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An analysis of Corvus Corax and Konrad Curze’s Relationship

There is so much potential between those two that isn’t explored in canon, with them being designed as narrative foils. However, much of what the fandom understands of their relationship comes from their primarch novels, as that is where most of their canon interactions lie, besides the scene at Isstvan V. However, the characterisation of Corax in these two novels is very inconsistent with his backstory, other novels and codexes, so it is not an adequate source to understand Corax’s character, or his relationships. I would recommend anyone that wants to learn about Corax to read Deliverance Lost instead of his primarch novel.

Here I will first break down the issue with Corax’s characterisation in his primarch novel, and then analyse the relationship between Corax and Curze with this mind.

I will put the conclusion here, and the detailed explanation with quotes below the cut:

Before the Heresy, Corax did not hate Curze, and overall had positive views of him. Curze has complicated feelings about Corax, stemmed from jealousy, and views him as a better version of himself which he projects his feelings onto.

Whats wrong with Corax’s primarch novel

Note: This section is long, and exists because most of the fandom’s perception of Corax and his relationship between Curze comes entirely from this novel alone. However, his characterisation in this book largely contradicts other canon material about him. This section will aim to explain why that is the case, and why this novel is a terrible source for character analysis. OP has very strong opinions about this. You can skip it if you want. I have also translated another lore post regarding Corax which can be found here.

Corax’s primarch novel and Curze’s primarch novel are written by the same author, Guy Haley, while most of Corax’s other novels and short stories are written by Gav Thorpe. In his own primarch novel, and in his appearances in Curze’s, Corax is characterised as sheltered, arrogant, naive, obsessed with the idea of “justice” and ignorant of the grim nature of their world. This is intended to juxtapose with Curze, who is presented as more mature in his outlook of the world, and less hypocritical in his actions. While this characterisation of Curze is compliant with the rest of canon and accepted by the fan base, the way Corax is characterised here is a direct contradiction to his other appearances in novels and codexes, and is only here to serve as a foil to Curze, who is presented in a more positive light in these two novels. Hence, I would argue this novel should be excluded when analysing Corax’s character, and especially when concerning his relationship with Konrad Curze.

Once again, anyone interested in learning more about Corax should go read Deliverance Lost first. Do not start on his primarch novel. In fact, I would not recommend reading it until you have finished all other HH novels and short stories about him, and only if you want to experience psychic damage.

The battle of the Carinaean Sodality, the major focus of his primarch novel, is also covered in the HH Black Books, albeit in less detail. There are two major differences in the turn of events: the first being how the Raven Guards made the incorrect strategic decision to chase down Arch-Comptroller Agarth, the second being there is no mention of Konrad Curze or the Night Lords whatsoever. Clearly, these elements were added by the author for his own agenda. While it is common for there to be contradicting knowledge about the events in the WH universe, in this case, one version is clearly more compliant with the rest of canon.

It is revealed in Curze’s novel that the disastrous campaign at Carinaean Sodality in Corax’s primarch novel occurred as a result of Curze’s doing, intending to teach his naive younger brother a lesson through practice:

'Corax affronted me, ordering me about like that. When the call came for the Eighth Legion to terrorise the Carinaen Sodality into submission, I arranged to be elsewhere,’ he told the flesh sculpture. 'I foresaw the event, and what would occur there when I was too far away to assist, and how poorly Corax's failure while acting in my stead would reflect on him. I assume he learned his lesson.’

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

The author’s intention is very clear here: the entirety of Corax’s novel is to compare him to Curze, portraying Curze in a more positive light in that he is not a hypocrite in his wrongdoings, and up-playing the relationship between them for this effect. Corax’s characterisation is changed specific for this reason.

The second major difference is how the Raven Guards made the mistake that caused great losses in the campaign. his primarch novel, he was insistent in deploying his entire Legion to hunt down one person in the name of justice, despite vehement objections from all his closest commanders.

