#danmei confessions

[danmei-confessions]

I think we should talk about Wu Zetian, China’s only female emperor, who historically has been regarded as a horrible and brutal leader.

She was born a commoner, became a concubine to one emperor, married his son and then took the role of emperor for herself when he died. She was politically adept, highly ambitious and extraordinarily intelligent.

History has accused her of smothering her newly born daughter and blaming a rival for her death. She had that rivals hands and feet cut off and then had her thrown into a vat of wine in which she was left to drown. She gouged out another rivals eyes and had acid poured down her throat. She wiped out 12 entire branches of a clan. She poisoned her mother. Just how accurate these things are is up for debate, but while these things might not all be true, she certainly did have several family members killed. And she did deal with her rivals and her detractors ruthlessly. Yet none of these things would have attracted criticism if she had been a man. She was no more scandalous than any other ruler during that time period.

But! Her rule was peaceful and prosperous. She avoided wars and welcomed ambassadors from as far away as the Byzantine empire. She changed laws so common people could be chosen for roles in government for their abilities rather than their name or status. She acknowledged and acted on criticisms from her retainers. She built watchtowers along the Silk Road so merchants wouldn’t be harrowed by bandits. Her reign saw women given more freedom(the ability to divorce, hold government positions, travel, hunt and ride horses, to be recognized by scholars).

She supported Buddhism and helped the religion spread and grow through commissioning temples, monasteries, and even a statue of the Buddha said to be carved in her own likeness. In the eyes of the common people, she likely would have been an incredibly popular ruler.

She remains a controversial figure primarily because of stories about her personal actions against her rivals by male Confucian officials who were prejudiced against strong and ambitious women and while they undoubtedly exaggerated aspects of Wu’s life, there is still substantial verifiable evidence of her ruthlessness.

We should also be aware that although she allegedly held her power through murder and merciless, according to Confucian philosophy, ‘while an emperor should not be condemned for acts that would be crimes in a subject, he should be judged harshly for allowing the state to fall into anarchy’ and viewed under this lens, Wu did effectively fulfill her duties as a ruler.

So we have a leader of ancient china who had two faces, one who committed acts of vile cruelty against her family and rivals and one who gave her citizens peace and prosperity.

Through a modern lens she can be viewed as an evil woman who rose from humble beginnings and coldly and calculatingly murdered her way into arguably the most powerful position in the world. A rich woman who threw crumbs to her peasant people while she lived luxuriously. She is a deadly woman, a black widow, an evil stepmother, a kinslayer. But according to historians, “without Wu there would have been no long enduring Tang dynasty and perhaps no lasting unity of China.”

The comparison to a modern mr beast obviously doesn’t hold water, but we can certainly analyze jgy to a more comparable historical figure and argue more accurately in a historical context if jgy was a good leader as the de facto emperor as the cultivation worlds Xiāndū.

It’s easy to see the comparisons between Wu and jgy, both were undesirable and deemed unfit by society. But both were politically adept, highly ambitious and extraordinarily intelligent. Both had family members murdered, perhaps sharing between them filicide. Both had a clans murdered to a man. Both are thought to have had their faces carved on religious relics for their narcissistic pleasure. Both had watchtowers built as a defense for their people. And both were torn down by the men following after them, vilified and distorted. Both forever destined to be speculated upon and misunderstood. Both of their legacy’s destroyed by rumor and falsification. It would not surprise me in the slightest if mxtx didn’t draw on Wu at least a little bit in the creation of jgy. Both Wu and jgy are culpable for some pretty heinous stuff, that can’t be denied. But like Wu, jgy also has a second face.

Moral bias and character motivation aside, his efforts to build watchtowers, his patronage of religion in the building of Guanyin temple, his fight against political corruption, his years long peaceful reign, his charity, all these things lead to the conclusion that under the rule of Confucian, he more than aptly fulfilled his role as a leader for his citizens.

