adeadhorse

[adeadhorse]

>  I think it’s weird that the gang are separated for the majority of it)

Yeah. The only person Logan even talks to in the entire finale is Quinn (he had one quick scene with Michael and Lola separately but that’s it). I was disappointed to not see Logan’s reaction to chase returning. I think that his friendship to Chase was important to him, even if the show didn’t really show it. Also I know it was only for one second in Fake Roommate but he did say he missed Chase and I generally think he was very affected by chase being absent. Just disappointed really. In general this movie feels off with the length. You can cut Michael's entire weird subplot and use it for the actual friend group they talk to everyday finding out about Quinn and Logan/their reaction to Chase returning as well Vince and Chase actual talking. You could argue about James needing more parts but he was SO BORING that i didn't think a closure was even needed for him.

It's easily Dan's worst finale, even though I think iGoodbye is pretty overrated. Also hilarious to me that the draft title was 'The Dance' when you don't even get to the actual prom until 30mins in. The pacing is just a mess, and specifically the first half with Michael very much feels like deliberately stalling. Like, was Chase even joking when he said Lola missed nothing important? Nothing meaningful happens until the last 10 minutes and then it's just a rushed "and they're all happy the end" and then that fucking movie undid that anyway

I agree with you about Logan; of course he missed Chase, they all did, and it feels odd to only highlight Michael and Lola's reaction, though I understand the former more than the latter. But really all the characters are treated incredibly flippantly; even Quinn and Logan sort of fall out of the movie after they've done their love declaration. I do not care about James at all, but he arguably needed to be involved specifically for Zoey and Chase's closure - put in some kind of confrontation, or at least some sort of explanation. Anything. Though as is, I do think it's funny that Stacey gets more of a resolution than James does.

[adeadhorse]

do you think sean's performance in chasing zoey feels sort of "off"? i've heard other people say it is and i think i agree, but i don't know why it feels different

So I probably don't think it's as off as other people do. I actually think his scenes are the only with any real life in them, other than probably the Quogan bits (the movie is honestly very boring and I think it's weird that the gang are separated for the majority of it).

It's quite possible that Sean looked at what is literally a 10 minute cameo and decided to phone it in a bit, but I think the scene where he sees Zoey again is better than that. Even just hearing his voice during the phone call always makes me sort of sigh in relief like oh, finally, the show feels better again. There is a sadness to the actual kissing scene, probably because Chase would have a concussion after falling like that, but that could be because it was the last scene filmed. You could also argue it's because he knows about James, but I actually think it's because it feels more like Chase has moved on; I know that I and a couple of other people have headcanoned that he grew up a lot in England, and I think that scene is why.

The only part I'd argue is a bit off is the actual dance scenes. That does alternate between feeling a bit more phoned in and then hyper, but frankly the entire cast seemed to spent most of S4 being hyper. And it doesn't change the reunion scenes with Lola and Michael being sweet, so I'm not too bothered by it.

[adeadhorse]

Another ask is that

How do you think Chase would’ve reacted to Logan’s anger management message? Given it was all over the web he must’ve found out in some way or form.

Tho to me; this episode is pretty much non canon in my book. Most of s4 is off but this is the episode that doesn’t even feel like Zoey 101 the most out of all them: Zoey, Dustin and James are completely terrible people in this episode, Logan even at is worse moments (besides webcam) is nowhere near as bad in this episode (tho what Zoey, Dustin and James did was worse) and Quinn and Lola are idiots. Not to mention the events of this episode are never mentioned again (if it was a show like SpongeBob it would be fine but for a show like this it’s kinda a big deal)

Sorry for rambling about how terrible this episode is, I just wanted to ask you if what think Chase would’ve thought of all that since no one else did. Hope all is well!

Honestly, I have never thought about it before, but good point.

I am also going to ramble, but please keep in mind that I have barely watched the episode because I hate S4, so my memory is pretty hazy.

Anger Management as a whole is indicative of what's wrong with S4, which is the genre change. It's one thing to no longer dip your toes into full drama because your actual main character is no longer there, but it doesn't even go back to the previous vibe of S1 or S2. Instead it goes full Drake & Josh, which had way more pop culture references from the start like Oprah and the Dr Phil parody, and makes sense because George Doty is running the writing instead of Dan, and George did a lot of D&J writing, especially in S4.

So the whole thing is based on Alec Baldwin's voicemail to his daughter which would have happened only a month or two before filming, but like...why put that into a kids show. Who is the target audience here. There's no commentary on anything anyway, and it feels weird to do an episode about how yelling at children is wrong when you're on a Dan Schneider show and that's his entire thing, so the whole thing is just mean-spirited.

That said, it's still just an exaggerated, worse version of an established plot device, which is to take some sort of 'revenge' on Logan. He was always presented as a kind of antagonist, so the payback was often deserved in some capacity. Chase was also very often the deliverer of it in some capacity; the rat down his pants in Zoey's Tutor is probably not deserved (and is arguably questionable), but I don't mind it, probably because I actually kind of like Chase's meanness in S3. So I would argue that how James behaves is pretty much how Chase would act in the same situation, especially if he'd just started dating Zoey. The issue is that James just comes off as being an arsehole because he has none of the established history with Logan that Chase does, and I'd argue that Austin and Matthew have none of the same chemistry and affection that Sean and Matthew had, which I think helped make some of the revenge plots feel more good-natured.

In terms of how S4 actually happened, I think it's likely that Chase would have reached out - both to provide payback idea to Michael and to be like "dude, what the hell is up with you?" to Logan. That said, he'd likely also just been told that the girl he's in love with started dating his replacement (I know this isn't confirmed by canon, but I maintain one of the boys would have told him), so I think it's understandable he'd keep his distance. Especially if he's clinically depressed.

In conclusion, S4 is bad and this episode is bad and it's a lot easier to ignore than to consider it canon (and it's always right to shit on S4).

[adeadhorse]

One thing that I’ve been thinking about in the film is that

Zoey ghosted Chase while they were at Hawaii, then what the hell was the plan for senior year??? It is assumed by most people that Chasing Zoey was the junior year prom finale and that had the show had a season 5, it would’ve been senior year before the school shutdown but like literally what was the plan???

Quinn, Zoey and Lola are still roommates and it is assumed that James moved out and Chase is back to being roommates with Logan and Michael but like literally what was the senior year like? The whole friend group bounding together without Zoey and Chase?

I always wondered this because that in the movie was a terrible way to make the trash ending in season 4 somehow even worse

"Make the trash ending of season 4 somehow even worse" is pretty much my thoughts on what I've heard about the movie, too. Like there was never going to be a season 5 and the original ending is lazy, but it's lazy in a way that at least pretends to give the audience what they want. I have no idea who the movie was for because it screws over their existing (thin) characterisations and provides literally nothing the audience wanted. But it's one of those things where you can tell there was really no plan or any in depth thought or consideration to this story beat. The movie is very much not canon to me, the same way the terrible 2015 short is, for similar but ultimately different reasons.

[adeadhorse]

https://www.tumblr.com/wishesinthedark/691922206719082496/my-theory-is-that-dan-schneider-had-a?redirect_to=%2Fwishesinthedark%2F691922206719082496%2Fmy-theory-is-that-dan-schneider-had-a&source=blog_view_login_wall have you seen this tumbler post explaining a indepth theory on a Sean and Dan feud and Dan being salty that Sean left to focus on school for season 4? It’s a interesting read

Honestly I feel like 'salty' is a bit of an understatement with what's outlined there. But yeah, I think if people are (understandably) offended by Nicole's OMGD diagnosis and think it's indicative of Dan's treatment and dismissal of Alexa, then it makes sense for people to look at Fake Roommate and S4 more broadly and question why certain choices were made.

[adeadhorse]

Have you seen How I Met Your Mother? I ask because it’s another “will they won’t they” main couple premises that people weren’t crazy about and liked the secondary ship more than the main one. If so, any thoughts on that show? If not, have you seen any other LA shows that had will they won’t they and which ones did it either right or wrong?

I have not seen HIMYM, though what I've heard about both the attitude towards women and the finale makes me inclined to not watch it.

I've seen Friends, which is probably the most notorious will they/won't they trope, and the one Z101 gets compared to the most. I was very into Ross/Rachel as a kid, but I now think Monica/Chandler is the superior ship as most people do. The constant breaking up of Ross/Rachel was tiresome, but for me the bigger problem is that Ross is a total arsehole and Rachel was right to outgrow him, which is why I actually prefer Joey/Rachel together (he would have gone to Paris with her change my mind).

JD/Elliott from Scrubs are very similar because JD is the worst part of that show, though in fairness them getting together permanently ended up being a network decision, not a show runner one. The X-Files also completely fumbled Mulder and Scully getting together (technically not an LA show because it was shot in Vancouver but I'm counting it).

I'd say Jake/Amy from B99 was the trope done right, even though I'm not a huge fan of the way they actually got together. The fact that they stayed together rather than constantly breaking up was really nice, and proved you didn't need to make a relationship unstable for it to be interesting (even though I think they really fucked up Casecation and I hate it).

Other kids shows also did it well; I always really liked how Ned's Declassified handled their main relationship. Kataang did it pretty well too, though Kim Possible is probably the winner for animated shows (Could It Be is simply the friends to lovers anthem of all time).

[adeadhorse]

did you watch or hear anything about Quiet on Set documentary? it is absolutely terrifying and hearing even more stuff on what happened behind the scenes is terrifying :(

also hope you’ve been doing well, it’s been since awhile since the account was active so hope you’ve been doing well for yourself!

hey, thanks for thinking of me and checking in. i would not say i have been doing well for myself but i am ok, so that's something. i hope you are also as well as possible in these trying times.

i have heard a lot about quiet on set but i haven't watched it. it is horrible to hear about how awful people's experiences were and i hope sharing it widely has helped them. i also really hope that this does trigger some serious change when it comes to protecting child performers, and generally reducing how abusive this industry is towards most people involved.

[adeadhorse]

Hi! No need to apologize, I appreciate your honesty! Lol As for someone who spent lots of time thinking about these characters and where they would be after all this time I could understand why they may not like it.

I definitely agree that Zoey’s screen time was a bit excessive. Especially when the OG series did a good job for the most part making sure the other cast member had an equal amount of screen time. (TBH season 4 only proved that Zoey was kinda boring without Chase 👀)

As for Zoey being a producer, I didn’t think it was too far fetched for her character (there were like a couple of episodes were she should an interest in TV. The Jet-X and the Webcast episode) Yes, she was mostly interested in fashion design but maybe TV was a safer option? Lmao I guess they could have a dressed that in the movie.

Majority of the cast not being on screen for a little over 10 years was concerning but Erin and Sean’s performance was really good! (especially Erin she killed it!!) JL was ok. Still a needs more charisma but was way better than her recent projects 😬. Logan was ok. Stacey and Mark were good. Micheal was done so dirty ( he rarely has any lines) so I couldn’t make a fair judgement. 😐

Haha I'm glad my honesty didn't go to waste. Like I get that this was very much a Jamie Lynn vehicle but it really just...shouldn't be? The show worked best as an ensemble for a reason, and if they'd talked to any actual fan they likely would have heard that most people like Chase as the main character, not her. This movie also clearly saw that S4 needed fixing and yet it just...made it worse? Which is kind of impressive.

