#how u gonna decide that some queer ships are acceptable bc YOU ship them but draw the line when it’s something you’ve never seen before

[lokiiied]

weird fucking reblog but okay lol.

[whitetrashjj]

crying my eyes out at your MLA format essays cuz not every queer storyline in media has to be rooted in angst of coming out. i get some of the points you’re trying to make. i also don’t think the show is queerbaiting but jjpope had just as much “evidence” as jiara had. like please explain why jj was so keen on kiara liking john b just cuz she kissed him on the cheek and then went and kissed pope’s cheek?…. like in jj’s mind a cheek kiss means liking someone and he did that to pope. also there ARE shots of jj’s lingering gaze towards pope lets us not lie here lmao. i get that you’re sick of people calling u homophobic i dont think u are for not shipping jjpope i also dont think the show is queerbaiting at all but you go on about “storytelling povs” and “lack of critical thinking” when YOUR critical thinking is literally biased as hell 😭 u can ship jiara all u want but jj and kiara, ESPECIALLY KIARA, are both very much queer coded and if u gonna say they’re not bc of some cheesy sTorYtELLiNg bullshit that u probably learned from a youtube video then you’re just biased to your ship.

You know why I have to write those 'essays'? Cause I get asks like this that brush over a bunch of different topics and I want to make sure I not only address every part of it but also make sure I'm making my pov very clear so I don't have people misinterpreting what I say - even though they still do - or accuse me about random bitching without and reasons or justification. Anyway get ready to do some crying cause you are getting another essay.

I know not every queer storyline has to be rooted in the angst of coming out. I wish there were more that weren't. It's the reason I loved booksmart so much. It's one of the reasons I love Dare Me, because that show had sapphic leads and while their relationship was at the core of the show. It wasn't the fact that they were queer that was focused on. Oh god I could rant about Dare Me forever.

Now my point with JJ and Pope is that we don't get the impression that the boys are currently out as queer. JJ from the start was set up as a bit of a womaniser, a bit girl mad - it would have been very easy to make that gender neutral if he was bi, as I headcanon. With Pope it's the same, I personally view him as gay, but if he was bi/pan it would have been easy to show him like that as we see him attempting to flirt on two occasions. Now this isn't to say that in future seasons they can switch it up as if it was always canon, like they did with Clarke in the 100. My point however, isn't to say that JJ and Pope releasing their sexualities and feelings has to be filled with angst, the example I gave can very easily be played a bit cutely - even if they do address the internalised homophobia that I'm just sure would effect a character like JJ - but just that based on my experiences as a queer person and what I know to be experiences of others that it would realistically play out differently to how it would with a m/f couple. Even then when to comes to friends to lovers in general the removal of physical intimacy when that tension starts to build out of awkwardness is common, it doesn’t play out the same way that ships like JB and Sarah do in which they increase in physical intimacy. 

I didn't bring jiara into this. I didn't go out comparing jjpope and their interactions to jiara, I was simply speaking to how jjpope's relationship was portrayed. In terms of 'evidence' I am more than aware the jiara wasn't written to be a developing romance, anything there was created by what the fans saw and choices made by the editors. But it is also a canon fact that at the very least JJ is attracted to Kie, that all the pogues 'kinda have a thing for her' and that he has 'tried' something with her. Even if the intention of those things wasn't to build to a relationship - they did happen and that's not up for interpretation. I'm not gonna bring up the 'did you tell JJ?' thing cause it still confuses the hell out of me.

The thing with the cheek kisses is that it's not the action in itself that made it a romantic thing. A handshake can build romantic tension when framed that way but that doesn't make every hand shake in that piece of media suddenly romantic, make sense? If you compare the two scenes we have the build up of Kie walking up to John B, a close up of a lingering cheek kiss, the pull back with lingering looks and then the reactions of others who have observed it and picked up on something. It frames it as a significant moment with slow beats. That's how you build romantic tension. With the JJPope one it just flows past it, JJ pulls back from the hug, a quick peck on the check and a 'love you too man' with a smirk and pat on the check. We don't even have a second of Pope's reaction to it. Do you see what I mean?

