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candy8448 · 2 days ago

Text

SUNRISE ON THE REAPING SPOILERS

Reading sotr thoughts

(Including analysis and short essay about it)

Orange = book quotes

I dunno how i feel towards the obvious direct link to katniss in this book is. Like what are the chances that the first victor of district 12 and the "aquaintence" with doctor snow created the word "katniss" and the hanging tree song, also what are the chances that the second victor for districs 12 and the victor of the second quarter quell was friends with katniss' (assumed) father (as well as maysillie, the girl he allies with, being the friend of her mother) and later even becomes the mentor to katniss?

Like i get having the chosen one in books, even if the point of the trilogy was that any random person can start a rebellion, and i get that its cool to have links and its cool to have references but this feels too much because yes panem is HUGE and district 12's seam, while idk how biig it is surely cant be that tiny to be friends eith the exact same people? Idk, suzanne's qeiiting is phenomenal but idk how i feel about the very obvious links and implication that katniss wasn't just some random girl but secretly had ties to very very important people. Idk.

Also im randomly thinking that because at the start of the games there were no career tributes or districts, but i heard that the first quarter quell was that the district had to chose which child would be the tribute. Im thinking, what if that first quarter quell is what inspired the idea of career tributes? Because think about it. That was when snow started to change how the games worked, that the victor would get luxury in the capitol, and the richer districts (1,2,4) would have had the luxury of picking the strongest and most capable children to be tributes, whearas all the poorer districts probably didnt stand a chance so just picked the most frail, going to die anyway of starvation kids to be tributes since they werengoing to die anyway, or some kid that (very sadly, theyre just kids) everyone kinda collectively hates. Just a thought

Also randomly thinking about how i probably dont have the energy to reread it but i wonder how katniss' views an oppinions of haymitch, especially about all the drunkeness and such contrasts to how she thinks of him after her games as she understands his perspective and shares similar ptsd and i kinda wanna reread and look for these small details about how her opinions about it changes throughout the series but again, im too tired to re read them again =_=

"And that's part of our trouble. Thinking things are inevitable. Not believing change is possible."

"That's when she revealed that he's been together some thirty years with the fellow in town who replaces busted windows. They have to keep it quiet because loving differently can get you harrassed by the peackeepers, fired from jobs, arrested even."

I might have missed a detail or something but leanore dove talked about her experience of the covey being arrested and how scary it was but i though that all of the covey got rounded up and put in 12 before the tenth hunger games? So how does leanore dove know what it feels lile so peraonally?

"I dont mean to be a pain, Drusilla, but i'm really low on reaction shots for the recap. Could i just snag a few?"

I dont know how much plutarch is in on the rebellion thing this far into the hunger games timeline, but even if this is so that he can get the families some time together, this seems extra cruel the way he goes way too far and maybe it is to cover his tracks but i also feel like the way he talks to haymitch later, while it is clear he has some rebellious thoughts and wants to help haymitch, i feel like plutarch at this ppint doesnt have the maturity or even the idea of a revelution yet, or at least that is how it seems to me right now

"I guess merrilee isnt too bad, except she tends to go along with everything maysilee does" merilee is katniss's mother right? I never actually knew her name (and tbh i thought that katniss' mother was friends with maysilee, not sisters) so this might go out the window but even now she is super docile and not knowing how to really react or do things on her own which makes sense how she drifts away after her husband's death ig

(About the 10th hunger games) "ive never seen her in any clips of the old shows, but then those early efforts are rarely featured, as they are said to be badly filmed and lacking in spectacle"

It's crazy how fast snow had influnce in how the games were seen, as spectacle became the purpose of the games meaning that it was so easy to hide the tenth games from the capitol 0.0

"I never saw them, but merilee's featured a hummingbird and maysilee's a mockingjay"

Im going to get more into this in a bit but i have things to say about how many coincidences and such are in haymitch's story so far. Like, how does the mockingjay pin get to madge later on? Idk, ill talk about my feelings about this aspect a bit later

"We have some beauties this year" (about the mutts this year)

Definetly a hint about the arena

"Are you serious about breaking the arena?"

