#grandfairy

[dj-beta14]

Here you go, another episode with english subtitles. Enjoy :)

[violetfaust]

Hooboy, long-ass post coming

Out of respect for @laschatzki I am replying to @rubbady-pubbady‘s reply to my post in this thread with a new thread.

Sorry for the delay; it’s been sitting in my drafts as it got kinda long. There was a lot of ground to cover. I was going to look for gifs but I didn’t have the strength.

A) Rumple isn’t horribly abusive??? Are you kidding?! The guy who trapped his wife on a ship so she couldn’t leave,

He did that to protect her life from a direct and immediate threat. According to your fanbase, ignoring one’s partner’s wishes to protect them is not abusive; that’s an act of wuv: “He loves her so much he’d rather sacrifice their relationship than her life!” Which, by the way, Belle also recognizes, since she tells Hook to go help Emma:

Belle: Go. Go. Emma needs you. We'll be all right. We've got Rumple's spell to protect us.

Hook: Thank you, Belle.

Read more at: http://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=29119

Then Rumbelle had a fight about it, because that’s what couples do when one of them pulls a dick move with bad consequences, even if his intentions are good. Only a dim Stepford doormat would say, “It’s okay, honeybuns. I would ignore your agency and wishes to protect you, too—in fact, I have!”

threatened her saying if she wants what’s best for her baby she’ll have to come back to him and even Belle said that was a threat,

And Belle was wrong about it being a threat and Rumple told her so:

Belle: Threats won't make me love you again, Rumple.

Rumple: No. But necessity will.

Read more at: http://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=29119

(And, shockingly, it turned out that he was right, as we’re seeing this half season.)

planned to use the shears on Belle’s their baby

I know, right? Thank goodness no one cut Gideon away from his fate of being kidnapped, raised in a cage, blackmailed, brainwashed, and tormented for 28 years, having his heart torn out, and being used as his grandfairy’s puppet to murder someone. Whew! Sure dodged a bullet there! I only hope Snowing are that lucky next week when they try to sever Emma from her fate of being the Savior.

and planned to speed up the pregnancy so he could do that and Belle RAN AWAY FROM HIM AND HE BACKED HER INTO AN ELEVATOR WHILE SHE LOOKED TERRIFIED!!!

Yes. He almost went too far. That was the one time in their lives since the chipped cup that he frightened her. (One time does not make an abuser.)

But guess what? Belle talked him down. She used reason and emotion, and he realized how wrong he was.

I’m pretty sure that according to your fanbase, planning something terrible (and even executing the plan, as Rumple didn’t) is forgivable if you stop at the absolute last moment. In fact, it makes you a hero.

where she had to beg him not do it, he put a tracker on her wrist so he always knows where she’s going “So now, no matter where you go, I’ll find you.”

Which, while another dickish move, was to prevent her from her stated purpose of kidnapping their child. And this time, he did it WITHOUT trying to restrict her movements or agency. Parolees who are flight risks wear ankle bracelets; how was this different?

And all of this is ONLY this season. I could say more about previous seasons. I mean I know Rumple fans stay in their little bubble but come on! What do you call this? Oh wait I forgot - Hook breathed in the background so he must be the terrible one!

I call it BOTH Rumple and Belle acting in terrible ways to each other (way that were the literal opposite of all they’d done before, sheerly for STUpidity and, as Kitsowitz admitted, to create a plot where Gideon could be the man under the cloak trying to kill Emma). Their relationship was extremely unhealthy in 6A, but unhealthy doesn’t always equal abusive. (I made a point of not calling CS’s unhealthy codependent relationship “abusive” until S5, either.)

