#I know this is kind of overdramatic

[nat20composure]

Astarion and Agency- The Necessity of Discomfort to Self Discovery and the Infantilization of Victims

Minor Astarion discourse ahead that mentions the treatment of SA victims post-abuse:

I want to open this post up just with like. The statement that I don't think there is a correct way to enjoy media and that I LOVE to see individual head cannons and takes on characters in media. I think that is also, to a degree, an integral part of video games because of how unique the experience of playing a game will be to every person who plays it. But it has been making me feel so incredibly sad looking through fan content, art, or discourse for BG3 specifically because of how many people have taken the route of infantilizing Astarion.

I understand the instinct to shield or protect an individual that you love and care for. I also understand that because of the nature of the things that Astarion goes through, a lot of people also feel very deep emotional stakes in him. I'm one of the many fans of the character who is a victim of SA and CSA, I really do get it. That is also why for me personally it is so demoralizing to watch so many people treat him like he is a child who cannot make his own decisions or stand up for himself. Part of that frustration stems from it feeling like a media literacy issue, and the other part of that sense of defeat is just because it feels indicative of a broader attitude that people seem to hold towards victims of abuse, particularly those who are victims of SA.

To explain what I mean by people infantilizing him: I see so many people refuse to allow him the opportunity to be hurt, or to feel uncomfortable. They see this character who has been through an immensely horrible and traumatic experience, and their instinct is to try and shield him from anything else that has the potential to upset him. I get that the people who want that aren't doing it with malicious intent, but frankly it is not really...Helpful? To try and prevent victims from Experiencing Discomfort tm. I also think it kind of disregards the entire thesis of Astarion's character and arc.

When you go through something that robs you of your selfhood and agency, the world can become a crushingly terrifying place. In Astarion, that fear presents itself in a desperation for power, control, and at the core of both of these desires- Safety. One thing the game is clear about is that he has a right to kill his abuser. He has a right to escape his situation. A lot of Astarion's personal arc is centered around being able to finally do that. But the game doesn't just leave it off at getting him to safety. So much of it is also about him needing to take responsibility for himself and his actions, with needing to learn who he as a person is.

The inclusion of the Gur children and Sebastian as characters is a good example of ways in which the game gives Astarion the opportunity to take responsibility. I think that if the intention of the arc was meant to be that "Astarion should never ever have to deal with being afraid or uncomfortable again", then the Ascended arc wouldn't Come with such heavy moral ramifications, like sacrificing the other people just like him, killing the victims he lured in, literal child murder. The game infers that he doesn't deserve to die because of the things he Needed to do to survive, but it also makes it very clear that there is a difference between addressing an Active Threat and using your fear as an excuse to hurt others. Breaking that cycle of abuse when he finally gets the chance to is what separates Spawn Astarion from Cazador.

Taking responsibility for himself, and letting himself sit in the discomfort of vulnerability ultimately ends up being a thing that he is very proud of and cherishes. If you tell him you will make sure nothing like that ever again he himself says that he doesn't want you to be his protector. And so it blows my mind when people go into all of these discussions about Astarion with this...Weird moral high ground for never, ever making or letting him make choices that might hurt him?

I see this the most when it comes to discussions about the possible polyamorous relationship with Halsin and the interaction with the drow twins in the brothel. So many people are just...outright angry? At other people engaging with either of those options? And I feel like that anger is one) rooted in the projection of their Own feelings on non-monogamy and what a victim of SA can or cannot look like. and two) Relies on undermining the agency that Astarion BEGS you for at every turn.

When it comes to the drow twins, the game adapts Astarion's response to them based on where he is in his own personal development (a really cool thing imo). Obviously, if he still doesn't feel good or safe about engaging with sex he declines and says you can feel free, though he hopes you aren't just doing it because he hasn't had sex with you. I think this makes sense: He's just gotten out of a situation where his Safety and worth were directly tied to him having sex. I imagine he feels afraid that not wanting to have sex with you makes him replaceable or inadequate because at this point in the game, he feels like that's all he has to offer. The interaction is relatively the same if you ask him for a poly amorous relationship with Halsin: He just asks you to reassure him that you aren't only doing it because he hasn't had sex with you, and then tells you he isn't worried about it otherwise.

A lot of people have taken the expression of that insecurity in combination with him still allowing you to go forward and do these things as him just "sucking it up" because he's afraid of losing you. (I am aware Shadowheart says he wouldn't be able to handle it when you ask her if you can date both of them- But keep in mind, Astarion says she wouldn't be able to either, and THAT obviously isn't true of her. For the purposes of this discussion I'm only including interactions with Astarion as a judgement of his character.) I understand that concern, but I feel this take disregards so many other points of dialogue, and is also continually rooted in the baseline vilification of discomfort.

