#they're both valid directing choices and they both get to the same point just in slightly different ways!!!

[liedownquisition]

Ah I see, so you just... don't actually understand that the way you phrase things imply things. Cool. Got it. That explains your own difficulty understanding the text, got it.

Also, no you're not really explaining it, and even if you were no one was asking for that "explanation" in the first place. Read the first post again, you'll notice the operative phrase "a lot of people" and this is specifically directed at things like people who complain/hate on Jason Todd, while adoring other characters who share a lot of significant themes, personality characteristics, and concepts with him.

It also, most 100% definitely says that that dislike is valid? But this is about people and things that complain about Jason for things that are DEFINITELY prevalent also in the characters that they do "stan." Such as Batman, or Huntress, and so on and so forth. It's kind of like this:

Where people prop up their character for doing the same things, which funny thing is usually more common with female characters on the negative end of it so this is a somewhat interesting, if still exhausting, subversion of a very boring and repetitive issue.

Anyways you also missed the part where we both agreed that Jason was an extension of the same philosophy - yes, that even includes the fascist portions. (Bitter even Literally Also Called Jason Fascist). A vast majority of the superhero fantasy at its core cannot exist without some degrees of it, particularly once it starts expanding into the kind of universe DC currently has. Come on, the watchtower? Brother Eye? Are these not sparking red flags in your mind? And who, exactly, is responsible for them?

Batman.

Also, Batman has been called fascist multiple times even in-canon and spin-off properties. Usually by Green Arrow, or in that Blue Beetle movie. They're not wrong, but no one takes Green Arrow seriously about it and the Blue Beetle line was framed as a joke for the audience to laugh at.

-He asked Bruce why he wouldn't, and when Bruce gave his answer he... "accepted" it and asked him to stand by and let him do it himself. If you wanted to illustrate the point of Jason asking Bruce to kill the Joker, maybe you should have picked the pages right before this where he was going on, at length, about the reasons WHY Bruce should have? Instead of the one where he literally said "Fine, I'll do it"? The page that literally says, twice, "You won't kill him, I will." And even then, that speech was less asking him to do it and more condemning him for his choices.

He didn't say "Don't" he said "Won't" the time is long since past for Bruce to be the one to pull that trigger. If he was trying to get Bruce to kill Joker, he didn't try very hard.

-That's fine not to reread, but you're clearly not remembering a lot of it or went into it with such a biased perspective you weren't paying attention (which, you know, it's a bad comic I can't entirely blame people from missing things. But again, at least hate things accurately?). Kori had more character and development than Roy did, actually. At least in the parts Lobdell wrote. I still haven't decided how to classify Tynion's portion of that mess. It gives me a headache.

-I never said Jason was a better Batman, I said that his ideals of "wanting to be a better Batman" means that his ultimate motivation is just an extremist version of Bruce's own. Once again: that means that if Batman is a fascist, then so is Jason. Albeit one that operates outside the overarching fascist system Bruce aligns with and attempts to build his own, equally flawed system

-Do you realize how many poor people literally kill themselves to get out of medical debt because they cannot find work and see themselves as just burdens to themselves and sometimes their families? Do you know how common it is for people to realize they need expensive medical care and ask their families to let them die instead for the same reason and how that's not really that far off from killing yourself for it? Do you even understand how much poor people who can't afford insurance just don't go to the hospital and die of preventable/fixable things because they're afraid of medical bills? Have you been paying no attention whatsoever to how even with insurance it's a huge issue to not get medical care because it gets denied and would be too expensive without it which is a RELEVANT and RECENT topic of concern?

It's still a death, it's just one that you can pretend didn't spiral from the initial incident. Slow, and agonizing, and you're going to suffer and know what caused it the whole way while Batman remains blissfully ignorant of his responsibility in your suffering.

And, with regards to your tags: Hi! Not only Have I been affected by organized crime, My family was part of, and torn apart by it. Speaking of putting words in our mouths, when did we say it was okay for him to kill "bad poor people"? We didn't. And Bruce Beating and Throwing "bad poor people" in jail doesn't help their families either! I've said it before but if Bruce was paying attention to the families of the criminals he & the system he supports put in jail and doing anything about it, chances are Jason wouldn't have ended up homeless in the first place!

"It's okay to prey on addicts as long as they're not kids" we ALSO didn't say that but do you know what happens when you cut addicts off cold turkey? I've known people who were in so much pain from the cravings that they were tearing out their hair and chunks of their scalp and digging their nails into their arms so hard they bled. I have known people who had seizures during withdrawals and hit their head going down and died because no one knew it was happening. I have known people who got arrested and thrown in jail and died in their cells because they were left to go through the withdrawals with no assistance.

Cutting the drug lines entirely isn't the answer, either. Preventing them from getting more kids hooked on drugs is the bare minimum. It's not an endpoint, it's a beginning.

To be honest I think that a lot of people who share the anti Jason Todd sentiment don't even actually hate Jason. I think a lot of them hate what he forces the narrative to do.

Jason forces the subversion of the hero genre -- he's the single, most extreme proof that Batman's hero fantasy wouldn't be effective in real life, and therefore Jason showing up can take you out of the universe really fast really hard. A lot of people are here for what comics are meant to offer, the one man hero fantasy that makes you Feel Good, and Jason showing up doesn't Allow you to enjoy it! And if that's the case, you're completely justified in not liking Jason, he takes you out of the thing you enjoy.

I think a lot of you don't actually find his personality or acts annoying in of themselves, you just hate what those actions do to the genre itself. And I think once you realize that and start looking at comics like actual pieces of literature, Jason and shitty comics both will become a lot less rage inducing to you.

[notafragilething]

Late Night Buck & Tommy Rambles Bonus Content: My First Theory of the Year!

If you missed it, I posted my first ramble of the season here where I went over Tim's most recent interviews and some predictions based on those vibes.

But I have also developed a theory. One that is probably wrong but makes sense in my brain based on this behind-the-scenes clip from a few weeks back along with everything I talked about in the main post.

And I need to share this and get other people's opinions because it's been consuming my thoughts all day.

Basically in that clip you see Chimney and Buck run down the stairs and Eddie take the fireman's pole while lights are going off indicating an emergency. However, instead of running to the truck you see Buck run in the opposite direction (past Chimney and Eddie) who stand there looking confused for a moment before running to the trucks. The emergency vehicles than all proceed to leave without Buck.

The only way I could see Buck taking off like that during an active emergency is if someone important to him was in danger. Removing everyone actively working at the 118 during this scene, that basically leaves Christopher, Bobby, Maddie, Jee-Yun or Tommy.

I'm immediately ruling out Christopher both because he's not in town and no way would Eddie stay behind. He'd be out the door before Buck. I'm also ruling out Maddie and Jee-Yun for the same reasons because that same can be said for Chimney in this scene. He wouldn't be sticking around either. I also feel like if Bobby was in danger you'd see a bigger reaction form ALL of the 118. Which leaves the most logical choice being Tommy.

There's a lot of ways it could play out where Tommy gets hurt, is in danger or Buck simply thinks he is (we know the 217 responds to an emergency with the 118, it seems like there will be an airplane emergency so a helicopter crash isn't out of the realm of possibilities either, etc.) That part isn't important but the outcome is.

So here is how I think the Buck and Tommy storyline may potentially play out in the first three episodes of the seasons based on the previous stated interviews and this scene (with my assumption that Tommy is a likely person he's rushing off for).

I think the season will start with Buck and Tommy being together but less defined. They're happy together and a couple but things haven't got serious yet. They're just happy and into each other.

Cue, at some point in the opening arc, Tommy getting hurt or Buck thinking that happened. He's already having a rough time with Gerrard but now Tommy's hurt or in danger. I 100% could see Buck taking off for Tommy because narratively that would just add fuel to the fire with the conflict between him and Gerrard (and would give Gerrard a valid reason to penalize Buck because taking off during an active emergency is probably frowned upon).

But Buck picks going after Tommy because of course he does. He wouldn't be Buck if he wasn't reckless and put others in front of himself.

Tommy obviously ends up being okay but I could see this being the catalyst for Buck realizing oh shit I have big feelings for this man. Like omg I'm falling in love with him feelings. Which, narratively, works to progress their relationship into a more serious one that the audience will now be invested in because we saw this big, grand moment.

It would also have the writers showing, not telling us that the two had progressed from the more casual dating / early rom-com relationship they had in season 7 into something more long-term and serious.

So, what do you think? Am I onto something here or did I just come up with a good fic idea?

[thewomancallednova]

Pen Pals

Oh fuck that was beautiful

shit what was the last episode i called "the best tng episode" yet, cause it might have been dethroned

okay i also gotta say that i have madly misrepresented this episode in the past. Like, in my memory from 15 years ago this episode was "Data makes a pre-warp friend, her home planet is threatened by geology, Picard so we gotta let them die because of the prime directive, but I guess we can make an exception for Data's friend if he insists, and then everyone except Data's friend dies." And that is not at all what happens!