Effie being here

Okay here is my ramble about this now. Ive noticed two things. One, there is references to everything and everyone from the trilogy. I dont know about you but i dont like it personally. I get that they would have deffo been alive and around when this takes place however district 12 is massive and the seam is probably a lot lot bigger than the richer district 12 towns, having everyome being friends with everyone that we know from the trilogy, having things like the pin, having effie here, idk. To me they are blatant references just for the sake of having something recognisable. Like effie beiing there, i had assumed from the trilogy that somepoint after haymitch's games that she was hired and then they got to know each other but no, she's right there, it takes out the immersiom of things being unfamiliar and sure im not really well versed in prequels so maybe they always feel like that but it feels like its too much.

Second, i dont really like how haymitch is so much extra rebell-y and how everyone fixates on him (like, talk about a chosen one), but with haymitch being picked out at the reaping illegally, wiress and beety and mags chosing specifically haymitch despite the other three being right there (and they dont know enough about them yet and both maysilee and wyatt standing a similar chance to haymitch from appearance but seemed to zone in on him. Maysilee also seems just as rebellious) and snow and plutarch also picking hum out and it seems so so focused on him like. I was under the impression that after the games snow killed his family and girlfriend because of his plot with the forcefield rather than everything surrounding him and centered on him from the very very start, it takes away from how unfair the games are (which yes even if they are rebelling its still cruel to do that but in the trilogy it came off to me as just the inherrent unprovoked cruelty from snow). Idk it feels too forced like haymitch really is just "the chosen one" of a book rather an unfortunate victim of the system u know?

"Ceasar launches into a breif retrospective of the other fourty-nine games"

Haymitch being the one to name both the "newcomers" and "the near beer careers" despite maysilee supposedly being the nick namey one

This is another point i have, there is wayyyy too much exposition in this book. I havent read tbosas so idk if its similar but something i really enjoyed about the trilogy is how little exposition we dont need for this book's plot. Ive made a short post about why i like it before. However in this book everything is just explianed to us. We are just given every tribute's name, we are given pretty in depth explanations of previous games as well as a LOAD of other information we dont really need for this book. In the trilogy we were only told things we needed in the moment from katniss's perspective and based on the info they teach at schools, anf based on what katniss cares about, making panem and district 12 feel lile a real place and making katniss seem like an actual character and a random girl who stumbles across starting a revolution, however here everything is given to us and a thing about narrative voice is that in this book is that it doesnt feel lile haymitch is talking. In the trilogy katniss is a good person who is nervous and suspicious, doesnt really know hoe to hold herself and strong opinioned, and it all comes off not by her description but by the way she narrates and communicates with the readers. Im not saying haymitch needs to be the same but haymitch doesnt have a personality and i dont know what he is like, the writing is giving me nothing about him other than blank slate "i hate the hunger games" person. He doesnt really have any oppinions on anything and the narration only describes what is going on, the first person pov doesnt really do anything because to me haymitch doesnt really think for himself, he might as well be a third person onmiscient narrator because the first person pov doesnt add substance here.

The narrative voice as well as the too much exposition makes the book feel so much like its judt there tongive people what they want rather than have a message. The only 'message' i can really see rn is "i dont want them to see us as animals" but thay isnt really a message for us its a message for the capitol not really communiicating with us. This was something i was really worried about with the announcement of this book, that the readers would judt want this only for more exposition of haymitch's games (which i was content without cuz thats not the point of this series) but it feels like the writing itself is also taking this view because im more than halfway through and have no feeling of any real message. Also none of the other character have any depth to me either, they all seem one dimentional. Like maysilee is bratty fashion rich kid, wyatt is litterally calculator he has no personality apart for "i will talk numbers now" the mentors are all "we actually have the perfect plan already random kid" without ever really connecting to him beyond him promising beety to not let ampert die in vain, i dont care about these characters the way that the trilogy made me care about rue (obviously) and even characters like foxface and the district 2 girl and marvel, as well as the other careers and other tributes, even though these guys are on our team in this book heck i care more about annie even though we never really see her from the conenction finnick has with her making her feel like a real person. I dont really like the writing of this book tbh and am not very engaged with it. In the trilogy i could get a very in depth sense of meaning and could constantly pick up whispers of themes and ideas littered everywhere throughout the books, it felt like it held a lot of substance and weight and importance for what it communicates with us that this book is lacking.

