wtfotteli

[wtfotteli]

Skam anniversary podcast episode 5 - english translation

Carl Martin Eggesbø is on the podcast again and talks being outed and feeling the pressure to figure out his own sexuality to be a good role model to others.

This is part 2/2 of episode 5, part 1 can be found here. Listen to it at NRK radio.

Torkil Risan (host): In this episode we’ll talk about episode 1-4 of Skam season 3, Even and Isak. The show has a new main character and the trailer hints at the themes we are getting into.

(skip to 27:45)

TR: And actor Carl Martin Eggesbø, who plays gay character Eskild, got a fair share of the attention regarding these themes.

CME: When the season came out, a lot of people asked if I was gay in real life. When I met people in the streets they would say “You’re Eskild? I like the show a lot”. And usually the second or third question was if I was gay for real. My friends and parents got the same questions. At that point, I thought I was gay, but I found it difficult to say with 100% certainty. I wasn’t totally sure. So to publicly play a character that was that sure of his own sexuality, and was very insistent in revealing others sexuality, it was an interesting contrast. And I remember a friend sent me a message, or maybe she called me, and she said “You’ve been outed”. Because she had listened to the podcast Harm & Hegseth, where they had discussed who in the show was actually gay or not. And Morten Hegseth says “Isak is not gay, but he who plays Eskild is”. And Harm asked how he knows, and he just knows. And I remember that felt like the end of the exploration of my own sexuality. And it was a principle for me, a political thing, that I wanted to spend time figuring this out. And I felt some shame that I wasn’t as publicly out as Eskild was. But when I hear Eskild talk about these things, about others that are gay, maybe Morten Hegseth was inspired by Eskild. But then and there it became very clear to me that- It suddenly got very personal. 

TR: Have you talked to Harm & Hegseth about this? 

CME: Nah, I went on Kompani Lauritzen (Norwegian version of reality show Celebrity task force) with them, and my revenge was that I won that whole thing. Jokes aside. I haven’t talked to them about it directly, but I forgive that. You can also criticize Eskild for lots of things that he says. At the same time, I think to be a good queer role model, you give others time and the space to figure their own sexuality out and you don’t publicly speculate about others sexuality. That is, in my opinion, a misunderstanding of what the gay fight should be. 

TR: The podcast episode of Harm & Hegseth Carl Martin was talking about, we’ve found, so let’s listen to a snippet. 

Morten Hegseth (on his podcast, way back): I get very curious about things, so I did some research yesterday. I wanted to check if the person who plays Isak is gay in real life. 

Vegard Harm: And he’s not. 

MH: No. But he who plays Eskild is. 

Vegard Harm: He is, yeah? That I wouldn’t-I thought he was acting.

MH: Nope.

TR: Morten Hegseth is a participant on this podcast as well, as he is a big Skam fan. But anyway, it’s relevant to hear from him what he thinks of Carl Martin’s criticism. 

MH: When me and Vegard discuss who is queer or not queer, the basis is that we don’t think there’s anything wrong with it. Because the moment you start to think “we can’t talk about that”, you’re saying that’s something to be ashamed of. But of course, for an actor that young that’s trying to figure himself out, that’s of course not very nice. Looking back at it. But it was a different time. It's almost 10 years ago. Not to say that you were allowed to be an idiot then, but it’s one thing that you shouldn’t speculate about others identity or who they’re together with, I get now that that was stupid. At the same time I’m thankful for the younger generation today that has taught us so much in regards to gender roles, sexuality and all that. You joke about it a lot, adults say “you think you’re so unique, but you’re just recycling the 1900s”. But the younger generation, that came after Skam, has been pretty groundbreaking when it comes to what you should or shouldn’t say about gender and sexuality. And to make assumptions about others' identity, they might change their mind tomorrow, you shouldn’t do that. But you get so obsessed. And is something about, as a queer person, you automatically start to wonder “are they queer in real life too?”. But you shouldn’t draw conclusions. 

TR: At the same time Carl Martin is figuring himself out, he’s also about to become a role model for others by playing Eskild in Skam. So there were many thoughts and feelings to deal with. 

