#fenian brotherhood theory

[midnight-in-town]

Let's talk about the "Fenian brotherhood" theory !! :D

Firstly, in case you don't know about it, please go read the theory that our!Ciel's birth name might be Fenian/Fionn/Finnian by @azuresins. It is incredibly relevant to what I'm about to explain next !

TBH, I don't really care about discovering our!Ciel's birth name. However, I truly enjoy this theory and I think it makes a lot of sense, because I absolutely agree with the idea of Vincent supporting (secretly or not) Irish independence, turning him into a political enemy of Queen Victoria...

...which could be very much why he ended up dead.

This theory comes from a private convo with my friend, @dorkshadows and I'll sum up their thoughts (and some of mine) below the cut !

First of all, while we think Claudia, Vincent's predecessor, may have been a personal enemy of Victoria because of whatever happened when Albert died in 1861, Vincent strikes us more as a political enemy precisely because of Brown's comment in ch108.

After all, if our!Ciel, who just managed to thwart their plans of getting the sulin gas, is "more like his father everyday", then it makes sense that Vincent "got in the way" of some of Victoria & JB's war/political plans too. >_>

Now, about the Fenian Cycle book: it was an important symbol for Irish independence and the Fenian Brotherhood that started in the 19th century before it got dissolved in 1880. To quote Wikipedia:

"The Fenian Brotherhood traced their origins back to 1790s, in the rebellion, seeking an end to British rule in Ireland initially for self-government and then the establishment of an Irish Republic. The rebellion was suppressed, but the principles of the United Irishmen were to have a powerful influence on the course of Irish history."

But how would Vincent even get involved with it and why?

In the theory that OC's name is Fenian/Finnian, @azuresins mentioned that maybe it's all related to Cedric K. Ros having Celtic origins. Since we do have one sketch by Yana of one twin bringing the Fenian Cycle book to the Undertaker (the most likely candidate for Cedric K. Ros)...

...it might indeed be a partial answer.

There is another possibility though, entirely thought by @dorkshadows, which is that Rachel (and Ann) might have been of Irish origins too.

After all, a common stereotype for Irish people in many stories is red hair and it's hard to forget that it was a very distinctive characteristic of Ann, Rachel's sister !

In fact, one of their first interactions is Vincent telling Ann to be proud of that hair, which we were told she inherited from her dad, the twins' maternal grandfather.

So Vincent might have not just been talking about Ann's hair color in that scene, but more specifically about her taking more pride in her Irish origins. Obviously though, Dalles/Durless aren't very Irish names, but it is possible that their original family name got anglicized into a more traditionally English name.

In any case, Vincent met Rachel and Ann after already knowing their father :

So it's possible that Vincent was, as the Watchdog, investigating Lord Durless as a nobleman with Irish lineage and possible ally of the Fenian Brotherhood. After all, to quote this article, "the Fenians in England and the British Empire were a major threat to political stability". Then Vincent met and fell in love with Rachel, thus deciding to support the Brotherhood instead.

I'd add that Vincent supporting such a cause simply makes sense, considering that the Phantomhive family, too, might have been burdened by the Watchdog's duty generations ago, because of their "different" lineage (full theory here). On top of that, if you add the possibility that Cedric/UT also was of Celtic origins (many decades or centuries ago) and that Vincent knew Claudia's death was Victoria's fault, it only makes sense that he'd eventually politically antagonize the Queen (both for his parents' sake and for Rachel's).

@dorkshadows also pointed out that, to this day, we don't know if the twins' maternal grandfather is alive or dead in canon : he was important enough to be mentioned in Red's flashback but has been missing from the narrative ever since. Timeline-wise, he could be dead, especially since we never saw him in the Blue Memory arc (our!Ciel's flasback), but we never know with Yana (look at Claudia being hinted in panels ever since the circus arc and probably being incredibly relevant), so it's worth keeping in mind.

Then, moving on to ch132 we know that, when the twins were born, Rachel is the one who named them.

