011 run. Orton won the 2013 Money in the Bank briefcase, which he cashed in on Daniel Bryan after he won the WWE Title, joining the Authority and serving as the foil to Bryan until WrestleMania XXX. He then joined forces with Batista and Triple H to reform Evolution to face The Shield at Extreme Rules and Payback 2014. Orton is a former IC Champion, World Tag Team Champion, SmackDown Tag Team Champion, Money in the Bank winner, two-time Royal Rumble winner, four-time World Heavyweight Champion and nine-time WWE Champion.

Promos/Character: The Legend Killing Apex Predator Viper really lacks in this category. These days all promos are scripted, but it’s really more evident than when Orton gives his often wooden performances. And Orton’s character work is that he hears voices in his head and is pretty much a douche (as a face, as well as a heel). He’s always seemed like he’s just missing a little something, just a step away from getting it with his character, but not quite getting there. And if anyone’s ever had a dumber, douchier pose we can’t think of them.

Workrate: Orton’s got all the tools to be a very good worker, and when he puts it all together he’s capable of some really great matches. The RKO OUTTA NOWHERE is a great finisher, and he’s countered shooting star presses, springboard dives, curb stomps and other moves for memorable finishes and nearfalls. He has a lot of other crisp and impactful offensive moves, like his powerslam, his draping DDT and the punt. However, his offense generally works best when he’s a babyface, but his character works best as a heel. Still, his resume of good to great matches is long and distinguished. His Backlash match with Foley in 2004 is great and the Evolution vs. Rock nN Sock at WrestleMania XX is a fun match too. Check out any of his 2011 matches with Christian, as that series is all great. He provided a good corporate heel foil for B+ Player Daniel Bryan to conquer on this road to WrestleMania XXX, and they had good matches along the way. The Shield vs. Evolution matches are great as well. While Orton’s highs are tremendously high, it should be noted he goes through lengthy periods where he seems to mail it in, and can also be guilty of dreck like his WrestleMania and House of Horrors matches with Bray Wyatt.

Staff Thoughts: It’s hard to imagine many wrestlers with more of a mixed bag than Orton. He’s got a lot of good to great stuff, some really bad stuff and A WHOLE LOTTA “just there” periods where he’s doing nothing interesting. His promos and character trend from awful to acceptable, and his Legend Killer and RNN updates were entertaining and may have been his promo highlights. Still, his resume is stellar and he has a lot of good to great matches and he’s just so ingrained into the WWE it’s impossible to imagine the company without him.

From the Voters: “I’m not his biggest fan, but it’s hard to ignore how important he has been to the company for the past 15 years. He is Cena #2. He’s in my upper tier, but the back half of that.” – Jason Sherman, June 2, 2017

“He is probably going to be in my Top 30. He was my favorite guy on the roster outside of HBK from 2007-2010. He’s always done great character work. I feel like he could have been higher if he didn’t have periods of time where he didn’t appear to be trying.” – Mike Eller, June 2, 2017

“I loved his early heel run, got bored with him during Rated RKO, got back into him in 07, then the HHH feud really killed it for me until that series with Christian which were incredible, so there is lot to weigh in on, he will be ranked but there is some rewatching that I have to do.” – Sean Zern, June 2, 2017

36. Goldust Total Points: 6,563 Total Ballots: 115 Average Rank: 43.9 High Vote: 10 Low Vote: 92 High Voter: Nikolaj; Good Ol’ Will From Texas

Nuance: Goldust has been with the company about 15 years, having been in and out of the company since 1996. He also appeared with his father Dusty Rhodes to take on Ted Dibiase and Virgil at Royal Rumble 1991. He’s been both a face and a heel and a singles as well as notable tag teams with Cody Rhodes and Booker T. Goldust is a master of little character touches and evolutions that makes him stand the test of time.

Jump Up Moments: Goldust had a memorable feud with Razor Ramon in 1995-96 due to his unwanted advances toward the Bad Guy. Razor ‘s suspension killed the feud abruptly and resulted in Roddy Piper subbing for him in the Backlot Brawl at WrestleMania XII, which was memorable and a decent brawl before nonsense took over. As a face he warred with Hunter Hearst-Helmsley and then had a really memorable feud with Brian Pillman following teaming with Steve Austin, Ken Shamrock and the Legion of Doom against the Hart Foundation in the all time classic main event of Canadian Stampede. Goldust later formed a fun team with Booker T and feuded with the UnAmericans winning the Tag Team Titles. His tag team run with half-brother Cody in 2013 was great and featured terrific matches against The Shield at Battleground 2013 and on Raw to win the tag titles. Goldust is a nine-time Hardcore Champion, a three-time IC Champion, a World Tag Team Champion and two-time WWE Tag Team Champion.

Promos/Character: The Goldust character was edgy and revolutionary when it debuted in 1995, as a movie quoting eccentric with a crush on Razor Ramon. That was quickly established to have been just playing mind games in order to avert any heat that may come their way for negative portrayal of a gay character. He would continue to be a face painting weirdo for most of the next two decades, which shouldn’t work, but Goldust made it happen. There had been effeminate characters in wrestling before, which were usually cheap heat magnets, but that wasn’t Goldust, he always had more depth. From his early vignettes quoting movies to his comedy work in his tag team with Booker, Goldust was always evolving. By the time he was teaming with Cody, the character was really more like “The Natural” Dustin Rhodes in the not so natural facepaint and ring attire of Goldust. This groundbreaking character work and evolution is a big part of what lands Goldust on this list.

Workrate: Goldust has some stellar work with his tag team with Cody and the matches from late 2013 are really great. He had a very good match with Randy Orton on Raw during the same timeframe. He’s enjoyed a late career renaissance that’s led to him having very good TV matches in recent years and being a consistently great worker and ring general. The early Goldust years featured a lot of stalling and “mind games” as he was transitioning from working as Dustin Rhodes to working as Goldust.

Staff Thoughts: One of the more revolutionary, edgy and certainly memorable characters in company history. He’s done great work as a weirdo character, as a comedy character and as a serious character, all as different shades of the Goldust character. He’s been a consistently entertaining part of the company for nearly 20 years, and can be counted on to deliver good matches whenever he’s called upon. You can hear JT and Aaron discuss him on Making the Cut and hear Good Ol’ Will profess his undying love on FYC for …deep inhale…Goldust… CHOMP.

From the Voters: “Listed probably somewhere in the 30s. A controversial adult-y character in still kid friendly 95 WWF. Had great feuds with Razor, Piper, and HHH. Reinvented himself with TAFKAG and the weird ass gear. Did it again tagging with Booker T and yet again with his brother.” – Dennis Nunez, May 29, 2017

“I’m surprised to see people giving him a pass for some of the awful boring matches he had in 96, but that said — I love this dude. The definition of buying into a character and making it work. He’ll be nowhere in the vicinity of my top 10, but I can see him being a top 50 guy on the basis of his work post-2002 and his overall character and promo work. A truly great pro wrestler.” – Greg Phillips, June 1, 2017

“Ok, he was assured a Top 20 spot for being possibly the greatest offensive wrestler ever in the fed, having a great singles feud with Val Venis, 2 legit great tag teams with multiple great matches, multiple runs in different eras constantly remaining over and even being a smart comedy figure. Been watching the Booker/Goldust tag stuff and they were pretty great. Raised Booker and Dustin on my list. Going through his New Generation stuff now.” – Good Ol’ Will from Texas, May 30, 2017

35. AJ Styles Total Points: 6,643 Total Ballots: 108 Average Rank: 39.5 High Vote: 9 Low Vote: 97 High Voter: Taylor Keahey

Nuance: Longevity is the knock on AJ Styles as he’s only had two years with the company. During this time he’s played both a babyface and a heel and has been effective in both roles. He’s been primarily a singles star, but had a brief tag team run with Chris Jericho. AJ Styles carries himself like a star and felt like a huge deal from the moment he debuted.

Jump Up Moments: The Phenomenal One debuted at the 2016 Royal Rumble to a huge pop, with the fans telling WWE they already thought this guy was a star. He went on to prove them right. After starting slow with a program with Chris Jericho lasting through WrestleMania 32, he went on a run of great matches to rival anyone in company history. AJ challenged Roman Reigns for his WWE World Title at Payback and Extreme Rules 2016 in awesome matches. He then attacked a returning John Cena, setting their feud up, defeating him at Money in the Bank and SummerSlam in many people’s 2016 WWE match of the year and one of the best SummerSlam matches ever. AJ then defeated Dean Ambrose for the WWE World title at Backlash, and successfully defended it against Ambrose and Cena at No Mercy in another stellar match. Styles first title reign came to an end when he lost to John Cena at Royal Rumble 2017 in another match of the year contender. At WrestleMania 33 he defeated Shane McMahon in a better than expected bout that he completely carried. He then had a good feud with Kevin Owens winning the US Championship twice in the process. At TLC 2017, he was a last-minute replacement for Bray Wyatt and had a good match against Finn Balor. Styles won his second WWE Championship by defeating Jinder Mahal on an episode of SmackDown in November in Manchester, England, becoming the first recognized World Champion crowned outside of North America. This was the first time a world title changed hands on SmackDown since 2003. He then challenged Brock Lesnar in a champion vs. champion match at Survivor Series that was great, before retaining his title against Mahal at Clash of Champions at the end of the voting period. Styles is a two-time WWE Champion and a two-time United States Champion.