And if you really want to look at Jgys leadership through a modern lens, we really don’t have to look much further than Ingersoll. “If you want to find out what a man is to the bottom, give him power.”

And really that’s part of the tragedy of his character. Because of his background he excelled when he was in a role of leadership. He was good at it.

Whether or not jgy as a literary character is a good person, is subjective and should not be used to measure his role as an effective leader.

All of that being said, jgy is my bestfriend and I love him and would I die for him.

.

[pan-withnoplan]

"Did Luo Binghe love Shen Yuan or Shen Qingqiu, the persona he crafted to present to the world? Shen Yuan is essentially stuck pretending to be a person he's not for possibly the rest of his life, never being able to fully be who he really is again."

SHEN YUAN DID NOT GO AROUND THE OOC LOCK MULTIPLE TIMES, CONFUSE THE OTHER CHARACTERS WITH "HIS" SUDDEN AND OBVIOUS CHANGE, TURN THE WHOLE QING JING PEAK INTO A HEALTHIER PLACE FOR THE KIDS, FIGHT THE SYSTEM AND THE SITUATIONSHIPS OF THE STORY TOOTH AND NAIL, SHOW BINGHE UNCONDITIONAL LOVE AND KINDNESS, SAVE LIU QINGGE'S LIFE AND BEFRIEND HIM, COME UP WITH A MASTER PLAN TO COME BACK TO LIFE IN CASE HE DIED, SACRIFICE HIS LIFE FOR BINGHE, DO WHATEVER IT TOOK TO HELP AND SAVE BINGHE, CHANGE THE WHOLE STORY FOR THE BETTER, AND GENERALLY EARN LOVE RESPECT AND ADMIRATION NOT ONLY FROM BINGHE BUT SEVERAL OTHER IMPORTANT CHARACTERS, JUST FOR YOU TO DOUBT BINGHE'S LOVE FOR HIM AS A PERSON, SAY THAT HE CAN'T BE HIMSELF, SAY HE CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT FEARING RETRIBUTION FROM THE SYSTEM, AND REDUCE HIS AGENCY TO THAT OF A NPC IN HIS OWN STORY.

[buried-in-stardust]

I swiped across an SVSSS edit that went viral and just had to share some of the comments under it lmao:

*Mo Dao = MDZS, Tian Guan = TGCF, Zha Fan = SVSSS

*yuandan (原耽) refers to original danmei, danmei being BL (boy's love)

(The novel names MDZS and SVSSS also sound very much like stereotypical novels aimed at men)

[eng by me]

[anqelbean]

Everyday I come closer to the opinion that gatekeeping my favourite book series is not only good but should also be encouraged

[justsome-di]

Sometimes I come across Fandom posts of people being in genuine distress and being completely unable to ignore discourse

So maybe this it a hot take but I think if you get super upset over fanfiction or fanart or fan theories bc of low stakes fan interpretations or something, then maybe you shouldn't be involved in Fandom culture at all

Maybe you should remove yourself from those communities. It's not a hobby at that point it's self-harm and bullying.

[danmeichael]

YOU DID ART??? I THOUGHT YOU WERE JUST THE HORNIER AND LESS CONTRIVERSAL (in term of hot takes, not the incest) VERSION OF DANMEI CONFESSIONS LMAO PPL HERE R SO HORNY I THOUGHT THAY WAS UR BRAND LIKE HOW ARTHURLESTERS-RIGHT-ARM IS MORE OF A PRIEST THAN A MALEVOLENT BLOG

fuck my stupid baka blog.

[danmeiconfession]

There's nothing more annoying than knowing that you can't actually express you're thoughts and feelings on a book without people being like wow you're such an anti how dare. Because I'm sorry I just think heavens officials is boring to me. It's not my thing. But if I express this openly I'll get a bunch of people yelling at me for not getting the book and not understanding the themes or being a hater. And like... I think its fine. It's not a bad book. I'd love to actually make posts discussing the writing itself but being critical in a way where you don't only praise every word makes you an anti. Better tag for hate... And I can say that 8 times in any post I make that I don't hate the book and I just want to discuss but the take away is still that I'm just illiterate or don't understand.