At least up until the "we gotta let them all die" point, because they have a discussion about the prime directive and fate and it's excellent. Geordi, Troi, Data and Pulaski are the pro-saving the planet's people side and Picard, Worf and (weakly) Riker are the anti-saving the planet's people side. And it's a really good discussion. That Picard ends by basically saying "well if we save people from volcanoes, then we'd also have to save them from slavery, and where'd that bring us?" And then Data fucking plays the recording of this ten-year old girl asking for help and everyone gets emotionally affected enough to say fuck the prime directive, let's save these people if we can. And then they do! It's fucking great!

And I love that this gently bends Picard. Like, the Picard of Symbiosis would not have gone for this and the episode doesn't outright changes him, it just nudges him ever so slightly in the right direction to make him a little better. Although yes, it is fucked up that he needed to hear that little girl's pleas for help first. But he got there anyway!

At one point Riker and Troi are walking down the corridor and Troi giggles unprompted and like honestly, yeah same girl.

I forgot Picard's a horsegirl! As if his character wasn't redeemed enough in this episode already!

I also love that Data is entirely driven by emotions here, like literally everything he does in this episode, it's all emotion. Not a "oh in this scene he is clearly happy or heartbroken" or whatever, every single fucking bit from him answering "Is anybody out there" with a "yes" is entirely emotions. Love that for him. I do find it a bit weird that At the end Picard goes all "well you are a bit closer to undersatnding huamnity by experiencing remembrance and regret." Like you wouldn't say that to a child that just had their first friendship break-up or something, right? Like, yes, it's cool that Data got to experience these things for the first time, but it's odd to frame them as steps on the path to humanity, when we would never frame them as such for any other being that experiences them. Data is a human being admit it already you cowards!

Also love that Pulaski is the one to openly acknowledge and validate it! Hell yeah character arcs!

Okay I was so cought up in everything else, but Wesley is great in this too! He has his first "command", leading a team of scientists to analyse the weird shit happening in this sector! And he's a bit insecure about commanding people who are older and more experienced than him, and then Riker gives him a pep talk, and then he gets better at it. Also loved that Wesley immediately questioned the hierarchies in place, good lad, Wes!

When Wesley approaches Riker for help in Ten Forward, Riker tells his companion that it's a "family emergency" and like. I never thought about that. But Riker is like a great ersatz father for Wesley, and a much better choice than Picard (who I think gets stereotyped into the role due to his closeness to Jack and shipping with Beverly. There's even fan theories out there that actually Picard is Wesley's biological father. No idea why, but they're there). Riker's the one who pushes for Wesley to become an acting ensign, he supports him every step of the way, he saves his life in Justice, And they both have some stuff going on with their own fathers (Riker's sucks and Wesley's is dead). Picard shares a connection with Wes' mother and that one conversation about not getting into the Academy first try. Which is nice, but now that I'm looking at it like this I really wanna see more of Riker mentoring Wes.

This is kind of funny to watch post-Discovery, with Saru's backstory basically being similar to Sarjenka's in that they're both from a pre-warp planet and figure out how to communicate with a Starfleet Lieutenant Commander.

Also, this is the longest Trek episode yet, at eight weeks, it's on par with TOS's The Paradise Syndrome.

I think this is also the first notable example of the TNG crew going rogue, with them clearly violating the prime directive, having Riker beam Data down instead of O'Brien, so that only Riker would be implicated in the crime and so on.

Sarjenka really could have used a lesson in internet safety, because you are not supposed to tell strange androids your family details! It could have been Lore instead of Data!

[poledancingghostson]

...what's the point then? What do you think the point is? The only thing Whizzer needs to be is hot. He's meant to be more effeminate than Marvin. That's part of why Marvin feels like he can push all of his misogyny onto him. That's part of why he puts him into a box of traditional femininity and will not let him out of it the whole first act. Marvin makes MULTIPLE comments about Whizzer not passing as straight ("indescrete"), so i would argue that him being at least a bit effeminate is written into the text. Being effeminate and skinny and short do not make Whizzer less conventionally attractive, less athletic, less strong, less ANYTHING that would take away from his written character. And Marvin can be just as insecure while being the taller one in his relationship.

The point of Falsettos is that gender roles are pointless and cruel to everyone involved. Whizzer being effeminate in no way takes away from that because even the most feminine people aren't going to be happy when forced to perform traditionally feminine roles 24/7.

falsettos productions where whizzer is effeminate/thin/shorter than marvin how does it feel to have missed the point entirely

[eddiesheep]

Can I get a fic (preferably stucky lmao) where it's technically classified as 'not Steve Rogers friendly' but instead of succumbing Steve to the terrible mishandling of his character by the MCU, he goes on a self-improvement journey where he acknowledges his massive fuck-ups, goes out of his way to try and heal his friendship with Tony, tries to make it up for his blind devotion to Bucky - by not necessarily claiming that it was wrong for Steve to protect the one man he adores the most, but still acknowledge that the way he went about it was not great and that he harmed many others along the way by putting Bucky above everything else.

Maybe have Bucky and/or Sam be there to support him while still directing him to the right path with their perspectives and make Steve understand things from different points of view.

Idk man, I see discussions about Steve and Tony here all the time, and I hate how ppl treat it like it's black and white.

On one side, we have people who adore Tony but also paint Steve like he's the devil in disguise, like he never cared about anything else other than himself, and is written in 'not Steve friendly' fics as a nasty, fake and insincere person who is constantly up his own ass, pretending to be this symbol of perfection in public, but behind doors he's a hypocrite who judges others based on petty bullshit.

And on the other side, we have those who adore Steve but treat Tony's character with nothing but disdain, describing him as a spoiled man-baby who got everything handed to him, like his character never evolved from the man he was aaaaall the way back in Ironman ONE (the version of him from before he even got kidnapped and held hostage by terrorists). That claim that he's the one who is selfish and up his own ass all the damn time, and - bizarrely - also claim that Tony is just as bad as Howard Stark. (which is just ridiculous, Howard knowingly hired and worked with nazis... guys... come ON)

They're both amazing characters when they're at their best.

Tony finally breaking the chain of abuse from his father and actively trying to be a better man than Howard ever was, striving to make the world a better and safer place with his wealth while dealing with his PTSD at the same time.

Steve having been born as a disabled man in a harsh environment, and yet still standing up to bullies and fighting for those he loves with all his heart (a.k.a his mother Sarah and Bucky) since he was a boy. Him waking up in a new era he has no choice but to adapt to, feeling completely alone with nobody to relate to. (Until Bucky)

Fuck me man, I love them both, why do we need to put a character down to elevate the other? Been reading posts from both sides and they all got valid, amazingly-angrily-passionate takes. Why are we letting the MCU get away with their shitty writing and character assassinations by accepting them? Miss me with that shit lol I love both of my boys. Imma write them paching things up and becoming better people :D

[abyssalpriest]

I think people are so fixated on "there's no right or wrong way to worship gods" to the point they ignore their entire message. It's not black and white, yes. It's an entire rainbow of colours. Saying "there's no right or wrong, it's all right" is saying "there is a right way to do it" - but that aside... It misses its own point, or at least people saying it miss the point of the saying, because the point is there are spectrums at play here. No right or wrong doesn't contradict there being stronger and weaker ways of doing things, or more or less beneficial things, or harder or easier ways, and so on, in fact that's what it's saying - there's a million ways to do this. Pretending that "there's no right or wrong" means "everything is good and right and equal" strips away the intended choice and empower to choose and customise one's path. If being a witch is just as good for every single person as being a devotee is or chasing priesthood is or becoming a spirit worker is and so on, if channelling is equal to getting no messages at all or possession work or merging consciousnesses... There is no point in doing the hard work - which is exactly what is happening nowadays. We're shutting off the awesome results that can only be gotten from awe-inspiring work by calling heavy lifting spirit work the same as a devotee who only has an altar and no real idea if there's a god listening. We don't have to say one is right and the other is wrong to acknowledge there's a difference.

There is no right or wrong way to approach Lev. There are definitely ways that are more or less effective, bond-making, personable, easy, liked/appreciated by both parties, etc. People deserve the freedom and elucidation that discussions on spectrum brings; yes, they deserve to not hear some rando talk about how they're Wrong, but if we completely ignore that some things are more effective, work better for others, and so on... If we treat "there's no right or wrong" as synonymous with "don't say there's a better or worse way to do this for various reasons" we're not equipping anyone with an art and science here, we're equipping them with a way to roleplay a reality in which they already have everything they want just by existing

There isn't a wrong way to approach gods. You may approach them with something they loathe and have them cut you off forever - and then you may find out that that's really good because you had another god waiting to find you this lifetime to work with you and they wouldn't have found you if you hadve gone in that other direction. However... Sitting here acting like the default god etiquette of praising you, acting friendly, showing up where they're needed, and so on because you give them offerings and whatever is an equal relation in terms of efficacy and so on to another art which may involve channelling and possession and heavy deep magics and energy-bonding and so on... The former may be what you need, it may be right, but if we boil it down, one of these paths is not going to give you the same effect as the other even if you need what some people would falsely claim is the "wrong" answer. In this case, for any person, one of these is going to be the better option for you.

