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Angela thinks

Abc

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Like you, I am glad that I took this class and am very appreciative to have had Ms. Clark guide us through this foreign subject. 

When I moved and wanted to change my hobby, I decided to take a class or two each semester at the local college.  Honestly, I didn't have any idea what Post Modern Literature was.  I figured this class would be a lot of boring old books and Gordon Rule writing but figured it would be challenging and would exercise my brain.  So, when I found the required books list I was surprised at the novels (What? No musty old "classics"?).  Blogging instead of tedious essays?  Okay!  I went into it with an open mind and I know that I have learned a lot - I can now have a conversation about "Post Modern" literature (and art); I've learned how to blog; and, I've enjoyed going to class the last four months with a variety of people.  It was seldom boring.

When I first came into this class I was dreading the readings and the essays, pretty much the entire class. However, after we got into “The Things They Carried” I was easily drawn into the book and had trouble putting it down. Now that’s a big deal for me because I would much rather do math and...

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No, this is not the beginning of a new chapter in my life; this is the beginning of a new book! That first book is already closed, ended, and tossed into the seas; this new book is newly opened, has just begun! Look, it is the first page! And it is a beautiful one!—C. JoyBell C. The end of a melody is not its goal: but nonetheless, had the melody not reached its end it would not have reached its goal either. A parable—Friedrich Nietzsche The end of THE END is the best place to begin THE END, because if you read THE END from the beginning of the beginning of THE END to the end of the end of THE END, you will arrive at the end.—Lemony Snicket

Well……….It’s Over

Thank you to everyone who made this class interesting with your debates and disagreements because it forced me to see different but equal points of view; thank you to those who I often worked with in group work because it helped me to understand a lot of the material we covered; and, thank you Professor Clark for allowing us the opportunity to study current, relevant, and interesting stories because I never had an inkling of what Postmodern literature was until now.

I know this class has been a good class because I can walk away from it saying that I learned something.  I don’t know how I would rate the novels on a scale of one to ten, but my personal favorite was A Visit from the Goon Squad because of the unusual way it is written. 

I think the quote from Nietzsche is very appropriate for this class.  Although the end of the course was not the true purpose of this class, getting to stand here at the end makes us realize what we learned and if we grew. 

If Angel is working later, I am going to try and put some quick answers of mine on the study guide (I’m not going to try and go into detail with my answers).  If you see my responses to or some discussion about the questions on the study guide on Angel or Tumblr, please respond back to me and others in the class with your thoughts because that seemed to help a lot of people on the midterm and there are some questions that are starting to confuse me.     

(via h-poirot2090)

I love that you quoted Lemony Snickets along with the others! That's funny!

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So, Cormac McCarthy, how about a sequel with a sunny side?

When I finished reading The Road, I thought that the ending begged for a sequel or even a series. I've watched some TV series like Jericho and Jeremiah (can find on Netfix) that centered on post apocalyptic America. Neither had a setting as bleak as the road described But both were interesting with their imaginary sets of problems and, of course, moral dilemmas. The Postman and Water World are movies that also imagine this scenario.

Like most people, I love (and need) not just a happy ending but the resolution, or implied resolution, of the problems that a movie or a book poses. The Road's ending leaves me without that satisfaction. Each of those series that I mentioned were eventually canceled with no resolution but fortunately the movies both had great endings.

So, Cormac McCarthy, how about a sequel with a sunny side?

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All very interesting questions.  I grew up in the 70's and 80's and nuclear war and fall out were very present and common subjects in school and themes for TV shows and movies.  People in my generation have asked themselves these questions many times.  I really believe that the answers to these questions change with age - as a teen and in my twenties I would answer differently than I would as my life transitioned to that of a parent, responsible for more than myself.  I have had these conversations over the years with friends.  The most memorable was my friend who had a son with cystic fibrosis.  In this end-time scenario, she imagined her delima was to watch her child die a painful death of starvation and painful life of trying to ingest food without medicine (excruciating) or to mercifully smother her child.  Real tough stuff to think about.  For me, my evolving answers have to do with my own personal aging and health issues.  As it is now, I am dependant on medication every day to live.  The need for long term preparedness for myself would be just a waste of resources.  However, the movie and book show that what might appear to be a randomness in who survived (not powerful politicians, beauty queens, Lovie and Thurston Howell, etc.), but the underlying commonalities were people willing to do anything to survive. 

