athensandspartaadventures

[athensandspartaadventures]

oh-oh-oh-oh-oh / mediterranean la-dy / oh-oh-oh-oh-oh / la la la la la la la

[ still on hiatus i am afraid, i've got a lot of stuff to do and deadlines to meet, but I'm trying to get back to digital art before I get too out of shape ] [ trying to drop by and do more doodles! ]

[athensandspartaadventures]

To add salt to the injury to those salty Sparta fanboys, why don't we focus more on Pausanias who wanted to betray Greece, or on a less-flattering depiction of Leoniadas, putting more empathy into the theory that he attempted to murder his own relative to gain the throne and the fact that he was married to his half-niece, with whom they had a 30-year-old gap?

(Sorry if you like them)

valid points, but I don't think those facts would actually change the public perception of the Spartans in relation to other greeks. its very easy to counter such a portrayal by pointing out that that those traits/practices were a universal part of greek culture.

it was actually a very common tactic to besiege a city and hope some bastard on the inside would starve just enough to sell out the others. and yes, sometimes that was a guy in charge who lost access to his favourite wine merchant during a siege. or, more on par with a spartan king, a greek ruler or aristocrat on the ionian coast would strike a deal with the Persians and demand he be made persian satrap under the new regime.

and uncle/niece marriages were even more common, since it kept property within the family without actually resorting to sibling marriages or parent/child marriages. the only combo more agreeable is cousins. it's ESPECIALLY agreeable for an έπικλερος, an heiress.

the thing about the spartan mirage (the misconception that they were stronger because of their culture/environment) is that it can only be countered by pointing out that they were not exceptional in any way; they just created the reputation that they were.

[athensandspartaadventures]

ooh 5H thebes please?

you cant prove he DIDN'T have sunglasses in the bacchae

[athensandspartaadventures]

If you’re still doing the expression challenge could I get a 3H Persia or a 7F Ed pwease ?

i'll get back to ed in a bit but for now here is persia eating an orange

[athensandspartaadventures]

Sardis G4 please? 🙏🏼 I love him

here he is counting some money and being caught off guard by having one fan! yay!

[athensandspartaadventures]

@noordzee

Athens making Medusa faces over something petty please!!

(apologies for the delay i was Indisposed)

if i remember any ancient greek at all it SHOULD read

"...where is the road...?"

"MOVE YOUR COWS" "Hello"

[athensandspartaadventures]

Athens and Sparta Adventures: Chapter 9: Libation Bearers pg. 15

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Ostrakon: a shard of pottery used to write on, the scrap paper of the ancient world.

We're not quite through chapter 9 yet, but now I really will be taking a little break before finishing up and posting the last quarter of this chapter. Happy new year! 2025 will mark the 15th anniversary of Athens and Sparta Adventures in the fall, eek!

The flashback is a reference to this page from chapter 7.

any mistakes in the greek are because sardis' first language is lydian ok p: also i always forget to figure out the nuances between attic and ionian.

[athensandspartaadventures]

Athens and Sparta Adventures: Chapter 9: Libation Bearers pg. 14

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The Persians: A tragedy by Aeschylus and the only surviving part of a trilogy. The play centres around the Persian queen Atossa waiting for news of Xerxes' campaign against Greece. Darius' ghost appears. It's a whole thing.

Promanteia: The privilege of consulting the oracle at Delphi before others, which could be very important during urgent political matters. People came from all over the Greek world to consult the pythia, so the line was probably pretty long!

Comments:

Since I've been revisiting Greece as a character, I've been thinking about her relationship with the others. I think although they haven't interacted in AaSA really, that Sparta just kind of acts on her behalf without actually interacting with her or consulting her.

Also, this may be the most insight into Sparta's thoughts and motivations that I've attempted to portray so far! Haha.

[athensandspartaadventures]

Athens and Sparta Adventures: Chapter 9: Libation Bearers pg. 13

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Alcman: Spartan lyric poet from the 7th century BC who was known for his choral songs, particularly for girls. This bit is from the First Partheneion as translated by David Campbell, who notes that "Hagesichora guards me" might be translated instead as the more erotic "wears me out [with love]". Since the speaker in this poem is a girl, well... the homoerotic tones haven't gone unnoticed! :)

Comments:

nooo i didn't just bring alcman in because i love him... it's not like i wrote about him in my master's thesis or anything... or want to undermine the image of sparta as a Tough Macho Guy who definitely doesn't like thinking about girls who love girls... baka (sadly i can't have him say Let's Go Lesbians to Mytilene and friends for several more chapters, sigh.)