Promos/Character: The “Face That Runs the Place” has played a compelling character as both a face and a heel during his short time with the company. Unlike so many stars of the day, the fans have been invested in Styles his entire run, always caring about whatever he’s doing. He has cut good promos since coming to the WWE, something that was a weakness at times prior to his arrival.

Workrate: AJ Styles’ in-ring work is sensational, incredible, terrific, unbelievable and yes, phenomenal. During his short period of time, he’s had a string of classic matches that wrestlers who spent more than a decade in WWE can’t touch. His feud with Reigns produced great bouts. His feud with Cena produced multiple MOTYC across two years and those matches are on the short list of best matches ever on both SummerSlam and the Royal Rumble. His match against Lesnar at Survivor Series was great and the match against Mahal at Clash is probably Mahal’s best match ever. Styles has done all this while having almost no down periods or bad matches.

Staff Thoughts: Your mileage on AJ Styles likely depends on how you value output compared to longevity. Yes, he’s only been with the company for two years, but during that time he has made his case with meaningful feuds and classic matches, nearly all being near the main event level. If you just look at the matches and moments he’s had, they rival plenty of wrestlers with a far longer tenure. You can see AJ gaining momentum with voters in the Facebook comments, as the initial talk was his rookie year with the company might earn him a spot low on the list. But as he just kept producing, more and more voters shot him up the rankings, as he likely benefited more than anyone else for his work during the voting period. Styles was the highlight of nearly every show he was on, and it’s hard to imagine WWE without him during the past two years. You can hear the guys talk about the Phenomenal One on this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “Think he’s light years ahead of any other guy who has started in the most recent era apart from perhaps Reigns (and I still think he’s comfortably ahead of him). He will make my top 50. Probably not top 25. His run is short but the body of work is still there as he’s in a work heavy era. Amount of shows & PPVs means he’s probably had as many televised matches as guys from bygone eras who had 5-8 year careers. He currently has only 1 PPV appearence less than Warrior and 1 more than Piper, for example.” – James Derbyshire, July 12, 2017

“By the time this list is submitted and compiled we’ll likely be looking at 2 full years of AJ as a WWE performer. Guys like Rick Rude are getting merit and he only had three years is look over. So yeah, AJ is going on the list. He might not have a huge body of work to be in the top 30, but he’s kinda my 50 right now with room to move up.” – David Mann, July 12, 2017

“Since the Jericho feud, one could argue he hasn’t had any ppv singles matches that clocked in below 4 stars. He was main eventing by his fourth ppv, pinning Cena clean his 6th month in, won the WWE title on his 8th month with the company, and then had the best straight run of ppv matches since maybe Triple H in 2000. He’s killing it, and by December, he’ll be 2 years in. Some would argue he was in WWE’s best match in 2016, and right now, he’s probably half of the leading candidates (with the same opponent) in 2017. If he left tomorrow, he would be remembered for years, and at this moment, I think he’s already had more ppv main events than Daniel Bryan did. Like Steve Williams said, longevity is his enemy, so while I’d argue he’s not top 30 or 40, I’d also argue he definitely has a place on the list.” – James Proffitt, May 31, 2017

34. Christian Total Points: 6,646 Total Ballots: 112 Average Rank: 41.7 High Vote: 8 Low Vote: 95 High Voter: David Carli

Nuance: Christian had a seven year run with the company from 1998 to 2005, and another four years upon his return in 2009, giving him more than a decade on his resume, so he checks the box for longevity. He played both a face and a heel, and had singles runs as well as notable tag teams with Edge, Chris Jericho and Lance Storm. Christian had a number of intangibles from acting ability to facial expressions that ensured he always got over with the fans in a way that often exceeded his push.

Jump Up Moments: Christian won the Light Heavyweight Title in his debut match and joined forces with Edge and Gangrel as the Brood. He really took off when he formed his tag team with “brother” Edge, having a great three-way feud with the Hardy Boyz and Dudley Boyz that featured legendary classic ladder and TLC matches at No Mercy 1999, WrestleMania 2000, SummerSlam 2000 and WrestleMania X7. The team with Edge also gave us great backstage comedy segments with Kurt Angle and Mick Foley and in-ring poses “for the benefit of those with flash photography.” He feuded with Edge over the Intercontinental Title when the team split, trading the title back and forth. Christian would later form the UnAmericans stable with Lance Storm and Test, winning the WWE Tag Team Titles while feuding with Booker T and Goldust. Christian then formed a tag team with Chris Jericho that competed in a very good four-team TLC match on Raw and later won the WWE Tag Team Titles. He would then bet Jericho $1 (Canadian) that he could win the affections of Lita before Jericho could win the hand of Trish Stratus. The angle saw great character work from all involved and culminated in a very good match at WrestleMania XX between the two former friends where Trish morphed into Hot Evil Trish and joined Christian. He competed in the first Money in the Bank ladder match at WrestleMania 21, before beginning a feud with John Cena claiming Cena was a poser and that Christian was a better rapper. The two had a triple-threat match along with Jericho for Cena’s WWE title at Vengeance 2005. Christian then left the company until 2009, winning the ECW title quickly upon his return. He was the veteran steadying force on ECW having good-to-great matches with Jack Swagger, Yoshi Tatsu, Tommy Dreamer, Zack Ryder, William Regal, Shelton Benjamin and others on a weekly basis through 2009, before finally losing the title on the last episode of ECW. Christian won the World Heavyweight Championship from Alberto Del Rio at Extreme Rules 2011 and embarked on a classic feud with Randy Orton over the belt. The two had outstanding matches over the title through August. Christian would feud with Del Rio over the World Title again in 2013 and the two had a very tremendous match at the loaded SummerSlam 2013 card. He would also turn in a solid performance at the Elimination Chamber match in 2014. Christian is a former Light Heavyweight Champion, Hardcore Champion and European Champion, a four-time IC Champion, nine time Tag Team Champion, two-time ECW Champion and two-time World Champion.

Promos/Character: CHRISTIAN! CHRISTIAN! AT LAST HE’S ON HIS OWN! And despite the very good character work he did with Edge, when he was on his own he really got to show his character and promo chops (and that badass rock opera theme song). Captain Charisma was such a good talker that he was given his own interview segment “The Peep Show” to speak to all his fans. He was able to tweak and evolve his character over time, being able to play comedy better than almost anyone on the roster, but still be considered a serious challenger for mid-card titles and eventually the World Title. The character work during the angle with Jericho, Trish and Lita was top-notch from all involved and Christian more than held his own, earning his $1 Canadian. He made the feud with Cena into something legit with his promos, getting cheered in the process, and getting himself over, likely more than the company ever intended.

Workrate: Captain Charisma had good to great matches up and down the card throughout his entire WWE career. The ladder and TLC matches he had when he teamed with Edge are great trainwreck wars. His feud with Jericho and their match at WrestleMania XX is a bit of a hidden gem, often overlooked. He did great work in the mid-card for the IC title and in the tag division in 2002-2005 before the brief feud with Cena and his departure. When he returned he carried anyone with two legs to very good matches during his run with ECW. Then some of the best matches of his career (and likely Orton’s) came in 2011 at Over the Limit, Capitol Punishment, SummerSlam and a cage match on the 8/30 episode of SmackDown. He also had a very great match with Del Rio at SummerSlam 2013 that gets lost on that all time card. Christian had very good matches week in and week out and was known for being an elite TV worker. The only weakness in his game came when he started using the spear as his finisher as a tribute to Edge, despite it looking silly for a man his size to do and it kept him from using the much cooler Unprettier/KillSwitch to close out matches.

Staff Thoughts: Damn, Christian has a lot of great stuff on his resume. And the only blemish we can find is that Steve Austin was leaving Christian a voicemail when he came up with the “What?” nonsense that plagues us to this day. But we won’t hold that against Captain Charisma. He could do it all from talking and character work to bringing the goods in tags, mid-card and main event feuds. The voters have spoken and clearly they are among the Peeps that Christian catered to during his long and distinguished WWF/E career. To hear what Aaron George and Ben Morse had to say about Christian check out this podblast.