To further go into it, the way that he speaks about both of these interactions changes significantly if you speak to him about it once he is completely free from Cazador, and has had time to allow himself to start reconnecting with himself and his sexuality on his terms. He has absolutely No reservations about an open or poly relationship with Halsin, and says he trusts that things will be ok because he one) feels secure in Your relationship and two) Knows Halsin is experienced and trusts him to not be a messy bitch about it.

I think that shift, in combination with the in game explanation of why he isn't ok with being in that sort of relationship with the other Origin Characters (for Lae'zel and Wyll, he says they'd never agree to that. For Shadowheart, he says she's not experienced with open relationships and that he doesn't think it'd work out. For Karlach, that it would break her heart. And for Gale, he says you need standards.) is a pretty good indicator that he doesn't actually care about polyamory or monogamy. I think the vilification of that choice relies on you picking and choosing when you do or do not believe Astarion or just outright not liking non-monogamy in the first place. This interaction has more to do with the player's choice and comfort level, and so is not as important to the broader discussion I am trying to have in this post.

The interaction that is more pertinent to not Allowing him to make decisions is, I think, the drow twins. If you interact with the drow twins after the completion of the Cazador questline, he is outright giddy at the prospect of interacting with the Drow twins. Specifically stating that he is excited to see how he likes these sorts of things now that he's free.

NOW- I do NOT think that he enjoys the act. The game makes that abundantly clear, and I'm not arguing that he has a great time. He obviously does not, and dissociates during it. That being said, allowing this interaction to happen does not make a player evil or selfish. You are not playing the hero if you decide to moderate his choices just because you do not think he is ready for it. Once again, no one is evil for Not doing it either, and I am not saying anybody has to want to. I am just saying that treating this choice like it is an evil choice to make relies on completely disregarding what He wants to do.

Astarion says so many times in the game that he is anxious about finally having the freedom to find out what he wants to do, and I think that his excitement for the drow twin exchange is one of the opportunities the game gives him to make a choice. He makes that choice- And it sucks for him. He doesn't enjoy the act, and having done it he would be able to move forward knowing that. I think it's really cool and important that the game represents that facet of recovering as a victim. While you are trying to renavigate who you are, you are going to make a million new choices you never had before. And sometimes those choices are going to suck ass. It would be a different matter if he knew these things would hurt him and went ahead and did them anyway. But so many people expect him to move forward avoiding even the Potential of being hurt, and I think that is extremely reductive of his arc and who he is.

Beyond the matter of interpersonal relationships, the choice between Ascending or not Ascending Astarion is not a matter of choosing the lesser of two evils. It is a choice between his fear and his humanity. Between letting his trauma and his fear define him for the rest of his immortal life, and allowing him the vulnerability of deciding who he is when he isn't running from the world. When he's willing to listen to the parts of himself that want to do right, that wants meaningful connection, that wants to be proud of himself. That wants to meet himself. To confront who he is when someone else isn't deciding that for him.

Astarion as a character is extremely ambitious, inquisitive, and adventurous, three traits that only become more and more evident as he breaks free from letting his own fear dictate how he lives his life. I don't understand how so many people can see him and want to take the core of his character away from him, when he spends the entire game fighting desperately to take it back.

Victims are not casts of the abuse they have gone through. Their shapes may be changed by the hands of others, they may have to relearn how to be the person they want to be. But they are not broken or irreparable or fragile. They do not need to be freed from the grip of one person to be held tight in the grip of another. It is so fucking unfair and self-important to think that your hands will be the ones that fix them. That your hands know better than theirs. I think the kindest thing you can do for a person is to trust them with themselves, and to listen when they tell you who they are and what they want. Please listen to the voices that have only just learned to speak. It is the only way they can get better at doing it.

[autrizzms]

when dandadan said the children are our future and we as adults should protect them with our lives if it comes down to it, and when dandadan compared the exploitation of the gig economy to assault in that it denies one of their personhood and autonomy, and when dandadan said we owe it to the most marginalized to see and remember them when society fails them, and when dandadan said violence begets violence and therefore it is brave and just to choose kindness even when it’s hard, and when dandadan said the pressure and expectations we place on children are unfair and have lasting impacts on them, and when dandadan said the world is a rotten place and it’s for that exact reason that you have to choose to help others and try to make it better, and when dandadan said it is possible to forgive those who have hurt you because people are complicated and deeply flawed, and only through doing so can you move forward, and when da—

[simcardiac-arrested]

i’ve been browsing the watcher tag, reading different opinions—both criticisms and defenses of the game. and this is my conclusion of the last few days:

some of you act Very Bizarre about people who dare criticize the thing you like. i think pointing out the broken storytelling of watcher and its other flaws, gameplay or lore related, doesn’t actually mean that you missed the point of the base game or that you never actually liked it and hurr durr, you must be a fakeass downpour fan who only cares about linear storytelling with characters you can help.