Coincidentally (read: it's probably not a coincidence xD), ch132 had the cover with Vincent reading the Fenian Cycle book to the twins and it's also the chapter in which Vicar Rathbone casually says that one twin/both twins (it's deliberately ambiguous in Japanese) have a name that is "rare for England" :

Many fans, myself included, thought that "Ciel" was the name being discussed there, but maybe they were actually talking about our!Ciel's celtic birth name ! To quote @azuresins, in that case that'd basically mean that, in that scene above, "Vincent said to an ENGLISH PRIEST [...] that people of Celtic origin deserved freedom, and to be treated better and that it probably was soon to come".

No wonder that Vicar Rathbone would immediately change the topic lmao ! xD

Vicar Rathbone be like

It is also very meaningful that Rachel decided to give the "Fionn/Fenian/Finnian" name to our!Ciel ("the spare"), as if to emphasize that he was free to make his own path in life, as the second son, unburdened by earldom. Choosing such a meaningful name might even be a parallel to Vincent's own situation with Frances as his spare, since both also have names with a meaning relating to victory and freedom.

Another important detail, as @azuresins already explained here, is that Fenian Cycle is also a tale of revenge and that our!Ciel parallels Fionn big deal, making it all even more relevant. And maybe Yana left other hints in her artworks too...

Finally, historically the Fenian Brotherhood officially got dissolved around 1880 (the twins were 5 years old), but it's always possible that, in Kuroverse, Vincent managed to make it thrive secretly as the Watchdog. The Fenian Brotherhood caused several incidents, including after 1880 (they assassinated a British Chief Secretary in 1882), so it wouldn't be impossible that the Queen eventually found out that Vincent didn't properly take care of them, because he was supporting them.

And when she found out? Well, she branded Vincent a political enemy and we know the rest (the household was massacred in 1885 and the killer most likely received help from real!Ciel, more details in the real!Ciel mastermind theory hehe).

The idea that Vincent ultimately became a political enemy of Victoria because he fell in love with Rachel makes their death...

...even more emotional to me, since Rachel probably died trying to protect Vincent. T_T

TL;DR that's the Fenian Brotherhood theory: because they supported an Irish rebellious group that wanted freedom, Vincent & Rachel were branded political enemies of Victoria and she & JB plotted their deaths, which led in happenstance to the RCMT.

(friendly reminder that the twins are 7, when Vincent asked Dee to look after them should he die)

I hope it was clear ! Thanks for reading. :))

[zooterchet]

MI-6 vs. RIN (RIN, the Enemy)

MI-6: British Intelligence, "Irish Division" (Criminal Networks and Corporate Lockworks)

Method: Each division has at least one genetic claimant, trapping other members in after one year or more of service.

"EV-L": Montreal Mafia, Canadian Defense Industry.

"ANGEL": Double, Manx-Amon.

"IMF": Kruz, Propaganda Denial.

"Secret Chiefs": Westminster, Metro-Pol.

"Spider": Colonial Plantation, Fugitive Hunter.

"CHiPs": Police Equality, Comedy Central.

"Hasbro": Game Theory, Police Narcotics.

"Child Study Committee": Behavioral Development, Royal Marines.

"COBRA": Insurance Courts Register, Canadian Intelligence.

"Canadian Mounted Patrol": Coordinates and Armory, Carnegie Institute.

"Irish Mafia": Counter-Conscript, Clams Casino.

"White's Parlor": Bets and Wagers, Bicycle Cards.

"White Power": Southern Poverty Law Center, Norse Nobel Prize.

"House of Usher": Deep Dive Operatives, Poe Center for Learning.

"Narcotics Bureau": Federal Agent, Kayem Old Thyme.

"Fenian Brotherhood": Hiring References, Penguin Books.

"Jewish War Room": Advertisements and Fortunes, Fox Studios.

"Foreign Office": Insurance Propaganda, Hollywood.

"British Airways": Amsterdam International, Bollywood.

"Philip J. Morris": OWL/MLA Format, Dutch Country.

"Yacht Club": Shingles and Textiles, British Lumber.

"Q Branch": Feminist Theory, Bretonwood Academy.