From the Voters: “I don’t know about top 15 but I would be surprised if Christian is out of my top 25. The guy has a lot of quality stuff and ranks high on most of the NJPW structure. I think he also has some real memorable feuds given his placement on the card. Like the Jericho vs Christian stuff was only around 3rd most important thing on just Raw in 2004 and it is still really memorable stuff.” – Chad Campbell, May 28, 2017

“The back half of his run is really good when he came back. The feud with him and Randy Orton was huge part of Smackdown in the Summer of 2011. Also i enjoyed his runs as ECW Champion after his return. Can’t leave out his first run of course with Edge as Tag Champs and feud with Chris Jericho in 2004. Going back and watching some of early 2004 on The Network that feud was a huge part of RAW before and Post WM 20. Check out the Cage Match they had on May 10th if nobody has seen it in a while, its very good.” – Jay Hinchey, May 28, 2017

“The man had good to great matches on a weekly basis during his run as ECW Champion, including matches with people like Yoshi Tatsu, Zack Ryder, Tommy Dreamer, and Shelton Benjamin that are highlights of their respective careers. After years of WWE searching for a veteran presence who could provide stability to the ECW brand, Christian held it down. Later he got good matches out of the likes of Brodus Clay, Alberto Del Rio, and Randy Orton, a cumulative achievement that might as well make him a miracle worker. And that’s not even considering his tag run.” – Glenn W. Butler, May 28, 2017

33. Sgt. Slaughter Total Points: 6,784 Total Ballots: 109 Average Rank: 38.8 High Vote: 10 Low Vote: 94 High Voter: Kelly Nelson; Kevin E. Pittack

Nuance: Sgt. Slaughter had about a six-year tenure with the WWF as an active competitor over three runs from 1980 to 1992. He showed the ability to play both a babyface and a heel on multiple occasions and was over with the fans regardless of his role. He worked primarily as a singles wrestler but was able to work tags when asked.

Jump Up Moments: Sarge entered the company as a hated heel, immediately becoming one of the top challengers for Bob Backlund in 1980-81, with the two having a series of great matches. Slaughter was one of the only stars of the day that Backlund didn’t defeated at MSG during this run. He then went on to feud with Pat Patterson after calling him “yellow” and doubling the payout if Patterson could break his cobra clutch. When Patterson accepted and was breaking the hold, Sarge released it and beat down Patterson, resulting in a hot feud and the famous Alley Fight at MSG on April 21, 1981, which is a fantastic match. Slaughter returned to the company in 1983, beating Backlund with his riding crop to reignite their feud, and the two had another series of very good matches. In 1984, Sarge turned babyface to defend America’s honor from no-good foreign heel the Iron Sheik. The two had an incredibly intense bloody feud, culminating in the famous Boot Camp match at MSG that’s must-see for any wrestling fan. Slaughter would return to the WWF in the fall of 1990 as an Iraqi sympathizer and win the WWF World title from the Ultimate Warrior at the 1991 Royal Rumble. He would lose the title to Hulk Hogan at the main event of WrestleMania VII in a really good match. Slaughter would lose a three-on-two handicap match to Hogan and Ultimate Warrior at SummerSlam 1991 before turning babyface until retiring from active competition in 1992. He would be named commissioner in 1997 and feud with D-Generation X having a Boot Camp match with Triple H at the D-Generation X PPV.

Promos/Character:Listen here, maggots, Sarge could get his point across in any promo he wanted to, as a heel or face. During his initial heel run he was paired with the Grand Wizard, but still did plenty of his own talking, including calling Patterson yellow to kick off their feud with the cobra clutch challenge. After his face turn he was able to bang the drum and wave the flag for the ol’ US of A adding even more heat to the Iron Sheik feud. Slaughter claims he was never comfortable with the Iraqi sympathizer angle (and many feel it was a bit in poor taste) but he added fuel to the fire calling US troops soft and claiming he supported Iraq because they were violent and he liked violence. The angle was effective getting heel heat for Slaughter and he took to wearing a bulletproof vest when he went out in public. The drill sergeant character resonated and made a good natural heel before being easily transitioned into a patriotic babyface. The character worked so well, it landed Sarge a spot as a G.I. Joe character, having his own action figure and appearing in their cartoon and animated movies.

Workrate: Sarge was an incredible worker during his 1980s stints, with the Alley Fight with Patterson and the Boot Camp match with the Iron Sheik being among the best WWF matches of the decade. Slaughter brought an intensity and violence to these brawls that’s second to none. He also had very good matches with Backlund in both 1981 and 1983, bringing the intensity to all their matches as well. Even in 1991, he was able to have good matches with Hulk Hogan and Ultimate Warrior at a time when that wasn’t always the case. Regardless of his opponent or the time of his run, Slaughter was a top-notch worker, and anytime he stepped through the ropes you knew he was going to deliver.

Staff Thoughts: Slaughter was a revelation for many voters, according to Facebook posts, and that alone makes this project as success, because Sarge is fucking awesome. The cobra clutch challenge! The Alley Fight with Patterson! The Boot Camp Match! Beating Backlund to within an inch of his life with a riding crop! It was all awesome. Add in the late career Iraqi sympathizer angle and title run and Sarge was an easy addition to the top portion of the list. You can hear the guys talk more about Slaughter in this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “The Backlund/Slaughter series at the Spectrum in I think 83 were really good. Slaughter makes my list, it’s just a matter of where. The boot camp match with Iron Sheik is one of my favorite matches.” – Matt Souza, June 2, 2017

“Sarge is very likely going to be top 20, and may even crack the top 10. Insanely entertaining in all his forms.” – Kevin E. Pittack, December 10, 2017

“Some awesome wars with Pat, Sheik and Hogan at the Garden.His 90-91 heel run was very risky with what was going on in the world, but was the perfect guy for the role.” – Jason Greenhouse, June 3, 2017

32. Jeff Hardy Total Points: 6,879 Total Ballots: 112 Average Rank: 39.6 High Vote: 13 Low Vote: 99 High Voter: Henry Rivers

Nuance: Jeff Hardy has put in nearly a decade over three separate runs, with the latest his current run, and he also sporadically appeared as a jobber for the company prior to 1998. Other than a brief stint as the New Brood, he’s never worked heel, spending his WWF/E career as popular babyface. He’s had a successful singles run in the mid-card and main event and is one half of one of the greatest tag teams in company history with his brother Matt.

Jump Up Moments: The Hardy Boyz team had great matches with Edge & Christian in a ladder match at No Mercy 1999 to burst onto the scene. They would then have an extended three-way feud with the Dudley Boyz and Edge & Christian, tearing the house down in ladder and TLC matches at WrestleMania 2000, SummerSlam 2000 and WrestleMania X7. Jeff stood out as the star of those matches with his daredevil aerial moves off the ladders. In 2001, Jeff received his first singles success, winning the Intercontinental title from Triple H, as well as the Light Heavyweight and Hardcore Title throughout the year. Hardy would make the Hardcore Title matter again with his matches against Rob Van Dam and the Undertaker during this timeframe. In 2002, Jeff challenged the Undertaker for the Undisputed title in a ladder match on Raw in a very good match. Upon his return from a four-year absence from WWE, Jeff defeated Johnny Nitro for the IC title and the two traded the belt back and forth while Hardy reunited the tag team with his brother. They competed in a four-way ladder match at Armageddon 2006 in the match where Joey Mercury took a ladder off the face, igniting their feud with MNM. Their matches with MNM at Royal Rumble and No Way Out 2007 are some of the best non-gimmick tag matches put on by the WWE. Hardy competed in the Money in the Bank ladder match at WrestleMania 23 driving himself and Edge through a ladder in another daring aerial maneuver. Jeff began a feud with Umaga over the IC title winning it for a fourth time and starting his push toward the main event. He would team with and challenge Triple H during the last part of 2007, with Hardy winning a match to become number one contender at Armageddon 2007. He hit Randy Orton with a Swanton Bomb from the top of the Raw set in anticipation of their match at Royal Rumble 2008. Hardy was drafted to SmackDown in summer 2008 and was a regular challenger for the WWE Championship. He was scheduled to be in the title match at Survivor Series 2008, before being “attacked in his hotel” and being removed from the match. He would win the WWE Championship from Edge in a three-way also involving Triple H at Armageddon 2008. He would lose the title the next month when brother Matt turned on him, igniting their feud from WrestleMania to Backlash. Jeff then won the World Heavyweight title from Edge in a ladder match at Extreme Rules, but CM Punk cashed in his Money in the Bank briefcase and starting a great feud. Hardy and Punk had a series of very good matches at The Bash, Night of Champions, SummerSlam and the August 28, 2009 episode of SmackDown, which saw Hardy lose a cage match resulting in him leaving the WWE. He returned with Matt at WrestleMania 33, winning the Raw Tag Team titles and the two have had good matches with The Bar. Jeff is a six-time WWF/World Tag Team Champion, a  WCW Tag Team Champion, Raw Tag Team Champion, Light Heavyweight Champion, European Champion, three-time Hardcore Champion, four-time IC Champion, WWE Champion and two-time World Champion.

