#the first one is from a scene of tbgo

[keitorinrose]

I keep forgetting to post here 💀

[hammysamhah]

hello peoples i’m about to sound real crazy right now but hear me out cus i’ve been thinking this for awhile now while binge watching TBGO and Trollstopia and i need to know your thoughts!! and buckle up folks cus this is gonna be a LONG post

so okay basically, i think that in the shows Guy Diamond has some sort of generational trauma/ daddy issues/ faced parental neglect or however else it can be phrased.

this theory is only show specific and i don’t know if i sound crazy for thinking this AND i know i’ve made a post similarly about this except with Dareth from Ninjago but i actually have some real evidence this time to back up this theory/headcanon

look, this theory started off as kind of a joke at first after watching TBGO episode: “Trolly Tales 3” where Guy is seen telling a bunch of children a story based off of the nursery rhyme about jumping over a candlestick.

the story is seen with Guy as the main character, wanting to pursue a life of entertainment involving jumping over candlesticks. Sky Toronto, whom is Guy’s dad in this story, doesn’t agree with this lifestyle and insists he starts thinking more seriously and be part of the company. Guy rebels and pursues his dream anyway, but in the end it fails after the candlestick drops Guy and becomes a solo act. Guy, now at his lowest, goes back to his dad’s and tells him he’s ready to be serious. Sky responds to the statement that he has seen Guy’s shows and that he doesn’t want Guy calling him dad anymore, but to instead call him his #1 fan. it was a small but sweet twist there at the end where the dad accepts the son in the end.

now i didn’t really give much thought to the story until i saw the way Guy reacted when the kids didn’t like it. now i’ll make it very aware that i very much know Guy is just super dramatic (they even acknowledged that in the scene i’m mentioning rn), BUT as someone who loves to overanalyze cartoon characters and expressions, he kind of looked genuinely hurt. he was also fairly offended when poppy said his story was too dramatic.

mentioning again that i know Guy is just a drama queen but i like to overanalyze stuff like this

now after i noticed these details, i jokingly remarked that it seemed like Guy took the dislike of his story personally, as if that was a semi-true story. like as if something like that did happen to Guy when he was younger and he twisted the story to fit the nursery rhyme. i don’t think that Sky Toronto is his actual dad, there’s too much proof that shows they don’t have any personal connection like that. but i do think that whoever his dad really was did push him the same way Sky did in the story. and that maybe Guy twisted the ending to be happy when in reality it probably didn’t have his dad accepting him and loving him for who he was.

now everything i have been talking about is all just speculation. there’s no real proof that this story isn’t anything more than just a story. BUT!!! by overanalyzing it is what made me realize that Guy being neglected in some way by his dad (or mom if he has one) would make some sense considering his personality.

Guy is very reliant on being the center of attention, he doesn’t like the idea of anyone being better than him and just has some confidence issues in general (at least in TBGO). there are many episodes centering around this. this is even stated in Guy Damond’s wiki.

now, attention seeking is a very common occurrence in people that were neglected as a child. his attention seeking and huge ego are both things that show signs of trauma or neglect as seen below

this is just a slice of what i have in store though because i think that this ties into the way he parents Tiny Diamond in Trollstopia.

Guy and Tiny have a few episodes centered around their relationship, they’re all pretty heartwarming and a little sad (while also being funny because the show’s a comedy). these episodes have a pretty similar moral which is “i’ll love you no matter what” and i feel like there’s a reason they all pretty much have this moral and it’s to show how Guy is growing as a character and parent.

let me just summarize these episodes i am thinking of realll quick for ya

Extra Tootering (s1 ep 12a): Tiny wants to learn how to glitter fart like his dad to impress his friends, Guy tries to teach him how but it doesn’t work. time comes where Tiny is meant to show his friends his trick and ended up faking it so no one could know he couldn’t do it. feeling guilty for his lie, he runs away and Guy finds him and tells him that whether he can glitter or not he and his friends will still love him the way he is.

Dad-urday (s2 ep 1b): Tiny thinks of his dad as his hero and Guy doesn’t wanna do ANYTHING that could ever break that image, so Guy participates in Dad-urday events that he hates just to make Tiny happy, only in the end to find out that Tiny will always view Guy as his hero even if he can’t do all the typical dad things that others can do.

Funder Construction (s7 ep 5a): Guy tells Tiny about how their family has a legacy of building extraordinaryly cool blanket forts and unintentionally pressured Tiny into feeling that he needs to make his own super impressive fort or else he won’t be considered a Diamond, Guy immediately comforted and reassured Tiny that no matter what he accomplishes in life he’ll always be a Diamond because he’s his son and that he’ll love him no matter what.

now let me break down these episodes a bit more to show you how i think it could prove Guy has parental trauma and how it plays into how he parents now.

for Extra Tootering, there’s this specific scene that spoke to me. when Tiny tells his dad that he wants to learn how to glitter like him, Guy tells him that he was also a late tooter and that Tiny should be patient, as it comes with time. but then Tiny starts saying that he’ll just hide his true self away until then. when Guy heard his son say those things, he was tearing up and even freaked out a little literally shouting a dramatic “NOOOOOOOOOOO!” and he immediately decided that he was going to help his son learn to glitter fart despite his earlier statement that Tiny should be patient.

