#Mel is cute but ZAG

[stellamancer]

my bf is playing Hades II and I keep asking him (to annoy him) where Zag is.

[xxcrystalinerose]

Thinking about the Fate-unravelling incantation once again.

Moros spoke of how he was not only the Fates' brother but also their guardian, and that they raised him under their watch. He was privy to their weavings, as the sole emissary to this trio of all-powerful, reclusive deities whose threads bind even the gods.

So, surely, he was there when Nyx met with the Fates to bring Zagreus back to life? We know that quite a lot of Nyx's children are old old—Thanatos has known Megaera much longer than Zagreus has ever been alive, yet he is implied to be one of the younger or at least middle children—so it's not entirely out of the question that Moros is already grown up enough to work with and for the Fates.

Moros knew of the price and consequences of defying the Fates' weavings. Of which their Mother, the Primordial Night herself, refuses to speak about even to this day, whatever terrible things it cost her or involved. She doesn't even allow any discussion about the Fates themselves, either. It was THAT bad and that's all we need to know.

It speaks volumes of how dire the present situation is, and how much Moros wants to assist Melinoë's task—not just help it, but make it possible in the first place (re: her bloodline curse)—that he straight up defies the top brass of the celestial bureaucracy by doing the godly equivalent of a younger sibling who overheard his older siblings had put some leftovers in the fridge to eat later, then went and stole the food for himself when they left the house.

Oh Moros, you've got it bad. At least you don't officially condone Mel's actions. We all know that's how bureaucracy works, right?

[whilomm]

so if the "unfinished portrait" is of melinoe as a newborn does that mean that zag never got to do any big brother stuff :(

[gettingnowherefaster]

Man the hide and seek scene in Hades 2 was soooo cute. Someone is actually being parented in this game?? So happy for her

[bloomingbluebell]

*plays hades 1 for 2 minutes* i miss melinoë :(

[enumaaelish]

hades 2 technical test save me. save me hades 2 technical test

[halfling-myth-lady]

Okay,so hades two has just released and I want to talk about some things:

On one hand,no narrator Zagreus which was something I hoped would happen so :(

But on the other hand,NARRATOR HOMER CONFIRMED!

I already like Apollo.he’s fun.

Dora is so cute.

In the trailer I got “strict teacher vibes” from Hecate but it’s a pleasant surprise to see how soft she is with baby Mel.

Also the portrait with zag,hades,and Persephone…

(They better not be dead supergiants-)

HYPNOS WHO DID THIS TO YOU

But on the topic,I think it’ll be an Orpheus situation where the second(or even third) boss gives us an item like a divine water bucket or something that we can use to wake him up.

Oh look a reason to use the cast.

HERMES IS MISSING?SUPERGIANTS WTF DONT TELL ME THAN IS NEXT-

Okay,but I also think this could be something like in hades early access were they aluded to things that’ll be added later.

This adds up with the fact that in hades 1 Hermes was the penultimate god added and you can’t get him till asphodel(i think)

Either way he better be okay.

The character portraits range from “pretty good”to “yep this is gonna get touched up” but not in a bad way.just that the shading look kind of off

Also I already love Hephaestus and hestia.

They are hyping up hestia as a nice grandma that can go unhinged if needed and I am all for it.

As soon as I saw Odysseus I already knew It’d be hilarious if Poseidon was there and what do you know?

Speaking of,I wonder if all gods from hades 1 are gonna come back or a few are gonna get switched around.

If so then ares is probably getting shafted which makes me sad.

On that topic,Aphrodite wearing ares’ war makeup is great.

Seeing Selene made me wonder if Helios is gonna appear,but then I remembered Apollo.

But even then i still want other titans to be added like the air guys just so that we can have an Apollo/zephyr interaction if possible.(if you know you know.

If Hermes does appear in this game I wish he has duo’s with other gods.(and his own curse)

I also wish that since we see Artemis outside of the boon bubble we can have profesional associates interactions.