I Just Think It's Neat how basically one of the only things written by Spartans we have in the historical record is poetry ok...

[athensandspartaadventures]

Athens and Sparta Adventures: Chapter 9: Libation Bearers pg. 12

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Quick Ref:

Black Soup: The famous Spartan soup made of boiled pork, blood, vinegar, and salt. It typically comes up in comedies or criticisms of "unsophisticated" Spartan dining and cuisine.

Tyrtaeus: A Spartan elegiac poet from around the 7th century BC who was renowned for his martial songs. This is J.M. Edmods' translation of a fragment (CURFRAG.tlg-0266.7)

Comments:

ok ok so I'm terrible at taking hiatuses when I say I'm going to, but this quarter of the chapter is going to get us through the last full week of December and then for real I will start my hiatus proper and fix up the last quarter! :) promise

I've had this scene in my head for eons, basically since I wrote chapter 7 if not before that. I struggled a lot with thinking about how to draw Persia holding court or a banquet or breakfast or anything, and just decided to go for it.

And for the first time in ages we get a little glimpse of Assyria and Babylonia, who we haven't seen since Assyria's cameo in chapter 2! While she was mentioned by name on that page, I don't even think Babylonia has appeared once in AaSA before this point, even though she's had a design for as long as AaSA has been a comic. They're just here to hang out judgementally, haha.

(On a related note, is it a bit weird for Sardis to be serving breakfast in his own house...? lol)

[athensandspartaadventures]

Hi all! We are now halfway through chapter 9 as of yesterday, hooray!

the sad news is: I think my employment is even shorter than I had initially thought, and I am most likely going to be working through most of December to save up for being unemployed and job hunting, sigh sigh.

I have most of the next quarter of the chapter done with about a page and a half to finish and then fix up, but I don't know if I will be able to start posting that section by this upcoming Saturday. The last quarter still has some ironing out in terms of the dialogue and the scene that I'll probably work on over the holidays.

AaSA will probably take a bit of a hiatus while I tie some things up both in the comic and in my life generally, so thank you for your patience in advance and I hope you're enjoying it so far :)

don't cry, more stupid doodles and wips to come, ok?

[athensandspartaadventures]

Athens and Sparta Adventures: Chapter 9: Libation Bearers pg. 11

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Quick Ref:

Erectheus: The mytho-historical founder and first king of Athens. He was the judge in the contest between Athena and Poseidon for the city's favour. Since he was (through a bizarre series of events) born from Gaia, there's a lot of depictions of him popping out of the ground. This lent credibility to Athens' "cthonic" origins, since Athenians claimed to have descended from him and not immigrated from elsewhere.

Women in Athens: While women were not able to vote in Athenian democracies, they did have their own recognition of "citizenship" under Periclean law. Women were barred from public life largely due to the belief that they were unable to control themselves or their appetites.

Comments:

Okay okay so generally we do see people reclining while they're eating but this is a bit more informal, haha. And there's hot lentil soup (fakes) that would be a disaster to spill on a nice couch!

The Greek reads "Now it is time to sleep" and "Go on, kid!"

(does he realize that there's been so much wine this chapter specifically because he's hard to deal with)

This is (mostly) the end of Athens' arc in this chapter. I think Miletus has pieced together something about his current situation...

[athensandspartaadventures]

tfw you get war flashbacks about a play you weren't in about a war that you were...?

(be grateful for the one time in antiquity you'll ever see him willingly wearing pants)

[athensandspartaadventures]

dealing with peasants moodboard

i was thinking it would be fun to do a side comic of Persia's origin story (or at least, what the Greeks assume is his origin story, he's notoriously difficult to pin down for an interview himself) but i have too many projects on the go, sigh sigh! just don't know when I can really work it into the main storyline at all so.

[athensandspartaadventures]

"what do they do when they're at home together" this

since we were on the subject of xenophon... terrible comic incoming. sexy subjects (though more heavily implied in the text than the images).

don't tell her anything she'll get Ideas

it's great that he's not on the internet (lets hope he changed a little between then and now)

don't worry she has a special order coming in from miletus to help

[athensandspartaadventures]

thinkin about how the median kandys -- which was a fashionable coat in achaemenid persia (the sleeves were decorative) -- was super popular among athenian women for a while

[athensandspartaadventures]

athens and sparta adventures is a very serious depiction of the ancient world using primary sources

except the problem with taking xenophon literally is that if sparta isn't doing anything he's just running around like a friggin' amogus