As I’ve read this book it does make me wonder if something like this could actually happen. With the technology available today it would only take one extreme personality to cause a worldwide catastrophe. Scary thought. Maybe this is why writers pen these types of novels, as a type of wake-up…

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In comparing the book to the movie we watched in class, I also noticed a lot of the same differences that many of you did.  Some additional differences that I noticed begin with Papa reading books in the shelter and a bag of keepsakes (boy's) shown in the movie.  The movie added Papa smoking a few times and the boy asking to drink some whiskey.  Also, the movie does not include Papa making "bullets" for his revolver.  In the book, I don't think they heard the dog while they were in the shelter and I also understood the cart was always a shopping cart not a lawn cart.  I could have misunderstood that.    In the book, the description surrounding the place Papa died (interstates/buildings as slumping heat damaged structures and melted windows) was completely omitted in the movie making it appear as though Papa died in a field.

By the way, I didn't create a "Mishna" for The Road but I sure have enjoyed reading those posted.

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I too found myself wanting more of the "rest of the story."  After such a long dark saga of scavenging, evading and survival, I was ready for the triumph of success.  I'd like to think that not only would the human spirit prevail out of such horror but so would our beautiful and mysterious planet.  I wondered if the mention of mushrooms growing was a sign of the beginning of planetary renewal or if mushrooms are the last to die in a toxic and dead biosphere.  I don't know enough about this type of science so maybe someone can tell me. Also I wondered about the air.  There were constant references to ash falling, rain falling and unchecked fires.  The characters fashioned masks.  How long can the planet take such an assault on the air with out the renewing cycle from plants/trees and lakes/oceans, etc.? 

After finishing The Road I have to say that all in all I liked the book. The book does an incredible job of showing how good men and women act in times of total chaos. While others were selfishly killing for supplies and resorting to cannibalism the father managed to keep a good moral sense and…

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The Road-Dark Tale Sheds Light

I've read "The Road" before and was not looking forward to reading it again.  The first time I read the book, it made me mad and left me so irritable that I put it down repeatedly; however, I kept picking it back up because I felt invested by the time and energy I'd already spent and had to finish it. 

With that in mind, I waited until I knew I could re-read this book over a weekend and stayed with it until I was finished.  This time I tried to approach it with an open-mindedness for this type of literature that I did not have before.  I surprised myself - I didn't totally hate it.  I didn't get mad or irritable because I actually saw it completely differently.  What was once to me a dark, worthless waste of time, pulp, ink, money, etc. now became an example of Post Modern literature for dissection, without any emotional reaction. 

Perhaps, like many of you did, I should have had some soft emotional tingle but I think it was impossible due to my strong negative first reaction.  It was good for me, with the learning process in mind, to hear other's opinions and reactions to something I was so certain about.  I think those opinions helped me to approach the book neutrally.

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I too enjoyed the last chapter of this book.  The concept of communication and  communicating and it's future is a great theme. 

And what about "Pure language"?   The author was very clever to put together the actual act of communicating, texting in an abbreviated version, fake communication (paid bloggers) and the positive impact as well as the ethereal communication of music.  I also loved the unspoken communication between Lulu and Scotty (as he is trying to run).  While some have commented that it was like a silent daughter father connection, I think it was the timeless language of flirtation.  She knows she's attractive and there's a power in asserting "potential filled" flirtation that calls to Scotty's ego and resurrection of his younger charismatic self.  Scotty is buoyed by the small gesture enough to let the crowd hear his inner music - communicated with the slide guitar.  To address whether pure or impure music is "selling out" or not is so subjective.  I think if a person enjoys music (of any kind), whether it makes one happy, cry, etc. then it's pure for that person regardless of if it has the same effect on anyone else. 

So, with the books many avenues of exploring time, communication and relationships, I would have to say that as far as Post Modern reads go (or at least what I;ve been exposed to), it wasn't bad.  I just hope I don't have to remember all the character's names and graph their relationships.   

             Lulu and Scotty

There are multiple main ideas being discussed in chapter 13 of Goon Squad, such as the pragmatic reasons for selling out, what methods of sharing ideas are being used today and how those could change, social commentary on not only the mentality of today’s time, but also on what is...

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Would you give this toddle purchasing power?

This toddle would be considered "a pointer".

This is a video of one of my grandsons, Lex, when he was one and a half years old.  He thinks he is helping his cousin play a video game, the Wii obstacle course. 

In the last chapter of "... the goon squad", it is fun to read about the imaginative future technology, the Starfish.  It's so simple that even a toddle can purchase music that delights him.  Yet I have to wonder how inexpensive it would be to purchase songs in the future.  I have thought that $0.99 and even $1.29 per song was reasonable until recently allowed my thirteen year old nephew access to my Itunes account. 

