#at least he wasn't before he got rewritten as someone who falls for their abuser

[gralunaisland]

Part 1 of "Why Gray is NOT a Tsundere"

(An Anti-gr///via Post)

[Links to Part 2 and Part 3 are linked here and at the end.]

One of the most commonly used arguments to demonstrate support for the gr////viugh ship is that even though Gray rejects juvia’s advances countless times, they still belong together because “Gray is a tsundere”, and therefore he actually likes everything juvia does and has been attracted to her and her antics since the beginning.

Despite these particular Pros loving to paint themselves as “guardians of Japanese culture”, using "culture" as an argument that the Japanese love stalking and obsession, I believe they are willfully ignoring what a tsundere actually is in anime in order to claim Gray's loved juvia all along.

To help demonstrate that, I will proceed to prove that every single main character in Fairy Tail is a tsundere based on their definition.

I shall also be trying to counter all (and I mean all, so every little point... whew this is going to take a while...) the points made in this post, recommended to me by a helpful anonymous asker a long time ago, from the @f*ckyeahgr*via page, where the poster (Author) tries to prove that Gray is in fact a tsundere. (This takes place in Part 2.)

(In Part 3, I’ll give my own examples with pictures of Gray very clearly not being a tsundere.)

Really, the purpose of this post isn't to prove that Gray never likes juvia in the material, because clearly Mashima and his weak will bent to the desires of the Pro fandom in 100yq to force these two together, but it's just to prove that it's not like Gray loved juvia all along, which some Pro's try to defend to their grave. The importance of proving that is that it will show that Gray hasn't been a willing participant in juvia's harassment.

The only feasible reason he could ever like juvia later is thanks to the guilt juvia caused him to feel from her almost dying, as well as Stockholm Syndrome from being gaslit and manipulated into thinking they loved each other, all that as well as being written into a shell of his former character who acts more like juvia than himself, but that is beside the point of this post.

Finally, a disclaimer: my frustration is mainly directed at juvia and specifically at people who use these arguments to try to make their opposition look stupid, and it's just my frustration with this argument. Please know, in the end, these arguments are just for fun, and I don't actually have beef with Pros as human beings. Also, please no raids on that blog (which actually might be retired by now lol) or on the user who posted it. We're all civil enough people here.

Pheww, buckle in, guys, this is going to be kind of a tough one. (As well as super long and suuuper in depth).

Definition of Tsundere given by Pros:

One of the biggest difficulties with combating this argument is that the actual definition of "tsundere" isn't really used by Pros; they just use a similar idea related to a tsundere, and then claim that they're right based on their own definition.

One person who participated in my 'Request for Discussion' post commented something along the lines of "Gray is a tsundere because he doesn't talk about his feelings with anyone". I would like to quote them directly, but when I went back to check what they said, it seems they have deleted all their comments. (Interesting. That seems to be a regular occurrence with Pros on my blog).

In another instance, the person who wrote the 'why Gray is a tsundere' post that I'll be refuting in part 2 of this post, (Note well, I'll refer to them as 'Author' from now on, and the quotes from their post shall be orange), even though they never actually take the time to define what they think a tsundere is, said this about Gray:

"Again, [Gray] is HARSH and TSUNDERE towards those he cares the most about. He has insulted Natsu, Lyon, Ur, Erza (calls her a monster) and [j]UVIA. And, he also is embarrassed when his true feelings come to the surface, and tries hard to keep them private. He doesn’t want people to know HOW MUCH he cares, and because of that, he rarely talks about his feelings to anyone, let alone directly to the person he’s having those feelings for."

It's quite similar to what the first Pro said, though more in depth. For them, it boils down to "not talking about his feelings". I'll circle back around to this later.

First, let's take the Pros' definition of tsundere and run with it:

Let us say that the term 'tsundere' really only means that the tsundere doesn't talk about their feelings a lot with other people. (Remember, this is what Pros mean when they say what a tsundere is even though that isn't the actual definition.)

Then yes, Gray is a tsundere.

But here's the clincher.

If he is, then so is everyone else who exists in the Fairy Tail universe.

Yay, you win! Everyone, including Gray, which is the important part, is a tsundere!

Doesn't that sound completely ridiculous?

