jungabyss

[jungabyss]

Yeah you’re still spineless because you refused to answer me directly on my original argument because you made another incorrect claim about Native Americans calling themselves a “nation” in order to get casinos when that is just false. Native Americans are distinct sovereign governments , it’s recognized in the constitution.

Thanks for repeating what we already know for the 5th time and still managing to miss the point.

The entire point is that Trump HAD NO VALID EVIDENCE for George Miller supposedly approving non-Native Americans. He was making baseless claims. Nowhere in the transcript does he show any substantial evidence and if he does, tell me the exact page number or link me the source.

Making baseless claims about Native ancestry with zero proof other than “They don’t look Indian to me” and mocking their ancestry on a radio show is racist. I’m sorry you don’t agree with the fucking facts because you’re too far up his ass that you can tell me what his shit taste like blindfolded.

You’re so spineless. Talking about how “stupid” I am when I called out the flaws in your argument when you can’t even explain why I’m wrong. How is saying that claiming Native Americans “don’t look Indian to me “ and having no further evidence for the claim even if you were trying to defend actual ancestry not wrong? Especially knowing how Native American ancestry is determined in this country.

What is your argument to that then? If I’m so wrong? Do you think we should question and determine Native American ancestry with our own standards when we doubt fraudulent ancestry? Or more importantly, should we question what made Trump think the Native Americans weren’t actual Native Americans with no actual proof other than his own two eyes claiming they didn’t look Indian enough to him.

Ah yes spineless because you called out "flaws" in my argument lol.

I know you think you were calling out flaws, but you were incorrect and I responded directly to you about it three different times but all you are doing is disregarding everything I say and repeating yourself as if you're making a new point or argument each time you say exactly the same thing.

I've already explained to you why I don't think it was racist. Saying someone "doesn't look Indian" to you isn't racist for fucks sake. On the surface level it could be argued that it's stupid or naive, but calling it racist is pretty far fetched. People like you have completely misused the word racist so much that it's essentially a completely meaningless term nowadays.

He wasn't generally questioning Native American ancestry just because some people happened not to "look Indian" to him. He was talking specifically about people George Miller had approved reservations for. And you can keep saying "he had no proof but his own two eyes therefore it's racist" but you just sound like a moron. Just because you don't believe anything else he says doesn't mean that's all he's basing the accusation on and there is more conversation about it in the transcript that you are ignoring.

But even if Trump was wrong here and everyone Miller had approved was actually Native American, that doesn't make what Trump said racist. What if they weren't actually Native Americans and George Miller was giving exemptions meant for Native Americans to non Natives? Is it still racist to say if he was right? Is it always racist to question, even if your suspicions are correct? Or are people just never supposed to say anything because on the chance they're wrong suddenly they're a racist now?

If the government is approving reservations for Native Americans, then yeah there should be some process to prove ancestry other than simply stating you're a Native American no questions asked because it's too easy for non-Natives to take advantage of.

And the reason I stopped responding to you isn't because you "pointed out flaws" in my argument. It's because your responses were circular in nature and you were just repeating yet again what I'd already responded to three times and you disregard things that don't fit your narrative, which is a dishonest way to debate. You also couldn't drop the part about the lawsuit even though it has nothing to do with the quote. The lawsuit is not where the quote is found but you kept bringing it up as if something that had nothing to do with with the quote could prove it was racist and yeah, that's stupid. I'm not going to waste anymore time talking to someone who can't tell the difference between Trump's lawsuit and the hearing where the quote came from and who thinks something can be racist regardless of the context because that shows your mind is just stuck on "orange man bad" and you can't have a rational discussion. You're just going to scream racism no matter what.

[jungabyss]

As if we needed any more proof of this spineless blog being a racist and lacking even more brain cells than I thought.

First of all, you claim that nobody cares that Ariel is black and that you don’t care about race at all but then you proceed to say that they only casted a black actress because of her race and not because of her ability to play the role.

Now my question is why would the casting of a singing fictional mermaid in a completely fictional land be only limited to white actresses if race was so not important to you? Why would the race swap be relevant at all if you genuinely didn’t care about race? Why would the movie be bad solely because of a race swap? The story stays the same, Ariel’s skin color or assumed ethnicity doesn’t play any part in her story unlike other Disney princess such as Mulan, Tiana, Jasmine, Belle, ect. She’s a literal fish.

