#worlds without number

[briarwickart]

sometimes your party's ranger does something so cool (like ride the benevolent personification of a corrupted forest into battle) that your character carves a figurine inspired by the event.

[level2janitor]

Introduction to the OSR

what's an OSR? it's a game that's kinda like old-school D&D. or is old-school D&D. or is compatible with old-school D&D. an OSR game generally has some or all of the following principles:

low character power with highly lethal combat. in old-school D&D a 1st-level fighter has d8 hit points and a longsword does d8 damage, and you die at 0HP. this is not to ensure characters die all the time but to emphasize the next bullet point:

emphasis on creative problem solving. most situations cannot be solved by straightforward use of your abilities (such as charging into every situation with swords drawn, if a fighter), so the game tests lateral, outside-the-box thinking.

emphasis on diegetic progression. spells are found, not obtained automatically on level-up. you get XP by finding gold more than killing monsters. most of your cool abilities come from magic items. making alliances & hiring followers is encouraged.

focus on managing inventory, resources, risk, and time. the players are constantly faced with meaningful decisions; this is the heart of the game.

very sandbox-oriented. the focus on creative problem solving means the game must be accommodating to players taking a course of action the GM didn't plan for. use lots of random tables to generate emergent story. some elements of new simulationism.

high tactical transparency, i.e., the optimal course of action is rarely system-specific, and ideally very possible for a new player to intuit.

usually semi-compatible with old D&D, but not always. usually rules-lite, but not always.

what does the OSR mostly NOT do?

focus on character builds. these change the focus too much to be on the rules than the fiction, can create situations where stuff everyone should be able to do is an ability locked to one class, and impede tactical transparency.

resolve everything with a die roll. combat uses dice to be scary, unpredictable and most importantly not your default course of action. everything else should bring up dice rarely - dice are your plan B when your plan A fails. the best plans need no dice.

use linear storytelling or put players into a writer/GM role. linear storytelling gets in the way of the decision-making so core to the playstyle; letting players write details into the setting is mutually exclusive with them discovering it.

rules for everything. 400 pages of crunch is worse at simulating a believable world than the GM and players' shared understanding. OSR games rely constantly on GM ruling.

mostly still applies to all the above. making your system a "pure" OSR game comes second to doing what's best for your game.

System recommendations

old D&D or a retroclone

old-school D&D - or old school essentials or basic fantasy or swords & wizardry, which are old D&D's mechanics repackaged with quality-of-life tweaks (and the upside of not giving WOTC your money) - are usually the go-to when recommending someone's first OSR game. they're actually not my first pick, though!

PROS:

very complete, with more robust rules than a lot of the lighter games on this list.

100% compatibility: most OSR adventures are statted for old school essentials. converting them to other OSR systems is usually simple, but not 1-for-1.

easier to find games for. anyone interested in the OSR space knows what old school essentials is.

CONS:

jank. these games largely still have weird saves, level limits for non-humans, some still have descending AC, etc etc. it's not that bad but it is there

i hate thief skills. lots of essential dungeoneering actions are locked to the thief class as abilities, with abysmally low success chances. this is stuff i prefer being handled without a roll. thieves in this system suck and make everyone else worse at dungeon crawling by existing.

there's just lots of really cool shit in other systems i'm about to go into that you just don't get here

Knave 1e and its various hacks

this is a 7-page super-lightweight system that boils everything down to just the essentials.

rolling a character takes like 5 minutes. roll stats, roll gear, roll traits, go. done. it's great.

characters are defined entirely by stats and gear, no classes. wanna be a fighter, have high strength and carry a big sword and armor. wanna be a wizard, have high intelligence and fill your inventory with spells. item slots are elegant and pretty limited.

initiative is instant: roll d6. 1-3, monsters go first. 4-6, PCs go first. swingy, but god it is so smooth and shaves like the most boring 5 minutes off of every combat

monsters are so very elegant. old D&D gives monsters a "hit dice" rating to determine their HP, e.g. a 3HD monster rolls 3d8 for hit points. knave takes this number (HD) and uses it for attack rolls and saves (aside from exceptionally bad/good saves), so a knave statblock looks something like this.

spells are all one or two sentences long & extremely easy to remember.

