#he couldn't save sarah. he can't save ellie and he couldn't even save you

[pettyprocrastination]

whoever this beloved anon was I am so touched by your kindness! You definitely didn’t have to do this but I am so happy you enjoy this idea and I will happily expand upon it for you!

this is just a collection of word vomit bullet points for the time being but I will happily answer any and all questions about this pair!!

warnings: violence, angst, child death (Sarah Miller), foul language, the same warnings that apply to tlou, reader is Sarah's mom and described as having similar features to her. 

So the general Idea is that you and Joel are happily married before the outbreak. 

You had been Sarah's mother, his high school sweetheart he got pregnant when neither of you were old enough to have any reaction to the pregnancy test other than a fucking panic attack in one another’s arms. but you made it work 

you both worked but made time for one another and your sweet girl, going to museums every other weekend and joel insisting on swooping you off for a date every now and then 

nothing special. He knows you’re more of a diner gal than anything too fancy that makes you both feel out of place. 

On his birthday in 2003, you had planned to tell him that you were pregnant again. But the memories of your own fears of motherhood from all those years ago begin to swirl through your head again and you get cold feel. deciding to tell him the morning after

it is his birthday afterall, you want to focus on him. 

but when you’re woken up in the middle of the night because tommy needs to get bailed out, Joel kisses you sweetly one last time before promising he’ll be back and you can’t shake the feeling that something bad is happening. 

its you that shakes sarah awake that night. shouting at her to put on her shoes when she’s still rubbing the sleep from her eyes because you’ve been listening to the radio for the past two hours, calling joel again and again and again praying for him to fucking pick up but to no avail. 

Sarah, bless your little girl’s bleeding heart is the one who insists you check on the adler’s against your better suspicions and when you find the eldest looming over her daughter, blood and sinew dripping from her mouth, you grab your daughter hand and burst into a full sprint until something slams into your back and sends you tumbling onto their front lawn

its how joel finds you, struggling to keep the once sweet old woman, whose now nothing more than dead eyes and gnashing teeth straining to snap at your pulse point as you push against her while sarah shrieks before your husband runs forward and cracks her skull with a wrench. 

there’s hardly a moment of pause, just enough for him to pull you up and into his arms before he’s ushering you both into the car with an urgency. 

when the truck crashes, you get separated from them. Perhaps at Tommy’s side when the flames rise and create a wall, separating you from your husband, or maybe pulled into the mob of chaos when trying to escape from those already infected-

all joel knows is that you promise you’ll find him: just get sarah to safety and you’ll meet him at the river

Poor thing is already so frightened, held in her father’s arms with tears streaming down her face insisting they can’t leave you they just can’t but her father kisses her forehead and reassures her its going to be okay 

“we just need to be brave, okay babygirl? Your mama’s real tough, she’s gonna be alright.” 

he isn’t sure if he’s saying it to his daughter or himself. 

but when he comes to the river you aren’t there. Only a soldier who points a gun at the scared little girl in his arms and then he loses everything

its when the light is gone from his daughter’s eyes that he realizes. His voice cracked and raw from sobbing that he looks around to see his brother with drawn in shoulders and tears in his eyes but his wife is nowhere to be found. 

Tommy says you got lost in the chaos. Everything was so loud, so sudden that he turned around and suddenly you weren’t there. 

Joel wants to go back but its Tommy that stops him, that dulls the red in his vision to a sad faded pink because his brother points at the orange horizon not too far from them, so much of the city is already in flames. 

“We’re gonna find her, but not there.” 

So Joel searches. for the first year spent in the world post-outbreak its all he did. 

He became a smuggler because of it. 

Information came at a price and he needed to be able to fucking pay it, whether it be in blood or ration cards. He was willing to do anything to find you or any thin thread that lead your way. 

But it’s Tommy that asks him to give up. Not in those words of course. 

The youngest Miller knows better than to say something so cruel that would make his brother, the only person he has in this world turn on him. 

But his voice is worried when he asks him one night in Boston when he hasn’t even had the chance to wash the blood from his knuckles 

“You think she would have wanted this for you?” 

the fight that followed his words was brutal. Vicious insults and scarred fists slamming against each brother until they're both too tired and bloody to continue. Each leaning against a wall for support and Tommy’s wavering voice breaking the silence. 

“I don’t know where she is, Joel. But I do know you're gonna get yourself killed if you keep lookin’ for her.” 

All he can do is nod. 

It’s a few days later when he meets Tess. Who has heard plenty of stories about the elder miller’s brutality and wants him to put that muscle to good use for some extra profit. 

It begins his new life. One that empty and cold but one he can live. 

Until of course, Ellie comes along. The sweet and incredibly opinionated girl that makes him become something akin to the man he thought died twenty years ago. 

its when he’s traveling with Ellie, that it happens. When a warm familiarity has settled between the two because so much blood and pain has been shared he can’t help but see her as something close, something bright even though all he can force himself to utter in her reference is “cargo” 

when theyre traveling through the woods as Ellie chatters away, probing his memory about a movie that may or may not have existed thirty years ago because her descriptions of the plot are incredibly odd he hears a voice shout for them to stop and finds himself staring at a man- no, a boy- pointing a gun at them. 