No, let’s see: Hook lied to Emma literally from the moment he met her; left her and her family to die (twice); manipulated her a thousand times (before you yelp: that’s hyperbole, but if you like I can come up with five or six times off the top of my head); stalked her with a telescope spyglass; felt entitled to her (from Eddy’s own mouth) while she was “shunning him” (JMo’s words); said he was happy her heart had been broken; touched or grabbed her at least half a dozen times without her permission and several times against her stated will (again, happy to provide the examples); tried to keep her away from her family because he wanted more of her time; lied to her about blackmailing someone and being blackmailed back (leading to her almost being thrown into another dimension); threw a jealous snit when she had literally her very first conversation after they started dating with a man whom she was not related to (August); told her he liked her walls because he liked breaking them down; said he “loved” her as she looked at him with tears in her eyes; attempted suicide to get her attention; told her he wanted to hurt her and that she’d always be an orphan, and left her crying; restrained her and stole her magic; tried to kill her entire family (again); yelled at her teenage son for not rescuing him hard enough; joked that being vulnerable was not her strong suit (after she had opened up to him about things that deeply hurt and while she was going to therapy); ignored her express wishes about the shears because he knew better than she did; lied about that; proposed to her while keeping the secret that he had killed her grandfather; and preferred to burn away his memories rather than tell her the truth. And literally packed his bags and prepared to leave her without a note or even a text, until he decided at the last second not to.

Off the top of my head.

(Everything that you say Rumple did, Hook did, only worse, plus those little extra goodies like attempting suicide to get her attention.)

B) Belle wasn’t trying to get away from her husband? What was she doing then?

To live her life separately from him. She came into Granny’s, the most public place in SB, and wanted a room; she said she and Rumple weren’t together “at the moment.” She did not hide from Rumple, and even after Rumple was an asshole about magicking her on the ship, she said she wanted Rumple and Gid to heal their relationship, and gave Rumple the sonogram as a peace offering.

C) Emma and Hook manipulated Belle into sending away her baby

No really…what? They did nothing at all! What are you talking about? Belle decided to do that because “Rumple will never stop.” Emma even says “Belle what are you doing?”. It was because of Rumple that Belle believed she had to send away her baby to keep him safe.

Emma: Gold did the right thing today. That doesn't mean he'll do the same tomorrow.

Hook: Emma's right. And we have to make sure that he can't use that magic on you, and we will.

Read more at: http://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=29985

Hook and Emma BOTH KNOW that Rumple would never do anything to hurt Belle. They have BOTH concocted entire schemes based on the fact that Rumple would do anything to save her. So, right here, they are either lying to manipulate her, or honestly being extraordinarily dimwitted and amnesiac. THEY were the ones who put it in her head that Rumple would still use the dust on her; had they not, maybe Belle wouldn’t have panicked and would actually have had time to find out that the Queen was the one who dosed her.

D)  Gideon has shown no attempt to hurt or kill Emma since reforging the sword “Gideon has the He’ll go after the Savior once again. I just hope there’s enough time that we can stop him before he does.” Rumple said this to Belle and yet neither did anything to warn Emma that he had the sword back. And he did basically kidnap someone Emma loves in order to blackmail her into helping him so he’s definitely messing with her life.

“Messing with her life” is not killing her. And Belle can’t have had much opportunity to tell Emma anything, since after the first attempt on her life Emma blithely went out canoeing with Henry, and when she came back she was busy snooping through her lover’s stuff, getting engaged to a liar, and showing off her ring (and then moping over thinking her fiancé had left her because for the VERY FIRST TIME in their relationship she called him on lying to her).

EDIT: I wrote this bit before Sunday’s ep and didn’t look it over before posting. As it turns out, Gideon DID have a convoluted plan to kill Emma, one that involved banishing her boyfriend, starting a business and sending out flyers, learning mixology, listening to Emma’s woes and gathering her tears, getting her to trust him, leading her to an abandoned house and opening a portal, summoning a GIANT-ASS spider to engulf her in webs so as to kill her very slowly, and using that to charge the sword to free the Black Fairy. (All of this done because the BlF was controlling him via stolen heart.) But c’mon--how could ANYONE, let alone Belle, come up with something so ridonkulous? To her knowledge, Gideon wasn’t using the sword to come after Emma (and see above about Emma’s unavailability, which doesn’t change).