7 pages is so light. i have the system basically memorized.

DOWNSIDES: there's no dungeon crawling rules (standard for meatier OSR games & something i consider essential) and no real bestiary, though the second point isn't a huge deal cause they're so easy to make. it also kinda assumes you already know how to run OSR games, so there's very little real advice or guidance.

KNAVE HACKS

knave 1e is in creative commons & comes with an editable word doc for you to publish with modifications, so there's a ton of variants (there was a spreadsheet of them somewhere, but i can't find it).

Grave is a favorite - i'm two years into a grave campaign and it's fantastic. it's a dark-souls-y version of knave with some really elegant innovations.

you have a set number of deaths before you for-reals die, as every character plays an undead as is dark souls tradition. makes it good for OSR beginners! being able to tell when you're close to your final death is really good - it lets you emotionally prepare for losing your character & raises the stakes more the more you die. (though honestly you should probably cut the number of extra deaths in half, it's super generous)

XP and gold are combined into one resource, souls. legendary creatures drop big souls you can make into magic items. this has ended up being the coolest thing in my current campaign. my players love finding powerful souls to make into magic items it's so fun

uses preset packages of stats/gear instead of knave's rolled ones, filling the role of more traditional character classes. has the wonderful side effect of not making you get stuck with low stats cause you rolled bad one time.

you have stamina equal to your empty item slots. you spend stamina on spells if you're a caster, or free maneuvers (on top of your attack at no action cost) if you're not. it's super elegant.

there's 3 classes of spells: wizardry for intelligence, holy magic for wisdom, and witch stuff for charisma. nice and intuitive.

there's a page of 50 magic items each a couple sentences long. this PDF is worth it just for the magic items.

DOWNSIDE: see the downsides for knave 1e. all still apply.

i enjoyed grave so much i made a variant of it with the dark souls bits removed (and some dungeon crawl rules added!) to use for my standard fantasy campaigns.

Knave 2e

sadly knave 2e is not purchasable yet (i backed it on kickstarter so i have access, though). but when it comes out i highly recommend it.

much larger and denser than knave 1e. it finally has dungeon crawling rules, it has GM and player guidance, everything is refined and the layout is so so nice and readable.

combat is a bit more interesting than 1e. you can break your weapon against an enemy to deal max damage. you get a free maneuver on high attack rolls.

there's rules for stuff like alchemy, warfare, building a base. it all kicks ass.

there are so many goddamn tables. i rifle through it anytime i need inspiration.

DOWNSIDES: some of the new rules are a little untested & wonky. introducing randomness into how often your rations spoil or your lights go out can cause issues.

Mausritter

you play tiny little mice! in a world full of big dangerous things that want to eat mice. cat = dragon. you get it. what more could you want

the mouse thing is just super intuitive. you get the dynamic between you and the big scary lethal world. fantastic OSR game to introduce kids

nice and robust ruleset; nothing feels missing

tons of super nice GM stuff! faction rules, tools for rolling up hexcrawls and dungeons, plenty of tables

super clean readable layout. font isn't too small to avoid being intimidating. guidance is really nice and clear.

combat is autohit. super fast & lethal.

100% free

look mausritter is just. good. i wanna run it so bad someday

Worlds Without Number

sort of a middle ground between OSR stuff and 5e. paid version here free version here

lots of classes, at least in the paid version. the free version comes with just the warrior, expert and mage. there's feats and more of a focus on builds than most OSR games. if you like more mechanical build variety than a typical OSR game, this is a great game for you!

extremely good multiclassing. y'know how in most games if you just mash together two classes you think are cool you'll end up with a total mess? not here! every combo is viable and works fine! easily the best multiclassing of any game i've touched

an absurd amount of GM stuff and tables. easily more than any of the other stuff i've praised for also having them. but personally i haven't dug into them as much, so i can't really comment on them

skills the way modern D&D has them. you roll dice and try to beat a target number. i don't tend to like rolled skills, but most people do, so if that's your thing WWN has them