I thought the author was very imaginative with the concept of future technology as well as going so far to create slang, and even an air of condescension and derogatory terms.  It was another clever avenue for her to explore the concept of time and communication (and how it links people).

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Yes, Terry, that does make you crazy - cuckoo for Coco Puffs. 

P.S.  Love the link!

There are multiple main ideas being discussed in chapter 13 of Goon Squad, such as the pragmatic reasons for selling out, what methods of sharing ideas are being used today and how those could change, social commentary on not only the mentality of today’s time, but also on what is...

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Terry, like you, I really enjoyed the chapter Great Rock and Roll Pauses.  About this point in the book I was really having to power through and force myself to read.  I have never had a story delivered to me in this form.  It was such a pleasant surprise that I actually did not want to put the book down.  I loved it.  I loved the innovative style of delivery.  Maybe taking the time to work through each slide/page and see how it worked alone and then connecting it to the rest of the chapter gave me the time I needed to process the story.  It was an effective method of storytelling because I felt empathy for each member of the family. 

It's nice to finally give a thumbs up to something Post Modern without squirming.  ("Sorry, Ms. Clark"... or should I say, "Thank you, Ms. Clark"?)

Time, Pauses, and African Tribes

Chapter 12, “Great Rock and Roll Pauses,” has left the biggest impact on me.  It is, stylistically, the most interesting way to tell a story that I have ever read, and, even though it seems avant-garde, it was still able to tell a poignant story to me. 

Egan talks about this chapter, along with other things about the book, in the interview above, but she brings up an interesting point about time through this chapter.  Someone in class mentioned that a pause in a song is where a song is playing, then seems to stop and make you think that the song is over, and then begins again until it finally ends.  The connection with time is obvious here, but, if the connection is true, doesn’t that mean that our present would be the pause, that the reality we are noticing now is the pause before the end of the song? 

That seems like a paradox to me because, according to our Western view of time, the present is constantly moving forward into the future.  So, how could it pause?  The teacher of my Religions of the World class mentioned once about some African tribes that have a totally opposite view of time compared to the Western view.  He said that these tribes do not believe in the concept of the future and that they teach that the present is constantly becoming the past. 

This “novel” (or whatever it is) is a book about time, but, to me, it is more than just that; and I hope that the interview above helps anyone else in their interpretation of this book.         

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First of all, again... I love your art work! 

Second of all, I love your point of view! 

I agree that the power of a positive word of praise and/or encouragement is real and is important.  Like you, I'm not talking about some lip-service hero worship.  I'm talking about some basic human appreciation for a person, whether it be something like freckles to a kind and innocent heart.  Speak up.  Say something positive.  Like an unabashed smile from a stranger, a sincere word of praise is a very easy gift to give and it's just as wonderful to receive.  I truly believe that these small deeds make both people better. 

From the book, a great example is the scene you mentioned.  Because of the kind (and tender) words Lou spoke, the reader is soften a bit to Lou (maybe he's not such a chronic letch...maybe he has the capacity to be a friend, a father...?) and the reader is also assured that vulnerable Rhea will now accept her outer beauty (and not let it stifle her inner beauty...). 

Although I agree with the general consensus of the class (that the character Lou is indeed a chronic letch), I still think that in a real life and wholesome application, upholding and encouraging people to NOT despise who they are on the outside while encouraging them to be the best person they can be (not a copy of anyone else) is always worthwhile.

Additionally, I think growing up on the weird side of the tracks adds dimension to a person.  I, for one, know that a person has no control of where he grows up. We all have different starting points. What one has control over is who he will become and how he will relate to others once grown.  That's where it gets interesting. 

“You’re scary, he goes, you know that?

It’s the freckles, I go.

It’s not the freckles it’s you.

….

People will try to change you, Rhea, Lou goes. Don’t let em.

But I want to change.

No, he goes, serious. You’re beautiful. Stay like this.

But the freckles, I go, and my throat...

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AVFTGS: X's/O's (aka:Goon Squad)

Chapter 6, X's and O's, was as cryptic and twisted as it was bizarre and even a little sad.  It was disappointing to find out how Scotty Housmann turned out.  He was the character with genuine magnetism and talent so he was supposed to be the real deal, the star.  Instead, he turns out to be a toothless, delusional misfit with an emotional compass that won't settle in any one direction. With his hard luck and quirky ponderings, he would be pitiable if he wasn't so twisted up and consumed with his philosophy of reality and equality.  I understood his X/O theory of the "human processing machine" to be essentially like the 0/1's of non-human processing machines (computers) - each comprehending information. Despite what conclusions he spins to qualify equality (even when there is none), he is indulging in self-delusion.  In the end, he knows that he has not turned out as good as Bennie (no matter how he interprets Bennie's responses to him at the office) but continues to delude himself. The author, Jennifer Egan, cleverly inserts an ending that makes the reader sympathetic to Scotty by having him give Bennie's business card to a stuggling young musician.   

