spoopy-nevermore-dump - Tumblr blog

spoopy-nevermore-dump · 11 months ago

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Hey. I'm sure all of you have seen Red's post, which they chose to call an apology (though I beg to differ in some parts), where I was called out amongst many others. This whole situation is a mess and though there have been many posts already, I just want to add my two cents, as someone who was directly named. Apologies for how late this is compared to the rest of the situation, not trying to stir it all up again, I’ve just been busy. (Please note that everything I say here is my own take/opinions and I am not directly speaking for anyone else, any issues you have with anything said here are with me alone.)

First of all, Red promised this post would be about the Crimson situation, the long prologue with the explanations of the "cliques" is completely unrelated and just an attempt to shift blame onto other groups for the situation blowing up as it did. This is especially horrible because of the fact that many of the people named are MINORS, who Red has constantly claimed to prioritize protecting, especially in the situation with Crimson exposing minors to NSFW. I'm not going to harp too much on the Crimson situation as I wasn't involved (or capable of being involved after my ban), though everything I have seen from Red has been a shitshow of mishandling, which they addressed, and I will give them credit for admitting they fucked up with it, and am VERY glad to see them step back from moderating, as I feel they were under far too much stress by both being highly active in the server as a mod and also trying to write a good story, and hope a larger variety of mods does the server good. I was there when the server hit 1k members, and knowing that the mod team didn’t grow until now (when last I heard it was around 6k?) feels like it would have driven anyone trying to moderate it insane.

However, I am here to give my side of the story, which goes back to the drama with the confession blog "@/esoterichistoria", in which they were sent an anon ask which [paraphrased] asked why the account existed and what they got out of it, in a sense that implied they didn't believe the account should exist. This ask was not answered publicly and was screenshotted and posted in the hideout, one of the NON PATREON channels in the discord. Red then went on to reveal themselves as the person behind this anon ask which led to other people sending harassment to the account. I was firmly on the side of supporting EH, and wound up creating a post of my own calling out the hypocrisy and "word of god" reliance on lore snippets sent by Red and Flynn in the discord, which when sent in the free channels would eventually disperse into the tumblr fandom. Unless I mistakenly shared a minor fact that was patreon exclusive (which would have only been shared to me by someone who was affected asking if they were right to be concerned about it) I did not intentionally state any patreon only information in any of my comments within and under that post.

That post for me, was what happened when the straw broke the camel's back. I had seen several instances of fan to fan hostility (such as telling people off for using the tumblr "#nevermore webtoon" tag for confession blog related posts, but only for the original blog and not the second one that popped up during this drama). I was fed up with watching a fandom I truly loved fall apart, and felt that speaking up about it would be the only way to see any change within this issue. However, I will admit the post was written in a stress induced craze as I was at the end of finals and preparing to move at the same time, which definitely greatly impacted my capacity to truly think through why I should make that post in the first place, but I felt the only way to get the drama out of my head was to send it out into the void of tumblr, and then, through the next day when I had a few spare moments I responded to a few people asking clarifying questions with less than stellar tact.

It was quite shocking for me to find out, just a day or so later (forgive me I am not the greatest with dates or timelines) that the Nevermore discord was gone from my server list, which I mainly noticed because I often use the emotes from that server in casual conversations with friends, and found my favorited emotes completely lacking of them. I had no message of why I had been banned, and shrugged it off as I hadn't been active in the discord community in ages, as I was busy with other things.

A few hours later, Percy, who Red had reached out to directly (but none of the other members of our "clique" as Red puts it heard a peep) shared a truly baffling DM that consisted of refusing to explain and extrapolating reasons behind actions that did not exist to justify the ban. We laughed it off and moved on, as though we enjoyed the fandom and comic itself, losing access to the discord was no loss as of our lack of usage of it in the first place.

I was in no way Stalking, nor were any of my friends. We had been members of a fandom who loved the comic and fandom, and had come to a point where our unpopular fandom opinions led us to feel a bit on the outside of the main popular opinion, and we were also just naturally shifting to different interests.