Of course it does. Let's break down that extremely faulty reasoning.

Refuting the Pros' Definition of Tsundere:

Let me ask you this:

Just how much do people in Fairy Tail actually talk about their feelings in normal circumstances on a regular basis? Literally, we should all take a moment to think about this.

Lucy's dad died? Well, she doesn't talk about it to anyone, not even to her best friends, Natsu and Happy, who followed her silently to his grave. She breaks down all by herself, alone in her apartment. Does she talk about how much losing Aquarius' key hurt her? Nope, not even that. She never even confides in people on how she likes Natsu, which is prime gossip material and not as private as a thing as grief for a dead parent is. Does any of that mean she's a tsundere? Not at all.

Natsu is super expressive, honest to the point of being ignorant and just plain dumb sometimes. He declares to anyone and everyone all the time just how much he cares for his guild, but does he sit down with people and talk about how Igneel leaving really made him feel, how abandoned and lonely he felt? Never. Talking about feelings is just not Natsu, and yet he's still clearly not an actual tsundere.

From Erza to Happy to anyone else in the whole anime, no one really goes out of their way to have a casual deep chat about their feelings ever, specifically about personal emotional trauma, but even about mundane feelings in general. Most of the time, they're all just chilling and goofing around and making jokes, because that's what you do with friends- not talking about your inner, personal turmoil doesn't make you a tsundere, i.e. it doesn't make you someone who's always irritable until they learn to be more open with people they like.

Anyway, these feelings and the words that describe them are just ripped out of them while they are fighting for their lives, which of course for them is quite often. Otherwise, they don't talk about it really, not even with the people they're closest to, and that's okay. It's their personal business. These are things that are good to process by yourself for yourself, and you really don't owe other people to let them in on your life. (*COUGH* if only juvia would leave Gray to his personal business *COUGH*).

Gray is no exception to any of this. He doesn't talk about his feelings much... but like I said, no one does. And it's not like he only confides in juvia, which you'd think would be the case if he were really a tsundere with juvia. (NO WONDER he doesn't talk to her about his feelings! Beyond just the fact that she never listens to him anyway, when he was sad after learning about Ultear's sacrifice, noticing it during the GMG parade, juvia told him she didn't know what was up with him, but that it was rude of him not to smile. she doesn't even ask him if he's ok, she just says he's being inconsiderate. Wow, I don't cuss much, but she's actually such an ass.)

And it's not like he never shares his feelings because even just one instance is when Wendy asks him if he’s okay after he learned about Ultear’s time spell during the Dragon King Festival-- hey look at that, juvia, Wendy actually cares how he's doing-- and he actually opened up immediately about what happened and his past to her. That's insanely not tsundere because Wendy is even a newer member of Team Natsu (I personally don't consider her as such), and yet Gray is comfortable enough to tell her his life story.

Even since the Galuna Island arc, which was basically Gray's full introduction to the readers/watchers, his emotions about Ur were open, raw, and visceral. Lucy for one was really concerned for him because it was clear that Gray was beyond upset once seeing Deliora. He was also so broken and betrayed by Lyon, and none of those emotions were hidden from anyone.

These are just a few examples of Gray not being embarrassed to let people know his true feelings, which directly contradict what the Pros were trying to prove.

But is Gray a tsundere in regard to the ACTUAL definition?

Let's look at the actual definitions of tsundere, compare Gray with them, and see if he fits the bill, shall we?

Well, here's some actual definitions I've found:

Wikipedia's:

"Tsundere is a Japanese term for a character development process that depicts a character with a personality who is initially cold, stern, stoic, harsh, temperamental, hotheaded before gradually showing a warmer, friendlier side over time."

2. Another longer, more in depth one from a website dedicated to the Dere types:

"Tsundere is a stock love interest who is usually stern, cold, and sometimes hostile to the person they like and others. They will occasionally let slip their warm and loving feelings hidden inside. They hide their feelings due to being shy, nervous, insecure, or simply unable to help acting badly in front of their crush.

The Japanese term "tsundere" refers to an outwardly violent character who "runs hot and cold", alternating between two distinct moods: "tsuntsun" meaning "aloof or irritable", and "deredere" meaning "lovey-dovey".

