anaisninja
anaisninja
He Knows Ash
978 posts
Here for the Johnlock. BBC Sherlock - I used to like it. 50-something year old INTP. US east coast.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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“The obsession, particularly online, with the homoerotic tension between Sherlock and Doctor Watson… The template for us was the Billy Wilder film The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes, which deliberately plays with the idea that Holmes might be gay. We’ve done the same thing, deliberately played with it although it’s absolutely clearly not the case. He’s only a brain, ‘everything else is transport’ to him and John clearly says, “I’m not gay, we’re not together” but the joke is that everyone assumes that in the 21st century that these two blokes living together are a couple– what they wouldn’t’ have assumed in the 19th century. They’d have assumed they were bachelor best friends and now they assume they’re lovers. That’s obviously such fun to play with and the fact that people now assume, in a very positive way, that they’re together is a different joke to it being a negative connotation.”  Mark Gatiss in The Gay Times, February 2012
Hmm, I’m actually not so sure about that. Because I never got this joke (and no, that’s not a generation thing. I’m round about the same age as the show creators). Honestly, to me, two blokes sharing a flat in central London in the 21st century are just two blokes sharing a flat because it’s fucking expensive. I’d never assume anything else.
Even if one of the man was depicted as obviously gay (Girlfriend? Nor really my area. - Boyfriend? I know it’s fine.) - I wouldn’t assume any kind of romatic interest between them. I can’t see a joke there either.
But when their flat sharing gets laden with innuendo? For example, their landlady asking them if they share a bedroom. Another acquaintance taking them for being on a date. Those two blokes gazing at each other as if they were about to eat each other alive. One of the man killing for the other, who, in return, protects him from being prosecuted… Well, then I’d start to assume something’s going on - because it is shown to me and hammered home.
Only, I can’t see a joke there either…
So, what Gatiss described in the above interview wasn’t what happened. They were not just showing us two blokes living together. Because then no one in the 21st century would think of them as a couple. Moffat and Gatiss had to actively insert innuendo for their viewers to catch up on their ‘joke’ in the first place. They encouraged this on many levels: text, acting choices, casting, costume, music, lighting, cinematography.
They actively implemented homoerotic (sub)text in their show - only to lament at the same time that people cought up on it? That some viewers expected something to come out of it. Because, in the 21st century, no one thought it possible that it could just be a lame joke! Because there just is no joke to it.
The viewers took the positive attitude Gatiis desrcibes a step further and expected positive representation from the writers after playing with the inherent homoeroticism of the original stories. The fandom was far more advanced than the show runners, it seems.
And why play with the  homoeroticism it in the first place? I really can’t see where the fun might be in there, apart from cracking some cheap gay jokes that feed an outdated no-homo attitude?
What is there to play with when it’s not an issue anymore? And if it’s still an issue, I’m not sure that making fun of it ist the appropriate approach to it.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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Martin is back in London! (May 11th, 2017)
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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Wow. Thanks for sharing this. Good to know that this is obvious to so many people.
A view from a casual perspective
Just home from a professional dinner/awards do. I met up with a friend who I only see occasionally and she watches BBC Sherlock but is not in the fandom. She’s a casual and loves talking to me as she is amazed by my obsession with Holmes and Watson. Anyway, tonight she made a bee line for me and asked me WTF had happened to the show. She herself was disgusted with the inconsistencies of the characters, and the about face in the narrative. Her view had been that Sherlock was gay, any viewer who didn’t see it was choosing not too, he was heartbroken over John marrying, and that S4 would have seen Mary turn into a kickass villain. I of course spoke with passion about my opinion of S4 (she was somewhat alarmed at my vehement hatred of the writers) but finally, as if to counsel me she laid her hand on my arm and said; the obvious answer is the writers were stopped from finishing their story, as S4 was so much in opposition to the 3 seasons preceding it, that it was a fuck you to someone. And that the ‘terrible last ep’ was a parting fart as they walked away. This from a 50 year old psychologist, with zero knowledge of all our ideas and viewpoints, does not know Moffat or Gatiss, and who just watched the show as pure escapism.