POC have only ever been upset with roles that were specifically made for POC ( which quite literally directly tie into our culture/ specific experiences )

What could white people possibly be upset about when it comes to race swapping a literal fictional mermaid? What cultural aspect is being ripped away from them? This isn’t Belle or Snow White who’s cultures/ethnicities are specifically mentioned & play part in their stories . But really ? A damn mermaid? How is Ariel’s skin color directly tied to the storyline at all? The mermaid spends most of the movie literally under the ocean and sings about wanting legs and a handsome prince.

Please stop acting like a dumbass and try to understand how ridiculous you sound trying to act like we are being hypocritical. Hypocritical of what? It’s white middle aged Disney adults that threw a tantrum on twitter about Ariel’s race when the trailer came out.

You care. You care deeply. That's why you're always crying out for more "diversity" in media. That's why you celebrate when a white character's race is changed. That's why you absolutely lose your minds over anything you perceive as "white washing". That's why you start a mob if a white person even voice acts for a fictional poc. You push for this shit relentlessly. You're total open hypocrites about it. You can't turn around and act like it's no big deal and everyone's over reacting when you get your way.

HUHH

This repost is so idiotic. I’m assuming it’s related to the Little Mermaid remake which is even more idiotic. How are you going to lose your mind over a literal fictional fish being black instead of white? The movie has a damn singing Jamaican crab and Ursula is literally purple. Ariel’s skin color adds nothing to the story.

It isn’t the same if a white actor was cast as Mulan or Princess and the Frog because their character’s races literally play a big role in the story. Like what’s not clicking? You have literally have like 6 other white princesses, I promise you aren’t going to run out of white people representation.

The reason why poc get upset when it’s white people replacing roles is because most , if not all the time, race ties directly to the story. And why is this even a discussion? White actors have already taken roles of poc before that were specifically made for poc.

This post just has white supremacist written all over it. It’s literally only racist people making a big deal over it because they for some reason can’t stand “woke Hollywood” making a fictional mermaid a few shades darker. Get a grip .

You are exactly the person the post was talking about. You came here to try to prove it wrong but you proved it right.

You're a huge hypocrite, which is exactly the point of the post. You do realize how idiotic you sound by going "omg how are you upset about a cartoon fictional character being black? It's a cartoon!!!!" and then immediately proceed to get upset about cartoon fictional characters being white, don't you?

You woke racists are the ones who have even made race in cartoons an issue. Literally no one cares about it except you. No one actually cares that Ariel is black. What we care about is the hypocrisy of it all. We care about the politics. Ariel isn't being played by a black actress because they just wanted to make the movie and she was the best person they found, she's being played by a black actress to appease cry babies like you who think race is super important and worth throwing a fit about until a character is the race you want.

I don't give a fuck about race. I don't need white princesses. I don't need black princesses. I'm not worried about "white representation." That's the point. You are the one who cares about representation in cartoons. I can like a cartoon princess whether her skin is black or white. People like you are the ones who made this a big deal. You are the people who started this issue. Skin color is incredibly important to you. The hypocrisy and politics is what I care about. Because of you racist cry babies, instead of Disney just making new stories and casting black actors, they are just recreating old classic movies to race swap them and the movies end up sucking because when you're just remaking a movie to be woke this time you're making a bad movie.

You're willfully misunderstanding the issue here to try and call people white supremacists but all you're saying here "if poc are upset about the race of a fictional cartoon character it's legit, but if anyone else is upset about it then it's because they're racist." And it's not even the race we're upset about. It's the insane level of hypocrisy coming from the people, like you, who care deeply about the race of fictional cartoon characters.

You are the reason Ariel being black is an issue in the first place. The reason this is even a topic of discussion today is, just like the post said, because you care.

[jungabyss]

I love how much you’re backtracking.