I promise you I do. And again it's not a terrible book I just think it's a book where by the end it's thematic statement falls flat and the ensemble cast is mostly forgettable. And that's fine. It's fine that it's not as good and I should be allowed to express this

.

[typemoonconfessions]

I don't know where the Lanling/Yan Qing ship came from and at this point I'm too afraid to ask (but if anyone is willing to explain it to me I would honestly be very grateful just so I'm no longer confused as hell).

direct quote from when we answered before:

good question!

it appears as if the ship originates off yan having a line for lan ling (take the TL version here, not the NA version)

Lanling Wang…… Wow, so coooool, the legendary super-handsome guy. Eh, I don’t lose at that? Hahhahahahaha, you have a good eye, Master

and so it appears as if the ship is originally based off of that. also, and i know this might sound a bit confusing if you look at yan qing for more than 2 seconds, yan/lan ling is rather popular amongst types who enjoy shipping more feminine guys (like people who ship astolfo with [yes, we know, d'eon isn’t a guy] with d'eon). often times though those arts of yan thoroughly change his body shape to match a more feminine one.

also sometimes all you need is two hot guys to ship yk.

[punksnom]

They confessed

They confessed!!!!!

THEY CONFESSED!!!!!!!!!

[wrongplaceworsttime]

i want to read a new danmei but… the slow burn…

[danmei-confessions]

My honest opinion is that Jin Guangyao as Xiandu did in fact make the world a better and safer place. That Jin Guangyao's watchtower project brought sorely-needed aid to regions typically ignored by cultivators is something I'm willing to believe, because that information is given to us by Lan Wangji specifically--someone who has spent the last 13 or so years "going where the chaos is," and therefore has firsthand knowledge of what the situation is like out there for civilians.

Jin Guangyao's consistent lobbying for the watchtower project, at considerable political and financial cost to himself, indicates to me that he genuinely cared about improving the lot of the common people and using his hard-won status to make institutional reforms for the benefit of society. And the fact that the Jianghu Wei Wuxian is resurrected into is so peaceful--that children like Lan Sizhui, Lan Jingyi, Jin Ling, and Ouyang Zizhen can run around being kind and idealistic--is proof that Jin Guangyao succeeded.

That Nie Huaisang succeeded in bringing about Jin Guangyao's downfall, then, is quite bad for the rest of society. We aren't given much information about Nie Huaisang's character, abilities, or goals beyond vengeance, so we don't know how important he considers things like helping the common people and improving society to be. On the other hand, Nie Huaisang's actions throughout the story indicate that he's all too willing to allow his own sect to decay and to put children in the line of fire in order to achieve his own, selfish vengeance. Therefore, if Nie Huaisang truly becomes the next Xiandu (as MXTX said he would), there is absolutely zero indication that he would give two shits about trying to help the common people. While he might not go as far as to try and directly tear down the watchtowers himself, it is still far more likely that the watchtower project would stutter and end under Nie Huaisang's reign--simply because maintaining the watchtowers is difficult and unpopular, and Nie Huaisang has shown zero indication of any willingness to work hard for *moral* ends that do not involve his own private interests.

Society at the end of Mo Do Zu Shi--both the Jianghu and the lot of the common people--is in a worse state than it was at the beginning. Wei Wuxian's actions created a massive power vacuum that none of the surviving named characters can effectively fill. Quite frankly, that Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji happily swan off into the sunset with zero regard for the political mess they helped create--a political mess that will doubtlessly negatively impact the lives of thousands--makes me second-guess their moral characters.

.

[factsilike]

As hilarious as it is to read about WWX initially being unable to perceive his own attraction to Lwj as anything other than the typical reactions of a woman, I wish more people would realise that it was not due to obliviousness, but rather because of compulsory heterosexuality and him simply not being aware such things existed. The time period he grew up in speaks for itself, as well as his unsafe (because the Jiang household was anything but secure) environment.