E) Snow had virtually no interaction with Belle They had a conversation at the hospital about babies and was the only person there for her at her first ultrasound and it’s also where Belle talked about wanting to give a picture to Rumple.

Yes, one brief conversation is, as I said, virtually no interaction. If they hadn’t encountered each other at all, I would have said they had no interaction, sans “virtually.” 

in fact, Snow’s last major effect on Belle was selling her out to Hyde

That’s funny because since Rumple ‘gave’ the town to Hyde and then Jekyll almost killed Belle, doesn’t that mean Rumple sold Belle out to Hyde? That’s an interesting thought.

That’s funny, because the reason Rumple “gave” the town to Hyde is that Hyde kidnapped Belle after Snow sold her out.

but instead did nothing to hurt her and allowed her pirate to live when he could have easily killed him

They were Dark Ones - he wouldn’t have been able to hurt them

He had the Dark One-destroying sword Excalibur and at one point had it against Killy’s throat. In fact, if he had wanted to kill Emma, Rumple could have quite likely taken her by surprise when she asked for it back and instead of giving it to her, run her through.

according to Eddy himself, a “crime of opportunity” when Emma had a plan that Rumple warned her was risky and could have ended with all of them banished to hell.

Well, of course it was a crime of opportunity - what else would you call it? He learned Emma was going to sacrifice herself so he took advantage of it.

I brought that up because you said in your original post that Rumple was “paying Emma back” for kidnapping him and threatening Belle by enchanting the sword. He didn’t; they were separate things.

And it’s a plan that would have worked and did work until Rumple took it. And he didn’t say it could have ended with all of them banished to hell. He said the sword chooses its miracles…after he already poured the potion on the sword ...

He explained the “banished to hell” part earlier; that’s how everyone knew what the marks meant:

Emma: What is that?

Mr Gold: That... is the mark of Charon.

Henry: Charon? He was the ferryman in the old myths. He navigated a boat... to the Underworld.

Mr Gold: Smart lad. You see, the Dark Ones only have a... a temporary pass into this world, like a like a tourist visa. The only way for them to stay... is to trade places with living souls.

Read more at: http://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=24162

Rumple knew better than anyone that Excalibur had been ostentatiously NOT choosing Emma for the entire season; what reason did he have to believe her plan would work? (Let alone that Killy would change his mind at the last minute.)

They do, however, regularly demand his help to get them out of their jams, or simply steal his stuff when his back is turned.

When and like what?

Well, a partial list off the top of my head (not counting all the times in FTL flashbacks):

Season 2

David wanting a tracking potion to find Jefferson (I think it was Jeff).

Regina wanted to make her magic work.

Regina wanted someone to stop Cora.

Emma tried to blame him for Archie’s death, then asked for a way to find/prove the killer.

Snowing got him to locate Regina after Gremara kidnapped her.

The Charmings tried to get him to stop Regina’s failsafe.

Season 3 (note that he was inaccessible most of the season—alone on the island, dead, in a cage)

The Charmings wanted him to find out what was wrong with Henry (or something like that; they accosted Rumbelle coming out of the shop).

They went to him to find out how to defeat Zelena when she had him in a cage (and they LEFT him there, with Snow saying that Z had done “nothing that can’t be undone” to him).

(Note: I’m not counting him make the dreamshade cure for David, since I think it was Neal who asked for it.)

Season 4A

Hook and David wanted him to save Emma from the ice mountain.

Hook blackmailed him into locating the Snow Queen (so that Hook and Elsa could get themselves captured).

Hook blackmailed him into getting back his hand.

Something I can’t remember that required Belle to ask nicely for the whole gang.

Emma wanted a spell to remove her powers.

I’m hazy, but I think they got him to make the portal to Arendelle?

Season 4B (n/a since he was never available/in the shop)

Season 5A (note that he was inaccessible by virtue unconscious/held prisoner most of the time)

Emma wanted Excalibur to pull off her plan.