We can eliminate right and wrong from our vocabulary, but eliminating the idea that one path is not identical to the other in favour of focusing on an absence of right and wrong rather than a presence of efficacy or lack thereof and calling or lack thereof and a million other things completely reduces the actual art and science of spirit work to what's ultimately a way to get validation and immediate emotional satisfaction over results and long term satisfaction

Being labelled right or wrong is not a bigger threat than looming stagnancy, uncrossed off goals, and so on. You are worth more than putting on hold all of what you want to do because youre scared of implying there's a right and wrong way to do things. This is not a black or white matter, but if you like green and not red then you're gonna have to stop saying "there's no black or white there's no difference in colours every colour is the same shade of grey to me"... And also... If you want to actually get good at working with colours, you're probably going to have to out down "there's no black or white just different colours, and I just pick colours based on what I'm feeling and work with them". You have not been wrong if you realise that you're not meeting your goals, that you even have goals in the first place, and that you want to work towards something different. You are not invalid, wrong, or otherwise bad because you realised you were stagnating at a beginner level and you were making a bunch of mistakes, there's nothing wrong with being a beginner. And honest to god... Everyone is going to have opinions on you and your work. You don't need to put all your brain power into preemptively arguing with people who disagree with you, trying to teach them there's no right or wrong when they clearly disagree.

[sixtenmachado]

sixten copy pastes some rambly discord messages into a review and calls it a day: An InFamous 2 Review

(Copy/pasted from my backloggd)

i like how WEIRD the movement is, there's not really any other games where the character moves like the InFamous games, except Ghost of Tsushima, which is made by the same studio and also directed by Nate Fox. It's kinda hard to explain but it's like right in between uncharted and a PS2 platformer, with a bunch of special interactions with grind rails, power lines and such. The game feels weird at first, but when you get into the swing of it it feels REALLY good to play, especially the movement. I can run around for hours in the InFamous games and never get bored, the balance of flow vs careful pathfinding is immaculate. I like the electricity, both looks-wise and how you're constantly aware of and interacting with electrical currents in the world

there are few games that are so mechanically fixated on the way you perceive and navigate your environment while also being focused on being empowering and free flowing

i also really like New Orleans as a setting, i like the misty swamps and the faux french architecture, i like the way hints of jazz sneak into the soundtrack in subtle and unexpected ways

infamous 1 and 2 are probably the most deserving of a HD rerelease out of literally any games because they run like dogshit and it brings the experience down SO much, especially when you're not a kid with patience for bad framerates

what else… I just love that Cole (the guy you play as) is this parkour dude with big pants and a funny courier bag, he loves urban exploration and he's like a gruff bald late 2000s game protagonist but he has a few moments where he softens in a way that feels human and believable. I love that his best friend, Zeke, is this kind of sleazy but truly loyal and kind southerner who clearly doesn't have his shit together but isn't portrayed with any kind of disgust or malice. Any other game would have that character just be a GTA-style piece of shit that you're supposed to just kind of dislike but feel empowered by what a piece of shit he is, but here he's portrayed with empathy and nuance

also while i don't particularly love comic books the game bleeds love for them, and it's just nice when things are so earnest. I can see what they were going for and i truly appreciate it

the good/evil system, while kind of binary and oversimplified, still has a fun dichotomy of carelessly explosive or carefully precise. Both playstyles are cool and valid, even if the moral choices themselves are generally complete no-brainers. But that's kind of the point: the more evil shit Cole does, the less he has to care. What's motivating him truly is personal greed, which aligns with the players motivations if they're drawn to that explosive playstyle. Moral choices in most games come down to investment in the story, but InFamous primarily treats it as investment in mechanics, with story beats reflecting the implications

for all the jank, strangely balanced combat encounters, annoying enemies shooting you as you're trying to get from A to B, terrible framerate, and often sort of forgettable and limp story, I can't help but give this game the highest score. None of those issues manage to get in the way of the impact this game has had on me, and all the fun I've had just running around in it. Every moment of jankiness, be it gameplay or narrative, is met by not only moments where it works really well but also shows some truly interesting, unique and clearly well thought-out artistic choices.

[krakensdottir]

This is, I think, the biggest obstacle in their relationship from Aziraphale's end. Crowley's obviously got a massive case of denial and difficulting expressing emotions other than anger and a slew of other baggage, but one thing he does seem to be pretty good at figuring out is what Aziraphale wants. You know, rescue, attention, stain removal... and the preservation of the books without Az even mentioning it, that's a huge clue. They don't have the same priorities, but Crowley at least knows what Aziraphale's priorities are.

But Aziraphale, I think, has a pretty poor idea of what Crowley wants. Another scene that makes this obvious is the Ball. People have said that the Ball was for Crowley. Well, kind of. It was about Crowley. But it was for Aziraphale, really. He's arranging the sort of romantic affair he wants. It's not what Crowley would want. If not for the interruption, I'm sure he would have played along, and been happy to indulge, but it wouldn't have been his first choice.

This is not to say that Aziraphale doesn't know Crowley at all. He's definitely picked up on some of the things he likes. ('Rescuing me makes him so happy.' Doesn't it just!) But he has a tendency to project himself onto people, and onto Crowley especially. He struggles to see other points of view in general, I think. Obliviousness is his superpower.

Of course it certainly doesn't help that Crowley rarely if ever expresses his own needs or wants. He's got to be the cool guy, after all. Doesn't really need anything. He's fine. Of course he's not fine, but you have to tell Aziraphale things like that. Aziraphale cannot take a hint. And Crowley damn well knows that. He'd have to be very open and direct if he needed something from him, and he does not do that, ever. He channels himself into giving Aziraphale what he wants instead of addressing his own issues, because he totally has a handle on those. (Sure you do, Crowley.)

The one thing Aziraphale has figured out about what Crowley needs, though, is that he's lonely. He's dead right about that. Lonely, and purposeless, and sometimes bummed about it. The problem is, Az then projects his own needs onto finding the solution. He wants validation from Heaven. He wants to feel like he's really serving God again. He wants back in the system, he just wants the system to be better. That would be lovely, wouldn't it? Just perfect.

And so he tries to give Crowley that. Just like the Ball, he gives Crowley what HE would want. And this time, that is a fatal error. Because with the Ball, again, it was just kind of not Crowley's thing, but barring demonic invasion, he could've rolled with it. Returning to Heaven, though, is a painful offer. It actively appalls Crowley. He recoils like he's been slapped. He'd have rather been slapped. It's why that scene hurts so much to watch. Aziraphale is being incredibly sweet to him, trying so hard to make him happy... and it's the worst thing he could possibly do to him. God, it's awful. It's amazing. This conflict could not have been better engineered, because both of them are so valid here. They're just fundamentally different people who want fundamentally different things. Aziraphale misread the room, as he is wont to do, but more fatally than usual. Crowley reacts poorly, as he is wont to do, and this time no apology dance will fix it.

(And god yes to everything about Crowley not letting himself get attached and effectively perpetuating his own loneliness. So true. It's been a safety mechanism for most of his existence as a demon, but it's something he will absolutely have to push through now, because Aziraphale can't be his only lifeline. He's got to have purpose. He's got to let himself care about the things he's always struggled - and failed - to not care about. Feeding peas to ducks and escorting the guests to safety was a start. I'd love to see that continue.)

Aziraphale as a natural collectivist and Crowley as a natural individualist raise their beautiful heads once again!

Aziraphale's huge mistake during the Final Fifteen is, obviously, as we've rehashed a lot, assuming Crowley would accept being reappointed as an angel. This isn't out of a lack of love for Crowley as a demon. It's because Aziraphale's first instinct when he's anxious is to look toward validation from a collective of some sort...and the Metatron has just reminded him of what Heaven could "offer" as that collective. A way to do good! Safety! Openness! He doesn't consider how Crowley will feel about this in large part because thinking individualistically doesn't come naturally to him; he's so busy thinking about the joy of Belonging that he doesn't consider how much Crowley values being outside the system - indeed, that it's an essential part of him.

Crowley's mistake, I think, is arguing that it can be very literally "just the two of us." Of course they can be a couple! Aziraphale wants that. He's happy with Crowley as his most unique, enduring, intimate connection. But just as Crowley's individuality is essential to him, Aziraphale is always going to need some cause to serve, somewhere to belong. That's who he is. And he loves Crowley so much that he wants, with utter desperation, for the two of them to belong in the same place, with the same people.

As I've said before, Aziraphale's sense of individuality is growing. He wants to be an individual, not just a faceless, passionless drone in a group of other drones. I think ultimately the reason he loves Crowley so much is that's the gift Crowley's given him - the safety to explore that thing he wants so badly. He needs, I hope, to reframe himself as "belonging" to Earth, rather than to Heaven.