Promos/Character: The Charismatic Enigma can’t cut a promo. Let’s be honest here, he may have shown improvement, but it was going from possibly the worst promo by someone who speaks a language similar to English to merely bad. His painted face era talking about E-MADGE-EYE-NATION or whatever it was left quite a few of us wondering if he was mid hallucination or we were. Still, despite that, the character was OVER. Fuck was he over. And he did have a unique character of, let’s say artistic free spirit, which matches nicely with his daredevil ring work. From Team Xtreme to the World Champion, he was always unique and you could always hear the little girls squeal whenever he took his shirt off, for whatever that’s worth.

Workrate: It was a mixed bag for Jeff as at his worst he could be sloppy and reckless and at times his matches lacked direction. Oh, but at his best he was great. He always worked the high flying reckless style and it served him well in ladder matches and TLCs of the day. But he refined his style to keep all the highspot hits while having very good match structure around them with Triple H, Edge and Punk. Add that to the tag team resume that includes the triangle ladders and TLCs and MNM feud, as well as his mid-card matches with RVD and Umaga and you’ve got a really impressive body of work.

Staff Thoughts: Good Ol’ JR might say Jeff’s goofier than a pet coon, but that uniqueness certainly resonated with a portion of the audience. Even the fans that didn’t wear cut-up pantyhose on their arms appreciated Jeff for risking his life by jumping off the highest thing he could find for our entertainment. He was also a master of generating sympathy from the crowd through his selling (and possibly legitimately nearly dying many matches as well). His athleticism was undeniable and his matches were always exciting. He built a helluva resume of good to great matches in the singles and tag ranks and connected as a character by overcoming his struggles and flaws to grab the proverbial brass ring. All of that lands the Charismatic Enigma in a prominent spot on our list.

From the Voters: “Top 100 for sure just don’t know where exactly. Very unique individual and very over whether it be with one of the greatest teams of all time with Matt or by himself as the WWE champion. A daredevil, he stole the show in the TLC matches and had two great Monday night Raw matches one against the Undertaker in a ladder match and another against HHH both I believe were around 2002 2003.” – Eric Boyd, May 30, 2017

“A legit draw on top with two distinct runs with the company. And now starting a third. His ’08-’09 saw the culmination of his World title quest and he finished strong with the Punk feud. Has serious tag AND singles credentials here too.” – Brad Warren, May 30, 2017

“Possibly top 50. While he was never as versatile or as good a character as his brother, he was undoubtedly the bigger star and could connect with the crowd like few others could. At his peak, he was rivaling John Cena in terms of star power and merchandise selling. And as short-lived as his main event run was (primarily due to his own demons), his ascent to the WWE Championship and feud with Punk were top-notch stories. Not to mention he is arguably the king of the “car crash” spottiest.” – Greg Rossbach, July 7, 2017

31. Batista Total Points: 6,977 Total Ballots: 112 Average Rank: 38.7 High Vote: 11 Low Vote: 98 High Voter: Sean

Nuance: Batista had an eight-year run with the company after his debut and had another run in 2013-14, mainly feuding with Daniel Bryan and the Shield. Batista has played a babyface and a heel and been effective in both roles. He’s been largely a singles wrestler, but had notable tag teams with Ric Flair and Rey Mysterio, so he has shown flexibility. Batista was a master of facial expressions and body language, which was a critical component to him breaking out as a star from Evolution. He’s always carried himself as a star.

Jump Up Moments: After spending a brief period of time as the Deacon to Reverend D-Von, Batista joined Evolution, winning the World Tag Team Titles with Ric Flair. The WrestleMania XX match with Evolution against the Rock ‘N’ Sock Connection is a sneaky fun match. Batista began showing more character, often rolling his eyes in the background while Triple H cut promos on behalf of Evolution. The Animal then won the 2005 Royal Rumble and decided to challenge Triple H for his World Heavyweight Championship, winning the gold at WrestleMania 21. He continued feuding with Triple H, culminating with a great Hell in a Cell match at Vengeance 2005 and becoming the first person to pin The Game inside the Cell. He teamed with Rey Mysterio winning the WWE Tag Team Titles in a good feud with MNM. Batista had a very good match with Undertaker at WrestleMania 23, and the two continued feuding through much of 2007. He faced Umaga at WrestleMania XXIV and then feuded with Shawn Michaels after HBK retired Ric Flair. Batista won the World Tag Team Titles with John Cena to further their feud, which culminated in a really good match at SummerSlam 2008. In 2009, Batista teamed with Rey Mysterio to unsuccessfully challenge JeriShow for the Unified Tag Team titles, and later turned on Mysterio after a Fatal Four-Way for the World Heavyweight Title. Batista destroyed Rey, which led to a feud throughout 2009. Batista renewed his feud with Cena in 2010, with good matches at WrestleMania XXVI, Extreme Rules and Over the Limit. Batista returned to the company in 2014 winning the Royal Rumble. He would go on to lose his shot at the WWE World Championship in an exciting three-way match with Daniel Bryan and Randy Orton at WrestleMania XXX. He eventually joined forces with Orton and Triple H reforming Evolution and having great six-man tag matches against The Shield at Extreme Rules and Payback 2014. Batista is a former WWE Tag Team Champion, three-time World Tag Team Champion, two-time WWE Champion and four-time World Heavyweight Champion.

Promos/Character: Batista has always done great character work, getting over by conveying he didn’t buy what Triple H was selling in Evolution through his facial expressions while standing in the background. One of his most iconic moments is giving Triple H and Flair the thumbs down before signing his contract to challenge Triple H at WrestleMania 21. And his turn on Rey yelling “You were supposed to be my friend!” is one of the best turns of recent memory. Batista always came off as a natural and it’s no coincidence he has found success in Hollywood post-WWE, as he was one of the best actors in the company. His promos were always believable, usually as a cool guy in contrast to the screaming manic style of others. He played a believable douchebag heel in his feud against Cena, and he deserves credit for recognizing a negative fan reaction in 2014, and embracing it by becoming an effective heel.

Workrate: Batista was hit or miss in the ring depending on whether he had chemistry with his opponent. When he does, The Animal can have classics and he provides good power offense. His HIAC match with Triple H in 2005 is great, and he always had good battles with the Undertaker, particularly their WrestleMania 23 match. His run with Cena in 2009-10 had lot of very good matches. The six-man tags against The Shield in 2014 were great as well.

Staff Thoughts: Batista has a sneaky good resume, providing excellent character work during his entire run, more very good main events than you might expect and almost no bad stuff. He’s one of the best actors in the company and he behaves like you’d expect a normal human to behave, rather than ranting and raving like a lunatic. But when he has a reason, he can come unhinged, like when he turned on Mysterio. His matches with Taker and Cena are top-level main events and his latest return saw him doing solid heel work to put over Daniel Bryan and then join with Evolution to have a very good feud with The Shield. He always came across like a big star and carried himself like a big deal. You can hear what the guys had to say about Batista on this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “I thought he still turned into a huge star, and he kind of walked away at a time when he was having his hottest run in the company. He still had a great 5 year run, and i thought he had a fun run his last time back. I’m thinking he’s going to be a top 20-25 guy for me.” – Sean Zern, May 28, 2017

“I could end up having him very high. I hated Evolution too, but he was the best guy in it. Got over huge in 05 and actually drew big and had very good matches with boring, top of the card failure, HHH. Loved his tag stuff. Undertaker match at Mania is outstanding. Farewell feud with Cena was incredible. Comeback was excellent. Turned into a tremendous promo over time. Was over as a face, but was excellent as a heel. He lacks the longevity and blowaway impact I want out of a top tier guy, but I could easily see myself rating him ahead of some major names. Might make my top 25.” – Dylan Hales, June 7, 2017

“He was around a lot longer than it seems, and I was starting to weigh up his good and bad periods but like, what are the bad periods? 2006. MAYBE 2009 before he went to SD. But like the rest…he was good in Evolution. Good in 2005 breaking out. Good in 2007. Good in 2008 before the injury. Good in 2009/10 as a heel. And even in 2014 he was fine once he turned heel. He feels like a hot and cold candidate but really, he was good for a lot longer than he wasn’t.” – Stacey O’Loughlin, June 7, 2017

30. Greg Valentine Total Points: 7,085 Total Ballots: 105 Average Rank: 33.7 High Vote: 3 Low Vote: 93 High Voter: Pete Schirmacher

Nuance: Greg Valentine had about a decade run with the company, appearing first in late 1978, and having a long uninterrupted stretch from 1984 to 1992. He was also one of Shawn Michaels’ Knights at Survivor Series 1993 and appeared in the 1994 Royal Rumble. The Hammer aplayed a heel for the bulk of his career, but had a babyface run from late 1990 to the 1992 Royal Rumble. He was a singles star with a successful tag team run with Brutus Beefcake and another tag team run with Honky Tonk Man.