"Black Flag": Ales and Pilsners, Anheiser-Busch.

"Abwehr Rogue": Bank Abnormalities Exorcist, Texas Instruments.

"Insane Clown Posse": Urban Intelligence, Hip Hop.

"Haganah": Boston Police Extrajurisdictional, Friends Stand United.

Rival Body: Royal Irish Navy 

Method: The lower on the list a hit is, the more severe, cycling upwards to death, automatic consideration of mebershiip.

 Irish: Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous tips, to poison a man's career, under good trust of false logic. 

Russian: The force of individuals into minority logic, to sword rally votes.

British: The defamation of economic forms, if aligned with Eagle Scout, through racial slurs applied.

French: The accusation of sexual defamation, for refusal of homosexual sex in case of changing of woman approached.

Israeli: The censorship of work produced, in challenge of morals of equality egalitarian, not libertarian commerce of purchased politician.

German: The mockery of own figure bought and sold in number to foreign state, out of rivalry of defeated military effort.

Arabian: The false accusation of treachery international, for discovery of superior system impossible for states of poverty.

Iranian: The challenge to laws of American attorney, through public defamation supporting those ignorant.

Palestinian: The common suit of men, on behalf of women, those abusing suits of court.

Spanish: The bigotry to leave area, if having incorrectly informed child of false status of fact, to make child blind to truth of father's own passage to child.

Portugese: The passage of African ignorant, through Jews as conduit of slavery.

Italian: The assumption of prostitution, through claim of man having failed job of office, and placed into halls of teacher.

African: The offense at notation of cheat by politician supported by foreign government, and the claim of victory at trial by juror won by foe.

Chinese: The exploitation of own labor, through abuse of immigrant migrant to own foreign country supported by trade politics.

Japanese: The support of own system, at secret expense to other, through understanding of own culture ignorant among services, through "anime".

Korean: The concept of corruption as refused to listen through man refusing crime in trade of dishonor, instead placing false education of office in support of own foolishness of women of own blood, "slants".

Vietnamese: A public ouster, after having discovered flaw of mother, at fatherhood of victim.

Latino: The claim of own spouse as victim, when aggressor to spouse, however through public show of pederasty when applied to child of stolen identity having observed.

Swedish: The ignorance of common people, for child's goal and false fear of self, when applied to other in accusation.

Finnish: The replication of tragedy against those more literate, through molestation of people through own failure to match atrocity observed by own public figure declaimed as other, the shame of futility in governance.

Greek: The reference to own feces as sacred, the lira market.

[azuresins]

This is just me talking out loud. I worry about misunderstandings when I talk to people, maybe too much...  When I say “Irish people were historically oppressed,” and talk about some of my theories, I worry people think I’m one... of... those people, who uses the Irish Slave Myth, aka: ‘white people were kept as slaves, too HURR HURR’ and use false equivalencies to invalidate actual slaves, and the oppression of PoC. ...I’m not one of those people.   I don’t think that Indentured servitude, is even comparable to slavery, or should be compared to it at all. It was a separate injustice.  I’m just saying that Indentured servitude, generally, was a bad thing and a human rights violation. Illegal, by today’s standards. And a HUGE part of British History, and it shouldn’t be overlooked, or dismissed. On December 13th, 1884 two members of the Fenian Brotherhood tried to blow up the London Bridge, and they failed... but I still think that the bombings and the political climate concerning the Irish / Indentured Servants (especially those who were taken against their will) are important to consider, in relation to what’s going on in the story, sure--! But outside of it it’s also. It’s important to consider.  “Whiteness™” and what’s considered to be the “Pure Aryan Race™” was foolishness, non-sense, hogwash, naz/ism, and also extremely politically based information that would change with time, and it took a long time for people to realize the Irish weren’t their own, inferior race of people that could SEEM white/Anglo-Saxton or whatever-the-fuck that was meant to be “perfect”, but weren’t! Because of stupid, shitty reasons... It just gets frustrating when people are like “....What? that was a thing?” like. YEAH BRUH IT WAS A REALLY BIG DEAL 