And Crowley does not actually want to be isolated, adrift in the universe with just one other person. He wants to put down roots. He wants to belong somewhere. I think if you had to choose a reason why he loves Aziraphale, that would be it: Crowley can feel belonging with Aziraphale, and Aziraphale also gives him opportunities to connect with others - with humans, specifically - in ways that would ordinarily never be permitted for an agent of Hell. However, he's afraid to make his connection to Earth's community irrevocable, and his fear has always been entirely reasonable, both because it puts his and Aziraphale's safety at risk and because it's heartbreaking to watch what humans do to themselves and each other ("Humans. You don't let yourself get too attached."). He'll have to overcome those fears not because they're so wrong, but just because they're in the way of what he wants.

[utilitycaster]

Could you elaborate on how FCG and FRIDA's date accomplished what people thought Launda and Imogen's convo in 49 accomplished? I've seen a lot of people only engaging with their new relationship as FRIDA being like "I can fix him" even though it's not accurate, especially not after last episode. Thank you for sharing your takes!

Sure!

The general meta surrounding Laudna and Imogen's conversation was that the two of them had been "stripped of choice" and so this conversation was them giving each other room to make choices. The problems I had with that it's just simply not true that Imogen and Laudna have been more victims of circumstance than anyone else in the party, except possibly Fearne (and even she shares Imogen's experience of parental abandonment, although her parents are far more sympathetic than Liliana). Orym's husband was killed because the Ruby Vanguard was seeing if they could bait Vax. Chetney was bit by a werewolf because he had to travel through the Savalirwood in order to get anywhere from Uthodurn on his own. FCG was literally designed to be a killer and has been grappling with that ever since (more below on that, natch). Ashton was, as a child, dragged into a ritual that likely orphaned him and transformed him (it's unclear if the chronic pain comes from the accident later or because of this or a combination thereof, incidentally). They then were nearly killed by weird magic during a job and were given weird powers by Milo.

Honestly, the thread connecting Imogen and Laudna is not that they've had things happen to them without having options - it's D&D, everyone's got a tragic backstory - it's the years of inaction that have yet to be explored, especially in Laudna's case. What unites them is not that they haven't had choices; it's that they haven't made choices. And in that conversation they still don't make choices - Laudna merely reminds Imogen that she can. It's not a bad conversation! But it's not a decisive one. They don't address any of the negative feelings and they don't even really actively choose each other by becoming closer because it's more of the same. As others have pointed out, really all Imogen and Laudna ask of the other is to be there, and that's completely valid. But it feels like for the relationship to go anywhere, particularly in a romantic direction, they would need to push past that. Romance carries with it the potential for change and conflict. It's a choice they're distinctly not making yet, even though it's clearly an option available to them and has been available to them. The person who has been stopping Imogen from making choices is herself.

Meanwhile: FCG and FRIDA's conversation is very emotionally raw! FRIDA admits they've been angry about being brought back with no input, and FCG admits they've been more confused and lost, and they both genuinely thank each other for being there.

The thing that gets me the most is this: FRIDA is able to ask "I don't mean to be too forward, but, if I was your special person, would you try and kill me?" Laudna meanwhile doesn't even ask "would you side with the people who killed me?" or "I understand this is a difficult situation with your mother but could you not side with the people who killed me?" And, honestly? This is so much more demonstrative of giving someone room to have choices than saying "you have choices" because it also gives the asker a choice. Laudna might give Imogen room to make choices, but in doing so deprives herself of agency and advocacy. FRIDA meanwhile is saying "I want this [ie, I am making choices] and I like you and I trust you can make choices; would you choose to be kind to me?" They bond over how neither of them really chose to be awake again, a thousand years later, but they are and they are choosing to see this as an opportunity. It's this fountain of choices and possibilities opening up before both of them. It's dynamic and moving forward rather than staying in the same place.

That's a huge risk to put yourself out there and be vulnerable to someone maybe saying "no" or even "I'd like to but I can't", but FRIDA makes it, and FCG acknowledges it earlier, that they've had their own barriers up and have struggled to let others in but FRIDA is different.

I think this has been a theme in the CR fandom with respect to shipping; I happen to believe that a relationship is most interesting if this is the person you can be honest with and reveal your uglier feelings to. There is another school of thought that centers around the idea that relationships are more about a submission of one's own agency, or protecting the other person without their knowledge, and I don't find those relationships terribly compelling. FRIDA and FCG really feel like the former in a way that Imogen and Laudna currently do not.

[buddha-in-disguise]

Will this ever end?

Well I woke up to a shitstorm on Twitter and the Supergirl fandom, with David Harewood.

I can't say exactly what was said to cause David to post what he did as I haven't seen posts he might have done - but his subsequent reactions have unfortunately merely seemed to have exacerbated the issue and inflamed it.

My thoughts though before I go further into this. Also remember these are my own thoughts, I don't expect everyone to agree with me. However I hope I can make some kind of sense with what I'm trying to write down here.

Supergirl this season has one character I'm finding hard to relate to. This has absolutely nothing to do with potential storylines and relationship possibilty, but everything to do with what they have tried to do with William Dey as a whole.

I get the reason he came along in regards Russell and so the Andrea connection. That story made some sense.

What hasn't made sense - William being used as a journalist, when Nia is right there! Nia has barely had any screen time, and virtually none as a journalist; you know - her actual job. I'm not sure what the minutes on screen ratio has been this season between the two, but it has felt completely slanted towards William as a viewer.

First instead of Kara and Nia investigating Leviathan after William was 'exposed' in the earlier episodes, now Nia is sidelined again, because they want Kara to team up with William to investigate Lex.

Why? Why do they need that journalistic pairing, when Nia - who as a Superhero, is better placed if danger from Lex occurs. But no, they're making it about Kara having to work with William because Lex threatened to kill him.

They have a Superhero who is also a journalist right there!

Right. There.

Personally this simply makes no sense to me. Plus if I am being honest, William as a character is bringing nothing to the table for me. He feels more like a token male character because James has left.

That brings me to Dansen. While we had some scenes before Crisis, considering at SDCC we were being told how Dansen would strengthen after those events, again we have seen seconds worth of screen time of Kelly, let alone the lack of Dansen.

We accept it isn't the Dansen show and this isn't about that, but again it feels as if it is being pushed way into the background & Kelly is being underutilised. She works for Obsidian North, yet was nowhere to be seen at the launch of the new tech. Sure, it isn't her area of expertise within the company, but you would expect senior employees to have been at such an important launch.

Plus, she is ex-military, but again nothing has been utilised about that part of her character.

The problems with both these issues is these characters are LGBTQ rep on the show. Representation that is already severely underrepresented on TV. Even allowing for the LGBTQ rep on SG (which is above average), it is still well below the ratio percentages that GLAAD show as being the main demographic of viewers.

So LGBTQ fans also look at non-canon representation as well. They have to, because LGBTQ on screen numbers simply don't reflect what the viewer numbers are. I made a post about it to try & highlight this, which I will link to.

But needless to say, LGBTQ fans also generally have difficulties that a lot of people don't have to face.

This brings me back to David and his lack of understanding that many fans were (looking through the comments), trying to explain to him. That criticism wasn't aimed at him per se (at least that I saw), or his directing or acting of that episode. If criticism was aimed at him, that was and is wrong.

The main criticism I saw was being aimed about elements that the writers and producers had done (Winn's wife being another aspect that was problematic). It was unfortunate that it has coincided with David's directorial episode.

Look, David can direct an episode wonderfully, it can have some great aspects to it, but it can also be highly problematic to some fans, & receive valid criticism for it.

For example, the latest episode of Batwoman. The Alice/Beth story was great. The acting superb. What I found worrying was the way they made Sophie feel guilty for legitimate reasons why she had led a closeted lifestyle. That lifestyle is valid, for Sophie and many LGBTQ people, and for good reason, including keeping some people safe from harm. I felt it was a clumsy attempt for Alice to get into Sophie's mind; it could've been tackled other ways, so it felt wrong they used her sexuality as a way to achieve that. Being closeted for many literally keeps them alive. So that was one hell of a poor choice in my opinion. So, great episode, valid criticism.

I personally find it sad that David hasn't seemed to understand this. Especially considering he only recently tweeted about the lack of diversity on TV for black actors. His argument there applies to what the LGBTQ audience have been trying to explain so many times, both with Supergirl and beyond that.

Except for LGBTQ it goes further, as not only are there LGBTQ, there is further intersectionality that runs through us as a group.

So for example, Kelly is LGBTQ, but Black. She is also a woman. All areas that struggle in their own sphere and marginalised in their own right. Added together, and it makes her representation even more important.

Nia Nal is Transgender. And a woman. Also two areas of intersectionality. If we don't listen to all marginalised people, especially when that intersectionality comes into play, we fail.

David is Black.

But also heterosexual, and male, and honestly, seeing his reaction I felt the heterosexual male with no understanding what the LGBTQ audience was trying to explain come through far more than I imagined I would.

