#I'm so sad it ended on a sour note bc there was so much potential

[kirakirabug]

I miss Wonder Egg Priority.

[maya-matlin]

Just related to that ask you for jeyton qnd just an observation that all thr baby mama drama with Jake's ex and Jenny's mom worth noting that had that not really being a thing they would've had a better chance at a future together.

I think the endgame are pretty clear and Jake wasn't the focus though being a in and out love interest, satelite at times like s6 Sean tropes like on and off very inconsistent good hearts and good intentions and his life with a perpetual instinctively to run when shit goes sour but usually not bc of peyon but his ex who always shows up to ruin everything inconvenient but consistently

She baby trapped Jake that Nicki. I don't usually blame like that but the shoe fits. She was trying to worm her way to sink her claws in Lucas too but he wasn’t like clear mind and drunk. It implies that maybe Nicki is older and used it against Jake qnd manipulated them and all the little throw away explaining and the taking off and the coming back to steal kidnap or get her daughter back. I get she wants to be a mom but she went about it absolutely wrong. She's never in the right and I don't think she should be trusted with kids not ehen her own daughters. I'm not a parent or a genius but no she shouldn't procreate!

She is a mess. She seems like she has beef unrelated to Jenny and she's a pawn. Where Jake is genuine qnd would do anything to keep Jenny from her bc she's a risk qnd not a motherly type she's cold and idk. She is ruining Jake's life and giving him jail and shit and trying to take the custody. At least bad Rachel had a heart and is inconsistent and a victim of shit writing but can see Redemption but Nicki? She's just black. Her soul is so mangled and she is unkind and unacceptable and her behavior is just shitty. I know dramatics and it's a drama but she goes way too far. They can't come back from thus qnd Jenny doesn't deserve that. Peyton could've been a great mother despite her age. It's a shame that Nicki did what she did to Jake he was a good guy who got with the wrong girl. And it ruined his life. She's gonna stalk forever he'll run forever. It's so sad. I hope she doesn't turn around and choose Nicki over Jqke all this shit was bc Jake wanted to protect her. His daughter who took care of for most of her life. Ugh. I hope they're happy Jake and Jenny. They were victims of the narrative.

Idk I am not that passionate but evidently I am.

I completely agree with that. It's incredibly difficult for me to imagine a Jake without Jenny because to be honest.. that's his only arc. Practically every decision Jake makes revolves around what's right for Jenny and how he can give her the best life possible. But even without all of that, Jake is a truly good, down to earth guy. I don't think his core values dramatically shifted when Jenny was born. Without Jenny, I can definitely imagine Peyton still falling in love with Jake.

The endgames are a mess. I think a lot went on behind the scenes during seasons 1-3. The initial plan was obviously for Lucas and Peyton to end up together. Season 1 pretty much revolves around this concept. The original triangle was Lucas/Peyton/Nathan, something that was intended to go on for longer. Early season 1 Nathan, unlike Brooke, was a pretty outright bad guy (though not without complexity and then untapped potential) who had zero chance of ending up with Peyton. Whenever it was decided to pair Lucas with Brooke for a while, I'm sure everyone had to have taken note of Chad's strong chemistry with Sophia which was obviously also the case in real life. Mark Schwahn also allegedly wanted Bryan Greenberg to be a regular, but Bryan either didn't want this or kept booking other projects that kept him busy. So Jake was kind of coming and going, meaning the show was unable to commit to Jeyton for long. In the meantime, Chad and Sophia literally got engaged and later married. Joy, Sophia and Hilarie have been open on their podcast about how the writers sometimes borrowed from their real lives when coming up with story lines. So in my opinion, in season 2 there was serious potential for the endgames to have shifted to Brooke/Lucas and Jake/Peyton. A lot of work was put into Lucas falling for and committing to Brooke. The beats and ambiguous glances that you'd usually see from the main couple when they're with other people were pretty much absent during season 2. This is even set up when Brooke finds Lucas's Peyton box. The discovery of the box rattles Brooke, forcing her to question whether or not this guy that she's gradually let back into her life and still truly loves still pines for Peyton even now. Anyways, I'm way off topic, but Lucas uses the Peyton box as a way to kind of prove how deeply he regrets the season 1 cheating and fucking up with Brooke the first time around. It's not until season 3 where you start getting the "It's always going to be there, isn't it?" and the "This song makes me think of Luke. I mean Jake." By that point, the story had shifted back and was slowly working back to LP. I don't think it was executed well at all, especially on Lucas's side, but I won't get into that. And exactly! Jake never wanted to run and start over somewhere else. He seemed happy in Tree Hill with his family. But Nicki wouldn't leave Jake alone and didn't seem to have any interest in proving herself, especially if it wasn't going to win Jake back.

