#and without putting it explicitly in words convey “you’re worth saving‚ Ray‚ and we love you‚ ” and that they gave him hope back

[fullscoreshenanigans]

Hi! First of all I appreciate everything TPN related you do lol, so glad to see that there is a community even though I myself joined the fandom late.

I love Ray’s character arc and basically everything he does. How the trio complement each other and make up for each other's weaknesses. How Ray learns to hope again and what not…but, I have been having difficulty pin pointing the exact moment Ray went from-I’ll only save Emma and Norman to I’ll save my entire family.

Was It a secret thing all along? Because something tells me that Ray always planned to kill himself and die in the manner he preferred rather than what was planned for him. (Not only to resolve his guilt, but also to give a final screw u to both Isabella and the demons. That this plan of his would have been enacted even if Norman was never shipped.

On that note…. Did Norman really agree with Ray’s insistence of leaving everyone behind? Or did he just say ok to acquiesce and reassure Ray (whom Norman might have realised had been spiralling for a long time)? Had Norman not been shipped would he have spent the two months trying to chip away at Ray’s walls/ give him hopes in bits and pieces and convince him? I don't believe that Norman agreed with Emma’s choices just because he liked her (even in ss1)

Thoughts?

Heyyoo late fandom joiners/Ray enthusiasts 😎🤝😎 and thank you! 💝 TPN tumblr has a cozy feel to it and for the most part is pretty chill.

Ray's journey from "I'll endure all the heartache of this hell if it means I can save my two best friends" to "If nothing else, I have to at least save Emma" to being able to do what his mother couldn't and love his family normally is so profoundly endearing and a significant part of what makes the escape arc so beloved, and I'm glad this post where I delve into it a bit more ended up being among my more popular ones:

One could argue Ray hallucinating Norman up on the wall was to assuage his own guilt at being unable to save him as he originally planned (something that, on his darker days, I think Ray himself would believe), but I prefer to view it as the final marker of his truly internalizing one of the deepest desires in his heart that he had locked away for so long. After living under that oppressive reality of dehumanization and exploitation and believing that there was nothing else for him, that this was all there was, that things would never get better and after everything he did up to that point, he didn’t deserve better, on top of Isabella throwing him completely off balance by shipping Norman out early and just being this incredibly conflicting and painful presence in his life, to have his siblings come together for this escape plan and without putting it explicitly in words convey “you’re worth saving, Ray, and we love you,” and that they gave him hope back…it fucks me up something fierce.

Was It a secret thing all along? Because something tells me that Ray always planned to kill himself and die in the manner he preferred rather than what was planned for him. (Not only to resolve his guilt, but also to give a final screw u to both Isabella and the demons. That this plan of his would have been enacted even if Norman was never shipped.

Shirai confirmed it took Ray about a year between making the deal with Isabella to conceiving of self-immolation being the linchpin for keeping her attention on him instead of a hypothetical Emma and Norman escaping:

(Mystic Code Book Chapter 1 Q&A)

Though we don't exactly when he was old enough and graduated to helping out in the kitchen to be able to start hoarding the lighter fluid under his bed, I think it's safe to say he'd been at it for a few years, in the same vein as acquiring the parts for the deactivator.

And yes, there is so much emotion steeped into his final speech to Emma as he's fully succumbed to the belief he deserves to die in the most excruciating manner possible (adore the nuance the anime adds to this scene [from this post]:)

(The little slump of his shoulders when he starts that second line, too. Granted, it takes a lot to undo years of such belief and self-loathing, but the resignation in his voice and body language is crushing.)

And then plagiarizing myself yet again from this post:

Ray’s retaliatory act of spite was threefold in its pettiness: 1. to Emma he verbally confirms he intends to deprive the demons of the feast they waited twelve years for 2. to Isabella the caretaker who sacrificed her charges so that she could live, he silently denies the means of prolonging her pitiful life 3. to Isabella his mother he proves that he’s better than her, that he isn’t afraid to die because dying as a human is better than whatever pathetic existence she had carved out for herself, ideally forcing her to look at him one last time with the same look of terror she had on her face the day she realized their biological connection These are what I think he’d focus on in his moments of anger over the years, though he’d still primarily be guided by a selfless love for Emma and Norman. It’s a misplaced, manic bravado he’d whipped himself into that night, thinking his death would be “the best way” to both ensure the survival of his last most precious person in the world and atone for all the siblings he did nothing to save, but this is the headspace he’s in after a lifetime under such an oppressive existence.

Did Norman really agree with Ray’s insistence of leaving everyone behind? Or did he just say ok to acquiesce and reassure Ray (whom Norman might have realised had been spiraling for a long time)? Had Norman not been shipped would he have spent the two months trying to chip away at Ray’s walls/ give him hopes in bits and pieces and convince him? I don't believe that Norman agreed with Emma’s choices just because he liked her (even in ss1)

If everything had gone as originally planned, they would have left on November 8, 2045.

