#WITH THE POTENTIAL FOR EVEN MORE STABBING

[eye-of-yelough]

the thing about saying i prefer toxic durgetash over healthy durgetash is that even that can get lost in translation because the word toxic has been watered down to a joke nowadays. i say i like toxic durgetash and someone will run over and agree like “me too i looove how toxic they are!! gort tries to manipulate my durge but they just laugh and stab him and then they kiss 🤪”

yeah thats fun but that’s just normal durgetash activities. that’s our definition of toxic, as normal people who weren’t raised in cults and literal hell.

i think i just want more people to embrace the potential for abuse with these two horrible horrible characters specifically. a more clear cut power imbalance. a durge who’s straight up terrified of gortash, or a durge who feels strangely comfortable and trusting toward him, which gortash uses to manipulate them into betraying/killing their companions and enforcing his will in the city.

and the vice versa, a durge who abuses gortash, is interesting too, but a lot harder while keeping gortash in character. maybe impossible. it just goes back to my inability to see gortash as someone who’s capable of genuine, selfless love, and a person has to be extraordinary to be seen as a equal (and even then, they’re not getting treated like one.) he’s a master manipulator! durge/tav has to have inhuman level of willpower/fortitude to survive any kind of relationship with this man unscathed. if they are stronger than him, he will find a way to weaken them, if they are smarter, (doubtful) he will find a way to break their brain.

and again, most durgetash shippers agree with this. they agree that gortash’s aim, at the beginning, was to subdue durge and mould them into his perfect sentient weapon. “but then after a while he realised he met his match/caught feelings” … with all due respect. i don’t think his brain works that way. this man is not capable of giving up. this is not a man who lets his emotions get in the way. this is not a man who lets anything get in the way.

[codenamesazanka]

Went back to reread the last bits of Jaku Arc and all of endgame. Here are some long notes (first part):

-> Chapter 295 is the best chapter of 'Deku Wanting To Save Shigaraki'. Sadly it is also just about the only chapter where Deku explicitly states he wants to save Shigaraki (the adult Villain) from AFO, from his hatred.

Deku: "You killed so many of us! And hurt countless others. That is unforgivable. It's unforgivable… and yet… back there… when you got swallowed up by All For One… At that moment… the look on your face… You look like you needed saving!"

Deku is talking about someone who just forced his teacher to mutilate himself, punched a hole through a mentor's chest, and stabbed his childhood friend. Deku was livid about these actions. And yet, when he saw the horror show that is AFO being a flesh parasite to Shigaraki, Deku was concerned. And moreover, the expression Shigaraki had on was angry, glaring, but still Deku wanted to save him.

-> Unfortunately this gets recontextualized - for the worse - in Chapter 305. Chapter 305 - the "I want to save that little boy!" chapter - is actually a mess.

-> In Chapter 305, Nana asks Deku if he has the resolve to kill Shigaraki Tomura.

Nana: You looked at him, and saw someone who looked like he needed saving. That's what you thought. We know that much because we're in sync with your emotions. Banjo: The issue is... He sure didn't look that way to us! No doubt he's suffering, what with All For One taking over his meatsuit... but that's doesn't mean the kid is hoping to be saved. Even in a sitch like that… his eyes were filled with nothing but hatred.

So here is the Vestiges basically arguing against saving Shigaraki because of the way he looked and behaved. They acknowledge that he's in pain; they acknowledge that he's in trouble with All For One (their mortal enemy!)... but he doesn't look like a proper victim, so does he actually need saving? Plus he has the potential to grow into THE ULTIMATE EVIL. Plus there are people in this world who are just beyond saving. So does Shigaraki Tomura actually need saving?

IMO, this is when Deku should argue back that, yes, Shigaraki still needs saving, simply because of the situation he's in, simply because he's suffering. Stay consistent with what Deku said just ten chapters ago. Shigaraki is awful, but he needed saving. Shigaraki has done unforgivable things, but he's still getting swallowed up by AFO, and needs saving. Shigaraki is wallowing in nihilistic rage, and (probably) therefore he needs saving. "No matter what kind of trouble someone's in," [Chapter 126] Deku wants to save everyone with a smile. He sees someone that on the surface does not appear to deserve saving - that other people are dismissing! - but he still wants to save. This would be the much stronger conviction and have much more weight to his goal of becoming the greatest Hero!

But no. It turns out, there was actually a Crying Child inside all that rage. Deku was able to look inside and see and feel a five-year-old who was full of sadness. Well, who doesn't want to save a sad five-year-old? You kinda have to!