Corvus Corax faced the crew upon the command deck of the Saviour in Shadow. ‘Arch-Comptroller Agarth is to be hunted down. Fleet to adopt wide search patterns. Find him. Bring him to me.’ There were mutters of agreement. But not all were convinced of this course of action. ‘What about the rest of the system?’ asked Agapito. ‘The Twenty-Seventh Expeditionary Fleet will make an immediate assault upon the Thousand Moons, as per Fenc’s plan.’ Agapito hesitated before speaking. ‘What is it, brother?’ asked Branne. ‘If we are not there to support them, they will struggle. With us at their side, we can end this quickly before the cities reach optimal firing situation. Without us–’ Corax’s pale white face leaned towards his old comrade in arms, interrupting him. ‘Agapito, Agarth has denied us the opportunity to show convincing force. He has escaped. If we allow Agarth to go free, we will undermine the Carinae Sodality’s understanding of Imperial justice. The elite will see themselves free of consequence, the populace will despair that we cannot save them. We cast ourselves as saviours from tyranny and the bringers of civilisation to all men. We lie if Agarth does not face justice. Those who commit outrage cannot be allowed to escape. We will hunt him down and destroy him.‘

Corax: Lord of Shadows, Chapter 15 - Guy Haley

There are several things wrong with this. Firstly, if anything, the one obsessed with justice has always being Curze, not Corax, so it’s quite strange how this is cited as his motive. Secondly, Corax has always valued independent thoughts in his subordinates, and he had always found it important to listen to and heed their counsel. Even if there are disagreements, he would choose to explain his thoughts rather than yelling at them from the start. His behaviour here does not correspond to how he is characterised literally everywhere else.

‘We can’t let them attack again,’ argued Reqaui. ‘They got thousands more troops to send and don’t care none about their losses. It don’t matter that we have an army of men willing to lay down their lives, we just can’t match them. They’ll come again and again and again until we’re dead or back in the cells.’ ‘I wish I had never considered it,’ said Corvus, staring at the orb of Kiavahr through the wide window of the guard officers’ mess. The couches were ripped and bloodstained, the ornately carved and lacquered tables and cabinets riddled with bullet holes and scarred by las-fire. ‘It is too extreme. There are millions on that world who labour under the yoke of the guilds as much as we did, and who have committed no offence against us.’

‘Break the power of the guilds,’ urged Reqaui. Corvus nodded reluctantly. There was no other way. ‘Great,’ said Nathian. ‘Let’s get a move on, no time to waste.’ ‘It has already been arranged,’ admitted Corvus. He sank down into the couch vacated by Nathian, long legs stretching out across the burnt carpet. ‘Turman and Wing One have loaded five atomic charges into drop-shuttles. Their guidance systems have been locked on to Nairhub, Toldrian Magna and Chaes. All I have to do is send them the order.’ Ephrenia pulled herself up with a grunt of pain and hobbled across the room. She lowered herself to the floor beside Corvus and rested her arm on his knee. ‘Time won’t make it any easier to give that command,’ she said, looking up at him with soft eyes. With a sigh, Corvus gestured to Agapito, who pulled the radio from his jacket pocket and tossed it across the room. Catching it easily, Corvus flicked the switch to transmit. ‘Turman, this is Corvus,’ he said slowly. ‘Launch the shuttles.’

Deliverance Lost, Chapter 17 - Gav Thorpe

Corax had always been good at listening to counsel from his subordinates, even from the days of the uprising in Lycaeus. In this passage, he asked the opinion of every single one of his commanders, and changed his mind after their counselling. While all primarchs are, at heart, ill-tempered and prone to violence, Corax is comparatively mild-mannered, and usually only his enemies face his anger.

The event here is also an important note on Corax’s view on war. Here, he chose to drop the atomic charges despite the civilian casualties, a “path of least resistance” approach characteristic of the Imperium. He is not so innocent like he is portrayed in his primarch novel that he does not understand the sacrifices in war, and he certainly does not need Konrad Curze to teach him this.

Curze has a much stronger moral compass than Corax. If he was faced with the same decision, he would find it much more difficult to choose to drop the atomic charges, because it involves the death of innocents, something against his values. Meanwhile, Corax would explain this as a necessary sacrifice, a view more consistent with the rest of the Imperium.

If anything, the Nev brothers are even more hot-headed than Corax. It makes no sense they’re the ones holding him back.

