#milgram thought

[minnwaa]

milgram fuuta's thought

honestly tho deco*27 outdid themselves w/ the second round songs so far, because it's so good??? i still cant stop looping fuuta's song until now and it's been HOURS since then. i haven't been listening to anything else please save me

but if there's one thing that i know after listening it THEN re-listening it AND THEN re-listening it, then after analyzing both salamander and the voice drama, i definitely gonna be voting forgiven for fuuta. okay here's why. (even though i know that half of the fandom gonna be voting forgiven for him anyway lmao)

salamander is essentially a song about loving something that hurts you, got addicted to the taste of it even though it might harm you or cause you pain. it's also mentioned in the song that you can find ways to make it less painful, but you'll be definitely "eating" or consuming it anyway. it's literally in the song,

Ouch! That was hot getting burned from living too fast It’s a bit annoying because I can’t handle too much hot food I want it on repeat, I want a spicy treat Can I get seconds? One more time!! I want to burn bright red

do you know why the song used salamander? it's because salamander cannot actually stand the heat, it's basically a myth because they liked to sleep in damp logs used in camping. they will actually die when burned because they need the mucus on their skin to survive, but salamanders can survive the heat when forced, not because they like the heat or because they are fireproof. so the singer, the speaker, is basically asking a salamander to die for the thing they love, which is the heat. salamanders can regenerate their body part, though, so that's probably the reason why the singer was confused why a salamander wouldn't like the heat even though it's probably going to survive when it can regenerate its cells. but it will still be painful. but they're going to survive anyway.

then like, we have backdraft. the last part of the song, the rap part, got me really interested, right? because holy shit that is a lot of words at once.

"Oh no, surrounded, lynched by the masses Moribund, that's all from me, reporting from the ground Bust out, explode that counter uppercut Tolerate, impress those spectators Alight, enmeshed, their eyes closing in Dodging seems impossible Bust out, explode that counter uppercut Swallowing me whole, can't douse this FIRE"

also @ milgram it's not, moribound, it's moribund,

moribund definition:

so taking what we know from salamander, we know that fuuta was probably building a habit to enjoy the thing that harmed him. from bring it on, we know that he's chronically online so that's probably what he can't stop enjoying. he knew that it was wrong and harmed him too, but at this point, he's addicted and can't stop. he's at the front line and center, even when he's half dead (not sure if it's like him being real almost dying or metaphorical social death) he can't stop because he had to "impress" the spectators. he was "lynched by the masses" probably means that he was peer-pressured to be the leader, to be the hero (callback to bring it on) but then thrown away and judged when all gone to shit.

which led me to my third point, onigiriico made a translation of the voice drama which you totally should read by yourself because i am in pain and i am biased for him fucking sue me

anyway

he had a good point, which is why was he the one being punished when it's not just him who bullied this person. he only said what's wrong is wrong and what's a sin is a sin, then probably triggered a wave of bullying. fuuta might be a person who has a big following, so he might feel like he's a hero because people do listen to him, people followed him, so it's the eyes that followed him. but one thing is for sure, he felt guilty for what he did, and he didn't know what he did would impact the other person this badly. what he needed wasn't getting beaten up, he's just so fucking chronically online dude. he needs THERAPY.

(at this point who in milgram doesn't need it. probably yuno)

so yes, i will vote forgiven. because it's not about the matter of him being innocent or not. let me be clear, i don't think he's innocent in anyway. bullying is a serious matter and what he did was wrong. but he's sorry and he felt guilty for what he did. (even when he said that he's not in the wrong but he obviously is, lmao kid) he probably wanted to stop but wasn't allowed to by his peer and his addiction, but now he knows how fatal his action is.

so in my eyes, he's forgiven.

[kiryuing]

[rhinoyo]

*shakes my art folder and a thousand mlgrm drawings fall out* hm. here you go <3

[linabirb]

milgram season 1 and season 2 mv art style comparison!

[theelusivelotus]

"Hey... why don't you listen to me...?" "I'm telling you..." "Hey..." "HEY, I'M TALKING TO YOU"

[clownsalot]

kirisaki shidou is the normalest doctor ever who has committed zero crimes. i would trust him with my life i would put my life in his only mildly suspicious gloved hands

oh yea and his delusion tax cover is a banger

[throw-down-enjoyer]

Kirisaki Shidou………………..