Now of course, it could be David had no intention of coming across in that way. Yet the way he liked certain posts also felt as a complete dismissal of the LGBTQ community as a whole. It felt like the reactions from SDCC 2017 all over again.

Without a doubt some fans were taking it too far. I get that. I don't know how often I have written about fandoms and the way some can behave. However, if David is putting everyone in a fandom as all being problematic (as his liking of Tweets seem to suggest), then that is a very poor take indeed by him, and one I hope he considers.

By taking those steps, he has angered some fans more than was necessary in my view. Like Staz the other day, I know we are all human and sometimes react emotionally. Unlike Staz, who tried to clarify his words and apologised for any upset he might've caused, David seems to have gone the other way and doubled down against fans, blocking even respectful tweets to him that were trying to explain a point of view.

Now before anyone thinks I am hating on David, I'm not. I have supported much of his work.

I am though disappointed that for someone who is marginalised himself, has had mental health struggles, he has seemingly failed to understand that LGBTQ are just as marginalised (if not more so) than he is, & that because of the issues LGBTQ people face, mental health problems are extremely high versus the general population. That some of his wording and liking of tweets have felt like a complete slap in the face for many, who have legitimate concerns about Supergirl at the moment.

As I say, I get some fans take it too far, in all areas of the Supergirl fandom. Outright hate towards anyone is absolutely unacceptable. I also understand that we all react at times that is instinctual because we feel hurt, and that reaction is not as good as it could be.

I just hope that rather than it implode more on us, that everyone takes a step back to try and calm down.

As for the issues of queerbaiting that has risen as a result of the teaser for the next episode of SG. Supergirl in earlier episodes of the season, used parallels to show Lena and Kara alongside canon relationships on the show. To then have other people call fans delusional for seeing those scenes as romantically formulated is not okay! It really isn't. That's hateful, because like it or not, those elements are there.

When I have people who don't watch the show asking if Lena and Kara are together because of clips they might see (straight people at that), that isn't delusional.

But, that isn't an issue the cast should address or make judgement on, or fans to insist they do.

It should though be something asked of the producers and showrunners, because if they have no plans to go through with it - it has been outright queerbaiting this season. Up until this year, they've not done things with notable intent to parallel other relationships. This season they have. The shift felt deliberate.

I know ultimately that this show is about Supergirl, but it is also about those around her as family & friends. I understand there are only so many minutes in one episode. What I don't understand is why those precious minutes are going to a character, when they have one perfectly placed to do the same role. Why they have to potentially explore another relationship, when we have one canon relationship & one relationship that while isn't canon in terms of romantic, it is a big story in terms of best friends, both seemingly sidelined. Which brings me to the Kara fighting for Lena's soul aspect. Again, I am not seeing a lot of fighting for anything, except more and more fans fighting themselves and cast.

I will be honest, I had high hopes for this season. I also knew it was likely going to be pretty confusing at times since it was given as 'our Black mirror season' and 'nothing is as it seems.' I accepted that.

However, all it seems at the moment is a jumbled mess from pre and post Crisis. They just doesn't appear to be any cohesion at all, which is making it really difficult as a viewer. Add in the changes post Crisis and it feels even more of a mess.

Of course, they could bring in more cohesive elements soon, but considering that we know episode 13 is 'It's a wonderful life,' and Alex Danvers in a later episode is wearing a Super suit - I just sense this whole 'nothing is as it seems' side we appear to be getting isn't changing any time soon, & with episodes running out, with so many strings running through at the moment, it feels really discombomulated. If by seasons end, they pull it off and you can look back and see how it's played out as a whole, I will be the first to say well done for that part.

I get that as more characters are added to a show, it can make shuffling screen time for those already established characters harder to achieve that will please everyone, especially when we get invested in those characters.

I do though think right now Supergirl feels chaotic beyond expectation, and no end in sight. I feel there have been too many character additions this season (particularly Andrea & William) that is taking screen time away from Kara, Alex, Nia, Lena, Kelly et al.

That is causing confusion for fans, that is also beginning to become frustration. That frustration is spilling over. Add in the genuine and legitimate concerns over the LGBTQ issues that have arisen, and the frustration has built even more.

Again though, that is something we need to be asking of the producers and show runners, and not pulling the cast into it.

Let's all try less to score points against each other, or make generalisations, as none of that is helpful.

If you can't do that, you will get other fans calling you out.

Let's all learn to step away a bit more when it is obviously getting to the point rational discussion isn't working, to let things calm down.

We all need to try and do better.

[mittensmorgul]

The Empty says he'll come for Cas when he's happy and I've been thinking that meant he had a heart to heart with Dean but isn't it more likely that his acceptance of his previous decisions will be what summons the Empty? He feels so much guilt for Heaven and the fall, etc. But he saw the AU and what would have happened if he'd not made his own choices. And we saw how terrified of heaven he is now, that he knows they're all shades of evil. So, maybe self forgiveness is the trigger and not Dean?

eep I have not had enough coffee for this yet… :P

Let’s start with the assumption that Cas is a multidimensional character with issues on a lot of fronts. Dean is not his sole reason for being, and not his sole emotional issue, you know?

That said, he knows the current situation in Heaven. Not only that, he knows that while he’s played a part in Heaven’s earlier problems, he’s been working harder than all the other angels put together trying to fix what’s wrong there– both as a result of his (and other angels’) actions in the past (because remember the whole apocalypse thing was NOT his idea and he has PROOF from GOD that he’s the one who kept trying to do the right thing… by the sheer fact that he was the one repeatedly resurrected, you know?) as well as now.

He’s consistently done everything in his own power to help Heaven, and aside from that one time he’d been partially taken over by the Leviathan and killed swaths of angels in “punishment” as Godstiel and that other time he was lied to and tricked into helping Metatron complete the angel fall spell (because he fully believed it would lock all the angels IN Heaven, not dump them out), Heaven’s problems really aren’t his fault, you know? There’s only so many times one angel can plead to all the others to let the past go, to accept that the world has changed, and that they either need to change with it or die…

Since then he has gone so far out of his way to try to make amends that it’s beyond ridiculous. I mean, I was just watching 11.02 a few hours ago, and even the angel who is probably Cas’s last “friend” in Heaven– Hannah– has played a part in Cas’s torture and manipulation. Cas had asked for help, and was the one angel who had a decent idea of the gravity of the situation with the Darkness, and yet even Hannah was ready to punish him in order to get Sam and Dean’s location out of him. NOT to talk with them and discover what had happened, but to punish and kill them for what they’d done.

There is no reasoning with angels. Cas had accepted that. The next time he asked for Heaven’s help (in 11.22), it was as a direct messenger of God, and he still had to beg, even when he had the authority of God behind him. So what did he really expect from Heaven? When Heaven approached HIM in 12.15, it was under the assumption that he would “repent” for what he’d done and return to them, and abandon his nonsense on Earth and with the Winchesters. But he firmly declared that no, he was doing all of this for the Winchesters. It was Heaven’s insistence they handle Dagon and Kelly their way that led to even more angel deaths.

Then they continued the same sort of campaign in s13– first attempting to kill Jack and then not letting anything stand in their way to capturing Jack to use his powers to “fix” Heaven. Dumah tried to ask for Cas’s help in “convincing” Jack to essentially be their magical little slave, but the truth was that the angels selfishly wanted to use Jack like some sort of battery, and not like a person. Which is honestly horrific.

I think that meeting his alternate version in the AU was more about understanding the differences between what he COULD have been versus what he IS. I don’t think it’s a matter of him realizing that Heaven is “evil” or corrupt or just flat-out wrong. Those were things he already knew. It was more about him being able to take his destiny into his own hands quite literally. Killing his AU self who’d been brainwashed and damaged beyond all recognition, precisely because he was never forced to consider free will, isn’t just about Dean having been the one to keep that door open for him, you know? Yes, the entire process never would’ve begun without Dean, but on every other level that mattered, the choices and actions came down to what Castiel chose for himself. Killing his AU self was entirely about him. They were even alone in that scene, you know? That was about Cas himself facing this. Not about proving Heaven was evil, or would torture him into compliance, or even about the fact that Dean had essentially saved him from that fate. It was about HIM, and what breaking free of Heaven’s control had finally allowed him to become. Which seems like a subtle difference, because yes Dean has been the catalyst (repeatedly, over the last ten years, opening the door in the first place and then continuing to support him to the point where he’s irrevocably become A Winchester himself in every way that matters, through trials and hard times as well as through successes), but the important thing to remember is that Cas could’ve chosen a different path at any point (like he did in s6), and yet over and over he continued to choose free will, even when he wasn’t sure it was the right thing, and even when he didn’t get it quite right. Reducing all of that to be “because Dean” is kinda reductive.

Obviously this summary here is seriously glossing over a lot. This is in no way everything that’s happened here, but just a quick lil refresher leading up to what I’m about to say… which is:

Cas has been making his peace with Heaven, and with himself, for a really long time. He’s even (shockingly) been given a sort of absolution from Naomi of all people, back in 13.19 when she walked him to the door and let him go. Then in 14.08 she acknowledged that Cas’s motives may not have been putting Heaven first in taking the actions he did to save them from the Empty Entity, which in itself is a sort of forgiveness or acceptance of who Cas is, and she also specifically THANKED him.