-> Plus, this revelation of the crying child immediately makes Nana clam up and look guilty and devastated. All her previous points about THE ULTIMATE EVIL and 'people who are beyond saving' loses water because... you can't say that about a five-year-old. You probably shouldn't say that about someone who still holds an inner crying child inside of them. So this issue is immediately ditched two pages after it's brought up. Shigaraki is sad, deep down, so he's not evil or beyond saving. Therefore he deserves to be saved.

-> With this, Deku draws a nice little line in the sand to decide who should be saved: Not everyone, evidently. And it does matter what kind of trouble they're in (so maybe they deserve to continue suffering). This becomes very evident later when Deku re-encounters Muscular and Overhaul. And I feel it reached its logical conclusion when Deku can save little ghost Tenko's heart, but has no solution to Adult Villain Shigaraki and ultimately contributes to his death.

-> Yoichi also takes time this chapter to respond to Banjo's comment that Shigaraki was full of nothing but hatred by pointing out that this was how Shigaraki was groomed.

Yoichi: That's how he was groomed. My brother's own damaged body now holds him back… So it's likely… that he schemed to hijack the boy's body and soul… As part of a grand plan to acquire One For All.

However, no one reacts to this. Not the vestiges, not Deku. Yoichi is straight up telling everyone that, hey, Shigaraki Tomura here is a clear pawn in AFO's schemes. Groomed to hate, and now having his body and soul hijacked, all for the sole purpose of stealing OFA. A clear victim...

But never mind, I guess. Why care about this blood-and-flesh guy who's survived being manipulated as a child to reach adulthood only to get possessed ("No doubt he's suffering, what with All For One taking over his meatsuit") in real time and in reality and saving him from just that? We gotta focus on the ghost of the Crying Child!

-> This is where I think the Viz translation doesn't quite work out - In the original Japanese, Yoichi says 'raised', with emphasis. This conveys and highlights the meaning that Shigaraki was not brought up properly, was manipulated in some way, but otherwise it's a relatively neutral word. In English, it's 'groomed', which everyone loves quoting, but that's a much more charged word, with the added connotation of Shigaraki never having had any agency. It is a word that makes everyone look real bad when they don't react to it. Like here.

-> When asked again by Nana if he has the resolve to kill Shigaraki, Deku reflects on his previous enemies.

Deku: Up till now, I've come up against all types. They've refused to back down... so fighting was the only way to stop them. But... I never understood what made them turn out that way. If I had, maybe things would've worked out differently. Or, who knows? Maybe I still would've had to fight them anyway.

Bolded is mine. My opinion, but this is wishy-washy-ness of the highest magntitude. This isn't Deku getting an enlightenment and from this moment on deciding to start approaching Villains differently. This is him casually considering a 'maybe'. This is him recognizing that there's a blindspot in his fights thus far... but unable to envision a future where he can correct that blindspot. Maybe things might have worked out differently... maybe not. Fighting is still on the table.

On it's own, it's fine. Deku's just thinking about his previous fights. He's musing about 'what if's. But this is him thinking as a response to Nana asking him to kill Shigaraki if Shigaraki proves unsaveable. This is him laying out the groundwork for his approach to Shigaraki. "Maybe if I understand him and try to save him, I can stop him that way... or maybe yeah, I still have to fight (kill) him."

-> And finally, we have The Declaration. I Want To Save That Little Boy. I am sorry to inform you that if you look at the context surrounding the sentence, it's not actually about saving Shigaraki/That Little Boy.

Deku: Shigaraki killed so many people. He's hurt people near and dear to me. And yet!! One For All is a power meant for saving, not killing. All Might taught me that. And not just me. All Might... and all of you who've built up this power... have given hope to countless people out there. I get that this power was first meant to destroy that evil. But you've all given your lives to link the chain this far... and I think there's another big purpose behind it all! Maybe there's no other way besides killing. And I dunno what I'm going to do when the time comes... But I want to save... that little boy.

Let's break it down.

"Shigaraki killed so many people. He's hurt people near and dear to me. And yet!! One For All is a power meant for saving, not killing." - Already the focus is taken away from saving Shigaraki. The focus is on OFA as a power. OFA saves - therefore, the implication is that it can be used to save Shigaraki. The implication is all we get.

It's also not that Shigaraki shouldn't be killed - and Deku brings up Shigaraki's crimes so he clearly thinks they're relevant to whatever his unspoken judgment of Shigaraki is - it's that OFA is a power that shouldn't be used for killing.

