#mcu discussion

[weepingmusicchopshop]

John Walker isn't racist, he's one of the less talked about victims of racism

The tragedy of John Walker is that he is a legit overachiever and American hero who's life was destroyed because some powerful racist in the government couldn't stomach the idea of a Black Captain America.

He was a special forces operative, highly decorated. He seems genuinely humbled and in awe of the role of Captain America and much more at home doing the actual missions and work of the job than kissing babies and shaking hands. That said he understands the symbolic part of the job is important and we see him working hard at the "inspirational" aspect of Captain America despite not being comfortable with it.

The only two people we see him having a real connection with in his personal life are his wife Olivia Walker, a woman of color, and his best friend Lemar Hoskins, a black man, both of whom seem to genuinely care about and respect him as a good person.....which probably sealed his fate.

The powers that be, the ones who just could not stomach the idea of a black man wielding that shield needed two things. 1) All American White Guy and 2) someone for whom it would be difficult for people to claim was chosen because of racism. They didn't ask Hawkeye because even if he had said yes it would have been unquestionable that race was the driving factor. So when they told John Walker was he was the best possible candidate for the job, they neglected to tell him that he was the best possible candidate for the job.....with a woman of color wife and a black best friend.

Again John Walker doesn't know that. As far as he knows he got the job because the aptitude test they had him perform put him on par with people like Hawkeye, Black Widow, Falcon, etc. Speaking for "etc" HE WASN"T FULLY BRIEFED ON THE DORA MILAJE. The Dora Milaje are the elite fighting force of the most technologically advanced nation on earth with a proven track record against Aliens, Super Soldiers, and lord knows what else. Its easy to think that John being patronizing of them was just racism and sexism but what if he didn't know he was facing multiple elite warriors armed with advanced weapons and armor? The scene right before they shows up John offers to put down his shield before fighting Sam to "make it fair". Then the Dora Milaje show up armed with weapons made of the same material as his shield and he calls them "pointy sticks". I am not arguing he wasn't being an asshole, I am just saying its highly likely he was never actually fully briefed on the Dora Milaje. Hell its possible he was never more than casually briefed on Wakanda. He seems surprised they are there, despite the fact that Zemo killed their previous king! Remember his bosses, the people that picked him because they couldn't stomach a black Captain America, are the same people in in Black Panther had no idea that Wakanda was a world power because they didn't care enough about Africa to even try to find out. John Walker has been told he is good enough for the job, so when he fails, when he is shown time and time again that he's not good enough for the job he's internalizing that as "I'm not doing my best, if I were doing my best I would be able to do what's expected of me". But he is doing his best, he's just not qualified for the job. He was lied to by racist, placed in a position he had no business being, over a more qualified minority and the whole world is gonna suffer for it.

TLDR: Racism imposes step costs on everyone, not just minorities.

[crazysandwich]

My Marvel Thoughts and an Open Call for Fellow Fans

Recently, I’ve had some amazing discussions about the MCU, and I just wanted to share a few thoughts. This fandom is genuinely one of the most welcoming and passionate communities I’ve encountered, and being part of it has been such a rewarding experience. Apologies in advance for the rambling that might follow, but I promise it’s coming from a good place.

I’ve loved Marvel (specifically the MCU) since the first Iron Man movie. I’ve grown up with these characters and watched the entire universe expand into something massive. But only recently did I start connecting with the fandom more actively, especially through Tumblr. It all started when I wrote my first ever fanfic on Ao3, and I can’t fully express how good it feels to be part of this creative and supportive space.

Now, I can’t get enough of it. I love talking about favorite characters, ships, headcanons, canon moments, what should have happened, and where things might go next. Honestly, I’m always up for a good Marvel chat.

So if you ever feel like talking MCU with someone, whether it’s to scream about your favorite ships, rant about a plotline, share theories, or throw around wild headcanons, my DMs are open. You can also send me asks, anonymous or not, or even fanfic prompts. I’d love to connect.

[elpis-simps]

Okay I just found out something. So we all know Captain Marvel. (BTW this post is for marvel fans) and her movie. I've watched that movie multiple times. Love it, I think it's written fairly well, great CGI, funny script, good lore and story, love how everything ties in, overall its a really good movie; and captain marvel is one of my favourite superheroes, and one of the most badass.

