#transcripts from dsmptranscripts on twt

[cdroloisms]

If you're not already burnt out from analysis, do you have any thoughts on the Mexican L'Manberg debates?

hmm i have to rewatch the vod tbh it's been a bit--not many thoughts that haven't been regurgitated a million times though.

something that has always interested me is the whole dethronement debacle/mexican lmanburg debates in relation to how leadership has worked for the greater smp faction, largely because the dsmp was never meant to be a faction and the creation of the official kingship for c!Eret was very much in response to L'manburg at the time. and there is honestly quite a bit of conflict that rises from the fact that the greater dsmp faction was never really meant to have a king in the first place, and the confusion that would arise about what the role of the king even was supposed to be (especially as the idea of c!Dream having any kind of legitimacy was worn away over time.) it'd be an interesting meta to write if i could think of a way to word it all--but it's always fascinated me, in this conflict, how the progression of "he's in charge of the server, i'm in charge of the land" to c!Dream's no-mans-land position of leadership in the dsmp faction progresses as the server goes on is utilized in c!Quackity's favor to effectively block c!Dream out of the conversation (even with so much of this being quite directly an attack on dream in the first place.) something something being king of the dsmp comes with a level of restriction, yes, but also a level of protection--and while c!dream, viewed nebulously as a leader, was also subject to a certain level of restriction to a certain extent (see: his asserting that he couldn't publicly stand against schlatt because of the peace treaty between their two nations), the fact that his leadership was more de facto early on (because the dsmp faction wasn't yet a faction) as compared to the kingship, this conflict is a clear demonstration of how he doesn't have the same political sway as the dsmp king to be able to ask for quite the same level of protection (and hence, how his request for an apology in the peace treaty goes unheeded and how he ends up as a trading piece in the negotiations.)

otherwise, mexican lmanburg definitely has a lot in terms of echoes of c!wilbur and the lmanburg narrative, particularly regarding c!dream's view on factions, which is interesting--c!dream has never actually been "anti-people doing what they want in a group," but of course that's how things ended up being popularly seen because. gestures. and of course, there's the whole idea that every single conflict on the server ever was initiated by c!dream which...again, lmao. along those lines:

[thinks abt lmanburg. a lot] yeah.

and lastly...this isn't really just a mexican lmanburg thing, but c!dream around this time was kinda known to reacting to threats by basically doing the thing where he would make like, a laundry list of threats, right, just really over-the-top stuff that would freak people out like hell, right? we see it in exile negotiations, we see it in mexican lmanburg debates--

and you know, they've regularly been pointed to as you know, look how crazy evil he is an how he overreacts to shit and etc, whatever. and it does interest me how these speeches are quite similar in pattern to moments post-prison as well:

specifically being quite consistent with moments where he's feeling, well, a bit unstable. it's an intimidation tactic that c!dream has long used, of course (white flags speech is a well-known example) but it's interesting to see it often in context of c!dream being to some degree, scared (or paranoid)--even in white flags, that was obviously a conflict that c!dream treated seriously that was quite a bit different in character from conflicts that preceded it on the server and therefore demanded a greater level of wariness and caution from him. always interesting, to me, the ways that certain actions for c!Dream are so deeply related to fear, feeling attacked (compared to, say, c!sam who would do the whole I Am The Warden power play against anyone that he felt challenged his authority)

very very scattered thoughts, but um--yeah! i really should rewatch this stream especially bc the transcript is incomplete, but alas

[honeyblockm]

why do i have to post "analysis". is it not simply enough to beam my thoughts into everyone's brains.

ummmmmm okay so the sapnap/technoblade parallels show up when you look at how they approach loyalty and bonds, I guess. Like the whole "those who treat me with kindness i will repay tenfold / those that treat me with injustice i will repay a thousandfold" thing. Uh. sorry my analyses read very stream of consciousness because i can't hold onto structure for the life of me.

also shoutout to twt dsmptranscripts ily + you're everything to me + if i bring up a quote or even reference an event there's a 60-70% chance i checked w the transcripts

venn diagram hold onnnn venn diagram! i guess i'll go through each of these points and elaborate (and by elaborate i mean A LOT haha this got so much longer than I expected it to be) under the read more

OKAY let's fucking go!!!!

