#at the very least when mizora is all like ‘how will you fight without my power’ to wyll at the end of his quest

[carryoncastiel]

Thinking thoughts about Wyll and his story. Two things I've gathered 1. His character has been completely rewritten in developement. 2. General consesus is that something is missing from his story.

Now, I haven't played early access and I don't feel like going through old content so this is just the conclusion I came to playing the game as is plus little mentions of things I saw in tumblr posts.

So Wyll is 17 when Mizora comes to him and makes him sell his soul to defeat Tiamat's cultists that want to destroy Baldur's Gate. In this fight he gets pretty badly injured on his face, losing his right eye and sustaining noticeable scars.

We can assume he went back to his father right after the fight and Ulder seeing his 17 year old son, his only child, missing an eye and probably still bleeding, does not listen to his explanation at all (if Wyll even gets to say anything) (edit: I forgot: Wyll actually tells you that he couldn't tell his father about his pact and he tried to show him the battlefield but there was nothing left to show. Still...what did he think was the reason Wyll made the pact then?) and just banishes him from the city for daring to make a pact with a devil.

After that the story gets a bit murky. Wyll tells you how he saved a boy from goblins and that gave him the calling to be the blade of the people. Throughout the game he will casually mention heroic fights he had and you and the other characters take it at face value because there's nothing telling you you shouldn't believe him - but it also doesn't really lead anywhere storywise. He just is the Blade of Frontiers and he does heroic deeds.

What kept bothering me in my first playthrough is that Wyll will casually flirt with Lae'zel and Shadowheart at the beginning of your journey. And it feels very random. The natural conclusion would've been (for me at least) for him to very obviously flirt with the player character too but he doesn't really do that. You have to ask about the dancing and you have to convince him to get one kiss. Even if he's drawn back for other reasons it still doesn't add up.

And of course once you start romancing him you find out he gets all giddy and blushy after that one short kiss at the party and he's a pure romantic at heart who wants to do this the proper way like the bards sing about in old ballads and he won't do anything beyond kissing until he literally proposes and you say yes. Also if you don't romance him and Lae'zel mentions being interested in him at the party, then next day she will lament that they spend the night together but he literally just wanted to talk (did I mention I love Wyll a lot).

The other thing is what Mizora says when you rescue her from the mindflayer colony. She tells you about asking Wyll how they met and the way she says it made me assume it would make Wyll look really bad. But then you hear the story about him saving Baldur's Gate from cultists and there's nothing bad that Wyll did here (besides selling his soul which duh).

Idk much about early access Wyll as I've said but I think he was supposed to be a huge liar. So I assume that actually Wyll was supposed to have made the pact out of seflish reasons and/or making the pact had major repercussions for other people. If for example innocent people died as a consequence it would also seem a tiny bit more reasonable for Ulder to not want to listen to Wyll's reasoning (still a shitty father move though). Now, he would've still been a 17 year old, a child essentially, getting tricked by a devil into selling his soul without realising the full impact it would have. But he would also feel incredibly guilty about it and then lie about it being his proudest moment that he never regretted to mask that fact.

Then he would go on to create The Blade of Frontiers, this huge legend that does every heroic deed you can think of. The flirting with every pretty woman he meets then also would make more sense in a "that's just what heroic male characters in stories do" way.

He would still be a good and heroic person at heart but some of it would be an exaggerated persona he created out of the guilt and shame of what happened when he made the pact and also the feeling of abandonment he got from his father banishing him.

I like Wyll as he's written now but I'd be lying if I didn't say he's missing some depth and giving him more flaws than just "he made a deal with a devil (out of completely selfless reasons no less)" would make him a more interesting character.

[prismatic-starstuff]

So because I talked earlier about my thoughts on Astarion and the polyamory options the game offers with him, I'm just gonna post the post I had in my drafts idk akxmalxnakxn

Disclaimers: I'm all for polyamory in general and I love the fact there are poly options in the game; and if you disagree with my assessments about the tone and/or intention of the dialogue, that's totally fine! I'm not trying to throw shade at anyone who reads things differently or prefers things a different way than me; I'm just having a little ramble about things as I experienced them. I'm not here to fight, so please don't fight with me.

So, there's... a lot of evidence in the game that Astarion doesn't like being with more than one person, and doesn't like his partner being with more than one person. And my potentially hot take on the matter is... I don't think the poly options with him are a good choice; actually, I think they're really cruel.

If you try for polyamory with Astarion and Shadowheart or Minthara, both of them - in very different ways - point out the fact that, basically, he doesn't feel comfortable or safe with the idea of his partner being with multiple people.

Shadowheart says: 'I think you may be overestimating his willingness to share; he might seem like the carefree hedonist, but there's something fragile beneath the facade. If you can give him the solace that I'm convinced he desperately needs, then it would be cruel for me to try and elbow in - liable to end in tears, or blood, or both.'

And Minthara, being Minthara, isn't so nice about it but effectively says the same thing; she says: 'I suspect that would puncture his fragile ego far more savagely than his fangs puncture your neck. Astarion likes to put on a show of nonchalant decadence, but he is as delicate as a flake of snow. Besides, that arrangement would not suit me either. I am not delicate, but I do not share what I desire.'