Ellie stills, but Joel can see enough to know that from the lanky figure and dimpled face that he’s young. Maybe twenty, twenty-two at the oldest, but his eyes dart from Joel to Ellie with a pinprick of fear that allows Joel the time to charge forward and slam him to the ground before wrestling the gun from his hands. 

He has enough to time to tuck it under the stranger’s chin before he hears the sound of the safety being turned off and finds himself looking up and seeing a gun just inches from his face. 

Joel’s head whips around when Ellie’s voice calls out his name in fear, he turns to see another stranger holding her a gun point, shoulders drawn back and a shadow cast over their face by the had obstructing their identity. 

“You hurt one of mine, I hurt one of yours. That a fair deal?” 

Its takes him a moment to recognize you. It’s been so long since he’s heard your voice, the sweet tease when you would poke at him each time he woke up late despite the fact that you reminded him to set his alarm the night before, the times you’d chide him with a harsh “Joel Miller!” whispered in public anytime he was able to grab you a bit too passionately to be appropriate in public but the laughter in your voice let him know you were never truly mad at him. You didn’t know how to be. 

But that sweetness is buried under a cold rasp that cuts through the air as you point a rifle at the scared little girl in front of you.

“You think I won’t?” You’re older now, skin covered in scars from a life he didn’t know you got the chance to live and your eyes are cold as they regard your husband. “Put the gun down and get the fuck off of him, I won’t repeat myself.” 

Joel mumbles your name in awe. The woman he loved, the woman he mourned the one he fought so hard to find stands before him like some sort of hallucination and suddenly the world feels like its spinning until you bark orders at him again. 

“You’ve got five seconds Joel, make a fucking choice before I make it for you.” 

He looks down and realizes the boy under him, the one with the bleeding nose and snarling face has your eyes and his dimples. 

“One.” 

The one above him has Sarah’s hair. Soft brown curls that shine under the sun. 

“Two”

Wait. No, they both do.

“Three.” 

Twins. Jesus fucking Christ you had twins. 

“Four.” 

Joel holds the rifle up above his head and the one boy standing snatches it from his grasp, tossing it to the ground and kicking it far from his reach. He slowly stands, allowing your son- dear god your son- to scramble to his feet. 

Your voice softens just for a moment. “You okay, Duke?” 

Blood stains the bottom half of his face from where Joel slammed his fist into the boy’s nose just moments before, but he nods nonetheless. 

Now, they both stand on one side of you and he can see the resemblance clear as day the same way he would whenever Sarah was by your side.

When you order him to hand over his bag, he does so without question before telling Ellie to do the same. 

She watches him with wide eyes, her hands still up in the air but gaping at her companion as if he had grown a second head. 

“Joel!” “Just do it, alright?”

He doesn’t miss the way you watch their interaction with narrowed eyes until she tosses her bag to you and you slowly lower your gun. 

“Now, you want to tell me what the fuck you think you’re doin’ at my home?” 

[ranna-alga]

I just realised something from the TLOU gameplay that made me so depressed that I needed to share with you all.

Rewind back to the prologue where Sarah is dying, and we see Joel look away from her a total of two times before she dies: the first time is at the same moment the camera pans to solely Tommy, of whom Joel is looking at (first image). Before he is out of shot, Joel can just be seen looking to Sarah again, until the camera turns back to him where he looks away a second time towards Tommy again (second image).

Now, if you go and listen to the audio of the actual scene itself, you'll notice that the second time he looks away is when Sarah draws her last breath and passes away. She's already dead now.

And Joel missed it by looking away for only a second.

The second time he looks away and then looks back at Sarah, she is already gone. He couldn't do anything. He couldn't look into her eyes, still filled with life (albeit hanging on a thread) anymore before becoming absolutely soulless because he missed it. He didn't see the light leave her, he didn’t see her succumb to the bullet wound where she would move on to no longer feel anymore pain in death. He missed it almost instantly. His last good look of her is after the second time he looked away, when she's already passed on.

But then we fast-forward to the very near end of the game where Joel is trying to perform CPR on Ellie after she almost drowned. He's becoming mentally and emotionally frantic because he cannot lose another one and projects this by trying to resuscitate her. He is back to where he was twenty years prior trying to save Sarah. And then the Fireflies appear.

Joel looks away from Ellie one time. He probably doesn’t even realise that these are Fireflies (they could have been Hunters or even FEDRA for all he cared). The look on his face in the second image is heart-breaking, but it only lasts for a second before he immediately looks down to Ellie.

He only looks up at them once. He doesn’t look up a second time.

Again, if you watch the original scene with audio enabled, you can hear the shakiness in Joel's voice, almost tearfully and very much coming from a place of fear. He's literally pleading for Ellie to wake up, all the while keeping his eyes on her - not looking up again - not even with one of the Firefly soldiers approaching him with an armed weapon.