CME: It was a confusing period. A lot of things happened at the same time. There was a discrepancy between who I was and how others saw me. 

TR: At the same time you felt you had to bridge that gap and take a responsibility you just felt like Eskild demanded of you?

CME: I remember my older brother, we were in the kitchen, while I was filming Skam and he asked “but are you gay?”. And I said “I guess I am” and put it out there. And he said “mum and dad would appreciate it if you told them, because they get a lot of questions about it in regards to the show”. I don’t know if it was right or wrong of him to say that, but I understood that it was important to my parents, because they got questions and were unsure and I had to deal with that. I understood there was a momentum there, where I just had to figure stuff out. I didn’t find it difficult to say, but it was a principle to me that- I mean I get that people wonder, because I do too when I watch tv and other contexts too. And I want to be visible and proud, I’ve said in lots of interviews. But at the same time, life’s long and there’s so much to figure out, you can go one way or the other. And I think the most important part is that you’re not lying to yourself and force yourself to explore when you just want to be out there and say that you like guys. But many people like different things and there has to be an openness for that. Eskild became a role model of someone who’s so sure of his gayness. And I felt like many projected that image of Eskild onto me. So I felt that I just had to take that responsibility and quickly be done with my own exploration. Because it was important to me to show that that wasn’t a problem. I get the impression that there’s a lot of actors that, or at least there has been historically, hasn’t been open about their own sexuality because they are scared of not getting any more roles. But I’m not going to let that dictate me. I haven’t thought of that as an actual problem. But I was 20 years old, so I was a little young to get that responsibility. I wish I had gotten time to figure stuff out on my own. At the same time I thought I was important to be a visible role model and I understood that that was important to a lot of people. But Eskild led the way for me too, he was a guru to me. And I didn’t know that’s what he would become. Maybe it was Julie that could see what was inside of me, and put guidning words in my mouth.

TR: Can you place the “blame” that you got this responsibility, you’re 20 and have to put your own process on double or triple speed because you feel like you’ve gotten a responsibility that you haven’t really asked for. Who started that for you? 

CME: There’s many ways to see it. In a way it’s me, who said yes to being part of this. And it’s NRK and all those who have dragged me into this. But really, the problem that this show tries to explore is that it’s difficult for many to grow up with a sexuality outside of the norm. And that’s the real problem. I think terms like “coming out of the closet” are very problematic. I wish it was possible to grow up and feel like there’s room for you to happily explore your sexuality, instead of having to figure stuff out fast, people saying he didn’t come out of the closet until he was so or so many years old. Some people might be helped by defining themself and saying out loud who they are. But for many, I’m thinking of that podcast with Morten Hegseth and Vegard Harm, it’s one thing that I was outed as gay, but I’m also thinking of Tarjei. If he had been gay and the whole world got to hear that he wasn’t. That puts a lock on people. To allow people to explore is very important. But there’s the (clinch?), I thought it was very important that I was clear and said I was gay, because it meant a lot for a lot of people that I was happy about that and didn’t have issues with it. At the same time I wish there was time and space for me to explore and figure stuff out. Because part of the joy of life is to figure stuff like that out. Why does that have to be such a traumatising, stressful thing that you have to decide who you love? There’s wine tastings, coffee tastings and all kinds of things. Why can’t you taste other stuff too? It takes time to find out what you like. I wish I had put that into words earlier, as Eskild. But at that time, in 2015-2016 when season 3 aired, it was important to have a character like Eskild that’s very sure of himself in contrast to Isak wasn’t ashamed of his own sexuality. 

(skip to 44:48) 

TR: I’ve mentioned there’s a lot of symbolism in these episodes. Let’s mention some of it. The music playing during the pool scene, I’m Kissing You by Des’ree, is also on the Baz Luhrmann Romeo + Juliet soundtrack and used in a kissing scene between Leonardo Dicaprio and Clare Danes in a swimming pool. This clip is posted at 21:21. The number 21 shows up in many places in Skam. Those who really know their angel numbers stuff can get something from that which I don’t know if it’s done on purpose, but there’s other things here that are on purpose. Isak is a biblical name. He’s Abraham’s son. And Isak’s birth is in Genesis 1 verse 21. And our Isak is in a way born here. *sound bite from the pool scene* He has at least found out a bit more about who he is, he’s had a second birth. And it happened in the water, that’s also associated with that kind of stuff. And Even is dressed up like God during all of this. And people find these references and hidden symbolism. Mari Magnus was responsible for the digital lives of the Skam characters. In the season 3 banner on the Skam website there was lots to dig into for the fans. 

