#i guess this is what homophobia and m*leven do to a person

[andcenterfolds]

Sums what I feel about Byler detractors (the GA and M*levens) lmao

[paladibun]

personal gay/bi mike ramblings & other late night thoughts //

Been thinking about how I relate way more to gay Mike as a bi dude rather than to bi Mike. (This isn’t whos interpretation is right or anything) I’ve seen the post that was like both gay byler would portray different experiences under one label and show that no label outright owns a specific experience. A bi Mike’s arc would be more about choices in relation to others with less introspection and a gay Mike’s arc would explain internal turmoil and self depreciation in relation to a queer identity and the need to hide it, which would require more of it . And ofc gay people don’t own this flavor of experience but in Mike’s case would explain his actions if under that lense for me personally. Also noticed the later headcanon is more prevalent for those with a bigger Mike bias than Will which is interesting.

Also thinking about what a mess or I guess how much ambiguity there is in both Will & Mike’s characterization when it comes to their relation to their sexualities which ultimately causes people to develop strong opinions and get angry when people get their arcs or dynamics wrong. The thing is that the Duffers like ambiguity - it gives them freedom and they also don’t like to state things outright when it comes to identities and very important sociopolitical issues while trying to be “realistic” /half-neg ( ex: Karen & Nancy talking about feminism without mentioning women, the way Robin’s coming out was handled without mentioning any gay words while the show is comfortable using homophobic words )

Anyway almost got heated on a completely separate topic.

It is sometimes confusing as to what is meant to be presented as a “Will Arc” and a “Mike Arc” On the one hand Will struggles from overt homophobia from others and from Lonnie growing up, on the other hand he has Joyce, Jonathan, Mike, and the party who adore him and while I doubt Will understands that they would accept him no matter what, there’s definitely an earlier self acceptance in his identity as a hyper-visible gay man(you can see it with the Turing Project & the bravery with the painting). I define internalized homophobia as “a set of complex contradicting behaviors based on society’s homophobia and heteronormative pressures” and some people define it as “being sad that people are being homophobic to someone” I think both Will and Mike have degrees of both and sometimes it’s hard to see how much of either both characters have. And for Mike, it solely depends on how you read his sexuality thus explaining his actions and feelings. Again, it is vague which I think is humanizing and realistic.

I won’t touch the dynamics topic until the tag evolves beyond late stage fandom spoon/fork binarization of gay relationships but just noting that aspect of byler isn’t void of complexity.

One last thought for the night:

Just looking at the fandom and noticing unfortunate patterns. Mainly the desire to be right above all else and largely at the expense of collective fun and creativity which is like the main point of fandom. I think it comes mostly from having to fight the GA and m*levens to prove we aren’t crazy (insert Joyce Byers gif here) a year ago and that mentality sticking for way too long. Like the desire to to defend your thoughts and feel your feelings strongly about a topic is amazing and is another big fandom driver but at some point people getting angry for fanon, headcanons, people having fun making things in a way that isn’t popular loud accounts approved is honestly concerning. I see it a lot from the side I agree with too and it’s like. We can do better right? Not everything needs to be activism tinged?

Anyway anyway thanks for reading this far I’m passing the whole fandom edibles as we collectively rewatch the source material and resetting our very “seeing red at posts we disagree with” adled brains. 💕

[bylerchoseme]

God is a God of a judgment and a holy God. It doesn’t matter what you think is cute or how willing you are to stretch the bounds of what a relationship should be. Homosexuality is a sin. He judges all and sees all and doesn’t care what you think about it. And facts don’t care about your feelings. And even if you take God out of the equation, it’s unnatural/biologically incoherent. Byler will never happen AND it is evil, no matter how cute it looks on the surface. And mike loves El, which he made clear when he said it 8 times. Have fun with your fanfiction though, I guess

Are you the same anon from earlier? It seems like it. I think you are actually. I am so delighted you decided to message me again because I have more things to say to you. Thanks for going out of your way to tell me everything wrong about Byler and same sex genders in general. You must be my biggest fan! :)

God is judging you right now and always for being a homophobic a*sshole. He is judging you for not letting same gender people love their own gender. He is judging you for sending hate messages. He is judging you for not loving everyone regardless of their sexuality. God is judging you for all of the things wrong with you. Do you really want to bring religion into this? Is that a clever and smart idea? Go for it. You’ll lose. I guarantee it. Homosexuality isn’t a sin for your information. Do you know what is a sin? Homophobia is a sin. Your hatred of Queer people is a sin. A sin is what you are. You’re the definition of sin. Take it as you will. I don’t think you’ll ever outgrow your immaturity and ignorance. You are what you preach. Take it however you want. You have serious issues. Maybe seek some help? Keep that in mind. You do need help. If you can’t help yourself, nobody can help you and absolutely no one. God loves everyone. He cares much less what you think. You’re entire paragraph is a lie.

What if I said being gay is the most natural thing in the world? What if I told you being gay is the most beautiful love in existence? What if I said being gay makes more sense than any straight relationship? What then? What will you do about it? I love gay people. I love all LGBTQ people. I am not a toxic hater such as yourself. I am not a miserable person like you. I don’t have the time and patience to judge people for who they love. Love is love. That’s a fact. If you’re not gay, good for you. If you’re not lesbian, good for you. If you’re not bisexual, good for you. If you don’t associate with the LGBTQ community, good for you. We don’t need you. We never have needed and never will need you. Go cry a river.

The more you convince yourself Byler won’t happen, chances are they will happen. Keep lying to yourself. You have two years to do that. Time will fly by in a blink and then you’ll cry and scream because Mike and Will became boyfriends and later husbands. 2024 won’t be a happy time for you. You obviously don’t know love. You can’t comprehend the meaning of true and real love. Mike can say he loves Eleven every second and even then he doesn’t love her. Mike is in love with Will. He loved him before he knew Eleven. He loved him while he was with Eleven. He will love Will after the inevitable M*leven break up. He will love Will when they’re together. Mike will love Will for all of eternity. He will love him in the afterlife. He will love him for a zillion lifetimes.

You’ll find out about Byler the hard way.

Here is Byler in love: