gqa-lite

[gqa-lite]

hans in the beginning of frozen:

hans after he dumped his fiancé and about to overthrow a magical queen:

[gqa-lite]

ive been obsessed with frozen and frozen 2 since both of those movies came out. this means that when i am standing in front of a door and i have to knock i physically can’t do anything but knock like anna does in do you wanna build a snowman. it’s been 12 years and i literally can’t knock any other way.

[gqa-lite]

It's been four years, you're calling out people over old screenshots. Rude. They had and have the right to have hateblogs if they don't want to be “united by love”. Elsa and Anna are not real, it's safe and ok to hate them.

I've gotten anons like this in the past, and I'm fairly certain that you're just a troll trying to goad me, but okay, I'll bite.

Why is it that I'm always the one being framed as "rude" in anons like these? Why didn't you call out the person who came onto my Elsa-centric post to say something demonstrably untrue about Elsa? Why are you arguing people like that "have the right" to be rude to me?

If Elsa and Anna are not real and you're arguing that people have the right to say, "Elsa is a sociopath," why can't I have a right to say, "No, that's dumb. Elsa, the character in the Disney cartoon for children, is not a sociopath. If you think that, that's silly."

I've had people be rude to me for years and make me scared of even voicing an opinion on Frozen, so that, yeah, I didn't speak out while all this was happening. And guess what? I regret that, because it allowed toxicity to thrive unchecked while I was harassed and denigrated. And when I DID speak out four years ago, even on a post that only got seven notes, I had someone wheedle me with passive-aggressiveness so that I begged for her apology and edited my post to be more like what she preferred.

I should have stood my ground then as I'm doing now.

[gqa-lite]

Hot take but Elsa the Disney character isn't a sociopath.

I made a post recently venting about (what I felt to be) a deeply odd comment someone made to me in the past, and that got making me thinking about an accumulation of posts over the years that have made me uncomfortable:

This post calls Elsa “a bit of a sociopath.” Its use of the term “sociopath” is both frivolous and ableist.

A while ago, @greatqueenanna and I were discussing this mentality (because it had emerged in more people than the individual I am currently citing) regarding Elsa and she reached out to a friend who, for the sake of his privacy, I shall call BG. He’s diagnosed ASPD (Sociopathy) and works as Clinical Psychologist, specifically with patients who have severe divergences (ASPD, Narcissistic Personality, Histrionic, Bipolar, Schizophrenia, etc.)

I will now share portions of his email response:

"I want to point something out that is very important to the idea of Elsa being a sociopath. Elsa’s entire persona revolves around her guilt. Elsa feels responsible for the accident that happened to Anna. She is burdened with guilt for her parents’ efforts to accommodate her powers, and then their deaths. The eternal winter and the spirit invasion left her with a heavy load of guilt. Elsa feels guilty that she wants to follow the voice and discover more about her powers.

Guilt, guilt, guilt. If you’re tired of the word guilt by this point, then I’ve made my point. Elsa is not a sociopath, foremost, because she feels guilt. This is important because empathy is the key between sociopaths and empaths, and that’s why I wanted to focus on this first. Sociopaths don’t feel guilt.

Next, Elsa’s key problem is her lack of self-worth; the complete disassociation from her own needs and desires. This is not an issue with sociopaths. With this in mind, Elsa shows a bit of recklessness in Frozen 2, but it’s not from a place of boredom or a need for power. It is from a place of trying to defend those she cares about. There was a fire, she tried to stop it from hurting others. She needed to find answers about the forest to save everyone, so she jumped into the hole. Elsa gets no real benefit from these actions; meaning it doesn’t qualify as the same recklessness a sociopath would do. Her lack of self-worth makes her able to just throw herself in danger and push others away from it. Her recklessness comes from a place of martyrdom.

So, we’ve ruled out three key features of ASPD – no empathy or guilt, a grandiose sense of self, and recklessness out of boredom or desire for power. Now let’s talk manipulation; especially since it seems like no one understands what that means. From good ole’ WedMD, we see that Manipulation in the clinical sense is the - ‘exercise of harmful influence over others. People who manipulate others attack their mental and emotional sides to get what they want. The person doing the manipulating, called the manipulator, seeks to create an imbalance of power.’

Does Elsa ever try to make someone feel inferior, try to induce self-hatred, reinforce self-damaging behaviors, or get them to mistrust others? No, Elsa does none of this. She does it to herself."

Outside of F2, the claim that "Elsa doesn't care about anyone other than Elsa" is nonsense. In F1, Elsa isolates herself because she wants to protect others. She wants to protect her family, the sister whom she loves. She wants to protect the people around her. Many of Elsa’s worst traits actually emerge from caring for others at the expense of caring for herself - and those traits are only present because of her trauma and because of the way she was raised. In Frozen Fever, Elsa devotes herself to Anna because she loves her and wants to give her a perfect birthday, even though Elsa herself is sick. She puts Anna first. In OFA, she reaches out to apologize to Anna after closing the door again, she is shown to be a loving sister, a loving queen, protective of Olaf, etc.