This, alongside the fallout of having expressed opinions on Montresor and the specific ways that his relationship with Ada progressed. I DON'T see people who ship Montrada as supporting a "SA Fetish Ship", I just personally wasn't a fan of it and alongside my friends who shared the same opinion, was sick of being told that we were blatantly WRONG for having a differing opinion, and chose to distance ourselves because of the level of vitriol we had experienced, and some made a statement saying we didn't wish to associate with people who enjoyed the ship, which is a perfectly normal way to interact with fandom. There are definitely perfectly valid ways to interact with the ship, and even explore it in interesting ways, it is just ways that I personally am not interested in engaging with.

(And just to point out the elephant in the room, yes I have a fic that focuses on Montrada, both because I saw a part of my former self in Ada and someone who hurt me in Montresor, and this fic was planned out long before Montrada was hinting at becoming canon in the comic. Though this fic is written in an explicit manner, it was on a site that allows that and was tagged correctly for those who wish to avoid it.)

I know I'm trying to prove myself to people who have made up their minds on if they believe Red's statement, and I know for those who have their minds made up, nothing I can say will change that unless they are willing to, and I can't force that. I personally do not agree with many opinions Red holds, and find the act of plastering the usernames of people, including minors, that they dislike on a public tumblr post knowing they have a loyal fanbase who may choose to take it upon themselves to harass people out of a sense of vigilante justice, frankly abhorrent and irresponsible. Though I would like to believe that the Nevermore fandom is better than stooping to harassment, I know it is naive to believe in any fandom that this is the case, every fandom will have a few bad apples, even if the fandom at large is kind and passionate and supportive of fellow fans. (note: as of writing at least one person I've been in contact with have received direct harassment)

As someone who has a tendency to come across as rude and bitchy when in a passionate argument/debate with someone, especially when an emotional connection to the subject is involved on my end, I know I may have been combative to an excessive degree and given myself a bad name. For anyone who has felt hurt in an argument with me, I do apologize, as sometimes I don't know the harshness of my words. I do quite enjoy a good argument, and when things get heated I do find myself being quite harsh, something many people do, especially when they have had a history of being the only one on their side of an opinion.

Despite the drama, I do still love the comic, through a more analytical lens and with caveats of my own personal opinions perhaps, but I do truly love the characters, the world, and am curious to know what comes next in the story when it returns from hiatus. Though I don't believe I will ever have a positive view of Red interpersonally, I want them and Flynn to be able to continue the comic for as long as they feel they need to tell a complete story. I probably will continue to write fic and engage with the fandom, as in my opinion, Fandom is for the Fans, not the Creators, and I truly do love sharing my writing with the Fandom, and I have many fic ideas that I want to have a chance to bring to fruition.

For those who don't wish to dig in deep on the older drama with the Montrada situation or my general drama hot takes, you can hop off here, and even if this didn't change anything for you I appreciate you taking the chance on hearing me out, as I am quite wordy and I know this post is already rather long. However, since Red’s post brought up these issues, I feel I should at least address them.

First off, on the accusation of stalking, I do feel Red may be pointing a finger and forgetting that three point back at them, as though I do understand wanting to have a grasp on who someone is when you feel wronged by them, going out of your way to construct a narrative of who's friends with who, and what they do in their free time, alongside congregating information about them to share publicly when even in the best case of you being correct their crimes were at MOST having an insular group chat and occasionally getting in arguments about unpopular fandom opinions or standing opposite your side in drama.

By every metric, while sharing screenshots can be seen as in bad taste, doing so with a small group of friends in a private group chat is not the end of the world. The phrase "keep it in the group chat" exists for a reason, people often share with their friends things they may not say publicly, and that is perfectly okay provided it's not planning some sort of direct attack on someone. People going "ugh I don't agree with xyz and wish they'd see reason" to friends is not stalking, it's a bit of gossip between friends, and when it comes from something that began as a shared interest that brought the group together, there's no harm in it. However, congregating identifying information and sharing it publicly DOES have harm in it, because no matter how many times you tell your audience not to harass people, opening the doors for it makes it more likely to happen regardless.