Emma blackmailed him into going to the Underworld.

Season 5B (note that he was inaccessible most of the time)

Emma went to him after Hades had been released to ask for Rumple’s help.

Season 6A

The EQ wanted some doodad/key to the Untold Stories.

David wanted info about his dad.

The whole group wanted help with Jekyll’s potion.

Times they outright stole from him:

Taking the Caddy back from NYC.

Emma and Killy taking the sword from the shop.

Those are, again, off the top of my head. I probably missed a few.

Does this list help jog your memory?

[rubbady-pubbady]

I’ve decided to reply to @violetfaust ‘s post https://violetfaust.tumblr.com/post/159438706546/hooboy-long-ass-post-coming

with my own post - not for any reason. Just because.

Oh thank you so much for this. I forgot about the post I wrote but after reading your hilarious post, I’m right back in. 

A) Rumple isn’t horribly abusive??? Are you kidding?! The guy who trapped his wife on a ship so she couldn’t leave,

He did that to protect her life from a direct and immediate threat. According to your fanbase, ignoring one’s partner’s wishes to protect them is not abusive; that’s an act of wuv:

Oh well - as long as he locked her up against her will for her own good! Then it’s fine!

And Belle was wrong about it being a threat and Rumple told her so:

Belle: Threats won’t make me love you again, Rumple.

Rumple: No. But necessity will.

Uh that’s not him saying it wasn’t a threat...that’s him saying “No my threat won’t make you love me but necessity will - there’s no other way to interpret that sentence so I have no idea how you twisted it around so much.

planned to use the shears on Belle’s their baby

I know, right? Thank goodness no one cut Gideon away from his fate of being kidnapped, raised in a cage, blackmailed, brainwashed, and tormented for 28 years, having his heart torn out, and being used as his grandfairy’s puppet to murder someone

That's the fate he got because Rumple wanted to use the shears on him - the fate Rumple wanted to cut him from was not loving him.

and planned to speed up the pregnancy so he could do that and Belle RAN AWAY FROM HIM AND HE BACKED HER INTO AN ELEVATOR WHILE SHE LOOKED TERRIFIED!!!

Yes. He almost went too far. That was the one time in their lives since the chipped cup that he frightened her. (One time does not make an abuser.)

But guess what? Belle talked him down. She used reason and emotion, and he realized how wrong he was.

A wife had to talk her husband down from doing something to her body that she didn’t want but hey at least he changed his mind! And that’s not the first time he frightened her - she says she needs the dagger to protect herself from Rumple in season 4, that sounds like she’s frightened!

where she had to beg him not do it, he put a tracker on her wrist so he always knows where she’s going “So now, no matter where you go, I’ll find you.”

Which, while another dickish move, was to prevent her from her stated purpose of kidnapping their child. And this time, he did it WITHOUT trying to restrict her movements or agency. Parolees who are flight risks wear ankle bracelets; how was this different?

The fact that you compared Belle to a parolee (and I’m guessing that makes Rumple her guard?) is amazing! And the idea that a pregnant mother wanting to protect her child from his father doing something to him is considered kidnapping - especially since she was only pregnant at this point and hadn’t even had the child yet so it’s just her body he’s tracking and controlling. Unless you say that when a woman becomes pregnant she’s just an incubator and can’t do anything without the father’s say so? And Rumple threatened her with taking her child away from her in the same conversation.