[cthoniccompanion]

ok I can't sleep so hades 2 thoughts so far:

guys, I really love melinoe. She is such a darling protagonist and so easy to root for. I love all the ways she contrasts zag and all the ways she so clearly takes after him despite never knowing him. I want nothing but the best for her. My dorter

hecate is a babe. That is all

I gave a Nectar to hypnos and got the dialogue where he aaaalmost said a sentence in his sleep, and now I'm convinced the only way we're going to get him up is by giving him 10 Nectar. Funniest possible outcome. Man's not under a curse he's just eepy

I want to put Achilles and odysseus in a room together so unbelievably bad. Would KILL to see them have a conversation in this game (has anyone written patrochilles/odysseus hatefucking yet or)

I'm distressingly obsessed with moros. What do you MEAN Doom Incarnate is cute and articulate and soft spoken. What do you MEAN he bows at the waist when you salute him. What do you MEAN he gets flustered from offerings. I need Mel to peg him yesterday

I can defrost Nemesis. I believe in this. I also really love that Mel calls her "Nem" even though there's clear animosity, it's very sweet (and I'm Dying to know what their history is like)

GAM GAM HESTIA IS MY FAVOURITE OLYMPIAN. She is serving cookies and sending you off to war. Hephaestus is my favourite for the new boons since he's so far gotten me the furthest but I just fuckin love this sweet old wartime grandma

Also Artemis as our Thanatos is so clever! Such a cool way to evolve her role and to let Apollo step into the traditional boon-giving role. I wasn't expecting that but it's my favourite gameplay addition so far

I'm REALLY bad at the game so far. I'm partially blaming the framerate but also I feel like the difficulty spike at the beginning is worse than with hades og. Maybe that'll be curbed by unlocking more weapons?? Only time will tell

I miss zag so much that after I logged off I went and read a bunch of my fics from his pov :(

[naarlar]

Okie so hot take: I don’t think Melinoë is as good of a protagonist as Zagreus. And here’s why.

It all comes down to motivation. Why did Zag go through the events of Hades 1? Because he was living in an abusive and volatile household and had to find some way to make things better for not just himself but his house. Otherwise he surely would have lost his mind having to deal with the abuse he got (remember at the beginning of the game basically only Nyx and Achilles were helping him. Everyone else is either neutral towards him or outright hostile). He needed answers, he needed to find out who and what he was by trying to find Persephone. And in the end he succeeded and was able to create a better life for himself and his house. Hell, even his relationship with his dad improved.

Now let’s look at Mel (yes this criticism is only addressing Early Access Hades 2). Why is she going through the events of Hades 2? Because… she’s been groomed since basically birth to kill Chronos. She doesn’t really have any other motivation than because it is what is expected of her essentially. She even says during her confrontation with Chronos, AFTER HE THREATENS TO HURT HER FAMILY, what do I care I barely know them (yeah sure she could just be bluffing to Chronos but that is still a very chilling thing to say when supposedly all of this is to save them and it makes her reunion with Hades lowkey ring hollow or weak). In another scene she even says the same thing to Hecate and says Hecate is more her mother than anyone else. Heck even in the flashback scene with young Mel and Hecate (which was very cute I’ll admit) she says she would want her mother to come back so Hecate isn’t sad. This makes all her motivations to kill Chronos and save the Underworld seem very… disconnected from the main component of the game? Being saving the house of hades and her family??

Like it’s expected of her and she was raised at birth to basically be prepared for this but she doesn’t have any personal reasons for doing any of this than just not letting Hecate and the others in the Crossroads down. Hell when she comes back from killing Chronos for the first time it honestly feels like Hecate is more interested and invested in what happened than Mel herself.

It makes her a really weird protagonist especially when comparing to her brother and how effective he was as a protagonist. Think about it, with Zag we got really in depth and character revealing moments where as the player we understand why he is doing all of this and so it is easy to go along for the ride because we like Zag and want to help him. Mel says she cares a lot about what is going on and wants revenge, but it all feels surface level (and which is understandable she doesn’t know these people, all she can say is “the titan took my family” when let’s be real she sees the people in the crossroads as more of her family). It honestly just seems like because she is expected to kill Chronos since she could think, she feels she has to do all this. It feels weird how she is disconnected from the core point of the game being to save the house of hades when Zag was so integral to that same core point in the first game.

I dunno, just my thoughts, I’m curious to see what everyone else thinks.

Edit: just fyi cause I feel with the comments I’ve been getting from my posts, I like hades 2 I am excited especially for the official release. I recognize my criticism/analysis could be wrong or out of date since the game isn’t finished yet. These are just my initial thoughts.

