#and is a blatant misinterpretation of jon snow as a character

[thelustybraavosimaid]

A reminder.

This is what Jon in his arc about outsiders and unity and prejudice and seeing past preconceived notions and going against convention is all leading to you guys...

[tomakeitbeautifultolive]

Maybe I am being an illogical and over-emotional Dany stan, not saying that to be sassy or anything - it's a very real possibility - I just don't see S8 Dany as "evil" or a "tyrant". I've seen some people on your recent posts saying that Dany stans want to make her into the victim of the series and that in reality, all the characters were victims... but I thought the show did it's ultimate best to not only ruin her character but also make it seem like an unavoidable tragedy? (1/?)

Like I thought the whole narrative of the final season was turning Daenerys into a tragic figure. The narrative rewarded the Starks but punished Dany and even D&D said if things didn't happen exactly the way it did, Dany wouldn't have burned King’s Landing if things hadn’t happened as they did. Ignoring how D&D is acting like the gods themselves deemed that the story had to go that way and not that they chose to write things the way they did of their own volition, (2/?)

I don’t think it’s necessarily crazy for Danys stans to see Daenerys as a victim not just of the writing/writer’s choices, but also within the GoT universe. Especially if we’re supposed to view her as someone who was broken by grief and lost her sanity … like that seems like someone I would have more sympathy than hate or disdain for within that universe, right? I’ve seen others on some of your posts saying that Dany’s behavior previous to S8x05 were problematic (3/?)

but I truthfully thought all of her reactions were fairly realistic and understandable. Like Dany snapping back at Sansa when she snipes at her was problematic and absolutely not the best decision, but it was understandable (up until the random snapping of sanity in 8x05). Dany worrying about Jon’s position as heir to the iron throne? While definitely OOC, within the narrative that D&D were trying to portray (4/?)

D&D were trying to portray (Dany being surrounded by people who seemed to not only dislike/distrust her and her people, but also were outwardly hostile towards her) Daenerys as someone to by more sympathetic towards. Maybe I’m wrong about all this, but that’s the way I saw it. Which I think is generally why people have more sympathy for Daenerys (and team targ) than other characters. (5/?)

Because in the end, Dany’s loss of sanity was painted as an unavoidable loss due to the incomprehensible actions of other characters, whereas characters like Sansa who broke a sacred oath and betrayed Jon because … she didn’t like Daenerys? I guess … there doesn’t seem to be a narratively supported theory for this behavior other than she wanted to, so she did? Unless you want to go into the whole Sansa had magic powers and saw the future. (6/?)

Even Missandei’s character was sacrificed in a brutal, terribly tone-deaf way to buoy Dany’s “madness” and make it more believable/sympathetic. There’s a difference between being screwed over by the writing (which they all were) and being fucked over by the narrative (which only Dany and her people/team targ were). (7/7)

Anon, in order to answer your ask, I'm going to have to do some backtracking because I think somewhere along the way, you misunderstood or misinterpreted my viewpoint.

I don't see Daenerys as evil or a tyrant, but there is no question that this was how the writers portrayed her in season eight (I personally disagree with this portrayal and find it absurd and out-of-character).

I have no interest in arguing about season eight canon or the actions of its characters unless I am refuting the character portrayals, plots, or pointing out how terrible and inconsistent the writing is. My beef is with David Benioff and D.B. Weiss, not the characters.

Yes, I do personally find it illogical to deny that Daenerys was portrayed as an evil tyrant in season eight, yet to accept that Jon Snow murdered her. I don't know how this is even a point of contention. It's blatant confirmation bias and it services nothing but irrational anger. (Also, the context of my argument was in relation to Jonerys fans who harbor resentment towards Jon - not Daenerys fans in general).

I don’t think it’s necessarily crazy for Danys stans to see Daenerys as a victim not just of the writing/writer’s choices

I'm not sure how the fandom managed to so successfully strip away my status as a Daenerys fan... but anon? Allow me to introduce myself.

My post pointing a half a dozen sexist tropes used against Daenerys

My post defending the emotional turmoil of Daenerys fans

My post disproving that Daenerys was foreshadowed as mad

My post proving  that 'Targaryen Madness' is heavily inflated

My post refuting the comparison to the WWII bombings

My post about how Daenerys is actually the sanest character in the series

My post about why I think the books will end differently

Even my recent Jon Snow meta doubles as a pro-Daenerys post. This is literally how it begins:

"In season eight, the character of Daenerys Targaryen was butchered both literally and figuratively. It was such a brutal and heinous maiming of her character that by the end of the series, it was impossible to suspend disbelief and accept the inane and illogical choices of the writers."

The problem with this post is that the people who are offended by it did not actually bother to read it. I get it. It’s six-thousand words long and not everyone cares about Jon. That’s fair. All I ask is for people who didn’t read it not to jump in and start arguing about what they think it says.

I’ve seen others on some of your posts saying that Dany’s behavior previous to S8x05 were problematic

Anon, I cannot control what other people say on my posts. What I can say is that I do believe that the show writers did try to portray Daenerys as more problematic/power-hungry than she is in the books (which is all the more reason to believe the books will end differently). Again, I made a very long post about how if Daenerys was foreshadowed as evil, then so was every other character.

Which I think is generally why people have more sympathy for Daenerys (and team targ) than other characters.

I also have the most sympathy for Daenerys. The way the writers destroyed her legacy and possibly George R.R. Martin's legacy is unforgivable.

There’s a difference between being screwed over by the writing (which they all were) and being fucked over by the narrative (which only Dany and her people/team targ were).

The argument I'm making in my Jon Snow defense is not "boo hoo Jon was ruined worse!" it was "Hey... if Jon actually acted in-character, would Daenerys have ever felt isolated? Disrespected? Would she have gone mad at all?"

I am very interested in Daenerys and her narrative as well as her legacy, though I admit - I do not have tunnel vision for her alone. I love the ASOIAF series as a whole. That is why I'm going to keep pointing out all the ways in which season eight canon is bullshit and made no sense - yes, even if I have to defend other characters besides Daenerys to do it.

Thanks for the ask, anon. I hope my answer helps to show that we’re on the same page regarding just about everything - except that I have no more interest in arguing about what happened in season eight because I don’t view it as canonical.