He can't look away a second time because the last time he did, he lost Sarah immediately. He fears that will happen again, but he cannot let that occur. He won't. Not with Ellie: his second chance, his new reason to live, his new love. Joel refuses to tear his eyes away from her, even for another second, if it risks her life suddenly slipping away before he could even realise it.

He cannot afford to have another daughter lay lifeless in his arms and have her drift off to a place where he cannot follow and protect her anymore, even if it means placing his own life on the line.

[elliespuns]

Do you think joel was a good cook or couldn't boil water to save his life lol. I feel like I read a lot of fics where joel couldnt' even cook an egg as a single dad, but idk i feel like either he could be really good at cooking, or he was okay at it but he had a couple of dishes that he could cook really well, like chili or something lmao or some southern dish.

As a single father with a teenage daughter and not enough money to live high on the fog, I'd say he had to be able to cook. I don't think he was great, because he surely didn't have enough time to practice in the kitchen with having to work all the time to take care of the bills and other things, and because they would mostly end up ordering takeout or pizza with Sarah. But I believe he would enjoy cooking on weekends, with Sarah helping him out (or making fun of him).

He was probably more likely to make the easiest dishes out there. Like mixing rice or pasta with meat and vegetables and either serving it just like this (either hot or cold) or baking it with cheese on top or something like this. He was probably good at preparing meat too, like roasting chicken or pork and then eating it with plain or roasted potatoes, or just making spaghetti meatballs, the easiest dish out there. I can also see Joel making homemade pizza by throwing cheese on a dough with mushrooms, pepperoni, and ham. Nothing revolutionary or nutritious, but doable and edible.

Imagining Joel probably had a grill in his backyard, he would spend his summer days with Sarah just barbecueing. He would have a good steak once in a while, and Sarah would love grilled corn. They both probably liked grilled vegetable kabobs too. But they would have mostly just burgers anyway since they couldn't get enough of these. And of course, he can't forget about salads; he would also make all sorts of salads if he was lazy: chicken salad, summer salad, lentil salad, you name it.

I don't think he was a bad cook. I think he would do really well if he tried. I think he also had a few tricks up his sleeve. Like making the best baked chicken/beef tacos or lasagna, which I can imagine were Sarah's favorites. Or something like parmesan garlic roasted potatoes, which he would look up on the internet and make for Sarah because he knew how much she loved parmesan and potatoes.

And not to forget about Ellie, I am sure she had a chance to taste some of his specialties too. There wouldn't probably be that many options in the post-apocalyptic world, but I bet my shoes that Ellie would love his parmesan garlic roasted potatoes, making him happy to remember Sarah loved those too. 

"Joel, these are so fucking delicious!" She says, around a mouthful of the savory potatoes, working another spoonful of them into her mouth. "Promise me..." She swallows. "Promise me you'll make these again."

"Sure, kiddo." He chuckles, pleased with himself, wishing he can make himself stop grinning. "Easy, though. Don't choke on them." This warms his heart.

"Fuck it, I would die for these potatoes!"

[crankyfemme]

Please talk to me about Joel and Tess I’ve been thinking about them all weekend

I don't even know if I have any coherent thoughts about them it's all just a wriggling mass of worms in here, screaming about their dynamic. (Update from after writing out the rest of this deranged essay: I did not mean for this to get so long and go off on so many tangents. I am insane. Thank you.)

I'm utterly obsessed with the way Tess is the one who calls the shots - just reblogged a post the other day about how Joel looks to her for decision-making, which mixed nicely in my brain with that quote from the podcast about Joel being "a little bit of a Frankenstein monster" that Tess is leading. This fermented in my brain with Joel's consistent characterization as someone who can't live for himself, only for someone else. As joking as it is, people are absolutely on the nose with the "acts of service being Joel's love language" posts. He doesn't know how to be a person unless he's orbiting another. (This also neatly parallels Ellie's greatest fear of ending up alone, but that's a whooooole nother essay.)

For a long time, Sarah was the axis around which he orbited, and that is why losing her led to a near suicide. Tommy managed to shift Joel's orbit around himself, to save his brother, which led to "all the things we did - the things you judge me for" from episode 6. This next bit is speculation, but I think it's fairly well supported by evidence from canon. I think that Tommy wasn't able to properly handle how Joel's trauma changed him, not okay with the level of violence Joel was willing to reach to keep Tommy safe, but utterly unable to lose the only family he had left.

(Continuing this Tommy tangent, sorry): he absolutely feels some level of responsibility for how fucked up Joel is now. If he had arrived just a little sooner, he could have saved Sarah, and Joel wouldn't be the way he is. Every time Joel does something morally reprehensible for Tommy's sake, Tommy thinks this is my fault. At least at first. They met Tess later, so there was no one else for Joel to orbit, so Tommy was the only option. And he was definitely there during and in the wake of Joel's suicide attempt, so he knows Joel cannot be alone. But the way they're surviving is fucking with him.

