#ishmael-core

[martyr0l0gy]

thinking about lighthouse keepers and stormy seas again

[plaguedocboi]

Being so normal rn walking around the whale-themed restaurant in my whale shirt taking pictures of the whaling art on the walls

[ranticore]

i appreciate your commitment to making your characters genuinely interpersonally unpleasant in ways that are both congruent with the rest of their characterization and entangled fantastically with the messed up things they go through. i was thinking of ishmael specifically at first but rapidly realized how many of your guys this applies to. excellent skill!

thank you.. I often find that ppl like the idea of a Flawed Character (whatever the hell that means in reality) but always stop short of what they consider to be a red line or hard boundary in the name of sympathy, relatability, or even Not Being Cancelled (tumblr the world's most ocd website), and I find it really interesting where that boundary lies and poking at it. Is Ishmael a rapist? It's his word against another person's and they both think they're telling the truth. If he was, would it make his later important revolutionary work less valuable or is it ok because the accuser was someone with immense privilege over him? It's not so much me trying to make a character unpleasant as I am trying to make them, I guess, thought provoking? Something that might sit uncomfortably, so u gotta think about it a bit. (ditto also love making characters that seem to fill a comfortable and expected place and then seeing how much it takes, in increments, for an audience to be forced to re-evaluate them on the fly or if they'll stay being typecast forever)

Also I feel it's just a natural exploration of how a person was treated in their backstory and as you say, how the world influences their decisions so it's less like I'm picking and choosing from a shopping list of flaws and instead just seeing the inevitable conclusion. why I can't have contextless ocs who only exist to be drawn

[saranilssonbooks]

Dickheads! Help me define "Ishmael core"!

[drinkthemlock]

there is something so intimate about being the last man living after a wreckage. floating away in the wild unforgiving sea…

[enkephallic]

Limbus Company: Deep Analysis of Sin

So, I decided to take a deeper dive into the different sin types in Limbus Company.

The TLDR Version:

Wrath - Unable to accept something

Lust - Having a strong desire

Sloth - Losing sight

Gluttony - Satisfaction-seeking

Gloom - Controlled by pain

Pride - Contempt of others/selfishness

Envy - Desire to surpass

Regarding the sinners' skills, the sin position is important as well. A S1 sin is a surface-level appearance, but S3 represents something deep inside them.

The detailed explanations are under the cut!

Wrath

Wrath, on the surface level, can present as being irritable or hard to get along with.

Wrath S1 examples

LCB Ishmael, who seems irritable and nitpicky at first.

Seven Heathcliff "Why am I doing this stupid job?"

Hook Office Hong Lu "Don't speak so softly, I'll feel homicidal"

S2 gets closer to how they really feel. The feeling of wrath comes from the feeling of "I can't accept this" - whether it's how they're being treated, how their environment is, etc.

Wrath S2 examples

LCB Heathcliff (past speculation) - Discriminated, mistreated, resenting what's happening to him

LCB Sinclair (past) - I don't want to get prosthetics

W Corp Hong Lu - Bored with his job.

And S3 wrath represents a strong rejection - they won't accept Anything they deem contrary to their own beliefs and ideals. It is a violent refusal.

Wrath S3 examples

N corp identities who are brainwashed - Kill all the dissenters and heretics.

Pequod Ishmael - "It's MY way or the HIGHWAY, god damn it!" (Throws a fit if another ID kills an enemy)

R Corp Ishmael - Hates it to the point she's looking for Singularity information of old R corp

LCB Rodya - I can't accept this armchair revolution and endless poverty. I have to kill this old windbag.

Lust

Lust in this case is a pursuit of something non-physical - a relationship, an ideal, a core element of your self. On the surface level, this can present as really wanting to be something.

Lust S1 Examples

LCB Don Quixote - Wants to become a great Fixer.

W Corp Ryoshu - Wants to be a great artist.

Sous Chef Gregor - Wants to improve his cooking.

S2 is a little stronger than just normal desire. They will willingly hurt other people or trample them to achieve their goal.

Lust S2 Examples

Tingtang Gangleader Hong Lu - Uses violence and is callous to those invading his turf

The One Who Grips Faust - Massacres Sinclair's village to get what she wants

LCB Ryoshu - Her idea of beauty ties in with violence

S3 is a little different - It's desiring something so badly on an existential level. It's pretty much what they live for.

Lust S3 Examples

R.B. Chef Ryoshu - Needs to be one of the Eight. Will stop at nothing to achieve this.

N Corp Heathcliff - Not brainwashed, doesn't really want to be. Wants to preserve his "true self".

G Corp Gregor - After an irreversible transformation, fully believes his reason to exist is to be a killing machine.

Interestingly, both LCB Heathcliff and Hong Lu have a Lust S3.

Sloth

Sloth is inaction, watching from the sidelines, not seeing what is in front of you. This can start with just simply being misguided, believing something to be true when it's not.

Sloth S1 Examples

W Corp Don Quixote - "I am working at a Wing!! CHOO CHOO!! Sally forth!!"

LCB Outis - Her piss-poor act of blind acceptance and obedience.