It was funny when it was treated as a crack idea, but it's frustrating when it's treated as a canon trait of his, when it's not. This guy is highly intelligent, both emotionally and intellectually, and the conclusions he came to regarding his own feelings as well as Lwj's were based on the information he had at the time. I see people point it out most in that scene at the start of the novel where Lwj gets drunk and points to WWX saying 'Mine."

But I can't believe how obtuse those same people are when they don't realise that while it's obvious to the reader (because duh they're reading a danmei novel about romance between the two main leads, and they let themselves be blinded by their own perceptions) that he's referring to WWX, to him it's not. Because what was he supposed to think? When all Lwj had ever been towards him was tolerant at best, and outright hostile at worst, and with his previous cold behaviour, was WWX really supposed to think, oh he must mean for me to be his! Because that would have made no sense at that part of the story. It was only logical for him to try to find a rational explanation, and the only one WWX could come to was that LWJ was referring to his sword, because obviously WWX wasn't going to take him seriously even if he had confessed, he would have only thought that he was drunk rambling or something. He didn't have any reason to believe him at that point.

It's not until the rest of the events of his second life progress and give WWX many opportunities and chances to reflect on his own feelings and Lwj's (changed and more affectionate) behaviour, does he start to think, could it be that I like him? Because WWX is no idiot; he realises his own feelings for Lwj pretty early on. And he catches onto Lwj's love for him too! Which is what the whole getting drunk at the inn thing before Guanyin Temple was about; he was scared to find out whether or not Lwj's love for him was platonic or not. (Which is a valid thing literally every person who has ever had a crush can relate to; worrying over whether the person of your affections feels the same or not. And it's difficult enough navigating these things in heterosexual relationships, let alone same-sex ones)

I think the way MXTX wrote WWX's journey of discovering his sexuality as well as his budding love for Lwj is beautiful and deserves more praise and recognition, rather than just glossed over as tee hee 'obliviousness'.

[lecinea]

I am seriously concerned by the danmei-confession anons that seem to think that murder and extreme torture are okay as long as it's done to 'bad people'

Darling, dear, you need to see what a slippery slope of superiority thinking that is. That is in fact the kind of hard lined morality that lead to inprisonment and eventual massacre of the Wen Remnants. Because they were 'bad', they were on the 'wrong side' of the war, part of the invading force of Lotus Pier (Wen Ning said that his people didn't kill people at random, doesn't mean they didn't kill.) But it doesn't matter if they were good or bad, because to murder a bunch of people is still wrong.

The cultivator that accidentially killed Jiang Yanli, only attacked Wei Wuxian because Wei Wuxian had just killed his brother. The brother was killed because he fired the opening shot at Wei Wuxian. The guy and his brother were there, probably because their sect leader told them that they had to defeat a dangerous villain with dark magic, which did appear to be true because Wei Wuxian did invent a whole new type of fierce corpse and killed the heir to of of the big sects. So did they deserve to die?

Y'all need to let go of this storybook idea of good and bad. Morality is so much messier and complex.

And if MXTX really does think that Wei Wuxian is the ideal of goodness, I am allowed to disagree with her. While it is her story, she did put it out in the world, and readers are allowed to form their own thoughts and opinions based on the story she has written.

[kukuandkookie]

People keep claiming Chinese BL manhua really only have stories featuring toxic male leads, so I offered to give recommendations with green flags... Someone finally said yes, so here's what I typed up in response!:

I Ship My Rival x Me:

One of my personal favourites!

Based on the hilarious novel, commonly known as I Ship My Adversary x Me and also has an audio drama adaptation on MaoEr FM. Basically a story about two actors who are seen as complete rivals by everyone except the actors themselves, which annoys the main character (Wei Yanzi) enough that when he discovers there are actual fans who ship them instead of pit them against one another, he’s so excited he sort of starts shipping them too (in like, an abstract, theoretical manner lmao). This of course causes shenanigans as he actually gets to know the person who people ship him with/pit him against, Gu Yiliang.