It's not until later, when Joel and Tess have become close enough for her to be Joel's new Person that Tommy can leave, which he does, of course he does, because seeing what's become of his brother makes him sick with guilt and anger. He couldn't leave until he knew for sure Joel had a Person to keep living for, but once that's a sure thing, he leaves. (There's another whole essay in here about Joel and Tommy being foils, where Joel must be devoted to a single person and Tommy must be devoted to some greater cause, but I've digressed enough. You came here for Joel and Tess. Sorry. I swear these thoughts are all related.) Back to Joel. Everything about him screams "experienced parentification as a child" and I know I'm still in speculation land but come on. He's several years older than Tommy and he became a father at a young age, and it's implied that he was a single father from pretty early on in Sarah's life (moreso in the game, but there's no indication they changed that for the show). Joel and Tommy's parents are never so much as mentioned.

Adults who were parentified as children have a hard time expressing and meeting their own needs, particularly emotionally, and have a hard time turning off their "caregiver" mode. Just for fun, I ran a quick search about parentification to refresh my memory, and I'd like to share a few sentences that made me insane: "A parentified child does not learn to distinguish their own needs and feelings from those of other people." Here's another: "In certain cases, some degree of parentification may have positive effects, such as building resilience and competency."

Who does that sound like? Joel "you were never gonna do it for yourself" Miller, that's fucking who. (For added derangement, rewatch the breakfast scene in episode 1, starting around 6:50 when Tommy comes through the door. "Awww, he loves you." "He's dependent on me. It's not the same." But I digress. Again.) ANYWAY: Enter Tess. Tess is fucking smart and ruthless about survival, Tess shares Joel's deep trauma of losing a child, and Tess doesn't have Tommy's angst about how Joel has changed from Before. She's exactly someone whose psychological profile can mesh well with post-Outbreak Joel's. She's resourceful and great at social engineering, and she quickly picks up on how Joel's mind operates. As the audience, we never get to actually see or hear how they met and grew close, but given how they are as people, I think it's likely that Tess initially saw Joel as a resource to use, then figured out more about him, and grew to actually give a shit - until she ended up giving a lot of shits. Too many, maybe.

She definitely knows she has power in their dynamic, that she can make the decisions and Joel will follow her lead, that Joel cares about her. The scene in their apartment kitchen where he sees her swollen eye and she already knows he's going to react the way he does, has her first sentence prepared so he'll sit back down. The casual way she allows him to tilt her head and pat at her face with the cloth? She knows his need to caretake, and she allows him a few moments to meet it, and then she gently redirects him and breaks the bad news about the battery to him.

She handles him emotionally like a fucking master pianist at the keys. (Follow along at about 53:25 in episode 1 if this next bit makes no fucking sense.) She starts gentle, reassuring, telling him "nothing's lost" after dropping the fact that Robert sold the battery. She matches Joel's energy when he stands, upset, saying "okay, fuck it, we get our money back and the battery" so he doesn't feel like she's being condescending or too calm about something that's a big deal to him. She approaches, makes physical contact with her hand to get him to meet her eyes, and lays out the logic - the goal is not out of reach, but will be unless Joel listens to her. And then she says "I need you to take a breath" and there's a quiet moment where you can see her exaggerating a breath for Joel to follow. (I think this is where I became unrecoverable, by the way, if it wasn't already back where Joel rolls over at her hand on his back to be her little spoon.) Notice the energy level in the room after that breath? They both continue speaking in lower, calmer voices. Even when Joel says "Well who'd he sell it to?" his tone is irritated without being loud and abrasive.

And then my favorite thing ever. "Now I promised Robert you wouldn't hurt him. But I would very much like for you to hurt him." Because Tess knows that she is Joel's Person, and what things Joel will do for his Person. She knows because she saw it back when it was Tommy. And Tess has no problem weaponizing Joel, unlike Tommy, who'd been driven away by that very thing.

The saddest part, to me personally, is that while Tess was able to understand that she was Joel's Person, she didn't let herself believe that meant love. Not the way she wanted it to. She figured that he had to revolve around someone, psychologically, but that didn't mean he had to love them. And Joel couldn't ever say it to her, because he loses everyone he loves. It's even more obvious with Ellie, later, when he so clearly loves her as a daughter and just cannot say it in such plain words. He loved Sarah, and she died in his arms, and he loved Tommy, and Tommy left him behind. So there's no way Joel was ever going to be able to be clear with Tess that he loved her, even though he so clearly did. Especially since Tess died before Ellie's presence in Joel's life started to heal the wound - "it wasn't time that did it."

God. I have no idea if any of this makes sense, I just had a million thoughts and feelings and went off on several tangents, but I've finally run somewhat out of steam and I did, in fact, talk about Joel and Tess like you asked. So I'm gonna call it a success.

Anyway, how was your weekend?

[lizajane2]

The last episode 6

“Must’ve missed all the street signs in the enormous fucking forest.”

“Holy.” 🤣🤣

Joel having a panic attack… I really like that they’re adding his trauma and not overlooking it. Like they’re not pushing it aside and giving subtle hints here and there.

Not Ellie talking about wanting to be an astronaut!!

