#Ieytd analysis

[agent-calivide]

I feel like it's not acknowledged enough that Zoraxis is not only a corporatocracy, but it's also a cult.

Like, straight up uses cult recruitment and maintenance tactics.

They find societal rejects, people who are in vulnerable stages of their lives, or people with specific goals that they cannot achieve without help and offer it to them with the promise of power/resources/attention (Prism wanting Kinesium, Solaris wanting to make Lasers, everything with the Fabricator)

Once you're in Zoraxis you get separated from society so the only people you talk to are other Zoraxis workers (we don't hear about any upper ranking Zoraxis worker having others in their life save for Juniper and Gibson).

Zoraxis seems to go out of its way to destroy your inter-personal relationships from a previous life (ie Juniper trying to kill Gibson without a second thought despite Gibson being in his life for decades. Regardless of how self-centered he is, that mentality is from years of being at Zoraxis, not being a narcissist)

Once's you're isolated, Zor controls you. They control your access to money, resources, information, it seems they even tried to create a fake currency to pay their employees with so everyone would be exclusively dependent upon them with all of the worthless Zorbucks lying around. (Ollie getting stuck in the underwater lab with no way out and no way to contact anyone while still thinking Zoraxis is a stand-up company that wants to do good)

Then if you show any sign of dissent, you're killed. Not simply threatened, there's not a carrot and a stick, it's a carrot or getting sent to the glue factory. And you know those are your options because Zor keeps a bottle of glue on everyone's desks, lest they forget (X-Ray, Anna, and Juniper's executions)

But not only must you stay in the cult, you must always be contributing to the cult, or you're also at risk of getting killed. So you can't ever take the time to slow down or care for yourself, you must pour everything into Zoraxis. Always. (Think Prism's lab getting blown up, her work getting destroyed as well as a murder attempt. Ollie being left for dead, Fabricator's exhaustion)

And if you, god forbid, are a low enough rung on the ladder that you don't get socially isolated, that is just another thing Zoraxis uses against you (Ashley Lincoln's family getting threatened)

I don't think Zoraxis just happened to find evil, cruel people who wanted to be murderers. I think Zor picked people who were fragile, and people who wanted. They wanted so so bad that they were willing to take questionable work, and then Zoraxis feeds into their worst selves. They encourage violent trains of thought, they push you to do things you would never do normally, they enable the worst parts of yourself in the name of getting an end product.

I think every Zoraxis worker genuinely could have been someone else, they could have had normal lives. Made great progress for society in one way or another. But Zoraxis takes you and wrings you out for all you're worth, so you better be worth a lot if you wanna live.

[stellar-collective]

hey do any ieytd lore enthusiasts wanna speculate on what in the WORLD these two images mean with me

i took these from the official website where JJ and Roxy have case files to look over and they’ve been driving me CRAZY. first off, why does Juniper have a red cigar in a black and white photo? did someone do that on purpose? red, especially dark red like that, is usually associated with Zor, right, but then WHY does the Agency have these pictures with the captions scribbled out like that since both were made before any connection to Zor was even speculated?? like, for Juniper, if they just got this photo from somewhere random it could make sense, but what is UP with Prism’s? clearly it was taken while she was still working at the Agency since the file was made before 3 happened, so it seems like a normal classified document thing, but then what’s up with the color? there are five or six photos for both characters, and all of them are captioned in black and white EXCEPT for these two. the only connection that Juniper and Prism share in canon is Zor, but once again, these case files were clearly put together before either of their spotlight games occurred, so ???????

i feel like there’s enough of the captions still visible that someone smarter than me could decipher em so if anyone’s got any clues or ideas or theories PLEASE I NEED ANSWERS

[eod-agent-13-12]

Just a short ramble about John Juniper:

Disclaimer: I'm putting this on my side since my main's posts aren't appearing in the tags. This isn't an attack on anyone but I just wanna share some thoughts.

I think we're sleeping on some of John Juniper's potential outside of ship and redemption fics.

While yes, my Phoenix (Florian) does see JJ as a brother/cousin/it's-complicated-but-also-platonic, they also have trouble reconciling some aspects of his personality with what he unintentionally stood as a symbolism for. (And stirring up some bad memories but that's a different topic to go to another day.)

Getting to the top of Hollywood likely took some parts of John's compassion away, if not entirely. (What little there was or remains, doesn't matter. He's a pompous difficult person by the time we get to him in the game.) And it's likely he stepped on some people at some point. Whether he did that reluctantly or purposely (if you characterize him like that), it's likely that some people got destroyed on his way to the top.

Imagine living in the world of IEYTD, enjoying pieces of media that get overshadowed by the mainstream. Imagine Phoenix finding out their favorite recreation spots were taken over by Juniper's productions to make more theaters so more people can watch his films. (For some Phoenixes, you can also explore how some people praise John Juniper while also deriding local productions. If you know, you know.)

Can you imagine the emotional turmoil that can happen in that situation? Not seeing John as a person but as a figurehead of a situation near and dear to one's heart?

The isolation of seeing things differently from so many people, even your handler. The possibility of purposely not watching any of his films out of spite? The headcanon that Phoenix knew John Juniper was evil from the start because they were aware of how shady the entertainment industry can be?

Someone please hear me out because I feel like this is a mostly unexplored aspect of John Juniper and Agent Phoenix's relationship.

Someone please write the emotional fallout of this relationship. Because it'll be an interesting story.

[wyvchard]

Another Hear Me Out (I have no idea where I'm going with this)

But what if Agent Phoenix is older than Reginald?

I know the vast majority of interpretations of Agent Phoenix tends to skew younger due to the audience, but can you imagine how much experience an Agent Phoenix in their late 40s to early 50s has? (Everyone's interpretation is valid, this is just a thought experiment.)

Assuming the theorized timeline's correct, this would put them in the right age to serve in WWII, which is one of the possible situations Reginald dealt with in his time as a field agent.

And in some dialogue, Reginald seems to talk about the agent's history like they've known each other for years with some dialogue, like that one about the messy hair from the third game IIRC.

His early game shrugging off of danger can now be interpreted as "we'll make light of this grim situation because we both lost too much and admitting how messed up this is would hurt more" instead of Reginald being dismissive towards new agents.

In this light, Phoenix might actually have volunteered to try out the new TK implants first to likely protect the younger agents from any risks because of that brain surgery.

The possible interpretations within this change could be huge. After all, depending on how you view John's age, Phoenix could view him as a kid still. Roxana's talk about legacy and leaving something behind? If they're the same age, it's less about "continuing to the next generation" but more on "use this to make sure the next generation still thrives".

It can also explain why Phoenix has the option of sitting in the missions, because standing can be quite tiring as one gets older. And the emphasis on "your mind is the best weapon"? What better way to prove it with an agent who uses their mind to keep up with the advancing tech?

(This is totally not me thinking about my Agent Phoenix's pa being the one to stop the death engine instead of them because he didn't choose to leave the agency. Totally.)

[agent-calivide]

Yap session unlocked

It depends on many factors. For instance, following American history because it’s what’s off the top of my noggin, OSHA wasn’t founded until 1970, and thus the idea of worker safety policies weren’t quite as standardized. Similarly, child labor wasn’t illegal until 1938, and by proxy there’s a good chance that management/directors lived through that era, especially if the EOD was founded as simply an Operatives Division before Prism came along (implied by Handler’s “when I was an agent, we had to pick up things the old fashioned way” comments) so the higher ups likely wouldn’t be too sentimental about worker safety.

What I’m getting at with all that is that the concept of labor laws and regulations kind of existed, but they weren’t nearly as prevalent as they are today since the games take place in 1967-68. Work culture was different, the way employers could treat their employees was different, the safety regulations were far more sparse.

But even if we don’t want to follow a governmental system since the EOD’s kind of nebulously non-governmental, the long and short answer is yes and no.

The EOD likely follows training similar to the military or bomb defusing (or health care fun fact), where you are rigorously trained on how to not die, how to operate in high stakes situations, and are given a heads up ahead of time that this job comes with a lot of risk that more than likely will get you hurt or killed. It’s specifically training to minimize the risk of an agent being killed or maimed preemptively. While it’s a bit of a joke, “I Expect You to Die” is the mantra of the games and likely is something kind of beat into the agents’ heads. Not literally, but subconsciously.

Between the training and the workplace culture, an agent coming in screaming “I ALMOST DIED, I’M SUING THIS PLACE” would likely get a “……well duh” from their peers. Because of that social pressure, the agents probably don’t make much of a fuss of the risks regardless, because they don’t want to be the drama queen that causes a scene. Presto, social shaming takes care of that problem for management.