LCB Meursault - It is simply none of my business if Sinclair hyperventilates and vomits on the floor.

S2 sloth is more purposeful, not taking action when one should or purposefully being ignorant of reality.

LCB Faust - Does not tell Dante and the others a lot of information and doesn't stop sinners from running amok.

LCB Hong Lu - Despite being perceptive, does not seem to register bad situations as bad or react to pain appropriately.

G Corp Gregor - This feels wrong but I'll just continue with it anyway.

S3 sloth is a total loss of vision, not being able to see what's important to them. Losing sight of all they used to desire, and doing nothing about it.

Dieci IDs - Lost their memory and doesn't even remember what was most important to them.

K Corp Hong Lu - Doesn't seem to mind his total loss of freedom and autonomy, despite desiring freedom in other IDs.

LCB Yi Sang - Could not care about anything he once loved or aspired to be, until he was able to gain his wings once more.

Blade Lineage Don Quixote - Once used her strength to fight alongside her comrades, but now kills for purely her own sake.

Gluttony

Gluttony is a desire to be satisfied, whether it's something material or psychological. This can present like greed or selfishness at first sight.

S1 Gluttony Examples

LCB Rodya - "I want meat, I want money, I want to gamble!"

LCB Ryoshu - "Let me smoke. Let me do as I please."

Lantern EGO Don Quixote - Curious about the abnormalities and wanting to know more about them

S2 Gluttony is wanting more at a crucial point in their life, or desiring more than they could chew. It could also mean getting hooked into something or addicted.

S2 Gluttony Examples

LCB Ishmael - "I quit my job, I need something that's not labour hellscape... Hm? That hag can sure talk..."

R Corp Heathcliff - Began deriving enjoyment from killing

N Corp Don Quixote - Didn't even need the brainwashing, got hooked onto the N Corp ideology herself

S3 Gluttony seems to be the final stage of seeking what they desire - being satisfied, even when they shouldn't be.

S3 Gluttony Examples

Tingtang Gangleader Hong Lu - Seems completely happy and enjoying himself

Seven Heathcliff - Actually learned to like his job

W Corp Hong Lu - Doesn't want praise or a raise, just fine with how things are now

Gloom

Gloom represents pain, and how it affects how the person treats their situation or other people. On the surface level, they may appear melancholic or having given up.

S1 Gloom Examples

LCB Yi Sang, LCB Gregor - Self explanatory.

Rosespanner Meursault - Crushed by work

R Corp Ishmael - Headache, pain, does not like it here

S2 Gloom is a moment of despair, when something in their heart was broken. This may also involve guilt and inflicting pain.

W Corp Don Quixote and most W Corp IDs (Except Hong Lu and Ryoshu) - The shocking reveal of what W Corp really is.

N Corp Heathcliff - "What the hell am I even doing??"

Lobotomy EGO Heathcliff - "All my friends are dead."

S3 Gloom can represent letting their pain affect how they treat others. Lashing out, being insensitive to others' pain, or simply giving up and accepting the hurt as inescapable.

W Corp Yi Sang - Abandoned hopes for freedom, just wants it to hurt a little less

G Corp Outis - Knows she cannot escape the unfair treatment

LCB Ishmael - Lashes out and hurts others because she is deeply hurting, making it more painful for her too

Pride

Pride is the belief that they are different from other people, and so the rules don't apply to them. This can seem as arrogance at first, even if they are not actually like that.

S1 Pride Examples

LCB Sinclair - Rich boy 1

LCB Hong Lu - Rich boy 2

LCB Faust - Doesn't hide that she thinks she's better than everyone else

S2 Pride can contain disdain for other people, and believing they are better than those around them. Therefore, their actions can be excused in their eyes.

S2 Pride Examples

LCB Meursault and LCB Outis - Competent and they know it themselves. Outis thinks of her comrades as dirt and points and laughs when they die.

W Corp Ryoshu - Her art comes from chopping up the dead and deformed passengers, doesn't give a single shit about them

LCB Rodya - Believed she was special enough to make a difference and split the hag's skull.

S3 pride goes a step further - their own desires take precedence over anyone else's. They may even see other people's lives as literally the same as a blade of grass. If they want something, they'll trample everything and anything.

S3 Pride Examples

The One Who Grips Faust - Probably doesn't even give a shit about the grand ideology or her minions. Just did it because she could, and wanted to.

The Middle Little Sister Don Quixote - "I can kill anyone who disrespected my organization!"

LCB Ryoshu - Has the littlest regard for human life.

Envy

Envy can start out with the simple desire to surpass someone, to become better than others. To want more than what other people have.

S1 Envy Examples

Tingtang Gangleader Hong Lu - Began wanting to be stronger, to have more power.

LCB Heathcliff - Rich bastards are annoying, they don't deserve it more than I do

Shi Ishmael - Just wants to survive in a world of dog eat dog

S2 envy is the need to be better than what you once were, to surpass yourself and get something accomplished.

S2 Envy Examples

LCB Yi Sang - Bettered his own craft and created the mirror.

Pequod Members - Lay their past self to rest, and opted to hunt the whale.

