#which is clear bc of how he doesn't understand mob and how he seems to think that he's made everyone act the exact same after brainwashing

[magicdyke]

its so fuckin interesting to me that dimple is the only character to make mob so mad that he almost breaks. he's the only thing that knows how to make mob upset to the point that he gets overwhelmed by it and totally makes sense for his character bc hes an evil spirit yadda yadda. i think that dimple is like the only thing that's ever seen mob at his angriest, so it makes sense that he was terrified of him

[johaerys-writes]

i’d be super curious to hear your thoughts of the characterisation of achilles in the iliad! because while he is considered honourable and respected by the standards of the culture, surely by modern day standards he wouldn’t be so much? which is why i think that MM did such a great job, because she basically modernised him so that we would see him in the same ways that the greeks did re: his nobility versus his arrogance, but i thought the general consensus on achilles is that he’s an ancient greek hero which equals Not A Good Guy by our standards (but my formal education in classics is limited, i mostly partake as a hobby, so i’m always looking to expand my understandings and opinions and you’re obviously a very intelligent and considered person)

So I think the most important thing anyone needs to do when engaging with ancient greek works (and indeed any sort of work, especially those created millennia ago) is to keep an open mind. Importing modern moral judgement is anachronistic when it comes to the Iliad; hubris, as we understand it now, simply does not exist in the Iliad, there are no Good Guys vs Bad Guys, there are no Heroes or Villains. Those notions came much later and are very much a Christian thing. A hero in the Homeric world has no moral implication; he is simply a warrior. A dude that does things, and not necessarily admirable things. So it would be pointless to try to view Achilles or Hector or Agamemnon (or even the gods in the Iliad who do some pretty fucked up shit) as good or bad guys, because such a thing is irrelevant in the Iliad.

That being said, I feel like Achilles is portrayed generally positively both in the Iliad and also in other ancient Greek works. He is noble, that is, he is of noble/divine lineage, he is well-spoken, well-educated, generally reasonable and polite with pretty much everyone, except for Agamemnon in that opening scene in the Iliad (who was a dick to him as well). He is also honourable and with a very rigid moral code: in the Iliad it is stated many times that he prefers to ransom back captives instead of kill them, and he even lets the body of one of the Trojans he slew be burned with his armour on as a sign of respect, even though it is a thing of great importance in the Iliad to claim the armour of the people one slew. He is not greedy and doesn't flaunt his wealth, he is generous with his Myrmidons and is generally rather well-liked. Until Patroclus is killed and he goes on his rampage, he is a pretty chill dude; and then after Hector is killed, he organises the funeral games for Patroclus where he is shown to be very diplomatic and reasonable, even with Agamemnon; and then when Priam goes to ask him for Hector's body back, Achilles treats him with respect and the two men bond over their grief. So like, idk about you but those don't seem like the actions of someone crazed or extremely arrogant or bad, even by modern standards.

I think what is most telling about how a character like Achilles was perceived in the culture that created him, is that his portrayal in later ancient greek works, mainly the theatrical and philosophical works of around the 5th cent BC, is generally positive. Some playwrights depicted him as a bit of a hothead or a little boisterous and full of himself, but that isn't really framed as a bad thing. Achilles in those works is a famous and powerful hero who knows how good he is and how much the army needs him, but he isn't needlessly flashy, he always keeps his word, he is brave and heroic even by modern standards: in Euripides' Iphigenia at Aulis, Achilles goes to great lengths to protect Clytemnestra and Iphigenia from the mob, and it is pointed out many times how averse he is to trickery and lies and that Chiron brought him up to be honourable, steadfast, to keep true to his values and to stay away from wickedness (which is what Agamemnon did, essentially). So I think it's really clear that for the ancient Greeks Achilles has many admirable traits.

You mentioned MM and how she modernised Achilles and made him sympathetic to a modern reader's eyes, and I simply don't think that's true. I think MM's portrayal of Achilles is pretty close both to the Iliad and how other ancient Greeks imagined him; perhaps the only way she differs is by portraying him a bit calmer in places lol. She simply took away all those layers of nonsense that had been piled on top of him through centuries of literary criticism that took all the later Roman works that depicted him as a sadistic monster a little too seriously or only focused on how awful he was compared to Noble Hector (no hate on Hector but those classicists really need to find a new blorbo *smh*)

I also think that maybe MM went a little too hard on the arrogance thing and on his obsession with glory without explaining it enough, but that's just my personal opinion. Achilles is very concerned with his glory in the Iliad as well, but we have to keep in mind his position here: Achilles gave up everything for that glory. He knew about the prophecy and knew that he would die in Troy, and made the choice to fight in the war because glory is just that important within the context of the Iliad. I think that many of the heroes we see in the Iliad would have chosen the same, if given a dilemma like that. So Achilles gave up the life he could have had, his kingdom, his family, just for his name to live on through the ages, and then Agamemnon royally fucked that up by disrespecting and insulting him publicly in the vilest of ways. Achilles then made up his mind to abstain from the war and to go back to Phthia and thus giving up his claim to glory because he was so over the war, and he probably would have done that had Patroclus not died. And then there was nothing else for him to do other than to die as well. So like.... idk. His actions make sense to me. He is a passionate character who is swept away by his emotions, he has flaws, he isn't perfect (if such a thing even exists) but I think he's all the more compelling for it.

