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So yesterday I said I had ✨opinions✨ on the DLC and today I have come to the conclusion that as per usual, I will not chill until I dumped them somewhere lmao. It's mainly focused on what I've seen people say about Carmine and Kieran online, be it on tumblr or other websites.
Teal Mask Spoilers under the cut :3
I have no idea if I used the under the cut feature even right lmao I've kinda always just been a douche and ignored it when talking about spoilers as I've realised gfjdjrc
Ok anyway so. I think what personally bothered me the most is a lot of people saying "they just have a perfectly fine siblings relationship, nothing unhealthy to see here" and "Kieran is a coldass douchebag who view others as objects and only cares about strength". Both statements I strrroooongly disagree with.
First about his and Carmine's relationship, since it plays into the other thing. It seems that their parents aren't around, though it's unknown why. The grandparents are apparently pretty lackluster in taking over their job and because of that, it seems that Carmine has taken it on herself to take somewhat of guardian role for Kieran. Which is a role she's visibly overwhelmed by, which makes sense, because that's not a role you should have to take when you yourself are maybe like 17/18 lol. You can see that she absolutely does care for and wants the best for him, but at the same time she can't wrap her head around his actions and how he's feeling. So a lot of the things she does she does out of good intentions (for example telling the player for him that he's interested in them because she says he couldn't ever ask on his own, or the whole lying thing where she believes not telling him you guys met Ogrepon prevents him from feeling left out), without understanding that they have quite literally the opposite effect (Kieran feeling like he's unable to do anything on his own BECAUSE she does everything for him, and of course him feeling left out BECAUSE you and her keep meeting Ogrepon a secret). On top of that she clearly has issues keeping her own emotions down, so instead of reacting calmly she'd yell at him whenever he does or says something she doesn't like. And whether you want to see that certain one-liner as her implying she does also hit him when she's not "being nice" or not, she seems unaware of what effect these reactions have on her brother. I do think the implication might very well be on purpose, but it's just not as obviously stated as it could be because this is still a Pokémon game and we don't gotta be too in your face about child abuse in a game that like 8 year olds play lol.
Anyway, aside from him thinking he can't make decisions on his own and stuff, there's a lot of ways this treatment shows in Kieran. Notice how while Carmine is pretty open about showing her anger, he keeps trying to repress his own until later in the story where he's starting to be unable to do so? You can see that when you battle him the first couple times and he loses, the light in his eyes leaves briefly (yknow, the anime thing they both do where that shows them being angry/frustrated) before he grabs his head and just says aw man or something. And when she outs him on his crush or whatever on you, he also looks angry like that, but she immediately shuts him down like usual. I'm pretty sure that's a learned behaviour on his part, aka "when I get openly angry or sad my sis will yell at and/or hit me so I have to keep it down". That's why he always switches the topic, runs off or just goes quiet when he pisses her off or he thinks he pisses her or someone else off. It's optional dialogue so idk how many people have seen it, but Carmine confirms that at the festival, though she again misunderstands why he does it.
Have a high quality photo of what I mea-
So yeah, in short, in regards to their relationship, I think it's clear that it's pretty dysfunctional. For some reason Carmine's stuck with taking a caretaker role she cannot possibly fill given her own issues and age. As a result, she takes it out on her little brother who in turn has to suffer the double bagage of lack of parents and dealing with his older sister's moods. And with next to no social contacts outside of her, he's stuck in that situation and he's got no one to help him learn how to deal with this in a healthier way (same with Carmine really). All he knows that if he was "stronger", he could deal with this better. Like that cool ogre from the folktale that does not care what people think of it and keeps fighting for its right to be respected regardless. Stronger being a very arbitrary word here, as the only specific goal he mentions (in the beginning) is able to stand up against his sister.