[bowl-of-brain-worms]

[disclaimer that im not very far into hades 2 and i dont want to spoil too much for people who also keep dying around oceanus lol]

I HAVE SO MANY THOUGHTS ABOUT CHARON. i mean i always do but MORE THAN USUAL.

like everyone is talking about how much he misses hermes when hes away doing his spy shit which is. so. fucking cute. BUT ALSO. this poor man has been through so much. one of his brothers is missing, another is in a damn COMA, moros is too busy to hang out (and is antisocial enough he probably wouldnt want to even if he did have free time), who even knows what nemesis is up to. i can only think about how lonely he probably is.

his edges have been worn down, hes so soft in this game. the way he talks to melinoe seems sweeter than how he talked to zagreus. and zag lived in the house his whole life, he probably didnt get to see charon very much growing up and no one can convince me he can understand charons language clearly. BUT MEL CAN. BECAUSE THEY TALK ALL THE TIME!!!!!

charon visits the crossroads often enough that the shades know him. people dont seem so terrified of him like they did in the first game. HES TRYING TO HELP. AND NOT EVEN FOR MONEY!!!! hestia says something about how the gold in this game (rather than charons obols) are from chronos. melinoe asks charon to "dispose of this" when giving him gold.

hes so interesting this time around i love it. im doing everything in my power to interact with him as much as possible on my runs (the boatman tarot will be helpful when i can finally afford it lol)

the second his portrait is released. its so fucking over.

[stillness138]

where are characters from the first Hades game now, and some other character-centric theories:

inspired by this post by @thebuttsmcgee

so from the technical test gameplay stream we learned that Chronos straight up took over the underworld and kidnapped not only Hades, but Zagreus and Persephone too. out of the underworlders from the first game, Charon is still doing his thing in secret, Skelly returns in a new coat, the Wretched Broker is back too, and Hypnos is the only other guy from the House who's hiding at Hecate's hub, but he's also fast asleep...

personally, i think Hypnos might be cursed or something like that. Chronos using Hypnos's schtick against him? lose time by sleeping through it all? or maybe he just wakes up a bit later. hell, maybe he's always asleep during the test but not the final game because he would've dropped a spoiler or something.

so what about the rest?

assuming they're not all imprisoned somehow,

-Nyx and Thanatos: they could've fled to Chaos. a narrator's note at the Crossroads says that it houses 'those still loyal to lord Hades', but doesn't necessarily say 'all of them'. Nyx visits Chaos in the first game once their relationship is mended, and like the post i linked said, Than would've probably tried to protect the family and the House for as long as he could. but in the face of no other option, i think Chaos would be a viable place to flee to for the two of them, out of Chronos's reach similarly to the Crossroads. Than also visits the surface though, so maybe he'll show up at the Crossroads at some point? maybe in a plot point, trying to help Mel free Zag and the fam? both of them are important enough to warrant an appearance.

-the Furies: my idea is that all three of them were forced to serve Chronos. they're a very important part of security and upkeep down there, i think he would've wanted the realm's employees on his side. i don't however think they're going to be the bossfight between Asphodel and Tartarus. they, or Meg alone, should have some presence however.

-Sisiphus: it would be kinda cute if the furies went behind Chronos's back and helped to tuck Sisiphus away somewhere safe, given that he is loyal to Zag/the family and maybe that'd mean they were ordered to torture him again. depends on what Chronos's rule over the underworld looks like for the different shades there, but Melinoë speaks to the few that hang around at Crossroads in an almost comforting manner, so i imagine Chronos is trying to rule by fear and get shades on his side that way. Bouldy's gonna be sad, but fine. i hope. but at least a mention would be nice.

-Achilles and Patroclus (and Theseus&Asterius): ...they're probably separated again, aren't they... brainstorming now, i like (pain and) the idea that they're both in Elysium, just not together. because i think Elysium would've risen up as an army of sorts trying to oppose Chronos, given it's all warriors and heroes. separated by war. Nemesis having Stygius with her makes me believe Achilles could be wielding Varatha. additionally, Theseus being forced to step up and put his vanity aside, delicious idea i think. also, Mel arriving to this supposed paradise only to find it in a desolate state. all of them, i think, should be at the very least mentioned too.

-Orpheus and Euridice: they could be both hiding or imprisoned or forced to serve, but. what if this time it's Euridice who's looking for Orpheus. he's at the house and at Chronos's whim, while she makes it to the Crossroads and asks Mel for help. it'd be a shame if they were never heard from again.

-Cerberus: probably locked up with the fam :( orrr he's running wild all around the realm and Chronos is literally incapable of taming him. that would've been fun. Cerberus bossfight tho... nah. no way he wouldn't see something familiar in Mel. but it could be fun too if done right. he definitely has to reappear.