Tsundere is a Japanese term for a character development process that depicts a person who is initially cold (and sometimes even hostile), before gradually showing a warmer, friendlier side over time"

3. And one last one for good measure from Urban Dictionary:

"Tsundere (ツンデレ, pronounced tsɯndeɾe) is a Japanese term for a character development process that describes a person who is initially cold (and sometimes even hostile) before gradually showing a warmer, friendlier side over time. The word is derived from the terms tsun tsun (ツンツン), meaning to turn away in disgust, and dere dere (デレデレ) meaning to become 'lovey dovey'."

(Yes, they are pretty similar, but I think it's important to show the solidarity and regularity of the definitions over the different sites. Plus, they each give their own nuance).

So, does Gray fit the bill?

Something to note about tsunderes is that they're not only cold and harsh to their love interest; they tend to be cold and harsh towards everyone because that's a core part of their personality, that they're socially awkward at dealing with people. If Gray truly is a tsundere, then he should demonstrate his tsundere characteristics with more people beyond his rejections of juvia.

Looking at definition 1:

Here, it says tsundere is more than just how a person acts mean to someone they really like, it's a whole character development process of a whole personality. Gray's personality from the beginning has had nothing to do with being cold, stern, stoic, or harsh. Yes, he's temperamental and hotheaded sometimes, but that's in terms of his rivalry with Natsu and other guildmates, which isn't the tsundere kind where his temperamental side hides a secret feeling (which it does not ofc). Gray is far from stoic, as he's lively and vivacious from the very first episode he's in. He's not cold, he's got great humor and is passionate. He's not a mean person, he just has friendly rivalry with his friends. Even with meeting Lucy for the first time, he was immediately friendly to her and required no "warming up" to be close with her. Remember, here it's not saying tsundere is specifically just for romance.

Looking at definition 2:

Even this one specifically notes that tsunderes are usually "stern, cold, and sometimes hostile" with "the person they like and others". Remember, it's a part of their overall personality. The tsundere behavior is a character trait that doesn't just apply to their romantic interest, so, again, that means we'd need to see Gray's tsundere-ness affecting all his relationships.

A prime example of a tsundere is Nakiri Erina from Food Wars: Shokugeki no Soma. She's not only standoffish to Yukihara Soma, whom she clearly has a crush on, but to most people in general, she doesn't know how to be friendly. It's a part of her character. She was raised in a harsh environment and was isolated, so it makes sense.

Gray on the other hand? Is not socially awkward and has no problem making friends (again, look how quickly he got chummy with Lucy). He's not standoffish at all and is far from cold and "aloof or irritable" to anyone. Even to juvia, which is the important thing to Pros since they want to say he's a tsundere with her, he's not really cold... he's just supremely unnerved and made uncomfortable by her.

He's never even mean to her, he just rejects her and tries to get away from her sometimes. And he's not even doing that all the time! On the rare occasions that juvia is able to keep herself mostly from drooling all over Gray, like when he taught her how to eat that burrito, he's actually friendly to her. But only when she's not being an absolute weirdo and creep. That's not him being a tsundere, that's him being a nice guy, but being understandably creeped out by juvia's outlandish and disgusting behavior.

And when he's being nice to her, he's not being "lovey-dovey", he literally just treats her like a normal friend. It's only during 100yq that Gray actually begins to show he has romantic interest in juvia, and I'm not counting that because that's Mashima's idiocy, and Pros have been claiming Gray's been a tsundere since forever, so they can't even use 100yq as proof.

Looking at definition 3:

Again, Gray doesn't take time to warm up to people, the reason Gray "turns away in disgust" is because juvia is a disturbing individual, and lastly, he certainly doesn't ever act lovey-dovey with juvia in the main story of FT.

My conclusion after looking the definitions is that Gray is therefore not a tsundere, as it's not a core part of his personality and character to be initially cold or aloof towards people, and because he never actually acts cold or aloof with juvia, only uncomfortable and disturbed in a rightly manner.

(Feedback on anything in this post is appreciated!)

Edit: Just to make it clear, due to a kind suggestion by my good friend, @youthinkofacoolname, I have split this behemoth of a post into 3 parts so it's less intimidating and more digestible, and then tagging the next part at the end so it's easily accessible. So, here's the link to Part 2!

Part 3 is here as well.