R.B. Chef Ryoshu - Wants to make better and better pies

S3 Envy is the result of their desire to surpass - or that they have accomplished something, but with a heavy price.

S3 Envy Examples

W Corp Ryoshu - Extremely powerful, but her sword will suck up her health if she doesn't charge it properly.

R Corp Heathcliff - Gained insane power but lost something important to him in the process.

LCB Sinclair - Was able to avoid getting prosthetics but his whole family dead.

Pequod Heathcliff - Managed to get out of the Middle but is covered in scars he can't erase.

I will continue to write more specific theories, but this is how I feel about the sin affinities right now! I'd love to write about EGO and enemies as well soon.

[pm-my-beloved]

Expresions of Sins

BREAKS THROUGH THE WALL I HAVE NOTICED A DETAIL MOST INGENIOUS

You guys know how we have Mirror Dungeon floor packs, I have seen some (Including myself) look at the sin weaknesses ones to interpret what sin... weaknesses in EGO could mean.

ONLY NOW have I thought to notice the theme packs of USERS of those sins. While i don't think those are representing what sins themselves are using, I do think they might signify the main expressions of those sins, or maybe degrees of that expression

Beware, this is going to be more chaotic, as I am writing this RAW without any particular deep analysis, more as a jump-off point for thinking, and all of it might just be making a lot out of nothing BUT WHATEVER ANYWAYS STARTING WITH

Wrath, which is represented with words "Repressed" and "Unbound", quite contradictory adjectives to attach to the same word. With the fact that "Unbound" one is the one with warning signs, it might reffer to degrees. Repressed is expression of wrath that is still somewhat managable when we contain the rage against injusticies or what we hate, while unbound is when this sin goes beyond control, when the fires of hatred overtake our actions (Hi sinclair and Ishmael)

Addiction and Tangling. Personal reading here, Addiction is something that comes up because theres lack in your life that you feel the need to fill, so here its pursuit of lust in search to fix what we are lacking, while tangling is when we are completly out of control of it, when instead of pursuing lust, its lust that controls us (hi bloodfiends)

Treadwheeling is basically a meaningless action that brings no change, so treadwheel sloth is acts which either perpetuate status quo, or have no bearing on reality, actions that change nothing. Then Inert sloth, is when we stop taking actions all-together of our own volition, rather, just flow according to our preexisting pressures and circumstances (oh hi yi sang)

Here my reading is as such Devoured Gluttony somewhat implies that there is some form of satiantion to this hunger, this craving according to which someone acts, while excessive suggests that there never will be any form of satisfaction to ones pursuits (Oh hi faust, what are you doing here)

Yeahhh i've got nothing.

Vain pride seems to imply simply perceiving oneself as better to others, while tyrannical being such certainty in ones superiority or rightousness as to impose it onto others.

With how I read envy as at its core inferiority, the Insignificance here seems to read to me as acting in perception of oneself as not worth the time, effort or attention (Oh hi heathcliff), while pitiful is when that goes to level where one perceives ones existance as lamentable to a point where one deserves some sort of compensation for it.

Sorry for complete chaos of this one, I can't really focus my thoughts RN and wanted to put this out.

Also, @lu-is-not-ok pinging the OG sin interpreter to see his potential thoughts if he feels like those theme packs hold any sort of significance.

[lu-is-not-ok]

hi there! i’ve been motivated by previous asks, so i would really like to hear your thoughts on hong lu’s relationship with yi sang, as it is currently and how it may progress with the story… they have very interesting parallels to me and i wish i could see their relationship explored somewhere other than my own head lol

also, (if you would allow me two questions) do you have any particular thoughts about hong lu’s particulars (bachelor and sheltered)? i find the sinners’ particulars to be really interesting too but i never see them discussed anymore. thanks for your time & have a good day <3

When it comes to Hong Lu and Yi Sang, their relationship is much more straightforward but also much more genuinely positive.

The two don't really interact with each other in any notable manner until Canto 4, which is also where their dynamic Truly gets established. Canto 4's Dungeon is where they both end up connecting, as Yi Sang recognises Hong Lu as someone who heavily resembles Young Ji from the League of Nine, while Hong Lu himself appears to relate to and understand some of Yi Sang's struggles.

This all comes to a head when Hong Lu is the one to recognise the emotional core of what was happening and gives Dante the advice they need to actually reach out to Yi Sang at his lowest.

From this Canto onward, Hong Lu appears to consistently check up on Yi Sang during moments that remind the latter of his past with the League. Hong Lu shows that he not only holds concern for Yi Sang's emotional well-being, but also wants to make sure he doesn't bottle up his thoughts the way he learned he did in his past.

Likewise in Canto 7 Yi Sang is shown to be returning the favor to Hong Lu so to speak, though he's shown to struggle a bit more with processing how Hong Lu responds in comparison.

Outside of these moments, Hong Lu and Yi Sang are shown to generally have a cordial and amicable rapport, both showing curiosity towards each other when they share their respective knowledge and likewise jumping off of each other's observations to add their own. While Hong Lu does tease Yi Sang once or twice, it doesn't read nearly as mean-spirited as some of the shit he pulled with people like Heathcliff and Rodya.