We of course then get stuff about All Might, because Deku cannot shut up about All Might. But once again, the focus is on OFA and All Might, and how they inspires other people. How they give other people hope. Does it give Shigaraki hope? No - as Deku should well know from their Mall Talk. I think this counts as failure number one in trying to understand Shigaraki, and Deku hasn't even officially started yet.

"I think there's another big purpose behind it all! Maybe there's no other way besides killing." Sadly, despite what I think we as a fandom has gaslit ourselves into thinking, killing is still on the table. Had been from the start. Deku believes that saving is also what OFA is now meant for... but he doesn't commit to it. He keeps killing as a possibility, instead of getting rid of it completely.

"And I dunno what I'm going to do when the time comes..." Deku never gets a plan. He says this in Chapter 305, and still has no plan in Chapter 417. Without a plan to ensure saving Shigaraki is a successful, of course killing is on the table.

Then after all that, finally, Deku says he wants to Save That Little Boy. That's the line we were all fixated on, because that's what matters to us. As it turns out, what Deku was fixated on was all the stuff before this line.

Overall, the gist seems to be: OFA is a power that's meant for saving, and that concept has given inspiration to Deku and many people out there. This power has evolved to be about saving... and that's why he wants to save that little boy.

(BUT maybe there's no other way besides killing)

(Deku also has no idea what to do when the time comes.)

So this part of Deku's speech, leading up to The Declaration? Not about the victim. It's not about Shigaraki and saving him from AFO. It's not even really about The Crying Child and his exact circumstances. It's about the abstract idea of saving - and propping up OFA and All Might.

-> Cheap blow but it is notable that Deku says "I want to save that little boy" and not "I will save that little boy". Where's your stubborn shonen determination, kid?

-> Also extremely hilarious in hindsight when you realize OFA ends up still being something that destroys AFO. And something that lead to Shigaraki's death. So much for being a power that saves.

-> Chapter 305, overall:

Deku never actually says 'No' to the possibility of killing Shigaraki.

Shigaraki Tomura is acknowledged explicitly to be suffering from AFO possession, but the idea of saving him is disregarded in favor of That Sad Little Boy.

And we're not actually here to save the victim - we're here because OFA is So Cool.

Off to a great start.

[real-total-drama-takes]

If the reboot seasons keep going with the early merges, coaster strategies like Millie’s or to an extent MK’s are gonna be really viable. Not winning challenges puts you in danger on a team, but pre-merge there’s usually at least one asshole everyone hates who can be a target instead. Fly under the radar, be nice to your team, and look like you’re doing your best even when throwing. Post-merge, it can be really viable to throw challenges because competitors who win a lot of competitions like Julia, Priya, and Caleb will be targeting each other due to their obvious threat level.

Coasting doesn’t necessarily mean a boring strategy. What it means in TD is usually letting an ally carry you to the end because they think they can beat you and then stabbing them in the back at the last minute.

I think the most viable winner of a potential season 3 under this idea is probably MK. She has Julia by her side who basically has a neon sign above her at all times saying “I’M A HUGE COMPETITIVE THREAT AND ALSO THE WORST! VOTE ME OUT!” and because MK so rarely wins anything, people aren’t likely to think voting out MK will undercut Julia’s game in any meaningful way. As long as Julia doesn’t backstab her again—which to be fair she definitely would do—she’s good in that department. The only issue here is that MK doesn’t throw competitions, she just sucks at anything physical (affectionate). So if she and basically anyone were in a final 2 I’m not super confident she could actually win unless she cheated somehow or just got lucky with a more mental competition. Maybe against Millie who’s not great at challenges or Zee who she could probably deceive into losing.

Speaking of Zee, he’s also a great coaster. Everyone except Julia and MK like him and those two only like each other (🏳️‍🌈). He has an ally or potential ally in basically everyone else. His social game is for the most part really strong. However, when he was eliminated in both s1 and s2 it was because everyone was mad at him for doing something stupid. In s1 it was probably just to take him out in a silly way because he’s mostly a gag character, but in s2 it was because he let slip the insane number of secrets he has on EVERYONE. People either tell him everything and anything on their mind or don’t realize he’s eavesdropping. Either way, it’s very promising. If he’s more strategic in the future and doesn’t blow up his game by spilling secrets in front of everyone and instead uses them to his advantage, he has good win potential. He’s also not terrible at challenges, and has a good showing in a majority of them. The catapult challenge definitely proves that he can excel in challenges even better than Julia when he needs to.

So yeah, those are my season 3 winner picks. I’d also be very happy with a Julia win without a redemption arc. She’s gay and horrible and wins.