Like obviously suzanne's wtiting style had changes a lot over the years so that is definetly a factor, and it is a fine entertaining book, and i might be missing something here but to me it feels like it lacks the depth that the trilogy had that let me really internalise it and its messages

Rant over for now (i think), if i have more to say later i will.

Update: i change my opinion a tiny bit later, ive been writing this post as i read along so i realise some stuff more later on)

"District 5 calls an emergency meeting in the green room. As the sole remaining district..."

I thought the career districts were 1,2 and 4, since when was 5 a career district? I think it mentioned somewhere in the trilogy books that 11 used to be a career district but stopped (i dont remember exactly i could be getting this wrong) if so wouldnt 5 have been mentioned as well as a former career district?

"District 5 does their best to highlight out shortcomings"

I find it so interesting that unlike the 74th games, where each tribute tries to advertise themselves, the interviews of the 50th focuses more on uniting and groups, careers vs newcomers, even the 74th careers didnt really advertise their group, but ig in terms of stratedgy, in a hunger game with 48 children there is no way that no matter how an individual advertises themselves, the capitol will not remember a single one of them and that was why alliences whereso kuch more important here, entire districts joined a side, no one (other than haymitch) was alone.

"Public opinion is driven by emotion. People have an emotional response to something, then they come up with an argument for why it logically makes sense."

That... makes so much sense, you can litterally see that in real life, we do that ourselves and villianise anyone who disagrees with us

"Unless every mouthful is precious, because their counterparts are poisonous."

Im thinking that they probably had this game have everything be poisonous because since there are just so many kids, the capitol wants to wipe out as many as they can as soon a possible, all the weak links so that the games dont go on for twice as long as they usually do, however the alliances helps them figure out things sooner which does put a slight stop in their plan and probably made the game go on longer, so it could be seen as a little rebellion in a way. Their counterparts are poisonous so ironically finding every person they can and uniiting, finding every piece of non poisoned food to eat will help them survive and rebell, exactly the opposite of what this games were meant to promote.

"Fire is catching, she'd say, but is this one burns down the arena, i say so good riddance."

Fire is catching, and if we burn, you burn with us 👀👀👀

"We'll paint our own posters, and i know just where we can get the paint"

""Come on, sis. I need this for my next poster" how quickly that's become our shorthand for defying the capitol"

Posters, propos, i guess the point of this book is that rebllion will happen someday, a message in perseverance.

This is such powerful imagery, im going to draw some art of this

Something im glad about is that collins didnt lean too far at all into the gore of having haymitch's guts spilling out, barely even described it at all because even as someone who does read a lot of whump, having the gorey details would jut return this book into being a spectacle. Instead we are focusing on what haymitch is thinking in this moment.

"Sometimes you wonder because her plans dont seem to involve you at all"

Self projecting there, snow?

"Why isn't plutarch's footage here?"

I... dont know why they would have removed that footage, maybe if they were planning to kill the family then they dont want people asking about them so they dont even show that they exist because it would be too coincidence if the entire family just happen to die (not that that stopped them), but then again, who in the capitol cares about the victor's family unless they are the tribute next year? Maybe this is just to show the cruelty of the capitol that all the effort for the footage was ignored. Idk.

""[Jethro Callow] hung himself yesterday when his son returned. Couldn't bare the shame" a booker boy's death"

Im glad he got closure on what wyatt's father thought, even if it was shame of his son dying rather than any actual grief.