Oh dear God the next bit is a big one! (cracks knuckles) (and that’s what she said)

No, let’s see: Hook lied to Emma literally from the moment he met her; left her and her family to die (twice); manipulated her a thousand times (before you yelp: that’s hyperbole, but if you like I can come up with five or six times off the top of my head);

Oh so we’re taking it from before they were together? Hey remember that time Rumple buried Belle in the ground?! Good times - I’m sure they have a photo album of that time.

stalked her with a telescope spyglass;

Do you mean that time he showed up to the place he was invited by Emma where she said she was keeping a place for him and he looked at the scene he wishes he was involved in as he could be because he was invited? Hey how about that time Rumple stared at Belle and her new boyfriend through the window of the shop after she had banished him and didn’t want him anywhere near her?

felt entitled to her (from Eddy’s own mouth) while she was “shunning him” (JMo’s words);

Huh? And Jen actually said she ‘shunned him’ because she’s vulnerable around him and that scares her.

said he was happy her heart had been broken; touched or grabbed her at least half a dozen times without her permission and several times against her stated will (again, happy to provide the examples);

He said he was happy it could be broken as it proves it still works. He actually says ‘don’t take this the wrong way’ but I guess you didn’t hear that bit ha! And if you mean 'grab’ her as a way of stopping her but not doing anything to hurt her in any way and letting go immediately then I’m guffawing already! You guys really crack me up. Hey remember that time Rumple touched Belle’s chest while pretending to be Hook even though it was in the same episode Belle said she was frightened of Rumple and was worried about him returning to the town? And remember when Rumple kept putting Belle to sleep in season 4 and froze her against her will with magic so he could continue to do stuff behind her back?

tried to keep her away from her family because he wanted more of her time; lied to her about blackmailing someone and being blackmailed back (leading to her almost being thrown into another dimension); threw a jealous snit when she had literally her very first conversation after they started dating with a man whom she was not related to (August);

When did he try to keep her from her family? In fact, he’s gone to great lengths to be a mediator between her and her family at different times and advises Emma to forgive them and talk to them. Remember when Rumple hid the fact that Belle’s father was looking for her? The blackmail? Was that with Rumple? Because making him do something good and giving him his own hand back are pretty fine by me and then Rumple ripped his heart out! And do you want me to remind you why he could blackmail Rumple? (psst it’s about keeping something from Belle!). And how did it lead to her almost being thrown into another dimension? Is that when Rumple was about to put her in the hat...and that’s Hook’s fault?! A jealous snit? The one line about August he had when he questioned their relationship? Hey remember when Rumple disguised himself as another man, interrupted Belle’s date with Will and then said Will ‘took something’ from him meaning Belle is a something that can be taken from him.

told her he liked her walls because he liked breaking them down; said he “loved” her as she looked at him with tears in her eyes; attempted suicide to get her attention; told her he wanted to hurt her and that she’d always be an orphan, and left her crying; restrained her and stole her magic; tried to kill her entire family (again);

He said he liked her walls because she said she was better off being the Dark One and it made her better - he was saying he liked her just as she was awww. He said he loved her and then took it back the next time he saw her - Belle has said this season that Rumple won’t be able to make her love him again which implies that she doesn’t love him now - how dare she? And that was when according to you he was just trying to protect her! Why do you want him with this awful woman?! Attempted suicide? He knew she would catch him and finally appear before him - hardly suicide! And the rest? He told her to kill him to resolve all of it and she did! Does that mean Belle will get to kill Rumple because I’d be up for watching that! Remember earlier this season when Rumple’s wife was pregnant and he decided to have a relationship with the Evil Queen and helped her threaten to kill the town with water from the Underworld? Hmm did he die to make up for that yet?  And remember when Rumple could have helped stop the failsafe but instead he was going to let Belle die because he just couldn’t be bothered?

yelled at her teenage son for not rescuing him hard enough; joked that being vulnerable was not her strong suit (after she had opened up to him about things that deeply hurt and while she was going to therapy); ignored her express wishes about the shears because he knew better than she did; lied about that

Not rescuing him hard enough...What? I don’t remember this but I’m guessing it will have me laughing. Being vulnerable isn’t her strong suit - that’s literally the point! He supported her every step of the way when she wanted to see Archie and said he was glad she was going to see him but a Rumbelle fan doesn’t know what normal conversations between a couple sound like since all Rumbelle spew is ‘You have a good heart Rumple!’ or ‘I didn’t know anyone could love me!’ for the thousand and one time. The shears he kept for fear that Emma would die and he even said he had no idea what he’d do with them (didn’t you say it’s fine for Rumple to protect Belle or is that just when you’re locking someone in?) which he got yelled at by Henry and he got rid of them and admitted it to Emma.

proposed to her while keeping the secret that he had killed her grandfather; and preferred to burn away his memories rather than tell her the truth. And literally packed his bags and prepared to leave her without a note or even a text, until he decided at the last second not to.