Plus I’m not even sure how you’d sue an entity like the EOD- they aren’t loyal to any government is specific-

This is all wild speculation of course, but it’s what makes sense to me

realistically would the agency actually use their budjet to save dying agents? or would they be like oh well, you signed a contract, ya cant sue us if you survive. plus youre legally binded to this company.

[sweetstwawbewwymilk]

I've seen the idea drift around the fandom that we should never find out who Doctor Zor is, because their anonymity is their greatest appeal and why they're so scary, and I totally agree... with one exception.

Can you come up with a better punishment?

Imagine if Agent Phoenix, or some other agent, just Kills Zor in their lair. Yes, they're dead, but they die in darkness. Their secrets die with them, but Their mystique, their omnipresence, their inhuman fear lives on.

But what if, at the end of it all, when Zor looks up at Phoenix holding them at gunpoint, and they tell them that they have them beat, they won, they can finish what they started...

Phoenix doesn't pull the trigger.

Doctor Zor cannot die to a bullet.

Instead, they drag Zor, kicking and screaming, out of their Lair. Out of the darkness, across the paths of everyone who ever feared them, and into the light.

And the illusion shatters.

They're dragged out, into the public eye, in front of international court, into the daylight.

Their face, once as unknowable and ever-shifting as a God's, is plastered on every newspaper and television broadcast in the world.

The once mighty mastermind, who existed everywhere and nowhere at once, is made human.

That is how you kill Doctor Zor.

[neurotonic]

splurging abt this bc…. idk i want to. as much as i like to play around with potential animosity between prism and solaris, they’re such similar people, and i think deep down the both of them have a strange sort of fondness for the other in the sense that they can see themselves in each other…

as tough as i like to think solaris can be on prism, i think most of that- whether she knows it or not- stems from prism’s compassion and vulnerability. she’s a lover at her core, and solaris can’t imagine being that kind of person without getting hurt, or scathed, or trampled by the world. seeing prism be so whimsical is… unnerving. it’s not safe for her, and she doesn’t understand it.

meanwhile, i think prism is the exact opposite with solaris. she’s seen what happens when she lets her rage consume her… it got her working with zoraxis, inevitably being betrayed, ruining what she spent her life working towards, sending her spiraling into her grief�� she can only imagine how angry and tired solaris is. how much the world hurt her. she wants to coax her out of her shell… mellow her out so things don’t become worse than they have to be.

but. you know. it’s hard to wrap their minds around each other’s viewpoints… and it turns into this strange messy friendship that the other is always misconstruing as an attack on their carefully crafted character

foirst of all you're always welcome to splurge in my inbox no matter what. second of all i really . really really like this interpretation of their characters... I've definitely thought about how similar they are in terms of experiences before, it's just how they end up interpreting their experiences and their general outlook in life has them acting very differently from one another... and like you said, even the smallest nudge in the opposite direction their fates would have been closer to the other's. Is Foil the right term for them...??

Which is why I really like the idea of them meeting and trying to work with their differing viewpoints ... Gotta be honest I haven't done much of that recently. sniff...those engineers sure can be a mirror of themselves yayyayy!!

The similarities get to them, I think, because sometimes they don't understand why they still couldn't get along most of the time?? It's a strange experience yet. I feel like they could complement each other's flaws by filling in a new perspective. and I always love that contrast between dynamics. The more they hang around each other I feel like they could appreciate each other's company. Even though they're still steadfast with their viewpoints (another similarity between them, I think it's not easy to make them discard their core beliefs)

Well. Anyways. I think this is social enrichment for them. Not romantic not platonic but a secret third thing (we're two sides of the same coin and we both don't know how to feel about that)

[agent-calivide]

Not to get on my "Juniper would live" soap box, more specifically the fall didn't kill him soap box but like

this is what's beneath the catwalk. is there a chance he'd slot right down that crack between the missile and the floor paneling, yes. But he also fell horizontally

so unless those panels worked as a slide to send him vertical again straight down that hole, he'd probably just fall to the floor below.

That being said, he was electrocuted and presumably unconscious before the missile went off, which would have cooked him alive. But like it wouldn't be the fall that killed him probably.

Anywhoozles, feel free to use this observation for any "Juniper lives" shenanigans, just something I spotted during a replay.

[stellar-collective]

ooh ooh actually!! Juniper knew FULL WELL that they were going to escape. in his villain monologue, he says straight up “i don’t expect you to understand, i expect you to— well, frankly i expect you to find a way out. but you’ll be too late!”