WHY THE F*CK do people think she's a "bad movie and bad superhero" like it's one of the really good B.E movies! (Before Endgame)

**I'm using B.E as Befoee Endgame because A.E (after endgame) is arguably the worse marvel era. Don't get me wrong, it has some great stuff in A.E, but B.E is just better overall.

Anyways, back to what I was saying. I think k Brie Larson was a great actress and did really well portraying the character Captain Marvel. Not to mention captain marvel was one of the overpowered superheroes in the B.E era, before they started making everyone OP to defeat big CGI villains and to make their movies more action packed to get more views and stuff. She had good plotline, good powers, cool backstory, funny, and genuinely one of my favourite female superheroes.

I would love to see her as the new face of the MCU, A.E. considering they killed off what was generally considered the "face" of the MCU, Iron Man and Captain America, they haven't put much focus on one or two specific people to be aforementioned face.

Captain marvel hasn't been killed off, she has amazing potential, and she's personally one of my favourite 'Big Badass Backup To Fight Big Strong Villain" in those "No hope left" moments.

I don't understand the hate on her. May e its because she was, along with Natasha Romanff, one of the first female superheroes on-screen in the MCU. Sexism is a big thing in movies and stuff, but I have some reasons why I think she and another person- who I will mention later- should be the next 'Face of the MCU'.

1: the previous 'face' duo was Iron man and Captain America. So it sta ds to reason, along with what marvel has been doing to be more racially and gender inclusive, that we should have 2 female superheroes.

Yes I know the whole 'really overexaggerated feminist film superhero plotline new budget annoying superhero to earn more money and get higher ratings' thing is annoying; but hear me out.

Point 2: I have a few options, but to continue off of point 1; I feel like a good combo would be The Scarlet Witch and Captain Marvel. (Wanda Maximoff and Carol Danvers)

They are both powerful, badass, good storyline, great actors behind them heroes/characters. They could make for a good duo to contrast from the B.E duo of men.

Point 3: yes u know that Wanda is 'dead' BUT before the rocks fell on her, you could clearly see a flash of RED MAGIC in the rocks. After the entire Dr Strange MoM (multiverse of madness) plotline was 'Scarlet Witch has grown in power she's following us into DUFFERENT DIMENSIONS and was prophesied since the DAWN OF TIME, and has unlocked much more of her powers, I HIGHLY doubt some normal old rocks would kill her.

It's just unlikely considering how obscure some of marvels foreshadowing has been, we know that they foreshadow films that come out like 3 years later.

Point 4: moving away from Captain Marvel and Wanda, how about a new duo.

Bucky Barnes and Yelena Belova. Its similar to the old duo of Captain America (man out of time, from 1940, soldier) and Iron Man (normal human, with special training/ gear that is one of the only things that makes them super.)

This duo would be interesting, especially as we've seen both bucky AND yelena on an official marvel movie poster together.

I personally love both characters;and it pays homage to the golden age of marvel B.E.

Bucky is homage to Captain America (obviously) and Yelena is homage to both Iron Man AND Natasha Romanoff.

And it could allow for more opportunity of the old age to come shining back through the new age, in the form of two humans, who have a rivalry,

(I think it would be interesting to have bucky and yelena to have a mild rivalry at least, considering we chose them due to there similarities with the old duo, cap and stark)

Who are also enhanced in ways that gives them an advantage in fighting, and it could give a lot of opportunity to save marvel. And bucky is a fan favourite character, so considering marvels reputation going down now their movies are getting worse COMPARED TO B.E, I think this could be a great way to bring the nostalgia of the old movies back.

So my original rant was about captain marvel being hated. Sorry for making you read all this, and if you have read everything here, I thank you immensely for giving me the time and chance.

I really miss the B.E era, and hate how they kill off all the OG great characters for new, sh*ttier superheros like Kamala Khan.