Sigh!! Just wanted to share.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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it’s amazing how incredibly much TBB is no longer my least favorite bbc sherlock episode lmao
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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@sleepingexplorer suggested: Johnlock and Smiles/Joy. Thank you for that, yet again !
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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this is obviously a coincidence but I’m really amused that these two covers use the same photograph
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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ugh. they should hire one of the absolutely amazing and brilliant unpaid Sherlock writers [i hesitate to use the term fan faction, because these writers are as good if not better than Moffatis]  to finish the story line they left open. They did a great job of building it up. Let’s get a closer who is not bored with it. Let’s get a closer who loves it dearly.
Morning Musing on Moffat
Yesterday I read a quote by Steven Moffat when discussing a new project that he and Mark are about to embark upon. It was one of those moments when the pieces fall into place and you realise that something has been obvious all along, but you missed it. Steven is a typical INSTIGATOR. Here is the quote:
“My main enthusiasm though is just to be at the beginning of something as opposed to well into it” 
In psychology we look at an ‘instigator’ tendency in people as both a positive trait and a negative, just as their opposite, an ‘inhibitor’ tendency can be both also. Neither is good or bad if in moderation. However if the person is not self aware of the negative effects they can get themselves into big trouble. Let’s look at the clinical signs of being an Instigator:
Becomes bored quickly
Hates being managed, controlled or given rules
Loves the thrill of invention, creation and building
Tend to move on from projects, jobs, and relationships easily
Leaves incomplete projects
If the going gets tough they walk away and start something new
Can motivate and enthral others to join in, embrace a project
Insensitive to their effect on others
Forgets their past mistakes and moves on because failure and rejection have no effect on them
When stressed they think negatively and then unexpectedly lash out inappropriately
Listen selectively with the goal of catching only the pertinent things
Can become lost in their impatience, irritation, and anger 
Are strategic experts who are natural-born problem-solvers
Suffer from excessive self-esteem or the-glass-is-half-full thinking
Think deeply about impacts of their career in order to make life changes
Are too thick-skinned; they don’t take things personally and their feelings don’t get hurt easily 
Regret speaking too much before thinking 
Are prone to displeasing or telling you what you don’t want to hear
Secretly wish to be less aggressive and speak more diplomatically
Are natural-born leaders with strong personalities to use in the game of life
With a view to Steven’s track record with BBC Sherlock you can see several of the above in action. He loves a dramatic build up and the rug pull, but once done he walks away from any consequence or explanation, leaving the viewers perplexed and annoyed, trying to come up with the explanation themselves and waiting for a consequence to occur but it never does. TRF is the most obvious episode where Stephen Thompson beautiful crafted the plan of Sherlock’s ‘fall’ at the hands of Moriarty, but then Moffat [and Gatiss] all but pushed him out for s3 and the follow up plan was to gloss over the event, make the leap off the roof top a joke with several weak solutions and introduce Mary, which was an anticlimax concerning the emotional impact of the events of TRF to put it mildly. There was too little resolution to the events of TRF as to the how and why. Some viewers still expect to be given a good explanation, hell some of us are still waiting to hear Sherlock tell John about his torture and scars. But you see to an instigator the details are not worth picking up and examining. Other examples of this problem are the shooting of CAM and Mary shooting Sherlock. We are left feeling bereft of a resolution. An instigator only seeks the build up and the climax, they are not interested in the fall out, the explanation. 
At Steven’s various appearances at fan events or public forums, he comes across as flippant, gloats about his own abilities and can zing out hurtful comments. He hates the fans wanting to lead the plot direction, the fans asking for a resolution to johnlock, even if he planned and wanted that resolution himself. In order to not be manipulated, guided, pushed or ruled, he sabotaged his own project goal. Johnlock had become predictable to most discerning viewers, and Steven will sacrifice anything to make sure he is unpredictable. [Yeah, just throw in an evil sister, that’ll show them] His humour can save him at times, but he is aware of his own writing style and so justifies it as the excitement we all seek. But that is a double edged sword, without full resolution the impact is just traumatic. And some rug pulls/surprises are just so OTT to be believable or even sane.