DOWNSIDES

the layout is terrible. everything is a huge wall of text with very little use of bold text or bullet points to draw attention to the important bits. the table of contents has like 15 things in it for a 400-page book! i couldn't find any of the paid-version-exclusive classes for like a month after i bought it! looking up rules is a nightmare.

the way the default setting handles "evil races" is like an exaggerated parody of all the problematic aspects of how D&D handles it. like, it wants so bad for you to have an excuse to genocide sentient free-willed people. but at least the default setting is easy to chuck in the trash

Dungeon Crawl Classics

the goal of this system is to take all of the crazy gonzo moments people remember playing old-school D&D in their childhood and turn all of that up to 11 while cutting the stuff that doesn't add to that. i think a lot of its innovations have ended up kind of standard in newer OSR stuff (like fighters getting maneuvers with their attacks), but it still has more to offer.

the funnel: you start the game with four randomly rolled dipshit peasants that you then throw into a meatgrinder to get horribly killed. you pick one of the survivors to be your 1st-level character.

maneuvers: fighters roll an extra die with each attack that gets bigger as you level. if it's a 3 or higher, you get to do a cool thing on top of your attack. pretty standard for OSR games, but this game popularized it!

crit tables: fighters also get more crits and nastier crits as they level. every crit, you roll on the crit table. maybe you chop off a dude's arm. maybe you just knock them over. maybe you shatter their shield. it's very cool

spell tables: i don't really like roll-to-cast mechanics, generally. but DCC goes so all-in on roll-to-cast that it still looks fun as hell to watch. you cast a fireball and maybe it goes how you want. or maybe you explode, or you nuke everything in a half-mile radius, or from now on you permanently ignite flammable materials you touch, or whatever. casters just have to put up with turning into a weird mutated mess across a campaign

there's no dungeon crawl rules, no encumbrance - this game is all about the big over-the-top wacky shit, and is not really interested in the more down-to-earth number crunching. it's more in the you-die-hilariously-all-the-time area of OSR than the you-avoid-death-through-clever-play area. not really my thing but the system knows exactly what it wants to be and i respect it

iron halberd

this one is mine! as the author i'm not qualified to tell you what isn't good about my system, so just assume it's worse than i make it sound, but here's a bunch of the selling points

semi-random character creation where you flip back and forth between rolling dice and getting your own input. roll stats, pick ancestry. pick starting gear kit, roll different dice based on which kit you picked. etc etc. stats are random but all equally viable (no rolling incredibly low or high stats). every time i run this game the character creation is a hit. seriously go roll up a character it'll sell you on the whole thing

you start out a lot stronger than a standard OSR character but grow way more slowly. i don't like 4th-level characters being 4 times as strong as 1st-level ones; HP never gets that high. emphasis is more on diegetic progression instead.

way too many subsystems for alchemy, crafting, strongholds, warfare, renown, rituals, likes 9 pages of magic items, a whole subsystem for becoming a cleric mid-campaign. i couldn't help myself i love this shit

in my current campaign we had a player permanently sacrifice some max HP to become a necromancer after deliberating on whether that's a good idea for like thirty seconds, which instantly made me think my necromancy system is a success

also free

Adventure recommendations

(in rough order of size)

Moonhill Garden (by Emiel Boven): look at this. look at it! this is like the best template for a little dungeon in an OSR game. all of the little factions are tied together. this would be a great oneshot to introduce people to an OSR system with.

A gathering of blades (by Ben Milton): a system-neutral, one-page sandbox. i ran this for an iron halberd game and it went super well. lasted like 7 sessions. highly recommend.

The Waking of Willowby Hall (by Ben Milton): a single dungeon with a million things going on. it's super chaotic with half a dozen different factions crashing into each other and a big angry goose. highly recommend, especially for kids

The Black Wyrm of Brandonsford (by Chance Dudinack): small sandbox with a fun fairytale vibe and a very fleshed-out little town. and a big nasty dragon.