That's valid, I can see where you're coming from. Like you said, it would be nice if they'd acknowledged her interest in fashion and had that as part of her failure to achieve her dreams or whatever. Instead, her being a producer just read to me as nothing more than a plot contrivance. It's very Hallmark TV movie (if they made a sequel that's a Christmas TV movie and Chase suddenly owns a bakery then I will be all in).

I'm glad JL has improved slightly, especially if she was on-screen that much, and I'm pleasantly surprised to hear that Sean was decent (Erin doesn't surprise me because she's one of the few that has continued to act). Chris just BAFFLES me like did he pull out of the project part-way? Hell he was the main male lead in S4. (It's also annoying as a writer when, theoretically, I would like to only focus on a few characters instead of all of them, but I try to find something for everyone to do because I know that every character is someone's favourite. That consideration really did not seem to be taken here, which is disappointing in an "official" sequel.)

[adeadhorse]

I haven’t gotten a chance to watch the Zoey 102 movie until recently. I walked in with really really low expectations. Some people are definitely trashing it because of the whole controversy with Britney (which is complex and more layer than people would like to believe) and not focusing on the actual film.

It was actually not bad at all. I quite enjoyed it and it was pretty fun compared to most reboots of our childhood shows that I’ve seen. I didn’t love it, but I didn’t hate it. A solid 6/10. The only issue is that I felt that it was a bit rushed (causing hurried explanations and a bit lack of chemistry between certain characters) A one season reboot show would have actually worked better in this case to build the story more carefully.

I know that the director recently said in an interview that they are think about a sequel movie. I wouldn’t be mad at it if they give it a better pace and give the other characters more screen time (especially scenes with Michael, Logan and Chase)

I’m not sure if you watched the movie yet or intend to but someone like yourself (who based on your writing really knows the depth of these characters and their world) I would love to hear your opinion of the movie if you ever do.

Hello, I am glad you enjoyed it! I agree with you that people solely bashing the show because of what happened with Britney and Alexa gets tiresome, because the original show had some merit despite those issues, and because you can just decide to not watch the movie instead of constantly talking about it (it's not like anyone is really on JL's side anyway).

I have no intention of watching it but @queenlova101 kindly gave me an extremely thorough rundown. To be blunt, I hated it. The downside of writing these characters for thousands of words is you do get to "know" them, so I think it's possible that I would have hated a reboot no matter how good it was because it was different to my version of them. Part of that is circumstance - anything is possible in a fanfic, compared to real life where you have budgets and availabilities. But I've seen other people say it didn't really feel like the original show, and to me they just made some baffling choices that shows they had no idea what the fans actually wanted or even liked about the original show.

Zoey should not be the main character to that extent (or at all really. Also why is she a producer), you should pander to the Quogan fans more, and most of all, you should have Chase and Michael (and Logan, but especially those two) interact as much as possible instead of not at all. I hate What Did Zoey Say with a passion, and Dan could not write for shit in 2015, but even he got that right. It feels like they told ChatGPT to write a script only going off the character names and every rom-com that got released c. 2008-2012.

I agree with you about the one-season reboot. Before I started actually writing fanfic I semi-planned out a season and a movie because I was more interested in screenwriting at the time. So again, I feel like I have potentially thought more about this show than anyone actually involved in the movie, so being disappointed was somewhat inevitable. I am also, at my core, a hater.

I personally hope they don't do a sequel movie or anything else. Neither attempt at an "adult" continuation has worked, it's just fallen into the trap most other reboots have of not having them change since high school and undermining a lot of what people liked about the show (I don't love PCA but that's! The main! Draw! You just shot yourself in the foot!). Frankly I would just like them to put the S3 cast (minus JL) in a new show with similar vibes and call it a day. That I think would actually be fun, and would make more sense than whatever they are doing now.

[adeadhorse]

when i die i want the zoey 101 cast to lower me into my grave so they can let me down one last time

[adeadhorse]

no major spolier but 102 100% shows that Chase is from Baltimore, debunking all of the fandom's nod that he was from boston

To be fair I think a lot of that was written before The Radio aired but good to have it confirmed.