-Dusa: wild theory time but she's hiding in the rafters, spying on Chronos. :D. if the situation is much more dire, she's either also forced to serve, or even banished into Asphodel to be with the other gorgon heads. either way i think she'll pop up again in some capacity.

-House Contractor, Head Chef, Resource Director: probably unwillingly continuing their jobs under Chronos's rule. although the chef might've lost his job, depends if Chronos like, eats normal food. well mostly onions and fish but still. alternatively, the chef will also show up at Crossroads like the Wretched Broker does.

-THE GOOD SHADE from Elysium: okay war hero good shade arc when? i'm sorry, but i love them.

some other ideas, theories and wishes:

-the obvious one is Hera, like many others i also hope she will appear as a major boon giver.

-i have a feeling, however, that Hermes might not. it seems a bit that Artemis and Selene are filling up his role as the little bit specific boon giver, but maybe i'm wrong. Artemis provides crit boons just like in the first game and Selene has a bit more of a Chaos vibe to her. let's see.

-i do think, or would like it if, Chaos shows up, but not as a boon giver. but i believe they would definitely have something to say about Chronos's actions.

-back to Hermes though... there's that sealed staircase that leads upwards from the Crossroads. people have already been theorizing this, but there might seriously be a section of the game taking place on Olympus, or at the very least somewhere under it. still, i don't think Hermes would be a boon giver either if he does appear. i would however like to see him interact with Charon.

-the Fates will, i think, remain obscure, even if Moros has more of a connection to them. maybe they'll be mentioned and explored a bit more, but i wouldn't count on them appearing by themselves.

-i would however like to see at least one more of Nyx's kids. originally, i also hoped Erebus himself ever shows up personified, but i like what they've done with it as a place.

Eris is i'd say the biggest contender, given that she's namedropped in the first game through a weapon aspect and a purchasable item. maybe she's even boss material (again, if Nemesis has the sword, Eris may wield the rail).

-same thinking can be applied to Ariadne (she lives with Dionysus on Olympus, does she not?), Talos (giant robot made by Hephaestus, how cool is that), and Lamia (snake lady with personal history with Zeus and Hera, would even make for a cool boss too i think, although i always viewed her as a more melancholic figure. but i'm just spitballing here). there are also Atlas, Prometheus and other names on Charon's many items, those are less likely to make an appearance imo.

-Talos also obviously has a weapon aspect in the first one, and then there's Chiron. in myth, he is the son of Chronos. the juiciness of that situation, given he has a relationship with Achilles and Patty as well... perhaps he'll be Elysium's miniboss in the spirit of Asterius? or straight up a main boss? or actually a friendly? i really hope they did something with him, the potential is so very there.

-i think Daedalus will remain present just in name and spirit.

-now that i'm on the weapons though, for all we know there might not be such a thing as weapon aspects (at least not tied to specific figures) in Hades 2, but if there are, including hidden aspects, i'd like to see nods to more of other world mythologies/histories/cultures, like Egyptian, Japanese, pre-columbian American or Slavic.

-this brings me to keepsakes and companion plushies, if they're in the game at all and if so, who gives them out.

keepsake-wise, beside the olympians, Hecate is obvious, as well as Odysseus, and Nemesis and Moros are too. Arachne and Skelly also. Charon seems likely, so does Dora. maybe Hypnos if/when he wakes up. Selene, probably.

i'd say, if companions are a thing, it's also up to Nemesis and Moros, Odysseus, maybe Hecate, likely Arachne, and if there's 6 of them like last time, the final one will be from either Dora or someone we haven't seen yet. or Hecate doesn't give one (she's pretty op for a summon) but Skelly does.

-this also ties into romance! it's been deduced a long time ago, right when the trailer came out, that Nemesis and Moros are very likely romanceable. i also see the appeal and potential of romancing Dora, and from the technical test, i like Melinoë's friendship with Artemis. Hypnos's presence at the Crossroads is interesting from this point too, but i wouldn't guess he'll be romanceable if/when he wakes up.

there are more details to speculate about, especially in gameplay and resources (boss room rewards! the equivalent of nectar/ambrosia to give characters!) but i wanted to keep this mainly about the npcs.

honestly curious what other people are saying!

[babumakeanart]

6 hours of playtime of Hades II -thoughts so far

This post will contain spoilers so those who want to avoid seeing them please don't read anything under the cut. Also, take these are my first 6 hours only, my options might change, develop etc. Don't take anything too deeply as this is my brainrot i need to get out because I am just amazed by this game!