Secondly, calling the post an apology was a half truth. Yes, the final paragraphs WERE an apology, but based on the situation and what was truly going on, the explanations of the Cliques was unnecessary and distracted greatly from the actual apology present. Especially as the context of “Clique 2” does NOTHING to add to the story of the situation with Crimson and why an apology is necessary. The situation was blown greatly out of proportion by adding on more context than the situation required, and is definitely the reason the controversy has grown so large. Not only was diverting to the explanations of the Cliques cluttering the otherwise potentially strong apology, it both works to paint Red as the victim to garner sympathy from loyal fans, and gives a target to go after for why the situation has grown so horrible, when a concise apology that left that all out would have cleared the air on the Crimson situation and not led to a large group of people who were unjustly called out and have their information blasted for anyone to see and opening them to excessive harassment.

Finally, Speaking to Red directly, If you'll allow me to speak at you a bit personally for a moment, the way you framed things in your post regarding "Clique 2" to me in some regards comes across as a misinterpretation of criticism of the comic and its characters as a criticism of you. As a writer I understand how your work often feels like an extension of you, and criticism often feels personal, but to take a small group of people who share a similar criticism and extrapolate it to mean they're spreading vitriol about you is a bit extreme.

(And in screenshots regarding the Prospero aromanticism issue that have been posted to tumblr, this seems to be a recurring pattern of seeing anyone who has concerns about how a certain aspect is being normalized within the fandom with encouragement from the creators, which regardless of intent comes across as endorsement, as an attack and trying to make an issue out of something that isn’t really that deep.)

Anyways, the main situation regarding the Montresor and Ada ship happened over a year ago and I have no way to access or look back on what was said having been banned from the discord, there may be discrepancies in intent and execution so take all of this with a grain of salt if you'd like, but I never meant to say that you as the author were glorifying SA by having Montresor and Ada to exist as a ship. It was a mixture frustration with how Ada's characterization (as interpreted by what existed in the comic) did a 180 and how the relationship between her and Monty was framed and the fandom's manner of acting as if saying that it personally made someone uncomfortable they were just a hater trying to stir drama. The fandom's usage of the phrase “fun toxic” and overromanticizing when Monty had been consistently characterized as misogynistic (not a bad thing) and Ada's prior characterization didn't line up with the “mutually toxic” idea that was being spread. I'd be a hypocrite if I was saying that every ship had to be morally pure, I've written some pretty morally bankrupt relationships in my own original works. I just found that the way the fandom acted around Montrada at the time was really uncomfortable to be around as an SA survivor simply because of the way people were changing their opinions of the barking scene, which to me with just the context of the scene itself was not at all something Ada did consensually (or only did under coercion) and is a form of humiliation which is sexual harassment.

It was never a moral righteousness witch hunt or anything, more just some fans pointing out how the portrayal of it could come off to people who was a survivor of someone who acted like Monty and that the energy in the fandom around it was uncomfortable and didn't actually leave room for nuance on the opinions of Montrada. I have always been a proponent of letting people ship what they want to, even if it’s personally not what I enjoy in the fandom. Perhaps the way it was portrayed on my end at the time didn’t come off the way it was intended, but there is a massive difference in my opinion between thinking anyone who enjoys a particular ship is evil and being personally uncomfortable with a ship and not wanting to engage with it within fandom, even with it being canon. And the preference for Morella and Ada was never upholding a "morally pure" ship as "better" than Montrada, it was simply preference from people who had already been shipping Morellada for a long time and didn't choose to abandon ship over Montrada becoming canon, only finding new reasons to continue holding that opinion.

All in all. I’ll miss when the good times of the fandom were around, and definitely will stick around for season 2. I wish it hadn’t all turned out this way, as I’ve made great memories and friends because of this comic and community. To anyone who still has questions or something to say to me, my ask box and dms here have always been open. And hey, if Red or Flynn have anything to say to me, feel free to reach out. I’m open to a civil conversation if that's what’s desired.

~~ Rose, of the “dark stalker Clique”

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spoopy-nevermore-dump · 11 months ago

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Lmfaooo what a week 😅

So a lot of people are, understandably, leaving the fandom. Drama like this always tends to put people off and unfortunately that affects the media they’ve come to love. I’m not going to be one of those people bc honestly, I don’t even know if I was ever that “in” the fandom in the first place to even leave it. My account isn’t and never was a nevermore account, yes I’ve made a few nevermore post but those were infrequent and amongst posts and reblogs of multiple other fandoms. I’m also in the discord server but I’ve only ever been a lurker, and usually only ever go in it when I want more context to something I’ve seen on tumblr. With that being said however, I still plan on reading nevermore when (or if) it continues because in THIS particular instance I can easily separate art from the artist and I’ll explain why in a moment.