Me, having flashbacks of part 2 on Ellie’s Birthday:

Joel had no idea what to do when Ellie was in danger of being found out. That man was frozen in fear.

Joel and Tommy reuniting, me:

Hearing Joel laugh really warms my heart. Like I don’t know how else to explain it. That man deserves so much love.

“Ellie let’s mind our manners.”

Not five seconds later, after Tommy announces Maria his is wife:

“Joel say congrats.” 😂😂

Then the look on Joel’s face when Tommy mentioned that Maria was pregnant. But then Tommy saying

“Just because life stopped for you doesn’t mean it has to stop for me.”

Me:

He’s right, Joel is stuck in the past and in a lot of pain but low fucking blow, Tommy. Low blow.

Another panic attack; having a moment where he sees Sarah in another; the way his expression just softens and becomes hopeful then utter heartbreak when reality hits him. What the fuck Neil?!

Ooo I love the way Maria and Ellie bounce off each other!

Okay I'm good no more crying, but then SIKE I'm gonna make it worse for you. Here's Joel pouring his whole fucking heart out:

"We made it as far as KC- she saved my life there, from another kid. she had to shoot him to save me. because I was too slow and too fuckin' deaf hear him comin'. And I saw a man kill his own brother to save her while I just watched. and today I thought that dog was gonna tear her apart because it smelled somethin' on her. And all I did was stand there. I couldn't move."

Not even done, Joel continues:

"I was so afraid. I'm not who I was. I'm weak. Lately, there are moments where the fear comes up outta nowhere and my heart feels like it's stopped. and I have dreams every night. I can't remember. I just know that when I wake up I've lost somethin'. I'm failin' in my sleep. It's all I've ever done is fail her again and again."

AND HE'S NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT ELLIE!! SARAH TOO!!

Writers: "WAIT YOU THOUGHT I WAS DONE? HA NOPE! THERE'S MORE!"

"Do you give a shit about me or not?"

"Of course, I do."

Then he leaves and we're given a flashback of Sarah when she was little, and they were decorating for Christmas? SHUT UP NOBODY FUCKING TOUCH ME!!

Meanwhile, I'm still sobbing as Joel and Ellie have a cute scene together and he's teaching her to shoot.

*deep breaths* I think it's safe now... (maybe)

Snaps the hunter's neck, "There's my Joel. There's my man."

"I can't fuckin' do this without you."

Shit, I'm tearing up again... what the hell man?! I've played this game and it's like I'm experiencing it for the first fucking time!

[gay-mooshrooms]

Finale

I have to post my thoughts on the finale or I will lose my mind. Having the episode start with Anna, and having her played by Ashley was one of the best decisions in the show. The symbolism of Ellie's mother being played by the person who first brought the character to life is fantastic and I thought her performance was incredible. And then having the intro be just across the entire series, making us relive everything we've all gone through, and seeing how their relationship has progressed was such a good choice. And then, once we meet back up with Ellie and Joel, we see him, for the first time in 20 years, truly being a dad. We can assume Ellie hasn't told him everything, but he knows something is wrong because he knows her. So he tries to cheer her up, finding food she said she liked, showing her a board game he knows she'll beat him in, keeping up conversation and telling her stories, offering to teach her guitar, asking for shitty puns, and finally, opening up to her. Finally talking, really talking about Sarah, the good and the bad. And also telling her the full story of the guy who shot and missed. I cried when I realized what he meant, and when he told her, "It wasn't time that did it", and Ellie realized what that means about her. And then we see the giraffes, and Ellie looking happy again, laughing again. And Joel could not care less about finding a literal giraffe in Salt Lake City, all he cares about is that Ellie looks like her old self again, and he smiles too. And then he tries to offer an alternative, tries to save her again, and tells her that they can turn back and forget everything, but she tells him no. Because she has given so much to get here, they both have, and she doesn't want it to go to waste. But she adds, that once they're done, she'll go wherever he wants, as long as she's with him. So he agrees. And then the fireflies find them. And the first damn thing out of his mouth is "Where's Ellie?" And this is where Marlene should have known that he wasn't gonna let this surgery happen. She tells him he can't see her, that she's being prepared for surgery, and you can see the pieces fall in his brain. And he yells, he cares so much, he just wants to see her. But Marlene won't let it happen. And you can see as he's walking, he will be damned if the world takes away another one of his baby girls. So he fights, and he wins. And I am obsessed with how they shot the hospital sequence. The noise is drowned out, we see shots of his face and how calm it is, and how focused. He only had one goal, and god help any motherf*ckers who stand in his way. And then he reaches Ellie, shoots the doctor, and we know exactly what that means, and the directors know this too. Because as they leave, they focus on the dead man on the ground, as we know just what that means for their future. And Ellie wakes up, and she asks what happens. And Joel lies to her, just like all parents. do because he wants to protect her. And we all know, that deep down, she knows he's lying, but she doesn't press it, at least not yet. And we see him opening up even more about Sarah, before Ellie follows suit, and finally talks about Riley. And then she makes him swear that everything is true, and he lies again, and we can really tell that she knows it. But as he said in the second game, he would do it all over again. Because there was no way in hell, he was going to let her sacrifice herself for a cure that might not even work. And even if it did, it wouldn't have fixed the world. Sure the infected might have caused the world to spiral, but it was the people who made sure it stayed that way. They were the true evil. Whether it be the fascist FEDRA, or twisted people like David, they made sure the world stayed broken, and that wasn't something that a cure could fix. And also, Marlene said that she was sure Ellie would want them to go through with this, then why the hell wasn't she awake, why couldn't she make the choice. If you were so sure she would do what you wanted why didn't you let her. She knew that deep down, Ellie wouldn't want to die.