Sealed within their sable battle plate the Raven Guard suffered little ill-effect, but the ordinary citizens of Zenith-312 and the soldiers of the Imperial Army were reduced to a frothing, mindless horde that numbered in the tens of thousands. Immediately, the Raven Guard found themselves under assault from all sides by the clawing mass of stricken humanity. Within minutes many had exhausted their supplies of ammunition and had to hack a path onwards with combat blades and gore-slick chainswords. In the hours that followed, the Raven Guard were forced to slaughter the maddened population of Zenith-312 and the men who had stood as their allies for so long, granting them the mercy of death as the Legion swept the voidcity clean. In the aftermath of the fighting, it was discovered that the Arch-Comptroller Agarth had used the massacre of his own people to shroud the escape of his personal shuttle, carrying a cadre of loyal servants and Zenith Guard. This news is said to have incensed Lord Corax and many of the usually stoic Raven Guard, recalling the brutal methods of the Kiavahran overlords who had once held Deliverance in their thrall, and the Raven Lord swore to bring the Arch-Comptroller to account for his actions. The Raven Guard abandoned the prosecution of Carinae’s conquest, and focussed all of its efforts into locating the escaped Arch-Comptroller.

The Horus Heresy Book III Extermination, p. 153

In the HH Black Book, which would’ve served as a template for the plot of the primarch novel, it’s stated that many Raven Guard commanders, as well as the primarch himself all chose to impulsively go hunt for the Arch-Comptroller, because they had to kill their own allies and because they were reminded of their oppressors on Kiavahr. This action is stemmed from a collective personal vendetta rather than Corax’s own abstract desire for justice. That seems more of a Curze thing. This change was introduced entirely so Corax can be compared to Curze. While Corax normally does peak of justice as well, to him it’s less of a priority than to Curze, and the way it’s addressed in this novel is entirely Curze’s opinion copy-pasted.

While Corax has always being presented as an idealist, he is certainly not hopelessly naive as characterised in his primarch novel. Even if Corax had very good parent figures growing up, he still grew up in a prison world, and not all prisoners there were kind like the political prisoner that found and raised him.

The primarch was no stranger to moral compromise. During the uprisings in Lycaeus he had needed every able man and woman for his freedom fighters and not all of the prisoners on the moon had been political internees. Some had been justly convicted murderers, rapists, thieves and wretches of the worst order. The overthrow of the corrupt regime had meant compromising the punishment – and justice for the victims – of these miscreants, but such was the necessity. In turn, once the techno-cults had been overthrown those that survived had been granted pardon for their deeds during the war, as Corax had been forced to promise them.

Soulforge, Chapter 2 - Gav Thorpe

Some of those criminals were included in his Legion after, because he recognised the need for cruel people, and the rest he freed as promised, even if it goes against his ideals. This is very characteristic of the in-universe values, and demonstrates that while he is an idealist at heart, he recognise the need for compromise in politics.

As well as this, the Emperor had felt fit to reveal the secrets of the Warp to Corax, pretty early on. The details of when and what the Emperor told him differs between versions, but the point stands. The Emperor felt that he could be trusted with this knowledge, and it is a secret he kept well, even from his sons. This would make no sense if he was the way he was characterised in his primarch novel.

While it is known that the Master of Mankind and the XIX th Primarch spoke for long hours, what passed between them remains a matter of conjecture. With the benefit of hindsight, some have claimed that the Emperor spoke to Corax of things men, even some other Primarchs, were not yet ready to hear; of the truth of those powers that seethe within the Warp and the darkness soon to come. Certainly, it appears that when the full horror of the Warmaster’s treachery unfolded there were elements Corax seemed to have been forewarned of, though he only ever passed such knowledge on to his forces as and when they needed and were ready to assimilate it.

Horus Heresy Book III Extermination, p. 133

When considering other sources and Corax’s characterisation from other novel, it seems that the result at Carinaean Sodality is due to a collective impulsive act from the entire Legion, which reveals the unique character of the Raven Guard. However, in the primarch novel, this event is presented as the primarch’s own strategic blunder caused by his own naïveté, exacerbated by his refusal to accept counsel from his commanders. This was done to reveal Corax’s character flaws, in order to contrast him with Curze. However, none of the traits raised in this correspond with other canon material, therefore, this book is not a good source for any character analysis involving Corax.

This also brings me to the next point. His primarch novel had the highest mentions of “Curze” and “Night Haunter” in any novel or short story about Corax. Curze gets mentioned more in this book than the ones taking place straight after their fateful encounter on Isstvan V. While Corax does think about Curze sometimes after the Dropsite Massacre, other traitor primarchs, notably Angron, also gets mentioned together. This makes sense because the entirety of Corax’s primarch novel was intended to act as a foil for Curze, so he kept comparing himself to Curze in story. However, he rarely does that in any of the other novels. And as mentioned above, due to the rampant discrepancies, this novel is not a fit source for character analysis, so this point will largely not be considered.