MM: Many hours of work are behind those. And with Isak, the idea is that it’s Even’s doodles. But there’s also easter eggs put in there. And to get the gay theme across there’s gps coordinates to a public urinal in Bislet (area in Oslo), that’s an old classic gay spot. 

TR: Glory hole?

MM: With a glory hole. 

(skip to 48:00) 

TR: The character’s names are interesting here. Like Even, he’s called Even Bech Næsheim. An interesting last name as Nils Bech, the artist who will have an important role later in the season, and Knut Næsheim, show creator and close friend of Julie Andem, had a close relationship at this time. 

[wtfotteli]

Henrik Holm on the Skam podcast - english translation

In the fifth episode of the Skam 10 year anniversary podcast Henrik talks about how he almost got arrested on the day of his audition, experiencing homophobia when playing a queer character and hate from henjei shippers. (this is part 1/2 from this podcast episode).

Torkil Risan (host): In this episode we’ll talk about episode 1-4 of Skam season 3, Even and Isak. The show has a new main character and the trailer hints at the themes we are getting into. 

Morten Hegseth: It was very homoerotic. There was milk and a locker room and it created a bit of an outrage, some complained about sexualising homos in that way and why allude to the body and sex. Some were mad, as it always is. But that made me very excited for season 3. 

TR: Were you sceptical? 

MH: Absolutely not *laughs*

TR: At the same time an, at that point, unemployed actor called Henrik Holm has followed the Skam hype during the first two seasons with scepticism. 

HH: I grew up in Oslo, as close to Hartvig Nissen as you possibly could, right across the street on the first floor. I remember thinking “oh my god, that’s not what it’s like to go to high school in Oslo”. I don’t know, I think it hit too close to home for it to feel believable. So to be honest, I was pretty critical. And I remember I saw the famous milk teaser for season 3 and thought “oh my god, are they making a season that’ll sexualise homosexuality? what are they doing?”. 

TR: So you had those thoughts, but yet you went to an open casting call? 

HH: An open casting call. And this was really groundbreaking when it came out, so to get to act in that, was at that point almost like getting cast in Game of Thrones. By Norwegian standards. 

TR: And Henrik is the type of person to prepare thoroughly before an audition. It was important that the character he was reading for, Even, could smoke weed believable. Luckily Henrik knew a place in Stensparken in Oslo where they practiced those kinds of things, so he went to the so-called “Spliff mountain” right before his audition. 

HH: I picked up a stick to make it look like I had a joint. Spliff mountain is a smoking spot. It’s almost, I can’t compare it to Christiania (neighbourhood in Copenhagen), but it’s a sanctuary and it has been for many years. It took some time before someone arrived to smoke an actual joint. They sat down beside us and asked “Hi guys, is it alright if we light up?” and we just “yeah, yeah, no worries, we’re just practicing a scene”. In the middle of the scene I notice some suspicious looking people in hiking gear, who’s not supposed to be up on the hill. And in the middle of that scene where we’re pretending to smoke I just hear “undercover (police), put down what you’re holding”. And the buddy beside me throws his stuff behind him and we’re like hands up, throwing away our sticks *laughs*. They are convinced that now we’ve captured some illegal weed users, so they want our personal details and say “we saw what you were doing. We don’t have evidence, but we saw you smoke”. And I was just thinking “what is happening? how will I get out of this? will this stop me from getting to the audition?” Because from their point of view, we were a group smoking together and every excuse we put forward was just to get away. But fortunately the buddy who was actually smoking said “just let those guys be, I don’t know them, they weren’t with me”. So he took one for the team and we got away that day. 

TR: Henrik aced the audition and got the role. Something that Morten Hegseth was thankful for. 