[eruditetyro]

this is under a readmore because people follow me who haven’t read call down the hawk!!! definite spoilers ahead please don’t read if you haven’t finished the book!!

so from chaos and vexed to nightmare. when you google “from chaos vexed to nightmare” all that comes up is that one yeats poem that fucking hozier and every other creator seems to quote all the time, The Second Coming. so I was reading an analysis of this poem and I have theories about mor o corra and niall and the new fenian. I think the situation is perhaps mirroring yeats’ life in that he was in love with maud but she ended up marrying some guy with “more revolutionary spirit.” obviously the new fenian is niall but is also tied to fenians which are members of the irish republican brotherhood. 

so niall emigrated to america from ireland for a reason, right? likely he was tied to whatever revolution mor o corra was in, but he wasn’t enough of a revolutionary for her, or he had to leave, and so he was replaced by the new fenian. I’ve seen lots of theories about this and it’s common theory that mor o corra is the person aurora was based off of but furthermore i would like to posit that mor o corra herself, declan’s real mother, is also a dreamer or perhaps even a visionary, or maybe just otherwise associated with magic (I DO NOT believe that adam is a visionary. adam’s never had a vision, first of all, and he’s 19, and most visionaries are supposedly destroying themselves at that point, right? the fox way psychics aren’t visionaries. hennessy is not a visionary and still saw the lace, ronan’s dream where adam is grown up can be explained as a symptom of them growing up and ronan wanting to grow old with adam. it’s not that deep) -- if mor o corra is not a dreamer, though, i’m not sure how the new fenian came about, because i’m quite sure he is a dream copy of niall. 

now obviously boudicca and the new fenian are connected. i wonder how deep that goes? was the new fenian created for boudicca? did niall go to america to distance himself from boudicca? in the books boudicca seems to be primarily or entirely made up of women, and so perhaps mor o corra intercepted declan’s request and sent the new fenian, who has no real direct connection to boudicca. i’m excited to find out more about all this in the next book.

I also wonder how bryde is connect to all of this. I think his irish story about the fish/hawk man was obviously about himself. I think he sees himself this way. that’s good in that it paints him in a positive light as a wise figure and ronan is very much at his mercy at the end of the book, but I’m still hesitant to trust him as we know so damn little about him. how has he figured out how to find dreamers? is he tapped into the ley lines, somehow? why is the lace frightened of him? what is the lace? I’m betting it’s connected to the ley lines and the end of the world. I wonder if it’s what ultimately sends the visions to the visionaries. the whole concept of the visionaries is fascinating. I wonder where they come from and how they work-- it seems strange to have a condition where your only choices are to turn it outward and hurt everyone around you or turn it inward and hurt yourself. surely there’s a third way. I wouldn’t be surprised if maggie explores that in the rest of the trilogy.

I really wonder what liliana’s deal is. I don’t think she wants to kill dreamers at all. my dream is that she and carmen work together against the agency after carmen finally caves to her conflicting morals. liliana seems to only be working with the agency as a way to get to where she wants to be, not as an end goal, you know?

is it possible that declan’s parents are both dreamers? is it possible that there’s more to declan than declan knows? I wonder how declan found out that aurora isn’t his mother. I’m so happy that he’s finally allowing himself a little personality. there’s really no point in him hiding anymore.

and adam. I really hope he’s ok. I don’t think he’s a visionary, and I expect he’ll be reunited with ronan at some point in the next book. I’m worried that he’ll have to drop out of harvard due to magic shit. I’m worried he’ll break up with ronan to attend harvard. I’m worried he’ll be kidnapped and used for evil. I’m worried that the lace has him. 

those are all my current thoughts on greater plot stuff. if you’ve read the book and want to bounce theories i’d love to hear from you!

[azuresins]

WHAT How can you even think alexis might be involved with the Queen in getting rid of the phantomhives?! If alexis turned out to be responsible for Ourciel's misery, Ociel would kill him, and that would surely destroy any future he might want with lizzy, they're my OTP!! Ugh! Curse your dumb theory! Alexis is a angel!!!!!!!!!! You Are Dead Wrong.