The statement that “nobody [was] ever thinking of her (except for Kristoff in the last 3 years of her life)” is misguided because it disregards not only Elsa but Olaf. I’m all for loving Anna’s and Kristoff’s connection (I’m a Kristanna shipper myself, after all) but to say she had no one else is untrue.

This person also made statements like this:

And this:

Even hotter take from me, but Elsa the Disney character is not reflective of real-life cases of domestic abuse and incestuous violence. I realize you dislike her, but she's just not. She is a character in an animated film for children.

This mentality wasn't just her either. There was another blog that described itself thusly...

...which openly admitted that:

If your Anna fanblog never was much of an Anna fanblog but instead an Elsa hateblog, that says something about you and how negatively you approach the media you consume.

You cared more about hating Elsa than loving Anna - so much so that you put your original intent of loving Anna to the wayside. There’s something sad about that.

If you had a whole blog dedicated to screaming that you wished a fictional cartoon character had died, that isn’t healthy.

And it wasn't just those two blogs:

I saw various posts like these over the years, but held my tongue because I didn't want to be branded an "Elsa stan" or get yelled at. I did get yelled at by verannaca in 2023, however, because she rudely came onto one of my posts about Elsa to say that "Elsa was the villain." I replied with the definition of villain from the Oxford English Dictionary and told her to chill, then she got angry at me for writing an "unnecessary essay" when like... SHE came onto MY post. If she hated Elsa so much, why did she seek out MY Elsa-centric post?

It was just... an ugly miasma of negativity and I hope that, when Frozen 3 and 4 come out, blatant misreadings of the text don't become popular again. I understand Anna fans' frustrations with Elsa's popularity and I myself have expressed issues with the writing of especially Frozen 2, but...

I really don't think I'm an "Elsa stan" for saying statements like "Elsa isn't a sociopath" and "Elsa isn't reflective of incestuous violence."

Still, I love Elsa just as much as I love Anna, just as much as I love Kristoff, just as much as I love Kristanna and Frohana and the Northuldra and everything else. We're united by love, first and foremost.

[gqa-lite]

The fact that the shorts (or maybe just some of the shorts, idk isn’t it multiple short stories?) are taking place before F2 tells me one thing.

They’re avoiding the Northuldra again.

Which is frustrating.

I get it, they don’t want to do anything without Sami approval.

But I have a solution to this. It’s a wild idea, I know, but hear me out.

Hire a Sami writer/director. Problem solved.

I mean, they did it for the All is Found short stories.

Come on people it’s been 5 years and no substantial Northuldran content; or Honeymaren, Ryder, or Yelena cameos or stories.

[gqa-lite]

Y'know what? I hope we're gonna see them in the next movies

Old people' love is so precious, and my black ass can't refuse some black love.

I made me sad to know they've been separated for 34 years and they still love each other all along

[gqa-lite]

being hans fan is so fun because you will never know what's going to happen to him in frozen 3/4 , like he might be an anti-hero, the baddest bitch ever or just a funny haha cameo. it's such a roller coaster ride to root for.

[gqa-lite]

Listen, I’m very excited to learn more Ahtohallan and Spirits lore in F3, and explore more of magic and Elsa’s powers.

But you know what’s really getting me excited? The possibility (heavy on the possibility, as nothing is confirmed) of Hans returning as a villain and taunting Anna about her role as Queen. I’ve mentioned it before on my main blog, but I need to speculate and make myself more excited at this possibility.

Imagine—Hans learns that not only is Anna now Queen of Arendelle, the thing he was trying to accomplish before Elsa set off the winter, but she is also choosing a commoner Ice Harvester with no known family to be her King.

Can you imagine how pissed off he would be? That he was so close to getting what he wanted, all he had to do was wait? His reaction is definitely something to think about, especially if he returns as a villain.

Hans coming back as a villain to taunt Anna, criticize her choices as Queen and make Arendelle and/or other nations question her?

Make Kristoff nervous at becoming a King because he doesn’t know if he could do it?

And then we get Anna trying to not let his words bother her anymore, but she still feels guilt about letting him in in the first place, and maybe even has some trauma left over from her relationship with him?

A freakn’ dark reprise of Anna and Hans singing Love is an Open Door?!

The drama, the development, the depth— I’m just like, so excited at the possibilities that could come of Hans’ return and how it would affect him, Anna, and Kristoff.

[gqa-lite]

If magic explained and excused everything for Anna and Elsa, why it cannot for Hans?