Like I said I’m not and never have been very active in the fandom. I learned about this drama through a post from an account I follow and went through the server to find more context. I was not present through any of the actual conflicts but I’ve seen the conversations.

So why am I commenting on this?

Well mainly I want to make a point about para social relationships as well as moderation of servers and fandoms as a creator.

I just want to preface this by saying that after reading through all possible context, perspectives, takes and evidence I could find or come across, I genuinely don’t think red is necessarily a bad/morally wrong person. I DO however think she is in the wrong in this situation especially due to how she handled everything. As for how a lot of people are reacting to everything, there’s a couple of things I’d like to note:

From what I’ve seen, all of this is just one big thing of “he said/she said” and pointing fingers as well as just picking sides. If your absolutely distraught because red didn’t turn out to be the person you thought they were simply because she said things you didn’t like, I understand the disappointment and frustration but please remember that content creators in general aren’t your friends. You don’t know these people, they just do things you happen to like. Now I’m not saying you SHOULDN’T feel upset about it, it’s ok to and you even should if it’s an issue to you feel strongly about but please keep in mind that this isn’t a “sign of their true colors” or anything because you don’t know what they were actually like to begin with. Ofc I don’t mean that to say “expect the worst from people” but more as a reminder that can hopefully help you to look at the situation more critically and logically before jumping in guns blazing. It’s understandable if it affects you emotionally, you were emotionally invested in their work; but please realize this before you let it get to that point. Now on the other side of the coin, there’s the people who I feel as though will just pick the creators side simply because they’re fanboys and will stand by them no matter what. I’m DEFINITELY NOT saying that’s what everyone who’s on red side is, but naturally there’s bound to be a few that are going to dickride for the sake of dickriding. Regardless, there’s a lack of willingness to listen and understand from both sides (at least from what I’ve noticed) and that’s a problem because when no one wants to listen then what’s supposed to be a community coming together to resolve an issue just turns into a giant flame war. Also this should go without saying, but at least give the mods a chance. They obviously handled the whole situation horrendously but they aren’t going to do their jobs any better when they’ve got people coming at them with pitchforks.

Speaking of the moderators. I genuinely can’t wrap my head around how red and the other mods have managed to fumble this badly…….like it’s almost funny. All said and done they all had ONE very simple job and they blew it. Although I very much disagree with it, I do understand red’s decision to unban crimson. They wanted to give them a second chance, sure whatever. What I DONT GET is why would they not at the very least check to see if anyone else would be comfortable with a decision that would possibly affect them or even impact their safety. At the very least a warning to or a discussion with the victims would have been something. Not only that but even after they unban them, once red saw the NUMEROUS amount of people that were upset about it they, they should have immediately banned them again and then apologize after instead of some rushed explanation. But I get it stress gets the better of you. I understand their desire to keep things as transparent as possible (which i appreciate and I’m sure so do many others) but from that first apology/explanation it felt more like red trying to shake responsibility off themselves and pointing fingers in the name of being transparent. I did see where red was trying to get at in her first statement, but there was also things that she honestly should have just had the foresight to realize wouldn’t put her in a better light, and this is aside from the victim blaming-esque wording. red basically says that she felt like a group of people (including Laci the one who reported crimson) were just out to get crimson, which is absolutely insane but then again it’s the internet so who knows. However it’s super clear that Laci obviously wasn’t lying bc the things she accused crimson of did in fact happen. So even bringing that up was enough for me to raise my eyebrow at but I digress. Then red practically says it was hard to handle the situation bc the evidence provided was censored, but Laci literally offered to give the uncensored versions so that was completely disingenuous on red’s part at best. To me it just seemed like the mods were looking for excuses for what could be there own laziness at best and negligence at worst. Their biggest fault so far is not being very good at actually listening to their audience and taking them into consideration. She also brought up that fact that Laci was apparently the only person to report crimson which I did not like to say the least. One of the victims confided in Laci and Laci brought it forward. I understand reds suspicions about Laci not being in the actual server where it happened but how are you going to immediately jump to “well why did no one else bring it up” instead of stopping for a sec and thinking “ hm clearly these victims feel uncomfortable stepping forward”. Which they had to do now anyway because of how bad the issue became. They should not have had to do that.