some of you are extremely biased against not even people who exclusively only enjoy downpour, but people who enjoy both base game and downpour. some of you are treating these people unfairly because (checks hand) uhh, they don’t enjoy the thing the way you enjoy it so they must’ve been fake fans all along and are probably just here for downpour! clearly you guys don’t even like rain world if you don’t think watcher is like the second coming of jesus christ!

does this sound familiar? if you were here in 2023, it does. if you have been a fan of rain world for a while, and you were here for the release of downpour and witnessed the fandom growing in real time, then boy does this attitude sound familiar. today’s “if you didn’t enjoy watcher it’s because you’re a fake fan who’s only here for downpour” is yesterday’s “if you got into the game through downpour and didn’t enjoy base game then you’re a fake fan”

to understate it—this attitude is fucking exhausting, especially coming from people who are grown ass adults and should be able to handle criticism of their favorite things without instantly jumping to “you guys like this thing in a surface-level, unenlightened way, while i, an intj, like this thing in the proper way that the writers intended”. it’s fucking exhausting and i cannot believe we are still doing this shit 2 years later, with a new dlc, and just switching the word order.

i really want the rain world fandom to be a place where many different opinions coexist, a place of discussion and constructive arguments. i want to be able to talk about the elements watcher succeeded in, and the many elements it could’ve done better—without people implying that one of my favorite games, one of the most important games in my life, actually means nothing to me and i missed the point of it. i want this fandom to be a place where i can listen to differing opinions, where people can try to prove me wrong and i can try to prove them wrong in a way that gives me—or them—a new light to see The Thing in. because that is what criticism is about—letting people change your vision of the thing you’re criticizing, letting them give you new things to consider, and vice versa. it’s about listening to each other, and respecting each other.

disappointingly, this is not what the rain world fandom is, and maybe never will be—just by nature of how much each story contrasts with each other (no, i do not think that watcher captures the base game perfectly, i think it’s pretty damn removed from base game the same way downpour is, but i digress), but, still. what i’m seeing is just…upsetting. i am not seeing respect. i’m not seeing any constructive discussion. i’m seeing people invent yet another echo chamber where They’re the True Fans and Everyone Else just doesn’t get it. i’m seeing people once again dividing themselves into factions of basegame vs downpour vs watcher vs basegame & watcher vs downpour again (because there’s never enough treating downpour like it is some kind of black sheep of the family). i’m seeing people literally say that if you want the watcher to be 0.2% clearer or 0.2% more accommodating, the game is not for you. and much, much more that i won’t list here, because you can literally see it for yourself if you just go in the tag.

all of it feels very dissonant in relation to the game—the game where you have to think, to consider different perspectives and interpretations to fully piece the story together, and even then you might not get all of it…it seems like the fans refuse to do just that. to me, at least.

i’m sorry if you saw yourself in this post and my words hurt or offended you—this was not my intention. i am not trying to go after anyone, call anyone out, or make anyone think like i have a personal vendetta against them because they have a different opinion. i tend to use hyperbole and strong language, so i understand if people misinterpret that, but the main point of this post was to just bring light to the issue and, i don’t know…feel less insane? feel less like i’m living in a separate reality, because most people i’m seeing seem to think this is just normal behavior that should be supported?

and, well, to let my emotions out. because as much as i am angry, annoyed and tired of this, i am also just profoundly sad that we’ve managed to cultivate such an environment that is antithetical to everything the game was trying to say. i am sad, because i am itching to share all of my thoughts and hear others’ thoughts, i am itching to understand what people take away from this dlc and how it differs from my experience. i am itching to just…post, to just talk about it. to put my own thoughts on my own blog.

i am sad, because i don’t feel like these thoughts are welcome.

so, yeah. this post turned out pretty emotional and kind of vague, so here’s a pretty emotional and kind of vague conclusion to it:

i did not enjoy the watcher as much as i wish i did, as much as i hoped i would. and it is not because i’ve actually been misunderstanding the game all along and never truly liked it for what it is, it’s not because i’ve constructed some personal version of rain world in my head that i expected the watcher to 100% adhere to.

i really wanted to enjoy it. i wanted to like it as much as everyone else did, wanted to be blown away by what it meant for the story and the characters and the worldbuilding. i wanted to look at it and see what everyone else sees in it.

but the reality of the situation is this: i did not enjoy the watcher as much as i wish i did, precisely because of how much i love rain world.

and that is not a mutually exclusive statement.

[dead-inside-demiboy]

Everytime I see people get upset about any form of media, especially indie/youtube stuff because the creators werent "inclusive" enough or "did it wrong" I just remember my irl friend, a cishet white guy who is fully an ally and friends with many poc, queer, and trans people telling me how he ran a dnd campaign with a group of characters that were each a color, and how his players were disappointed cause he made the only female one pink and the only non binary one the robot, and how the two of us had a good laugh about it.

