howdy-is-canon

[howdy-is-canon]

Thinking some more about Andy's dad. He IS a whole human being but I've struggled to really work him out with any complexity because he's kind of a symbol more than a character as it stands. His name is Richard btw. Anyway it makes me wonder, cuz I'm not a parent. I'm sure having a child is a transcendental experience. I'm also not excusing his behaviour but I'm trying to explain it. My own dad pesters me about what I should be doing with my adult life and career. I understand that to be because he cares about me and thinks I have potential, but also because he doesn't understand me or what I want or what I'm capable of. He could be pretty cruel when I did things that worried him too. Of course most of it was because I was being annoying, or whatever. Point is a lot of that comes from Caring about your children and I feel like he honestly does want Andy to succeed and is honestly scared that he Won't. Like, dropping out of uni is probably like, alarm bells, dude sees his son suddenly not having any kind of career, not having money.

Of course it's harder to justify his very conservative views and being like homophobic and ableist and all of the other stuff that he would've casually said to/about Andy growing up that just made him feel so alienated and in the end like... I say semi estranged because i really don't see Andy putting a definitive end to their being in contact. But like, after the divorce and Lilly and Andy moving to Rosie's house and Andy otherwise staying with Howard and having a job and an income, and Richard just generally being the kind of person that if they met as colleagues at a job Andy would literally just avoid him cuz he's the type of guy to be in the staff room talking about how there's only two genders............. It's like. Under what circumstances do we really need to talk. Not many.

But the thing I'm struggling with is imagining how this would impact Richard to really honestly lose your wife and your son all in one go........ I mean that's what you get when you treat your family like that and surely he'll be fine but I'm just genuinely struggling to picture it cuz I still don't know him that well. It just makes me wonder. Is there any potential for him to grow as a person and try to fix things. I think Andy would be open to it if he tried. I dunno!!!!!!!

[howdy-is-canon]

I feel soooosososo exhausted and sick and also starving to death lying in bed at 2 in the morning lol but I was literally just thinking about Andy and to be so brutally honest he would have grown up around his dad's conservative views and internalised a lot of it cuz he literally didn't know any better, this is nothing new but. I was thinking it'd make sense if he got a little bit into that whole anti woke scene as a teenager. Like, Jordan Peterson, Blaire White type of energy. And it literally came from a place of insecurity, like, he had undiagnosed autism, couldn't form meaningful connections with anyone, knew he couldn't be straight but was trying to force Something. I think this is a big reason, without realising it at the time, why I switched it to Howard being the first to realise he was aroace and to then help Andy realise the same about himself. Cuz Andy had never seen a shred of acceptance in his life and blamed himself for not trying hard enough. He thought everyone must be trying harder than him when actually it was just easier for other people.

Howard was not privileged in his upbringing at all while Andy came from a financially very comfortable, middle class background, but Howard was surrounded by much more welcoming (and neurodivergent, and queer) family. So it's kind of swings and roundabouts. Andy loses all that financial privilege when he becomes an adult and semi-estranged from his dad anyway so... I feel like he feels he lost years of his life and personal development because of his upbringing and didn't even get compensated for it in the long run LOL money isn't everything but it's a lot......

[howdy-is-canon]

side note hes being a bit cryptic on purpose. he knows carolyn has never heard of aromantic or asexual and doesn't feel like he should have to explain it any further than he already did, or explicitly come out to his ex girlfriend cuz she's gonna take it in bad faith anyway. he's just riled up by the insinuation that he should have to come out as gay or aroace or anything to spare her feelings when like. no

I need to get a shower at 4:40 in the afternoon but also I had a minor lightbulb moment but I don't know if it makes any sense so I'm feeling it out:

so Howard doesn't readily talk to Carolyn about Andy, pretty much ever since they broke up because she brought up Andy in that conversation, so it's a touchy subject lol, but like always in these situations, the longer time goes on, the weirder it is not to mention it, so I'm like, at one point Howard surely has to say something like. Oh they're moving in together. They got a dog. They're getting married. Surely either Howard has to say something, sometime, or Carolyn has to find out some other way. Which ok Howard's an idiot if he thinks oh yeah my ex girlfriend who I can't bring myself to talk to about one of the most important people in my life with whom I'm making major life decisions, yes me and Carolyn are Friends. But like I think in reality it's this thing that's been slowly dwindling and he doesn't really know why they still talk cuz she knows nothing about his current life lol. Tom is that you. But anyway I feel like she sees something on like, idk, Stan's or Ciara's Instagram or something, and it's like, there's a photo with Howard and Andy in it, and it's clearly a family gathering, and she's like WHAT cuz probably she didn't even know they still knew each other lol and leaps to the conclusion that he IS gay and he DID leave her for someone else. Which ... Ok it's weird cause what does Howard even talk to her about if he never brings up Andy lol. Probably nothing much and it comes to be pretty one sided and maybe they're already not talking anymore by the time Andy and Howard move in together or anything serious like that. That makes it less weird lol. But also means what does she like, start a fight over text out of the blue like WOW HOW COULD YOU when in previous canon I had it that she has a long term boyfriend and then husband and a little son. So I'm like does she just happen to see it and Not say anything to Howard and thus there's no drama. Wait no it makes sense I THINK because it just has to be when Howard and Andy are at a family gathering, which can be as early as like 6 months to a year into their relationship. I don't know how long is between Howard and Carolyn breaking up and Howard and Andy being a thing cuz it's so gradual and not clearly defined, but that doesn't mean Andy's not still invited to Howard's uncle's barbecue lol. And probably SHE has been invited to Howard's uncle's barbecue before...... DRAMA.... I was born to write a long running sitcom. Anyway so it can be pretty early on and before she's in any other relationship and could still understandably be upset or annoyed with Howard and send him an angry text lol. I wanna know what THAT conversation looks like. Later

[howdy-is-canon]

it's later! i've been thinking about how this conversation would go. over text. after carolyn sees a photo of andy and howard at the family bbq. lol

carolyn: wtf are you dating andrew???

howard: what

carolyn: i saw your mum's photos on facebook from the barbecue

howard: he had nothing to do with us breaking up if that's what you're asking

carolyn: i don't care if you're gay or whatever but why would you lie to me about why you wanted to break up cuz you made me feel like shit

carolyn: if you just said you realised you were gay i would get it

howard: i did not lie

carolyn: yeah ok

carolyn: i felt fucking bad for you as well

howard: literally why would you feel bad for me do you think i'm broken or something

howard: and also how is it you could understand i'm not into women but you can't understand i'm not into men either

idk if she replies after this lol perhaps more on this later?

I need to get a shower at 4:40 in the afternoon but also I had a minor lightbulb moment but I don't know if it makes any sense so I'm feeling it out:

so Howard doesn't readily talk to Carolyn about Andy, pretty much ever since they broke up because she brought up Andy in that conversation, so it's a touchy subject lol, but like always in these situations, the longer time goes on, the weirder it is not to mention it, so I'm like, at one point Howard surely has to say something like. Oh they're moving in together. They got a dog. They're getting married. Surely either Howard has to say something, sometime, or Carolyn has to find out some other way. Which ok Howard's an idiot if he thinks oh yeah my ex girlfriend who I can't bring myself to talk to about one of the most important people in my life with whom I'm making major life decisions, yes me and Carolyn are Friends. But like I think in reality it's this thing that's been slowly dwindling and he doesn't really know why they still talk cuz she knows nothing about his current life lol. Tom is that you. But anyway I feel like she sees something on like, idk, Stan's or Ciara's Instagram or something, and it's like, there's a photo with Howard and Andy in it, and it's clearly a family gathering, and she's like WHAT cuz probably she didn't even know they still knew each other lol and leaps to the conclusion that he IS gay and he DID leave her for someone else. Which ... Ok it's weird cause what does Howard even talk to her about if he never brings up Andy lol. Probably nothing much and it comes to be pretty one sided and maybe they're already not talking anymore by the time Andy and Howard move in together or anything serious like that. That makes it less weird lol. But also means what does she like, start a fight over text out of the blue like WOW HOW COULD YOU when in previous canon I had it that she has a long term boyfriend and then husband and a little son. So I'm like does she just happen to see it and Not say anything to Howard and thus there's no drama. Wait no it makes sense I THINK because it just has to be when Howard and Andy are at a family gathering, which can be as early as like 6 months to a year into their relationship. I don't know how long is between Howard and Carolyn breaking up and Howard and Andy being a thing cuz it's so gradual and not clearly defined, but that doesn't mean Andy's not still invited to Howard's uncle's barbecue lol. And probably SHE has been invited to Howard's uncle's barbecue before...... DRAMA.... I was born to write a long running sitcom. Anyway so it can be pretty early on and before she's in any other relationship and could still understandably be upset or annoyed with Howard and send him an angry text lol. I wanna know what THAT conversation looks like. Later

[howdy-is-canon]

I need to get a shower at 4:40 in the afternoon but also I had a minor lightbulb moment but I don't know if it makes any sense so I'm feeling it out:

so Howard doesn't readily talk to Carolyn about Andy, pretty much ever since they broke up because she brought up Andy in that conversation, so it's a touchy subject lol, but like always in these situations, the longer time goes on, the weirder it is not to mention it, so I'm like, at one point Howard surely has to say something like. Oh they're moving in together. They got a dog. They're getting married. Surely either Howard has to say something, sometime, or Carolyn has to find out some other way. Which ok Howard's an idiot if he thinks oh yeah my ex girlfriend who I can't bring myself to talk to about one of the most important people in my life with whom I'm making major life decisions, yes me and Carolyn are Friends. But like I think in reality it's this thing that's been slowly dwindling and he doesn't really know why they still talk cuz she knows nothing about his current life lol. Tom is that you. But anyway I feel like she sees something on like, idk, Stan's or Ciara's Instagram or something, and it's like, there's a photo with Howard and Andy in it, and it's clearly a family gathering, and she's like WHAT cuz probably she didn't even know they still knew each other lol and leaps to the conclusion that he IS gay and he DID leave her for someone else. Which ... Ok it's weird cause what does Howard even talk to her about if he never brings up Andy lol. Probably nothing much and it comes to be pretty one sided and maybe they're already not talking anymore by the time Andy and Howard move in together or anything serious like that. That makes it less weird lol. But also means what does she like, start a fight over text out of the blue like WOW HOW COULD YOU when in previous canon I had it that she has a long term boyfriend and then husband and a little son. So I'm like does she just happen to see it and Not say anything to Howard and thus there's no drama. Wait no it makes sense I THINK because it just has to be when Howard and Andy are at a family gathering, which can be as early as like 6 months to a year into their relationship. I don't know how long is between Howard and Carolyn breaking up and Howard and Andy being a thing cuz it's so gradual and not clearly defined, but that doesn't mean Andy's not still invited to Howard's uncle's barbecue lol. And probably SHE has been invited to Howard's uncle's barbecue before...... DRAMA.... I was born to write a long running sitcom. Anyway so it can be pretty early on and before she's in any other relationship and could still understandably be upset or annoyed with Howard and send him an angry text lol. I wanna know what THAT conversation looks like. Later

[howdy-is-canon]

ok SO…………… imagine a world where howard and andy met while howard and carolyn were still together.

we have to think about the stage of howard's life that he was in at this time: he does NOT know that he's aro OR ace, so, uh, this changes a lot already because beforehand, he had already split up with carolyn, and had realised he was aroace, prior to meeting andy, which is why he ends up helping andy to realise his identity also. this doesn't necessarily need to change cuz howard can still realise hes aroace, break up with carolyn, and thru discussions and coming to terms with it himself, this would still help andy to come to the same conclusion about himself. i do think it's harder for andy to figure it out for himself considering he's not been in a relationship as such, ever, so it's one of those, “maybe i haven't found the right person” or “maybe i just need to experience it to understand” things… 

anyway let us consider the DYNAMICS here because…. much to consider here… it does resemble a sort of love triangle, if we're gonna be typical and romantic, but i feel this situation is neither of those things, so, lol. this is a dude in a relationship with a friend he's never been attracted to out of a feeling of obligation, realising he's a whole other orientation, ending it, and simultaneously building a friendship with someone else, and over a course of months to years coming to realise the kind of relationship that would work for him that happens to be with this guy. not like, sorry carolyn, i met someone else. lol. it would have ended regardless.

so anyway… probably howard DOES tell carolyn like, oh i trained up someone new today, he's called andrew, he seems nice but terrified. carolyn probably jokes about howard being the one to scare him, on account of his :| vibes, and howard admits he wasn't thrilled to have to train someone and it may have come across at first but he decided he likes this guy and hopes he didnt make him feel bad……… 🥺 

so two things are happening here: howard and andy are building a friendship, goofing around, laughing about carrot pants; and howard and carolyn are. i dunno. not doing that. i think they've been getting on fine but everything kind of immediately changed when they went from friends to “dating” and he felt pressure to be a certain kind of person to her now, what is a boyfriend, what do boyfriends do, am i being affectionate enough, etc. which he kind of blamed on Society or something at first before he realised most people WANT to do those things and aren't secretly lamenting them. and, gasp, that's why they form romantic relationships. 