During the scenes with Halsin - whether it's at the brothel with the drow twins or it's MC asking Astarion about general polyamory with Halsin - it seems painfully like he's going along with it for MC's sake; both conversations are initiated by MC, his immediate reaction in both scenarios is to ask if they're pursuing this because he's not giving them sex, and only after that discussion does he agree to it. He doesn't express any personal interest in it, so it seems to once again be expressly because MC wants it; in fact, he's acting very much like he did in Act 1 back when he was pretending.

I also saw a clip once of someone who slept with Mizora while in a relationship with ascended Astarion, and he's dripping bitterness all the way through the conversation about it. I don't have the exact dialogue on hand right now, but he speaks as though he's jealous because he wanted to be with Mizora too, but— honestly? That whole part felt like a cover. Because with the way he tells MC to at least bring him along if they decide to have other affairs in future, and the way he sounds so mocking and delighted if MC says that the affair was bad in any way, it just feels like he vehemently dislikes the fact it happened at all; it feels like it's not about Mizora at all, it's about the fact he doesn't like them being with somebody else, especially without him.

Still on the subject of ascended Astarion, there's also a line of dialogue where Minthara asks about sharing immortality with her and he pointedly shoots that down, stating that it is 'for me and my darling to share.' In response, Minthara says: 'If they have prevented your eyes and fangs from wandering to other necks, it must be a special bond indeed.' All of this points to Astarion only having eyes (and, uh, fangs) for his darling, and no-one else.

Again, I'm all for polyamory; I wholeheartedly support it, I know polyamorous people and have polyamorous friends. I really love how it's just a normal and accepted thing in BG3 that no-one bats an eyelid at, and I think more games should be taking that approach.

But when it comes to Astarion in specific... he doesn't come across as polyamorous at all, because there's simply too much evidence pointing to the fact that he's not; and so, the polyamory options with him in specific honestly... hurt. Because at no point does he ever seem enthusiastic about it, as if it's genuinely what he wants to do; instead, it all just feels like another extension of him having to go along with what others want in order to satisfy them. There's a piece of dialogue where Astarion mentions how he sometimes does not know how to say no as a result of the trauma and abuse he's gone through, and I think that's exactly what's happening.

And considering that's been his whole life for two centuries, and it's being perpetuated by the person he's developed feelings for suddenly springing these situations on him, it just... doesn't feel good to me, personally.

[blackjackkent]

OK. Prison break report. This took a little finagling and several attempts but here's the upshot. Very long post. XD

There are cells to the east, south, and west of our entry point, as well as several cells in the main room and one gnome who apparently already freed herself.

West is where Ravengard is being held.

The plan here, roughly, is to slam a potion of haste each and split up. The faster we can get all the doors open, the more time all the prisoners have to run for the exit. East seems to be the longest distance to travel, but south is full of water, so there are various complications.

Minsc and Hector can both triple dash (from their rogue extra bonus action and Cunning Action), so we'll send them to the east and west. (According to Hector's character sheet, with all three dashes enabled and standing next to Karlach for her Aspect of the Elk aura, he can move 72 meters in a turn - which maths out to 12m/s or just under 27 miles per hour. XD If he has the Potion of Speed up, this increases to 108 meters per turn - 18m/s or 40mph. This man is going off the rails.)

Karlach has the longest jump distance, so she'll go south across the water. Jaheira is slowest so she'll hang out in the main room and open doors there.

Boo, tragically, does not seem to be able to pull the levers to open the cells. :( Short king.

There are a few sahuagin guards hanging around but it seems like running is probably a better bet than trying to fight them so we're going to try to ignore them at least to start.

Such is the opening state of play.

Actually pursuing the plan turns out to have some complications, namely... Mizora. Of course.

She is, it seems, not particularly happy with Hector and Co. trying to go around her deal with Wyll. (To be completely fair, I chose to come here deliberately, but Hector didn't, but I doubt Mizora cares about this nuance.)

As soon as the door opens on Ravengard's cell, there's immediate echoing laughter in the air - the same laughter which, creepily, plays whenever you put Wyll through the level-up/respec screen.

Yep, that's right, Mr. Duke. How about we talk about it in the submarine, where we--

Oh. Well. That seems fine. Tell her I say hi, I guess.

I'm actually a bit big mad about this, because even with triple dashing which is enough to open every cell door in the western hallway, Hector still has one action left because of the Haste potion, which means... he can do this:

However, it looks as if Fiendish Obeisance isn't being treated as actually coming FROM Mizora, because it stayed active even after Hector cast this on Ravengard.

I was REAL proud of how clever I was being, too :/

Anyway, decided this was a problem for next turn Roz and moved on to having everyone rescue the rest of the gnomes. Minsc with his triple dash had an easy peasy time getting the doors to the east open on the first turn. Karlach, who I just realized has boots of speed and Misty Step in addition to her jump distance, had a similarly easy time with the southern hallway. Both of them were able to run almost all the way back out again too. Double dash with a haste potion is no joke. Jaheira also had no trouble Misty Stepping around the central room to get all her doors open in one turn as well.