my special little guy - exactly what it says taller than sapnap - by a LOT. sapnap is a short king (canon, dxd whispered it into my ear as i slept) and techno is Big. kills pets/kills orphans - these two things are on the exact same level in terms of severity

strong emphasis on personal loyalty

okay going to be serious this time but i wouldn't say either of them lack principles or something because that's just blatantly untrue it's just that sap and techno both come across as people who will prioritize their bonds over principles. well techno doesn't because of the whole anarchist thing but he does. uh.

like like like techno's actions showed this trait in more recent lore with the prison break stream withhhh ranboo, who he's made evident his care for and also ranboo is his friend. from the start of the arc, techno's breaking into the prison because ranboo is in it. sorry rivalsduo but i don't think c!techno gives a shit about dream he's been sitting on the blueprints and making plans but literally the day after ranboo gets arrested he's like guys we need to get into pandora right now immediately. and during the break in/breakout he's clear that he's not leaving w/out ranboo and then theres everything w/ ranboo dying and finding michael. because the other thing techno holds tight to is his word, in this case dream's favor, but while we've yet to see what he'll do when his relationships come into conflict with his promises, the prison break is a case where they both aligned in trajectory (break someone out of the prison) but to me it showed his friendship with ranboo taking priority over the favor.

but i want to talk about bedrock bros.

okay sapnap time! I think he's a lot moreeeee clearly defined by his loyalty to the people he cares about like siding with dream and george

[cdroloisms]

well, both of them are literally insane and “mutually assured destruction” was the theme of their alliance in Pogtopia

I mean, both of them are delusional and historically have struggles with their perceptions of reality versus what's actually true, so like, yeah fair enough to that. But in terms of like...the mutually assured destruction part, what I'm assuming you're referring to is how the stated plan for c!Dream and c!Wilbur (c!Wilbur first saying so in Vassal and c!Dream repeating his words to c!Eret a month later on the 16th) is the idea that the goal that they shared was for Manberg and Pogtopia to destroy themselves. But I wouldn't say this uh really counted as mutually assured destruction for the two of them?

Like the point of that era and c!Dreambur in that era is very much that they were on the same team, not that--as is the case with mutually assured destruction--that two sides are both discouraged from fighting each other because the destruction would be total on both sides. Like, mutually assured destruction is about two sides being deterred from engaging actively in conflict with each other because they know that they'll both end up with losses that are too high, while c!Dream and c!Wilbur's whole deal according to the two of them was purposefully inciting conflict that would lead to the total destruction of two sides that neither of them were a part of. As Wilbur himself says:

(Honestly the name for the AU was kinda shit but considering I have several AUs named after the discord channels that birthed them, like, I just can't name shit for my life man I don't know what to tell you)

(Also people referring to c!Dreambur as MADduo often misses out on the whole. Possession thing at play, which makes me sadge 😔 It sets them up as opposing sides in a way that I think doesn't exactly reflect the consistency with which c!Dream ends up swayed to work on c!Wilbur's terms and to believe that he is, in small or large part, correct about matters. Which is fascinating. People have a tendency to portray their relationship as being much closer to equals than I think is accurate, personally.)

[cdroloisms]

Forever crying at Dream telling Tommy “I was tortured. I’m sure you knew about that, sure you wanted it to happen” (Paraphrased, it was something along those lines) bc like holy shit my boy

ayyy i was just compiling the parallels so here's the quote for u anon!

and yeah the whole. god. all of it. and it really does suck too because c!tommy...while he reacts to this like ???? in the moment--he does. know. and not only does he knows, but he is one of the ONLY (as in, like, basically THE only) people to confront c!quackity over the torture!

(transcript courtesy of @/dsmptranscripts on twt, per usual)

like. honestly. his tone here is pretty condemning--even if he might think c!Dream is a right fucker who deserves what he gets, he's far from comfortable with the idea of torture, including torturing Dream. he's not excited about it, he's not happy about it, he's not enjoying it. but of course, c!Dream doesn't know that, does he?

[cdroloisms]

hi sorry i. just saw the c!awesamdream iceberg graphic and i knew about most of the things but wh. WHAT fantasy about having dream screaming and crying beneath him???

thaaaat comes from LN2, the prequel to the first Las Nevadas stream! quackity is trying to convince sam that they should kill dream after tommy died, sam is moping on his island before he reveals his little torture tool bunker basement in said island and on the way to the prison uh is . Is very normal about killing Dream, I Think.

(transcripts under the cut! courtesy of @/dsmptranscripts on twt)