AND. okay this feels bad. but when i was with tom i never mentioned him to people. my family obviously knew and i did sometimes talk about him, but not much, and mostly for functional purposes lol. i remember i was working at pearson the year i met louie when me and tom broke up, and i remember telling tom about louie, but i couldnt bring myself to say the word “boyfriend” out loud so i never mentioned tom to louie LOL uhh……. i can see howard just never really bringing up that he has a girlfriend until they break up. tbh. and probably he's acting spaced out at work after it happens, and andy's like, hey what's up. and howard is like umm. it's hard to explain.

and he's probably like. idk if they talk about it AT work, maybe andy asks howard at lunch or, when they're just standing around at some point lol. somewhere a little more private ya know, in the back. i know how supermarkets work……… and howard's like ok so…… i was kind of… in a relationship… i know it's probably weird that i didnt mention it before now, but it's because, umm. okay, this is gonna sound crazy, (it's fine, says andy) but, ok, we were friends in school, right, and i don't really know why that changed, because i don't think i ever actually saw her as anything else, but, i mean it was her that… expressed an interest… and i guess i just went along with it ‘cause that's how it goes, or so i thought, and it's a bit stupid really ‘cause we were actually really good friends until then. and like, i don't know if we will be again. now. ‘cause, fair enough, she didn’t take it very well.

andy: what did you tell her…?

howard: dunno, i just fuckin’, uh, had a mental breakdown or something and she kind of got the picture. (he’s kind of laughing at himself in a bemused way lol) … and then she asked me if i was gay. and i'm like, i don't fuckin’ know. i don't think i'm anything.

andy: that seems a weird thing to ask.

howard: well, okay. don't think anything of this, but, i don't make friends very often, so the fact i've brought you up a handful of times in conversation is apparently a good reason to think i've been secretly gay this whole time. which if i am, then it's a secret to me an’ all.

andy: wait, did i come up in your break-up conversation with your girlfriend?

howard: look, it's her that brought it up. (he kinda shrugs and holds his hands up here)

andy: no, it's fine, just… (i think andy is trying not to laugh here. very serious conversation.) it feels a bit like i'm part of a love triangle or something. 

howard: yeah, ya homewrecker. it's all your fault.

andy: i will not be held responsible for this!

howard: nah. it would've ended anyway.

andy: you're still making it sound like i had anything to do with this.

howard laughs at this. an exasperated little chuckle. i was going to say he runs a hand through his hair but this is, in fact, buzzcut era howard we're talking about. probably he just rubs his fuzzy head a bit lol.

howard: no, i know.

andy: are you doing okay, though?

howard: yeah… it's all good. thanks. sorry to bring you into it.

andy: don't be! i asked.

howard: yeah, but, just the stuff carolyn said about you.

andy: well that was her, not you. but i'd rather know about it than not.

howard: okay. fair.

i guess it trails off after this. but more conversations will be had i am sure. andy would check in with howard the next time they see each other. at some point there would be a conversation about howard's guilt over not being what carolyn wanted, and he felt “like a right dickhead” for pulling the whole it's not you it's me, thing, but it literally IS him and not her, it's what HE lacks. and andy says something about how howard doesnt owe anyone feelings he simply does not have and it's kind of absurd to think otherwise. 

as for how howard and carolyn's relationship is faring at this point — probably they've occasionally messaged each other and intended to stay friends. after the initial upset i think she does say she just had to process it and it's not his fault he feels like he does, but she doesn't understand why he ever thought it was a good idea to start going out if he never felt that way about her. he's been unpacking this himself before this conversation. he says he just liked her, and cared about her, and he thought that's what that was, and had nothing else to compare it to. he says, he doesn't want her to think he didn't care about her just because it wasn't in the right way. he's probably getting a little bit upset, a little bit agitated at this point. at the way he is. at how it just could never have worked, and it's his fault.