At this point we've amassed a pretty sizeable collection of rescuees, mostly gnomes but also a few humans who seem to be members of Ravengard's retinue:

All of them (except Ravengard) have a buff on called "Glimpse of Freedom" which increases their movement speed. So getting all the doors open on one turn seems like a good start and hopefully they'll all just motor their way out by themselves without my assistance.

Ravengard seems like he's going to be a problem, though. Dimension Door would make this quite simple, but Shadowheart is back at camp, probably brooding, and we have no scrolls for it, so we've got to do this the hard way.

I got control of Ravengard when his turn came around, which made me briefly hopeful that maybe the protection from good and evil worked after all, but 'twas not to be:

Aw shit. Here she comes.

"Well, look who it is. I was hoping you'd bound along. A bargain's a bargain - and I've come to see it through." She glares at Ravengard imperiously. "Mea furia. Kneel for me."

Without hesitation, puppeted on invisible strings, the Duke kneels.

Mizora smiles coldly.

"If only Wyll were here to see this. This *is* what he wanted, after all... Now stand back and enjoy the show!"

And she vanishes, replaced instead by seven infernal spiders who all swarm Ravengard at once.

...OK, let's try that again. Fuck you, Mizora.

Resetting back to the point where Ravengard came out of the cell, I skipped trying to apply PfEaG to him and instead hurled Hector's only Potion of Supreme Healing onto the Duke's dumb face. I then ran everyone else through their rescue missions in the other hallways again, pivoting them all towards the east when they were done in preparation to act as an honor guard to get this poor bastard out of here. I also sent Boo down the eastern hallway for moral support.

This is a very busy opening turn. :P

Triggered Mizora again, and this time, as planned, the spiders weren't able to one-shot him, although they did come pretty damn close and also triggered something called "Blood-Scent Frenzy" in one of the nearby sahuagin.

However, the fact that he lived past the first turn made it possible for a) Hector to toss another health potion on him and beat the shit out of the threatening sahuagin, b) Minsc to barrel completely from one end of the facility to the other and finish the sahuagin off before running almost all the way back to the escape ladder, c) Jaheira to toss another health potion on him and kill the last two spiders, and d) him to survive the explosions from the last two spiders and start running for the door.

Meanwhile I ended up sending Karlach back down the west hallway where Minsc came from so she could provide her Elk speedy aura to the gnomes that were still trying to get out.

(I have no idea if this is as interesting to read as it was to play, but it was VERY intense in the moment. :D I felt very cool and strategic.)

At this point, things started to get a smidge more concerning, as more sahuagin started spawning in and everyone's haste potions wore off so we basically completely lost a turn (other than, thankfully, Ravengard being able to make a break for the door). I also realized there had been no sign of Omeluum this whole time. (I also discovered that two of the gnome hostages had been killed; probably it's possible to get them all out safely and maybe I will try on a future run but for right now I'm counting it as a victory if we get most of them plus Ravengard and Omeluum out.)

Omeluum is hanging out in a side corridor off the western passageway. Originally I was gonna send Karlach after him since she's already down that way, but he's also behind a locked door which means Hector; I had him chug another haste potion to postpone the lethargy and book it down the hallway while everyone else headed for the exit ladder. (Conveniently, this happened right as Omeluum decided to pop into his head and tell him to GO, which Hector ignored. Going to be a bit of interesting soul-searching later about him going to these lengths to help a mind flayer, I suspect - especially while he's planning to betray the Emperor.)

The gnomes, bless them, did pretty much make a run for it to safety without my assistance while all this was going on. And with Karlach's Aspect of the Elk and Minsc throwing health potions from the upper level we were able to get Ravengard out of danger with three turns remaining.

The number of sahuagin in the place was starting to make the game chug a little bit, though. O.O

Hector got to Omeluum on turn 5 and had no remaining actions to help Omeluum out of his restraints, which meant that everything started happening very fast on turn 6. At this point everyone else had made it into the submersible so it was ONLY Hec and Omeluum unaccounted for.

I had it on good authority from @zenjestrr that Omeluum could bamf his own damn self straight to the submersible, so Hector gave him a help action and then started barreling out of there.

And with Haste, with three dashes, 30 remaining HP after every AoO in the place, and a brainful of absolute panicked terror...

...he barely made it.

YESSSSSSSS.

Omeluum had a pretty tight time of it; there were eight sahuagin in the room with him by the time his turn finally came around at the bottom of the order, but he was still alive. Barely.

Go boy go!

And he made it in and at the last minute we sailed away!

Fun little cutscene (which Minsc got control of for some reason, but I didn't feel like going back and wrestling it to try and figure out why it wasn't Hector) of everyone getting into the sub and looking relieved.

Woohoo, we did it! \o/

That was intense, haha.

Several follow-up scenes, it seems, but it is late so those will have to come tomorrow before raids. :D