First of all, you tried to claim that I was wrong in what I was quoting because you clearly didn’t actually read the entire transcript and casually skipped over the rest of Trump’s testimony and his lawsuit and then you’re turning it around and saying “This isn’t actually about Trump’s lawsuit at all , this is actually about his testimony on organized crime he came in to discuss that he knows so much about that he didn’t even manage to give any substantial evidence but he continued to claim that he did know what was best for Native Americans as any white businessman would“ when I clearly addressed it was both. Try to keep up.

The funny thing is, even what you’re claiming about his testimony about organized crime and him saying “they don’t look Indian to me” is still not correct no matter the context. Because even if he was trying to help Native Americans, he was going off his own skewed perspectives of them and showed no actual valid evidence of their “fraudulent” ancestry. What he said is still a micro aggression. No matter how much you want to twist it because he had no valid evidence to back it up.

Second of all, you just repeated what I just fucking said about Trump’s lawsuit. I literally said that he filed a lawsuit because he found the Indian Gaming Act unconstitutional and there’s a literal testimony on page 250 of him arguing that not taxing the Native American casinos was unfair. Way to backtrack because you realized you didn’t have any idea of what you were saying and now you’re just repeating what I stated to you. Lmao.

And trying to twist it by saying “ Yeah he did file a lawsuit because he thought it was unconstitutional but that doesn’t mean he was fighting about taxes” When the entire lawsuit is about Native Americans not getting policed and taxed and him thinking it was unfair to him.

Lastly, the part about sovereign nations is BS because you said “ If Native Americans were now calling themselves nations in order to have their casinos—.. “

Stopping you right there. Literally what the hell are you talking about? The Native American Tribes have been recognized as Sovereign Nations since the Indian Reorganization Act in 1934. They weren’t now all of a sudden “calling themselves “ this or that. That was a load of BS from Trump because he didn’t want them to have no state interference because it hurt his own businesses. The US constitution already recognizes that the Tribal Nations are Sovereign governments. There’s nothing unconstitutional about this considering I’m sure you’re aware of history and I don’t need break down the entire timeline for you on how and why this came to be.

The facts actually do support me because I’m not twisting anything like you are and trying to give anything a new definition and manipulate it the way I want to. The transcript is the same one you linked. You’re the one trying to excuse every racial comment and say “it’s actually not racist because if you knew how complex it was and why he said it and what he is implying it’s actually not racist at all, he actually said this because he was so worried about real Native Americans being wronged because he’s such a good person and not a billionaire businessman trying to fill his wallets. You just call everything racism now and follow the mainstream media”

Girl you sound like a clown. Again, get a grip. And maybe a therapy session because you seem to be developing a weird parasocial relationship with Mr.Trump.

He’s accusing George Miller of approving reservations for people who weren’t Indians. He’s not really speaking derogatorily about Native Americans with that quote. And if George Miller was indeed approving reservations for people that were not Native Americans then he absolutely should have been called out for it.

No he’s not. Trump was taking issue with the treaty protected tax exemption status that many Native Americans have in their business ventures.

Towards the end of the testimony he states, “I want to find out. ... Well, then why don't you -- you're approving for Indian. Why don't you approve it for everybody then, sir?”

Followed by.

“You're saying only Indians can have the reservations, only Indians can have the gaming. So why aren't you approving it for everybody? Why are you being discriminatory? Why is it that the Indians don't pay tax, but everybody else does? I do.”

His goal was to either get them to pay taxes like he had to, or get the government to give him a similar exemption on his own casinos.

Trump’s “they don’t look Indian to me” comments was not him defending real Native Americans. He was basing it off stereotypes of how “Indians” were meant to look like in his head. You should look into it, he was obsessed with Native American casinos in Connecticut. The entire whole testimony is him questioning why Native Americans have those exemptions in the first place.

Literally everything you wrote is wrong. From the issue at hand to your analysis of the comment. It's painfully obvious you don't know the context of the quote and you haven't seen or read the entire testimony, which you claim is just him questioning the exemptions. Even the quotes you pulled to try and debunk what I said don't have the "they don't look like Indians to me" section in them.

This quote was not about stereotypes or about how he personally thought Native Americans were supposed to look and it wasn't about tax exemption status. Please, please, please, stop using mainstream media to research things.