[speeshularts]

He's soft, like mashed potato

[blueepink07]

Yuno: her struggling relationship with autonomy

(character analysis)

One aspect I have always loved about media characters is their attempt to be perceived as mature, despite their young age. Some succeed, others struggle to hide what they see as their childish side.

Yuno is no different in this context and I'm surprised that people don't talk about it enough.

Beginning with her age 18, it's truly a controversial age, if I may say. It's a confusing age, because you are technically considered an adult, but, at the same time, your mind is not fully developed to actually be one. In the end, you are still a child at heart and mind, despite the fact that you are legally an adult.

We don't know much of her home life and honestly I don't think it would do any good for me to make assumptions, since it's pointless in the long run and it would just lose credibility. However, one thing it's for sure based on Yuno's actions. She desires autonomy.

Yuno: Despite that, you arbitrarily assumed things about me and sympathized with me. Even though all I did was make a rational decision of my own free will.

I'm the one who chose, let you and you and you all in ~🎵

She highlights quite a lot with these phrases… She chose for herself, she is an adult who willingly decided to partake in compensated dating. Being called naive or innocent, two words that usually are used to describe little children, surely infuriated her… and she shows it.

It's funny now that I think about it. Fuuta also has the same problem, but his reactions are more childish, in the end, not doing him any justice. However, Yuno is no different. Of course, she does it in a more subtle manner, but she really does get worked up quite a lot when it comes to her being perceived more as a teenager than an adult. Her whole song it's literally about this idea. Yuno being infuriated that she is infantilized by the audience, making a sad backstory for her so they can dismiss the idea that there wasn't necessarily a big factor that provoked her to partake in compensated dating, but it's only her own free will.

I might add that the compensated dating itself is a way for Yuno to feel that she has more autonomy and she no longer needs to be treated as a child.

"An adult is a human or other animal that has reached full growth.[1] The biological definition of the word means an animal reaching sexual maturity and thus capable of reproduction." ~ wikipedia

Moreover, even the media promotes the fact that sexual content should strictly be watched by adults. And Yuno does end up having sex during some of these dates…

And if this idea isn't convincing enough… I think that Yuno likes to partake in compensated dating, because she knows the clients don't consider her a child. They are interested in her, in a way that makes Yuno feel satisfied with herself (at least, for a short period of time, when she is in their presence) she feels grown up and mature. She also receives money for her services, providing her with enough financial resources for Yuno to consider that she finally managed to complete one of the first steps of adulthood, to be financially stable.

Doing something that is not really socially accepted, again, can be considered as autonomy, because you do not follow the same rules that the society obligs. Yuno knows how compensated dating is perceived, but she still does it, because she thinks this action provides her "warmth".

The "warmth" that Yuno speaks about is a vague term to describe her desires. Based on her interactions, I would like to think that this term refers to genuineness and mutual understanding. Yuno, in the first VD, describes the society as being a place where "everyone eats each other". People need to point fingers at others who made a mistake, who did something that's not socially accepted to make themselves feel better.

Yuno: That’s right. You know those people who just wanna convince themselves, so they intrude in other people’s affairs even though it’s not their place—I despise them. That’s what I was saying. They only do that to make themselves feel better, don’t they? Those people don’t actually end up doing anything.

And you know what is interesting? The fact that Yuno finds more closure being in the company of some murderers. Why? Because they can also be considered some outcasts of the society that she pretty much dislikes.

Es: However, it also explains why you’ve given up. About yourself, human beings, even the whole of society, you’ve realised everything—that’s why your expression is so cold.

Teenagers usually have little power in our society. They can achieve great things, but have to go through more hardships due to the limited freedom. They need an adult to actually help them. That’s just how society is built.

Yuno's distaste for the society can explain why she has grown so fast, or, at least, thinks that she has matured enough. She was tired of the society inflicting on her rules that she, as a simple teenager, had to oblige. So, going into Milgram, starting to hear people crafting a sob backstory for Yuno, treating her like a child, despite the fact she has already done a few steps in order to sustain herself financially and emotionally as a young adult, it's truly insulting.

Es: This is just popular belief, but the law is also something the people have decided. There’s nothing, which can satisfy every single human being, now is there?

Yuno: That’s right.

However, even after all these, that doesn't mean she doesn't actually struggle with this new found autonomy that she craves.

I actually think that this autonomy is the cause of most of her suffering.