Juniper was cocky. he just needed to stall Phoenix for long enough that he could finish the peace summit, and to his credit, it came within an INCH of working. but here’s the thing:

it wasn’t his plan.

yes, we could say that he has some fondness for Agent Phoenix. thrill of the chase and all. it’s implied that for all his roles, he’s never gotten to be a real, hammy villain before, but here’s the thing: Juniper does NOT see Phoenix as a co-star. he doesn’t see them as a nemesis, even though that’s absolutely what they are, he sees them an an extra, a bug that keeps flying into frame and ruining the shot. (at least, that’s what the Juniper we see believes. he’s probably just mad that Phoenix is more talented than he is and is therefore pretending not to care)

as far as what he directly tells us in the games lines, he WANTS Phoenix dead. he wanted to do it offscreen; in a plane, in a van, somewhere it didn’t matter bc they didn’t matter. once again, i doubt that that’s how he feels internally, but that’s the persona he put on and he always commits to the character.

the person who actually wanted Phoenix to escape, no question about it? Zor. Zor insisted on the camera, the footage, the ultimate means of escape for Phoenix. Zor got rid of Juniper as soon as Phoenix bested him. if you fail in the disarming, they sound disappointed. if you succeed, they address you directly. and the exact same thing happens in the next game!

so basically it’s all Zor’s fault actually

thinking about john juniper again

very rambly so im putting it under the cut

Its the fact that in the second game, this man decided that Phoenix, the very same person he named because of their ability to essentially rise from the dead, known to escape anything, can be left alone in a laser trap whilst he goes to the peace summit

juniper is a little incompetent and prideful, but I'd think he'd know better than to leave phoenix alone; well, I think he'd know better than to leave the drill/scredriver/laser thing in such an easily accessible location.

he knows who phoenix is-- thats the real kicker

maybe, just maybe, theres some shred of humility within him because of this

did he want pheonix to escape? I feel like there may be a possiblity-- he has titled himself as 'the worlds greatest actor', after all. perhaps he was so insistent on the idea that phoenix would escape and they wouldn't be directly killed by him

I mean, i can sense a little bit of fondness between the two-- sorta like, a thrill of the chase dynamic (junipers just living the pipe dream of being some sorta evil nemesis-- I like to think he always liked playing the villain in some movies he'd been cast in) And, like, he seemed so surprised when phoenix showed up

I mean, if juniper wanted phoenix dead, why not kill them there? If he wanted to keep them captured, why not take them to the peace summit (imagine that haha <- not-so-subtle plug for one of my fics [listen, i was thinking about that fic before typing this out in a haze, okay? /vsilly]) He could've exposed the agency's involvement and make phoenix an example-- y'know, show them how serious he was

basically, juniper liked phoenix and wanted them to escape

[stellar-collective]

Opinion on Ricardo Morales?

ooh… my opinion on this guy is… ehh, complicated? we have so little info on him that i don’t want to jump the gun on making assumptions, but tbh… i don’t trust him.

i don’t think that he’s actively malicious, not by a long shot. i mean, as far as we know, he’s at least TRYING, and that counts for a lot against an opponent like Doctor Zor, but he’s certainly got his fair share of faults. most of what we know about his character comes from his interactions with Prism, and he sure as heck did not handle that situation well even a little bit. did he MEAN to drive Prism out of the Agency? i doubt it. is that what happened? yes. and i think that he is fully capable of doing the same to Agent Phoenix. (it’s lightly implied he already did that to another head agent, after all. at the very least, he didn’t help) would he? i don’t know, probably not, but i believe he could, which makes him dangerous

i have my fair share of theories on the subject, but i feel that Morales may be an evolved version of Reginald from the first game: obviously he doesn’t WANT anyone to die, but… he’s expecting it. so he doesn’t care as much as he should, and that hurts people. if presented the choice (and idk if he will be, i don’t have the faintest idea where the series is going next) i think he could just as easily throw us to the wolves or become a true and vital ally that helps finish this for good and all. i don’t really have enough info to form a more solid opinion tho lol

[mothbeasts]

i miss posting and making and engaging with ieytd content but I will be honest sometimes it feels alienating. as a lesbian.

[wyvchard]

Random IEYTD Theory / Headcanon

Dr. Zor targeted Dr. Prism after Agent Phoenix managed to get Anna Ulanova out of Zoraxis.

Something about it being an unspoken narrative parallel might be fun.