Evils of Illmire (by Zack Wolf): this is a very dense, entire campaign's worth of hexcrawl in a very compact package for like $5. it doesn't do anything particularly new, but the value-for-money is absurd and it's a really good template for how to do a sandbox if you're used to 5e adventures

Ask me anything!

if anything here is unclear or intrigues you, send me asks! i love helping people get into OSR games. i'll link frequently asked questions here if i get any.

[stonegearstudios]

A Spear Brings Sorrow

To kill a Unicorn is a tragedy.

To murder one and construct a weapon from its remains is a sin against the world.

Hey all, so I'm releasing my first ttrpg micro supplement. It's part of a ongoing project I'm doing to train myself to actually finish things.

I'm pretty happy with the results, not only do I have this fantastic art from @regal-bones but I've made up statblocks for three common fantasy systems, and a backstory to help you insert the spear and its wielder into your game.

You can get it here: https://mb11.itch.io/a-spear-brings-sorrow

I'm really terrible at promotion so any sharing is quite appreciated, as well as constructive critique.

[blueringart]

Finally did a proper drawing of my PC in the game @stonegearstudios is GMing. I love playing a warrior; everything I touch dies and it's beautiful. (COMMISSIONS)

[haveyouplayedthisttrpg]

Have you played Worlds without Number

By Kevin Crawford

Worlds Without Number is a fantasy role-playing game, one fully compatible with the hit sci-fi game Stars Without Number. It's built from the ground up to provide gritty, hard-edged adventure in the fathomless future of the Latter Earth, a fantastic realm of time-lost sorcery, savage foes, and barbaric splendor. The cold steel in the fists of your heroes and the half-understood sorcery in their tomes must suffice to overcome the monstrous remnants of ancient alien rulers and the present depredations of ruthless lords and hideous beasts alike. The riches of lost ages await in the subterranean Deeps that once held their kingdoms, and even the heavens above are not beyond the reach of the recklessly daring.

[maximumzombiecreator]

I loved your post detailing what makes a megadungeon work and was wondering if you had any system recs for playing one for the more crunch-minded table.

This is an interesting question! In another post I recommended some OSR systems, but those mostly lean away from the crunch side of things. Of those, Worlds Without Number is definitely considered one of the crunchier OSR systems, since it has something pretty close to feats from more modern D&D incarnations, just adapted for more old school style play. There's a free version of the rules on drivethrurpg that I would really recommend looking at, and if that looks appealing, that's what I'd go with.

2nd Edition AD&D brings a lot more crunch to the table, though again, I feel like it's a bit difficult to get into for more modern players. I'd love it if an OSE style refresh of it existed, but I don't really know of one. The closest I know of is For Gold & Glory, which from what I've looked at does compile and clean up 2e rules, but it's missing Kits, which are the main crunch-adding feature I think a crunchy table would want from it. You could possibly just grab the 2e PDFs off of one of the various archive sites and see if that works for you. While I do think the rules are a bit messy, they're not as completely chaotic as 1e stuff.

That said, I don't think an OSR game is necessary to run a megadungeon. The things that I feel more modern D&D descendants lack for a megadungeon is that combat needs to be quick (at the bare minimum for low-stakes combat) and that attrition needs to matter. These are things that OSR games do, but non-OSR games can do that too.

But I'm actually at a bit of a loss for fantasy games with more modern design sensibilities that have both crunch and fast combat. Crunchy modern fantasy RPGs have tended to go in the direction of PF2e where combat is interesting and deep, but takes too long to really be suited for the kind of play I was describing. I can think of some more modern crunchy games with fast combat, but they tend to be sci-fi or cyberpunk. And yes I do want to run a cyberpunk megadungeon now, but I think that's another post.

Would be curious to see what others recommend as well.