[adeadhorse]

I have watched the reboot and you know what? I thought it was pretty good actually. For the sake of not spoiling it for anyone else I can message you privately with more specific thoughts I have or just wait a few days and I can put the rest in your ask box lol. My only (vague) complaint is the characterization of some of the characters. I get they’re not 15 anymore but still was a little strange (i.e. Stacey and Mark specifically). Other than that I’m glad they gave Zoey more depth (and failure lol).

I’m glad you thought it was decent! I 100% want spoilers and more in-depth thoughts; I’m intrigued that of all the characterisation they messed up it was those side characters but yay for giving Zoey something. Can Jamie Lynn act yet?

[adeadhorse]

cannot find it but i saw a post on here a couple of days ago about the whole "character A fell first but character B fell harder" dynamic and how character A is pining and came to accept that character B would never love them back while character B just wakes up one day like "we need to get married right now" and this is the exact dynamic chase/zoey should have

[adeadhorse]

quogan shippers new fanfic idea just dropped

[adeadhorse]

do you think Chase was video calling the gang off screen in S4? because there was NO WAY he returns and says “wow nothing happened while i was gone for 5 months”zoey dated james, Quinn and Mark Broke up, Quinn and Logan got together (that he wouldn't know because secret) and vince came back all in one semester and chase didn’t notice any of that in finale because we hate good writing.

"because we hate good writing" i am WHEEZING that's literally the entire vibe of S4 huh

The entire gang? No. And maybe not even super regularly, but Michael is a) absolutely emailing him with updates, especially to complain about getting a new roommate and b) SOMEONE (maybe not Michael because he doesn't want to hurt Chase, so Logan or idk Lola) is telling him that Zoey is dating his replacement. Michael is emailing him about Vince and asking whether he has any specific revenge fantasies he wants them to dish out on his behalf, and then sending an update saying "hey he's cool actually, also do you know how to get cheese stains out of clothing". And honestly at some point I think Chase stops replying, mostly because I headcanon him as being hardcore depressed but like, what are you even supposed to say? Glad you're all having fun with my replacement and the guy that violently beat me up, cheers.

I also personally headcanon Chase as knowing about Logan and Quinn. For one, I think that's what would have happened in S4 had Chase been there, but even in this scenario I think Logan just would have wanted to talk about it SO badly that if he didn't just spill it all out one video chat he would have kept dropping hints to the point that Chase is like "are you two...dating?". To which Logan would probably say "pfft no how could you think that", and Chase would say that he kept scheduling calls to ramble about nothing but it would usually involve Quinn, and he just mentioned a picnic, and he seems to be scheduling a LOT of time to specifically make fun of Quinn, like 2-3 hours worth, and something seems off. Queue Logan begging him not to tell anyone ie Michael, Chase agreeing, and Logan getting to work through his feelings.

So I do think he knew things by way of Logan and Michael which is why he's just chill in Chasing Zoey (though I think coming up with an in-universe reason for that is stupid because it is just transparently lazy as shit). But I think it's pretty clearly implied that Zoey hadn't spoken to him at all since the start of the season seeing as she didn't have his number and the girls were overly supportive of her relationship with James, so I think the inference is that they didn't talk to him much then either.

[adeadhorse]

[adeadhorse]

Who are your top 5 most disliked characters? Also, which character do you think deserved more screen time?

The gym coaches, especially the one that mispronounced sushi

Coco because her screaming all the time was not funny

James.

Stacey who was also rarely funny and got waaayyyy too much screen time.

Zoey in S4

Dana and Rebecca deserved more screen time. Dana basically got relegated to one line per episode by the end of S1 and never really got a chance to live up to her full potential. Daniella Monet is just a genuinely good actor who made Rebecca feel very real before switching quite effectively into evil bitch mode.