There were two parts of this chapter that were very clever.  First, the visual of this social misfit bringing the dead fish as a gift into the swanky record executives office while never comprehending why this would be inapropriate and leaving actually feeling empowered by his toothless grin. The second clever part was the explanation of the undercurrent of communication between to people who used to compete, as teens do, and then meet later in life.  I was blown away by how well the author lays out this tier of unsaid yet understood implications (at least in Scotty's mind) with the following:

(Page 101)  "A is when we were both in the band, chasing the same girl. B is now." I knew instantly that it had been the right move to bring up Alice.  I'd said something literally, yes, but underneath that I'd said something else: we were both a couple of ass wipes, and now only I'm an ass-wipe; why? And underneath that, something else: once an ass-wipe, always an ass-wipe. And deepest of all: You were the one chasing. But she picked me.

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Mallory, that was a really neat observation.  What you said is so optimistic and I like that.  One should consider opportunity to change life for the better.  There will always be nay-sayers and there will also be those who will comfort their own regret of not trying with ridicule and the comfort of staying in what is familiar (like Arlene who shed a tear and declined but later called Buck's promise "total horseshit" and then had a swinging contest with her other grown sister). 

Without reading the entire piece, who knows if Sarena was lied to or not.  Maybe the rest of the universe wasn't as morally corrupt as Texlahoma - maybe that's why Cape Canaveral "just plum forgets" them. 

I'd like to think that it all turned out for Sarena and that she painted to her hearts content.  I love a happy ending.

When I read Generation X for the first time I was quite confused, but I clearly understood it much more with a second read. Although I’m not sure what the whole meaning for the story was, I found it pretty strange but entertaining. But now the more I think of it, I think that Texlahoma is...

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From Generation X

Realizing that I only read a portion of Douglas Coupland's work, I will say it was an amusing and playful story about urban life.  I think it's more revealing of how the author sees the world than anything.  He is describing many typical urban attitudes.

The people and the setting of "Texlahoma" remind me of my northern relatives that are urban dwellers (not sub-urban): living in bleak northern cities (Toledo=Texlahoma); holding one uninspired bleak job after another (Walgreen's =Woolworth's perfume sales counter); common small pyramid scheme to "independence" (Tupperware or Avon representative = aloe products representative); adults (that don't value jobs) still living with parents.  Just like in this story, the majority of these people aren't bad people they are just numb and uninspired. The exceptions are the mother (has some small hope of building a small in home business) and Sarena (sees beauty where other's don't and will trade it all to live in that beauty).

From my interpretations and notes, here are some examples of some of the elements of fiction:

One way that this story is PoMo are the references to product names.  The setting being in a permanent 1974 as well as the dismal description of Texlahoma is also non-traditional and, therefore, Post Modern.  The plot's order of events runs beginning to end in a tradition fashion while the characterizations are PoMo as each character is developed with trendy features (feathered hair) and express nontraditional values (losing a job is not important).The point of view is from Claire the narrator with neutral omniscience.  The story is an allegory (symbolism) for urban life and the numbness to the ordinary as well as the extraordinary. 

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Julie, I like what you had to say.  Those selections were good and I have certainly enjoyed the class discussions so far.  I'm always amazed and enjoy how similarly and how differently people think.  I have really enjoyed the creative Tumblr posts too.  Some have downright impressed me.  

Really, had I not taken this class, I would have never read any of these selections, in part or in their entirety - with the exception of The Road which I labored through when it came out (I still haven't forgiven Oprah).  I look forward to the second half of this class and hearing everyone's take on the upcoming reading assignments.  They do have an impact on me.  The hardest part for me is learning to read not just for comprehension and enjoyment but to descern the elements of fiction and filter out the elements (or lack) of what makes it Post-modern.  It's fun, like solving a puzzle and the best part of PoMo is you're always correct (as long as you can support it). 

Three of the reading assignments standout as my obvious favorites so far. I connected with O’Briens “The Things They Carried” simply because I lived through that era and knew several young men that faced some of the problems O’Brien talked about. It was a poignant and vivid trip down memory lane....