[End of why Corax primarch novel is toilet paper section, you may skip to here]

However, it is true that despite the vast potential, there is very little actual canon interaction between them. Here are the sections I will be looking at:

Curze’s primarch novel While I have established that the characterisation of Corax by Guy Haley is bad, it seems that the consensus regarding the characterisation of Curze in his primarch novel is accepted by the fan base. Corax’s appearance in this book is short enough that his characterisation is mostly alright, and his response to Curze here is supported by other sources, so it will be considered.

A Raven Guard artefact, intended as a gift for Curze

Their fight at Isstvan V

Two Lords of the Night

The meeting between Corax and Curze that occurred in the flashback of Chapter 6 of Curze’s primarch novel is one of the two canon interactions between them, and this passage revealed a lot of information about how they feel about each other.

'We followed similar paths. We should have had so much in common, and yet Corax always hated me. He thought I was barbaric, cruel. Him! The noble freedom fighter who incinerated untold thousands in atomic fire to secure his great moral victory. He understood the value of atrocity well enough, even if he pretended not to.’

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

This is the passage commonly quoted as proof for how Corax hated Curze. However, as this is taken from Curze’s monologue, it can only prove that Curze thinks Corax hates him, and Curze thinks everyone hates him. In fact, if you look at how Corax treats him in the flashback, the opposite conclusion can be drawn.

One important thing to note about this section is that the flashback section written from Sevatar’s perspective, and he is very biased towards Curze. His comments about either primarch should not be taken as face value. It should also be noted that while it is canon that the Raven Guards and the Night Lords do not like each other, and do not like collaborating on campaigns, it does not mean their primarchs must hate each other extra.

'Brother,' said Corax. 'I come to you without violent intent, but please, explain to me what is going on in this city.’ His voice was soft like the Night Haunter's, though not as sibilant, and with a more measured tone. Sevatar refused to let it beguile him. The threat Corax made was clear enough.

Corax broke the silence first. 'What is the meaning of this, my brother?' he said, gesturing metre-long claws at the mess of the slain. 'What happened to your warriors?' Unable to help himself, the Night Haunter snarled. He caught it and turned it into a mocking smile, but not before all present had seen his anger. He was a predator challenged by something just as dangerous. For a moment, Konrad Curze exhibited weakness. 'I happened to them,’ said Curze evenly. Corax looked over the ruined flesh in the room in disbelief. 'What have you done?' Curze smiled blackly. 'An internal dispute, Lord Corax,’ he said airily. 'A Legion matter, that I have resolved. You must understand, there are many criminals in your Legion also. You have your ways of dealing with those who stray too far from the bounds of good conduct.’ He poked a blade of Mercy through the shattered eye lens of a helm and held it up for Corax to see. ‘This is mine.’ Corax's eyes lingered on the blood staining Curze's chin. ’Then perhaps you could tell me why you are bombarding this already compliant sector?'

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

Throughout this entire exchange, Corax’s demeanour was calm when he asked Curze for answers. Despite the fact that he arrived with his Shadow Wardens fully armed, he left without any violent exchange, meaning he accepted Curze’s explanations.

Curze described this exchange as Corax “affronting“ him, but there is actually nothing aggressive or judgemental about Corax‘s demeanour the entire time. Curze thinks Corax is attacking him, because he thinks everyone hates him, and lashed out briefly in anger, as he felt challenged by Corax’s questioning. This is quite characteristic of their interactions. Curze feels challenged by everything Corax does, and in the following moments of vulnerability, he retaliates through the use of sarcasm and intimidation. He is trying to rile Corax up, for if Corax reacts in anger it shows they’re more similar.

Corax registered that Curze probably ate parts of the Legionaries he killed, but did not comment on the fact, and he is not disgusted by it as Curze expect, as he doesn’t register the moral problem with that. His lack of response is not silent judgement. He genuinely do not think there’s a problem with it, or he would’ve commented. One important point to note is that Corax appears devoid of emotions because he actually does not have opinions on most things, nor does he have a clearly defined moral compass the way Curze does. He also does not process sarcasm, which is partly why he is not offended at all.