I think he’s ‘done’ with Sherlock. It got boring. He had the great success, the awards and the acclaim, he thinks he made megastars out of Benedict and Martin, he had his fun with his time in history overseeing Holmes and Watson [Dr Who] and it’s time to move on. He leaves the field littered with unanswered plot points, incomplete character and plot arcs, intentions unfulfilled, a final mess that will never be resolved. In five or ten years there will be a special, or a series of 3, that will move on as if s4 never occurred. There may be a new Mrs Watson already ensconced in a house in the suburbs with John, or Rosie may never be explained and she is MIA in the new story. We have precedent of the glossing over of things in this show. 
Just a final word on the fandom’s BRILLIANT metas, art and fiction making up for the inconsistencies and holes in our beloved show; they will one day be held up as fandom’s resolve to create sense out of a flawed original work. The totality of the original with our supplemental is beautiful, it is an entity, an entire world, of coproduction which when seen as such, takes on a complete resolution. The original work fragmenting into thousands of more perfect possibilities. The fandom didn’t fail, it augmented and completed. We are not the problem, we are the saving grace. Our Sherlock and John are beautiful because we resolved and healed, and finally gave them their thousand happy endings. 
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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yes!
Please. Let me say this again. Late-40′s is not old age. It is not amazing/impressive/noteworthy that your OTP still wants each other in their late-40s. I wouldn’t even write how lovely it is that they still want each other in their late-80s. You know why? Because they wouldn’t think that. No one thinks, “Look at me, still having a libido/being in love/drinking wine/dancing/having sex!” because you are who you are no matter how old you are. You know what they do think? They think, “How the hell can I be 40/50/60/70/80 when I still feel like I’m 20?” All it says when you write that is that you’re younger than the age you’re declaring to be exceptional-under-the-circumstances. No one older than you needs to be recognized for still doing the things they were doing before you were born.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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best
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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when writer have regrets
I'm jist watching S3 of Last Tango in Halifax and read this (http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2016/09/06/last-tango-in-halifax-creator-killing-lesbian-character-was-a-mistake/) interview with the writer qhp says killing off a popular character was a mistake. It made me wonder if Moffattiss had ever admitted to a regret or mistake.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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I like this reading so much better because that scene has troubled me since it aired. That scene is so inconsistent with my reading of John/Sherlock’s relationship!  
The 'beating' in TLD
My sister made a comment to me just after TLD aired. She said that there is now proof there is no such thing as an after life. I asked why? She replied that if there were an afterlife my Dads (not hers, she’s a half sister) would have been out of their graves and back to protest the scene where John beats up 
Sherlock. It was disgusting, and unnecessary. It shook my faith in the show. How could they have thought that Watson would ever beat up Holmes? But then a gay friend called it for what it was ‘gay bashing’; the gay guy gets beaten up for being in love and the 'straight’ guy gets to vent his own anger that he desired the gay guy and has bisexual leanings which he’s repressing. It’s part of most queer dramas. My gay friend wasn’t even upset about it just resigned. 
 Yet I needed to fit this into the framework of a show I believe gave us the first out Sherlock Holmes. Even without johnlock, that is a huge big deal. So WTF is going on?
 If everything in S4 is MP/coma etc then having John beat Sherlock is maybe a metaphor for John’s anger after Sherlock 'died’ for 2 years, Sherlock did kill John’s wife by feigning suicide. I get that. Don’t like it, but I can see where they are going with it. I also can see the analogy that John is angry with himself for wanting Sherlock, for the girlfriends and wife not being enough, he wants more and that more is Sherlock. However I do have to consider what my gay friend saw in that scene, the 'traditional’ violence sent the way of a queer character. Not just in film/TV but in real life. Did the writers for some reason need to show this in order to make a point?
 As some of you know, one of my Dads was beaten up by a group of men outside a pub, very similarly to what we saw on screen in TLD. Only a barmaid came out and called the police they would have killed him. The incident changed our lives as a family. However I recall him saying, years after the incident, that it isn’t the level of physical pain or possible death that they inflicted on him that night, after all it was the same anger at his existence that he saw every day in people’s eyes or heard in slurs or jokes or discrimination, no it was the fact that people feel justified to act that way. It was always his fault. 