This quote came from a 1993 hearing about the Indian Gaming Regulatory act. As someone who was very active in the gaming business in New Jersey at this time, Trump was called in to discuss the fact that an abundance of organized crime was taking place at the unchecked and unsupervised Indian casinos and blaming congress for not looking into it or doing anything about it. He was there urging Congress to look into it and do something because it was hurting and victimizing the Native Americans who couldn't just tell a crime boss to please get out of their casino.

The whole testimony was about how the Gaming Act had made it almost impossible for Native Americans to keep organized crime out of their casinos. If you don't believe me you can read the transcript of the hearing yourself. Donald Trump's testimony starts on page 178. The quote in question of "they don't look like Indians to me" is on page 242 where he is talking directly to George Miller accusing him of approving reservations for people who were not Native Americans. And this is something Trump pretty much knew to be a fact because he personally dealt with the people who got approved for these unchecked reservations who got approved by simply saying they were Native Americans and not having to prove it in any way. He was absolutely defending Native Americans and admonishing congress for allowing organized crime to take over their casinos and letting people who were not Native Americans take advantage of the Gaming Act.

If reading it in context is too hard for you can also take 45 minutes and watch this video of someone who explains the entire situation in detail and basically will read the transcript to you.

I don't know where you got your info but it's all wrong. Be careful when you tell people to look into things when you're making claims, because once they look into it (which, incidentally, I had already done, which is how I knew you were wrong) it becomes obvious whether or not you really looked into it yourself.

[jungabyss]

You said the entire testimony was about the tax exemption and that is objectively false. The entire testimony was about the organized crime at the casinos. The tax exemption was literally a back and forth between him and one senator who asked him about it and it took a couple of minutes. The whole rest of the testimony and case was about the organized crime. So out of the hours long hearing, you found the few minutes where they were talking about the tax exemption and pretended that was what the whole thing was about.

Because it’s both.

The suit alleges that the act forces states to permit Indian tribes to set up casinos, even if they are prohibited in the state. In addition, states have no power to tax, regulate or police the casinos.

Why do you think they brought taxes up? Because it’s literally part of the Indian Gaming Act and what he’s filing a lawsuit against. You’re just feeling cornered because you don’t understand the the full extent of the lawsuit.John Barry, who was Trump’s attorney literally stated that the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act violated the Constitution because it required states to permit gambling but denied them the right to tax and regulate the games.

“It’s not his job to provide evidence”

It’s not his job to provide evidence over a lawsuit he filed? Yes it kinda is and he showed no valid evidence unless you want to count the Native Americans not looking “Indian” to him as solid evidence of the claims he was making.

Good try though. I don’t why you’re reaching so hard over this billionaire politician but it’s funny at this point.

Your whole in depth description about a sovereign nation and why it was a valid argument on his part was just a load of BS. It’s literally irrelevant what they call themselves because it doesn’t take away why it is that way to begin with. Also you somehow agreeing that what he said was indeed what he meant by it being not fair so thanks for proving my point? You kinda just walked right into that one. You didn’t need to write a whole paragraph to gaslit yourself .

I have to say , you really are trying to convince yourself that him clearly making inappropriate comments about Native Americans and their ancestry was totally okay and not only that, but that this white billionaire was so concerned about Native Americans that he filed this lawsuit because he wanted to defend them against organized crime in the community instead of viewing them as clear competition & just wanting to benefit his own wallet. Like any businessman logically would, with a dash of racism added in there. Are you really that naive? Or just willingly that dense?

Yeah you certainly don’t admire Trump at all, you look at “facts” and “evidence” that you so casually missed the part where he clearly argued about tax exemptions since it was literally included in the lawsuit he made & try to tell I’m wrong because the testimony “isn’t about taxes at all”.

I don’t think this issue is too complex for me, it seems to be for you though since you pull an “deeply analyzed excuse” out your ass for every obvious racially motivated comment he makes. You just look dense at this point, the only people you’re convincing is your just as dense following.

Get a grip.

He’s accusing George Miller of approving reservations for people who weren’t Indians. He’s not really speaking derogatorily about Native Americans with that quote. And if George Miller was indeed approving reservations for people that were not Native Americans then he absolutely should have been called out for it.

No he’s not. Trump was taking issue with the treaty protected tax exemption status that many Native Americans have in their business ventures.