MH: I would say it’s the closest we’ve gotten to James Dean in Norway. 

(skip to 07:44)

TR: Even is a bit strange in that bathroom scene, he uses an extreme amount of paper towels. This was also a scene that Henrik Holm practiced extra for. 

HH: He had to have the ability to take someone by storm. The character had to capture his (Isak’s) attention like no one had before. So I remember finding it difficult to have that playfulness and indulge in his type of humor. Like in that bathroom scene where he takes all the paper towels and asks “you needed some too?” I had to take that scene out on the town, just to check where the realness was. How do you actually deliver a line like that? Because it was so far away from what I would say. 

TR: It sounds like a scary thing to do, to do Even’s paper towel trick out on the town in Oslo. 

HH: It was a bit scary. 

TR: Even succeeds in getting Isak’s attention. And I want to bring forward a scene that’s a good example of something that Skam is unusually good at, the use of music. Maybe I’m extra sensitive to this one because it takes me right back to being hopelessly in love in high school, just play these few notes. *plays Talk Show Host by Radiohead*. And it’s not necessarily a good feeling. Often being in love is portrayed as something easy and light, but sometimes it’s heavy and difficult, even tragic. This song evokes those feelings. Isak is in the school yard and zooing out while Vilde talks as he sees Evan. And the music is not the only reason for picking this Radiohead song. In Baz Luhrmann’s Romeo + Juliet there’s an iconic scene where we see Leonardo Dicaprio’s Romeo the first time, a reference Julie Andem did on purpose

JA: It came as a result of me deciding to make a parallel to Juliet and Romeo in season 3. And I just thought it would be fun to play with the references from Baz Luhrmann’s movie through the whole thing and it’s an amazing scene when he walks on the beach. 

(skip to 11:45)

TR: The references are not just something those of us who look for them can find, here it’s explicit. Even talks about both Baz Luhrmann and Romeo and Juliet, a story not exactly known for its happy ending. 

JA: Romeo and Juliet is an archetype love story, that I thought- when I put together the scene where Isak watches Romeo and Juliet and that longing for, a feeling that he could never have that love because he’s different. And I wanted to see if it was possible to get the audience to feel jealous of Isak and Even’s love story. Like he was jealous of Romeo and Juliet. Can you make a gay love story that is so powerful the audience wants to be a gay 16 year old? Both because that’s the set up of Romeo and Juliet and because if there's always a fear of it not happening and ending, the power of the love story is stronger. 

(skip to 14)

*Sound bite from the cheese toast scene*

HH: That was 100% improvisation. 

TR: It was?

HH: Yeah, I can tell. I think the only thing in the script were the messages and then it said “they make toast”. 

TR: What’s so beautiful with this is, it’s not about the cheese toast, from Isak’s pov, it’s something new and exciting for Isak. 

HH: It’s like kids playing. And love should be fun. 

(skip to 20:25)

TR: Isak is struggling with his locker, until Even turns up. 

Sound bite from the show, Even: Are you going to the Halloween thing? 

Isak: Nah. Or, maybe, idk. Are you?

Even: Join me.

Isak: Okay. 

Even: Great, then we’ll pre-game together. *slam*

TR: What’s happening there is you, bashing his locker into place, that Isak has struggled with the whole season. I think I missed that symbolism on my first watch. 

HH: There’s symbolism there. And that scene took quite a few takes to get right. I don’t know how many times I hit the locker without it opening 

TR: In Skam there’s a lot of symbolism and references to numbers, little things like the locker. How clear was that to you?

HH: They kept that to themselves. That wasn’t something we were supposed to think about, because the characters wouldn’t understand that context or have that perspective on those things. So those are things I didn’t understand until way later. 

(skip to 25:50)

TR: The themes we’re talking about here, queer love, we haven’t seen a lot of in Norway before this season of Skam. At least not in this way. Henrik Holm experienced people getting really into it, for better or worse. 

HH: It was a little absurd, because people thought we were really gay, to the degree where they thought we were in a relationship outside of the show. And many refused to let that fantasy go, to the degree where they were sending messages to friends, family, partners. 