[keepfight1n]

@infectd asked: ❓+ Why did you lie to me?

ㅤsuddenly the room is too small, his chest too tight. his mouth is dry & he isn't sure he even has the words. certainly doesn't know if he'll be able to get them out. how long could he stay silent before she simply gave up on him? " i . . . lied because ── you deserve more than that. " he swallows the words as he says them, no more than a heavy lump in his throat. " you deserved a choice, and i thought i could give that to you. " flashes of a girl in his arms cowering from the light of an assault rifle morph into the girl before him, unconscious & unknowing. " . . . she didn't get a choice. sarah. and i didn't, uh ── i couldn't save her from that. " the timber of his voice grows uneven.

ㅤ" but i could save you. and i guess i thought maybe you would want all of this if you thought there wasn't anything else. " the lie had once tasted hopeful on his tongue as he watched his lips move in the rearview mirror. now, they just tasted bitter. " i know you wouldn't have chosen this. i do. and i know that it's my fault that you can't have what you want. " she grows blurry in his gaze, and he does his best to blink away the moisture clouding his vision. " i never wanted t ' hurt you, ellie, but i can't lie t ' you again and say that i regret doin' what i did. you matter to me. i know that might not be enough, but . . . i guess i don't have any interest in a better future if you don't get to see it. "

[seabird-bard]

hi hi!!! bored so do you have anything you like want to infodump about? or just send a long post about or want me to research/read/watch/listen to or etc? this ask can take as long as u want or be as long as you want or whatever u want just curious :) can be about absolutely anything!!

hey there!

sooo this is pretty different from what i normally talk about BUT tlou hbo has reignited my hyperfixation on it and sadly they have taken over my brain once again. aaand i kind of feel like people are misinterpreting the core of the story at the moment, so. full ramble below the cut and yes i will be spoiling absolutely everything (including the next season, but i'll mark that part with a warning) so i am very sorry tumblr user hazmatazz if you can't read this now but. i NEED to get this off of my chest.

right off the bat, i'm going to get to the main thing: joel's lie.

a lot of what i'm about to explain is best summarized with the bts the making of clips that are shown at the end of look for the light but i feel a very deep need to spell this out for some of you.

NO ONE IN THIS SITUATION IS RIGHT OR WRONG!!!

and this is a running theme that i'm definitely going to get back to later because that's another main thing with tlou as a whole.. they tend to create very morally grey, not-right not-wrong characters, and that's on purpose. a large part of this story as a whole is to show how people (and humanity in a lot of cases) would react if we were put into these situations.

which leads us right back to what joel did.

the last of us offers this already very damaged, very broken person a really visceral, hard decision. and i feel like people are forgetting that these experiences, him losing sarah and tess and the promise he made to tess.. all of that shapes his decision to save ellie and protect her.

like (i believe it was, i don't have the time to check--) craig mazin said at the end of look for the light, a lot of tlou1 is about the deep, unconditional love of a parent. he was essentially offered to save his adoptive daughter or save humanity.

just think about his situation for a second. if you had this person that you loved like family, and you had to choose saving them over a world that is already long gone, would you? because i know i would, and i'm sure there are a lot of people that would agree with me.

and then there's ellie.

throughout the first part, ellie has this strange sort of, for lack of a better term, "chosen one" complex, where she has this mindset that's like, "okay, i have this really special, probably rare thing, and there's no one else like me, as far as we know. what can i do with that?" and her first answer is always to use it. the show takes this another step further in a small way when she tries to save sam, but it doesn't work, which is some pretty rough foreshadowing, but i'm getting off-topic.

ellie wants her immunity to mean something bigger, to be something greater than just something that can only stop her from getting infected. she wants to save and help people, because she couldn't save rylie or tess or sam, and she's watching all of these people die around her, and she can't do anything. so, obviously, when she finds out there's a chance she can change that, she's going to want to tak eit. and even more so, she's going to get hurt when joel, this person she loves and cares a lot about, stops that from happening on purpose and lies to her face about it.

they both have their reasons. does that make joel a little selfish, in some ways? maybe. but talk to any parent you know, and they would do the same thing. sometimes, when it comes to stuff like this, people can be inherently selfish. it doesn't mean that they're bad people, though.