And then there’s red’s formal apology…

First off, girl why are you dropping names??? A bunch of who are supposedly minors? Like let’s be so fucking for real right now😭

And then the audacity to be like “please don’t go after or dm these people” like babes if you were genuinely worried about them you wouldn’t have used their names at all. ESPECIALLY when in the end it was completely irrelevant and borderline inappropriate since it really had nothing to do with crimson, their actions or how you handled them. Not to mention the act of calling them “cliques” when literally all they were was side servers. Like if they’re cliques then what does that make red and everyone who’s on her side? It was very clearly just a biased reaction to people saying things she doesn’t like about her, which by all means she has the right to respond to but not in a way that is clearly trying to sway how everyone else sees them. The way red describes everything is as if it’s middle school drama and then proceeds to play directly into it. Don’t get me wrong her apology was fine, when she was ACTUALLY apologizing. Everything else felt like a last ditch effort to drag others under the bus with her. It was lowkey embarrassing to say the least.

Again, it’s important that I make it clear that I don’t believe red is a bad person. I just think she’s an immature person, or at least she is in how she handled everything and continues to handle it bc like I said I don’t know her, and don’t care to frankly. I didn’t start reading nevermore to be buddy buddy with her. Like if we look at the grand scope of things, this is a grown woman beefing with kids. Obviously they aren’t all kids, most of them aren’t I believe but she’s practically stooping down to school yard conflict in how she’s responded so far. Especially at one point in the server when she was being called out and jumped to “yeah I guess I’m the bad guy and totally evil. You all should hate me”. Like actually cut that shit out.

And my final point because I’ve ranted long enough. I mentioned before that in this instance I am willing to separate the art from the artist, I stand by that because I genuinely do think this is a situation where red could hopefully grow from this and rectify things. The actual unbanning was a stupid and inconsiderate move on her part, but I doing think she meant any ill-will or had any malicious intent. I disagree with the people calling her a r@pe apologist because that’s honestly just a huge reach. I’ve also seen some accusations of red and/or Flynn being racist, promoting inappropriate art knowing there’s minors around and from what I’ve seen it’s pretty iffy. Regarding the racism, I don’t believe that they are. Their characterizations of the characters regarding their ethnicities IS stereotypical and was obviously just very surface level research into those respective cultures but I chopped that up to ignorance rather than racism. As a woc I was frankly just relived they didn’t make the poc characters centered on some kind of discrimination or tragedy from their era, which yes is something shouldn’t be ignored but also I don’t know if rednflynn could accurately and more importantly, respectfully portray those types of issues. Nor is it even their place tbh.

As for the promoting inappropriate art of the characters and creating some themselves. Yeah they do. I’ve never been shocked about that nor did I think it was something that they are wrong for doing, I mean it’s their own work. Granted I didn’t realize how many minors were in the fandom but that’s literally every fandom, there’s only so much you could do about it. I don’t know if nevermore has a rating but it’s not like it was something ever promoted to be kid friendly, it’s obvious that some scenes are just straight up fan service. While I personally don’t like fan service it never was enough to impact the story so I personally never saw an issue. But point is I don’t think they should have to monitor what is and isn’t appropriate for minors but things get tricky when they have a server where they are clearly aware of minors.

And then there’s other things like people accusing them of promoting SA or some shit like that bc if a lot of stuff involving Montessor which frankly, that’s just a media literacy issue on the readers part. So yeah with that being said I don’t think red is a bad person, although I understand why a lot of people are done with them which is completely fair. I’m pretty much in a grey area about it, who knows if they end up getting in an even bigger scandal, hopefully they come out better from this but only the time will tell. The best/smartest thing red has said throughout this entire debacle was that they’re taking a step back from the fandom. I think it’ll be good for everyone, especially them. It seems like it’ll take stress off them anyway. Plus the hole they’ve dug for themselves is already halfway to china so there’s that

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spoopy-nevermore-dump · 11 months ago

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Now, this last conversation does take place in a patron only channel of the Nevermore Discord, and as such I only have access to the few screenshots I could collect, not the full thing. I'm only including it because this is important to my ban, and this is where things went south very quickly. I noticed Red saying strange and vague things toward my friends and I, and this wasn't the first time, so I got confused and decided to ask for more context. I had no idea what she was talking about. This was directly after and related to conversation two. After that, I was banned the next day.