[gilgalahad]

Ariel Perez

[artboykeith]

A proper drawing of Snix Moonspine he is a kobold merchant with the ability to turn into a wyvern his goal in life was to gather a magnificent hoard and live out his days as a dragon

[default-cube]

thinking about what a perfect (for me) fantasy ttrpg system would look like.

a great base system to hack onto would be sword and wizardry complete revised along with the book of options. the classes in that have to me the perfect balance between being simple and easy to pick up while still being clearly distinct from each other. though i would probably substitute in the d6 thief skills from carcass crawler #1.

one thing i do not like however, as sacred as it is in osr games, is the 3d6 down the line attribute generation. or the distinction between attribute score and bonus in general. i much prefer having attribute scores be directly the bonuses and having full control over them. so i would add in something like the the attribute generation in knave 2e, where you start with 3 points to distribute as you choose and then get further points on level ups. though of course that means i have to redo some stuff in the s&wcr classes. i can live with just scrapping prime requisite xp boni completely, but for example what about the monk abilities that only activate at 15 DEX/WIS? i guess they can just activate at +2 but the whole thing would probably need some rebalancing.

i'm also partial to attacks auto-hitting like in mark of the odd games. though of course that has huge ramifications for everything else. obviously it affects how armor works and all AC values have to be redone. but also, what would the to-hit improvements of e.g. the fighter translate into? maybe something like shock damage from worlds without number?

for inventory management, i really like slot-based inventory systems. something like in mausritter is just really pleasing to me.

do any of you have suggestions for how one could fit all this together? anything awesome i missed that should be in there?

[dragonatthedinnertable]

We had our first session of our new D&D campaign today! Character sheets worked out, lego minis created, then off to play!

I'm running the Stonehell megadungeon, in Worlds Without Number. 2 hours was just enough to get the party (with a farm boy with pretensions to theatre in tow to carry stuff) through the canyon gatehouse. They talked with ghosts, stole a bag of tools from some wasps, and murderised a group of goblins. Ix the Thing got to eat a variety of new monsters.

[riteliso]

Howdy. Here's a gunslinging tabletop goblin I play for a worlds without numbers campaign my girl is running-- her name is Midna Mudsucker.

She is an aggressively sapphic vices-loving gambler with a tragic backstory-- (surprising coming from me, I'm sure.)

I intended to play her as more of a loose canon, but as tends to happen with tabletop groups, by the pure nature of her not being a heartless unthinking monster in practice, she's by far the most righteous in the group if you follow their actual actions from the beginning of the campaign. That's what happens as soon as your character cares about at least one thing, smh.

[wasabiburger]

The third episode of the anthology actual play, Gunpowder & Glass is out! In this episode, we follow Amethelia (played by Heather) a seasoned necromancer having to help clean up the mess a younger necromancer caused in a hostile territory!

[k25ff]

Discord suggestion for the symbols of Worlds Without Number's basic magical disciplines – High Magic, Elementalism and Necromancy. (Worlds Without number has a free version, give it a peruse. It's great.) (1617)

[several-things]

Naaaa wie geht's dir so? :3

Ja jetzt wo ich noch wach bin kann ich auch antworten, ne?:P

Ja ganz okay, ich erhole mich grade von der berühmt-berüchtigten Hamsterbäckchen-, aka Weißheitszahn OP(aua)🤷‍♀️

Weil ich grade einem Freund seine eigene Mini Figur zum Rollenspielen male, zeig ich dir mal meine eigene, ne? (Schon wieder ne tsk tsk tsk)

Danke dass du fragst^^

Bei dir so?:3

[blueringart]

I'm supposed to be drawing a Big Thing right now, but I took a quick break to finally hammer out my character token for a game of Worlds Without Number I'm in (GM'd by @stonegearstudios).

I am, of course, playing an orc, because if a game allows me to pretend to be seven feet tall and also green (the best colour) obviously I will jump at the chance to do so. His name is Ghiraz and he's been keeping a diary of his adventures, in brave defiance of the fact that he does not know how to spell. (COMMISSIONS)

[dimension20liveblog]

I just realized we have 3 of 4 of our Worlds Without Numbers friends! What a delightful time in a season so familial in nature.

This will crush me