You can love that moment as a shipper. I mean it's a great moment that really highlights their dynamic. To you it's a dynamic that you see and think oh this would play out so well romanticly, it's a dynamic I see and think oh I love their friendship. Each of those are valid reactions. But it isn't a moment that has been intentionally framed to build romantic tension and suggest a budding relationship.

Darl, I swear to god if I was coming to you with my shipping bias' this would be a very different conversation. I know I will always have them and I will lean into them when I'm on vc with shes, theys and gays and we are getting lost in headcanons but I do my best take a step back when I talk about these things here because I've been in fandoms when you have two extremes and no one relents and it's awful, I don't want to create that space. And once again, I did not bring jiara into this. My original post was not a comparison to jiara.

I am very curious about your perspective on queer coding here. Because yes, JJ has chaotic bi energy and I will die on this hill. But I do not see how he has been queer coded. Other than people seeing a man being physically affectionate with another men and insist that can't be platonic. As with Kie I can see it more, not for a second do I believe that what went on with Kie and Sarah was straight. And I desperately want to see Maddie play Kie as pan to rep her own very underrepresented sexuality! And in terms of how she's written, stuff like being an astrology bitch and environmentalist scream queer to us, I do think it is important to note that the writers of the show being who they are would necessarily have the same impression of what a queer womans traits would be. In regards to that scene in ep 1 where they have the hot touron girl and then JJ, JB and Kie all perking up and doing the nod thing? I don't think anyone has a straight explanation for that.

The 'sTorYtELLiNg bullshit that u probably learned from a youtube video' comment made me laugh cause it reminds me of this guy I had a fight with on the weekend over Remus and Sirius being queer and he decided to undermine my argument by saying 'just because you read it on reddit doesn't make it true' which... yike. Any way, maybe you do but I don't have the tolerance to sit down and watch a youtube video on someone analysing a show. All my interpretations come from years of writing actual essays analysing elements and themes in media. As well as having a keen interest in direction and editing, so I pay a lot of attention to those things and you start to notice patterns. In terms of credentials I don't have any but I do think these 'essays' do an alright job of me not only explaining my interpretation but why. Because I'm not someone to just say things and expect that to just be accepted or think that is makes it true.

[blahrutocs]

i redesigned casey and now i kinda ship him w/ sal..... i’ve been Developing him a bit too and this is what ive come up w,

sal and casey would be a cute couple imo.... they'd probably butt heads at first, bc casey butts heads with Everyone at first by nature, and he's really argumentative naturally whereas sal is kind of Nervous around new people, but like... sal can find the good in anyone, which is somethin' i think casey would need, because he's not good at expressing the good in himself!!then they probably found some middle ground......... sal has a very calming presence, i think, he's a very Sweet person and people like being around him a lot........ but he'd definitely be someone who wouldn't judge him or say anything cruel, he always puts a lot of time and consideration into the people around him and i think that'd be something very good for my boy, cause then he could also just....Develop a good and nice friendship with sal!! they probably became real close real quick and it....confused everyone, i bet!! casey probably gets frustrated sal doesn't tend to Value himself as much as he should and doesn't really stand up for himself. i feel like casey is.....Very Open about finding Sal attractive but just not in front of sal, like he's casually just like "hey, how is that man single when he looks like a literal god, jw. askin for a friend" and everyone in the groups like..........hey man do u wanna date sal? kinda sounds like you wanna date sal,

Casey is secretive to No One, except for Sal...................whenever Sal is around he clams up! He ain't gonna say nothing gay in front of that boy (who he would totally smooch if he offered tbh) i picture casey being like, that one kid w/ no friends who watches anime and decides he's gonna learn japanese........