Gu Yiliang is a true sweetheart and the greenest of green flags. He’s a complete puppy and I love him. And this means, naturally, the only misunderstandings in this story are of the hilarious kind (you’ll know what I mean if you read it lol). 😂

This one actually used to be available officially in English on the Bilibili manhua’s international app before it got shut down, but it recently got picked up by Seven Seas, the company behind a lot of official English translations of danmei (Chinese BL)!

Touch Your World:

A literally colour-blind boy (as in, he cannot see colour at all and only sees things in black and white) discovers someone who he can see colour on. This person is a designer who has suffered past betrayal and trauma that has caused him to shut himself up and grow much more on edge, but this chance meeting draws both parties out of their shells.

Pixiu’s Eatery, No Way Out:

Not a green flag top in the traditional sense, but here we meet the mythical Pixiu: an ancient Chinese mythical creature who now runs a restaurant. While he’s a penny-pincher with a temper and he doesn’t get along with his love interest at first (a ghost named Wen Xi who he finds suspicious due to Wen Xi’s ties to a past rival of his named Taotie), Pixiu and Wen Xi eventually grow, quite naturally—and hilariously!—into a found family.

The Wife Is First:

Based on a novel of pretty much the same name (and is written by the same author as the popular manhua and donghua, No Doubt in Us (a heterosexual body-swap romance, which also has a subtle gay side ship)). Here we meet Jing Shao just as he’s about to lose everything: once a royal and a powerful general, he has been betrayed by all those around him…except the husband he has never treated well.

As such, when we first meet him, we actually witness his—and his husband’s—deaths. But then he awakens and finds himself back in time to the night right after he was forced to wed this husband of his, and Jing Shao vows to treat him well from now on because he stuck with him through thick and thin despite everything.

Don’t Say You Love Me:

A high school romance with a supernatural twist: Lin Yutong was confessed to by his best friend, Qin Weiyun, at their graduation party. When he drunkenly freaked out and ran away, Qin Weiyun was hit by a car during the chase…

Devastated by his loss, Lin Yutong quickly wakes up to find himself back at the start of his high school journey, right before he meets Qin Weiyun… And this time, he wants to keep Qin Weiyun safe.

But his overly familiar attitude at first gets the wary Qin Weiyun a tad suspicious, because he’s actually quite an aloof person.

The author and artist of this one is also behind another popular manhua titled Your Dream Is Delicious, which is about a demon named Yi Kui who discovers he enjoys eating the nightmares of Lin You. This eventually leads to them—you guessed it—falling in love.

It’s Not That I Want to Wear Women’s Clothing:

Our main character is hired to crossdress to help this CEO get over his gynophobia (fear of touching women) without him knowing. Naturally, this leads to an awkward romantic journey of both identities of our main character getting close to this CEO…who at first glance seems like the typical cold and aloof CEO type, except he’s actually quite a sweetheart.

Salt Friend:

A slice-of-life high school story about the “school bully” named Tong Yang who’s actually a crybaby and the aloof person named Xiao Zhen who discovers him crying. While the two don’t seem like they’d get along at first glance, this quickly becomes a friends-to-lovers story that navigates family drama alongside the romance.

How’d I Get a Heroine’s Script?:

A transmigration story with a twist. Chao Yi is wheelchair-bound but finds himself eventually as a young lord in what is basically a palace drama (court politics, intrigue, family drama, all that good stuff). His System, Qin Que, tasks him with wooing the difficult 7th prince, Gu Yunheng, who smiles on the surface but is quite cold in actuality.

Despite the two getting off on the wrong foot—mostly because Gu Yunheng is really hard to get close to—they soon end up as unlikely allies…especially since there’s a lot of secrets, such as regarding the death of the body Chao Yi’s occupying, the scheming princes, and even Gu Yunheng himself.