So here is just some ideas in my passionate rant which I would love to see. I love Wanda and Captain marvel, but personally I think I would prefer the Winter Soldier and White Widow duo because it would need less fancy magic CGI, and give the film(s) they appear in a more B.E and better quality feel then just a bunch of CGI that takes away from the quality of the movie and storyline, and the lack of CGI ( I mean the bright magic flashy stuff they constantly use in A.E, not the general cgi they more often use in B.E)

Would give the film(s) a better, more enostalgic, more authentic, emotional, just overall better film quality and plotline.

[clives-archive]

I wish people wouldn't fight about this, but I guess that's fandom for you?

I mean, while I think there are differences in what Bob and Wanda did, even in terms of how much they were or weren't responsible for what happened, or how much they were aware of what they did, or if they would have been able to stop it, I don't understand why we would approach the whole situation as "do we have to forgive these guys?"

Like, they both messed up, they both hurt people, but we know in both cases that this isn't what they set out to do. They're both a victim of nobody really knowing how to deal with powers on a level as they have them, which also means, if they want to run away - which Wanda kind of did at the end of Wandavision - nobody can really stop them.

And I think this is a really interesting situation, actually - they both have to create guidelines for themselves, even when their mental health is acting up, or they're grieving or hurt. We have seen that they both try to remove themselves from the equation - Wanda by seemingly sacrificing herself, Bob by refusing to use his powers at all. I'm pretty sure neither of these situations will stick, and how they continue dealing with that, and with the people around them, is what's really interesting to me.

And to return to the actual topic, even though they had different roads to becoming who they now are, they are two sides of the same coin - two messed up people who went through a lot of trauma and had frightening amounts of power thrust upon them. And to try and create a sort of competition about who is the "better" person here really seems pretty reductive.

So Bob accidentally terrorized the largest city in the U.S, and we forgave him because he had a hard life, And Wanda did the same thing on a much smaller scale for the same reason. So we can forgive her too, right? Right?

[jessmalia]

#don't do that in the middle of an argument steve tony will pop a boner

[rulesofdisorder]

i still see team cap vs team ironman discourse on tiktok and the main reason people are team ironman is because bucky killed tony’s parents (which. isn’t what the teams are about, it’s about the sokovia accords but whatever) and actually. bucky killing tony’s parents is proof that team cap is the correct side.

because steve’s main issue with the sokovia accords is that in signing them the avengers “surrender their right to choose” and if they sign them, they will be essentially owned by the government. and steve says that the government is “run by people with agendas and agendas change.”

how does bucky killing the starks come into this? howard worked for the government. he worked for shield, and thus worked unknowingly for hydra, for years. until one day hydra decided that howard was a loose end that needed taken care of. shield’s (hydra’s) agenda changed. and when their agenda changed they sent in the winter soldier to kill howard and maria.

howard and maria’s death are directly caused by hydras control of the government. if the avengers signed the accords and something like the hydra infestation happened again, then they could be the ones sent in to neutralize these kind of “threats”. but threats to who? that’s the problem with the accords. bucky is an example, albeit an extreme example, of what the avengers could be made to do if they sign the accords. the winter soldier neutralized the threat of howard stark at the command of hydra, who had infiltrated the government. because hydra’s agenda included howard until it didn’t and that meant he had to die.

[vampibrainrot]

In my heart Yelena adopted the guinea pig and now she and Bob are co parenting it (she forced him to accept it with the argument that having a pet would be good for him)

[gloriousburden]

Wait I don’t know if anyone’s talked about this before, but in Jotun Loki fics, people always have the reader touch him while he’s in that form which sort of… never made sense to me.

Considering the fact that he’d be reverted to his Jotun form, wouldn’t anyone who touched him began to freeze? Hence why (perhaps one of the reasons) Loki in Thor 1 was so apprehensive about grabbing Odin’s hand, with the hand the Jotun grabbed him by and reverted him with in Jotunheim?

I… don’t think you’d be able to touch him. And he wouldn’t just be cold to the touch. Loki is ALREADY quite cold to the touch canonically (right bottom corner shown in the picture above), so in his Jotun form… he’d be freezing.

Anyone please correct me if I’m wrong, though. Was just wondering because I always had the sort of idea that if you touched Loki while he was reverted to his Jotun form, that it would be dangerous. Just like touching any other Jotun.

