finalfantasythoughts

[finalfantasythoughts]

FFXV Thoughts - Development and Evolution

FFXV is one of my favorite entries in the franchise, in my personal top 3/5 (controversial though that may be). However, it's no secret that the game had a development riddled with problems and the result is felt in various aspects of the game. This also ties to why people prefer the "game" (at least the very limited parts we saw) when it was still Versus XIII or just under Nomura's direction. I wanted to look at some of the issues with the game as well as point out how certain elements from the old trailers translated into the final game, even though certain people try to make it out that XV and VsXIII share nothing but a few locations and characters because the final product didn't align with what they thought the game would be. I'm not going to mention combat really because while a bit oversimplified, I still enjoyed it (my biggest gripe is how awkwardly magic was handled). I know I'm beating a dead horse and some people are over the whole situation, but I had a lot of thoughts and wanted to share them as somebody who played XV years later so I had no expectations for a game that despite being shown off over many years, didn't necessarily reveal much. This will contain spoilers for the whole of XV so here's your warning.

I'll start by saying that one of the biggest losses for me personally was the change of the opening the game in Insomnia through the invasion to Kingsglaive. I see why they made the film and I enjoyed it while watching it, but I do wish we could've played it, as that was pivotal to the story and old trailers suggest it was planned to have a lot of introductions there, both character and plot-wise. Not to mention I'm just not very attached to Nyx and the movie original characters. Noctis' Japanese voice actor even revealed that about half of the original script took place here, which makes sense that it'd be dialogue heavy due to character/plot/world introductions, tutorials, early boss fights, etc. (correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe FF7 OG's script spends something like 30% in just Midgar, for comparison). My other biggest loss is the idea that we may have been able to interact more with Tenebrae at some point (a "leak" claimed it would be akin to a dungeon, but who knows).

I do think it's exaggerated how much changed though, at least from a view of the major story beats. Certain things got recontextualized (Kingsglaive being the largest example), but I think more survived than people think. They even used Nojima's original script as the base of the final game. There are many posts that show all the parallels and references to the old trailers, though they are spread to the game, DLC, anime and movie. It also seems that even a lot of Fabula Nova Crystallis elements were preserved, just using different names and replacing the FNC gods with the Astrals. Some of it, like the "eyes that see the light of expiring souls" (most likely a take on the concept of the Eyes of Etro) seem to have been cut, though Noct and Luna are still chosen ones by the gods, and possibly had near-death moments (Noct in the anime, scene with Luna being abused that was cut). Another plot that seems to involve sleep (rumored to be a dream world or somewhere Noct would dream of dead loved ones, something I believe connects to Hamlet if I remember correctly) was seemingly cut, though there are loose moments where Noctis sleeps/dreams (Luna's death, in the crystal with Bahamut, platinum demo, dreams of the Omen trailer aka why Regis sent him away, etc.). I do agree that the final version was in need of presenting itself better; fleshing out characters, events, and locations would have been beneficial for the story. Instead the guys were taken out of infiltrations and big moments regarding the empire which was somewhat disappointing, as the old trailers and interviews made it seem that they would be consistently involved in the politics/war.

At a time, the keyword of Versus XIII was apparently 'misery' and this was appropriate for all the characters. I would say this is still the case; after the fall of Insomnia, Eos is thrown into chaos and each character suffers. Noct is forced to come to terms with his position, destiny, etc. while trying to process the death of his father (and eventually Luna), destruction of his city, etc. Ignis has to worry about Noct and sees a vision of his death in his DLC, as well as going blind which brings into question his value to combat. Prompto has his birth exposed which throws him off psychologically, killing Verstael, not to mention that he was already self conscious and unsure about being part of the group. Gladio (admittedly isn't as intense as the others) has to worry about Iris post-invasion, his pride being wounded easily by Ravus, and feeling unsatisfied with Noct's shift into king. Other characters like Ravus, Luna, Regis, etc. also go through 'misery' throughout the battles with the Empire. The bleak world described in early interviews is still present, especially after the Starscrourge continues to spread and nights get longer, aided by the empire's manufacturing of daemons and invasions of prominent territories (remember in the World of Ruin section they say Lestallum in nearly the only safe place left in Eos). Nomura also stated that despite this being the main theme, it would still be balanced so as to not make the game feel oversaturated with sad scenes and be unpleasant, which I think is present in the final game. I see people expecting essentially no humor or things that are present in every FF, and personally I don't believe XV under Nomura would've done away with some of these things. In my opinion, this game was going to be okay with getting darker, but I also think people blow out of proportion/had the wrong expectations about how far it'd go.

Another argument I see a lot is that the final version of Noctis is completely changed from the original version, which I don't really agree with. Early trailers with the more brooding, cold and overpowered Noct seem mostly (if not entirely) conceptual, not to mention that Nomura specifically said not to let the trailers fool you into thinking these were good descriptors for his personality and that presenting him this way was a conscious decision (probably because it looks cool if we're being honest). In later trailers, we hear Noct speak and he sounds pretty "shounen" (not a bad thing) and his conversation with Stella also paints him as shy but fairly friendly. Now I think the final game version made some changes and shifted his arc to be more about responsibility than revenge (which is what people seemed to predict his arc would be from the old trailers), but again, I think more was preserved than people give credit for.