you could argue for both sides here, and that's what makes all of this so complicated. ellie is a bordering-on-suicidal fourteen year old girl who wanted her immunity to mean something for other people, too. joel just wanted to keep her around and let her live a somewhat fulfilling life. you could also say that fedra wouldn't allow the vaccine to be distributed, or that the fireflies are liars or that maybe the fireflies were just trying to help, and you'd be right on all accounts. it is just too difficult to call either of these people wrong for getting upset and doing what they did.

season two spoilers start here!

i also sort of want to elaborate on that thing i said earlier about tlou and its characters, because i know for a fact we're going to have the same fights we got when tlou2 came out once season 2 is out, and i want to clear some stuff up right now before i lose my mind. yes, this is tangential. i do not care at all lmao

if you can forgive joel and tommy for all of the shitty things they've done, hell, if you can forgive ellie for what she does in part 2, then you can absolutely forgive abby, too. and if you don't, you're kind of biased and lack some very important empathy, imo.

let's just look at what these characters do during this conflict completely objectively, for a minute, sticking to the games' canon.(since s2 isn't out yet)

joel kills abby's father, the surgeon that was meant to kill ellie, in order to save her. abby, in turn, once she finds him, kills joel. ellie and tommy, out of pure grief and anger, track abby and her group down and kill all eight of them off one by one. ellie only spares abby once she's the last person standing and has a kid to take care of.

keep in mind, abby literally SPARED ellie and tommy. was this for some pretty harsh reasons? probably. but still. she said it herself, she let them live. she could have killed them at any time in that room, and she made the choice not to.

now, no one other than abby had really laid a hand on joel, other than wrapping that tourniquet around his leg at the very beginning. ellie still wanted them all dead, because they were there, and they helped, and they were friends with abby, and in ellie's eyes, that's crime enough to deserve punishment.

but we still love ellie. we still love tommy. we still root for both of them, because we understand their characters and empathize with them. (which was sort of the point of playing as abby for so long in part 2 but i guess some people just didn't click with that which is fine but ugh. you don't GET ITTTT)

on the outside looking in, abby really isn't any worse than either of them. you may even argue that she's better. but that's one of the driving themes of the games, and the story as a whole. no one is good or bad, we're all just people with separate motivations that intersect in bad ways.

spoilers end here!

i guess that's why i get so frustrated when i see that we're still misunderstanding the conflict between joel and ellie here. there isn't any right or wrong here! they are both just people who care about each other very deeply, and sometimes, because of that, they get hurt. if we're going to keep doing this i am begging you all not to watch season two. you're just going to get pissed off again.

[romeoandjulietyouwish]

heyyy! im in my first semester at uni and super missing my family. i would love if you could write something fluffy with joel and ellie (if you want to, no pressure) :) (btw im so happy you reopened ur fic prompts!)

aw of course <3 this turned out a more hurt and comfort than fluff but it's me what did you expect XD

"Ellie!" Joel calls, opening the back door to shout out to Ellie's room. It's getting dark now, the sun just setting behind the trees, casting the sky in beautiful shades of purple. Fireflies already flit about the yard lazily. "Come on, kiddo! Dinner!"

When she doesn't respond, Joel sighs and jogs off down the steps. He knocks a few times on the door, "Ellie, come on." When there's still no response, Joel tries the handle. It swings open and Joel peeks his head inside. On the bed, he sees an Ellie sized lump turned away from him with the blankets drawn over her head.

"You alright, sweetheart?" He asks softly, walking in and quietly shutting the door behind him. He walks over to the side of the bed and sinks down around her knees. "Ellie? Talk to me, baby girl."

"I don't feel good," she says, her voice muffled by the blankets. "Go away, I'm fine."

Joel chuckles a little, "Those are two different sentences there. Which on is it?"

"Go away," Ellie decides.

"You see, I'm not going to do that. You don't leave kids alone when they're hurting," he tells her.

Ellie sits up, throwing the blankets away and glaring at him. "I'm not a kid, Joel." Her sharp tone is cut by the fact that her cheeks are wet with tears. In their time together Joel has learned that when Ellie gets sad, she gets upset to hide it. So instead of rising to the bait, he just gives her a sympathetic smile.

"I know you're not a kid, but you're my kid," he tells her, squeezing her ankle. "And I'm here for you."

"Why?" Ellie asks quietly, pulling her knees to her chest. "Literally everyone else I know has given up on me or abandoned me or died in front of me. I'm a fuck up, Joel, I couldn't save fucking anyone. Why do you want me?"

Joel sighs and glances down at his hands. "Ellie-"

"Do you just keep me around because I remind you of your dead daughter?" Joel looks up and meets Ellie's eyes, seeing the immediate regret on her face and a worrying flash of fear. "I-I'm sorry, I didn't mean that-"

"You did," Joel says, keeping his voice even, "and it's alright. Look at me, Ellie." He waits until she does before he continues. "I look after you because you're my kid, not by blood but that doesn't matter. I love you, Ellie, I'm not going to leave you."

"It would be easier if you did," Ellie tells him. "Then I wouldn't have to wait for you to give up."