Jump Up Moments: Valentine came to the WWF in late 1978 and would soon break Chief Jay Strongbow’s leg, giving him the aura of a badass with no remorse. He was managed by the Grand Wizard during this time and would face Bob Backlund for the WWF Championship in a great one-hour draw at Madison Square Garden in February 1979. The Hammer returned in 1981, again challenging Backlund, with the title being held up when a dazed referee accidentally handed Valentine the belt. He would face Backlund in a great steel cage match at the Philadelphia Spectrum in February 1982, before moving on to feuding with Pedro Morales over the Intercontinental title, injuring him by suplexing him on the floor. Valentine left the company until 1984 when he returned for good, winning the IC title from Tito Santana on September 24, 1984. Valentine then put Santana in the figure-four leglock, further injuring the leg Valentine worked all match and igniting the red-hot feud between the two. Valentine defended the IC title against the Junkyard Dog at the first WrestleMania, losing by countout when he took a walk. Hammer then resumed his classic feud with Santana in many very good matches culminating in the classic cage bout where Santana regained the IC title on July 6, 1985 in Baltimore. Valentine was enraged and destroyed the belt after losing his IC title after a 285-day reign. Valentine then formed The Dream Team with Brutus Beefcake and won the WWF Tag Team Championship from the US Express on August 24, 1985. The Dream Team would have excellent matches with The British Bulldogs, Santana and Ricky Steamboat (4/21/85, Toronto Maple Leaf Gardens) and the Killer Bees, before losing the titles to the Bulldogs in a classic match at WrestleMania 2. The Dream Team may still be suffering from the effects of the Nightmare at the Rosemont Horizon, if Gorilla Monsoon is to be believed, but they did challenge the Bulldogs for the titles in a series of cage matches during the summer of 1986. The Dream Team then moved on to feuding with the Fabulous Rougeaus, culminating in a win at WrestleMania III that saw Beefcake turfed from the team. Valentine did his best to carry Dino Bravo in the New Dream Team, but the Hammer is only a mortal man, and some people can’t be carried. In 1988, Valentine began a feud with Don Muraco that included putting his manager Superstar Billy Graham in the figure four leglock, despite Graham having an artificial hip and walking with a cane, but the feud was dropped when Muraco was fired. Hammer then went on to feud with Ronnie Garvin, defeating him in a retirement match, but asking he be reinstated after Garvin insulted Valentine as ring announcer at SummerSlam 1989. The feud continued until Garvin won a very good submission match at the 1990 Royal Rumble, countering Valentine’s Heartbreaker shin guard used to put more pressure on his figure four, with his own Hammer Jammer shin guard. Valentine then formed the Rhythm & Blues tag team with the Honky Tonk Man, before turning babyface losing to Earthquake at WrestleMania VII and Irwin R. Schyster at SummerSlam 1991 and appearing in the 1992 Royal Rumble match.

Promos/Character: Valentine was not the best promo, and was always paired with a manager, going from The Grand Wizard to Capt. Lou Albano to Luscious Johnny V to Jimmy Hart. Hammer played a no-nonsense character who would kick-ass, take names and break legs. At this writing it’s still unknown whether he was the motivation for the classic album “Please Hammer, Don’t Hurt ‘Em” by MC Hammer. Other than being an asskicker, there wasn’t a lot of character depth for Valentine, which likely limited his upward mobility on this list.

Workrate: Some voters would tell you that Valentine is THE BEST worker in WWF/E history, and he is certainly on the short list of contenders. His matches against Backlund for the title are among the greatest matches of that era. The Valentine/Santana feud is one of the greatest angles of the 1980s and the cage match to settle the feud is particularly memorable. The Dream Team is an underrated tag team with classics against the British Bulldogs and Santana & Steamboat, and our hot take is that Beefcake was NOT the workhorse of that team. Valentine went on to have another excellent feud with Ronnie Garvin late in his career to round out his case. Hammer always worked hard often forcing other wrestlers to keep up, making every match good at worst. You’ll almost never see a bad Valentine match, as he always did the little things and knew how to structure a match to get the crowd engaged. He knew how to bring hard-hitting offense and still sell and show ass as a heel. Few wrestlers had his consistency nor his high-end classic matches.

Staff Thoughts: Valentine gets in on the strength of his classic matches with Backlund, the all-timer feud with Santana, the Dream Team run and the late career feud with Garvin. That’s a diverse resume, from the hour-long draw with Backlund in 1979 to his Garvin match at Royal Rumble 1990. No doubt, it was a long and distinguished career for the man who reached middle-age at 21 and then never aged a day since. Along the way he had classic tag team bouts and can console himself with the fact that he made Beefcake part of a good tag team, as he continues to struggle to recover from the Nightmare at the Rosemont Horizon. Add it all together and Valentine has a strong resume as an all-time great worker than hit with voters placing him high on our list.

From the Voters: “I think you can honestly make a case for Valentine as the greatest WWF worker of all time. Backlund’s best opponent, four insanely amazing matches (dont sleep on their 84 match). The Tito feud. Dream Team, Oh My God, the Dream Team! US Express, Bulldogs and a Can-Am Match all great. His solo runs through 90 were great. Garvin feud was awesome as were his matches with Blue Blazer and a reprise of the Tito feud in 88. What did he so well was he took all these WWF wrestlers out of their comfort zone. He forced people to work hard and react organically. He was selfless, but he wasnt going to let you coast. He reminds of Regal in that respect. When you watch a Valentine match in the WWF setting it is like nothing else on a WWF card.” – Martin Boulevard, May 29, 2017

“Oh for sure. Probably got the best matches out of one of the greatest champions in the company (Backlund). Had an epic IC title run. Did the best he could with some nonsense later in his career. I got nothing but time for Valentine. He would for sure be on the list.” – Matthew Richards, May 30, 2017

“He’s a top 20 contender in this thing. Feud with Tito is legendary. Hell of a tag guy. Carried those scrubs Brutus and Bravo for two years. Feud with Garvin is a hidden gem from 89-90. ”- Jason Greenhouse, May 29, 2017

29. Ricky Steamboat Total Points: 7,218 Total Ballots: 114 Average Rank: 37.7 High Vote: 6 Low Vote: 88 High Voter: Vince Male

Nuance: The nuance category isn’t kind to the Dragon, as he had only about a five-year run with the company from 1985-88 and a brief stint in 1991.Ricky  Steamboat was the consummate white meat babyface, having never worked heel. He’s primarily been a singles worker in WWF but has some very good tag matches teaming with other babyfaces, like Tito Santana and Hulk Hogan.

Jump Up Moments: Steamboat defeated Matt Borne at the first WrestleMania before entering into a feud with Mr. Fuji and Don Muraco, where the heels hung him with his karate black belt, before battling on two Saturday Night’s Main Events. He defeated Hercules at WrestleMania 2, before moving on to his feud with Jake “The Snake” Roberts. The feud began when Roberts attacked Steamboat before their match on the May 3, 1986 SNME, giving Steamboat the DDT on the floor. The Dragon beat the Snake in a Snake Pit match at the Big Event in Toronto and later on the October 1986 SNME in a Snake Pit rematch. Steamboat then challenged Randy Savage for the Intercontinental Title, losing by countout on November 22, 1986, only for Savage to continue his attack injuring Steamboat’s larynx by coming off the top rope with the ring bell. He returned at SNME in January 1987 saving George Steele from an attack with the ring bell by Savage. This two would have several matches, including a great one at Maple Leaf Gardens from February 1987 before meeting at WrestleMania III. That match is an instant classic, beloved by a generation of fans, as it had an epic feeling that was the first of its kind since the Hulkamania era began. Steamboat would then drop his IC title to the Honky Tonk Man in a shocking upset on the June 13, 1987 edition of Superstars. He lost in the first round of the WrestleMania IV tournament to Greg Valentine, robbing us of a rematch with Savage. Steamboat then left the company until 1991 when he returned in a dragon costume breathing fire (literally) where he was undefeated on TV and teamed with Kerry Von Erich and Davey Boy Smith to defeat Warlord, Hercules and Paul Roma at SummerSlam 1991, before again leaving the company. In 2009, Steamboat took part in an angle with Roddy Piper and Jimmy Snuka taking on Chris Jericho, who was running down the legends. Steamboat appeared in-ring for the first time in nearly 15 years teaming with Piper and Snuka against Jericho at WrestleMania XXV, and the Steamboat/Jericho portions were shockingly good. He had a strong singles match with Jericho at Backlash 2009.

Promos/Character: Perhaps Steamboat’s best promo work came when he was trying to speak again after Savage’s attack injured his throat. Otherwise, Dragon wasn’t much of a promo guy, doing his talking in the ring. He played a great white meat babyface, but that was due more to his in-ring character work than his out of the ring work. The less said about the fire-breathing dragon costume era, the better.