As I stated before, compensated dating is something that she decided to partake in, in order to prove her independence. She thinks that what she has chosen for herself is healing, helping her. But, if it's that the case, then why do we have these scenes?

It's difficult to admit that one of your decisions was actually… Quite wrong. Especially, when it's one of your first one's as an official adult, in the very first stage of your life when you finally have enough independence.

“Cognitive dissonance is what we feel when the self-concept — I’m smart, I’m kind, I’m convinced this belief is true — is threatened by evidence that we did something that wasn’t smart, that we did something that hurt another person, that the belief isn’t true,” said Carol Tavris, a co-author of the book “Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me).”

She added that cognitive dissonance threatened our sense of self.

To reduce dissonance, we have to modify the self-concept or accept the evidence,” Ms. Tavris said. “Guess which route people prefer?”

So which one does Yuno prefer? To convince herself that what she is doing makes her happy.

Yuno: Despite that, you arbitrarily assumed things about me and sympathized with me. Even though all I did was make a rational decision of my own free will.

Yuno: I’m not pitiable. My family gets along super well. And I’m not particularly struggling for money. I decided, of my own free will, to do it because I felt that it was necessary for me.

Sometimes, considering how many times she mentions it, for me it feels like Yuno tries to convince herself that what she is doing is good for her.

But you know what is funny to me?

She is good at making herself enjoyable for others as well as giving somewhat good advice:

Mahiru: My birthday…… the day I was born……But was there really any reason for me being born? Lately I’ve started to wonder that. Do you ever think about stuff like that, Yuno-chan?

Yuno: Eh? Not really. I mean, Mahiru-san, you’re really the romantic type, right? Not that I have anything against that. But isn’t it a bit much to think that everything in life has a meaning? If it makes you happy to think like that then go ahead, but if it doesn’t, then isn’t that in itself meaningless?

Mahiru: : ……you might be right. I’ve always just lived my life like this, so I don’t really know.

Yuno: We’ve all just gone through a bunch of things in life that happened to lead us here. It’s nothing more than a coincidence. Definitely not fate or anything. Probably. Even if there isn’t a meaning, you can still be happy that it’s your birthday. That sort of thing’s all you need in life really. So happy birthday, Mahiru-san.

Mahiru: ……no, I’m fine. As long as I don’t move too much I don’t even feel any pain. Sorry for making you worry.

Yuno: Oh, really? That’s good then. Mahiru-san, if there’s anything you want then just ask. It’s not like it’s a huge burden, I can just ask for it along with my own stuff.

Mahiru: Ok…… I’m fine for now. Sorry, for making you worry. Ah, Yuno-chan…… Today’s your birthday, right? Happy birthday.

Yuno: …Haha, thanks. Thank you, but y’know. Is it really ok for you to be saying that to me when you’re in that situation?... you really aren’t suited for Milgram, huh, Mahiru-san.

Amane: What is it… Kashiki Yuno. Don’t sit so close to me. Go away.

Yuno: Sorry for barging in when you’re getting into your worldview thing. But Mahiru-san’s finally managed to get to sleep. Humour me with some small talk while I take a break. By the way, Amane. Have you ever wished you were never born? I’ve thankfully lived a pretty fun life so far, so haven’t really. But you seem to be struggling with something. So I kinda wondered if you thought like that.

Amane: ……I don’t think that. Being born into this world is the first miracle any person experiences, and is something to celebrate. Even if after birth I was put through trial after trial, the value of that will never disappear.

Yuno: Hmm. Ok…happy birthday, then. It’s good that you were brought into the world, I guess.

But Yuno has a big, and I mean a BIG tendency to self-destruct, not intentionally.

Wanting to be independent comes with its own downfalls. At the beginning of the trial, Jackalope states that Yuno has distanced herself from social interactions. So much so, that we have never seen her actually confiding to someone else, in any of the portal timeline translations. She might have her reasons, either minimizing her problems, and using her energy to help the ones she deems to have worse than her, or, this is simply her nature to bottle up her own sadness. This again might also be the cause of her wanting autonomy and proving to herself and others that she is mature enough to manage her emotions.

Not confiding in someone else for a long time can cause depression. Something that Yuno might be struggling with during trial 3 or she is already struggling with it a bit.

Furthermore, it's interesting that Yuno admits disliking behaviors that she deems childish. For example, she doesn't like the way Haruka and Muu behave, because they are ignorant of the problems in prison and have a really childish way of thinking. Amane's hate towards Shidou, might be often wrongly interpreted as a simple child's tantrum. Kotoko's actions, responding with violence to violence, it's again, an aspect often deemed as childish and immature.