Which is one of the reasons he was probably afraid to grab Odin’s hand. Not only at the thought of himself being a “monster” and untouchable in that sense, but also literally being untouchable because it wasn’t necessarily safe and he was hyper conscious of it, even if he had already been reverted back.

I get people excuse things for the sake of Fanfic, but I actually don’t think I’ve seen people talk about this before. So I don’t know if it’s just them excusing it, or a fandom-wide misconception.

May reword this later. Probably sounds a bit stupid and might be straight up incorrect in some areas because I just woke up.

[merrysithmas]

least hot take ever but if marvel doesnt hire fassbender and mcavoy for their xmcu its almost guaranteed to fail like 95% of their other recent movies

[logicheartsoul]

if you like it, maybe you should put a pin on it

Based on this post where Bucky finds Sam's board that's filled with pictures of Bucky with strings pushed into it when he was trying to find him back in 2014-2016 and Bucky puts post it notes grading him if he was correct or not. People in the tags commented about this spinning off to a proposal and this was born.

This is my first finished fic in years so, I may be rusty. I hope y'all enjoy!

One day, Sam looks over at the board again— amongst all the chaos and dangling string and pinned up pictures and paper…

He tilts his head, squinting, before blinking his eyes.

There, on the map, is a new picture, stuck through with a blue pushpin.

Familiar brick, that doormat given by his nephews, the dark wood door.

Home.

100%, scribbled in black sharpie, across the surface of a bright yellow post it.

But what catches his eye—

“Will you marry me?”

Sam turns his head, footsteps creaking the wood underneath Bucky’s feet. He’s wearing a suit, not uncommon these days, but something different than the typical navy and grey suits he’s pilfered from Sam’s closet along with his ties.

No, there’s a svelte silhouette to his form, as if it’s important the fit is right. He’s in a three piece wearing a pin attached to the lapel.

And in his left hand is a small, velvet box.

The words on the post it note ring in his head as Bucky steps closer toward him.

“You found me,” he says, close enough his heat emanates from his body, seeping deep into Sam's own.

His eyes, those nowadays soft eyes, hold a glimmer of trepidation, but also hope.

“I sure did,” Sam replies, smile smug. “I’m good at what I do.”

Bucky’s other hand is warm when he reaches out, his thumb resting over Sam’s knuckles in a solid grip. There’s a slight tremor that seems to ease and settle when he brushes his thumb over Sam’s skin.

“Wouldn’t want anyone else to try and find me.”

“Well, you said I was 100% right on the last time I found you. No one can top that.”

A smile blooms across Bucky’s face, his eyes glowing.

“You’re right.”

Sam laughs, the joy bubbling through him, light and airy and warm.

“Can I get that in writing? Or better yet, on video?”

With a flick of Bucky's vibranium thumb, the box gently opens.

“Only if you say yes.”

Sam shakes his head, the line of his grin softer but no less strong, his eyes peering down at the ring gleaming in the lights of their home.

“You drive a hard bargain there.”

Bucky releases his hold, the absence creeping in, until he pulls the ring out of the cushion. Sam’s hand is still hovering in the air when the cool metal slides along his finger.

”What, do you want me to beg?”

The box snaps closed; Bucky’s hand slips into his pocket before drawing it out, resting his left hand on Sam’s waist. His other is holding Sam’s, thumb resting on top of the ring.

Their bodies draw closer, not quite a dance, but movements of a beat they’ve done so often, it’s like breathing.

Sam’s lips brush against Bucky’s, not quite a kiss.

“That could be a start.”

Their foreheads are pressed together, touching, gaze so focused all they can see in the reflection of their eyes is each other. Their hands warming the other’s waist.

“Say yes and I’ll do anything,” Bucky declares.

He tries one more time.

“Marry me?”

He strains to hear in the silence but his enhanced senses register Sam’s whisper like a yell.

“Yes.”

The taste of triumph, of victory, of finding peace and home, is on their lips, and steals their breath before they part for air.

They don’t move far away, foreheads still leaning against each other. Sam’s smile is a bit devious now, a cheeky twinkle in his eye.

“Gonna hold you to that, husband,” he says, and Bucky just laughs.

“Whatever you want, sweetheart. Whatever you want.”

_

If you like my writing, feel free to check out my writing tag!