Workrate: Ricky Steamboat is an all-time great worker, with nearly every match being good and his best being classics. The WrestleMania III match stands out as an all-timer and, while you may debate it’s star ranking, for many young fans, it was a match unlike any they’d seen before. It’s undeniable how influential that match was, with its multiple near-falls (though some may count this as a negative due to how persistent this would become). Steamboat played one of the best underdog babyfaces of all-time, giving greater credence to matches during his feuds with Savage, Roberts and others. He didn’t often have tag team matches, but did team with Tito Santana to challenge the Dream Team in an excellent match on 4/25/1985 at the Maple Leaf Gardens. He also had a great match with Savage in 1986 at the Boston Gardens that is on the Macho Madness DVD.

Staff Thoughts: His run was short, but my God was it memorable. Ricky Steamboat represented the ultimate underdog babyface to a generation of fans who started watching WWF in the mid-1980s. For young fans who weren’t watching the Iron Sheik/Sgt. Slaughter feud or the Santana/Valentine feud, the WrestleMania III match showed that there could be more to wrestling than lumbering giants and Hulk up comebacks. Add that iconic, influential match to his feud with Roberts and his other work with Savage and his shocking loss to the Honky Tonk Man, and voters definitely remembered to Enter the Dragon on their ballots. You can hear the guys talk about Steamboat on this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “One of the best white meat babyfaces ever. It was a smart move never even hinting at a heel turn for him, would’ve been a disaster. Steamboat was a good guy personified. Savage feud was amazing, but I enjoyed the Muraco feud even more. My only issue was his very short IC title run. I know he had asked for time off to be with his family, but it was such a disappointment to see such a small reign after such a great chase. That, combined with his best work being in WCW, makes me have him ranked lower than most other people will.” – Tim Tetreault, June 2, 2017

“Naturally. All time greatest babyface that never had a run with the WWF Title. Best arm drag in the business period, even to this day. His work in the 80s speaks for itself. And I truly almost cried when he showed up at Wrestlemania 25. The guy still had it.” – Michael Schoen, June 2, 2017

“Not enough time to be way up the list, but Jake and Savage feuds were good and memorable. His comeback was short but fun. I saw him go 25 mins with Drew Mac on a 2009 house show and it was great. Will make it, but not enough meat to be top tier.” – Dylan Hales, June 16, 2017

28. Tito Santana Total Points: 7,335 Total Ballots: 111 Average Rank: 35 High Vote: 5 Low Vote: 97 High Voter: Dean Coles

Nuance: Tito Santana appeared in the WWF in 1979 and 1980 before returning to the company in 1982 for a 10-year run, so he has longevity covered. Santana has always played a babyface, but has had both a successful singles run as well as tag team success with Ivan Putski and Rick Martel.

Jump Up Moments: In 1979, he teamed with Ivan Putski to defeat Johnny and Jerry Valiant for the WWF Tag Team Championship, before losing them to the Wild Samoans in 1980. Tito returned to the WWF for good in 1982 and began feuding with Don Muraco over the Intercontinental Title in 1983. During this same timeframe he would challenge the Iron Sheik for the WWF Championship at the Philadelphia Spectrum battling to a double-DQ in one of the Sheik’s only title defenses. After a lengthy feud, Sanatana captured the IC title on February 11, 1984. “Chico” would then start an epic feud with Greg Valentine over the IC title, losing it to The Hammer in September 1984 and being injured by Valentine shortly afterwards. Santana began using Valentine’s figure-four leglock and appeared in the opening match of the first WrestleMania making The Executioner submit. Santana and Valentine would continue their feud in a series of no-DQ, lumberjack and other matches in singles and tags. The feud finally ended in a great cage match on July 6, 1985, and is considered one of the best in-ring feuds in WWF history, and likely the best of the 1980s. “Chico” would defend the title until losing to Randy Savage in February 8, 1986 when crooked referee Danny Davis failed to notice Savage using a foreign object. He would challenge Savage in a series of rematches, all of which are quite good. Tito teamed with JYD to take on Terry and Hoss Funk in a very good match at WrestleMania 2. At WrestleMania III, Santana teamed with the British Bulldogs to challenge the Hart Foundation and aforementioned crooked ref Danny Davis. Tito would then join forces with Rick Martel as a team that strikes with force… called Strike Force. Strike Force would have a great series of matches with The Islanders, and then go on to defeat the Hart Foundation for the WWF Tag Team Championship, holding the belts for five months. At WrestleMania IV, Demolition would end Strike Force’s reign in another good match. Strike Force split during a match with the Brain Busters at WrestleMania V when Martel walked out on Santana. Tito would feud with Martel for the remainder of 1989 with the two being on opposing teams at SummerSlam and Survivor Series 1989, and Santana defeated Martel in the finals of the 1989 King of the Ring tournament. Santana made it to the finals of the IC title tournament in 1990, losing to Mr. Perfect. Their SNME title rematch was of the top WWF bouts of the year. He was the sole survivor for his team at the 1990 Survivor Series and he lost to the Mountie at WrestleMania VII. He would then adopt the El Matador gimmick and wrestle Shawn Michaels at WrestleMania VIII and Papa Shango in a dark match at WrestleMania IX, making him the only performer other than Hulk Hogan to appear in the first nine WrestleManias. Santana is a two-time WWF Tag Team Champion, a two-time IC Champion and the 1989 King of the Ring.

Promos/Character: Tito was not a good promo. His two most memorable promos were probably the one with Martle naming their tag team because they strike with force or Tito screaming “Lord” at Lord Alfred Hayes after Valentine injured his knee. Both of those would be memorable more for unintentional comedy than anything else. His character work is a bit flat, though he does play the best matador to grace the squared circle we have ever seen.

Workrate: Santana is another wrestler with a strong case for being one of the best babyface workers in WWF history. His feud with Valentine may be the best feud of the 1980s and one of the best in-ring feuds of all-time. Strike Force was a great tag team with excellent matches against the Islanders and good feuds with Demolition, the Brain Busters and other teams of the day. Tito worked great as an underdog, as he’s an excellent seller and shows great fire when fighting from underneath. Tito was always able to capture fan’s attention and support, doing most of his character work in-ring.

Staff Thoughts: Tito Santana is one of the all-time great in-ring workers in the WWF. He’s had a prominent role in the transition into the Rock ‘n’ Wrestling era, holding down the workrate portion of the company with his stellar feud with Valentine,while also appealing to the kids WWF was targeting (he was a character of Hulk Hogan’s Rock ‘n’ Wrestling cartoon). Tito is the only wrestler not named Hulk Hogan to appear at the first nine WrestleManias, which speaks to the faith the company had in “Chico.” The feud with Valentine and tag work with Strike Force provides his top-end stuff, but Tito was also a very consistent worker and you’d be hard-pressed to find a bad Tito Santana match. To hear the guys talk about Tito check out this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “Tito is a guy who as a kid i never really appreciated however going back and watching some of his stuff great worker a guy who was a stalwart of the mid card. Great matches with Greg Valentine, Randy Savage and others. I need to see a lot more including more matches with him and Valentine but he would be on my list.” – Mike Poulin, June 4, 2017

“Tito, might make it into my top 20. At first when I think of the guy I’m like “yeah sure, he’ll be in there somewhere.” But I forget that I missed a lot of his key feuds and matches. He was really the workhorse of the company from 84-86. He was adapt as a singles and tag guy. And he was always over with the crowds. Here’s a guy that I wish the Network would spotlight with a Collection because you know he has a bunch of gems, 10-15 minute clinics that go unheralded.” – David Mann, June 5, 2017

“If this were just based on ring work, he’d be very high. One of the best pro wrestlers of his era. Unfortunately he had nothing in the way of promos or great character work. He was extremely versatile in singles and tag work, but never got a heel run, which would have been interesting. He gave Curt Hennig his best match in the WWF that didn’t involve Bret Hart. Tito’s a lock, just not sure where. Probably somewhere past 50.” – Greg Phillips, June 8, 2017

27. Jake Roberts Total Points: 7,464 Total Ballots: 111 Average Rank: 33.8 High Vote: 6 Low Vote: 76 High Voter: Taylor Keahey

Nuance: Jake “The Snake” Roberts had a six-year run with the company from 1986 to 1992 supplemented with his return in 1996 into 1997 and brief appearances in 2005 and 2014. He played both a heel and a babyface, showing great flexibility, though primarily as a singles wrestler. If there’s anyone who could give a nuanced performance, it’s Jake the Snake, as his psychology, character, body language and tone were second to none.