 Are Moffat and Gatiss making a point here that viewers were not up in arms about a gratuitous beating? That many empathised with John? Is Sherlock still the problem? Beyond his sexual orientation is he guilty of having a personality that is not tolerated? (Reading the St John comments on the contact twitter accounts I could scream) Being ‘other’ needs to be knocked out of someone? It’s a huge question and we do need to ask it repeatedly.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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What for you, personally, was the biggest challenge you had to overcome?
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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Gif by @livingthegifs
This thread (which is interesting in its own right, you should read it!) made me reflect for a bit on why I find this scene so damn annoying.
My first instinct is yeah, this is wildly out of character for Mycroft. The man is responsible for many deaths, in the tens of thousands if we’re to believe the jokes about him starting wars. For him to say “I will not have blood on my hands!” is not only hypocritical but silly. And sure, I’ll buy that Mycroft’s a hypocrite – that he avoids legwork precisely because he can’t handle this sort of thing – but I don’t buy that Mycroft’s unaware of his hypocrisy. A truthful response would be “I can’t do it” or, if that’s too vulnerable, “I won’t do it”.  
And this is where the annoyance comes in. Because: why do the writers have him say something so transparently hypocritical? Why do they have him vomit when the Governor ends up killing himself? It seems almost like they’re mocking him. Fucking Mycroft, they want us to think. Willing to order people killed but not willing to kill people himself. They want us to see him as a weak hypocrite.
But where does that leave us? It leaves us rooting for murder, narratively. It leaves us thinking, “If Mycroft were a better man, he’d have killed the Governor.” It leaves us comparing him to John, and esteeming John in comparison, because he comes closer to killing the Governor, because he actually tries to do it, because he doesn’t vomit afterwards. Of course, John can’t do it either. I’m glad of that. Just as I’m glad that Mycroft is being a hypocrite. But I find the whole thing very distasteful.  
The series of moral dilemmas at the heart of TFP is incredibly trite, not just in themselves but also in the context of a show that let’s people kill without consequences or reflection. To be fair, we knew this going in. In the very first episode, John kills a man, the ethical dilemmas resolved with a joke: “He wasn’t a very nice man.” Given that, it’s hard to expect a reckoning for Mary shooting Sherlock, or Sherlock killing Magnussen, or Mycroft starting wars and abusing state power. I mean, we complain about Eurus being forgiven for murdering a bunch of people but at least she ended up back in prison. That’s more consequences than any of the other characters got.
I’m just so sick of plotlines where people commit crimes and we’re meant to approve of them or find them badass. (And oh, the irony of writing this sentence about a Sherlock Holmes adaptation!) I’m sick of fiction where we’re meant to think less of people for not being able to kill. I was willing to ignore it when I first watched BBC Sherlock but I’m over it, I’m done with it. There are too many high-functioning sociopaths in real life for me to want to spend any more time with them in fiction.
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anaisninja · 8 years ago
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i bet my whole entire skeleton that mycroft has referred to john as “my brother-in-law” to a third party at least once
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anaisninja · 9 years ago
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Want to share a few casual viewer reviews of s4. It’s certainly not just the johnlock community that hated everything. The TV Junkie is hilarious [his comment at 7.58 made me giggle]
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But this second one is the BEST. He doesn’t know much about canon or Holmes/Watson, but James Murgatroyd is just so pissed!! We all need to take this guy out to a bar and have fun with him. He is sooo on our wavelength about Mary. Watch!!!!
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anaisninja · 9 years ago
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i havent been able to find it again, but remember that video of Mark and Steven (from when s3 aired) when they were talking about the ACD canon scene when Holmes returns from the dead and Watson faints. They talk about Watson's losened collar and the taste of alcohol on his lips upon awakening. Steven starts to say, "what actually happened was..." and then Mark interupts saying "spoilers!" WTF was that all about then? what did Steven and Mark believe actually happened?
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anaisninja · 9 years ago
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Martin Freeman is back in London! New Mark Powell suit, BTW.
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