[cinemabuffoon]

◇

[lobeliamaximoff]

Propaganda I'm not falling for:

Bob is a malewife

Wanda knew what she was doing in Westview

Wanda would hate Bob

Bucky doesn't care about Thunderbolts/New Avengers and would easily drop them for Sam's team

Wanda is a monster and doesn't deserve any redemption

Bob and Yelena are the new Bruce and Natasha

Bob needs Yelena as his babysitter in Doomsday

Boblena in general

ScarletVision

[4thelovabob]

Look, we're not babying Bob here. But there were deliberate choices made with the costuming, framing etc. of his character that show he remains, obviously, deeply affected by childhood trauma. He's dressed in oversized clothing (the same as his child self) in his attic fidgeting with a Rubik's cube. A toaster sits behind him (the Brave Little Toaster, anyone? Maybe it was his favorite childhood movie).

Just saying it's not infantilizing or regressive to show him surrounded and clothed in these childhood relics. It doesn't mean he's not mature or isn't living an adult life - just shows how the pain and vulnerability of his past lingers.

[jeonstellate]

i know the ‘pushing the concrete chunk together’ scene is supposed to showcase their teamwork, but the entire time i was just thinking: steve could probably do that by himself.

since it took three people with super soldier serum (plus yelena and ava) to push the concrete chunk, it got me thinking: who has the “best” version of the super soldier serum, in terms of enhanced strength, after steve?

personally, iirc, i concluded right there and then that the order had to be: bucky first (hydra), alexei (soviet), then walker. i couldn’t gauge the weight for that concrete, but that just made the most sense to me. idk.

[samwisethewitch]

What Non-Pagans Need to Know About Fiction Featuring Pagan Gods

In light of Marvel's Loki show dropping a second season and a new Percy Jackson series on the horizon, I want to say some things about how fandom spaces can be respectful of real-life pagan religion.

Let's get one thing out of the way: literally no one is saying you can't enjoy fiction that uses pagan gods and heroes as characters. No one is saying, "Stop writing stories about our gods." In fact, many ancient cultures wrote fiction about their gods -- look at Greek theater or the Norse Eddas. The act of writing fiction about the gods is not offensive in itself.

But please remember that this is someone's religion.

The gods are not "just archetypes." Their myths are not "just stories." Their personalities are not a matter of artistic interpretation. For many pagans, the gods are very much real in a literal sense. I don't think Thor is a metaphor or a symbol -- for me, Thor is a real, autonomous spiritual being who exists outside of human perceptions of him, and who I have chosen to build a relationship with. Even if you are a hardcore atheist, I would hope you could at least be respectful of the fact that, to many modern pagans, the gods are both very real and very important.

When authors are not respectful of this fact, they reduce the gods, these very real objects of worship, to fictional characters. And here's the thing about fictional characters: they are fundamentally tools for authors to use to draw a desired emotional response from an audience.

Dracula's personality and behavior is wildly different depending on who is writing him, because different authors use Dracula to create different reactions in their audiences. In the 1931 film starring Bela Lugosi, he's equal parts alluring and disturbing, a symbol of America's mixed desire and disdain for foreigners. In Nosferatu, he's more strictly frightening and disgusting. In Francis Ford Coppola's movie, he's a tragic, romantic figure clinging to the last scraps of his humanity. In Netflix's Castlevania, he's an incredibly powerful being who has grown bitter and apathetic in his immortality. All of this is Dracula, and all of it is fine, because Dracula is not and never has been a central figure in anyone's religion.

Let's take a look at what happens when authors give this same treatment to real gods:

In Hellenic polytheism, Apollo is one of the most beloved gods, both historically and today. Apollo loves humanity, and humanity loves him back. He is the god of sunlight and of medicine, but also of poetry and song. He is one of humanity's most consistent defenders when one of the other gods gets wrathful. And while he does have dangerous or wrathful aspects of his own (he's also the god of disease, after all), he's also kind and soft with humanity in a way other gods often aren't, at least in some historic sources.