And that's it. I know the formatting is a bit confusing, but it's important to me that my name is cleared. Thanks again.

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spoopy-nevermore-dump · 11 months ago

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The Recent Nevermore Drama.

Red, I think it's quite sad that you decided to delete all the original comments going against you and reexplaining what went down within your 'apology', which was 95% calling out rather than talking about the cause of the whole uprising. Nonetheless, here was my original reply, just so everybody who stumbles across this post can see the reply from somebody who's viewed it from both sides. The original message was, as follows:

'Hey Red,

I hope you're managing amidst everything that's been going on. I know you've been through a lot recently, and I hate to add to the messages you've been receiving. However, there are some things that I really need to talk to you about.

Over the past few days — even years — I've noticed some things that really concern me. It feels like there's been a lot of blame unfairly placed on certain individuals within your community, which is incredibly damaging, especially when it unfairly paints others in a negative light. I understand you've been trying to address the situation with Crimson, but the approach taken hasn't been effective and has caused more harm than good.

In terms of the Crimson drama, I think it could have been handled more sensibly. Consulting with Laci and others involved would have been beneficial before making the decision to introduce Crimson back to the server. When you were writing your explanation, which I know was rushed, you should have stepped back and consulted for longer - I know you felt pressured, but.. you needed to give yourself time to handle it.

With the screenshots, too - they were only censored to the point of concealing most of the users involved to keep the MINORS safely out of the evidence, and yet you continued to banter on about how they were censored and unable to interpret what happened. As well, you tampered with evidence when you sent a screenshot, CUTTING OUT the part where Laci mentioned they could give you the evidence uncensored if you asked, yet you continued to complain.

On the topic of minors, you name dropped SEVERAL in your apology. Do you know how endangering or scary that can be? It's insane that you felt the need to name anybody involved to get people off your back.

There's also Sardonyx - I don't know if you'll share this with your patreons but, if you do, hello Sardonyx. They casually aggravate people, make NSFW conversation in YOUR SFW server, and you still allow them to pursue in such a way. They continued to temper people after the initial Crimson argument and started their own, which could have been avoided if you had muted both persons involved (rather than banning everybody against Sardonyx) and asked for them to calm down and explain their conflict in dms.

Also the Bunnybel issue - I know the topic was discussed by people banned, but there's also the factor that neither you, nor your mods stepped in to stop it. Matter of fact, you contributed to it, and everybody went along with it as a fun easter event of drawing your two main protagonists in these outfits that, when looked at closer, actually have a much more terrible implication. You should have handled this earlier, rather than blaming it on somebody and ranting about how it's all their fault and they're in the wrong.

Again with Laci, too - you outright blaming her for everything that has occurred is terrible. Whilst that may be what you see in this whole confrontation, in truth, it really isn't anything like that, Red. Saying that everybody else involved were her 'lackeys' and 'twisted around her finger' was an incompetent, foolish way of pinning all these hardships on her. Some people involved, including me, had barely spoken to Laci prior, because a lot of people cared about the fact that YOU had unbanned a potentially alleged pedophile back into your server full of minors. I know it doesn't seem like everybody cared, but we all did, otherwise we wouldn't have started this whole 'riot' thing or whatever to go against it. I surely cared, considering I have been at the face of two pedophiles sending me unsettling, inappropriate images, and I know that it is hard to reach out to somebody or stop them when they shrug it off so nonchalantly.

Lastly, I think it's hypocritical you spoke about how certain groups were stalker-ish and stealing messages from a patreon chat, despite you taking a chat from private servers and dms. The behaviour is equal, is it not? You used your influence to alter certain texts and take them out of context, and the other groups simply took what you said and proved that you, and unpunished, favourited people who have been held dearly, have done terrible things yourself.