now i know the topic being about farting glitter makes this feel so unserious but that isn’t gonna stop me from overanalyzing it LOL

the main thing i noticed was how upset that Guy was when Tiny started talking about hiding himself from the world. Tiny was wanting to hide himself because he couldn’t glitter like Guy could. Guy didn’t wanna be the cause of his son hiding himself!! any parent would be upset in this situation. but if i consider my past point of that story Guy told back in TBGO, where the dad didn’t want his son to be himself, being a real thing that Guy could’ve gone through, Tiny wanting to hide himself could very much upset Guy!! not just for the basic reasons of wanting your child to be happy but also because he doesn’t want Tiny to go through what he went through.

later on when Guy finally finds his runaway son, this interaction plays out:

(direct quotes from the ep)

Guy: “don’t you see? i love you just the way you are! we all do!”

Tiny: “but you’re my daddy, daddy! you have to say that.”

Guy: “…you’re right, Tiny. i guess because i’m your father, in a way, i do have to say it.”

and the way Guy said that last sentence just felt interesting to me. the pause before he said it, and using the words “i guess” made it feel like he never really got that treatment from his own father ? ofc i could just be grasping at straws there a lil bit but it’s what i’m thinking.

now by the end of the episode Tiny has learned how to glitter and used it to save himself, his dad, and friends from falling to death lol— but what Guy says to Tiny afterwards was very sweet.

(direct quote from ep)

Guy: “TINYYYYY! HAHA! you did it! YOOOOU did it!!! for the record, i’d still love you if you couldn’t, but i’m glad to not be dead.”

i just like how Guy specified that he still would’ve loved Tiny either way. this doesn’t directly lead any points to my theory other than maybe Guy feels the need to make sure Tiny absolutely knows that he’ll love him no matter what. but any parent should feel that way about their child. i just really thought the moment was sweet and worth a mention.

now onto the next episode, Dad-urday, and let me tell you this episode probably spoke to me the MOST when it came to defending my theory.

for the entire episode Guy was stressing over disappointing his son. Tiny thinks of Guy as his hero, and Guy doesn’t want to do anything that could ever shatter that thought and make Tiny think less of him. so he and Tiny participate in a thing called Dad-urday, where all the dads in Trollstopia do a bunch of stereotypical dad things (like grill, play catch, fish, stuff like that). but Guy isn’t good at those things, so he goes to his friends for help and this interaction pursues.

(direct quotes from ep)

Synth: “Tiny’s gonna love dad-urday! he thinks the world of you and what-not!”

Guy: “exactly! Tiny thinks i can do anything! but tomorrow he’ll realize i can’t, and i just don’t want my little boy to lose his hero…”

Guy is seen here putting so much pressure on himself for no reason! he should know that Tiny would love him despite his lack of ‘dad’ skills, but he’s convinced himself that if he isn’t perfect and amazing at everything then his son will think less of him. this is totally rooted in Guy’s confidence issues and probable parental neglect i think.

so Guy forces himself to do typical Dad-urday things (with the help of his friends) to make sure not to disappoint his son. but things go wrong when Guy has to participate in a boating event to which he gets into a dangerous position. at this point Guy’s friends finally told Tiny the truth and Tiny immediately just wants his dad to get out of the danger he’s in leading to this interaction

(direct quotes from the ep)

Tiny: “daddy! your daddy friends already told me everything! you gotta get out of there!”

Guy: “b-but— this isn’t how i wanted this to go, Tiny! you’re my little boy! and i want you to keep on believing i can do anything! so you don’t lose your hero!”

the way that Guy sounded so panicked and upset in this scene really hurt. to me it feels like Guy is desperate to not end up being a bad dad, he wants to be someone his son can look up to and to be the first person he goes to if there’s a problem. i really think this shows that Guy never had a good role model himself, as he doesn’t understand that he doesn’t need to do all the things he’s making himself do in order to achieve this goal.

this mindset even had Guy forget that Tiny already knew he’s not perfect, as Tiny pointed out he already knew he’s not capable of everything and specified about when Guy tried to build his bike and failed, which made Guy finally remember. Tiny then proceeded to list a bunch of other things about his dad that aren’t the most charming, like his bald spot, or his fake calves lmao

anyways the next bit of dialogue here seems pretty meaningful

(direct quotes)

Tiny: “there’s only one reason you’re my hero, daddy…. *BECAUSE* you’re my daddy!”

Guy (tearfully): “…really?”

the fact Guy was crying in this scene just showed how touched he felt that he didn’t actually have to be perfect to be a good dad. and that he already was one. the mere fact that being his dad made Tiny think of him as his hero definitely made him realize he was doing a good job. he needed to hear that after all the pressure he put on himself earlier.

now onto Funder Construction, which is a pretty big one too cus they actually talk about their family in this episode!

this could potentially put a little dent into my theory since Guy is the one who talks about them and he didn’t seem like someone who didn’t like his family. but i might just put it as he didn’t wanna have his child worry about it. i mean Guy is an actor in the show, it wouldn’t be too crazy for him to ignore his feelings for a minute and talk a little kindly about their family’s legacy to inspire Tiny, because Guy did play a fair part in it after all.

now to put it simply this episode hurt my heart so bad 😭 Guy’s parenting in this episode is so good it hurt. Tiny found an interest in making blanket forts, so Guy tells Tiny about how making blanket forts runs in the family and that they’ve all made huge creations out of them. and now Tiny wants to do the same.