TR: Like questions?

HH: No, more hate. Stuff like “you have to let Henrik be with Tarjei”. My ex got a lot of strange stuff in her inbox. In addition to us getting a real feel of what homophobia actually is like, in the shape of slurs thrown at you in the streets and nasty glares. I remember getting surprised that there’s still so much homophobia in the world. And I realised how important the show was. Partly because of that, but mostly because of the reaction from those it meant a lot to. And that totally changed our relationship to what we had created. So it was mostly very, very positive that people needed those kinds of role models on tv. 

[wtfotteli]

“Sander...” Robbe whispers, pulling Sander closer like he always does.  

Sander hums, letting this boy do whatever he’s pleased with him. He pulls and pushes Sander wherever he wants, but Sander tries hard not to engage. Because you are perfect and I’m a fuck up and I don’t want to mess you up.  

People say teenagers have a lot of hormones, and Sander is no better. Of course, he wants to engage, to hold Robbe tighter, let his hands wander up and down his lean figure, and explore everything his brain has already painted in his imagination. But, at the same time, he thinks Robbe is too good for him, so it’s better to keep some boundaries in the imminent case he breaks Robbe’s heart and traumatizes some experiences for him.  

Robbe grunts in between kisses, letting Sander know he is frustrated with Sander basically pretending to be dead while they kiss, holding back from starting a make-out session he is not sure he will be able to resist taking further.  

“You’re annoying,” Robbe complains, pushing Sander away from his arms and legs, a second from pouting.  

“Hey!” Sander smiles, feeling his whole chest warm, trying to grab Robbe’s wrists or shins to pull him closer. After a little bit of a fight, Robbe is close again and willing. Sander holds the back of his head, kissing him slow and deep, holding the hair that reaches Robbe’s nape a little too tight to be innocent.  

They spent yet another whole afternoon in this pull-and-push game. Robbe climbs his lap and wraps his long, lazy limbs around Sander and it gets harder and harder to put a stop to it after every round.  

“You’re a baby...my baby.” Sander hears himself voicing his thoughts out loud. He thinks about taking a picture of Robbe like this, messy, spent, with his hair pointing in a million different directions, with his lips puffy and dry, but he knows his gallery is filled with pictures of Robbe already.  

They stopped kissing because Robbe’s phone wouldn’t stop beeping with a row of new messages. Sander could tell it was from his mom because Robbe’s whole body language changes when he talks to his mom or dad. He adjusts his posture like his parents are there, seeing and correcting him, the easy smile that’s always resting on his cheeks is gone, and he tries to fix his hair. Robbe looks completely different. And he is very evasive when explaining what the messages were about. Something about religion, something about Robbe being his mom’s miracle baby.  

For someone so soft, easy, kind, and open-hearted about human goodness, Robbe believes in very little things that are not proven scientifically. And it’s written all over his face that his deeply cynical beliefs stem from whatever happened within his family. 

To change Sander’s attention and avoid another attempt at a conversation about Robbe’s family, his demeanor changes back to how it was before the text. Soft, compliant, trying to make Sander lay down on his bed.  

“I want to be yours,” Robbe whispers like a secret against his lips.  

Sander sighs, running a hand through Robbe’s soft hair. “You’re way too young for me.” He teases, turning his face away, looking out of the window across the room, trying not to smile. 

Robbe grunts, “Fuck you,” and pushes him away again, pulling him back just as quickly, pressing their lips together.  

After hours of making out with his dream human, Sander’s self-control is struggling. Robbe’s tongue is warm, the right amount of slow and curious, and before he notices, Robbe is straddling him and Sander is squeezing the sides of Robbe’s small waist, a second away from pushing his hips up- 

Thankfully, Robbe stops their kiss, sitting up on top of Sander, snaking his hands inside Sander’s shirt, pushing it up until Sander’s shoulder blades stop him from going further.  

He seems to inspect Sander’s exposed torso – they haven’t seen each other shirtless before.  

Sander smiles lazily, pressing his lips together so as not to engage, and ends up asking if Robbe likes what he sees.  