"Oh." Joel's heart aches for Ellie. She's been through so much in her short life and he only knows a fraction of it. "Oh, Ellie..." He moves forward, giving her time to push him away, but she doesn't. She allows him to pull her into his arms. Ellie so small, smaller than Sarah was at her age, Joel holds her close, feeling her cry against his chest.

"I'm not going to give up on you, baby girl," Joel whispers to her. "You are so goddamn important to me. There is no way in hell I am ever going to let me go."

"You can't say that shit and not mean it," Ellie tells him.

"I mean it more than anything," Joel assures her. He kisses the top of her head and then holds her at arms length so he can see her face. "It's you and me against the world, kiddo."

"I like the sound of that," she says, wiping her eyes with her sleeves.

"Do you like the sound of dinner?" Joel prompts. "I made red beans and rice."

"Yeah." Ellie's voice is small, childish in a way she usually isn't.

"Come on then." Joel helps her to her feet and keeps an arm around her shoulders all the way inside.

Later that night, with a movie playing on the tv, Joel looks down at Ellie. She's tucked under his arm, fast asleep with her cheek on his chest. A knitted blanket is tucked over her legs, one that was gifted to her by someone in town. He thinks of the little girl he met almost two years ago with her nervous eyes, always ready to sling a punch.

Now she's cuddled up next to him, she's safe, she's warm, and she's home. He'll take care of her. Any doubts he had are now long gone, a fleeting memory. She is his kid. There's no changing that now.

[ranna-alga]

I think about this conversation between Ellie and Tommy in TLOU2 a lot, particularly this line, because what if it was Ellie that died instead of Joel?

(Disclaimer: this text will make absolutely zero sense probably since I put very little thought into it and there are likely some plot holes. You can choose to dislike it or not but this is all hypothetical so let me have my depressingly whimsical wonders here)

Imagine it this way: Joel's death scene pretty much plays out the same way as it does canonically, except that the roles are reversed: Joel is the one who is pinned down and forced to watch Ellie be brutally murdered in front of him. Perhaps, in whatever way, Abby's group discover that she's The Immune Girl™ that Joel killed almost the entire Saint Mary's hospital for - the reason why Abby's father was murdered. If she's here, and is still as close with Joel as Abby may assume, then he couldn't be that far (say that members of the group saw Joel and Ellie moving together for a while before taking separate directions for whatever reason or something). The plan was to originally kill Joel, but Abby can't help but think: why do they get to live a picture-perfect life with each other as father and daughter, when he was the one who robbed me and my actual father of that life and she was the reason my father was in that position in the first place? How can he commit the sin and live without consequence after? Knowing that Joel would be looking for Ellie, the attack on her would start and continue even when Joel finds her and is made to watch - a sort of 'you took away the thing I cared about the most in this world, so now I will do the same to you and make you feel the pain I felt' message to Joel from Abby.

This would have been the second time he watched his daughter die. The second time he lost the one thing he lived for. The second time he's failed - as a protector, as a survivor, as a father. He had only four years with her, two of which was lost due to her anger towards him for what he did at Salt Lake City. And only the night before her murder did she confide in him about possible forgiveness, only for that to be taken from him? For her to be taken from him? After everything he did for her to ensure her safety, even if it meant the cost of her trust in him. Every part of him that died alongside Sarah was brought back to life slowly but surely thanks to this girl who stole his heart in only one year after two decades of being an empty shell of violence and resentment towards the world and himself.

His biggest fear came true - losing Ellie, failing her too - and it happened right in front of his eyes, just like Sarah.

Remember when it was heavily implied that both Tommy and Joel had a very violent and vicious past during the early years of the apocalypse where they were their darkest selves? Joel would have likely reverted back to that in this scenario. Absolutely nobody in Seattle will be safe. That man would turn that militarised city into a fucking ghost town, no doubt about it.

As for Tommy... Would he have been the same? Would he also want vengeance for Ellie as much as Joel did? Or would the pain of having another niece die + watching his brother descend into bloodlust and resentment again be simply too much to bare? Could he tolerate losing his brother and not get him back this time ever again?

It took twenty years after Sarah's death to find solace in life thanks to Ellie. He can't wait another twenty for another one - he can never go back, never again. He failed to save the lives of those he cared for (Sarah, Tess, Sam/Henry) and he feared the same for Ellie. But at least they made it into Jackson, their new home, alive and safe. But now? What more does he have to live for? How much more stronger would his self-hatred become for failing again and again and again where he can no longer see the light Ellie brought to him?

Knowing now that the surgeon he killed was Abby's father, he probably thinks it was an error to kill him instead of just knocking him out so that this WLF ambush costing Ellie's life wouldn't happen. But one thing he's certain he doesn't regret? Dooming humanity of a cure, because taking both of his daughters away from him proved Joel's decision to save Ellie from the Fireflies: to him, humanity didn't deserve to be saved, not anymore.

TLDR; I may be aromantic asexual but I'm still a proud Joel Miller simp who loves the thought of Joel in the bloody Santa Barbara appearance Ellie had in the canon TLOU2. No shame.