Guy supports Tiny throughout the entire thing until Tiny starts rushing it and the fort becomes unstable. by then Guy is begging Tiny to stop but Tiny is consistent on getting it done. then the tower starts wobbling over with them on it and they fall off the side! luckily they were able to hold onto some loose blankets but they still were in a very unsafe position. and even then, still Tiny is consistent about finishing this fort and thus, this interaction pursues:

(direct quotes)

Tiny: “i have to build something the world has never seen before!”

Guy: “BUT WHY?!”

Tiny: “because if i don’t…i’m not a Diamond.”

Guy: “…not a Diamond..?”

and dude. Guy’s face after Tiny said that. that brief moment of just an emotion change felt like Guy was realizing that he unintentionally pressured Tiny into thinking that if he didn’t build this fort he wouldn’t be considered part of the family. this is the exact thing Guy wanted to prevent Tiny from feeling.

so now continuing the scene, tiny is crying at this point:

(direct quotes)

Tiny: “it’s like you said, ‘every Diamond built structures that would stand until the end of time.’ so, if i don’t do that… how can i be one of them?”

Guy: “…Tiny Diamond. young man, you listen to me, and you listen good, because i have something that you need to hear. first of all, the things the Diamonds of the past did took them their entire lifetimes. if they caught one glimpse of what you’ve accomplished as a child..? it would blow the hair right off their heads!”

Tiny: [smiles and sniffs]

Guy: “and second of all, and way way more importantly, none of that matters! i don’t care if you build a thousand skyscrapers, or if you never touch another blanket again, you are always a Diamond. because you.. are my son.”

this scene is so important not just for Tiny but for Guy too. Tiny is learning once again that his dad will truly love him no matter what. and unlike last time with the glitter fart, (which Tiny was able to achieve in the end), in this episode, Tiny’s plan doesn’t work, but now he’s okay with it. because his dad made him feel less pressured and more loved. Guy Diamond truly said some powerful things to his son. this will most likely be a memory that Tiny will remember forever and that’s such a good thing.

coming back to the theory though, Guy had accidentally made his son feel how his family probably made him feel in the past. maybe not about specifically the blanket tower stuff but possibly something similar or just anything in general. pressure to live up to family values can be traumatic if your family makes you feel outcasted for not living up to it the way they want. and considering i think Guy either got disowned or ran away himself, (solely based on the story he told those children in TBGO), it obviously didn’t end very well.

the fact he made Tiny feel that pressure was probably heart breaking to Guy. and he made sure to immediately make sure Tiny knew he had no reason to feel like that. he became so serious so fast to make SURE tiny didn’t feel out of place in their family.

and that just shows Guy’s development not just from the trauma im theorizing but just in general in the show. Guy was never really the most serious character in this show. i mean, he’s a naked sparkly troll who’s main character trait half the time is farting glitter or being super dramatic in comedic ways. but seeing how serious Guy gets when it’s about his son just goes to show how seriously he cares about him. and that’s how you break generational trauma yall, Guy Diamond mastered it.

so um yeah this is pretty much all i have to say about this theory. i just wanted to show how i thought that Guy didn’t have a good childhood but made sure his son had a great one. really sweet stuff for this mostly unserious show. i know this is probably super dumb but i don’t care i just love dumb things. and if you actually read all of this thanks and here’s a cookie 🍪

[thanostherappersupremacy]

Trolls why Barb is worse than Creek

( I made a little youtube video of their scenes to help talk about my point and decided to also share it on here lol so here I go )

In the Trolls fandom Creek is very widely hated while Barb is very widely loved and Creek is normally judged very harshly for his actions while Barb is often seen as a Redeemed bad guy who deserved the second chance that she got

while Creek is usally seen as a scumbag who deserved the death that he got at the end of the first movie ( yes he did return in TBGO but the series is seperate canon to the movies )

and who didn't deserve a second chance in the end of the film after betraying his people but tbh I think this reaction from the fandom is very unfair

which is why I made this video basically contrasting most of their major scenes in their movies to show why Barb is actually worse.

like for starters lets talk about their very first scenes in their movies where Creek's first scene is him showing up and making a few sarcastic remarks at Branch in retaliation for him being a jerk to his friends

so sure it isn't great behavour by any means but it is understandable and tbh the fandom does seem to act like Creek and the snack pack were bullying Branch in this instance

when in reality Branch just started being a jerk to them unprovoked and thus they verbally hit back a little so Creek and the others wern't really the bad guys in this scene.