One of Robbe’s cold, ridiculously soft hands goes up right in the middle, stopping to feel Sander’s heartbeat, smiling when he notices how fast it is beating. He goes back down, smiling mischievously as he pays special attention to the line of hair that goes inside Sander's black jeans, he holds a few hairs and pulls.  

“Ouch!” Sander writhes, putting his hand where it stings.  

They stay there for a moment, looking at each other, Sander feeling goosebumps because of his exposed torso and because Robbe is right there, on top of him, only a few pieces of clothes in between.  

“One day I will win this fight. And you’ll regret having waited this long...”  

Sander sighs, defeated and in love, nodding his head. “I’m sure I will. But then we’ll make up for all this lost time.”  

“Promise?” Robbe asks. 

Sander nods his head again. “Promise. I’ll get us a nice hotel room and all.”  

Robbe smiles at him, finally coming close again for another kiss. Sander doubts he will be able to resist this boy for long if he keeps asking like that.  

[wtfotteli]

The eyes tell more than words could ever say.

Willem De Schryver in 2020.

Those eyes! 💚

[wtfotteli]

KNOKKE OFF - S2 🇧🇪🇳🇱

(High Tides)

Willem’s back as Alexandre Vandael in season 2 of Knokke off. 💫

Alex’s grandmother has come to town to put things back in order after the drama in season 1.

I don’t think it will go so smoothly though…😍

Season 2 will be out 6 December on vrtmax and 31 January on Netflixnl.

😆

[wtfotteli]

Willem Herbots new short film with Eben Yehemdi:

Isn't This the Logical Consequence of Consciousness? (Is dit niet het logische gevolg van bewustzijn?) by Artuur Derks

Cr: Flanders image

[wtfotteli]

Willem De Schryver as Jan Laureys in the new series De big fuck-up currently being filmed. It’s due for release in 2025. 🕺🏻🔥❤️

[wtfotteli]

Isak: What do you think your parents would say about me?

Even: I think they would have loved you.

Oh Isak! If only you knew…things could have been different…

🥺😭

[wtfotteli]

wtFOCK 🇧🇪 Sander Driesen

[wtfotteli]

wtFOCK I I Sander and Robbe ❤️

I will never, ever believe in the words "too late" because it is never too late to be exactly who you wish, do exactly what you should, say exactly what needs to be heard, and live the exact life you should be living.

(Tyler Knott Grayson)

🩷❤️🧡💛💚🩵💙💜

[wtfotteli]

Wow!! This shot of Willem is 🔥

From his shoot with Elias Verwilt last year.

[wtfotteli]

wtFOCK 🇧🇪 - Robbe and Sander ❤️🌈

You are the love that came without warning; You had my heart before I could say no.

🩷❤️🧡💛💚🩵💙💜

[wtfotteli]

wtFOCK - Robbe and Sander ❤️

Sander's 6 month anniversary post 29/5/20. Adorable 🥰

Toen ik u nog mocht hamsteren 🖤 Als er iemand mij heeft geleerd wat liefde is, zijt gij da.

Kzie u graag.

Happy anniversary 🤍

When I was still allowed to hoard you 🖤 If anyone taught me what love is, it was you.

l love you.

Happy anniversary 🤍

[wtfotteli]

Happy 4 1/2 year anniversary to Robbe and Sander ♥️

wtFOCK - Robbe and Sander ♥️

Can you believe Robbe and Sander have been together 4 1/2 years?

Robbe and Sander's 18 month anniversary posts 29/5/21

Sterkerdanijzer: "My favourite shoulder to lean on. "

Earthlingoddity: "All the days of my life. All the days I owe you."

🩷❤️🧡💛💚🩵💙💜🖤🤎

[wtfotteli]

wtFOCK - Sander 😍

It's instinctive the way I'm falling for you.

Like an effortless intake of breath.

The definition of 😍

🩷❤️🧡💛💚🩵💙💜🖤🤎

[wtfotteli]

wtFOCK - Robbe and Sander 🥰

I found you without looking and love you without trying.

🩷❤️🧡💛💚🩵💙💜🖤🤎

[wtfotteli]

Happy 25th birthday to Tarjei 🥳🥂