i actually don't know at what point the words aromantic or asexual first come up. i've had it that howard was the first one to adopt these labels, although he's less of a googler than andy, but it makes sense because stan's his brother and he's up to date on all the lingo and his friend rees is aroace don't you know. and howard does talk to stan about things. perhaps in more detail than with andy at this point since they hadn't really known each other for that long yet.

i think i still like it how it was; howard figures it out, tells andy at some point, bla bla bla, time passes. thoughts are percolating in andy's brain. months go by, he's started university, he's feeling how different he is to everyone (it's the autism, baby! get ready!), there's that thing about that guy who tries to flirt with him and he tells him he's already taken cuz he doesn't want to straight up reject the guy, and maybe a little bit for clout (he thinks, okay, well i have no friends here but at least they will know that i have someone outside of this place!)... and howard does come over a few times, and he is assumed to be the boyfriend, and i dont know yet how andy ends up explaining this one, but i think howard has a grand old time pretending to be andy's boyfriend lol. 

perhaps……… in classic sitcom fashion…… this leads to howard playing the part, putting an arm around andy, messing up his hair, giving him a widdle kiss on his widdle head 👉👈 and this is how they kind of get used to these casual touches. and maybe, just maybe, andy is SO touch-starved, and howard is kind of lamenting how these kinds of interactions seem to be exclusive content reserved only for those in romantic relationships. and maybe they talk about it a little bit. maybe they shyly admit to each other how they think it feels kinda nice. and maybe andy clarifies he's never felt any romantic feelings for anyone either, he is pretty sure, just in case howard was worried about that. and maybe the fake-dating scenario is actually the catalyst for all of Howdy. imagine that. wwooooooooooooooaaaaaaaaauuuuhkghg dying noises

also not sure how carolyn sits within all of this. i'm sure her and howard are talking a lot less, but still talking. probably they meet up now and again, as before. it seems okay, but howard probably actually finds it really hard to bring up andy, because! now i see the drama. if she realises howard and andy end up in some kind of a committed relationship, regardless of whether it's romantic or platonic or whatever the hell, i feel she may lose her mind lol. she’d probably be retrospectively filling in the blanks of what led to her and howard's ultimate demise, even though as i said, it really did not have anything to do with andy and would’ve always happened. but she would blame it on andy and think howard a liar. i imagine it could turn into a bit of a fight. she's calling him a liar and saying she felt bad for him and all this time it WAS because he met someone else. and howard is riled by this and asks WHY she felt bad for him, is it because he can't feel romantic love? does that make him worthless? is that the only thing that makes a person worth anything? 

(insert moses sumney “doomed” lyrics because im still insane about that song: if lovelessness is godlessness, will you cast me to the wayside? well i feel the peeling of half-painted ceilings reveal the covering of a blank sky)

(in fact another moses sumney lyric, from “don't bother calling”, which kind of encapsulates howard's guilt around not being enough for carolyn: i don't know what we are, but all i know is i can't go away with you with half a heart)

(i need a separate document just for moses sumney lyrics. but like. howard before he finds his little situation with andy mood, from “me in 20 years”: i'm left wondering if it's written on my urn that i'd burn alone like a star

(btw this is not howard's kind of music but i think andy would like it and i think it would absolutely murder him lyrically, and then he would show it to howard and it would murder howard as well. lol. anyway literally not relevant right now.)

umm… so maybe this is the bitter end of howard's friendship with carolyn, probably not, but at least it can never be how it was again. there is the potential for carolyn to learn and understand, but i don't know if this happens while they are friends. as i say, once howard unpacks some trauma, i think that carolyn not Getting It is not the biggest issue anymore. i think seeing her after this point would literally send him into some kind of a panic attack honestly. 

we know that at some point howard and andy decide to explore some intimate acts LOL i’m such a prude just say sex. but not really tho. they don't get very far. anyway i don't know if this is the trigger for the delayed-onset ptsd or no. i mean, probably? which means that howard and carolyn could have been friends still for several years until he simply has to cut ties with her. but perhaps it's been tapering off anyway. he's probably been feeling kind of weird about it for a long time and probably somewhere deep in the bowels of his mind he has known that he’s only been continuing their friendship to compensate for how he couldn't be the thing that she wanted, and he thinks he at least owes it to her to be a good friend. he's just like me fr.

and then… and then… i think that’s enough for now