I disagree with you here. I don’t think Magic was used an excuse, since to me it seems like the narrative puts heavy emphasis on fear of those involved being at fault, rather than Elsa’s magic.

Especially in F2, the narrative puts even more emphasis on this, showing how magic is often villainized because of fear.

Also, Anna never really blames Elsa’s magic for anything. Anna specifically calls Elsa out on her behaviors, especially in F2. She specifically calls her out for being reckless, shutting her out, and trying to do everything on her own.

Elsa is also shown blaming herself rather than her magic after F1. In F1 she does look at her magic as a curse, but then her blame shifts to herself in later installments, like ‘ruining’ her sister’s birthday, or for the family not having a holiday tradition. And in F2, she specifically doesn’t want to follow the voice because she afraid of messing things up. Not her magic messing things up, but her own choices.

Thus, Hans making certain choices because of an enchantment, doesn’t really sit well with the overall narrative of Frozen. This franchise has specifically spent the course of two films trying very hard to make sure to tell its audience that magic is not bad, the fear of it is.

The thing about The Tenth Kingdom (I’ve seen this show too, one of my faves!), is that the mother was already having problems before being enchanted. She tried to drown her daughter, ran out of the house when she realized what she was doing, and then the Evil Queen enchanted her. So I don’t think this is a good example.

Thus, I still think that Hans needs to be held accountable without any external factors being at fault. It’s different if you say Hans is the way he is because of how he was raised, to give context to his thought process— but to say that he was not at fault at all because of magic, then that is definitely not a good idea.

If they really do the troll theory for Hans or involve some form of the cursed mirror or any form of enchantment ("Frozen Heart"?) upon him, I will laugh so hard and admit my defeat.

[gqa-lite]

The Troll theory specifically will most likely not happen — Jen Lee spoke before that they don’t let outside theories, stories, and comments (fan fiction or official side content) affect their writing process.

Also, there would be legal issues if they decided to use that for the future. The person (or people) who came up with the fan theory can sue them.

Now, I honestly have no clue where they’re going to go with Hans. I’m hoping for complex villain or anti-hero, but it’s completely up in the air at this point.

But I do know that If they pull anything similar to the Troll Theory and say that Hans was actually ‘enchanted’ to do bad things, then that would be a huge cop out in my opinion. It would be a huge disappointment and disservice to so many who have suffered abuse from a significant other.

If they want to do redemption arc, then they need to go the whole distance for it to meaningful and impactful. Full accountability, and no excuses.

If they really do the troll theory for Hans or involve some form of the cursed mirror or any form of enchantment ("Frozen Heart"?) upon him, I will laugh so hard and admit my defeat.

[gqa-lite]

I'll use this meme until we get something, anything, a tiny crumb,,,

[gqa-lite]

Anna was frozen in the first movie, Elsa was frozen in the second movie, which means, Kristoff, I’m sorry to say this…

[gqa-lite]

And it seems I am officially wrong in theorizing that Wish could be the next Frozen. Such a shame. Had high hopes for this film. I’m still gonna see it eventually, but it is so sad to hear that it is not doing well. Good for it that it was nominated for a Golden Globe though.

Look, I’m not gonna jump the gun and say Wish will be amazing, because we simply don’t know. Wish could be awful, or forgettable, or whatever else.

I do find something funny though.

Back in 2013 when Frozen was first being advertised more heavily, people were over-hating it. They hated the designs, said the songs and singing was bland (yes, they were saying the songs were bland), mocked the trailers for saying that it was the biggest musical since The Lion King. People were very sure that Frozen would flop hard. Sound familiar?

Not only were they wrong, but Frozen ended up being…well you know. And even though there are still people to this day that say the film is bad, they can’t deny that the film is huge and well loved. It’s also good to note that Jennifer Lee and Chris Buck are behind Wish, just as they were behind Frozen.

I’m just saying that if Wish is truly good and exceeds all expectations, then we are literally watching Frozen happen all over again. Even with another well-loved musical pre-dating it (Encanto would basically be like how Tangled is to Frozen).

And that’s why I’m pretty much ignoring the over-hate for Wish. It’s honestly screaming “I’m the next Frozen.” I could be wrong, but eh. We’ll wait and see.

