#quartoth

[dreamsinstopmotion]

Connor was at his best as a character (not a person) in his first few episodes (teenaged not baby). How he is unfamiliar with the modern world. Saving Sunny, chocodiles, tools for eating. His unhinged grin when he tries to kill Cordelia, the confusion and pain on his face as her demony powers pass through him, ridding him of some of the stain that Quartoth left on him. How he breaks down and cries in her arms, just like a child. Because he is just a child and that is the first moment in his life that he gets to be one, to take comfort in a mother, to be vulnerable and feel safe.

I think one of the problems with how Connor was handled is that he very rarely got to be a character who's depths we explored, who's immense trauma was delved into. There could have been much more to him than the writers gave us.

I generally don't like Connor as a character. I don't enjoy him and he brings a lot of grief to the show, we all know the troubles of season 4. It's sad, because I think he had a lot of potential if his character and storyline hadn't been so fumbled.

[rensplotdumps]

Stupid Idea #12

HE [Wesley] WOULD HAVE BEEN A GREAT DAD Au where he actually runs away and raises Conner?? Wesley would be a much better dad than holtz Even in quartoth He would teach conner to love angel, Cordelia, Fred, Gunn, and Lorne He would get them both back together And then when they come back angels pissy but realizes that conner fucking adores angel and has a hard time staying mad (but still tries) but hed at least try and play nice around conner.

[mossomness]

I would love to hear why Frunn is a Notp! Not trying to put you on the spot, just curious :) And yes, the last few episodes of S3 of AtS are torture to watch! I usually skip them.

From just a writing/production standpoint, it was written to be a temporary ship, and it comes across that way in the show a lot. In the episode where they got together, it was played as miscommunication. It was written as Fred got together with Gunn because Cordelia misunderstood her. In the following episode Gunn says he thought she would get with Wesley. Cordelia said a couple episodes after that, that she originally thought Fred and Wesley should have been together. It’s constant. It was a ship written to cause drama, not to last. Perhaps, if it had been written differently, I wouldn’t hate it so much.

I don’t like how they act when they are together. I can’t stand their dynamic. I have always been annoyed by cutesy, and they have it in abundance. You can get a cavity just watching these two together, they act so sweet. It’s to an overwhelming (even sickening to me) degree. Fred already acted a little too ‘little girl’ for my taste at the beginning, but it was understood because of what she had been through. By mid-season 3, it was to the point that she should start to mature/overcome her trauma. When she was with Gunn, it got worse. He treated her like a little girl, and she acted more like one when she was around him. At the beginning of season 4, circumstances led her to mature, because no one would have stepped up if she hadn’t. I don’t think it’s Gunn’s fault that Fred acted that way, but by being with him, Fred didn’t develop. And, when he was with Fred, Gunn became possessive of her. It was probably just the writers trying to add to the drama, but he became a complete jealous asshole when it came to Fred. Over and over again, he would say snide comments to insult Wesley around her because he felt threatened by the bond they had (That’s not the shipper in me talking. Gunn mentioned he thought Fred would choose Wesley). It could be said that he was only rude to Wesley because of the Connor thing, and I definitely think that was the main thing to end their friendship, but Gunn was making comments pre-Quartoth.

I don’t think they really knew each other in a deep way. They obviously knew each other. You can’t date someone for 6 months and not. But I think it was shallow level stuff. When it came to the deeper important things, I don’t think they did, and that’s what broke them up. They both had a darkness in themselves that the other didn’t, and refused to, see. Then when that darkness was exposed, they realized they weren’t the people they thought they were. When Fred was dealing with finding out that her professor tried to kill her, Gunn offered her cocoa. I am not saying he should have helped her kill him, but he didn’t even want her to really talk about it. Everything he said was right, they don’t kill people, but she didn’t really get to vent first. He immediately wanted her to calm down. When she was about to kill her professor, Gunn did it, because he didn’t want her to deal with it. He wanted to protect her from the pain. But is that what she needed? Was it his right to take that from her? Fred didn’t think so. Earlier, when she was on her way to kill the professor, when Wesley said he was surprised Gunn wasn’t with her, she said he didn’t have it in him and that’s what she loved about him. In her eyes, he would never do that. But he did. He was not the person she thought he was, and she was not the person he thought she was. They saw the perfect versions of each other, and when they saw the flaws, they realized their relationship didn’t work.

I probably would have really liked their dynamic if they had been friends. I think they would have a cute big brother/little sister vibe. I never thought they had romantic chemistry together. I see this problem a few times on this show, where the writers go in a romantic direction with characters that have great chemistry, but not in a romantic way. Then the romance feels forced and unnatural. This is one of those examples.

This ended up being a much longer answer than I meant it to. I guess since I don’t talk about my hate a lot, when I do, I have more to say.