I understand that this whole thing has been overwhelming for you, Red, but I believe that there was a real need for you to approach each situation differently, and not to compile everything into an 'apology' that is 5% apology, and 95% calling out people and altering the blame to be put on them. I think that the tactics you used were poor, and I hope that you do figure out something better in the future.

Take care, and I'm here if you'd like to discuss this any further.

Best regards,

A bystander.' And the second reply I made, aimed at one of her patreons (or moderators? who knows.) who put a whole lot of shit behind a paywall and then continued to support her. Aha, Debobble, if it wasn't illegal, I'd show the whole world you trying to make a fake screenshot of Laci 'configurating her hate schemes', and how terribly it was done. 'Hello!

I hope you're having a joyous, maybe even 'whimsical' day!

A lot of things that have occurred recently are the fault of both 'sides' (if we can call them that. Not 'Laci's lackeys' or 'Clique 1 and 2'.) and I think I should refer to the way that this has been dealt with again.

Yes, the server was owned by somebody different who was capable of banning Crimson, and it was intended for less SFW purposes, but I think Crimson went outright too far in a predatory way. They put a teenage oc with an adult oc, which is pedophilic behaviour, and sent several overly NSFW images. I assume that this chat was intended for 'implied sexual circumstances', rather than overly perverse, but I could be wrong. I agree in the fact that something should have been done, and I approve of Laci's initial reaching out, but I don't approve of the way Red banned them for as little as they did.

As I like to say; 4 months, 4 minors. You afforded Crimson a month for each minor they influenced in such a predatory way, and I think the time should have been extended.

Might I also add, these screenshots were not 'heavily' censored. They were censored for the safety of the minors and other persons involved and, yet.. Red seems to be content with name dropping every minor who was involved. So much for the safety of her members!

AND I have more to add, which I trust you to hand over to Red for me since you seem content to do that quite often for her - do you mind reminding her and the entire patreon and mod chat that Crimson (and Red, I'm pretty sure) knew the age of one 12 year old, who we might call 'Green'. They continued to share NSFW things to them, including making jokes about what I assume was a 'vibrator in public'. How SFW for a child! Crimson is VERY innocent.

I agree that all of this has gotten out of hand, but both responses, from Red, the moderation team, and the patreon chat against the groups banned for involving themselves, but I wouldn't consider it a mob. Both sides had good intentions, it's just the way Red has gone about it - framing others for her mistakes and outright dismissing people for being concerned about the safety, that has made this come to such a volatile level.

And the whole, breaking several TOS, and a law? If thats what we're doing, what are you doing? Leaking private messages, encouraging predatory behaviour, endangering minors, leaking names which could result in a witch hunt from Red's expanse following? Oh dear..

How volatile.

Best regards,

A bystander.' Red, every little detail you have undergone is such a negative, unredeemable smidge to this massive whiteboard of what you could do. Instead of handling this like the adult, you undertake criticism harshly, which is detrimental considering you are somebody who has been writing for years, which means that you should have matured and adapted to take this kinds of things. You could have taken a month, maybe two, maybe three, to explain the whole Crimson thing - it would have been much less detrimental to yourself, and your community. You absolutely wrecked every second, third, fourth, fifth chance people were tempted to give you with every detail that went in to making sure that YOU felt like you had to be right - name dropping, which could lead to witch hunting with your massive following, especially since the people were minors and specifically requested you keep their names out of it. You allowed an alleged, potential predator back into your server without consulting it with victims - and don't get me started on the whole 'Crimson didn't know!', they knew at least one of them, and still continued. You pinned the blame on Laci, on another person (who has asked me not to say their name and, like the respectful person I am, will not be namedropping. That doesn't seem like a familiar concept to you, does it?) and you keep all these little dirty secrets behind a paywall. Red, in the most respectfully disrespectful way, grow up and learn to be better. You spout all this bull, every little detail and, when it backfires, you cower into a corner, guilt trip, manipulate, and eventually resort to the potential physical or mental harm of other people. It needs to stop. The icing on the cake, to all of this? YOU, as the 'mature adult that would never stand for pedophilic behaviour, that loves their audience, that has a server full of minors', that YOU would delete messages explaining the situation in a different point of view. You don't want your vast following to see these and think, 'huh, maybe Red isn't as good as I thought they were?', well they aren't. I don't know if people will see this but, sincerely, I hope Red, Flynn, DeBobble, the patreons, the moderators, and all of the discord and general following of Nevermore and RnF know that what Red spouts isn't necessarily all true.