[gqa-lite]

I think it is absolutely unhinged that people are so heavily critical of Elsa in F2 that they say she was borderline abusive. The Elsa cr*tical crowd is so wild to me because did we watch the same movie???? The issues with Elsa and Anna’s relationship are not caused by Elsa’s inability to focus on Anna and Anna only. Was she more distant in the second movie? Yes. Was it justified? 100%. We’re talking about a woman who has had to spend the last 3 years navigating her abuse alone. She has Anna, sure, but there is only so much that she can do, and with the expectation that Elsa is supposed to continue ruling Arendelle as if nothing happened to her is a lot to handle. Plus we know Elsa, there is no way in hell that she openly discussed her feelings and struggles because she was taught for the majority of her life to CONCEAL, DON’T FEEL. Those habits are hard to break, especially after being drilled into her by the people who were supposed to protect her. So she is absolutely going to keep her negative emotions away from her sister because that’s what she thinks she has to do to keep Anna safe. Regardless of how much personal work she’s done on herself to recover from her trauma, she did not have the proper coping skills to deal with a crisis, so the minute something out of the ordinary happens, she immediately reverts to solely focusing on herself and fixing the problem as a way to keep Anna safe. It isn’t about Elsa only caring about self-preservation, it’s just the only way Elsa knows how to cope; ‘do everything myself and try to keep danger away from the family’. 

Elsa runs away from Anna to keep her safe, and Anna runs after Elsa to keep her safe. This is why they need a balance. Neither is wrong, but if it’s not managed properly, they will both be in danger.

[gqa-lite]

I want to point this out. And I’m saying this as a Helsa/Hans fan.

Hans makes it very clear that he was willing to kill Elsa even before the winter.

“Elsa was preferable, of course, but no one was getting anywhere with her. But you — you were so desperate for love that you were willing to marry me just like that! I figured after we married, I would have to stage a little accident for Elsa. But then she doomed herself and you were dumb enough to go after her.”

Hans was, indeed, doing all this just to be King, eternal winter or not. It doesn’t matter what someone has been through in their childhoods. “Cool story, still murder.” Now, does that mean he’s beyond redemption? No, but that doesn’t really negate what he did, and trying to downplay his actions is not the way to go. The best redemptions acknowledge their actions and not try to soothe them over with “but my abusive daddy!”

I also don’t understand why so many Hans fans are quick to dismiss what he did to Anna. He manipulated her and then emotionally abused her (and to an extent, physically with trying to quicken her death). That’s low-key domestic abuse, since they were engaged. I think we need to take off the shipper goggles and understand that in canon, Elsa would probably not date someone who abused her sister.

Is he really an irredeemable monster?

• Let's not forget that no one is prepared to deal with a sudden magical winter.

Hans was in a situation that he had to think a lot about, the queen escaped leaving an eternal winter, the princess went to look for her and he who only had superficial ideas of Arendelle had to take charge.

Were Hans' actions bad or do we only judge him by his last actions? Well, he had in mind to marry the monarchy to be king but we are all ambitious, Besides, it wasn't just that, he wanted to be recognized by his father, he wanted to at least feel loved by his dad for once, is that bad? besides, after everything he did for Arendelle, the best option to take the throne was him.

The council insisted at all times that Elsa was a monster, which council is against their queen? It wasn't just Hans' fault.

In the film, we see that Hans distributes blankets to combat the cold, gives them food, and tries to keep a kingdom calm in a stressful situation.

How would you feel if the queen plunged them into an eternal winter and the princess was missing? He was supporting them and fulfilling a duty that he should not have been Hans, so I think telling him "Unredeemable monster" It's a term that I don't think is for Hans.

Although Hans tried to murder Elsa and Anna, he not only did it to become king of Arendelle, but also because if he killed Elsa the winter would end. On Anna's side, even if he had kissed her, he would not have saved her because, as we know, "he didn't love her."

So is Hans an unredeemable monster for doing all this?

Let's remember that he grew up in an abusive family and that affects any child,

For Arendelle, after everything Hans did for them, he is also an “unredeemable monster”? If this was so, then what would Elsa be to them?

It is not good to judge without first analyzing.

[gqa-lite]

“She gets sexed up”

“It's inappropriate.”

“A terrible example for young girls.”

“Does being yourself mean wear swanky clothing and wear a lot of makeup?”

[gqa-lite]

I hope people realize that the authorial intent with Elsa being a spirit of the Enchanted Forest is that to ask her to leave would be a brutal ask. Elsa hesitated on the voice initially, but when she gave in, she dove headfirst into everything. She was even set on going to the forest on her own. Her magic knew it was all good... she battled and befriended the other spirits. She found Ahtohollan and she finally knew why she was the way she was. Why she had magic, why she was different, why she had the power of a goddess inside her when nobody else around her ever did.

Have you... experienced nature? Have you ever felt such great pain from the sense of otherness that the world forced on you, that when you finally ran into the woods and screamed your lungs out... you came to understand just what you had been missing all this time?

Elsa is a nature spirit raised in a cosmopolitan setting. And when she finally found nature and its peoples, spirits, Ahtohallan... she wasn't just Elsa with magic. She was the Fifth Spirit, a part of nature.

Don't ask her to leave that.