If you really think O!Ciel is going to reach adulthood to life a long happy wonderful life with Elizabeth Midford, I don’t know what to tell you... I’m not going to judge you for having them as your OTP, but whether her father is involved or not, I fail to see how you can’t just find a way to make your ship work around it.    Alexis might be involved, or know more than what he is letting on, because he’s...literally head of security for the Queen? Directly under her? And he’s also connected to the Phantomhive’s through his wife on a much more personal level. The motive to get rid of the Phantomhive family would add up, in his case for several reasons. He outranks them in status, for one; it’s a very sad thing when your daughter marries beneath her status rank. He would get to keep his only daughter from marrying into that family which he knows to be extremely dangerous -- His wife has done a great job of reminding him and her daughter how lethal of a position being the wife of the Earl of Phantomhive is; if the death of Rachel and Vincent and the consistent deaths in the family history weren’t enough of a reminder.  I also have a theory that a big part of the reason why Vincent, Rachel and their children were targeted in the first place was because of their extensive support to common-classes and charity works. And their support toward, specifically, Irish and celtic immigrants who, at this time, are being treated like dirt by the majority of England. The name “Fenian” or “Finnian” was considered a dangerous name or a ‘slur’ to England’s upper class, so the fact that Vincent, would casually read such a book as the Fenian Cycle to his children as a bedtime story, is enough to show where his true loyalty lies. Queen Victoria and the rest of England were NOT kind to historically to Irish and celtic immigrants, for a long time. If even one of her trusted nobles such as the Phantomhives went against her, or even tried to imply they were supportive of such people (there was a group of Irish resistance who were marked terrorists, called the Fenian Brotherhood); she likely would want them dead. Because in plain terms, like a lot of minorities, at some point the Irish and other celtic immigrants weren’t just ‘lesser humans’ they were also seen as threats. To England.   Alexis himself said:

"The Marquessate of Midford is a house of knights that has protected England for generations. To ignore the plight of her people would go against the code of chivalry." If he thought the house of Phantomhive had been sullied, or that Vincent and Rachel were threats to England at large? I absolutely think he would have sided with the Queen.  He’s also O!Ciel’s legal guardian; and he didn’t seem to have any issue leaving him alone to be raised by himself and cared-for by servants and left to his own devices very shortly after the deaths of his entire immediate family. For how much he seems to love him? As a father? No good person, would let a ten-year-old even in Victorian times, take on that alone. Also? 

Name one key person in this story, who seemed like a sweet/nice/good/well-meaning character, who either didn’t a.) turn out to be hiding a huge deep dark horrible secret  b.) have some deep tragedy surrounding them c.) they were deadass a villain in the arc  In the best case scenario, he’s an idiot and extremely stupid and neglectful and the Queen was SOMEHOW careful enough not to tell her head of secret security, about her secret plan, to kill one of her own and burn the mansion to the ground (see how bad that sounds?).  In the worst case, he helped kill them/failed to protect them from what was coming.  And finally, I just don’t care for him. 🤷‍♂️

[azuresins]

Since my last theory was so well received, I decided to make another piping hot take on OC’s real name. I know others have considered this as a possibility, and have made posts long ago about it before, but I didn’t go into detail about why. I wanted to compile all the evidence in one place, and include a crucial political piece of evidence that I feel people missed.  //deep breath// Finnian, but more likely, Fenian. Different spelling, but same pronunciation, all the difference in the world in context. 

So I’m sure we’ve all noticed this list before. However I’d like to gently point out one thing: These were names considered for REAL CIEL, there is no list for Our Ciel. 

“It’s just an alias he picked” you say. Is it just an alias?

Or did that name mean something much more? Look at how often this book comes up. Why?

Our Ciel is trying to live as his brother, right?  Real Ciel, in the mind of OC, could likely name a servant or someone after his little brother, and no one would think anything of it. He saw something in Finny that he saw in himself. 