(Chapter 11 | S1 Episode 4; this is also super funny when you think of how part of the reason Norman is saying this is to get back at Ray for throwing him off balance with his betrayal by knocking him off balance. "Yeah‚ thought you wouldn't like that. Bitch." kdjfksdjh <3)

But regardless, Norman agreed with Ray from a pragmatic stance, in the sense he saw Ray's plan of just having the three of them, Don, and Gilda escaping as being more likely to succeed, but he actively chose to follow Emma's plan and strive for the ideal outcome. It's what underpins the whole "build a boat out of mud" speech.

From here:

But like episode 1 foreshadows with him silently chiding himself for only initially considering the possibility of him, her, and Ray escaping

that adorable pause of awe and wonderment hearkens back to this panel that is so very integral to his being:

(Chapter 14) Even with each new development, she still remains true to her ideals, operating with kindness and understanding until proven without a shred of doubt that doing so is futile because that’s the world she wants to live in (e.g., speaking with Leuvis about avoiding a confrontation, but shifting gears as soon as he confirms his priority is amusement and conflict because it would jeopardize the lives of all the children at Goldy Pond to pursue it further). There's a deep admiration that's been present for years, and now that their reality has been permanently shifted, it's even stronger as the one constant he's never doubted.

However, he was deeply, deeply hurt at Ray's perceived betrayal, and for those last two weeks of October 2045, he was genuinely willing to toss Ray aside before deducing Ray's true motivations, at which point he's firmly slotted back into the "dear friend who must be saved at all costs" category of Norman's mind (I delve into this more here and here).

This post is already really link heavy, but if you're interested, I have an assorted list of tags I use on this blog, and I use FSS Chatter for my non-jokey original posts and responses, including:

• Ah yes, one of my favorite genres of baby full score trio pictures: Isabella being openly affectionate toward Emma and Norman in front of Ray while being hands off with him • The little bow of reflection and smile Ray makes as he briefly soaks in the last morning Emma and Norman will be able to carry out their routine as usual • "I think I could survive truly horrific circumstances if I had a crush on someone there" • "If Ray and Norman couldn't kill Isabella because the alarm would go off when her heart stopped, why didn't they incapacitate her in another way?" • Why I love the way the anime adapted the exchange between the full score trio in chapter 27 and chapter 28 • The follow-up post to ^ • Forever obsessed with and contemplating what’s going through Isabella and Ray's heads during this scene in S1e07 • "If I were greedy…" (Musings on Ray's line to Isabella in S1 episode 7) • The inclusion of these two frames of the anime is everything to me actually • My thoughts on Ray having purple eyes and how that would affect his relationship with his family • What did Ray write in the note he uses as bait for Krone? • What would an Isabella and Ray reconciliation look like • Some more angsting over Isabella and Ray's relationship • When you think about how these panels in chapter 159 are of Emma contemplating what makes a person themselves and whether losing one's memories constitutes death… • My guess about what Norman says to Ayshe in chapter 160 • TPN 181 - WSJ Release vs Volume Release Differences • I kind of wish the boxart for S2 was as detailed as S1's…but I do really love how angelic they look here

I also have some small guides regarding the light novels if you haven't already read them (here and here), and a tag specifically for Isabella and Ray's fraught and complicated relationship if you enjoy angsting over that.

Also also if you haven't seen it I highly recommend checking out the English TPN masterlist complied by @1000sunnygo it's an invaluable resource I use all the time for references.

[fullscoreshenanigans]

I’m never going to be over Ray and Emma both having visions of Norman when they both desperately needed the comfort of his presence.

I could have gone with manga panels for both of these for uniformity, but yet again CloverWorks takes advantage of the medium shift to add such beautiful nuance to (hallucination!)Norman and Ray’s exchange in the S1 finale—Norman speaking to Ray so, so gently in both the English and Japanese dubs with his final remark featured here, Ray being so overwhelmed by everything that’s happened in the past hour already and now topped with seeing one of the two people who was most important to him reappear, after he thought he’d never see him again, that he nearly cries at his words. I can’t express how much I adore the way they handled this scene.

By turning out to be a hallucination/dream as opposed to a ghost, we’re shown Norman’s departed spirit isn’t actually guiding them as its own independent entity with an agenda in another incorporeal form, but instead how they both internalized his character and personality and, most importantly, how they wished to see him again that manifested his appearance (see this post for further differences between their perspectives of him on this particular night).

Ray has spent over half of his life utterly loathing himself for the choices he made in order to save Emma and Norman. So much so he built up a bravado around the act of his self-immolation for years, resulting in the manic fervor he displays when giving his speech to Emma in the few minutes before the clock strikes midnight on his officially listed birthday (this is also fueled by his fraught relationship with Isabella, but that’s for other posts). He not only believes he deserves to die for his actions and perceived inaction, but that he should do so in a violent, agonizing way.