Kind regards, A bystander.

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spoopy-nevermore-dump · 11 months ago

Text

Here we go...

So I haven't said anything about previous events so far, and my point still stands as I will remain quiet as everything has just come to a head with it all. It'll still sit here and marinate and reveal everything about the drama. A lot of people don't know, but all of this drama that happened? (Not the crimson drama, the previous drama about the mass ban) Has happened because Nora (or Sardonyx) personally went out of her way to lie and tell everyone what was happening. Most of the bans were innocent, if not all. And I was scooped up into it by nora herself and told the same shit, and I was only told the right issues involving it because someone who is close friends came forward about it all, and told me and showed me the truth.

Nora(Sardonyx) has had a hold on every dramatic situation, she has lied, been a hypocrite, a two face, and has shown she cannot be trusted. She has decided to talk shit and speak about all of this to a 13 year old, and Nora is 27. Everyone knows this, she is a manipulator who will try her best to make others look bad to get the heat off her back. Another issue with nora is previous conversations I've had with her, in light of them, some of the conversations we've had, she has made toxic remarks towards others. Bad mouthed almost every patreon, and has dragged me into it. I tried to match her jokes, tried to be friendly and laugh along with her. And in that, I'm sorry on my end. I never intended to hurt others, but she has. Again, I dont have any of these screenshots because I did leave any server I was associated with her in, and can't prove it on my end. She probably could, with cherry picked screenshots and edited ones as well.

I again apologize on my end for that, she has manipulated me through every part of our dms and has influenced me to be just as bad of a person. I've learned to be better, and I have talked with one of the people she has talked bad about and we are both on good terms. If no one knows this by now, she is still in the main server, after showing proof of her Threatening to kidnap and torture, her nasty remarks, she has tried to tell others that another person is Homophobic, which was untrue and that would have resulted in a ban. In the end, she's still there. And She's getting away with threats and others. I highly recommended staying away from her, as she has lied, manipulated and bought her way through everyone.

Another issue with nora is her banner situation, she has used NSFW fan art as a banner, fully exposed, unblurred fan art. Not going at the artist, but Nora using that art as her main banner on discord has resulted in minors seeing it. She has spoken to two people who asked her to change in, because they and others were uncomfortable and this was her response.

She used the main nevermore discord, a server that had NOTHING to do with the situation. Also her lying in this reply, she talks to minors. (Not in the crimson disgusting way-) but she does actively dm minors at the time it happened. She wasn't considerate. And the kidnap and torture mention, well. She never got banned for threatening two people.

I blocked out the other person, as I don't know if they want to be named or not. Some people know who she is but for the sake of tumblr, I'm blurring her out. Through some of mine and her dms, there was some playful flirting going back and forth. Note on playful, by the way, but her being engaged and having a partner and telling me she thought all of it was real? Someone needs to hold her hand when they tell her this....(not me, dont let me go near that crazy woman she might K&T me too...)

But yeah, they were playful, pretty heavy flirting and it got detailed, SURE, its PLAYFUL FLIRTING. it happens. But her saying she's a "lesbian in a straight relationship"? Someone needs to hold her hand and to tell her AGAIN because this just aint it...

But she's still there, I've left the main nevermore server because of her. Because of her lies and manipulation, she has dragged others into this. People who had no involvement in this, but thats her way. She has done it before, DMing other people because she can't fight her own battles. She has to have others do it.

In the end, all I have to say is, Nora (sardonyx) is the one behind all the drama that happens, and will continue to be the one and will continue to get away with it. I highly advise to keep your distance from her , if not well...none of this would have been posted if she didn't go around acting like a 14 year old and spreading rumors about me.

Nora, if you're reading this, tell Eric i feel so bad for him to end up with someone as pathetic as you. And that the person you wanted to get freaky with found out how much of a horrible person you are. And I hope others do the same.

anyway..be careful with her or you might end up kidnapped and tortured <3

(stay safe)

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