See You My King:

Zhang Li, a student interested in what is basically ancient Egypt, goes on an expedition to the ruined civilization and nearly loses his life. Except at the same time, he discovers an ancient tomb with a statue that actually comes to life and saves him…

And this statue even follows him home. This statue is sweet and loving despite its inability to speak, and Zhang Li grows attached to it (or him)… But then the statue falls apart and Zhang Li is devastated.

In wishing for a miracle to bring them back together, the statue’s stone heart sends Zhang Li back in time…to when this ancient civilization is still present. And that’s how he discovers his stone statue is the “tyrant king” of this region, and as cruel as he seems at first glance, both this king and Zhang Li eventually grow close and unfold the different sides to one another that makes them inseparable in the face of all kinds of threats.

Trapping the Foxy Doctor:

A doctor and a psychiatrist meet…except it doesn’t seem like a perfect love story at first glance. Not because the doctor is traditionally foxy (seductive and/or cunning), but because he’s so silly and on-the-nose that he initially kind of rubs the psychiatrist the wrong way. Except, of course, with the kind of sunny sincerity displayed by our doctor Zhi Banyi, you can’t resist him for long…

And the psychiatrist, Lin Li, is himself quite a polite soul despite his complex upbringing. As such, the two end up together through a series of cases where they have to collaborate and help clients, with a lot of shenanigans sprinkled in between (including the fact Lin Li has a side-job live-streaming as a woman—and “she” just so happens to be Zhi Banyi’s favourite streamer lol).

Pirouette Into My Heart aka Salad Days:

You know the “he was a skater boy and she did ballet” kind of set-up? Well here we have a boxer and a ballet dancer…and hey, “can I make it any more obvious”?

This one is basically a feel-good story of the century. It’s childhood friends to lovers, and it’s soft and cuddly and encouraging, as we follow the main character, Jiang Shen, in achieving his ballet dreams. And on every step of the way, he’s accompanied by the boxer Bai Jinyi, who’s also chasing his own dreams.

The draw of this one is that while there’s obviously conflict to drive the plot along, it’s ultimately a comforting story, so you get all warm and squishy inside reading it. Bai Jinyi and Jiang Shen are very supportive of one another, as is everyone around them.

There’s even extras at the very end that swap the classes of the two main characters, which makes for a similarly compelling AU. 🤭

Beryl and Sapphire:

Not always BL but often is. What do I mean by that? Well it’s a story that can switch to any universe even as the characters stay the same, and some worlds are just one-off gags while some are whole story arcs. The original manhua features stick figures, so if you really want to experience this one, I’d recommend the donghua. The first season also cleverly shows the main characters as actors in the OP, which explains all the world-switching pretty easily haha.

Don’t Pick Up Boyfriends from the Trash Bin:

Unfortunately I’m not sure the manhua for this one is still ongoing, but the original novel (all about transmigration and hopping multiple worlds) 100% features a green flag top.

The Guy Inside Me:

I know the title sounds sexual lol but it’s actually a joke about how it’s a body-swap story. 😆

The original Chinese title is “This Question Is Too Difficult”) and of course, the author also wrote Fake Slackers, which has two very smart students act like terrible ones due to not wanting trouble.

Falling to Where I Belong:

The thing about this one is that the top is 100% a total green flag... It's the main character that's more of a red flag, in the sense he at first only asks the top out to humiliate him due to a misunderstanding.

But it's still a heartfelt story filled with regret and growth, and I did really like the portrayal of Cheng Feichi. Personally I think the manhua humanizes him a bit more than the novel since we didn't really get his POV in the novel that often, but I did hope for even more emotion in the ending... Still, it was a satisfying read, and while I would like to comfort the main character, Zhen Yeming, over his regrets, I really want to just give all the good things to Cheng Feichi, who definitely deserves it after everything he went through.

More Than Brothers:

For the "non-freaks" out there, they're not actual brothers, don’t worry; not adopted brothers either. Just a guy who saw his younger friend as his bro…until this friend disappeared from his life and apparently got into a bad crowd… Except in reality he is being harassed and is struggling to leave his abusive family.