Ray knows Norman, knows his sense of rigid morality well enough to account for him discovering his alliance with Isabella and using that to his advantage, to further push Norman away so he’ll be more comfortable with using him (he even chides Norman for not keeping his original plan to do this a secret) and so his death will hurt him and Emma less. And for roughly the entire back half of October 2045, Norman did genuinely hate Ray for his betrayal in the same way he hated Isabella, his reaction so visceral at being deceived and hurt by people he had loved all his life. He would have been willing to sacrifice Ray if not for intervention from Emma, which opened him up to directly confronting Ray and, in turn, led him to discover Ray’s true motives. He was so humbled and taken aback by the depths of Ray’s love and loyalty he returned to his original categorization of him: a dear friend who needed to be saved from his intended fate in their cruel world. Even if saving him came at the cost of his own life; even if he desperately wanted to live.

One could argue Ray hallucinating Norman up on the wall was to assuage his own guilt at being unable to save him as he originally planned (something that, on his darker days, I think Ray himself would believe), but I prefer to view it as the final marker of his truly internalizing one of the deepest desires in his heart that he had locked away for so long. After living under that oppressive reality of dehumanization and exploitation and believing that there was nothing else for him, that this was all there was, that things would never get better and after everything he did up to that point, he didn’t deserve better, on top of Isabella throwing him completely off balance by shipping Norman out early and just being this incredibly conflicting and painful presence in his life, to have his siblings come together for this escape plan and without putting it explicitly in words convey “you’re worth saving, Ray, and we love you,” and that they gave him hope back

(Chapter 36)

it fucks me up something fierce.

Emma’s hallucination of Norman is much more brief during this time.

No words are exchanged, but none are necessary.

(Chapter 31)

After two and a half months of grappling with the real, palpable grief she felt at his death, seeing him around every corner and hearing his voice, and sublimating it into her efforts to ensure the success of the escape, she’s able to find solace in her vision of him before the wall.

(Chapter 119)

It’s why she sheds no tears for him until their reunion nearly two years later.

(TPN Light Novel 1: A Letter from Norman - “The Day Emma Cried”; translated by @1000sunnygo​​)

But up until that point, she repeatedly draws strength and comfort from his memory.

Even before chapter 93, she’s unconsciously reaching for him in her fevered dreams.

(Chapter 45 Side Scene)

Him and Isabella, predominantly in black due to her belief they’re dead, and Ray and the rest of the escapees who she hopes are still alive, predominately in white.

(Chapter 50)

Though she had to compromise on their original plan by only bringing along those over five at its outset, she’s committed to their end goal. She was the spark that pushed them to strive for the ideal outcome instead of settling for the safest one that would be tinged in regrets, and he gave up everything to facilitate it.

(Chapter 53)

The three-panel overview of her thought process ends on her final handshake with Norman. It’s painful enough for this man to be insulting her living family, but when her thoughts drift to the boy who had given his life so they would have a chance to live freely, who came to believe in all those things the man was disparaging, it’s the final straw that breaks her silence. She won’t stand and let her family be disregarded so casually or let Norman’s memory be desecrated like that.

(Chapter 64)

She eventually brings him up to Yuugo in an attempt to connect with him over lost friends, and her framing of it is interesting because while viewing Norman as having agency in making his choice (as much as they can have under the circumstances in that he went willingly, which isn’t much, but from her perspective as a traumatized child), she states simply that she let him go. (Shoutout to the way SKATES delivers said line in the manga dub. Wonderfully heartbreaking. </3)

(Chapter 30)

After she and Ray both knew how much he wanted to see the world beyond their walled existence and live on with them.

So when we get to chapter 93 where she’s on the brink of death, having visions of all the suffering experienced on the grounds of Goldy Pond before finding refuge and strength in visions of her family, the one who catches he when she begins to sink is Norman.

Unlike with the hallucinations at the end of the escape arc that were meant to obfuscate his fate, at this point we as an audience know he’s alive at Lambda, so this is all coming from the perception of Norman Emma holds deep within her heart. Even from beyond, even if it meant being separated from her longer, she sees him guiding her out of the unknown, murky depths so she can continue fighting to actualize their plan. (To say nothing of the way she imagines him delicately intertwining their fingers upon reaching her as the way he catches her. The association with safety and gentleness is always present and yet another valued refuge in light of the violence she’s in the middle of.)

Minor tangent to end on, but it’s interesting to me how when Emma brings up Norman’s name among people she misses, during the only time they privately mention him, Ray takes a beat to gather himself before focusing on what’s still obtainable in this life.

(Chapter 55)

There’s zero chance she blames him for Norman’s shipment, but he’s still not ready to look her in the eye and delve into it where they could potentially draw attention from others when he considers it a failure to his two most precious people after years of meticulous planning.

(Chapter 65)

But Norman’s still in his thoughts too as he adamantly refuses to fail Emma again.

(Chapter 93)

Though he comes very close.

(Chapter 123)

And he’s the one to remind Emma of how special their bond is when she’s having doubts about voicing her disagreement with Norman’s plan.