"They're joined by a chorus of honking"

Oh i just realised that the reason haymitch raises goose in the mockingjay epilogue was because of leanore dove

"That you may see sweet lucy gray upon the lonesome wild"

This is what i mean by references shoved in our faces, like okay they showed haymitch her singing because she was a victor, but surely in 40 years more covey had died after lucy so there would arguably be a different gravestone, a more recent death that leanore dove was burried next to, but coincidently it was lucy gray's grave he happen to read. Like it still doesnt explain where lucy gray went at the end of tbosas but this means either her body was found and burried or maybe the covey just couldnt ever find her so made her a grave. Idk, some things can just be left open ended i think, lucy gray didnt really have to be mentioned here imo

"And maybe it wont be realised today, maybe not in our lifetime, maybe it will take generations. We're all part of a continuum. Does that make it pointless?"

Yeah i guess the big message of this book is that rebellion requires effort and time but eventually it can and will happen.

That being said, i stand by what i said about the writing, that this message is kinda explicitly told to us with the same note of painting posters and plutarch litterally spelling it out for us, and while the trilogy had its themes of many ruled by few, propaganda, spectacle, it still wasnt forcefeeded and instead communicated organically through the development of the story and the world building and even then i could pick up aditional themes that were not the same but mentioned in the thoughts and descriptions of things, judt enough to where you can notice and internalise the message without even having to describe or explain it, just a whisper of communicating an emotion that allows you to piece together and shape the messae in you head. Small themes sprinkled around that arent related to the big themes but are all exptremely important in their own right and im glad they were mentioned even if i cant fully put them into words but im able to udneratand it internally. Sotr doesnt have any of that its just this one single message about patience and perseverance.

While i changed my mind and dont mind/even like a little that haymitch is rebellious, i still dont like the "chosen one" energy he emmits, that right away he is chosen to carry out the plan, that plutarch picks him, that he was reaped illegally, that snow knows something is up with him from before he really set foot in the capitol, it feels too forced. I like all the little spontainious acts of rebellion with the charriot, drinking snow's milk, the things he did inside the arena (that wasnt the blowing up of the berm) so the flint striker, the running away with lou lou, the three remaining at the tree, the posters etc, all these small things that show haymitch as rebellious and unrelenting, that shows why haymitch still puts effort every year to mentor tributes until finally it works with katniss and haymitch, that shows he isnt the type to give up without just placing him as a blatant chosen one that everyone gravitates towards without seemingly any reason. (Also in the trilogy katniss isnt a chosen one, haymitch does give her attention, but he also gives peeta just as much attention. Its just because we see it from katniss's pov that it almost seems like haymitch bonds with her more but no its clear that haymitch cares about them both through the three books, but in this book its clear that everyone only values haymitch, everyone else is pushed to the side and we never get any sort of indication oof any importance being put on them, and there isnt because they are left in the dark, haymitch is straight up just the chosen one)

Also random point, do you think that the reason haymitch didn't tell katniss and peeta the rebellion plan in catching fire was because when he knew what the plan was it backfired horribly because that was all he was trying to do, so he thought that he shouldn't tell them even though they were the focus of his protection?

"The walls of a person's heart are not imprgenable, not if they have ever known love"

"I finally told our story"

"Katniss showed up with an old basked filled with goose eggs"

Oh my heart

Overall a good book. I didnt like the writing style and it didnt really click with me, it lacks a lot of the depth that the original trilogy had (and im also concious of the idea that while yes it had a message it wasnt as charged as the teilogy and it really did feel like it was a book for the fans to have what they want with haymitch's story and all the unessesary exposition and lore) so i didnt really like it that much. There was like one or two moments with strong imagery but overall i didnt think it had as much quality as the trology did and it didnt really stick with me or communicate with me, it was kinda a meh book where i just followed along a story with no real connection to it how releavnt the messages of the trilogy was to now and how releavnt this should have felt, like yes it may be trying to start a new commentary with themes different to what the teilogy wanted to talk about but i still coouldnt find ANY themes in general related or no. And maybe i did miss something, i would be very glad to start a (FRIENDLY!!) Debate/discussion in the comments or through asks or something. I in fact want to discuss this book more and see what people gained out of it because i really want there to have been a real purpose that maybe i just missed

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