Curze's narrowed eyes crinkled with a smile. A little tension bled from the room. 'We are the weapon of fear no other Legion dared to be. We are the glorious Eighth. You think I am a monster. I am a simple tool, like you. We have different uses, though identical edges.’ 'I do not think anything about you,' said Corax. 'Other than the disgust I feel for your methods.’ Curze shrugged. 'You may join the line of all the others who feel the same. I don't care. I am exactly as the Emperor intended me to be. Are you really any better than I, Corax shadow-skulker? The Eighth are open in our murders. The Nineteenth are assassins. We are all killers. We are brothers in method as well as in blood.’

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

This is the entire conversation in a nutshell:

Konrad: You hate me

Corvus: No I don’t

Konrad: It’s OK if you hate me. Everyone hates me

Corvus: But I don’t?

Corax did not, at any point, say he hates Curze. He has no personal opinion on Curze; his main issue here is with Curze bombarding a compliant sector and wasting the Imperium’s resources. Curze’s insistence that everyone, especially Corax, must hate him stems from his self-hatred, and this is especially elevated because Corax is the one out of his brothers most similar to him, a point he also emphasise to Corax. He is the one that likes comparing himself to Corax, not the other way around.

Curze’s insistence that Corax must hate him is stemmed from his own self-hatred and jealousy. He feels better about his hatred for Corax if it’s reciprocated, and believes Corax should hate him, because he hates himself. Everything Curze accuses Corax of calling him is his perception of himself. He thinks he is a monster, he thinks everyone hates him and he thinks Corax is better than him, so he attempts to put those words into Corax’s mouth. It doesn’t matter that Corax denies it, because this is Curze’s perception of himself.

Because of their similarities in physical appearance and designation, Curze is constantly comparing himself to Corax, and considers him to be the better one out of them. Curze is jealous of him, and tries to provoke him and belittle him by insisting they are on the same level. Everything he attack Corax with is something he feels about himself. He does not like that he is a tool of the Emperor, so he provoke Corax with this. Corax is actually aware of this and accepts this role, unlike Curze. He does respond to Curze’s provoking and may not even be aware of it.

He sneered, gnawing at his skin until blood ran. 'I'll tell you why. Envy of his mastery lay behind my hatred. I haunted the night, but Corax owned it.’ Breath hissed through dagger teeth. 'He owned it. My stupid, short-sighted sons thought the Ravens' abilities came from technology given only to the Nineteenth. I saw it was innate. Imagine what I could have done had you given the same gifts to me? How much more perfect a monster I would have been had the shadows loved me as much as they loved Corax!'

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

To Curze, Corax represents a better version of himself, a better possibility. His existence reminds Curze of his own faults, and it pains him, which is why being in Corax’s presence makes me feel challenged. It doesn’t actually matter too much to him what Corax thinks of him, as Corax to him is more like a reflection in a mirror that he projects his feelings onto. He thinks Corax hates him because the better version of himself should hate him.

Corax's black, unreadable eyes rested on Curze for several seconds. 'I will return to my ship. Stop this bombardment. The conquest is falling behind schedule. We risk turning the population further from the Emperor's light.’

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

Corax’s main issue with what Curze was doing here was that bombarding a compliant sector is a waste of the Imperium’s resources and delays the progress of the Great Crusade. He had no issues with Curze personally, nor with the methods he used to dispose of miscreants in his Legion.

'First Captain,' that silky, miserable voice said. 'Does he believe it to be true, that your Legion is a weapon of fear?' 'He does.’ 'Do you believe it?' Sevatar did not reply. ‘I say many of the other Legions see you as a coterie of sadists and murderers,' said Corax. His voice was totally isolated from outside noise, and spoke eerily into Sevatar's helm. 'So I ask you again, do you believe it?' 'My Lord Curze, Sevatar said stiffly, and severed the vox.

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

Ignoring all of Sevatar’s pointed commentary, we can come to the conclusion that Corax is reaching out to him out of concern for his brother. He’s asking for a second opinion because Curze is difficult to communicate with. He reiterated these opinions about the Night Lords neutrally. However, Sevatar is also unwilling to communicate with him.