With Anna being able to essentially sabotage Zor's biggest project, why not sabotage the greatest mind of the agency as a form of revenge?

(Explanation under cut)

If the timeline stands that Cog in the Machine takes place in September (or shortly after Spy and the Liar), then Zor starting to get into the agency around November the year before (based on the date of Operation: First Class) would give them enough time to: 1. find insiders to slowly sabotage Dr. Prism's work and sheets (I'm still in the camp that believes she was set up in that presentation.) 2. give Dr. Prism enough time between retirement and showing off her new loyalty without tipping the agency off and 3. create a plot that would weaponize Dr. Prism's research.

I doubt Zor would allow Dr. Prism to miss the first batches of check ins. After all, they don't want the agency to be suspicious. She had to keep up appearances at first before going missing.

There's also some logistical stuff that needs to be considered. After all, Dr. Prism was the head of R&D. The retirement of a department head is a big deal. It's not something she can easily quit. There had to have been some sort of transition period.

She had to have passed her responsibilities to someone else. That person seemed to be implied to be a certain Eugene (maybe a Dr. Floyd refered to in the radio transmissions is the same person), someone she described as "the worst" and not to be trusted with giving more implants to more agents if her note / retirement letter is to be believed.

In Blind Spot, Reginald remarks "either you're really strong or that steering wheel is not attached correctly" when the steering wheel popped off. And in Cold Shoulder, he also admits that the agency's track record with inventions has been "less than stellar since Dr. Prism left". This is coming from the man who laughed off Zor's assassins coming to you; it had to have been really bad for him to say that. But some parts still remain functional and the agency seem to be recovering enough from her loss to somewhat create a shield generator fairly quickly (but not to her capabilities yet).

Even if Spy and the Liar took place within a week, setting up a factory will take time. (Especially if she is alone as implied.) And especially an underwater lab.

And in the introduction to Hot Water, Reginald also mentioned that a couple of months ago, an agent had a similar blackout we had in Not a Dril. This means that KBOOM's experiments had been in the works for that long.

Just thinking of the right spot of when Dr. Prism quit since it likely had to have been a pretty quick time frame, but not too quick that it doesn't give Zor a chance to breathe. After all, one can only have so many plans to go through at once.

[sunniiskies]

I love you jet set

John Juniper in all of Jet Set:

[the-valiant-valkyrie]

me seeing the name of a machine when its creator is not at all relevant to the discussion or even mentioned by name

[ellascreams]

I’m a poet and I’m bored, I’m going to over analyze the lyrics of the I Expect You To Die 2 opening credits. Spoilers. (Note, I couldn’t actually find the official lyrics anywhere, so the placement of the line breaks are sort of just me guessing. It shouldn’t affect my analysis much but it might annoy some people.)

From the spotlight I can see you Play your cards right, Kill your stage fright, This could be you Murder pun! Huge fan of the ABAAB rhyme scheme btw. I think this could definitely be a reference to how Zoraxis immediately knows that you’re involved, you get noticed in Stage Fright, which is when Juniper is literally in the spotlight. Juniper is also the one who first figures out you’re the agent from the Death Engine.

To me the most notable thing is that it immediately established the fact that the entire world is focused on Juniper, but he’s the only one focused on you, even more than the other Zoraxis agents are. It also foreshadows Phoenix’s rise to fame. Juniper is a celebrity, the whole world is focused on him, but if you play your cards right and stop his evil scheme he falls out of the public’s view while you suddenly become famous for saving everyone.

If all the world’s a stage, let’s set it on fire So you’ll be the spy and I’ll be the liar

Moving on to a simple couplet, AA rhyme scheme. The imagery of the first line is absolutely sick and I love it. There’s the obvious meaning in this line of Juniper’s evil plans, emphasized by the music video’s visuals of the nukes. Digging a little deeper, I think it’s interesting that Juniper really does seem to think of the world as a stage. He thinks of himself as the star and Phoenix as an extra, he thinks of his plans as scripts, his lies as roles, it’s his real egotistical view of the world around him and it’s what Zor exploits to get him to do what they want.

From the background You can hear me Highest billing, Makes a killing, They revere me

Switching to more of a ABCCB now but I don’t mind. Another murder pun! I honestly love those. Paralleling the first verse, once again calling attention to the fact that you’re hiding in the background while Juniper hides in plain sight, this also parallels Juniper noticing you. He’s paying attention to you more than anyone else is, and you see him for who he truly is more than anyone else does. You’re both aware of each other and you both know each other.