Their relationship is perhaps one of the few on the bus that I can genuinely say is an entirely positive one for both of them. They both clearly care for each other and enjoy speaking with one another, even if they might struggle to understand one another at points. No ifs or buts, they're just straight up honestly decent friends.

It really makes me wonder how Yi Sang is going to take it once Hong Lu's lies are revealed... Compared to a lot of the relationships Hong Lu has with the other Sinners, his bond with Yi Sang seems the most genuine. Will Yi Sang be able to recognise that and will he decide to still stand by Hong Lu side?

Now. As for your second question.

I don't have much to say on Hong Lu's particulars beyond mentioning that their translation is. Interesting to say the least.

According to someone who speaks Korean, the term that got translated to "Bachelor" would more accurately be translated to "Young Master", aka it doesn't really have anything to do with marital status in its original language.

Similarly, the original wording for the "Sheltered" particular is more so an allusion to Hong Lu having a different sense of reality to what is considered normal. It's an interesting specificity that the English translation added that from my understanding wasn't there in the original text.

I don't have much else to add beyond the fact that people are too quick to trust the Manager Instructions as being the ultimate truth on what the Sinners are like. Their description of Ishmael as someone whose "patience runs deep" is proven incorrect in the fucking Prologue where her impatience is directly called out. This shit isn't a trustworthy source of info.

[championoftheoppressed]

Please Watch My Adventures with Superman

This show is just so delightful and manages to capture the essence of Superman in a way a lot of adaptations just don't quite get. If you've ever been curious about Superman, if you've ever felt Superman is too boring for you, or you just enjoy a fun superhero story, I highly recommend checking this series out.

The first season has ten episodes, and the second season has just aired its third episode. In the US, it's available on Adult Swim and Max.

What It's About

If you aren't familiar with Superman, he's an alien -- the last survivor of planet Krypton, sent to Earth as an infant where he was found and raised as Clark Kent. Being an alien, he has extraordinary powers which he uses to lead a double life as a hero. This show focuses on a core trio of Clark, his girlfriend Lois, and their friend Jimmy, all of whom work at the Daily Planet newspaper.

Clark Kent / Superman

One of the main reasons this show works is it understands that Clark is Clark, first and foremost, and Superman is his disguise. Clark is a big friendly nerd. He's a huge sweetheart who cares so deeply about the people around him and the planet that adopted him.

This version of Clark is starting out very young (early 20s), so a lot of this story is about him just figuring things out. He's gradually learning the truth about his origins, the extent of his powers, and how best to be a hero -- all while grappling with the fact that he isn't human and his people of origin may in fact be a massive threat to Earth.

Clark is voiced by Jack Quaid, which you might not expect to work well, but he honestly nails it.

Lois Lane

Lois is loud. She's ambitious. She's intelligent and quick-witted. She doesn't take no for an answer. She has jumped off a building to prove her point -- twice. She is an unstoppable force of nature, and this show refuses to dumb any of those traits down.

But above all, she's kind. She wants to use everything she can do to help people. Her relationship with Clark is also everything you could ever want from a Clois dynamic.

This version of Lois is Korean-American, and voiced by Alice Lee, who does a phenomenal job.

Jimmy Olsen

Jimmy is Clark's best friend and roommate. This version portrays him as a supernatural/paranormal vlogger, running a web series called Flamebird. He's easily excitable, very passionate, as well as one of the most dedicated friends you could ask for.

Following in the footsteps of several previous iterations of the character, this version of Jimmy is African-America. He's voiced by Ishmael Sahid, who's just perfect in the part.

Why It's Great

The characters are all fun and interesting in their own right, while also having a great dynamic with each other -- as duos and as a full trio. And because the characters are shown as being very young and just starting out, they're very relatable. Additionally, every character feels very true to the spirit of their comics counterpart, despite taking a lot of liberties with the specifics.

There's a great cast of villains so far -- Livewire, Task Force X, Mxyzptlk, Parasite, Silver Banshee, and plenty of others that I don't want to spoil. They've also been teasing some really interesting stuff for the Kryptonians, which is noticeably different from any previous adaptations I'm familiar with.

The show is very anime-inspired, giving it a distinct flavor from other Superman adaptations. The creators are clearly having a ton of fun with it. Classic Superman villain Mxyzptlk, who's typically shown as an imp, now looks like he just walked out of a Dragon Ball episode, in an episode called "Kiss Kiss Fall In Portal."

It's also the same animation studio as The Legend of Korra and Voltron: Legendary Defender, who do excellent work. The character designs are unique while still fitting the characters perfectly. I particular love Clark and Superman's designs -- they've struck a balance between making sure he's big and muscular while also retaining a certain softness to his appearance. The fight scenes are fluid and dynamic. It all just works.

[melliae]

Theory about Mephistopheles and the Chinese Identity of our American Girl

It seems my pleas for someone to steal my computer have fallen in deaf ears… At any rate, before starting this short, schizo theory, I have to clarify the following line

It’s not “an observer, and a wishmaker.” There’s no connector or word that implies the observer and wishmaker are different people. They are used in tandem, with no in-between at all.