Meanwhile Barb's very first scene is her leading an army to attack a Tribe and destroy their place and steal their sacred string so she can unite all the Tribes under one Rule

and her reason for doing this is literally nothing like there's literally no justification so you can't really use the "" she had good intentions "" argument

because she honestly didn't, the Tribes were all perfectly fine living seperately to each other so her taking such extreme action isn't noble or morrally complex at all

its just very selfish and evil since she destroyed cities imprisoned countless people and was going to destroy all other cultures and Brainwash countless people for the rest of their lives with no real good justification

( and the whole Brainwashing someone forcibly changing their personality and removing their free will for the rest of their lives is kinda Horrifying tbh and arguably equally as bad as simply killing someone )

compare this to Gristle Jr in the first movie who did order the Genocide of the Pop Trolls but he did have the somewhat understandable reason of wanting to lift himself and his people out of a 20 year long depression

and compared to Creek who only betrayed his people due to being imprisoned tortured and threatened with imediate death therefore he had a much better reason for doing bad and the difference between him and Barb is night and day imo.

again look at their scenes throughout the movies most of Creek's scenes are of him being a helpless Hostage put in situations out of his control

and even when he does betray his people and admitedly acts very jerky and unremorsful towards Poppy and the Village

he is still technically a Hostage only doing evil because of a lack of options which he literally says so himself during the betrayal scene,

meanwhile most of Barb's scenes are of her being Cocky unremorsful and just rather blatantly evil with only a couple of exceptions such as the scene with her dad and her scene relating to Poppy near the end but the issue with these scenes is that neither of them actually relate to why she committed her crimes and they deffinitly don't excuse them.

and I think it is espescially unfair how Creek seems to be judged as deserving of his death mostly for his unremorsful attitude in committing a crime he was forced to under the threat of death

but Barb is mostly loved by people and viewed as a Redeemable character despite her acting equally as unremorsful over her many crimes throughout the movie

and even at the very end when Poppy only destroyed the strings to stop her from enslaving their entire speices Barb turned around and tried to blame her for it

acting as tho it was her fault and showing no regret or acknowledgment of her own actions yet Barb is still given a second chance in the end despite this.

so tbh she's a pretty evil selfish character who caused untold damage and hurt and tried to enslave her entire species for no real good reason

meanwhile Creek committed 1 bad action of betraying his people but he only did it because he was forced into an impossibly unfair situation

where his only choices were to either betray his people or die horrifically so he deffo isn't as bad as Barb imo and isn't deserving of being hated

while she's so universally loved in the fandom and viewed as a flawed but good person while Creek is normally viewed as the scum of the earth by the fandom

as Barb is pretty much a worse person in every single category tbh.

[bobbydagen24]

This is like my Hundredth Reblog of this post lol but I keep coming back to it because I keep having new thoughts 😂😂😂😂.

Namely I find the reasons for them changing the original character in his place to be both nonsensical from a writing perspective and also kinda iffy from another point of view

first off changing the character because they didn't want the audience to have any potential attachment to the character who would turn traitor later in the movie is honestly kinda contradictory

as the whole point of this type of twist villain is to both emotionally shock the characters in the film and to shock the audience I mean just listen to the soundtrack of the betrayal scene ( its really good lol )

its clearly framing this as a big emotional gut punch which it certainly is for Poppy but the writers admitting that they didn't want the audience to possibly feel any of that emotion just feels weird to me

as why wouldn't you want your twist villain to have a big impact like that? hell it'd even sorta make a potential good message to young children that even nice seeming people

can still possibly hurt you and sometimes be bad people deep down ( tho I'm arguing this from the point of view that the characters main motives would still need to be changed to make them more evil )

idk I just feel as tho trying to cripple any possible emotional reaction audience members may have to your story is a little counter productive.

and as for the part which I find a little iffy about the change well if it is true that they changed the original character both for the reasons that they didn't want the traitor to be likable

but also because they didn't want the audience to potentially have any sympathy for them well then I find it troublesome

that they chose to change the characters personality rather than ya know change the characters motives and actions in the film

as I feel that kinda says something about what people's priorities are when it comes to how they judge fictional characters if a film maker sees a villain who the audience may potentially feel sympathy for

so their solution is to give them a more unlikable personality rather than change some of the stuff that they go through in the film and change their motives.

and clearly the film writers were unfortunately correct in this way of thinking given that Creek is by far the most hated villain in the franchise

Despite the more extreme and far less understandable actions of other villains who are generally liked such as Barb or Crimp or Veneer

I choose those ones due to them being redeemed characters who are shown sympathy by audiences despite none of them technically having valid understandable reasons for doing evil things.

meaning it is just down to their personalities and nothing more which is why they are liked and seen as better people more deserving of sympathy and second chances than creek is

due to his surface level unlikable persona, another example being the fandom being fairly quiet about Barb being let off the hook for her crimes at the end of world tour

yet a few years before when creek came back in TBGO the fandom was up in arms over him being given a second chance despite his more sympathetic reasons for doing what he did.

so yeah all I'm saying is that same as in real life a characters personality should have no real bearing on Wether or not you extend sympathy to them

if they have terrible crimes committed against them as otherwise it kinda is just victim blaming but in a kid friendly way tbh.

so even if the original old woman character had been kept as the traitor and been a likable but still irredeemable antagonist then the movie still would have needed to change her motives

so that she wouldn't have had the same problem as creek of overall being a victim with not much choice but to do evil.

but even so trying to intentionally insure that your audience will care less about a major plot point was just a poor way to go about things imo.

as ideally the traitor character would be both someone who was likable to the audience who they could maybe grow an attachment to before the twist

and would be someone who the audience could truly judge as evil if their motives and experiences in the movie had been changed.

and wow that was a long talk lol I guess Creek and the wonky ways in which he was written are just a very thought provoking topic for me haha 😂😂😂😂.