The Protagonist Just Wants to Fall in Love:

Kind of a classic in the transmigration genre, except now we get multiple worlds in multiple arcs. Our protagonists are Systems on their final mission, aiming to become human by the end of it, and their task is to guide their protagonists away from the path of "darkening" (essentially corruption).

And each and every one of these systems do so by getting their protagonist to fall in love with them lol.

Unsurprisingly, my favourite arc so far—in the manhua at least!—is the historical one between the advisor and the emperor, but the third—and currently ongoing as the time of me writing this—world between two university students who started getting close during military training and by playing games is also quite cute.

And okay, man I could really keep going, especially with the manhua that are based on novels, but this post is already really long asjakfl. It was, in fact, so fucking long YouTube wouldn't even let me post it at first until I cut it down AMFKGSJDFGS.

But I still want to at least give a shout out to some of the manhua with pretty healthy, green flag tops/gongs!:

Like Han Yuan, despite the characters not getting along at first and Yu Han being rather aloof to the spoiled Luo Linyuan, is still quite sweet at its core. Lovely Allergen is as well, even with their "brotherly" relationship being the forefront of the conflict between Song Yu and Yue Zishi.

Another kind I wanted to bring up is the ones where their worlds or stories are dark, but the characters aren't necessarily. Like The Film Emperor, He Insisted on Being My Patron has a very green flag gong (he's such a puppy!), but he and the main character are up against the reddest of red flags of a villain LMDFKGSJFD.

It's also not a manhua I think people who want green flag leads would necessarily enjoy, given that beyond being "darker," it also goes into the territory of fan service-y and "problematic" nsfw content, but again, the male lead is really quite sweet to the main character despite the shitty situation they're in.

And I thought of Bu Chonghua from Tunhai aka Swallowing the Seas (another one based on a novel), since the main character there, Wu Yu, comes to see Bu Chonghua as so good and just that he pushes him away because he feels like he can't dirty such a man with his own darkness, both in his past and personality. It's a trope I really enjoy.

I'll briefly mention some ⚠️ spoilers ⚠️but the reason I wanted to highlight it is because: the latest chapter of the manhua has Bu Chonghua overhear Wu Yu saying he likes Bu Chonghua, and this is after Wu Yu disappeared and Bu Chonghua is worried he skipped town for good. He follows Wu Yu, all while wondering if the like Wu Yu holds for him is the same as his liking of Wu Yu, and when Wu Yu is about to be gravely injured in an underground fighting ring, Bu Chonghua steps in to save him... The chapter ends with Wu Yu holding him back pleading with him to stop because it's not worth dirtying his hands with such a man as his opponent, and that's such a delicious flavour of angst because like...Wu Yu thinks it's fine for he himself to fight against such a person, but he doesn't want Bu Chonghua to. ;-;

Oops. I didn't mean for this to become a deeper ramble of Tunhai KMSGFKGHSJ. It's just interesting to me since Tunhai and its prequel, Poyun aka Breaking Through the Clouds, may not have what the people who prefer green flag tops want in terms of content, but its tops are technically not that much of a red flag either.

Which also get us to the kind of stories where plot can also sort of outweigh whether a top/gong is a green flag or not. Like No Arguing With Mr. Mo has two characters who struggle greatly in their relationship, with the question of "are they in love?" being an overarching issue for them, meaning it's not exactly healthy, and prevents them from being fully either green or red flags.

I also didn't bring up a lot of historical/xianxia manhua, which I'm sure some people may disagree with... Like the leads in Tianbao Fuyao Lu are arguably quite good, and while I haven't read Dinghai Fusheng Lu yet, I assume it's in a similar boat as something set in the same world.