True that was bad. And Emma pretty much broke up with him because of it (I don’t think I have to bring up Rumple’s unneccessarily cruel proposal to Belle where he made her think he was giving her all his trust and then used her for an alibi) and he was about to leave to be a better man for Emma because as he says himself, he’s not the man Emma needs him to be. And what makes you think he wouldn’t leave a note? He was at the docks staring at the ship and contemplating what he was going to do - there’s nothing to suggest he wouldn’t tell her.

(Everything that you say Rumple did, Hook did, only worse,

That is literally the opposite of true...as I‘ve made abundantly clear.

B) Belle wasn’t trying to get away from her husband? What was she doing then?

To live her life separately from him.

So...trying to get away from her husband then?

Emma: Gold did the right thing today. That doesn’t mean he’ll do the same tomorrow.

Hook: Emma’s right. And we have to make sure that he can’t use that magic on you, and we will.

Hook and Emma BOTH KNOW that Rumple would never do anything to hurt Belle. They have BOTH concocted entire schemes based on the fact that Rumple would do anything to save her. So, right here, they are either lying to manipulate her, or honestly being extraordinarily dimwitted and amnesiac. THEY were the ones who put it in her head that Rumple would still use the dust on her; had they not, maybe Belle wouldn’t have panicked and would actually have had time to find out that the Queen was the one who dosed her.

They both know he would never hurt her? They’re worrying about the thing Gold wanted to do to her literally two minutes ago which he had been plotting for several episodes unless you’re saying he wasn’t going to do it and they’re all silly for thinking that? And their lines were in reply to Belle saying she should feel relieved but she’s not so she was worrying about him still doing it too before they even said anything! They certainly weren’t the ones who put anything in her head - I’m pretty sure Rumple coming at her with the intention of using the dust and the intention of taking her baby away was what put it into her head. Also I feel so bad for Belle - even her supposed fans think she’s an easily manipulated idiot who has no thoughts of her own.

And Belle can’t have had much opportunity to tell Emma anything, since after the first attempt on her life Emma blithely went out canoeing with Henry, and when she came back she was busy snooping through her lover’s stuff, getting engaged to a liar, and showing off her ring (and then moping over thinking her fiancé had left her because for the VERY FIRST TIME in their relationship she called him on lying to her). To her knowledge, Gideon wasn’t using the sword to come after Emma

Yeah how dare Emma actually live her life and spend time with her son after she nearly died - what was she thinking? Even though that had to be several days and she lives in a house that Belle has been to so she’d definitely know where Emma is but Belle didn’t seem to bother going there or to her parent’s apartment or anywhere at all. And to her knowledge, Gideon was using the sword to come after Emma since Rumple even said he was going to do that. But as we all know, Belle likes to sit in the shop and tell other people to deal with her son that she won’t go talk to.

That’s funny, because the reason Rumple “gave” the town to Hyde is that Hyde kidnapped Belle after Snow sold her out.

So you’re admitting he did sell her out then? Nice.

Rumple knew better than anyone that Excalibur had been ostentatiously NOT choosing Emma for the entire season; what reason did he have to believe her plan would work?

Oh so it’s just your headcanon for Rumple’s thought process then? And he must have had plenty reason to believe it would work since he was relying on at least one of them sacrificing themselves to get his powers back. If he didn’t think the plan would work, his plan would not work at all so why was he bothering?

I’m actually going to go through all the times you mention:

Season 2

David wanting a tracking potion to find Jefferson (I think it was Jeff).