After much work i have finally written down my analysis on the fictional character Creek from hit children's movie Trolls 2016, open Read More on your own discretion because this shit is about to get long

Alright let's start with a small summary for the folks that have never watched a Trolls movie and don't really know anything about Creek outside of the plethora of art i've made about him

Creek is one of the movie's side characters and secondary villain, he is Poppy's (the main character) friend and acts as a short-of twist villain (i'll explain that 'short-of' later,). Although shown to be a stereotypical nature-loving hippie he later betrays his friends and everyone he's ever known as he sells out the location of their village to Bergens, a race who 20 years ago used to keep the pop trolls in a large cage and would eat them once a year during a holiday called Trollstice.

He is first introduced when Branch (the movie's second protagonist) is confronting Poppy about her decision to throw a party, arguing that this could attract the attention of the Bergens, this is also where my first point about Creek's character begins First thing to notice is that, unlike what some people would like you to believe, Creek is NOT the only troll in Poppy's friend group (the Snack Pack) to be dismissive towards Branch, if anything Poppy herself is the only one in the group that seems to want to give him a chance ("i think everyone deserves to be happy"). Creek also shows up late to the conversation, only appearing once Branch escalates the situation by throwing Poppy's party invitation to the floor and stomping on it. You could easily argue that, in Creek's perspective, he is only doing what a good friend should do and protecting his friend from someone who is being cruel towards them, and although Branch has a GOOD reason to be upset and we later find out more about his backstory, there is no reason for us to believe that Creek or even the rest of the Snack Pack know anything about his situation, to THEM Branch is nothing but a party pooper who actively chooses to stay miserable ("some folks just don't want to be happy")

One point that i sometimes see that i would like to snip in the bud as soon as possible is that Creek doesn't truly care about his friends, especially Poppy, and is only using her to get something out of her (what exactly ? well we don't know, we could especulate that since she is the princess, he may want to use her for her status, possibly wanting to become royalty himself, but we're not here for that), the reason i bring this up now is because of the scene that follows the interaction with Branch, where Creek is the first one to notice that Poppy is still upset about the results of the conversation, not only that but he doesn't seem too happy about it himself

It would have been extremelly easy to animate him smiling or looking smug after Branch storms off, but that doesn't happen, he even glances down at the ground before looking towards Poppy, which is when he attempts to cheer her up. This small scene ALONE already leads me to believe that he truly does care, and although his attempts at cheering her up aren't exactly the best nor the most productive ("tune out his negative vibrations Poppy, they're toxic") he is still trying.

However we do not get enough time to find out more about his relationship with Poppy outside of this very moment as the next scene in the movie is the party and their imminent capture by the Chef Bergen, this is where i'd like to remind you that i called him only a "short-of" twist villain. For a twist villain to truly work we first need to understand why this character is considered to be a "good guy", and their relationship with the protagonist, so that the incoming reveal of them being the antagonist has a impact, not only on the other characters, but the audience themselves. The thing about Creek is that we don't GET that insight into his relationship with Poppy, they interact TWICE before the reveal, and one of those interactions is Poppy attempting to save him from being carried away by a Bergen, therefore the "twist" itself falls flat... but what if i told you that was done on purpose by Dreamworks ?

Before the existence of Creek there was another character who was meant to take his place in the storyline, and her name was Miss Guffin

According to concept art, Miss Guffin was originally going to be Poppy's mentor, and be captured by the Chef Bergen, and much like Creek she would sell out the other trolls as an attempt to save herself. Now that would have had a much bigger impact, not only on the audience as they realise that the respectful elderly character was a selfish coward at heart, but for Poppy as she would have had a much closer relationship with Guffin as her mentor. So why was she changed ? It's simple really, she was just too likeable.

Creek, by design, was created to be unlikeable, not only so that his reveal wouldn't upset the audience, but so that you wouldn't feel pity about his eventual demise. THIS is what i mean when i refer to him as a character "doomed by the narrative", he only exists because a much more appealing character had to be turned down for the sole reason of not upsetting those who watch the movie, he would never have been allowed to have a closer relationship with Poppy, because that would have given the viewer a emotional attachment to him, and we can't have that. Creek is a tragic character in the sense that he was destined to be the traitor, not only a traitor but a unredeemable one, and i understand why that is, there was never going to be enough time in the movie to give him a satisfying redemption, and it would have thrown off the entire flow of the story, killing him off was a much easier choice than trying to squeeze an awkward redemption at the very end, but that doesn't stop me from wishing that there WAS more. His fate feels unfair to me, as his only crime is being kind of a dickhead, and it's hard to blame him for his decision to sell out Pop Village when his only other option wasn't much better, so let's talk about that next.