And then there's the ones that develop into green flags... Like Mo Ran starts off awful, yes, but he does become much better later on!! But I don't think that's what those people after green flags want to hear lol. Plus I'd argue Erha is best experienced in novel (or audio drama) form over the manhua anyway—the manhua feels more like something made for established fans in my opinion.

Regardless, I hope this shows that with so many listed above, many manhua actually feature male leads who really do care for their love interests in a healthy, respectful way, whether they're 100% green flags or they develop into green flags or they're not even complete green flags. ^^

Edit: Oh I forgot to link my full list of danmei/baihe manhua recs HMSKFJSKS. I currently don’t have any summaries, tags, or content warnings in this list though, but there’s quite the range of stories!:

[retributory]

Thank you for the post saying Binghe wouldn't care if he found out Shen Yuan replaced Shen Jiu, I saw a post on that danmei confessions blog that was something like "Shen Yuan being compared to Helen of Troy is accurate bc they both bring ruin to those around them, since if people found out about Shen Yuan then Cang Diong would want Shen Jiu's body back for a burial (so they would basically exorcise Shen Yuan out of it I guess and he'd die again) and Luo Binghe would break up with him for not being able to trust him anymore" and that pissed me off so much bc like. Worstie how can you read the novel and be this wrong about everything in it. Personally I don't think people know Shen Yuan replaced Shen Jiu (except maybe Binghe) but if they found out about how he was forced to due to the System, like he was a hostage and cursed by some entity, they certainly wouldn't blame him or force him to leave. I mean literally the only person who would mourn Shen Jiu is Yue Qingyuan, and he likes the current Shen Yuan too! He wouldn't want him dead either. Idk how some people can misinterpret a novel's point this bad but I wish they'd stop talking about it as if they're facts

yeah idk the average user on that blog appears to be reading entirely different novels and you go in the notes and people are nodding sagely as if the posts make sense. like if the actual text of the novel disagrees with you i think you're just wrong lol.

and yeah they . . . pretty much have already guessed it isn't shen jiu anyways. like they don't know who it IS, or what exactly the truth of the situation is, because the system and such are out of their scope of knowledge, but they're quite confident in running theories like "qi deviation-induced amnesia and personality change," so they don't consider him the same guy anyways. they were actively shocked it WASN'T possession (though the possession theory is kind of correct. lol). it's also so weird to think that cqms would (for lack of nicer terms) give a fuck at all if sy DID maliciously possess sj. in the original timeline it's made pretty clear no one comes to sj's defense except yqy, because sj specifically desires that outcome. sj isn't some helpless baby at the whims of everyone around him - he specifically and intentionally seeks to ruin his own life and the lives of everyone around him, or at the very least make them as miserable around him as possible. thus, no one else likes or misses him at all, and in fact every peak lord at that meeting was jumping for joy that they got Other Guy instead of sj, which is a contributing factor to why they just decide to simply not call him out on it.

i also think (says guy who posts about svsss 3 times a day) people are like. taking it too serious. you're not supposed to be seriously considering lines of thought like that because svsss is a transmigration parody novel of xianxia power fantasies - whatever exists in the background exists purely to support the world of this satire. and while that certainly is a fun topic for meta - i enjoy reading posts like that! - it becomes irritating when the meta is framed as if somehow you are in the wrong for enjoying a novel the way it was intended to be enjoyed by the author, and that the only True way to enjoy it is through enlightened meta-contextual analysis that assumes all the characters are actually different people.

someone on that blog was like "why doesn't svsss expand on the lore and fights and characters!!!" because they don't matter to the story my friend. not every novel is lord of the rings. this is xianxia transmigration parody novel my friend. just read . . . an actual stallion novel. actually really do that because then you'll form a connection with sy because these things are written SO bad and then you'll understand him LMFAO

[danmeiconfession]

ok this is a very personal opinion of mine but I absolutely despise any heterosexual fan content in danmei and baihe fandoms. i came here to read gay shit. if I wanted to read about straight people, i would just watch a true crime documentary or one of those 5 hour history videos on youtube about the etiquette of victorian mourning.

.