In the Lore Olympus comic series, Apollo is a villain. He's characterized as an abuser, a manipulator, and a violent man child. LO!Apollo is downright hateful, because the author wants us to hate him. Lore Olympus is a retelling of a myth about an abduction and forced marriage. Lore Olympus is also a romance. In order to get the audience to sympathize with Hades and root for his relationship with Persephone, Rachel Smythe needed to make someone else the villain. Apollo is the most obvious and extreme character assassination in Smythe's work, but several other gods (notably Demeter) also get the asshole makeover to tell the story Smythe wants to tell.

Here's where this becomes a problem: Hellenic polytheism is a fairly small religious community, while Lore Olympus is a massively popular webtoon with 1.3 billion views as of August 2023, print books available from major retailers, a TV adaptation in the works, and a very active online fandom. Rachel Smythe currently has a MUCH bigger platform than any Hellenic polytheism practitioner. Smythe and other authors are shaping how modern culture views the Hellenic gods, and that has a very real impact on their worshipers.

This means "Apollo is an abusive asshole" is becoming a popular take online, and is even creeping into pagan communities. I've personally seen people be harassed for worshiping Apollo because of it. I've seen new pagans and pagan-curious folks who totally misunderstand the roles Apollo, Hades, and Persephone play in the Hellenic pantheon because of Lore Olympus and other modern works of fiction.

There are tons of other examples of this in modern pop culture, but I'll just rattle off a few of the ones that annoy me most: Rick Riordan depicting Ares/Mars as a brutish asshole hyped up on toxic masculinity; Rick Riordan depicting Athena as a mother goddess; Marvel depicting Thor as a dumb jock; Marvel depicting Odin as a cold, uncaring father; DC depicting Ares as purely evil; whatever the fuck the Vikings TV show was trying to do with seidr; the list goes on.

All of these are examples of religious appropriation. Religious appropriation is when sacred symbols are taken out of their original religious context by outsiders, so that the original meaning is lost or changed. It requires a power imbalance -- the person taking the symbols is usually part of a dominant religious culture. In many cases, the person doing the appropriation has a much bigger platform than anyone who has the knowledge to correct them.

When Rick Rioridan or Rachel Smythe totally mischaracterizes a Greek god to tell a story, and then actual Hellenic pagans get harassed for worshiping that god, that's religious appropriation.

Religious appropriation is a real issue. This isn't just pagans being sensitive. To use an extreme example: Richard Wagner and other German Romantic authors in the 19th century used the Norse gods and other Germanic deities as symbols in their work, which was a major influence on Nazi philosophy. Without Wagner, the Nazis would not have latched onto the Norse gods as symbols of their white supremacist agenda. To this day, there are white supremacist groups who claim to worship our gods or who use our religious imagery in their hate movement. We are still reckoning with the misinterpretation of our gods popularized by Wagner and other German Romantics almost 200 years ago.

Again, no one is saying you can't enjoy fiction based on pagan mythology. But there are a few things you can do to help prevent religious appropriation in fandom spaces:

Above all else, be mindful that while this may just be a story to you, it is someone's religion.

Recognize that enjoying fiction based on our gods does not mean you know our gods. You know fictional characters with the same names as our gods, who may or may not be accurate to real-life worship.

Do not argue with or try to correct pagans when we talk about our experience of our gods.

Don't invalidate or belittle pagan worship. Again, this mostly comes down to recognizing that our religion is totally separate from your fandom. We aren't LARPing or playing pretend. Our sacred traditions are real and valid.

If you see other people in your fandom engaging in religious appropriation, point out what they are doing and why it isn't okay.

Please tag your fandom content appropriately on social media. Always tag the show, movie, book, etc. that a post is about in addition to other relevant tags. This allows pagans to block these fandom tags if we don't want to see them and prevents fandom content showing up in religious tags.

For example, if I'm posting about Athena from the Percy Jackson books, I would tag the post #athena #athenapjo #percyjackson #pjo. You get the idea.

And if fiction sparks your interest and you want to learn more about the actual worship of the gods, you can always ask! Most pagans love talking about our gods and trading book recs.

If you are writing fiction based on real mythology, talk to people who worship those gods. Ask them what a respectful portrayal would look like. If possible, include a note in your finished work reminding audiences that it is a work of fiction and not meant to accurately portray these gods.

[arachniasbride]

Kathryn Hahn as Agatha Harkness | Agatha All Along (S01E01)