#c: Revion

[tmrrwppl]

ROP thoughts

Clari and John want like... 5 minutes along with Revion/The Watchwarden...

:-|

I tried to tell them they just look alike and this is a fucking 4th wall break but do they listen? No.

Russell is encouraging them, which makes it 20 times worse.

[inappropriatemetalfilth]

“When Lord Father is present and you suddenly remember your posture” or  “HIERARCHY AND URUKS” That unnamed uruk really grew a lot in the moment he had his back straightened. “Fabio” looks way more unfazed by Adar´s entrance, but even he has a moment of lowering his head lightly. The last post mentioned their hand gestures and bowing (x), which certainly indicate that Adar has an unmatched position of authority.  Bowing - Do they do this on their own accord? - Is there some kind of protocol, military courtesy, court ceremonial established? - If so did Adar set the rules?   - Is it remnants of how they had to live under Morgoth and Sauron?  Rank and Titles  On the wonderful JM Discord I´ve already wondered, if or how interchangeable “Adar” and “Lord Father” are. (Gratitude and Thanks for the conversation go to @niennawept @astro-gnome, @bluestaratsunrise!)  While the uruks do use the word “Adar” to a) talk about him, b) announce him, or c) when they chant it, I do think, he´s only ever addressed once by someone with “Adar” instead of “Lord Father”. Adar or Lord Father - Is it completely interchangeable? - Is it personal preference?  - Is there a component of rank or status (some uruks are allowed to use Adar´s name, while others are restricted to use his title)? - Is it a matter of formal / informal or on duty / off duty use?  - Do they even have concepts like formal or duty? Or is life just life? (They use the term “sun duty”, but do they have designated leisure “off times”?) Adar - One thing that could point to a situational use is, that we (correct me if I´m wrong) only hear Magrot say “Adar” to his face when addressing him (1x04). This could perhaps have even been a “last wish” kind of thing. Only in this last moment of his, Magrot is allowed or is allowing himself to address Adar directly by his name. Pure speculation aside, it might just be due to an informal situation, Magrot´s status, or because there actually isn´t any taboo or any reservation about addressing Adar by his name going on.  - Revion and Arondir obviously hear the uruks say “Adar”  - Vrath and Lurka [Grugzûk?] are having their “For Adar” conversation (1x03) - “Wait! Bring him to Adar." (1x03) - Bazur´s announcement: “Magrot! Adar...” (1x04)  - The chanting of his name (1x03/1x04,1x07) - Waldreg: “Hail Adar, Lord of the South lands!” (1x07) As @niennawept has pointed out with Waldreg there might be an additional factor for him using the title when he addresses Adar directly: he might not want to use an elven word, and thus mostly refrain from saying “Adar”. Lord Father  - Waldreg uses the title to address him directly: ”Meaning no offense, Lord-father” (1x06),“Lord-father! You must move now!” (1x06), “What should we call it instead, Lord-father?" (1x07) - It might also point to situational use, that every time when Grugzûk is addressing Adar, he is doing so while reporting: “Lord-father... We found it. It's in the tower." (Warg Scene 1x04), “The tunnel is complete, my lord. (...) Like fire, Lord-father.” (Sun Scene 1x05) - Bazur using “Yes, Father.” (1x06) in Ostirith is doing so in a formal/duty situation as well.  - When Theo escapes an uruk orders: “You! Send word to Lord-father." (1x04) Uruks and authority Among the uruks other than Adar we have the couple with official and unofficial names that seem to have some authority over others, even among the unnamed ones we - e.g. have this one giving directions to another (x) to branch out and search their surroundings.  - In Ostirith Grugzûk is giving a command: “Open that door!“ (1x06) - Bazur is leading the (for a lack of a better word) ceremony for Magrot and has e.g. in Ostirith a clear leadership role, not just when he is relaying Adar´s orders  “All of you! Fan out! Find them!” (1x06). - In the scene with the quarrel over the tree, the way Magrot is sauntering into the scene and all others are looking at him (the uruks seemingly just as curious about how he will handle this situation (x), as the humans and elves are) very much imply that he is in charge there. - Before Arondir is almost killed, one of the uruks (Lurka is listed in the script, but it sounds like Bazur? [and might be another one]) is taking charge when he decides that Arondir shouldn´t be killed but brought to Adar ("Wait! Bring him to Adar." 1x03). - However there is one conversation that might indicate, that the authority structures or ranks among them might not be that rigid: “Lurka [?] : You there! Anchor him. Toss him out with the rest. Vrath: You toss him out with the rest. I had sun duty yesterday. Lurka [?]: You'll stay in the sun till you're black as coal if Adar wills it. (**)    Vrath: For Adar, then. But not for you!” “For Adar.”   (1x03) If the names in the script are correct [Edit: Thanks to @circe007 we know now they well might not be (x)] Lurka [Grugzûk] thinks he can order Vrath around, Vrath has a different opinion on the matter.  I do find the “you there” odd, does Lurka [Grugzûk] not know Vrath´s name? If they are of the same or similar rank, as the show kinda makes it appear, wouldn´t they have been around each other and know their names?  - But them having a word like “boss” certainly proves that there is some formalized, structural concept of hierarchy:   “Orc: Leave no stone unturned. Orc: Boss will skin us alive if we don't find him. [Theo] Orc 2: Boss is the one who lost him in the first place.” (1x04) The boss in this case must be Vrath, who encountered Theo with the sword hilt and then lost him. In general in this chaotic searching situation some ordering is going on (but often it is unclear who is saying what) such as “Kishdibatot / Search it.”. While they do have some forms of hierarchy, the term "boss" is used and some of the uruks are shown to be in charge in some way, we don´t get to know a lot about how uruk culture works in that regard. Which I´m fine with, that uncertainty after all allows some headcanons, but I´d be so curious about a couple of things:  - How much, or if they (higher or lower ranks or equal uruks) are involved in the decisions making process and planning, or if the “boss” uruks are solely/mostly handling and organizing whatever situation or battle is at hand, basically like a cog in the command chain?  - I´m still curious how the plan Galadriel reads about in scripts in Númenor (x), came to be, who originated it and how did Adar learn about it? And in this light, if it was discussed with the other uruks? Did they have a conversation about how they wanted to proceed once Sauron was out of the picture? Was the plan one they always wanted to follow through with (because the sun hurts) or did they grow tired of living in the world as it is, facing hostilities and then turned to that option?  - And you know .. just in general how does that society function? How do they handle conflict? Is equality a thing? Is one uruk heart worth the same as another?  Additional Question:  ** Why is Adar being used as a bit of a boogeyman figure and somewhat of a meanie or threat here? Surely an unquestioned boogeyman, one they´d do everything for, not even second guessing, but still a boogeyman?  Really wondering about this, especially in light of the fandom portraying Adar so much as a benevolent, loving father figure (despite the sun scorching moment, or sending some to be cannon fodder (x) and because of incredibly heartbreaking emotional moments like the one with Magrot, his speech before the battle or words to Galadriel, or generally his mission to give them a home free of sunlight).  | The Rings of Power | 01x06 "Udûn" |  Adar (Joseph Mawle), “Fabio” (Jed Brophy), Unnamed Uruk |

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