Naomi, at least (and probably Dumah) are now beginning to understand Cas and the fact he hasn’t been “working against Heaven” all this time, but searching for a better way, balancing the needs and wants of Heaven with the needs and wants of humanity on Earth. Because it’s never been “us or them,” as SO many angels have been convinced of over the years. This is not a black and white issue, on any level.

So when it comes to what could make Cas perfectly happy, what would trigger his deal with the empty, I think it must first and foremost be about Cas himself.

Even having Heaven’s forgiveness and acceptance wasn’t enough to trigger the deal. Even saving Jack wasn’t enough. Even reunited with the Winchesters as a family wasn’t enough. Because while I feel that yes, Dean will of course play a major part in Cas achieving that happiness, because Dean has ALWAYS been the major trigger for ALL of Cas’s growth over the years, it wouldn’t be as simplistic as some romantic declaration, you know? Because Cas as a character is so much more than that.

But since you asked me what I thought of this, I’m gonna tell you.

I’m not entirely sure it will ever come to this. I’m not sure they won’t find some other resolution to Cas’s deal before it comes to them laying out Cas’s happiness trigger on the table that blatantly, you know?

Not to mention, this is the sort of speculation I personally hate, because it’s based on the assumption that we’re looking at this from the right direction. And we literally have no way to know if we’re somehow obsessing over the entirely wrong thing, or interpreting it correctly.

Right now, this entire question and response is grounded on unstable foundations. It’s nothing more than a theoretical exercise, because we have no way to know what will actually be important by the end of the season. I can suggest that thematically and from a character perspective this will come down to Cas’s choices and his own opinion of himself, and that Dean will likely play a role as a catalyst in making his choice. But outside of that… I’m not even sure if the rest of this will ever actually be relevant in the first place. Because we’ve made the ASSUMPTION that we’re correct in believing this must come down to some sort of confrontation between Cas and the Empty, or that we will definitively have a singular moment of Absolute Happiness with unqualified certitude that it was One Singular Thing that sparked Cas’s doom. And that’s just… not how this works. At least not from the speculation side of things.

I mean, this is an interesting question from a purely theoretical standpoint, because it was interesting enough to me to spend the last two hours typing this nonsense up. But outside of this reply having been an interesting thought exercise for me, I don’t think there’s really any conclusion to be made. I think the question is unanswerable, because we don’t even know yet if canon will bear it out as a valid question in the first place, you know?

I really hope that makes sense. It’s just frustrating to me that there’s even this hemming and hawing over speculation like this, as if it has to be Destiel or Not-Destiel, and those are the only two valid assumptions going forward. Because that assumption negates all of this ^^, that yes of course it is all about Cas and his choices and being able to forgive himself and hopefully understand himself enough to make those choices about who and what he wants to be, but you literally cannot divorce Dean’s presence in Cas’s life and his influence in every one of Cas’s choices over the last almost 11 years from what Cas inevitably will choose for himself. 

I’m not saying that Cas will choose xyz thing because of Dean’s influence (hur hur), or because Dean pushed him into choosing it. Cas’s story arc is still primarily about HIM, just like Dean’s is primarily about Dean, and Sam’s is primarily about Sam. That’s how main characters function in a narrative, you know? But they also don’t function in a vacuum. What makes up the narrative is how each of the characters relate to the others, and how all of their choices are influenced by and consequently affect the others.

So at the very root, I think the question is looking to establish some false duality that it must be one or the other thing, that one of these things will be The Truth™ and will therefore negate or invalidate the other. And that’s just… not how this works. I think that really does a disservice to Castiel as a character, reducing him to a plot device when this has literally been his character arc since s4, made essential to the ongoing narrative structure since at least s8

[cargopantsman]

i like this thought, but since my whole thing is angst I kinda wanna riff on this in the opposite direction. so this isn't a refutation (and should probably be its own post but i'm lazy) or going against the ship directly.

but I see Harrow being this archetype of both devotion and determination. as the Reverend Daughter she is invested in her house, and given the circumstances of her conception (and her feelings about it), intimately beholden to it. ("I'm a war crime!") Add on to that the (possible?) fact she did roll away the stone and transgressed directly against the creed of the house. . . (still working out if JG's refutation was valid or not without looking up a wiki)

I'm just saying Harrow carries a lot on her frail necromantic shoulders but has the bullheadedness to be determined to carry it all alone.

With her and Gideon's antagonistic childhood, which introduces a lot of the enemy energy for the enemies to lovers trope, but also drives a certain wedge in place concerning Harrow and Gideon being able to function (well) romantically. (Part of this is that I do headcanon Harrow as ace from some cues from The Text.)

All of that to say that I don't think Gideon is wrong. The Frozen Corpse is a central focus of Harrow's "love" (in whatever context that means) both as an adolescent infatuation and a sacred duty.

Combine that with Gideon being an ever-present reminder of what was paid for Harrow's conception (and to a lesser degree we see Ortus also being a target of her disdain for the same reason I think). Given that the few glimpses we do get of them growing up together tend to involve cruel pranks, physical violence, and emotional trauma there really isn't any hint of reliance on each other.

Until they get to Canaan House.

At which point they're two strangers in a strange land forced to bond over their shared house (to wit, Harrow is invested and Gideon disdains) and also there was only one bed! (well, a bed and a pet bed?)

So I don't think Gideon was wrong. And maybe I just like the bittersweet of it, that Gideon really did love Harrow in ways she couldn't really articulate. And that Harrow realized she also had some kind of love for Gideon, even if she could give Gideon the kind of dedication that was elsewise demanded of her duties and ultimate lyctorhood.

And I've been where Gideon was. I've been where Harrow was. There are choices that have to be made. Life gets in the way, duty gets in the way. Sometimes the best you can do is take what succor from your love you can get (even if it's abuse [totally different convo]).

So I love the subversion of one flesh, one end... Gideon makes her sacrifice and Harrow suddenly realizes the extent of what it all meant.

But then she isn't even given time to process it.

So Harrow confesses to Gideon in the pool, right.

And she tells Gideon she loves The Body. And seeing The Body--being in the presence of The Body--made her want to live.

And Gideon takes this to mean that Harrow can never love her, because Harrow, romantically, sexually, is fully consumed by the desire for The Body.

But . . . The Body. Alecto. The fucking life force that animates Earth. Harrow, who lived in a dark hole full of bones her whole existence, saw LIFE for the first time. The glory of a whole-ass planet packed into one being.

Did she want to fuck it? Yeah, kinda. You'd fuck the ecological majesty of our world too, I bet.

But it's still a pretty different kind of relationship! David Attenborough is probably as obsessed with this world as anyone, he still got married.

I'm just saying, I think Gideon has misread the situation. The ice lolly bimbo isn't a girlfriend, she's more like a spiritual calling.

[klanced]

New concept: white people should keep their fingers of of characters of color and stop pretend that they can understand the characters' struggles or dynamics. People who blame and vilify Keith are just as bad as the people who call Allura racist. Especially, when they're twisting what really happened. Keith ever said "not all Galra". You all want to make yourselves look so problack when you're not.

Lmao. Imagine being this far up Keith’s ass :)

Anon, are you a fruit harvester? Because I’ve never seen someone cherry-pick a narrative this hard before. Let’s dismantle your argument one one piece at a time.

“People who blame and vilify Keith are just as bad as the people who call Allura racist.”

I’m gonna go out on a limb and assume that you can’t tell the difference between a rock and bird, because you seem to be completely incapable of comparing and contrasting anything :/ Wow! 

Are you… implying that the feelings of an asian character are more valid than those of a black character? That an asian character… deserves more respect than a black character? That Keith… needs to protected, while Allura deserves to be condemned? Wow. That’s a lot to unpack!

Let’s do a check-list, and hopefully this’ll jog your memory since you seem to have an incredibly selective memory of season two, anon :)

Keith’s Galra arc caused him a lot of insecurity over his identity. It’s totally reasonable that he wanted support and validation from his friends/team, and it does suck that Allura wasn’t immediately accepting of him.

HOWEVER, you forget that Allura kind of has a valid reason to be wary of Galra! Maybe because she… idk… witnessed the Galra turn against her people and then slaughter them right in front of her? 

And don’t forget! Allura saw the beginning of the Galra Empire… and then she woke up 10,000 years later to find that it was still alive, and even stronger than before. Why? Because no one had ever stood against Zarkon. At least, publicly speaking.

Oh, sure, we know now that the Blades exist, but Allura had no idea when she woke up. Instead, she fell asleep to her father’s face against a backdrop of war, and awoke to the same war, only worse this time, because it wasn’t a war anymore, not really. Calling it a war implies that the other side had a chance to fight back.