Then there's the Stella vs Luna debate. This has always fascinated me because even though the interaction between Noctis and Stella is nice (and I wish we'd gotten something similar with Luna), we know virtually nothing about Stella. In fact, it seems between initial planning stages and the 2013 trailer (aka Stella's last appearance), her role had changed. Storyboards show her seemingly as a childhood friend to Noctis like Luna. It's possible they met but didn't know who each other were and would still "meet" for the first time at the party in Insomnia, but I believe Nomura also said that he didn't really like Stella's character when he made her and that she had grown into one that the he liked over time (including when scenarios would've been finished). Between that and the fact that there was no mention of the Stella vs Noctis fight for years before her replacement, it really seems like once the scenario was more developed, her role had changed. I actually like Luna's character as well, she just happens to be in the camp of characters who didn't have their story presented very well. Looking at the XV media, her story is interesting; she essentially is a hostage to the empire and has a fated role forced on her, which she grows into and accepts. From what we see she's determined and capable, yet also reckless at times, and it's a shame we didn't really get to know her because she was interesting in her own right (and while she was a "strong" female lead, I do think the devs overhyped this fact for how little we end up seeing her and how many lines of hers were devoted to Noctis).

People also complain a lot about the Noctis and Luna romance (and some believe there would be better romance with Stella, but I'm pretty sure Nomura said they wouldn't be romantic). To me, the romance was more so born out of Noctis and Luna's high mutual respect for one another combined with cherished childhood memories. Both of their lives changed after Tenebrae was invaded; Noctis was growing up and learning more about his role to someday be king and Luna was a tool of the empire, replaced her late mother as oracle, and was growing physically weaker due to communicating with the gods (not to mention the scenes of abuse that were cut). The fact that Noctis and Luna desired to be around each other always made sense to me and their relationship was tragic in the way of something that's always out of reach, but I feel like the marketing/a couple scenes made it seem like more of a true love story like other FF games which wasn't really the case.

Another point of contention is specifically derived from the 2013 E3 trailer where it was publicly announced Versus would be XV. That trailer featured a lot of crazy set pieces moving through buildings and the moment leading up to Leviathan that lead people to lament those sections of the game for not looking as it did here. The problem is that those seem to be mock up "target goal" looking sections that seem to demonstrate the level of spectacle the engine could create but no guarantee that it would run properly on PS4. People also complain about the Altissia map size being so much smaller in the actual game, but it's possible that all that map in the trailer would only be "explored" in the scripted event we saw.

World of the Versus Epic is another interesting thing that everybody seems to run with as proof that XV was to be a trilogy. Yes Nomura seemed to hint that XV would not be a standalone title (then not long after said nothing was confirmed), but there are so many possibilities. It could've been more like the VII Compilation with spin-off prequel/sequel games or movies or anime specials, etc. I feel like XV was not going to be structured like the VII Remake, and if it were to get full blown sequels, would be more like KH or X-2, XIII-2, etc. especially since Versus XIII's script was completed in 2010 for a single PS3 title (unless the script got significantly longer). If anything, this "epic" could've been a way to continue using XV's assets to carry fans over until Remake and XVI (I believe Roberto Ferrari said that Versus at one point had a tentative date for release in 2014). The only other point is that Noctis' VA said there were "three times as many scenarios" and so some got cut. Now every game seems to have cut scenarios, and given the fact that FFXV has a shorter runtime than the majority of FF games for main story, the only way I could see a trilogy is if they were all relatively short games. But even then, considering the amount of characters and areas that could've been fleshed out more (not to mention all the script that changed for Kingsglaive), many of the cut scenarios probably could've fit in the game had the team had more time/focused less on the open world.

One other thing that I wish had carried over more was the FMV/CG cutscenes and some of the art direction of the older versions that gave the game a bit more of a grandiose feeling, not that I dislike the final's more grounded take. I have a feeling that the lack of these might come from shifting resources to companion media and the fact that they added different costumes, but I loved the aesthetic and feeling these scenes added to the trailers. The older direction also leaned into a more "Shakespearian" vibe. Those elements are still very prevalent in the final version (there's many posts that explain the Hamlet inspiration), but I think some of the scenes that only appeared in trailers gave the game a bit more of a "dreamy" and tense, mysterious atmosphere that I wished would've been pulled from more. Not to mention the trailers always showed intense fights (Stella and Ravus one-on-one's, Noctis and soldiers, empire and Regis, etc.) which didn't get the same focus in the final game.

Finally, there's the theory that KH4 or a possible game based on the Verum Rex commercial from KH3 will be the "true" Versus. Personally, from what we've seen so far it seems like Nomura is using KH as a space to use some concepts that didn't carry over to XV, specifically things like having an open city space, some of the art direction and some aspects of combat. As I've said, I think the XV universe preserved more of the story than some people think, so between that and the fact that KH is it's own universe that doesn't really use some FF things (empires, FNC lore, etc.), I think he's just entertaining some of the things he still wanted to do something with while also possibly taking shots at XV and SE. Could be wrong once more is revealed, but that's how it appears to me.

Anyway, this has gotten incredibly long so thanks for reading if you got this far! To be clear, I really do love XV but some fleshing out of concepts would've done it good. I'll probably make more posts on elements of XV and how they relate to old concepts/FNC etc. so stick around if you're interested in that at all (as well as posts about other FF games, just in a XV mindset since I recently replayed).

Here are some of the links with good amounts of info in one place, if my info seems incorrect or anything, I apologize

[finalfantasythoughts]

Recently replayed Final Fantasy X and was reminded again how much I love the CG/FMV artstyle of FF games from the 00's.

Final Fantasy X (2001)

Final Fantasy VII Advent Children (2005)

Final Fantasy VII Dirge of Cerberus (2006)

Crisis Core Final Fantasy VII (2007)

Final Fantasy Versus XIII (2008 trailer)

Final Fantasy XIII (2009)

(Didn't try to snub FFXII but it has it's own artstyle compared to the Nomura designed characters)

Gifs aren't mine but demonstrate what I like