doesavpnsecuretexts

[uwmspeccoll]

Livy’s Admittedly Biased History of Early Rome

Throughout all of written history there has been one commonality in all works of this kind. Due to the nature of humans, we all have preferences and experiences that make up biases, and thus every text about history is biased. It doesn’t matter whether the events were recorded at the moment of their occurrence or thousands of years after the fact. Even works with multiple authors are not free of bias due to differing views, but rather have multiple different biases. There is no way to remove bias for historical sources, so the question now is how do historians provide the reader with a clear recreation of past events?

On of the oldest solutions I have found comes from the 1st century BCE Roman historian Livy. The copy found in our library, titled Livy: The History of Early Rome, is a 1960 Limited Editions Club production, with a translation by Aubrey de Selincourt and illustrations by Raffaele Scorzelli, printed in Verona at the famed Officina Bodoni by Giovanni Mardersteig in an edition of 1500 copies signed by Mardersteig and Scorzelli . Despite the legendary tales of rivers protecting generals and consuls battling dragons, Livy is still able to provide the reader with an acceptable history due to what he says at the beginning of his work. In the first few pages of this lengthy read, Livy plainly tells the reader about his bias, stating that he believes Rome is the greatest civilization to have ever existed. This is then followed by both a hope that this view will not affect his writings and an instruction to remember this hope.

Livy’s histories do fall into the land of fiction at various points, yet with that instruction, readers have the ability to understand why they are present and hopefully can better interpret the events behind the legend.

View more of my Classics posts.

-- LauraJean, Special Collections Undergraduate Classics Intern

[aboutanancientenquiry]

Aubrey de Sélincourt The World of Herodotus (1962).

Aubrey de Sélincourt (1894-1962) was British Classicist, renowned for his translations of Classical texts, among which Herodotus' Histories (Penguin, 1954). The World of Herodotus, his last work, was one of his most successful books.

[ltwilliammowett]

"A sailing vessel is alive in a way that no ship with mechanical power ever be."

—Aubrey de Selincourt (1894-1962)

[sowingseedsandshootinghoops]

Why Study History: Herodotus

Note on the text: I used The Histories by Herodotus as translated by Aubrey de Selincourt and published by Penguin Books in 1972.

Herodotus is known as “The Father of History” and is considered to be the first historian. What distinguishes him from similar Greek writers is his determination to be as unbiased in the way that he presents his facts as possible. He tries to be as fair to everyone involved as he can be. What I love the most about Herodotus is his openmindedness and his ability to appreciate what is good in cultures other than his own. He has a genuine love and appreciation for those cultures. He has no qualms about giving other people, other cultures, their due as is evidenced by his own introduction where he says that his purpose in writing this book is to “preserve the memory of the past by putting on record the astonishing achievements of both our own and of other peoples” (41).

One group of people that he has incredibly high regard for are the Egyptians. In fact there is some evidence that they pushed him to become the historian that he is because he says that “the Egyptians. . . by their practice of keeping records of the past have made themselves the most learned of any nation” (158). It’s entirely possible therefore that this inspired him to make “the writing of the records” his profession. Because, to quote an overused cliché, “those who don’t know history are bound to repeat it”. He not only loves the Egyptians on their own terms, but for the influence they had on the Greek world as a whole. He talks extensively, for example about how the pyramids are “astonishing structures [that are] equal [to the] most ambitious works of Greece” and that the Egyptian labyrinths that he saw “surpasses them all”, and praises them for being able to do things like figure out how to divide the year into months and devise the most advanced medical system (188). More than that, he is a critical enough thinker to see all the myriad ways in which the Egyptians have influenced the Greeks. He’s not afraid of giving them their due. He talks about how

the names of nearly all of the gods came from Egypt. I know from the inquiries that I have made that they came from abroad and it is most likely that they came from Egypt, for the names of all the gods have been known in Egypt since the beginning of time with the exception (as I have said before) of Poseidon and the Dioscuri [i.e. Castor and Pollux]- and also of Hera, Hestia, Themis, the Graces, and the Nereids” (150).

Even Homer, that most esteemed poet of ancient Greece, was influenced by the Egyptians. Herodotus mentions at one point a story that he heard in Egypt about Helen of Troy and argues that Homer “was familiar with the story; for although he rejected it as less suitable for epic poetry than the one he actually used, he left behind indications that it was not unknown to him”, at which point he quotes the passages in question which he thinks links Homer to the Egyptian traditions.

Now make no mistake, although he admires the Egyptians (among other people) he is very proud to be a Greek. He is not shy about proclaiming all the wonderful things that the Greeks have done. In fact it can be argued that, in Herodotus’ mind, what the Greeks did was more important than what people like the Egyptians did before. Because although all those cultures were able to do amazing things for the world, the Greeks have given the world something better: the gift of freedom. And no where is this more obvious than when he talks about the battle between the Greeks and the Persians. For Herodotus this isn’t just a battle between one empire and a coalition of small city-states. It’s a battle between the systems of freedom and democracy (the Greeks) and those of totalitarianism and slavery (the Persians). By defeating the Persians what the Greeks did, in Herodotus’ mind, was show the world how “noble a thing freedom is [and] not just in [one respect] but in all [respects]” (369). So although he has a lot of respect for other peoples, it is clear that he values Greek culture at least as much if not more.

Now, as I said before, what sets Herodotus apart from others is his ability to truly appreciate other cultures, even when the practices of those cultures run counter to his own. No where is this more evident than in his discussion of women. A lot of the views which Herodotus appears to have about women can only be described as misogynistic. The most startling example of this comes in Book 1 where he makes the point that

although abducting young women. . . is indeed not a lawful act. . . it is stupid to after the event to make a fuss about it. The only sensible thing is to not take notice; for it is obvious that no young woman allows herself to be abducted if she does not wish to be” (42).

This book is full of stories of adulteresses, temptresses, and all around bad women who wreak havoc on those around them. You might therefore assume that when he sees other cultures treat women differently that he sees this as a bad thing, but no. He admires the industriousness of the prostitutes of Lydia (an ancient Turkish kingdom) who, according to inscriptions that he himself saw, not only made more money than the other tradesmen in the area, but were also able to use their money to pay their dowries, and had the power to choose their own husbands. It is also Herodotus who gives us the original story of the Amazonian women who he says were both stronger and smarter than their male counterparts. He admires them for their ability to effectively lead the men and do what needs to get done. He has a lot of admiration for them. Even later, when he talks about the invasion of the Persians he says that there is only “one name [of a lower ranking commander] that [he] cannot omit- that of Artemesia” (474). She was a widower who commanded some of the greatest, most famous, ships in the Persian fleet. Herodotus says that she had a “great spirit of adventure and manly courage. . . and [that] not one of the confederate commanders gave Xerxes [i.e. the Persian king] sounder advice than she did” (474). This shows that despite his own beliefs about women he was able to appreciate other cultures that believed differently.

While reading Herodotus I couldn’t help but reflect sadly on how scattered and divided modern society is. We are so quick to point fingers and to demonize those whose beliefs differ from our own. That while Herodotus appears to be genuinely intrigued by, and want to learn more about, those around him, we have opted to put up more walls, both literally and figuratively. We are not interested in learning about each other. It feels like we could learn something from him in that respect.

[oliverdelarosa]

"Una embarcación de vela está viva en una forma en que ningún barco de propulsión mecánica nunca estará" (Aubrey de Selincourt) ¿Estás de acuerdo? https://www.instagram.com/p/Ckkv4h5tA6a/?igshid=NGJjMDIxMWI=

[effulgentpoet]

endless list of favorites:

I LIKE TO SIT BY THE FIRE AND STARE (Irene and Aubrey de Selincourt)

I can't see the things that Anne can see (Anne she's seven, but I'm just three). Faces, and rivers, and forests, and all....(Anne's enormous, but I'm quite small).