Jump Up Moments: Roberts debuted in March of 1986 and defeated George Wells at WrestleMania 2 making him foam from the mouth when he wrapped Damien around his head. The first of his many great feuds began at the May 1986 Saturday Night’s Main Event when he DDT’d Ricky Steamboat on the floor and laid his snake on The Dragon. The two would have Snake Pit matches at the Big Event and the October 1986 SNME. Jake would get an interview segment called the Snake Pit at this time. He also was getting cheered and would be turned face by the fans. Jake officially turned when the Honky Tonk Man attacked him during an episode of the Snake Pit, legitimately injuring his neck with a guitar shot. This led to their match at WrestleMania III which saw Alice Cooper accompany Jake to the ring where he shockingly lost to HTM. Roberts would challenge Honky for the IC title throughout much of 1987. In 1988, Jake began feuding with “Ravishing” Rick Rude, who inadvertently selected Jake’s wife Cheryl as the lucky winner of his post-match celebratory kiss, though Cheryl refused and slapped Rude. This led to Rude airbrushing images of Cheryl on his tights, sending Jake into a rage. Jake appeared on the winning team at Survivor Series 1988 opposite Rude and other members of the Heenan Family, including Andre the Giant, who he also feuded with. On the March 1989 SNME Jake came out to assist Brutus Beefcake in his match against Rick Rude, using Damien to scare Andre (who was assisting Rude) into a “heart attack”, starting their feud. Andre won most of the house show circuit matches, but Jake won their WrestleMania V match by DQ when Andre attacked guest referee Big John Studd. The Snake then moved on to a feud with “The Million Dollar Man” Ted DiBiase after DiBiase attacked Roberts following a match with Virgil. Jake returned from injury to steal the Million Dollar Belt and dared DiBiase or Virgil to reach into Damien’s sack to retrieve the belt. Roberts took on The Million Dollar Man at WrestleMania VI, losing via countout, but giving away DiBiase’s money afterwards. Roberts feuded with Rick Martel in 1990-91, after The Model sprayed Arrogance in Jake’s eyes blinding him. This hot angle culminated in a blindfold match at WrestleMania VII, in an interesting match for crowd participation, which ended when Jake located Martel and planted him with the DDT. He would then feud with Earthquake after the big man squashed Damien and served Quakeburgers to Lord Alfred Hayes. This caused Jake to introduce a new snake Lucifer, who was Damien’s big brother. In 1991, Jake was helping train Ultimate Warrior in the dark ways to prepare him for his feud with the Undertaker, locking him in a casket, burying him alive and having him walk through a room of live snakes, only to be bitten by a cobra, revealing that Snake, Taker and Paul Bearer had been working together all along. Warrior was fired before the scheduled series of matches took place. During the wedding reception for Randy Savage and Elizabeth, Jake and the Undertaker gave them a live cobra as a gift, starting his feud with Savage, where he later goaded him to the ring and had a cobra bite his arm. The two would feud into 1992 battling at This Tuesday in Texas and on SNME. Jake was poised to hit whoever came through the door next, Savage or Elizabeth, before being stopped by the Undertaker, leading to their feud. This led to Jake demanding answers on The Funeral Parlor and DDT’ing Bearer before trapping Undertaker’s hand in a casket and hitting him repeatedly with a chair. This led to a match between the two at WrestleMania VIII. Jake would leave the company until 1996 when he returned with his born-again Christian gimmick. He advanced to the finals of the 1996 King of the Ring losing to Steve Austin and being the motivation for Austin cutting the Austin 3:16 promo.

Promos/Character: Jake “The Snake” Roberts has to be on ANYONE’S short list of the best promos in WWF history. He was a stark departure from the manic screaming of the main eventers of the day, and Jake would talk slowly and silently staring a hole through your soul and talking about dark matters. He would tell you to “Never Trust a Snake”, and he certainly played that character to a T. His feuds were some of the best of the time, if not all-time, because he played that dark character and cut promos with a scary psychology not seen before and never done as well since. He’s a hugely memorable character and is remembered with mixtures of fondness and fear by fans of the era.

Workrate: Jake was a capable worker, but his blow-off matches never lived up to the hype of his feuds. Most of the matches weren’t that memorable, even when the feuds are. He had great in-ring psychology and the DDT is one of the coolest finishers of all-time, but workrate is a bit of a weakness for the Snake.

Staff Thoughts: There’s never been anyone like Jake the Snake, with his deep, dark promos and psychology. He just got it and connected with the crowd on a whole other level, whether as a babyface or a heel. His feuds were always some of the best of the time and as a promo there’s no one better. The slow, quiet delivery and that stare just made everything he said that much creepier. For someone who never won a WWF Title, could he possibly be more memorable? That list of feuds is incredible, showing he was always busy, never just killing time during his WWF run. The lack of memorable matches likely hampered Jake’s placement on the list, and if not for his personal demons, there’s no telling how high he may have climbed. Still, his character work feuds and promos alone struck a chord with voters for sure. You can hear Good Ol’ Will and the guys talk about Jake the Snake on this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “No doubt. Mind, promos, matches with big time feuds..steamboat, honkey, rude, Martel, dibiase, warrior, savage. One of the best heels of all times!” – Shawn Kidd, May 30, 2017

“Hard to imagine any fan of the federation era not including him on their list. Pretty much epitomizes the era and probably an easy top 25 choice for me. A lot of guys get hyped up for their psychology and mind for the business. Jake lives up to that hype. Best worker ever? No, but I was compelled with every feud he was ever in from Steamboat in 86 to undertaker in 92.” – Brian Meyer, May 30, 2017

“I’ve been rewatching his DVD set lately and gaining even more appreciation for him. The master of the little things. His matches rarely drag because he’s always doing something. Great at elevating feuds to the next level; had great ones with Steamboat, Rude, Martel, and Savage. He may not have had a lot of great matches, but he also had very few bad ones. Superb as both a face and a heel. One of the best promos of all-time.” – Ben Morse, June 7, 2017

26. Ted DiBiase Total Points: 7,518 Total Ballots: 112 Average Rank: 33.9 High Vote: 7 Low Vote: 84 High Voter: D. Macgregor

Nuance: Ted DiBiase worked eight years as an in-ring competitor for the company, including a babyface cup of coffee in 1979, and his main run from 1987-1993, before transitioning to a managerial role in 1994. He had a babyface run in 1979, but is best known for his heel work as The Million Dollar Man. He had both a singles run and a tag run teaming with Irwin R. Schyster as Money, Inc.

Jump Up Moments: DiBiase’s 1979 run was significant for a feud with Pat Patterson where he lost the North American Title, leading Patterson to unify that title with the South American Title in that good ol’ tournament in Rio de Janerio. He was also Hulk Hogan’s first opponent in Madison Square Garden during this time. Upon his return in 1987 as the Million Dollar Man, he attempted to buy the WWF Championship from Hulk Hogan, who told him he’d have to win it in the ring. DiBiase attempted to do this unsuccessfully before recruiting Andre the Giant to win the title for him. This led to the Hulk Hogan/Andre the Giant match on the Main Event on Feb. 5, 1988, where Andre “won” the title and presented it to DiBiase, before WWF officials discovered the wrong Hebner counted the pin, leading to the title being vacated and a tournament to crown a new champion at WrestleMania IV. DiBiase would advance to the finals of the tournament losing to Randy Savage, and continuing to feud with him at house shows where the matches would be better than their WrestleMania IV main event. DiBiase would team with Andre the Giant to take on Hogan and Savage in the main event of the first SummerSlam in a very good match. He would then win the 1988 King of the Ring. He purchased Hercules’ contract from Bobby Heenan with thoughts of making him his slave, but Hercules turned face proclaiming he was a man and feuded with DiBiase. In 1989, he would create the Million Dollar Belt and feud with Jake ”The Snake” Roberts over the belt, as well as continuing his feud with Hogan by aligning with Zeus. As punishment for buying #30 in the 1989 Royal Rumble, DiBiase was forced to take #1 in the 1990 Rumble, lasting over 45 minutes, a record at the time. Roberts returned from injury stealing the Million Dollar Belt and putting it in Damien’s sack, leading to a match at WrestleMania VI where DiBiase won by count out. At SummerSlam 1990, DiBiase bought the services of Sapphire leading to crackerjack detective Jim Duggan looking for her and DiBiase feuding with Dusty Rhodes through the beginning of 1991. DiBiase captained a Survivor Series team in 1990 with the debuting Undertaker being the surprise team member. At the 1991 Royal Rumble, DiBiase and Virgil defeated Dusty and Dustin Rhodes, and DiBiase ordered Virgil to put the Million Dollar Belt around his waist but The King of Meat Sauce instead hit him with the belt. At WrestleMania VII, DiBiase lost via count out to Virgil, and would lose the Million Dollar Belt to Virgil at SummerSlam 1991 to a huge pop. In 1992, DiBiase would team with Irwin R. Schyster to form Money, Inc. The team won the WWF Tag Team Titles from the Legion of Doom in February 1992 and defended the titles against the Natural Disasters at WrestleMania VIII and eventually lost the them to the Disasters over the summer. They would regain the titles and feud with the Nasty Boys. DiBiase faced the returning Brutus Beefcake on an early episode of Raw, smashing his face with a briefcase causing Jimmy Hart to turn on Money, Inc. and Beefcake’s friend Hogan to challenge the team to a match at WrestleMania IX, where Money, Inc. retained their titles by DQ. The team would then feud with the Steiner Brothers, trading the tag team titles back and forth. His last match for the WWF was against Razor Ramon at SummerSlam 1993. He would take on a managerial role as head of the Million Dollar Corporation from 1994 to 1996. DiBiase was the inaugural North American Heavyweight Champion, a King of the Ring and three-time WWF Tag Team Champion.