Everything about Nicki was disturbing and bizarre. To start with, the OTH writer's room was dominated by men. So we had to sit through multiple versions of similar "bitchy", "slutty" and "crazy" women who did nothing but anger and hurt the male characters. Nicki was simply the first. It was very apparent from Nicki's introduction that she wouldn't be redeeming herself. What Jake tells Lucas about he and Nicki's discussing abortion implies the pregnancy was unplanned. But Nicki is an extremely manipulative person, so it wouldn't be super shocking if she knowingly and intentionally got pregnant with Jake's baby to keep him with her. The time line is a bit muddled because we hear about how Jake entrusted Nicki with Jenny at one point, presumably after their breakup, and ended up finding Jenny freezing in Nicki's car outside of a bar. So clearly even before Nicki left town, she was sending off warning signs and proving herself to be a bad influence on their daughter. Nicki isn't remotely painted in a sympathetic light, so we don't know if substance abuse problems or postpartum depression could have been contributing factors in her behavior. But the fact Nicki displays predatory behavior, preferring to have the power over her romantic and sexual partners, it's hard for me to argue she's a good person or deserves better from the narrative. Even after seeing all she went through to track down Jake and Jenny in seasons 1 and 2, it's hard for me to legitimately say she wants to be a mother. We hear in season 3 that Nicki appears to be trying and is in a better place, but it's hard to reconcile that with how she's written in all of her on screen appearances. Then there's the fact Jenny called Peyton "mama". But I digress. I agree Nicki shouldn't have been a mother.

Yeah. Maybe it's just Nicki's personality and she's overall less emotive and selfless than Jake. Maybe it's the overall sexist writing. But the deck is very much stacked in Jake's favor. No matter how you look at it, he comes across as the far better, more reliable parent. YES! I understand Jake leaving town with Jenny was extreme and Nicki's threats may have been in response to Jake's refusal to give her a chance to parent their daughter, but she always came across so vindictive in regards to how she dealt with Jake. At one point, Nicki even tried to claim Jenny wasn't Jake's biological daughter. To be honest, it could be true. Nicki isn't the loyal type anyways, but clearly Jenny being biologically his was of less importance than their emotional bond. Right. Characters like Rachel, Taylor and Alex were all written to be very villainous early on but eventually showed they had depth and displayed true loyalty and love for the people around them. Nicki feels far more dangerous. No, I totally agree. I wish I could say Nicki had some redemptive qualities. She got some very rare time in the spotlight during the Boy Toy auction when she got to spend the night with Jake. Instead of us seeing a more vulnerable Nicki who deeply loved Jake and regretted her actions, she's written as kind of a succubus when she attempts to seduce him into taking her back, literally saying "Come back to me" and "We can be a family." Jake thankfully gets to speak his piece by the end of the episode, but Nicki responds to Jake's vulnerability by just saying that she'll force her way back into their daughter's life by going for custody. So after all of that, I'm not convinced enough by Jake claiming Nicki as of season 3 was "trying". Peyton would have been great for Jenny. I truly think she would have been happy settling down with Jake and becoming Jenny's mom. I know Peyton's love for Jake and Jenny is sometimes interpreted as her simply wanting a family, any family, but I strongly feel Peyton was telling the truth when she said she wanted that specific family. For the sake of Jake and Jenny, I hope Nicki actually got herself together and became a better person because they don't deserve to be burdened by her toxicity forever. Otherwise, I hope she got out of their lives for good.