The observer IS the wishmaker, in other words.

This clarification is important because before it, Carmen seemed genuinely surprised at how censored and blurry Jia Ishmael’s story became (“Oh.”, “[…] I suppose”). That means that she wasn’t the one who did it, and it doesn’t make sense for the observer-wishmaker to do it either. Thus, none of the parties we know of caused that phenomenon.

Now, the question is: what caused it? We know thanks to Yi Sang and Canto VI’s mess that the Mirror reflects the possibilities the individual holds at some level, with the worlds of Abnormalities—living symbols of the unconscious mind—described as “cracks in the mirrored world” and “incredibly narrow and unstable chasms.” Basically, and if we take Binah’s words in LC at face value, Abnormalities and the mind are more fundamental than Mirror worlds, acting as their foundations. Needless to say, this has several implications that I won’t get into, but the core of what I’m saying is that the Mirror Worlds are the possibilities of the mind and are only limited by it (as many players have guessed by now).

So the censored and blurred parts now make sense: they were carefully curated because they blatantly contradict what the observer-wishmaker assumes/thinks what defines Ishmael. If those parts hadn’t been hidden, then the contradictions would have made the observer-wishmaker think that Mirror World can’t possibly exist, making its observation an impossibility and thus denying their wish. Naturally, this also has its own implications that I won’t explain, as the only important thing about it is that we have 2 possible explanations now: either the mind of the observer-wishmaker ignored those parts, which is not very likely due to self-evident reasons, or someone modified what the Mirror showed.

We know from Dante’s Notes, that Identities are found via Mephistopheles’ engine (which, according to Faust, is also called Mephistopheles…), meaning that no one can really mess with what is extracted at all. Obviously, maybe Faust put a strange mechanism that allowed some unknown people to control what the extracted elements show, right? But then, the doubt about how those people know what Dante, as the observer-wishmaker, considers possible emerges.

So now we go into the schizo part…

Dante has a Golden Bough in their head, which is the thing that connects them to the Sinners  (Morositas pretty much confirmed it) and the “sapling” in Limbus’ headquarters. We also know that Golden Boughs have curious interactions with Mirror Worlds as per Canto VI, and they have a similar color to Mephistopheles’ engine…

Basically, Mephistopheles was the one who censored the information in Jia Ishamel’s story, likely due to the connection it has with the Golden Boughs in general (hinted during A Notable Change) and thus with Dante. This obviously presupposes that Mephi is alive at some level, which is somewhat supported by the game, from Charon to the Indigo Elder and Cassetti. Even Dante noted it somehow “evolves” with the Sinners in their notes.

For that matter, this has a literary foundation as well! Mephistopheles fulfilled every wish of Faust in all the variants of the story, and LCB Faust enjoyed stargazing in the past according to her evening greeting—and what kind of existence grants wishes in the universe? Furthermore, A Midspring Night’s Dream 2 seems to support this idea as well, with Charon specifically saying “Mephi, twinkle-twinkle like stars” at the end, after Dante woke up from their “fever dream,” which, as we know from the first April’s Fools event, is likely a glimpse into a Mirror World.

(Besides, how to forget the fact that the last skill of “Vergilius” is Mephistopheles running over the Sinners, and I genuinely doubt the actual Vergilius knows how to drive the Bus or would entertain doing so in those circumstances.)

Now, this also leads us to some interesting implications again: if Mephistopheles is a “star,” wouldn’t that make it a fallen one? Representation Emitter shows how Faust (or at least a Faust-adjacent person) discovered the engine somewhere underground. Consequently, does that mean the Stars are angels or similar creatures? Moreover, what does it imply for Dante’s true identity? In all versions, Mephistopheles is subservient to Faust only and no one else…

[possessable]

old drawing but i think it's funny that both of them end up severely injured by the ends of their fights but Ahab kind of just has to sit there sopping wet pathetic while Ishmael steals the Whale kill . meanwhile Eigong brushes off her Mortal Wounds to jump up to the Root Core like nothing happened . Eigong, how are you doing that? You should be dead . Those injuries were bad enough to kill you in another ending

[aeroblossom]

this gutted me. up until this point the most you'd see is 'can't deploy' when a character temporarily was unavailable. but now? gone. just gone. she doesn't even consider herself part of them. not anymore.

i'm in the process of doing the dungeon still (please excuse me in case something i say here becomes obsolete by the time i finish it). outis' concerns were valid, and i appreciate that dante also addressed them. but given that it took so long for outis to give even ishmael her deserved respect, and that she doesn't trust faust either, it's almost expected that she would be the first to cast suspicion on don quixote.

she is seen as annoying, childish, someone you kind of just have to... tolerate. like you're just going along with them. someone who does not make a significant contribution. so this perceived betrayal is the perfect excuse to make quick work of her - both in outis and ryōshū's eyes. and she entirely predicted this. she knew it would happen.