Like give these people a break sometimes, we are all human, and especially if you aren't a part of a minority, sometimes you just want to tell a story and aren't thinking of how many brownie points you can slip in. Also, we are all dumbasses! Irl we let the people in our life be stupid sometimes, lets extend the same kindness online please.

Yes, inclusivity is great and we should be asking larger companies to tell more stories with different perspectives, but also lets not harass people and indie storytellers for these same things please? We are all stupid humans and a lot of people don't have the big eye of the internet to give them the "correct" beliefs.

[silverislander]

if i wind up writing fic for anyone other than caitvi its going to be timebomb summer camp counsellors au i just know it. look at jinx (when she's not depressed, at least), then look at e7 powder and tell me that in either universe she isn't destined to be the most legendary camp counsellor on the planet... and ekko as the counsellor of the cabin she's sworn enemies with who win colour war every year... but then they're forced to head up the same cabin, confronting the ghosts of their childhood friendship

you see the vision

[greyedian]

longing for the day when making fanart stops feeling like i'm massively disrespecting the source material lol

[stage-set]

[nyxnco]

i dont know what it is in me that makes me go awww :) so endearing this is why i love you when my friends make mistakes and act awkward and cringe and embarrassing in front of me but also makes me think that all my friends want to kill me with hammers and lasers when i do the same

[zooblesbutchpuppygirl]

Not self ship related but GOD it feels so good to know I'm not crazy for thinking there's even a slight chance that I have bpd (< mutual on twitter who Has bpd just confirmed that my vents on my priv sounded exactly like bpd spirals)

[mulletsonlydotcom]

lachryma slapped my nuts off my body it was THAT good

[annihilatius]

Resident Evil fans when RE4 remake is actually deep, has three-dimensional characters and makes the player think critically about it instead of the original where every plot point was layed out clearly and concisely in front of the player where every antagonist was an entirely irredeemable one-dimensional baddie saturday morning cartoon villian with no depth or intrigue or realism (they don't immediately understand everything it has to say like the original so that means it must be garbage corporate slop made solely for money)

[gothethite]

'This goth band is overdramatic and a bit silly about skeletons 🙄' 'Ummm why are you spending time thinking about subgenre classification it's not a massive deal' 'Your coat doesn't look very serious'

[serpulalacrymans]

i feel like part of me has died. i can't write at all.

everything i write sucks, and i wish i could have the same burst of energy i had before. i have so many ideas in mind, but when i put them into practice they don't have the same shine as i imagined.

i'm stuck in a place mentally, and i thought everything would get better when i finally had some free time. it didn't. i feel trapped, i feel empty, i feel like part of me is mentally dead.

i'm not having fun at all. i'm tired.

- i know you. you know me. you don't have to answer me at all. i just wanted to take some weight off my mind.

Repackaging your way of life can make it more exciting if that's what you're struggling with. Learn new ways to express your hobby. Try different ways to write. Be more poetic. Be more juvenile. Try it out on paper. Try a free site or app for writing. Look up online tutorials and discover new words to use... It won't fix you. But it might help for a little while.

A passion isn't a passion anymore if it feels like a chore. People change. So do their passions. I'm sorry.

[halfdeadwallfly]

so.. i accidentally touched a trash can which made me feel like my hand was burning so i went to go and wash it and in the process i nicked the faucet with my fingernail and i got like dirt(?) under it. which. terrifying???? anyway i started hyperventilating and my hand started burning again but worse and i was trying to figure out what to do bc i was in the bathroom of all unsafe places to be, so i like ran out to the hallway and my hands are covered in soap and water which feels unsafe enough as is, and everything is just dangerous and i feel like someone's wedged something under my fingernail and tried to pry it off me and i'm trying so hard not to scream again bc i don't want to freak my mom out and i'm still hyperventilating bc there's this unknown thing on me. so anyway. it took a bit to get it together enough to like. go back and wash my hands again. and now i'm like. completely exhausted. aaaaand i still feel like i can't breathe like an hour later :') i had lovely plans to go out this evening and maybe walk and watch the sunset but now i feel like death! point being. fuck ocd :)

[dragonji]

damn that talking about your feelings shit really does Suck Tremendously huh.

[cha1cedony]

I'm gonna ramble about fic writing (while taking a break from actually writing, but I'm making progress this time! I promise! woohoo. knock on wood). ANYWAY, one of my favorite things to consider as far as characterization goes is self-awareness. Because there's so many different ways and degrees to which a protagonist can be self-aware, and I just LOVE seeing how characters shift (not necessarily 'grow') over the timeline of a story. I love thinking about where a specific character would choose willful ignorance, where they would choose to come to terms with a harsh reality, where they would be entirely oblivious, where they're NOT oblivious but can't even verbalize it in their own internal monologue... chef's kiss. My favorite stuff to write