Promos/Character: The Million Dollar Man is one of the most memorable and colorful characters in WWF history. From the vignettes announcing his arrival to his in-arena skits challenging fans to bounce basketballs or perform demeaning tasks for money, it was clear that “Everybody had a price and everyone’s going to pay” for the Million Dollar Man. DiBiase played the part perfectly, from his trademark evil laugh to his suits with dollar signs and his custom made Million Dollar Championship. DiBiase was a great talker, always able to add to his feuds and make them seem important. Plus, it was such a hateable character, his matches often had unreal heat.

Workrate: DiBiase was a technically sound wrestler and everything he did looked good in the ring, but he lacks the memorable top-notch matches to put him over the top. The 1979 babyface matches with Pat Patterson are very good. His house show matches with Savage are good, not great. His feud with Virgil was very hot and the SummerSlam match where Virgil wins the Million Dollar Belt was a memorable moment after a strong match. The Money, Inc. tag team run featured mostly forgettable matches. Overall, his in-ring results are a bit underwhelming, particularly for someone like DiBiase, who we know to be talented from his work elsewhere.

Staff Thoughts: The Million Dollar Man is one of the top characters that the WWF has ever had. He was involved in so many memorable moments. His feuds with Hercules and Virgil were fun, as was him purchasing Sapphire and feuding with Dusty and Dustin. He was in the main event of WrestleMania IV in the finals of the tournament and later faced Hogan for the tag titles at WrestleMania IX, so he had his WrestleMania moments. The memorable matches were few and far between, which limits his place on the list somewhat. Money, Inc. was a top team at a time when the tag team scene was dreck, for whatever that’s worth. You can hear the guys talk about DiBiase on this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “As a character, he could be Top Ten. Unfortunately, he has no classic matches in the WWF. I enjoy some of his matches but there are so many guys with better matches on the list. Maybe his 10 minute challenge against Dustin in 1990 or the Mania match against Macho Man. Couldn’t stand the Money Inc tag team overall. On the plus side, so many memorable moments and angles. He makes the list but I don’t have him very high.” – Good Ol’ Will from Texas, June 3, 2017

“The definition of not needing a title to get over. I know they did the Hogan/Andre thing where DiBiase sort of had the belt for a bit, but it just seems like he should’ve been the main man at that time and had a run with the title. Such a great, believable heel with the mat skills to back up the talk. Definitely in the Top 50 for me.” – Mike Andrews, June 8, 2017

“Difficult guy for me to rank, partly because of the categories. He has so many “jump up” moments, but almost no “jump up” matches, even though many are good. I think particularly to his work with Bret. Yet his work was always crisp, he always had the crowd engaged and was always over as a heel. I think he’ll end up placing higher than some might think.” – Greg Phillips, June 8, 2017

25. Mr. Perfect Total Points: 7,569 Total Ballots: 116 Average Rank: 35.8 High Vote: 5 Low Vote: 87 High Voter: Scott Herrin

Nuance: Mr. Perfect was a character in the WWF for about a nine-year stretch, though he missed a couple of years of that time due to injury. He also spent some time in the early 1980s teaming up with Eddie Gilbert. Mr. Perfect spent time as a heel and a babyface, with the bulk of his time in singles work.

Jump Up Moments: Mr. Perfect debuted with perhaps the best series of vignettes the company ever did, showing Perfect performing a variety of sporting events, well, perfectly. While Tom Brady can’t throw and catch the ball himself, according to his wife, Mr. Perfect showed he could in these vignettes. He was one of the survivors at the 1989 Survivor Series and was undefeated on TV for over a year. Perfect helped The Genius defeat Hulk Hogan via count out on Saturday Night’s Main Event, kick-starting a feud between Perfect and Hogan, where they wrestled at live events and Perfect defeated Hogan via DQ in a match televised from MSG. Mr. Perfect was the runner-up in the 1990 Royal Rumble. He suffered his first pinfall loss on TV to Intercontinental Champion Ultimate Warrior on an MSG Network special. He also lost to Brutus Beefcake at WrestleMania VI. Perfect lost to Hogan in a good match on SNME April 28, 1990. Perfect won the tournament for the vacated IC title and successfully defended the title against Tito Santana on SNME in a great match before dropping the title to Texas Tornado at SummerSlam 1990. He captained the Perfect Team in a losing effort at Survivor Series 1990 and then regained the IC title from Tornado. He then retained the IC title against Big Boss Man at WrestleMania VII. Perfect then suffered injuries and lost the IC title to Bret Hart in an excellent match at SummerSlam 1991. He spent the next year as Ric Flair’s executive consultant, forming a power team with Flair and Bobby Heenan. Perfect eventually turned on Flair joining Randy Savage for a tag team match against Flair and Razor Ramon at Survivor Series 1992. He would then feud with Flair winning a memorable loser leaves WWF match on Raw in January 1993. Perfect then began a rivalry with Lex Luger, losing to him at WrestleMania IX. He had a very good match with Doink to qualify for the 1993 King of the Ring, where he defeated Mr. Hughes, before losing to eventual winner Bret Hart in the semi-finals in another great match. He then challenged Shawn Michaels for the IC title at SummerSlam 1993 in a match that WWF promised would be a classic, but was not. He then retired from in-ring work until his return to the company in 2002, when he was a surprise entrant in the Royal Rumble lasting until the final four. Mr. Perfect was a two-time IC Champion.

Promos/Character: Mr. Perfect is on the short list of best characters the WWF has ever had. The vignettes where he executed every sport from billiards to swimming were fantastic. Perfect played the character… ahem… perfectly with his cocky walk and sneer and especially that gum swat. He was always nails on the gum swat, no matter the trying circumstances. Mr. Perfect was great on the stick as well, later serving as an executive consultant for Ric Flair (and if you can be called upon to cut promos to help Ric F’n Flair, you know the company thinks you can talk) and as a color commentator. Add it all up and Mr. Perfect was a character that stood the test of time with fans, making him one of the more memorable characters ever.

Workrate: Mr. Perfect was a great seller (if anything it was too overblown and some fans feel like he oversold too much) and had some innovative moves like his somersault neck snap and the PerfectPlex finisher. Sometimes his offenses wasn’t as impactful as you might like, and the number of classic matches aren’t quite what you’d like from someone with Perfect’s talent. Still, the matches with Bret Hart at SummerSlam 1991 and King of the Ring 1993 are excellent, and his matches with Hogan are very good. His match with the Blue Blazer at Wrestlemania V is one of the best five-minute matches in company history and his loser leaves WWF match against Flair is very good as well.

Staff Thoughts: Mr. Perfect is one of the most memorable WWF characters ever, with the excellent vignettes holding up to this day. The towel, the gum swat and the sneer made him a great character and instantly a big deal. He then went undefeated for a year and feuded with Hogan, showing that he was a big deal. His star fell a bit, but he was the IC title level anchor for the early 1990s and had classic matches with Bret Hart. He was an important part of the team with Flair and Heenan and then had a good feud with Flair before he left the company. All said, the in-ring quality and strong character work make him the Perfect candidate for the top portion of our list. To hear what the guys had to say about Mr. Perfect, check out this FYC podcast.

From the Voters: “You absolutely nailed exactly one of the things I am looking for on my list in general which is this is a WWE exclusive list. What do we know about the WWE? It is very much character driven. Mr. Perfect might have done a lot more elsewhere but in the WWE he had to get over the gimmick that he was given, and he absolutely did. Oh, and he may not have been as great of a worker as he was in previous stints… but he was still pretty damn good, particularly when you compare him to his peers within the WWE within his era.” – Brian Meyer, June 2, 2017

“So many factors that put him inside the cut. His selling of the Mr. Perfect gimmick. Fantastic athlete who was fluid in the ring. He also sold others offense effectively. He was willing to job to inferior talent and not lose momentum. He jobbed to Beefcake at Wrestlemania and then Von Erich at the very next PPV while keeping momentum as a dangerous threat to the title. It was strange to see him as a face, but his promo work and attitude helped him get over with the fans. It would not surprise me if he finished as high as 60.” – Jeffrey Thomas, June 2, 2017

“My favorite wrestling character of all time (well, behind deviations like Heel Stone Cold and Hollywood Rock). Not a lot of folks know that. I adored him. He was an exceptional, phenomenal worker who made *everyone* he wrestled look better than they did coming in (Shawn Michaels at SummerSlem excluded). His two matches with Bret are among the greatest matches I’ve ever seen. Could talk like few of his peers, could work like few of his peers, and was still over in his comeback run. He’s in, and he’s going to rank highly for me.” – Greg Phillips, June 2, 2017