all this time, she had been living with this hope that she could live a new life. that she could escape the hell she crawled out of. that she could be someone else, someone who isn't sancho. burying the past six feet under, and with it, the helplessness at her core. the knowledge that it is futile. that it is meaningless. and she knew it, all this time. deluding herself with blind optimism, telling herself she could do it, while the knowledge of the truth ate away at her slowly. she pushed away sancho, crushed under her feet the possibility of failure, pretending to be someone she isn't. ignorance was bliss. it was better to be blissfully unaware, to have no memories of who she once used to be.

and instead of the dream she'd hoped to make a reality, the nightmare became her active, living hell. she would not be accepted. those she came to care for and those who cared for her, would not accept her. they wouldn't understand. once they know the villain she thinks she is, she cannot stay. the person who has, until now, often held the group together with her genuine compassion and sparkling personality - left them for good.

the delusion has ended, the dream is over. the fun times are gone. you must face cold, hard reality. the reality that the people you came to love may suddenly turn on you entirely if they ever found out who you are, and how you are. the unending festival has, in fact, ended.

one of the dungeon minibosses is hurting teddy bear. a pained, miserable being that still wants to be loved. who hurts anyone who approaches, but still reaches out, desperate for companionship in endless solitude. sancho thinks she is a threat. she knows she is one. she is 'dangerous', not someone who could ever coexist with these people. it is don quixote who shares fun and painful memories with them, not her. even though they are one. they are one and the same.

in sancho's mind, it is don quixote who has experienced happiness, not her. it is don quixote who deserves to be with them, not her. and now, with rocinante gone, don quixote is no longer here. and with don quixote gone, the last vestiges of her father have left sancho. she has nothing left.

a comfortably painful solitude, the wish to connect with others; the urge to share more of you with people, to hide inside the cage of your mind forever; to never begin so you may never fail, to die trying; to know nothing more than nihility and darkness, to reach out to the light - to hope and to dream no matter how the world ends around you. contradictory traits, complementary traits. they are don quixote and sancho, and they are both herself.

[mossy-green-aka-ferrythem]

It's interesting how I feel like a lot of people misread Heathcliff in Limbus Company.

Like he's clearly just a good guy with a hard exterior who diverges a shit ton from his book counterpart.

Like he's just way more respectful in general, and honestly? Limbus's Cathy might actually be too sweet as well, but that's a subject for another time, really that's a critique I have picked up from what many well read Wuthering Heights-ers have said about Canto 6, and I am inclined to agree with most of what is said because honestly? Canto 6 is probably one of my least favorite Cantos, I think it tries to do too much too quickly, diverge from the core narrative of Wuthering Heights in ways that don't fully work, and just works in a rather odd, and quite honestly, unhealthy dynamic between Heathcliff and Cathy, especially when you consider the base text. (There are a lot of things that I do like about Canto 6 though, so don't think I totally disqualify it or hate it)

I do absolutely adore Limbus Heathcliff as a character though.

He's just such a well manners upstanding guy mostly, who can play up a sort of "jerk" personality, but with little hard feelings. Like you can't tell me he didn't have at least somewhat of a friendly intention.

Also. I find it interesting how Heathcliff and Ishmael have kind of gone back to their sort of rivalry.

I am sure they're still good friends deep down because of their shared experiences though.

This isn't even a "Heathmael real" thing it's like the characters genuinely have a dynamic where many aspects of themselves mirror each other and it causes both a bond and mutual smart-assery between them, resulting in both tension, as Ishmael's more mission based personality clashes with Heathcliff's more unplanned-intuition based approach, while also, they are sort of bonded by experiencing abusive circumstances, with Ahab being just. Ahab, and Heathcliff still growing up in poor circumstances (though it feels like some of the themes that made such a childhood so heartbreaking aren't fully present in Canto 6, but I digress.)

Just making this post because I feel like Heathcliff can get mischaracterized quite a bit, and I am a big time Heathcliff-liker.

Also if anybody wants to bring ships into this uhhhhh...

I like every Heathcliff ship to be honest so don't be surprised if some choices I make lead to more Heathcliff nsfw ship content lol.

(Though I am a bisexual trans woman who's mostly interested in men if they can fuck women good so. Yeah. There's that. I either like woman x woman or sometimes, man x woman if I like the man enough lmfao. Anyways I digress.)

Yeah. I really like Heathcliff in Limbus.

[mossy-paws]

Whats ur favorite piece of limbus/lobotomy lore? Take this as an excuse to yap.

ohhhh boy this is a HARD one, there’s so many aspects of both games that really just punch me in the fucking gut to an absurd degree that it’s difficult to pinpoint just one… if I have to say though, the most emotional parts for me have gotta be probably Ishmael’s canto and the upper layer Sephirot’s backstories/deaths

ishmaels canto just because there’s just geniunely a lot that I resonate with, hell I unironically live by the ocean, go fishing/boating pretty often, have an ocean related name, etc etc. Plus there’s just a lot of myself I see in ishy and she truly is one of my favorite characters (next to Donq of course /silly)