Casey draws Anime in his sketch book which he shows to no one except friends, and also hates being asked to draw someone because he thinks its totally uncool (he'd probably draw sal if he asked though) he's probably pretty good by now since.......Not havin friends gives you time to work on stuff!! I think he'd be interested in animation to some extent, too!! casey is also a photographer and has a degree in filmaking....I Imagine him RLY wanting to take pics of sal but being too shy to ask, also he puts timers so he doesn't like sal's selfies too quickly bc he Doesn't Want to Look TOO gay. he probably flirts with sal a bit but makes sure it's mild and sounds like a joke!! sal has.......No Idea, honestly, he's just like.....Totally clueless to it, I mostly picture sal as having........ Self esteem Resembling a rollercoaster and sometimes he'll be like "YES I AM GOOD AND PEOPLE LIKE ME" other times he's like "me? i am a garbage rat and i come from the sewers, my truest home," so has a hard time really Believing people like him, For Some Reason, casey probably lowkey wants to confess but doesn't know how, he's also probably mildly terrified he's gonna make sal uncomfortable bc he really values the friendship and.....Doesnt wanna Gay It Up if it's not needed,  i kind of think casey's probably had a few friendships that...........Didn't pan out, bc they found out he was gay and got very Weird about it, and he probably tries to......Not Replicate that, despite sal being Very considerate..... he singlehandedly organized a gsa in highschool and then also planned their Queer Prom almost Completely by himself...........  he's like, the last person in the world who would be unkind to casey about something like that!! 

  Casey is just a nervous boy who often worries about being Accepted, even by other Very Gay folks...........he's probably a lil nervous about like, intimacy and stuff. doesn't like being touched without being explictly asked.......

he had a casual relationship with riley but riley is.............Very chill, so i think it wouldn't be too unpleasant for him.............. casey probably doesn't like not being the one in control though!! it works out bc sal is kind of uncomfy w/ sex in general and demisexual......... he's not adverse to it but it does make hm nervous!!   

he animates sometimes in his freetime, i think, he has.......Lots of free time, lbr, his  parents are both like...... Doctors, so he doesn't worry that much about Money or anything! and tries to fill his spare time with...... Whatever, really, he pobably has a few weird skills he never talks about,

mitch was probably casey's first real friend... he and riley didn't know eachother very well by the time riley dropped out, but he and mitch both stayed and finished college, so they probably became pretty good friends!! mitch stayed in touch with riley, so by extension so did casey. otherwise casey probably would've been too insecure to put any effort into the connection.

he’s kind of typically “flamboyant.” snarky. will not take any shit. he’s a photographer, he has a degree in filmmaking and enjoys it a lot. very secretive, doesn’t really share any personal details with people. pretty judgemental. will comment on your outfit if he thinks it’s bad or like… straight up laugh at your opinion sometimes. he can win arguments but……Often Unintentionally hurts feelings doin so!!

he secretly likes people more than he lets on he’s just….Super bad at socializing because he’s like inherently argumentative and cant turn it off. he was also not a popular kid, he moved to a new town and was really chubby  and people were just… not nice to him. he was v self conscious ab it!! hes Very New to friendships!! his first real friend was when he was an adult already.  he’s got a lot of softness inside of him!! 

OTHER FACTS...........

*casey self harms, he’s not proud of it but doesn’t hide it either.......

*he’s been diagnosed w/ adhd and anxiety but...... Does Not Believe He has either of those things

*constantly on the defense

*doesn’t have a good relationship w/ his parents but..........Doesn’t really bother fighting w/ them, they’re not the nicest but he just.Gnuinely doesnt care anymore.

* he and sanchez dont have the best relationship,casey’s theory is its bc he used to be fwbs with riley and Was Not at all subtle about it but like…. when he first meets sanchez he comments how he thought he’d be taller, and then immediately follows it up with “Btw, i fucked your bf.”

i’ll add more to this later................. also if anyone read this whole thing what would be a good ship name for them cause i got,.......No clue