“Cedric”, dear grandpa (whoever he might be 👀) -- Likely a Celtic person, with an Celtic name. This is the Victorian Era.  People of Celtic origin were almost never noble. Irish, Scottish, Welsh and others of Celtic origin as a collective whole were people were facing hardship and fighting England for their freedom. Names and namesakes were e v e r y t h i n g.

A french name, a noble name, a pretty name, would not have made anyone react this way. But an Irish name absolutely would.  ESPECIALLY “Fenian” -- considered a slur even in some parts of England at this time. Has anyone heard of the Fenian Brotherhood?  

They were a radical group, a huge “problem” (to England) in the 19th century. There would virtually be no bigger “fuck you” to the Queen than to name your son Fenian, and show pride in your “”””” undignified”””””” roots. 

Also, it would make what Vincent said to an ENGLISH PRIEST (extremely heavy metal and) uncomfortable. He basically said that people of Celtic origin deserved freedom, and to be treated better and probably was soon to come. Hence, the priest suddenly changing the subject.  Rachel likely wanted to give each twin a name that represented their non-english heritage: French and Celtic. It made all the sense in the world to give Ciel a name fitting a noble, and Fenian to the twin who was free to make his own path in life (politically that name is associated to freedom, also why OC would name his servant who was captive the same name. He clearly saw something of himself in him, and wanted him to be free.)  *Edit: I realized that I used “Irish”  when I should have “Celtic” because the Celts originated from and spread to many countries and areas besides Ireland, I apologize for that. I adjusted a few words in this to make the point more clear.  *Edit two: Fenian / Finnian is also associated with the color white, as well as yellow. Hence, “Black Butler” -- OC is “white” or symbolic of the other side of the board. Monochrome, chess, black and white, the promise in WHITE clover, -- there’s been hints the entire time, honestly. 

***Edit 9/4/18

Another hint from kuro wiki, if Oc truly is (also) symbolic for a WHITE star while RC is the BLUE star... 

****Edit 5/31/19 - more info about the Fenian Brotherhood above, addition below:  Since the name is clearly associated with white/yellow and we’re going with that O!C is symbolic for a white star ... I just want to point out that the brightest star in the sky isn’t technically Siruis. 

It’s the Sun. Our Sun is a white star.  How many times in Kuroshitsuji has a sunrise been significant? 

[azuresins]

I read your fenian name theory and I love it. But would Vincent and Rachel be that stupid, though? Naming their kid "Isis" basically.

I just spit out my tea ‘naming their kid Isis’ fsjafhiasueut9wetewthewkt t So-- yes and no. I wouldn’t compare it with Isis. Although the Fenian Brotherhood eventually became radicalized and many resorted to extreme violence: Consider how much death, war, and cultural loss was suffered at the hands of England. For decades.   I don’t know if I can put into one post how many people died and were killed just for their faith, alone and burned for no-good reasons. Their gods and goddesses went from that, to ‘fairies’, to demons by the time King James was in power and he came way before Victoria did.  To be honest with you, the Big Thing™ that REALLY would have set Queen Victoria off doesn’t add up with the timeline because it happened well after the twins were both born (But then again, Kuro doesn’t have a completely set-in-stone timeline, either), but there is no shortage of how strong that name was politically.  Vincent and Rachel Phantomhive were notorious for their charity work and were really loved by the common people. But the house of Phantomhive was also responsible for protecting the queen FROM people like the fenian brotherhood; and the Phantomhive Manor was the main base of operations-- so that explained why the house had to go, too.   If someone in my most trusted circle had a child who was born on the anniversary of my beloved husband’s death, and then named that child after a group that actively hated my guts and were trying to assassinate me-- I’d be more than a little pissed off.  It’s heartbreaking to me wondering how different things might have been if OC were named Albert, or something.  As for “being that stupid” - I don’t think it was a matter of being stupid. I think it was an act of bravery; and the Queen (or her security eyes on the midfords), took it way....way, way too far; seeing the name as a threat. And who knows? Maybe Vincent WAS a threat, and plotting something against her. I wouldn’t blame him if he was.  That’s my understanding of it. If his name is anything else, I’ll be really confused by the way the manga is written.