for the upper layer Sephirot, man when I was playing through lob and I got to their core suppressions I had to take a step back for a bit, especially on Giovanni’s/Gabriel’s. I already resonate with Yesod a lot (primarily because he’s probably the most accurate representation of OCD I’ve EVER seen in a piece of media, even if it’s unintentional, and because there’s just a lot of qualities I see in him that I see in myself LMAO), and his story was rough for me to get through (although I didn’t share with Y’know. The self harm and stuff, even still it was highly emotional for me). I didn’t really understand Hod’s when I first got through it (I didn’t pick up on the mention of her death/the treason (I had to have a friend point it out actually (thank you torch if you see this /silly)) so I didn’t really get the full meaning of it until after. For Elijah’s it was just really sad but I sort of anticipated it coming since the game hinted at it so its impact wasn’t really as strong, it was still pretty horrifying though… and for finally Giovanni’s, man his was depressing, I really like how the game showcased how different both his love for Carmen and Ayin’s were. For Gio his was actual, genuine true love, he cared very deeply for Carmen and would do anything to have her feel happy in the world, for Ayin, it was obsessive, and almost cold(?) in a way, colds not really the right word but it was sort of more in a morally-unethical way to the point where he would do absolutely ANYTHING, no matter how brutal, horrifying, or awful of a process it was to get her back in some way or form. The game portrays stuff like this so interestingly and I love how it’s really a psychological horror more then anything- project moon doesn’t NEED gory/scary/etc imagery or whatever to have a good horror game, it’s all psychological and that’s why I love it so much

anyways enjoy my ramble, some other bonus stuff that really stuck out to me too have to probably be Enoch and Lisa both, the disaster at love town (that’s LOR but eh still counts), and probably canto 6

[limbuscompanysituations]

Good day

Which of the sinners do you believe would be most likely to be yanderes/yandere headcanons?

Many thanks

After giving it some thought (under the cut because it became longer than expected):

Yi Sang: Unlikely. He's very puppy/good boy coded. He could never do anything if he saw the target of his admiration wasn't into it. He might, I don't know, jerk off thinking about them then cry?

Faust: Likely. Faust is a genius and if you don't think so, she also knows every outcome. There isn't a single world in which the one she admires isn't into her.

Don Quixote: So likely it hurts the scale of likelihood here. I'm glad I'm not ranking them from most to least likely, or else she would break everything. She knows everything about her crush. She has everything her crush could ever want. And if she doesn't? She will acquire it one way or another. Also even if they say clearly they don't want a single thing to do with her, she will take the "oh it's forbidden love" route and go behind their back to be their "knight in shining armor". Everything she does is in her beloved's best interests. Living her best delusional life.

Ryoshu: She might look like it but no, actually not likely. Don't get me wrong, she's very into whoever she likes, but they have to be a little bit obsessed with her or else it won't work. They have to breach the gap. If not it just turns into artistic obsession, which she deals with by slicing them up a little bit and immortalizing them in agony.

Meursault: Likely. He will make an entire plan with several steps on how to best conquer the one he desires the most. He's going for the most efficient path here and will not care if he has to mentally/emotionally/physically manipulate them as long as he conquers his end goal. Now the tricky part is to get him to have such a visceral interest in somebody. He might lose interest about halfway through planning, who knows?

Hong Lu: Unlikely. Some of his other IDs may be more prone to obsessive tendencies, but he's very... free-spirited at his core. If his crush doesn't want anything to do with him, he will be upset and gloomy about it but he will move on. He gives me the impression of a person who's had to give up many things, even in his life of luxuries. I don't think he'd put much effort to get them.

Heathcliff: Likely, but in a pathetic way. I don't think he's much efficient at this whole obsession thing. He wants to please them but he wants to be loved back. The second part is vital here. Other than him needing their absolute love and approval, he might try to conquer them, fail, get sad/angry about it, go on a journey to better himself so they will for sure feel so stupid for dumping him and then end up not going back? I don't know where I've seen this before...

Ishmael: Likely. And she will go after them. Time after time after time, she will go back to them. She's super smart and she will play the long game to get what she wants too. Prone to planning like Meursault, but much less clinical about it. She will not stop until they are the one obsessed with her. Absolutely and completely loyal and dependent on her.

Rodion: Unlikely. Just like her good buddy Hong Lu, she's very free-spirited. She likes when others are drooling after her because then she can use them as she pleases. She doesn't like this obsessive feeling so she might just take a good distance from her crush and see how it works out for her.

Sinclair: Likely but oh boy this one's hard. This little guy has so many anger issues, as well as self image issues. He will change every aspect of himself to get them to notice him. He will internalize his anger as best as he can, as he is worried about hurting others. But there's only so much of this anger his internal self can take, and once it explodes out of him, he might forcefully try to get control over his crush. He will feel like shit for it and he will hate himself more, but he will reason that they were the one to push him to doing unreasonable things. This route can only leave to a tragic ending for both.

Outis: Likely, but she's tricky... Outis can play the long game, as well as any role she's given. She will become what her beloved wants the most, as a way of having their absolute attention and affection. This façade may crack at times, though. If they ever grow averse to her then she will consider kidnapping and other options.