First - Melinoë and the story: 

Melinoë is the most badass sweetheart and she is very pleasant protagonist to follow and learn things in her footsteps, like Zagreus's dynamic to another character she can be respectful but can bite back when her line is past which I really like and it is fun to watch and person is hype for another interaction with NPCs and the environment. 

So far the story is ‘simple’ and I am putting it like that because so far we have a clear goal but you can sense there is something deeper going on and is really interesting to explore. So far I got into the third level, already forgot the name of that but it’s the Mourning Plains or so and boy, that place gave me the creeps the first time I got there and THE BOSS!! oh boy :’DDDDD 

Gathering items:

This is what I kind of find refreshing in one way, that I can gather ingredients much faster than it was in Hades I. Maybe it is just me but gathering the crystals in Hades I is tedious and I still need to buy so much furniture for the house. So far I like the variations you can get and use things for. The gardening is very nice and I think I saw Odysseus checking the garden at one point?? very cute. 

And taking different tools for the run so far doesn't feel like bother to do so and if you unlock forget me not you can actually see what tool you need for recipes. So unlocked stuff is very helpful to you. 

Fighting: 

Of course, the fight style is very different than Zagreus had. Zag feels more like go and smash and be fast, while Mel feels more strategy fight. Not that is slow is still a nice hack and slash, and the difference is very nice to see between siblings! So far I unlock all the weapons and my fav is the axe :DD and the flame weapon is so funny when you are running with them XD 

Nemesis:

I do not really know all the lores about all the characters that are being in the second game as well some in the first game but I love how the game is built on Nemesis' interaction with your runs. How she sometimes (so far I have met her like four times or so in my runs) challenges you who have the most kills, clears the room before you even have a chance to stop and she blocks one doors so you have to choose the other door!! also she buy items in charon shop?? it feels so alive?? and I love it so so much!

Hermes and Artemis:

AAAAAAAAAAA seeing these two actually being there with you is so cool! love it 

Clothes: It's such a tiny detail but when you get different fabrics your clothes change color and is so adorable TTATT ofc my fav is lavender

Cats, dOGS SO MANY ANIMALS:

TTATT do i need to say more??? 

CHAOS: okok when I seen the door to the dimension where Chaos is I sprint there without any thinking but seeing the SPRITE??? hello?? IS THAT MEG?? what does that mean, what is happening why does Chaos look like Meg? What happened to the underground?? This was a point in the game where I really stopped and my brain did this: 

Didn't make a screenshot because I was just stunned but wow

Anyway if anyone want to scream with me please you are very welcome to because I am crying about this game!!! Excuse my bad English I just had to get my thoughts on the paper otherwise I would do no work haha 

Love to hear all the theories!

[xxcrystalinerose]

Gotta love how Zag's love interests are 1) The punisher of jealousy and oathbreakers, 2) Peaceful Death, and 3) Cute gorgon head maid who's a total sweetheart

While Mel's (possible) love interests are 1) Divine Retribution, punisher of hubris, 2) Doom (feared and hated by all mankind), 3) Strife (Greek pantheon's #1 troublemaker), and 4) Two mortals whose whole life story is a cautionary tale about hubris.

All the while unlike Zag, Mel's implied to have never had a romantic relationship before as an adult, based on her Aphrodite boon dialogues (to me, her and Icarus screams "childhood puppy love", which doesn't actually count as true relationship experience).

Girlie I think you need to get therapy or get laid. Preferably both. And soon.

...

I do think it's cute that at least between Meg/Than and Nem/Moros, both women are deliverers of punishment, while both men are embodiments of concepts that will inevitably arrive at the end of mortal lives. Dusa and Icarus + Arachne also fit the mold of "sweetheart dealing with power dynamics issues" (prince/servant vs. goddess/mortal, in Arachne's case a mortal maligned by gods).

Zagreus and Melinoë may have never known each other, but they somehow have the exact same bisexual taste, which is very important to me.

Also proof that they're DEFINITELY Persephone's children: got their mother's taste for tall big tiddy goths lmao.

[soulgathered]

but have you told zag or mel that they are cute today ???

[anywayhereskirkwall]

I'm skimming through the hades 2 stream and it looks very good and I'm definitely excited, but there's a part where they show a family portrait of hades, persephone, zag, and baby mel (it's very cute) and at least 2 or 3 people in the chat responded with "did zag have a baby with his mom? why is he standing next to her while she holds a baby?" Like...why would that be your first thought what's ya'lls damage