I hope this answered your question, anon! Thank you for giving me the chance to ramble about my favourite fictional man <3

[sebbyisland]

13 year old girl who is familiar with common light novel tropes gets transmigrated into Mob Psycho 100 as a mob character in Salt Lake Middle School (she knows they are fictional bc she vaguely remembers her friend in her past life mentioning the story before she died). She correctly deduces Mob is the main male character, but ONLY because he has black hair and red eyes just like the male lead in a romance light novels, and he’s (secretly) a super powerful guy who leads a underground society (cult, we don't worry about details), which is the perfect set up for a “nobody” male lead who gets a glow up once he embraces his immense power. Tsubomi is de facto popular girl female lead, which she concludes early on. With the obsessive one-track-mind and enthusiasm of a teenage nerd, she decides to bet that completing the mob x tsubomi arc was the reason she was brought into this novel. This is the premise of “I Swear My OTP is Canon!”

Since Mob is clearly already head-over-heels for Tsubomi, she (who will now be referred to as MC) decides to get to know Tsubomi better so she can accelerate her inevitably falling for Mob. MC's schemes are very innocent and mostly comes off as her REALLY wanting to get to know Tsubomi. MC also has no tact and asks direct question likes "Tsubomi-chan, what does your ideal romance look like?" This whole time Taubomi thinks she’s flirting. Tsubomi is so flustered by someone who doesn’t seem put off by her more anti-social characteristics, meanwhile the reincarnated girl just wants enough info to fill out her ship dynamic profile sheet.

Eventually other people start getting jealous of her relationship to Tsubomi and spread rumors that she's taking advantage of their friendship so SHE can date Mob (this is a double layered smear campaign meant to insult her for trying to be close to Tsubomi and make fun of her for liking Mob). Mob and Emiko help stop the rumors and this is how he and the reincarnated girl become actual friends. Tsubomi never believed the rumors, but watching Mob and MC get along so well leaves a foreign pain in her heart. Tsubomi doesn’t usually fight nor spread rumors in general, so she stuck with ignoring what was happening, but she feels weirdly upset that MC didn’t expect her to defend their relationshp and wonders if their friendship wasn’t important to her, if all that flirting didn’t mean anything to her after all. She would seriously rely on Mob instead of her? Tsubomi is experiencing jealousy for the first time in her life. MC assumes she's mad about the rumors, and Tsubomi doesn't correct her so she doesn't have to confront her feelings.

Meanwhile, MC didn’t expect Tsubomi to help because she still sees Taubomi as the untouchable Popular Female Lead and she’s just a Mob character so why would Tsubomi be involved with her? Tsubomi, listening to MC explain herself, doesn’t know what she means by “female lead” but she DOES know MC is putting her on a pedestal (just like everyone else). But why does she care enough to even talk about this with MC? Tsubomi isn't sure. During their confrontation, MC realizes her behavior has genuinely affected Tsubomi, but is too clueless to initially understand why. Cue Yuri misunderstandings arc.

Mob helps clear MC's mind in an exorcism adventure arc. MC comes out of the experience understanding that Mob isn’t hiding his powers or secretly gathering members for a cult, but rather choosing not to rely on his powers all the time because he doesn’t view them as particularly more special than anything else. He's not special. He's not the main character of the universe. This is the first BIG crack in MC’s logic.

However, before MC can fully process what any of this means, Tsubomi announces she is moving away!!! In the climax of Confession arc she pleads with Tsubomi to take cover instead of waiting for Mob, but Tsubomi tells her that regardless of what Mob has to say she realizes she wants to try making more genuine connections with people, and the reason Tsubomi knows she wants this is because of her relationship with MC. Mob has always been a genuine person to her. She wants to hear Mob out, noticing he was so stressed to talk to her, because she knows how nice it is to feel heard from her friendship with the girl in front of her. Even if MC had other intentions, Tsubomi recognizes that she genuinely enjoyed her time with MC. Before MC, Tsubomi was already with moving forward and being detached from the people around her, but now MC has inspired her to take more direct action in maintaining relationships, She's already decided. She's going to hear Mob out.

When Mob approaches, MC is standing speechless. She gives them some distance for "privacy," and she can hardly believe it. Here she is, about to be a prime witness of the CONFESSION scene, and she can’t even fangirl about this critical OTP moment or watch from a distance because she’s too busy thinking about Tsubomi! She can’t believe she was so wrong about both of them. She watches Tsubomi swiftly reject Mob's confession, and then immediately ask to trade numbers with him as if this doesn't give incredibly mixed signals, but Mob, as nervous as he looks, seems to take it all in stride. Maybe no one can really be put in a box, not even these literal fictional characters.

MC is unaware Tsubomi makes a small glance her way while rejecting Mob. As Mob walks back, his eyes finally meet with MC. He walks over to her and hands the last remaining flower in his hands to MC girl with a soft smile. For some reason, feeling like she's about to cry, MC gently takes the flower in her hand. She wants to do this for him, to help him let go of his expectations and grief, but it also feels like she's trying to let go of something, too. When Mob is out of earshot, Tsubomi tells MC that the flower suits her more than her, anyways. She can do whatever she wants with it. Wordlessly, the girl slides the flower behind Tsubomi's ear. The End.