Towards the end of the testimony he states, “I want to find out. ... Well, then why don't you -- you're approving for Indian. Why don't you approve it for everybody then, sir?”

Followed by.

“You're saying only Indians can have the reservations, only Indians can have the gaming. So why aren't you approving it for everybody? Why are you being discriminatory? Why is it that the Indians don't pay tax, but everybody else does? I do.”

His goal was to either get them to pay taxes like he had to, or get the government to give him a similar exemption on his own casinos.

Trump’s “they don’t look Indian to me” comments was not him defending real Native Americans. He was basing it off stereotypes of how “Indians” were meant to look like in his head. You should look into it, he was obsessed with Native American casinos in Connecticut. The entire whole testimony is him questioning why Native Americans have those exemptions in the first place.

Literally everything you wrote is wrong. From the issue at hand to your analysis of the comment. It's painfully obvious you don't know the context of the quote and you haven't seen or read the entire testimony, which you claim is just him questioning the exemptions. Even the quotes you pulled to try and debunk what I said don't have the "they don't look like Indians to me" section in them.

This quote was not about stereotypes or about how he personally thought Native Americans were supposed to look and it wasn't about tax exemption status. Please, please, please, stop using mainstream media to research things.

This quote came from a 1993 hearing about the Indian Gaming Regulatory act. As someone who was very active in the gaming business in New Jersey at this time, Trump was called in to discuss the fact that an abundance of organized crime was taking place at the unchecked and unsupervised Indian casinos and blaming congress for not looking into it or doing anything about it. He was there urging Congress to look into it and do something because it was hurting and victimizing the Native Americans who couldn't just tell a crime boss to please get out of their casino.

The whole testimony was about how the Gaming Act had made it almost impossible for Native Americans to keep organized crime out of their casinos. If you don't believe me you can read the transcript of the hearing yourself. Donald Trump's testimony starts on page 178. The quote in question of "they don't look like Indians to me" is on page 242 where he is talking directly to George Miller accusing him of approving reservations for people who were not Native Americans. And this is something Trump pretty much knew to be a fact because he personally dealt with the people who got approved for these unchecked reservations who got approved by simply saying they were Native Americans and not having to prove it in any way. He was absolutely defending Native Americans and admonishing congress for allowing organized crime to take over their casinos and letting people who were not Native Americans take advantage of the Gaming Act.

If reading it in context is too hard for you can also take 45 minutes and watch this video of someone who explains the entire situation in detail and basically will read the transcript to you.

I don't know where you got your info but it's all wrong. Be careful when you tell people to look into things when you're making claims, because once they look into it (which, incidentally, I had already done, which is how I knew you were wrong) it becomes obvious whether or not you really looked into it yourself.

[jungabyss]

Girl…..

What I quoted is literally from the same context of what you linked me , I took those quotes from the exact transcript you did. They are on page 250. Trump filed a lawsuit because he viewed the Indian Game Act as competition because he didn’t like how they had no state interference.

Also, you saying he was defending Native Americans……He literally had no evidence these Native Americans weren’t actual Native Americans, I find it rather laughable that your evidence is he “dealt with them personally” when that means nothing. There was no substantial evidence he showed.

Side note, On Page 443, there’s a transcript of him on a radio show literally admitting he doesn’t think it’s fair that he pays taxes and Indians don’t.

IMUS: Okay. This is just my opinion, but I don't think it makes sense to anybody to have Indians operate casinos in New Jersey.

TRUMP: General George Custer was against it also and looked what happened to him.

IMUS: But in New Jersey -- obviously you have three casinos -- you already have casinos.

TRUMP; Right, but the difference is I pay taxes. The Indians aren't paying any taxes. The Indians aren't putting anything back into what's happening. The funny thing is Caomo was forced to put -- and now ail of a sudden they send hire certified letters, "We want bridges."

They call it the sovereign nation. They call it a nation/ this great sovereign nation, the Indian tribes. All of a sudden, it's nations.