This is what happens when Corax actually hates someone:

In answer, Perturabo accused Corax of seeking to avoid battle, a crime verging on dereliction for a Primarch of the Legiones Astartes. The two very nearly came to blows, with only the intervention of Leman Russ staying bloodshed.

Horus Heresy Book III Extermination, p. 135

‘I struck Horus once for usurping the victories of the Raven Guard for his own glory, a moment that no doubt festers in the Warmaster’s thoughts. I aim to repeat the insult, whenever I can.‘

Ravenlord, Chapter 7 - Gav Thorpe

No Night Lord was harmed in this exchange, despite the fact that Corax came fully armed with his elites, who clearly wanted a fight as much as the Night Lords. If he hated Curze as much as Curze believes, he would not had left peacefully.

For some unfathomable reason, that made Curze cringe, and he nodded like a rebuked child. His sons wavered in their adoration, then Curze gathered his dignity and his wits. Standing from the pile of the dead, he clothed himself in a primarch's majesty, obliterating memories of the pitiful, cannibal thing he had been a few moments before.

Konrad Curze: The Night Haunter, Chapter 6 - Guy Haley

As soon as Corax left, so does his influence, and Curze recovers his composure. Being in Corax’s presence makes him go really defensive.

From this exchange, it can be seen that Corax does not hate Curze, and shows concern for him. Curze has complicated feelings for Corax, stemming from jealousy. He sees Corax as a better version of himself, and projects his own self hatred onto Corax. He constantly tries to rile him out, with limited effect.

A Gift

EX TENEBRIS Ex Tenebris is a masterwork bolter fitted with an incredibly sophisticated telescopic scope system. Chapter legend has it that the weapon was forged by Corax himself, as a gift for his wayward brother, the Night Haunter. But the Horus Heresy turned the two Primarchs’ Legions against one another, and Ex Tenebris was instead borne into battle by heroes of the Raven Guard.

Raven Guard Codex 8th edition, p. 58

This is highly unusual because while Corax does create weapons and artefacts, most of these were made for his sons or himself, and there is no record of him crafting such gifts for other primarchs, not even for the ones he is known to be friends with such as Leman Russ and Roboute Guilliman.

The weapon is also designed to fit Curze’s fighting style, a gift with much thought put into it. Clearly, Corax must have like Curze a lot to make such a gift for him.

There are also a lot of implications as to what may have happened. What exactly caused Corax to not give out the gift? The most likely explanation would be that the Heresy happened, but that would mean that the gift was completed quite late, and by that point the Night Lords have already accumulated a reputations among the Legions, and Curze’s mental state has been steadily deteriorating. That means Corax must have cared for him despite all that. If the gift was completed earlier, then another event would’ve been the reason that Corax didn’t give it out. Or perhaps Curze rejected the gift? There is a lot of room for speculation regarding the details, but one thing is clear: There was a point in their relationship where Corax liked Curze enough to craft him a weapon, a treatment normally reserved for his sons.

Battle at Isstvan V

The fateful battle at Isstvan V is also an important point in the relationship. Very little detail was included in the original codex, so the author of the novel had free reign, and his choices here are very interesting, and most likely setting up for future interactions, which unfortunately never happened because Curze went ahead and died.

The most interesting thing about this section is the differential treatment of Corax and Curze of each other, compared to how they treated Lorgar.

And there he stood at the heart of the killing fields, winged and haloed by amorphous contrails of psychic fire, shouting his brother’s name into the storm. Corax answered with a shriek of his own – the call of the betrayer, the cry of the betrayed – and the raven met the heretic in a clash of crozius and claw.

The First Heretic, Chapter 26 - Aaron Dembski-Bowden

This is the start of the fight between Corax and Lorgar. They do not acknowledge each other and get straight into the fighting.

‘What are you doing?’ Corax cried into his brother’s face as their weapons locked. ‘What madness has taken you all?’

‘Answer me, traitor,’ the Raven Lord grunted. His dark eyes were narrowed at the sickening light that haloed Lorgar. ‘You… are a poor reflection of our father… with that psychic gold.’ Lorgar felt himself slipping back in the mud, his boots grinding across the earth as his brother’s strength leaned heavier against him. He couldn’t break the weapon lock this time. Both Corax’s claws clutched at Illuminarum’s haft, burning the handle and the Word Bearer’s hands. ‘I am bringing the truth to humanity,’ Lorgar breathed. ‘You are destroying the Imperium! You are betraying your own blood!’ The wildness in the Raven Lord’s black eyes was something Lorgar had never even imagined before. Corax had always seemed so taciturn, so devoid of passion. That this warrior lay beneath the albino facade was a horrendous revelation.