Regina wanted to make her magic work.

Regina wanted someone to stop Cora.

Emma tried to blame him for Archie’s death, then asked for a way to find/prove the killer.

Snowing got him to locate Regina after Gremara kidnapped her.

The Charmings tried to get him to stop Regina’s failsafe

I have never included Regina in anything I’ve said since I don’t consider her one of the heroes so I’m excluding her points already.

David went to Gold to buy the potion and Rumple wanted the two of them to stay out of each other’s way and hilariously it’s Rumple who breaks that deal a couple of episodes after that. And you do realise that if you advertise yourself as a dealmaker for centuries, you can’t complain if someone wants to make a deal with you.

How dare Emma think one of the two big murderers in town that they know of might be the murderer! And they didn’t ask for a way to find the killer - Gold was clearing his name.

Snowing called in their favour to get him to help as he himself did to Emma earlier that season (remember when he threatened to kill all of them?)

Of course they wanted him to stop the failsafe - it affected him too and he would have died but as I said earlier he didn’t care about dying and didn’t care if Belle died. And this was right after he tried to murder Henry! Just a reminder.

The Charmings wanted him to find out what was wrong with Henry (or something like that; they accosted Rumbelle coming out of the shop).

They went to him to find out how to defeat Zelena when she had him in a cage (and they LEFT him there, with Snow saying that Z had done “nothing that can’t be undone” to him).

They accosted him? They went to him to tell him that Pan, his father was doing something to his grandson as Rumple himself said he wanted Pan gone as much as they did.

Belle left him in there too right? And the only way to help him was to stop Zelena - as you mentioned, Snow says what was done to Rumple can be undone meaning they were planning to undo it.

Hook and David wanted him to save Emma from the ice mountain.

Hook blackmailed him into locating the Snow Queen (so that Hook and Elsa could get themselves captured).

Hook blackmailed him into getting back his hand.

Something I can’t remember that required Belle to ask nicely for the whole gang.

Emma wanted a spell to remove her powers.

I’m hazy, but I think they got him to make the portal to Arendelle?

They came to him because Elsa had found her sister’s necklace in his shop and even though he did know about it, Rumple refused to help. Should they not have asked him about it?

Hook ‘blackmailed him’ because he refused to help Elsa or Marian when asked and he had something that could be used against him - so good on Hook!

Hook used the same blackmail to GET HIS OWN HAND BACK THAT RUMPLE KEPT AS A TROPHY. Are you kidding?

Emma did come to him for help because she actually trusted that he had changed and then Rumple used her trust against her to try to put her into the hat.

Nope they didn’t come to him for any portal - he controlled Hook to force him to tell them there was a portal.

Emma wanted Excalibur to pull off her plan.

Emma blackmailed him into going to the Underworld.

Emma wanted it to stop them all going to hell including him - and technically she gave it to him in the first place.

In one of the biggest fist-pump moments in the series, Emma blackmailed him (it’s strange how he always has something he doesn’t want Belle to know) as he took back the darkness making Hook’s sacrifice worthless.

Emma went to him after Hades had been released to ask for Rumple’s help.

True and I hated that scene. But again he refused.

The EQ wanted some doodad/key to the Untold Stories.

David wanted info about his dad.

The whole group wanted help with Jekyll’s potion.

Times they outright stole from him:

Taking the Caddy back from NYC.

Emma and Killy taking the sword from the shop.

David made a deal with him - see above for dealmakers making deals.

They told Rumple how to stop someone who threatened Belle - it was even phrased as something that would benefit him

I didn’t know they took the caddy from him  - that is absolutely hilarious! Thank you for that information.

Yep they took the sword that could kill her away from someone who might kill her - and?

It seems like all these times you say they ‘demand him to get them out of their jams’ are times when it would benefit him, times he outright refuses, times he makes a deal or simply times when information leads them to go talk to him. Poor Rumple - how dare they? They don’t deserve him - ha!