In the next scene where we see Creek, him and the rest of the Snack Pack have been put in a cage by the Chef, this is where i'd like to point out that his first reaction to this predicament is to try and get everyone else to stay calm ("Woah, woah ! Everyone, we must all remain calm") This scene leads directly to the one where he gets nearly eaten by King Gristle, and when i say nearly i mean it, he is shoved INTO his mouth and assumed dead by everyone except for Poppy, who is only holding out hope that he is still alive. Of course we later find out that he is indeed, not dead, but that is only because he clung to Gristle's uvula causing him to choke and spit him out. The way we find out that he is alive is through Gristle himself, who reveals to Bridget that he has him locked inside his cape's clasp

Notice how little space he has in there, i'd say barely any to move let alone breathe, as he lets out a desperate gasp just as the clasp is opened. We do not know how much time has passed since he escaped being nearly eaten alive, but we can estimate it has to have been at least a few hours, as quite a few events happen between the formerly mentioned scene and this one. We do NOT get to see what happens between him, Gristle and the Chef during that time, which means we can only ESPECULATE why he was put in there in the first place, so allow me to do just that:

- Firstly, we do not know if Creek agreed right away to the Chef's request to reveal the location of the village, for all we know he might have declined to do so, and putting him into a small claustrophobic space was a way to give him that final push. - However this could have also been a way to stop him from escaping and telling the other trolls of the Bergen's plan, but i fail to see why they would have had to resort to such a, let's be honest here, barbaric method of keeping him put, when a normal cage would have done the job just as well, perhaps the Chef wanted to make sure he wouldn't change his mind. - Thirdly, this could have been a way to have someone keep an eye on him as the Chef busied herself with other things, essentially making Gristle the guard to Creek's prison No matter what option you decide makes the most sense, one thing is clear: Creek was tortured

At last we finally reach the moment he reveals to Poppy, Branch and the rest of the Snack Pack that he plans on betraying all of them and selling out the location of the village, this is the scene that is supposed to make you despise him, for being so cowardly and selfish that he'd rather let everyone he's ever known die horribly than.... give up his own life ? Hold up did i read that right, oh... hm Creek is a character who finds himself in a situation out of his control and is forced to make a decision between two truly awful options, he can either let himself be eaten or everyone else goes, there is NOT a correct answer here, and in the end his sense of self preservation wins. A decision probably influenced by the fact that before this moment, he had spent hours trapped in a small space with barely enough oxygen. There was NEVER going to be another way, as the Chef states herself:

Especially bringing attention to how he acts in this scene, to me it comes across less like he's finally showing his true colors as a manipulative person, and more like he's desperately trying to justify his actions not only to Poppy but to himself ("At least you get to die with a clear conscience")

And it seems like he's successful in doing so, for him at least, what other options does he have ? It's either give up your own life, or convince yourself that what you're about to do isn't truly that bad, he chooses to look at it with a positive outlook, ignoring the very obviously bleak reality he finds himself in ("So in a way... You could say... I'm doing this for you")

Another thing about this scene is that we don't really get to see his true feelings on the situation, as during this conversation the Chef Bergen is actively sharpening knifes in the background, even if he did want to come up with a escape plan or air out how he feels about this predicament they find themselves in, he would be unable to do so, as the person who could easily just snatch him up and kill him right then and there stands in the very same room. And that is a recurring thing when it comes to Creek, we don't get to SEE much of him, we don't see the events leading up to his betrayal, we don't really get to see his relationship with Poppy or even the rest of the Snack Pack for that matter, we don't SEE how he feels about being trapped inside Gristle's cape clasp or having to choose between himself or his friends, and honestly we probably never will. For a secondary villain he barely gets any screen time at all, and the screen time he does get is spent in near constant live-threatening danger.

And finally, his story comes to an end, the Bergens discover true happyness, Chef Bergen is defeated, and the last time we see Creek he's getting swallowed up by a mountain sized creature, the very thing he tried so hard to save himself from, to the point that he would give up everyone he's ever loved, happens regardless of his choice, was he even given a choice in the first place ? When both options led him to the same fate ? I would say it's almost tragically poetic if it didn't feel like salt to the wound.

Of course, Trolls: The Beat Goes On exists, but it's not even close to being a good continuation of his character let alone a satisfying redemption, his introduction is incredibly rushed, characters who have no reason to forgive him for his actions immediatelly welcome him back with open arms, and the one person who doesn't do so is shown to be in the wrong even though his reaction and suspicion make complete sense.

Besides, TBGO is it's own can of worms and opening it now would only make this post longer than it needs to be, so i'll spare you from that.

My final point is that Creek is a much more complex and interesting character than the story would like you to believe, and it CAN be quite frustating seeing people brush him off as just a selfish fraud who never truly cared about anyone but himself when there's really so much more under the surface. Of course i'm not saying that you should love him, hell you don't even need to like him, he has a lot of flaws and has made terrible decisions, but that's also exactly the reason why i am so keen on giving him a better ending. He shouldn't need to be perfect to deserve a nicer fate, to be given an actual choice for once, one that isn't going to blow up in his face in the end, the ability to be better and do better. You don't deserve to be tossed aside just because you have a big ego or some other personal flaw, you don't deserve to be considered unredeemable because you were put in a situation out of your control, making a bad decision shouldn't define your existence for the rest of your life.