‘But he lied to us,’ Lorgar spoke through lips that produced more blood than language. ‘Father lied.’ The claws jerked, snagged against Lorgar’s enhanced bones. Corax tore them free, inflicting more damage than the first impaling had done. Blood hissed and popped as it evaporated on the force-fielded blades. ‘Father lied,’ Lorgar said again. He was on his knees, hands clutched over the ruination of his stomach. Corax’s black eyes gave nothing away. He stepped closer, his one functioning claw raised to execute his brother.

The First Heretic, Chapter 27 - Aaron Dembski-Bowden

Corax is questioning Lorgar here, but he is not actually interested in the answer. His words here are more just him venting his anger at betrayal, and by the end of the exchange he is no longer responding to Lorgar at all except with his lightning claws.

Corax looked to meet eyes as black as his, in a face as pale as his own. His claw strained against a mirroring weapon, both sets of blades scraping as they ground against each other. One claw seeking to fall and kill, the other unyielding in its rising defence. Where the Raven Guard primarch’s features were fierce with effort, the other face wore a grin. It was a smile both taut and mirthless – a dead man’s smile, once his lips surrendered to rigor mortis. ‘Corax,’ said the other primarch. ‘Curze,’ Corax said the name as the curse it was. ‘Look into my eyes,’ said the progenitor of the Night Lords Legion, ‘and see your death.’ Corax sought to wrench his claw free, but Curze’s second gauntlet closed on his brother’s wrist. ‘No,’ Curze’s laughter as was joyless as his smile. ‘Do not fly away, little raven. Stay. We are not finished, you and I.‘ ‘Konrad,’ Corax tried. ‘Why have you done this?’ Curze ignored the plea. He turned his void-like eyes on the prone Lorgar, with disgust written plain across his carcass face. ‘Rise from your knees, you accursed coward.’ Lorgar sought to do just that, using his brother’s midnight-blue armour as a crutch to haul himself to his feet. Curze bared his sharpened teeth. ‘You are the foulest weakling I have ever seen, Lorgar.’

The First Heretic, Chapter 27 - Aaron Dembski-Bowden

Contrast this with Corax’s reaction to Curze joining the battle. They address each other by name and look into each other’s eyes. The scene is presented as intimate, and highlights their similarities to each other. If you compare the way Corax asked Curze this question to how he questioned Lorgar before, there is a very obvious difference. In using his personal name and taking on a softer tone, Corax is actually looking for an answer here, and the betrayal he felt here is clearly more personal compared to Lorgar’s.

Curze’s response is very interesting too, the level of insult he is throwing at Lorgar is so much more offensive than what he is saying to Corax, and Lorgar is supposed to be his ally. He is calling his hated enemy pet names while calling his ally ‘coward’ and ‘weakling’.

We have already established that Curze feels challenged in Corax’s presence and shows vulnerability, which he compensates for by sarcasm and intimidation. This is really obvious in this passage as well, Curze uses flowery language which Corax probably does not comprehend. However, comparing to what he is saying to Lorgar, which is his usual level of art of language, what he says to Corax is so tame. He ignores Corax‘s question because he does not know how to answer him, and instead makes a dig at Lorgar, because that’s something he can do easily without losing his composure further.

At this point, Corax only has one functioning lightning claw, and is already spent from his fight with Lorgar. But all Curze did was hold him in place by locking his functioning claw and grabbing his wrist. He has the chance to do a lot more damage if he wish, but he does not. He sees Corax as a better version of himself, and despite how much he claims to hate him, he cannot truly bring himself to actually hurt Corax, because that would destroy the “better future” that Curze could not have. However, he does take sadistic pleasure in seeing some of Corax’s composure break, in dragging the “better one” down with him.

There is very little information about this fight in the codex, however, the author made one very deliberate change: Corax’s lightning claw was broken by Lorgar in the novel, while it was broken by Curze in the codex.