That beautiful mask you wear is all I desire So you’ll be the spy and I’ll be the liar

Great imagery once again. One thing they put a lot of emphasis on in this game (or at least the song and trailers) is the fact that spies are inherently liars or at the very least disguised. As he’ll mention more in some later lines, Juniper wants to defeat you, partially by getting past those disguises and lies. They’re your main defense. Once they’re gone he’ll have a better shot at winning.

He mostly just wants to destroy your disguises, but the video does show him stealing a mask, I think that’s because he can also use them to an extent. With the mimic mask, people’s faces become his masks. He uses the Handler’s voice to trick you. He could maybe use your voice and face to trick someone else. At the very least, something or someone in the Agency would probably be useful to him.

Face to face to face again

Because you’re both two faced. Probably my favorite line, it’s just such fun wordplay.

And through the camera lenses we ascend

This line could be taken a few different ways I think? First of all, it’s just cool imagery again. Secondly, it could be taken as breaking through lies. By breaking the camera lens, which would also be breaking through the fourth wall, you’re breaking through the unreality that is trapping you. As I mentioned earlier, Juniper really views the world as just another stage, so this could also definitely represent breaking through his plans and lies.

The final thing I noticed is the use of the word “ascend.” English as a language tends to view being placed higher, or at the top, as good while being placed lower, at the bottom, is bad. There’s a whole bunch of phrases related to it. It’s one of those little quirks of language. My point is that “ascending,” getting higher, can be seen as some sort of victory or success. This is somewhat emphasized by the music itself, with the instruments from the success score playing, and the actual success score itself being played a bit later.

I also think it’s worth quickly mentioning that these different meaning aren’t mutually exclusive. A line can mean several different things at once, that’s part of the beauty of poetry and language.

You’re a minor part I’m the major star Ha! The credits are more than just the end

Once again with him thinking of the world as a stage, thinking he’s the star, the most important person in the whole world, while you’re just an extra. As he says “the end” the success theme plays, which is just a neat detail, and it could be connected to the “ascend” line as I mentioned earlier. I also think it’s important that it plays while he’s talking about credits and endings, since that theme plays at the end of successful missions.

I might be overthinking it here but I also think this whole verse has some parallels to his monologue. You properly meet face to face for kind of the first time actually, you break through his film set, then there’s the obvious one of him calling himself the star and saying you’re just an extra, and then he calls the peace summit your final scenes but they’re just the beginning of Zor’s rule.

Cause the truth is I despise you I will tear apart All these works of art That disguise you

Love this verse. The voice actor is absolutely great by the way. When he says “I despise you” it really sounds like he means it. Juniper really does despise you too. That’s one of the things that makes him such a fun villain to me, he truly hates you, possibly even more than Zor and Prism hate you, because they at least respect you as a skilled adversary. Juniper doesn’t. He thinks you’re pathetic but you somehow keep messing up his plans anyway. To him, you’re like a pesky fly that won’t stop buzzing around his head and tripping him up.

This is also furthering the themes of the second chorus. Being a spy as you are, you’re protected mostly by disguises. He wants to destroy those disguises. He wants to tear apart the things that protect you. And this is once again described using masks because the mask imagery really is so central to Juniper’s character.

I’m making the final cut, it’s down to the wire So you’ll be the spy and I’ll be the liar And I’ll be the liar And I’ll be the liar And I’ll be the liar!

Another potential parallel to safe and sound, I think he quite literally tries to make “the final cut” once you burn down the set. I think now’s the best time to talk about the repeating phrase, the game’s namesake, “you’ll be the spy and I’ll be the liar.” I especially like the fact that the final verse puts extra emphasis on the liar part, because that’s ultimately the game’s main theme, lies and breaking through them.

From what I can tell, even the puzzle solving in this game has a lot more emphasis on seeing through lies and people actively trying to trip you up then the others. Like Jet Set, where you have to actively ignore almost everything Juniper tells you to avoid the death traps, or the notes the Fabricator left telling you to just “enjoy the show” in Stage Fright, you even have to distrust your Handler in Safe and Sound.

One very important thing for this theme is the parallels between Phoenix and John Juniper. They’re both liars hiding behind various disguises. That’s again represented by the gameplay, you go undercover fairly often. The big difference is just that Phoenix hides in the shadows and Juniper hides in the spotlight.