[i-just-like-commenting]

Since being on Goodreads I haven’t done this as often, and now I have an old meme stuck in my head. Sing it with me now:  🎵 Too many books~~ 🎵

The Histories, by Herodotus, trans. by Aubrey de Selincourt Auschwitz #34207: The Joe Rubinstein Story by Nancy Sprowell Geise (for book group) The Great Tang Dynasty Record of the Western Regions by Xuanzang, trans. by Li Rongxi Tarma and Kethry: the Vows and Honor Trilogy by Mercedes Lackey Eugene V Debs: Citizen and Socialist by Nick Salvatore Angola Janga: Kingdom of Runaway Slaves by Marcelo D’Salete, trans. by Andrea Rosenberg

On audiobook: Postcapitalism: A Guide to Our Future by Paul Mason

[lumaraschronicle]

When the Persian king goes to war, he is always well provided not only with victuals from home and his own cattle, but also with water from the Choaspes, a river which flows past Susa. No Persian king ever drinks the water of any other stream, and a supply of it ready boiled for use is brought along in silver jars carried in a long train of four-wheeled mule waggons [sic] wherever the king goes.

Herodotus, The Histories, ed. A R Burn, trans. Aubrey De Selincourt (New York, NY: Penguin Books, 1978). 117.

[lumaraschronicle]

Exiled PCs (& NPCs)

I picked up The Histories by Herodotus 8 Nov’17, taking a break from reading The Druids: Their Origins and History by Lewis Spence. I got to the point where the Persians come to the Ionian settlements to conquer them. Two of the Ionian towns, Phocaea and Teos flee before the Persians coming to conquer the Ionian settlements.

When the Persians arrive at the town of Phocaea, the leader of the Persian army come to conquer the Ionians (Cyrus at this point is conquering other places in Asia and Africa), Harpagus, began the siege and informed the Phocaeans that they “pill down a single tower in their fortifications and sacrifice one house.” THe Phocaeans ask the Persians for one day to decide, Harpagus says ‘fine, whatever’, and the Phocaeans “at once launched their galleys, put aboard their women and children and moveable [sic] property, including the statues and other sacred objects from their temples -- everything, in fact, except paintings, and images made of bronze or marble -- and sailed for Chios. So the Persians on their return took possession of an empty town” (107).

The Phocaeans sail for Chios, but the people of Chios think that the Phocaeans will build trading centers on their own islands to rival the trading centers of Chios, so the people of Chios tell the Phocaeans to hit the road (or splash the sea, as the case may be). So instead of Chios, the Phocaeans sail to Corsica. They land there, start building towns among the other peoples that have settled Corsica, build temples, do what people do. After five years, it seems like the Chians may have made a wise decision, because the Phocaeans make very bad neighbors. “... During that period they caused so much annoyance to their beighbours by plunder and pillage, that the Tyrrhenians and Carthaginians agreed to attack them.” So after a sea battle of equal numbers and the Phocaeans winning a Pyrrhic victory (which the Greeks call a Cadmeian victory), the Phocaeans pack up their stuff again and sail from Corsica to Rhegium (108).

The Teians of Teos also sailed away from Harpagus and the Persian army when it appeared at the outskirts of their town. It seems that the Teians had a better voyage, it being somewhat less of a diaspora than what the Phocaeans had. The Teians went straight to Thrace and set up a town called Abdera (109).

So the garden patch is set, now for the campaign seed that pops up from this. I came up with an idea of a campaign for this. I’ve seen a GURPS game posted where the PCs were going to be Roman nobles and generals who were ousted from Rome. They sailed to a new land with their retinues &c. to try to set up a new area to survive.

In any scenario where the PCs are responsible or dependent upon (the cinch being their actions help determine the survival of said refugee population), the interesting and, I believe, engaging part for the Players is that the PCs somehow handle or aid in handling the risks entailed in finding refuge and thriving. The Pcs might be leaders of this town, or at least well respected and influential members of the society, which must evacuate and find a new home, negotiate with new neighbors, feed their people, and generally try to pick up where they left off in a strange new land (at least new to the PCs and their people). Anyway, I thought that this would be a cool idea for a campaign that I’ll probably try out in the next two years.

 Herodotus. The Histories. Edited by A R Burn. Translated by Aubrey De Selincourt. New York, NY: Penguin Books, 1978.