I've come to accept that Creek is a very important character to me, he's a character who NEEDS to be selfish for the story to work the way it does, one who's the narrative is actively trying to make as unlikeable as possible at all times, but it's attempts had an opposite effect on me, and the more i dug only solidified him as my favorite in the entire franchise. I love him because of his unused potential, potential that'll most likely never get a true chance to shine due to Dreamworks not seeming to really care about him as a character, so i have taken upon myself to do what canon failed to. If i had to pick ONE THING for folks that read this post to get out of it, is that you should never be embarassed of your enjoyment for a fictional character, no matter how unlikeable or one-dimensional they seem to be, analyse every frame they show up in, write that fanfic, draw that art, create that self indulgent AU, find meaning where no one else did

[nellynee]

Trollstopia blindblogging: episode 3a- Bring it in

Putting end thought at the top from now on for ease but I’m really proud of this show. I expected the same message but they pulled it out way less mean spirited than I had anticipated. Which is the sort of thing we need towards this message of Cultural exploration these days.

Also this Episode is hilarious, the song is peppy and fun (if not outstanding) and its just a really good time. Legit 4/5. While you should watch the Pilot for lore reasons, trolls is the kind of series you can skip some episodes and still be comfortable. I’d give this one a genuine watch recommendation if you are making a short list.

I’m avoiding the descriptions on this, but between the music on the title card and the title itself, it’s hugs and classical trolls, calling it now.

Something I’m finding moderately immersion breaking is these sadly small crowds we are seeing for large events. I know animation costs money buy at least vague colored blobs in the background as a suggestion of massive crowds would be nice. It was really kind of sad in Kick Off Party. In this case I either have to assume that 1, the huge crowds of trolls we saw in the pilot arriving have trickled off to a sad few or 2. Poppy is doing a long series of smaller meetings to be more personal with the trolls, and she’s going to be doing these things on repeat all day. I’m gong to assume the second.

“Twelve seconds! Forget the orderly line, form a chaotic mob!” What I saw of TBGO made me love Smidge. She’s just absolutly the best. Such sass, such chaos, so freaking cute

The Country Troll’s watch is a pocket watch that’s so freaking cute!

oh my god they hugged with their front hooves

ok wait I just found an animation error. The female troll pre and post announcing hug time are different trolls. The first was a bob cut and white hat with yellow skin and blue hair. the second had a brown hat and pigtails with the ends tied up and much lighter toned hair and purple skin. I only noticed because I thought their hats switched when they threw them in the air (they did) but they totally just switched a model half way through a scene!

The Funk watches glow and they hug with their necks that amazing

Classical Trolls looking uncomfortable? called it

Ok but really thinking about this the hug watches and hourly hugs are canonically a Pop Troll invention to celebrate their liberation from the Bergens (don’t get me started on pop culture trauma responses and how unhealthy their happy culture is or I won’t stop) so I’m wondering if the group is small because these are all the Trolls who heard about Pop Hug Time is whole ham for it and now looking at how excited they are this is genuinely cute AF

Ok Poppy and Smidge hug walking is super cute too like. Smidge being Poppy’s BFF is one of those things from TBGO that I really appreciate.

OK they gasped so long they passed out I got gasp just listening to them actually laughed.

but oh yeah called it. Victorian values. no touchy

OMG THEY BOW

Ok. OK. real talk here. About my personal headcanons. And that is. NONE OF THE CUTAWAYS ARE REAL. none. across the whole franchise. this is a very good example. We know how Troll babies work. And yet the image presented for the Classical birth is very reminiscent of human hospital births. I very truly believe that the cutaways, which are never referenced by the Trolls themselves (like “I remember the time you did such and such”) are symbolic shorthand for the audience’s benefit only. This also applies to flashbacks as described by a character, as I believe that is the impression the character had of that time and not a reflection of reality (the most prominent example I give of this is Cooper telling the story of how he was lost. I firmly believe the visuals were symbolic in nature and not literal for that sequence)

“Meyeh I have a huguh?”

Excuse Dante a moment he just had an experience

oh wait nevermind

But oh my god he’s such an asshole he’s doing this to her on purpose

ok like this took me some thinking because I tend to mindlessly respond to what I watch and then have to percolate on it so this is a response I inserted in after taking a break for a night because bed time but... he really is doing it on purpose. This is exactly what I mean by Poppy is just “a tiny bit racist and that doesn’t mix well with her “I know best” attitude.” Because she just insulted the hell out of the Classical Trolls as a whole. “We bow to express these same feelings instead” “um ok but do you have anything else for like, when you actually want to express these feelings but like.... more?” “We Bow.” Like The Classical Trolls aren’t missing out on anything they are just curious about this custom most of the other Trolls engage with way to just insult Dante’s entire culture directly to his face Poppy she really deserves his response.

“LACKLUSTER!” Absolute face of delight as she screams

ok that was a perfectly cut scream

OK I love the giant lotus town in the sky

Just realizing though the last was rock, this is classical. Hard bet we get a techno, country, and fun epi before they start mixing it up. Hard bet because it’s a sure win

OK I’ve seen her around but haven’t caught the name. Minuet huh? the little shoulder waggle got me. 

“In what language would you like me to answer that? I speak seven...teen...thousand! Actually no I got carried away there it’s seventeen” MAN Trollstopia really hitting it out of the park with their OC’s. I kinda love her. I might actually care about Classical trolls a bit. Amazing.

On that note, what languages does she speak? We do hear Korean and Spanish in WT but only in song and not spoken form and everyone seams to speak the same language. Is she capable of singing other genres naturally, or does she know the languages of non troll species?