This theme and parallel is also super noticeable in the last level, Rising Phoenix. In order to stop Juniper, Phoenix has to reveal themself to the world. In the end, all the lies and disguises are gone from the EOD and Zoraxis, but for the EOD it’s mostly a good thing, and it’s very bad for Zoraxis. This is also when Phoenix sort of takes Juniper’s fame. And there’s another layer to the lies with Zor’s betrayal.

Wow ok so I went off on a tangent there. I just wanted to fully explain myself because it seems like a lot of people don’t understand the title. I think the repetition and connection of the spy and the liar helps showcase those parallels. The way it’s used makes it almost sounds like a common phrase, but it’s not, and that makes you stop to think what makes spies and liars related to each other. How are they similar? How are they different?

I like how in the song Juniper specifically says “you’ll be the spy and I’ll be the liar.” It reminds me of agreeing on roles before acting out an improv scene together or something similar. It once again highlights Juniper’s view of the world. In the title, and in most of the song and game, it acts like spy and liar are what you both truly are. What’s left when you take away all the lies. But with Juniper telling you that these are the roles you’ll be playing, it adds another layer of doubt and disguise. Are you really just the spy and the liar? Maybe. But maybe it’s just another act.

[warriorend-2]

ok ok since i can't be stupid and gay all the time (<- college student)

putting this shit under a cut bc while it's mostly just me rambling it's. spoiler heavy. & also wound up being 1600 words. sorry

1: possibly the most glaring thing, which makes me doubt the Phantom being a lot of otherwise-possible candidates, is that they would have to be very good at infiltration

-I presume Roxana didn't put the medal in her computer herself, which means whoever did put it there had to get in after she left, get into the computer without waking up Robutler, modify it to put it there, & put everything back (mostly) the way it was & leave a combination. granted maybe they just gave the medal to Roxana to put in there, but like. why

-getting it into that spot in the mines wouldn't have been too hard i don't think, just. knowing where the mine is and then sneaking in during off-duty hours (...assuming those happen)

-tbh the one in blind spot is probably the easiest to place given that it's just behind a license plate, & cars do have to stop sometimes even if it's not often

-i'm. not sure how they got the medal into hot water though. i'm guessing they snuck it in among the materials? (the other option here is that Zor had a hand in getting it there, which opens up a whole other can of worms so i'm not gonna. think about that one too hard)

-the one in cold shoulder is also not too hard to see it getting there. i would laugh if they had to make a mold of that little compartment & then make a block of ice for it though.

-the one in kboom is where i'm like. OK this facility is presumably not super new but it's also not super old given its current purpose. it may have been repurposed but still. how did they get the medal where it is and then also tag the bucket. the volcano doesn't look like it's horribly far away from shore (in the ending credits) but (also i'm aware the medal shouldn't even be able to be where it is but. yknow.)

and odds are that it doesn't matter that much, i'm just. they had a little safe set up in the control point already, they had access to the pneumatic tubes, etc. if the locations have any bearing and aren't just "here's somewhere to stick this puzzle that would be hard to figure out", then that implies some Shit about the phantom (& possibly also their allies. if they have any. if they do I highly doubt they're Agency-related.). given where the phantom gets to i am somewhat leaning towards the idea it may be V. Vitti (also the. insignia), given that we've seen the sort of places Agent Phoenix gets into (...seat of power) & so

2: Zor's goals feel a lot more on a personal bent this game, not just irt destroying the Agency but also. destroying the kinesium & anything that uses it. so whatever their reason, it seems to be a lot more personal (+ they actively Address the player more often, which could be Phoenix's infamy but also in the other games they were barely present, both in terms of voicelines & actual like. Story Push. they were a very passive supervillain in the other games, is what i'm saying)

which leads me up to like. we all know characters can lie, & in this series it's kinda expected, but. idk. i keep circling back to the shield generator. & the lava generators being accessible from Phoenix's cabin, but not the one Roxana was in. & Phoenix's cabin seemingly having all this shit that the others didn't have, & it could have been a tactical choice on Phoenix's part, but.

i mean. Zor does definitely say they want you dead, but they don't say it directly a whole lot (iirc they say "kill you and Prism" but otherwise they don't directly address the player in death threats, it's usually just. agents, plural. or "whatever end you meet" which is also a threat but is vague)

which just. why is Agent Phoenix still alive? Game design aside, of course. It wouldn't be much of a game if the villain kills you in the first level, after all.