Allura opened her eyes to see an Empire that has lasted for 10,000 years, with no (apparent) internal conflict. She woke up to an army that has never doubted Zarkon. What she saw was an entire race who never tried to stand up and say that this is wrong, or we shouldn’t be doing this. She saw the Galra, she saw their complacency, and she saw nothing she could trust.

What was it that Allura said to Kolivan? “Your caution is the reason Zarkon is still in power!”

Now, let’s rehash what happened in the show!

Keith cautiously broaches the idea of working with the Galra to Allura. She immediately dismisses the idea because the Galra have had 10,000 years to do something, and they just let things get even worse. Voltron can handle Zarkon on its own. Cue shot of Keith looking sad.

After revealing his Galra heritage, Keith looks at Allura. Her face is carefully neutral. Cue shot of Keith looking sad for a few seconds.

Cut to another shot of Keith looking sad.

Another shot of Keith looking sad.

A scene where Keith vents to Hunk about how Allura is making him sad. Hunk tries to comfort him by essentially boiling the situation down to “this is all just Allura’s problem, but eventually she’ll get over it” (with ‘it’ being the Genocide And Destruction Of Her Home Planet Along With Countless Others That Zarkon Has Murdered Over The Past 10,000 Years)

Surprise, a shot where Keith is sad again (x10)

And then the scene where Allura suddenly realizes that She Was Wrong All Along and apologizes to Keith. Keith starts to say something in return, but Allura cuts him off, because this was obviously all her fault and Keith did nothing wrong :(( Allura wipes away his tears and gives Keith the most awkward comforting hug ever, because obviously it’s her responsibility to ensure he’s emotionally stable :)

“Especially, when they’re twisting what really happened. Keith ever said “not all Galra”.”

Are you sure about that? Yeah, Keith never said ‘not all Galra’ but… his bullshit argument and your bullshit argument can be summed up pretty nicely with a reference to this bullshit argument. Looking at my above bullet points, we can conclude that the narrative (with all its shitty writing) is wholeheartedly in support of Keith. The audience is supposed to feel sympathy for Keith. We are supposed to empathize and weep alongside him. 

We are supposed to coddle him. We are supposed to forgive him. We are supposed to excuse him. But where does that leave Allura?

I don’t think the writers intentionally wanted Allura to be the villain of Keith’s (show-spanning) character arc, but they needed someone to… be a foil? To be so extreme(ish) that it pushes the audience in the other direction, towards sympathizing/liking the Galra? Yeah. They needed that kind of catalyst. But this Hell Fandom took that and ran with it and somehow produced the idea that Allura is a racist. 

So no, anon. There is nothing comparable about ‘Keith getting called out’ to ‘people calling Allura a racist.’ You’re pissed because this show worships the toilet Keith shits on, while the fandom is willing to call out the blatant favoritism and bullshit of the writers. 

If this arc had actually been written well, Keith and Allura would have been left on equal ground. But that’s not what happened. Neither characters were perfect in this situation; both were flawed in how they approached the issue. And that’s okay! That’s great, even! But things started tilting sideways when the show writers refused to admit that Keith was wrong. And not just about his Galra plot-line, but also about how he acted/what he did this season in general. They excused away all of his actions, even when they were shitty moves and choices! Keith held a king at knifepoint, Keith shouted at his teammates, Keith did x and y and z and was surprised when it all blew up in his face. But he never, ever, faced any consequences for it. But you know that if Lance or Hunk had done something like that, they would’ve suffered hell for it. They would’ve been treated as a joke. They would have been demonized for it.

And you know how I know that? I know because I still see posts in the tag about how ‘Allura is a racist.’

Oh, and finally?

“New concept: white people should keep their fingers of of characters of color and stop pretend that they can understand the characters’ struggles or dynamics. (…) You all want to make yourselves look so problack when you’re not.”

1. I’m Chinese-American you fucking jackass.

2. How dare you insinuate that I, and anyone else speaking up against this, is doing this simply for ‘brownie points.’ How dare you imply that certain races cannot weigh in on this problem, and then turn around and pretend that ‘vilifying’ Keith is somehow more racist than calling Allura, a black woman, a racist. How dare you claim all this while ignoring the fact that this entire conflict centers around a pale male character versus a black female character. How dare you pretend that last sentence wouldn’t have some degree of impact on the fandom and its treatment of both characters.

3. The next time you feel obligated to try and lecture, shame, and belittle me, at least have the decency to do it off anon so I can rip you apart to your face, you fucking coward. 

[elizabethrobertajones]

Ha! Sorry , yeah I forgot to put in Cas's name (and it's coming from a LOT of Cas fans in a "I get why they're happier to see their mum- just as someone without blood relations it makes me super sad to see people act this way about bio parents- same reason I can't watch Once Upon a Time which is super gross about that)

Aah, I get you >.> Yeah, I understand now. But I haven’t been on my dash at all so I have no idea what people are saying about this or how they have been interpreting it. I’m so far behind despite it being like 2 days since the episode I’m still in the fresh eyes episode reaction phase >.> I’d like to know what people are saying before, like, the next episode, but I suppose I can offer my perspective without any idea what everyone else is saying about this :P 

To my eyes I didn’t think they were “happier” to see their Mom - they called Cas and Mary came too and they didn’t have an expectation she’d be there. Using Sam as a control group because Dean is definitely acting weirder in that scene, Sam just sort of stumbles on both of their other immediate family in the wood and glomps onto both of them. 

I have read a fair amount of meta now suggesting Dean’s weirdness about Mary being there was because he hadn’t expected her and the whole deal thing - which we don’t know the terms of yet when they see her for the first time - being a real problem. Now I rewatch it Dean definitely seems much shiftier about it all so I read HIS reaction to seeing Mary as not letting go of Cas and rushing off to her because he cares more to see her, but he is distracted by her presence because he hadn’t counted on it.

(It all relies on Cas and Mary bonding while Sam n Dean are locked up - I don’t think they knew really that Cas and Mary had been as close as they were even before they both split off on their own things, because they talked alone at night. Mary IS Cas’s emergency contact and that should be fairly obvious but Dean made a point of calling Cas and only Cas over and over when they got out so his behaviour excludes Mary and remembering 12x06 I think he would have feared exactly what nearly happened, involving her in the deal even if he couldn’t have been sure the terms covered her, Winchesters tend to sacrifice for each other and the last time they saw her her vulnerability there was emphasised.)

Buuut the camera from Cas’s perspective tells us he’s THINKING Sam and Dean are prioritising Mary, so that’s a valid thing to discuss, but I do think Cas’s self esteem was literally the subplot of the episode for him, so his judgement on these matters is impaired - 12x03 with the conversation about belonging is so important and he thinks Mary belongs (and she assumes he does), but when Cas sees something like Sam and Dean rushing to hug Mary, despite how we see how happy they are to see him, he can’t process it properly; we’re getting Cas’s perspective but it’s only a perspective. So I think Cas is actually feeling what you are about the sad and isolating feeling of blood family winning over found family (as he expressed in 12x03 about Mary belonging just because she was their mom) and he feels like he’s seeing it in action there.

But the show has ALWAYS stressed these messages about what blood is and how that includes people who aren’t literally blood at all (and in Cas’s case are angel grace instead of blood :P)… Crowley’s one thing in the episode was to remind us how he cares (even though he says he doesn’t) and Dean gave him the family don’t end in blood (or begin there) speech about HIS newly discovered Mom back in 10x17, which is now pretty eerie. It looks like we’re coming up to conflict about Mary in 12x12, and her choices, and while I think there’s a very very low chance the Winchesters disown her, I do think the actual bonds of closeness between them all need to be really forged in fire through all the stupid decision making Winchesters do :P I just watched the end of season 6 yesterday, and Cas making all his stupid decisions, and Dean saying he considered Cas family to try and talk him out of it… The knock on effect of that long down the line when Dean and Cas reconcile, is a bond that’s far stronger than it was before, because it’s come through all that pain into forgiveness. 

And not to say Mary isn’t important to them because although she hasn’t been in their lives, the comparison to Rowena is obviously nothing like how Mary was to her sons when she was alive and they were small… The tragedy aspect of her dying changes the way in which she wasn’t there for them and how they relate to that… It’s an emotional stake they have in each other that people literally can’t have in real life so the melodrama attached is very heightened and weird… Anyway, the way Mary has been written in the past, to go right back to episodes like Home, shows a huge sacrifice and love for her sons, so though she hasn’t had many chances in the narrative, their one encounter with the “real” her in the whole story before season 12, she did one of the big Winchester sacrifice plays out of love for them, so though she doesn’t remember it, in a way I would suppose to them it seems like she has been tested and her true self demonstrated to them in a way that would make them very happy to accept Mary as-is, as both blood and someone who would earn their total respect and trust, even taking the tragedy and subsequent canonisation of Mary aspect out of it.