He had lost one lightning claw in battle against his twisted kin, the Night Haunter, but where the other lashed out, his every blow cut an enemy Legionary to ragged shreds and cast steaming viscera on to the thirsting black sands, and when he took to the sky upon his blackpinioned flight pack, it was to descend once more to scythe down scores of Traitors and to rescue pockets of Loyalists who had been cut off and surrounded, falling like lightning on their attackers and allowing them to break out of the killing ground.

Horus Heresy Book III Extermination, p. 33

The Word Bearer smashed the first claw aside, striking the fist with enough force to shatter the gauntlet completely, but even as scythe-long claw blades span off into the surrounding melee, the second claw struck home.

The First Heretic, Chapter 27 - Aaron Dembski-Bowden

This had to have been a deliberate choice on the author’s part, and comparing their battle prowess it would've been more likely that Curze broke it rather than Lorgar. This further emphasises the point that Curze couldn’t physically harm Corax as he symbolise a better possibility.

As well as this, from what Curze has been saying, he does want them to meet again. He wants to continue their state of entanglement, and he does not actually want to kill Corax.

‘Thank you, Konrad.’ Curze spat at Lorgar’s feet. ‘I will let you die next time. And if you…’ The Night Lord trailed off, his black eyes narrowing as he watched the figures appearing at Lorgar’s side. Their armour was crimson ceramite and ridged bone. Great claws, both metallic weapons and fleshy, jointed talons, extended from bestial arms. Every helm was horned. Every faceplate was split by a daemon’s skullish leer. ‘You are so much more than merely foul,’ Curze turned his back. ‘You are rancid in your corruption.’

The First Heretic, Chapter 27 - Aaron Dembski-Bowden

Curze actually hates Lorgar because he perceives him as weak, and this is the level of insults that is thrown. There is no ambiguity and no pet names. Curze makes his distaste known. The mention of a ‘next time’ might be relating to Corax rather than Lorgar. This implies he came here to gloat at Corax rather than to save Lorgar, so if there is a next time, which presumably wouldn’t involve Corax, he would not come save him.

ADB also really like the relationship between Curze and Corax, and contributed the most famous “little raven” line. It is quite unfortunate that there was no further interaction between those two, and unlikely for there to be any more interactions in the future, as Curze went and died, and, for the sake of the integrity of the story, personally I do not think he should be brought back.

This entire passage gave the impression that Curze came here just for Corax, but at the same time could not actually hurt him outright. Corax felt personal betrayal at the appearance of Curze on the traitor’s side. Lorgar existed to serve as a mark for how special their treatment for each other was, since neither of them had a close relationship with him.

After the Heresy

After the Heresy, Corax does indeed hate Curze, because he hated all of the traitor primarchs. He hated them for betraying the Imperium, and for the losses suffered by his Legion on Isstvan V. It is, however, not a personal feud towards Curze, unlike Curze’s feelings about him, which was very much personal.

Konrad Curze and Corvus Corax’s complicated feelings about each other is very interesting, and it’s not as simple as mutual hatred, which is how most of the fandom presents it. Due to their similarities, Curze views Corax as a “better possibility” for himself, and projects his self hatred onto him. Seeing Corax reminds him of his own flaws, which is why it makes him uncomfortable and lash out, claiming to hate him, but he also cannot bring himself to actually destroy this vision of a “better” him. What Corax thinks about him doesn’t actually matter that much to Curze; he believes Corax hates him because by his own values he should.

Corax doesn’t have opinions on most things, and he does not actively seek out relationships with people. However, from his actions, it can be deduced that he does care for Curze before the Heresy. Unlike Curze, he does not have a strong moral compass, so he does not really have a problem with Curze’s methods, not even as much as Curze hates himself, as they all serve the Emperor. It’s also quite likely that he doesn’t register Curze’s sarcasm at all. He is not a man of many words, and his silence can usually be interpreted as acceptance rather than judgement. After the Heresy, Corax hated all traitor primarchs.

Another interesting point about their dynamic is their complete inability to communicate with each other. Curze immediately goes into defensive mode, and start talking exclusively in sarcasm, with the intention of riling Corax up. Corax on the other hand cannot not process this at all, but Curze will treat everything he does as a personal attack. On the other hand, if Corax actually reacts to his provocation, I think their relationship would only be worse. In the end, Curze did succeed, in a way, to make Corax hate him, after the Heresy, just not the way he wanted.

#Very important post tysm for writing #And very informative #I adore Thorpe's Corvus a lot #corvus corax #konrad curze

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