But it feels, to me, like the weaknesses are far too glaring to be just missed over, especially in 3, because. if they want you dead that badly, why. why leave things so safe?

Hot Water is one i wind up on a lot, because you could chalk things up to being deathtraps, but Ollie knew about the gas and the grenade trap, & seemed completely unfazed by them (& kinda implied that's just How It Is for new folks), so they're not necessarily targeted, it's just standard practice. Putting aside the fact that even if they were intended to be deathtraps, they're so. Mild. to put it bluntly. Zor knows Phoenix by this point, knows the shit they've pulled & survived, a gas trap & a grenade in a vending machine feel very. yknow. that's like throwing a rock at the back of someone's head, comparatively

and then the KBOOM demo & the shield generator, both explicitly left for you to see. & it's a pretty 1-to-1 comparison for how the actual KBOOM mission goes, except for the telekinesis save at the end. the squid gets involved, but for the most part, considering it's a lab Zor loosely implies they were at, the security is very. lax. & everything is accessible to the "new hire", popsicle-ID necessity aside. (also apparently Ollie has been down there a while, given he doesn't seem to. know about the whole "world domination" thing. which is Eerie because if that's the case then how long exactly has the whole Kinesium thing been a plan?)

to me. & it has felt like this since the end of the second game. When Zor says they want you dead, there's a whole host of unstated conditions to that, which they would be good at given the whole CEO thing.

"I want you dead if you aren't good enough at your job to survive" sort of deal. which also lines in nicely with how they seem to be as an Actual Boss. of course, they never say the second part out loud, but. short of them just being Really Smart in a lot of cases (failsafe in Juniper's mask, leading Roxana along long enough to get her research & then trying to kill her, etc) but Really Dumb in others (leaving the shield generator, making the squid the only real danger to Phoenix down there, not having any failsafes to make sure the missiles launch at the end of 2 even if the briefcase is compromised (or just not using them), etc), it's like. the ways their plans get foiled at the end of 2 & 3 feels intentional.

plus you could make the argument that Roxana was also being used to lead Phoenix along until they were where Zor wanted them, at which point both of what they were using her for (Kinesium research, kite Phoenix around until they're in position, even if that second one wasn't in the deal) was done & they could get rid of her without feeling bad.

would stopping KBOOM have been possible without Roxana's help? Dunno. Not the way it's presented in-game, because in-game she was also instrumental to stopping it.

i'm also going to briefly play semantics for a second. i'm not sure i consider "even the great Agent Phoenix will eventually burn out" to be a threat because. that's what phoenixes do. They burn, and then they come back. Sometimes it takes a while, but. if i'm not just thinking about semantics Way Too Hard, the wording of "burn out" suggests something far different than "die". combining that with Zor talking about the Agency like That, & the Phantom (at least vaguely) implying prior experience with the Agency, & realizing that their involvement would cost them their life, makes me think. maybe "burn out" isn't a threat of death, but a threat of something about Phoenix changing soon. Maybe as a result of almost dying. "burn out" is also used for like. becoming exhausted, stopping trying, & maybe that too. who knows. i don't, i'm not on the dev team, i'm just some 21 year old chewing on semantics.

at the end of the day, my current standing on Theories is. hard to sum up but i will do my best. o7

-The phantom is probably one of a very small handful of candidates, & I'm leaning towards it being V. Vitti or maybe possibly Zor in a funny hat.

-Zor is trying to kill Phoenix, but not inescapably. maybe they're testing Phoenix, maybe they're just trying to almost-kill Phoenix enough times they get tired of the Agency and fuck off so Zor can do the whole "world domination" thing (which i am not. wholly convinced they actually are after.)

-summing those two up made me think of something else. perhaps the Phantom was also testing Phoenix in a roundabout way, by seeing if they could survive everything else, because they only show up in the third game. Their note opening with "it seems you're as good as they say" indicates they are at least familiar with Phoenix & their reputation, albeit maybe not directly (if it is Vitti, i doubt she would have access to Agency knowledge, but post-Rising Phoenix, once the rumors started getting out...)

-this is a silly theory i like to throw around in my head, but i'm very fond of it, so: the "death room" you go to after dying in a mission may not necessarily always indicate Actual Death. in some cases, yes, but in other cases. idk. i've always gotten more the vibe of having been captured as opposed to outright killed (although being able to respawn does throw a wrench in there, but oh well. game has to be a game & all)