Buuut yeah while Mary has been this constant presence in the show, Cas HAS physically shown up for them more… I don’t wanna get into points scoring or saying who is more deserving because they both have very different relationships to the brothers, and they have been put in the narrative in a neat sort of parallel to each other walking a similar path but with their own baggage, and the direct parallel in 12x03 of how they felt about belonging started this off. The narrative is therefore treating them as equals both needing to come to the same place and feel the same way in SOME ways, about belonging and finding a family (and they’re doing it with each other as well as bonding with Sam and Dean which is great because the family dynamic will work best with all 4 of them sharing love in all directions)… But it all needs to be tailored to the ways they’re approaching it. To take that 10x17 speech again, Cas is “family don’t end in blood” and Mary is “but it doesn’t start there either” and they’re working through those two extreme opposite ends of the mantra side by side, so in moments like this, it’s demonstrating where we’re at with this. (Mary seems to find some belonging but now is desperate to protect her family even more; Cas’s actions not just here but in the speech after killing Billie, clearly paint him as an outsider looking in, and admiring “the Winchesters” while not feeling like a part of the family unit - the three standing together and him addressing them)… This is not the end of this arc by a long shot, so while Sam and Dean are relatively stable and when it comes to THEIR relationship absolutely a fluid duo who move and think together (have they EVER been this good?) Cas and Mary have been thrust to extreme ends of their approach to belonging right now… 

So I think to compare them by how much history they have with the Winchesters is a bit one-sided whichever character you are favouring, because these stories are parallel lines on the same emotional quest, and you need to consider both to understand the other. I don’t think it’s really a competition for family? Cas’s found family side is equally a valid part as Mary’s blood relationship but to reconcile both to the core family unit has to deal with the issues of both, which from Cas’s perspective is Mary having less history but easier acceptance into the family and from Mary’s perspective is reconciling being in this family by blood with properly feeling herself as part of the family unit with the same bonds that the forged in fire found family relationships have - in 12x03 her problem is she’s feeling like an outsider because “her” family is babies and married to John, not two gruff hunters and their angel. She HAS the blood connection and it seems to give her an “in” but she’s struggling so much with what is “more” than that. 

… I hope this rambling makes any sense and maybe makes you feel better about whatever’s going on here. I definitely don’t think the show is betraying its age old mottos about family that I assume would make it so appealing when you have a lot of found family. 

[dust-jacket-analysis]

(Disclaimer: I am in no way attacking anon for their opinion or question. In fact it's on digital sight for anyone who does. They were kind and are asking a question. Be polite people).

So there's actually a lot of different reasons I think people in general like him. With different levels of validity (That's not me saying people can't just like him for beacause. When I say that I'm talking about those Drew Stans. If you catch my drif). | | V (The those in Question): Of course there's the simps. People who think he's 'fine.' So they basically don't care about anything else he's done. Those also happen to mostly be the same people that sexualize him and other minors in the cast.

Then there's people who have an idealized version of him in their head? If that makes sense. They took the fanon UwU soft boy version of him and made it canon in their minds. And suddenly any bad thing he did is excused because he's their 'precious baby.'

For me personally, he has a lot of good writing. Like he parallels a lot of the cast. Jake, Hailey, Lia (The beginning of my Dria shipping obsession), even Daisy in some ways (I have a post about these two here, because I know this will raise a few eyebrows). Also it's the way Drake and Droey parallel each other. Two Dynamics that Drew is apart of. And the way Halia and Drake parallel each other, Drew playing a part in that. Plus, he's written in a way where at the end of the day you're supposed to sympathize with him slightly. Like despite the massive flaws he has (being a bully /:) you feel a bit bad for him. Because everyone knows that feeling of watching the person you care about most in this world be with someone more than you. It sucks. So we're supposed to feel for Drew in those moments. Despite everything else.

Not to mention everyone he knew and trusted lied about his girlfriend cheating on him. And he did really care about her, even if it as at a different point in time (another post about them here lol).

Like it's clear there's a redemption arc being set up here. When talking about character arcs, I tend to use Azula and Zuko as examples. Because they're the two primary directions you can really take an antagonist character. It's redemption versus damnation. Most antagonists get one or the other.

But some rare cases, an antagonist gets both. They have their damnation moment, and then they start their path to redemption. Like Hunter for TOH. He had his Azula breakdown during Eclipse lake, and then post Hollow Mind he was able to have his redemption arc.

I think the season finale of TMF was Drew's little 'damnation' Azula moment. He broke down, made increasingly poor moral choices and eventually lost his dearest friend in the process. Almost a self-destructive move. So now, like Hunter from TOH, after a bit of suffering he'll probably get a redemption arc.

So that makes me personally feel more invested in his story. Modern humans are hard-wired to see the best in each other. We all love a good redemption story. So I imagine the idea of a Drew redemption could draw in a lot of potential Drew fans.

Idk all in all I just personally find him neat. And while I can't speak for everyone, I think a lot of others do too. He just has so much there, it feels like Rosy really invested in writing a realistic teenage antagonist.

I’ll be honest I do not understand why so many people like Drew so much. At first I thought it was the whole, “Oh, he’s a grumpy tsundere” thing, but then I realized Zander actually fits that description much better. But then why is Drew, at least from what I’ve experienced, one of if not the most popular character?

So uh. Can someone explain to me why so many people like him? I mean he’s a cool antagonist and all, but I get the feeling most of those who like him weren’t drawn in because they immediately started doing deep psychoanalysis on him, so what initially drew (no pun intended) people to him? Like is it just vibes or…?

(This isn’t hate towards people who like Drew, I’m not trying to call him overrated or anything, I’m genuinely curious).

confession #882

[estonian-is-horrible]

Originally I didn't want to post this as I didn't find it funny or insightful enough, but thought that maybe someone will find it relatable or interesting to see how others see Estonia.

I moved to Estonia in 2012 and these kinds of jokes were starting to pop up more often. There wasn't a lot of (English language) memes around the foreigner experience in Estonia then, so even mostly unfunny / barely amusing posts had a better chance of being circulated (like the aforementioned "kaksteist kuud" type 'jokes').

Anyway. I'm not attempting humor now. This is my experience, and I make no claims to my experience being universal or well-informed, but thought I'd set the record straight(er) for people who've never visited Estonia:

1.a and 1.c - yeah. I mean yeah. But also no. People are surprisingly happy to share a genuine smile with a stranger, give or take some situational awareness. People generally don't smile out of obligation of reciprocity, but because they are happy to make a fleeting connection.

2. Silence is pleasant, and people here know when to enjoy it. The nature deserves your attention. Vast majority of people aren't weirdly silent.

3. 4. 9. and 16. - These points are the ones that make it sound like it's most definitely from 2010s. "People talk on Skype..." nobody talks on microsoft skype buddy. Nobody. "...when they're 2 meters away" wow people send each other memes without talking. Truly the pinnacle of observational comedy.

I mean, we all know this - Estonia takes its "internet as a basic human right" very seriously, and even super-rich countries built on exploitation and slavery like Germany, Switzerland, UK and USA have laughably inaccessible internet. When I wanted to get a free wifi in Switzerland in 2011 I had to fill out a form and register on some mcdonald's newsletter to get 15 minutes of wifi. Meanwhile in Estonia it was hard NOT to find a free wifi.

5. I mean... I never liked strangers talking to me on the street unless they're tourists asking for directions (or con artists/pickpockets pretending to be tourists asking for directions). If anything, this just narrows down the country of origin of the OP.

Culture shock is a very interesting phenomenon, and just because I don't particularly relate to this or other points, doesn't mean it's not a valid experience.

6. OK buddy sounds like someone didn't discover 100µg vitamin D supplements yet

7. 🤷‍♀️ normaalne 🤷‍♂️

8. YES. You enjoy what little sunshine you can. Good choice.

10. See point 6 and/or consider getting diagnosed and/or medicated for depression if you find people talking irritating.

Without genuinely trying to judge the OP, what often happens with culture shock, and to some extent, with any habit change, is that at first you are uncomfortable with the new default (eg. people not talking on a tram), then you get used to it, and then you start hating your previous behavior and start judging people harshly for something you'd have done just a year ago. Possibly in part because you've realized your faux pas, but don't have a good strategy for dealing with guilt and shame - but that's just a wild guess.

11. I haven't given in to the sauna craze yet, but I would probably change the tune if I had one in my apartment. With these seven months of winter? Steam me soft and fry me crispy idc

12. and 20. When talking to both foreigners and locals, there seemed to be two polar opinions - (1) estonians are always on time and (2) estonians are always late. Genuinely, I've heard the same two opinions from dozens of people over the past 12 years. Mostly I find that people appreciate being on time, but aren't rude about it.

13. 14. and 16. Well. Again, "wow different country has different food" is both banal and boring, but also fascinating when you dig into it. I feel like "<country of origin> versus estonian cuisine" could be a 10 page essay for almost every single country.

17. again OP doxing themselves as USAnian/Australian possibly

18. again... this point has incel vibes. Literally the length of hugs has no bearing on whether someone wants to date you or not. Otherwise wow i guess I have 100 girlfriends and boyfriends now (yes they eat kohuke)

19. haha weather.... temperatures... amirite guys