Before it wasn't a nation, before gambling? Now it's this great sovereign nation. We protect, we do this, we do that, but when it comes to gambling, it's a sovereign nation

So it’s really a double standard and no taxes are paid . No supervision's there, tremendous crime, and most of the Indians don't want it themselves. The leaders -- you know, all chiefs and no Indians, and the leaders want it for the obvious reason, but I think it's something that's going to end or is certainly going to be supervised very, very stringently.

IMUS: Would there be any reason, if push comes to shove, for you to become a member of these tribes?

TRUMP; Hell, I think if we lose various things, I could perhaps become an Indian myself.

IMUS: You know, do one of those Robert Bly deals.

TRUMP: Well, I think I might have more Indian blood than a lot of the so-called Indians that are trying to open up the reservations.

What do you think is more likely? A businessman actually being concerned with “fake” Native Americans taking advantage of the Act or him simply viewing it as competition and a double standard that doesn’t benefit him & his own businesses?

Use some critical thinking since you seem to be too far up his ass to actually make an unbiased take on him. It’s painfully obvious what his intentions were by filing that lawsuit, not to mention him literally admitting it.

You seem to be the one views Trump from a completely bias perspective if you actually think he was trying to help Native Americans when everything points otherwise. Please don’t make me cackle, it’s like Trump is personally paying you to defend every single one of his actions.

He’s accusing George Miller of approving reservations for people who weren’t Indians. He’s not really speaking derogatorily about Native Americans with that quote. And if George Miller was indeed approving reservations for people that were not Native Americans then he absolutely should have been called out for it.

No he’s not. Trump was taking issue with the treaty protected tax exemption status that many Native Americans have in their business ventures.

Towards the end of the testimony he states, “I want to find out. ... Well, then why don't you -- you're approving for Indian. Why don't you approve it for everybody then, sir?”

Followed by.

“You're saying only Indians can have the reservations, only Indians can have the gaming. So why aren't you approving it for everybody? Why are you being discriminatory? Why is it that the Indians don't pay tax, but everybody else does? I do.”

His goal was to either get them to pay taxes like he had to, or get the government to give him a similar exemption on his own casinos.

Trump’s “they don’t look Indian to me” comments was not him defending real Native Americans. He was basing it off stereotypes of how “Indians” were meant to look like in his head. You should look into it, he was obsessed with Native American casinos in Connecticut. The entire whole testimony is him questioning why Native Americans have those exemptions in the first place.

Literally everything you wrote is wrong. From the issue at hand to your analysis of the comment. It's painfully obvious you don't know the context of the quote and you haven't seen or read the entire testimony, which you claim is just him questioning the exemptions. Even the quotes you pulled to try and debunk what I said don't have the "they don't look like Indians to me" section in them.

This quote was not about stereotypes or about how he personally thought Native Americans were supposed to look and it wasn't about tax exemption status. Please, please, please, stop using mainstream media to research things.

This quote came from a 1993 hearing about the Indian Gaming Regulatory act. As someone who was very active in the gaming business in New Jersey at this time, Trump was called in to discuss the fact that an abundance of organized crime was taking place at the unchecked and unsupervised Indian casinos and blaming congress for not looking into it or doing anything about it. He was there urging Congress to look into it and do something because it was hurting and victimizing the Native Americans who couldn't just tell a crime boss to please get out of their casino.

The whole testimony was about how the Gaming Act had made it almost impossible for Native Americans to keep organized crime out of their casinos. If you don't believe me you can read the transcript of the hearing yourself. Donald Trump's testimony starts on page 178. The quote in question of "they don't look like Indians to me" is on page 242 where he is talking directly to George Miller accusing him of approving reservations for people who were not Native Americans. And this is something Trump pretty much knew to be a fact because he personally dealt with the people who got approved for these unchecked reservations who got approved by simply saying they were Native Americans and not having to prove it in any way. He was absolutely defending Native Americans and admonishing congress for allowing organized crime to take over their casinos and letting people who were not Native Americans take advantage of the Gaming Act.

If reading it in context is too hard for you can also take 45 minutes and watch this video of someone who explains the entire situation in detail and basically will read the transcript to you.

I don't know where you got your info but it's all wrong. Be careful when you tell people to look into things when you're making claims, because once they look into it (which, incidentally, I had already done, which is how I knew you were wrong) it becomes obvious whether or not you really looked into it yourself.