“Raise your right arm. Raise your right arm. Raise your right arm. Your right arm not your leg.” I don’t know who writes this shit its funny as hell and whoever the voice director is is putting in some fucking work this is so funny

Yup theory is these little shits are doing this on purpose to Troll Poppy and I will accept no different no matter how the episode ends and the Classical Trolls are funny now

Fuckin SLAM that piano down

no wait its a HARPSICORD

“PAINFUL? UNCOMFORTABLE? THIRD ADJECTIVE?!” 

of course it’s uncomfortable they are doing this on purpose! (I hope)

OK look this episode is legit hilarious 

another perfectly cut scream

Classical trolls are legit terrifying though

“PAINFUL? UNCOMFORTABLE? THIRD ADJECTIVE?!”

ok so I Kinda half called it. 

Noting for myself, that bowing for Classical Trolls fits my reproductive and cultural headcanon’s I made.

[6kate6kate9kate]

Going on the fact that a Trolling mentions a bacon-wrapped cupcake in a deleted scene from the first movie, plus a handful of times in TBGO where Trolls are shown with meat or fish (frosting dog, anyone?), I've never really thought of them as vegetarian. Their diet seems to consist mainly of sweet things, but they're definitely omnivorous. Hickory confirms this in the sequel, although we never actually see his grub get eaten or even cooked. The concept of lulling their prey to sleep is certainly an interesting one, though, and I can definitely see them showing a level of respect and giving thanks for the creatures they eat, when they do eat them. I'm mildly curious about what type of creature they get meat from...puffalo is a clear possibility, but maybe they have miniature pig-like creatures as well, in the case of bacon.

If there are any vegetarian Trolls, Creek would strike me as the most likely to be one, though it would probably stem more from a sense of superiority than any real moral obligation.

Eat and Be Eaten

So based on the information we got in Trolls World Tour, I have finally figured out a way to juxtapose two concepts that have always bothered me into one post.

First, that trolls eat meat. Second, how the trolls were able to forgive the bergens and be friends with them so easily after being literally eaten by them for an unknown period of time.

Because of the 70′s vibe they were going for in the first movie, I came away with the sense that the trolls were all vegetarians, since the vegetarian way of life first started becoming popular around then. I pictured the trolls living in perfect harmony with all the (non-singing) animals and plants around them. DJ Suki did swallow a bug and didn’t seem upset, but then, it had been an accident. And DJ just rolled with it and enjoyed the unexpectedly cool side-effects (strobe-lights flashing from her eyes and mouth).

Then in Trolls Holiday we saw Branch singing with one of the same type of bugs DJ had eaten and I’m like, “Okay, if they sing, shouldn’t DJ have been more upset at the idea that she had eaten a fellow creature that was at least semi-sentient?”

In TBGO we saw Smidge start to swallow a bug and then pull it out of her moth and offer it to Poppy.

Then in Trolls World Tour, we saw Hickory offering the others some “grub”, literally small bugs that they apparently “cook” over a fire, even though the one on the stick didn’t look uncomfortable.

Then it hit me that in each case, every bug about to be eaten was alive. Just as the trolls had been alive when the bergens in the first movie were about to eat them. So what if swallowing your prey whole is considered the most humane way to consume another animal? Yes, you could traumatize your prey by killing it first, and then cutting up the meat - you’d have to if the animal was anything bigger than bite-sized - but if you ate mostly tiny animals, you could spare the animal almost all suffering. A quick, fun slide down a slick, warm tube and then a plunge into a hot pool that kills in seconds. As if a human fell into a pool of lava. Almost no pain, since once the nerve endings are damaged/burned away, the bug wouldn’t be able to feel anything even if it was still alive.

So maybe the reason the trolls were able to forgive the bergens so easily was because they were used to the idea of animals, even ones that sing, being eaten. Gulped down whole. It’s probably an accepted way of life in the trolls’ world. Like, “all animals eat each other, but as long as it’s done quickly, without deliberate torture, it’s acceptable”. Even the trolls’ teeth support this theory, since they are rounded. No way to cut or tear into a creature.

Even the bergens would follow this life philosophy, since even they get eaten by bigger predators. Chef was swallowed by the hill monster. That might explain why the bergens don’t seem to feel guilty for eating trolls 20 years ago, too. It’s just Life, to them.

The only flaw in my theory is how Chef showed a cookbook which showed various recipes that amounted to torture for the troll being cooked. But I can see this as being a product of the sick, drug-addled minds the bergens probably all had at the time, being addicted to consuming trolls for a “hit” of happiness. All the trolls in the cage looked sickened by the book and Biggie’s comment about “They put him in a TACO” makes me think that the trolls might see eating another animal as okay, but not torturing it first.

In TWT we saw them “cooking” the little bug on a stick over a fire, but since the bug didn’t look particularly distressed, I have to wonder if it was just a way to relax the bug, using the heat to make it fall asleep so it can be eaten without being scared.

The Country trolls eat burgers, so they obviously eat larger animals, but so far in Trollstopia, none of the bigger animals they keep seem to be able to talk. I’m assuming they have figured out a fairly humane way to kill their livestock, too. Maybe they feed them something to make them fall asleep, sort of like Hickory’s method of essentially placing a bug in a relaxing sauna. Maybe he even learned the “relax your prey” method from the Country trolls.

I’m curious to hear what the rest of you think about this whole concept.