Now onto the whole "Kieran sees Ogrepon, the player, probably everyone but him, as an object" thing which... yeah no, he's not a sociopath kcngjtc
More precisely, the player character comes in as this cool person who has no trouble beating his sister in a battle. They don't seem to have all that much trouble socialising either. Good thing he doesn't know all the kewl stuff we did at Area Zero and all or he'd lose it completely. I think a big bonus is also that we're not from his town, so we don't have any bias against his ogre idol. So like, he's head over heels for us, he actually gets to hang out with us and warms up as we realise we're interested in his stories and all and wow. He's found an actual real friend omg. He might not be 100% aware of that, but that's all he really wanted. He wanted to befriend the ogre because it sounded like it would be someone to understand him. And now there's suddenly this super nice person who's taking that role.
But then suddenly, that person hangs out with his meanie sister and stops interacting with him almost entirely. I have a feeling that Carmine hanging out with people he'd want to befriend and them making fun of him is just a thing that happened before and that's why he jumps to that conclusion right away. Keep in mind, the reason Carmine came to us in the first place is literally to make fun of his lack of skills at the mini game lol.
So yeah, the reason Kieran is so massively pissed off is because he does view the player character as a human being, and one he really really liked and put up the courage to open up to, yet from his POV we shamelessly take advantage of that and leave him alone again to hang out with his sis instead. Would probably come off to him like you just pretended to be his friend because you had to and now you're hanging out with the cooler kids and giggle about how silly he looked when, idk, he asked to have a sandwich with you lol. Of course this is not what the player intended (or is meant to intend) and I too felt physical pain when the game gave me no option but to lie xD but I'm pretty sure you guys making up and giving each other another chance is what's gonna happen in Indigo Disk.
For Ogrepon, instead of as an object, I think he just keeps seeing the ogre from the story in her. You gotta remember that he never gets to properly interact with her, he doesn't even refer to her by her actual name like Carmine does once she learns it. He doesn't understand that, ironically just like him, what she really wants is just acceptance and a friend. He thinks that the reason she's distrusting of him is not because she has trust issues and needs to warm up first just like him, but because he isn't as strong as you are, the one she does trust much easier. He's so convinced that nothing in his life will change for the better until he's "stronger" that... presumably the Dokutaro thing somewhere during the mid point starts influencing him. Not like, straight up possession, but more it taking advantage of his instability and promising to give him the strength he wants if he does what it wants. Just like the dex entries of the loyal three says what happened to them. So Dokutaro moreso takes the role of some guy who's a really bad influence and convinces you to do things that will harm both you and others with some sneaky lil psychological tricks. Because I mean, self-sabotaging is something Kieran literally does around the time he presumably comes in contact with Dokutaro. He completely stops trying to talk to you, he boxes the furret he apparently raised from an egg, he doesn't come along to help beat the loyal three to get the masks. I wonder tbh, if Dokutaro was influencing him, if it didn't lead him away from helping with that on purpose, since it originally made the loyal three steal the masks in the first place. I guess that would also explain why he would have been fine with Ogrepon just going back to the cave so he could get the masks back later. And while there definitely is the whole jealousy aspect, I think it's also Dokutaro leading him into actions he wouldn't normally do to get the masks. Because if he gets the masks it'll give him what he wants or whatever. I think without the Dokutaro influence, honestly, he'd probably just have locked himself up in his room for the rest of the story after you lying and sobbed into his Furret pal's fur lmao.
Soo yeah, I think that's about it. They both have quite some issues and continue the trend of ScaVio characters that really need a therapist lol. I like Kieran especially though, he's really adorable despite having his own set of flaws of course. So I do hope the next part will take his (and Carmine's) story into a satisfying direction. And I better get to give him a hug because he needs one smh. Maybe Arven can make him some top tier candy apples. Oh oh yeah, noticed btw that he adds Dipplin to his team after he gave us a candy apple at the festival and told us there's a mon that looks like one? Pokémon likes to do storytelling via the team, so maybe the Dippling reminds him of our broship 😔😔
#pokémon#the teal mask#kieran pokemon#carmine pokemon#furret deserves everything btw he better takes it back into his team eventually
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