Gregor: Unlikely. He's old and tired. If his crush doesn't like him, he will take the Yi Sang route (jerk off facedown in bed and cry). He will get over it pretty fast too. He's low energy when it comes to emotional matters. Being obsessed about somebody who doesn't want anything to do with him will lower his emotional energy even further. Might grow lethargic while he tries to get over them.

Bonus people:

Vergilius: Unlikely. He doesn't think he deserves anything good in his life. His eyes will glow brighter as he stares at his crush, and he will be taken by an intense desire to have them closer, but then he will turn away and wallow in his own misery. Even if they wanted him, he wouldn't indulge. Having any connection to him will only lead to tragedy.

Dante: WILDCARD. They have a lot going on for them to pick up an obsession. Between figuring out who they are to figuring out where they should go, there's little to no time remaining to even think about pursuing a crush. Now here's where the wildcard part comes from. Even with their memories completely wiped, it is possible that some strong feelings from their previous life could remain. Maybe they will see that special one out on the street one day, and they will not know why, but they will desire them so strongly it makes them feel dizzy. Might even go crazy trying to figure out who this stranger is and why do they want them so bad.

[necronatural]

Limbus Company theory

Okay, I have absolutely no idea if anyone's noted this yet. Did anyone pick up that the Sinners are held down by a Sin, represented in their EGO, and their Canto are about their struggles against another sin entirely. The branch creates a space for 'penance'. When Rodya entered the field of effect of the branch, Baba Yaga went crazy, freezing the entire mine. There's clearly some paralleling at work here.

So let's go through.

Gregor, Canto 1: Sloth V Gluttony (survival); note that this expedition failed, and we later explore Sloth with Yi Sang

Rodion, Canto 2: Pride V Gloom; note that Rodya refused to actualize

Sinclair, Canto 3: Gluttony (Greed) V Lust

Yi Sang, Canto 4: Sloth V Gluttony (greed); Dante's resonance begins

Ishmael, Canto 5: Gloom V Envy; Dante's resonance progresses

When we look at the dominant sins of the remainder...

Heathcliff, Canto 6: Envy...

Don Quixote, Canto 7: Lust…

Hong Lu, Canto 8: Gloom…

Ryoshu, Canto 9: Wrath…

Meursault, Canto 10: Pride…

Outis, Canto 11: Pride…

Faust, Canto 12: Pride…

Dante, Canto ?: ????

Sins not confronted yet: Sloth, Pride, Wrath

Sinner sins left to explore: Envy, Wrath, Lust (If we're talking strictly what progressed Dante's clock, Gluttony & Pride)

Assuming Dante's doomsday clock setting is moving in 5 minute intervals, Dante currently has 2 positions left on their clock; 5 minutes to midnight and midnight itself. It's made almost explicit that their resonance with sinners is the tool with which they resonate with the branches. By obtaining each sin, they're building to some sort of complete whole.

Predictions based on this theory; Pride being so back-heavy probably means we're going to scramble for branches with Hermann. It gives the impression that for whatever reason Pride is necessary, which is interesting.

My own theory: Rodya says she'll settle in the cold [Gloom] for a little longer, and Sonya says she doesn't have the mark. I'd say this might mean Rodya hasn't sufficiently resonated. Sonya may have tried to bait her in hopes of getting better results in this regard.

This may mean ...

The last few Cantos will be a losing streak (LOL)

Someone who hasn't cleansed themselves of their opposing sin/formed the mark of cain will get the branch; I'd imagine this person shares sins with Dante, Vergilius, or Charon, who I believe are probably Envy, Wrath, and Lust respectively (OOP @ WHO WE'RE MISSING ⬆️)

In that respect Vergilius V Sloth, Charon V Pride, Dante V Wrath. I even think the wrath Dante is opposed to could be Vergilius

Very notable there's only 3 sins missing; it could be possible we already have Dante's branch; they were very obviously part of the group of Cain Marked, and again, their clock started at 25-to-midnight and just kind of sat there for a little while. It's also possible it didn't move until Yi Sang because their sin was Gluttony (ambiguous manifestation)? If Hermann also represents Lust ..... Think about it

Rodya's refusal of the call of Cain might become plot-relevant, just as our failure to observe what happened to Gregor on the myth arc timeline of 3 years ago and relationship with the Big Bad makes it obvious he's going to be a core character in the future. We can tell based on those who have the mark of Cain that he just doesn't have the chops, so mayhaps their mutual exclusion will be a surprise tool that will help us later.

And of course, my theories for the sins that weigh down our remaining Sinners: Heathcliff V Sloth, Don Quixote V Wrath, and Ryoshu V Pride. I predict all the Prides share Rodya's opposing force, which is Gloom; we see this in the books these characters are based on, with Meursault's despair of being sentenced to death being overcome by his Pride, Outis putting herself through grueling trials for the sake of returning to her family, and Faust beginning with suicidal depression leading to her pride creating(summoning) Mephistopheles.

I think it would be pretty funny if Dante was Gretchen's evil baby. Or that Gretchen might have been their previous self, manipulated into giving birth to Dante (extremely vulnerable and exploitable state), which they will be disgusted by and put to death. How many representations of the Divine Feminine in classic literature can Dante represent any% speedrun