Yuno: Really? If you ask me, Kotoko is someone I would never want to make my friend, though. She’s the type who picks a conclusion from the very beginning and won’t actually talk with you.

Yuno: Well, I guess it’s arbitrary who one gets along with. But Mahiru-san in particular is something. I think both her body and mind are at their limits. Also, Mikoto-san was also attacked but apparently it ended up in something of a draw. That guy was strong, huh—how unexpected. Also Haruka and Muu-chan have become kind of bothersome. And additionally, Amane-chan and Shidou-san too, huh.

Lastly, her second MV also shows her desire of autonomy in Milgram, not only through lyrics, but through visuals too.

Beginning with her door, it looks a lot like a medieval castle door.

Her room, the way it is designed, especially the bed and the chair, also resemble a princess' room.

However:

Despite the important role that princesses played in courtly life, they had limited personal freedom. They were often kept under close guard and were rarely allowed to leave the palace or castle where they lived. This was done to protect them from danger and to prevent them from engaging in political activities that might undermine the authority of the king or prince.

Medieval princesses had little to no autonomy most of the time. Their life was dictated from the start, having the only purpose to be betrothed and give birth to children.

That’s why the design choice is intentional. Yuno feels like a princess trapped in her pretty room (the MV is quite claustrophobic, the only outside elements being a few memories), exposed to the world (the many windows imply this), the voices that keep demonizing her.

That’s why the scene where she starts breaking things in her room is so important. It serves as a sign of rebellion, to show that she is not the perfect, helpless princess that people like to portray her as. She is an adult who makes bad or good decisions, who thinks for herself. She is proud of her autonomy and is tired of constantly proving to others that she is not capable of taking care of herself.

[prisoner-000]

also also. remember! Milgram mvs are based on the prisoners' perceptions. It's easy to read Kotoko's stance on the other prisoners from her view on them as pawns, but what does that mean for her, who sees herself as a dangerous beast who kills those lower than her?

Yes, they are lower than her.. But she's still covered in human blood, a genuine monster with sharp teeth and a horrifying appearance. She sees herself how the little girl in orange saw her: A dangerous stranger. She wants to save the world, she wants to erase evil, but she's also afraid of herself and what she's become. She's terrfied of what that means. But it's too late to turn back.

She's going to save everyone even if it costs her her humanity.

[lattescribble]

" Is that so…? Continuing with the treatment…huh… how can you be ‘saved’ just with it… "

" ‘Saved’…??? Are you worrying about me? Somehow, you’re getting kinder now, Futa-kun. Just by thinking in that way, Mahiru would already be ‘saved’. "

[a-star-that-burns-brightly]

Actually, I'm curious Do you guys have any criticisms when it comes to Milgram? Specifically from a writing/storytelling/character perspective, but it can also be about anything.

[asherasgayagenda]

shes connected the dots guys

[shiikiyun]

I think something i don't often see in discussions about Futa's character is how, if you really take a second, he's kind of a people pleaser

He isn't so in a way like what Mikoto got going on, he does want to be around people of the same interests as him, and you wouldn't think he'd care about anything but authenticity if you stayed with the way he behaves on milgram. It is only when you think about him -in- those social circles he manages to get into that you can see him tweaking lol

I think the closest to see this that we have in milgram itself is that one interaction with Kotoko in which she attempts to debate how prisons respect human rights. Any other time he expressed his opinion/stance on things he was aggressive and maybe condescending to the rest because they disagreed with him, but the second someone agreed? Whole demeanor changed. Suddenly he didn't have much to say anymore and he just parroted Kotoko's words back at her. Why. If he has such a strong personality and mindset, why was someone validating his point enough to shut down his otherwise very firm attitude?

Futa doesn't go as far as to manufacture his every word for it to cause a positive reaction on others from the get go, but he does seek validation all the same. He braces himself for rejection by being loud and obnoxious and harsh until he sees a positive reaction and then is when he does a complete 180 to keep the other person in that place of validation. He is simultaneously completely bad at it though, but I never said he was good at people pleasing. Which connects back to what i've said before about his inability to fit in. Even when he thinks he's doing it right and he sees himself getting validation by people he cares about (in the case of his crime, by mimicking his friendgroup's method of "bringing justice" by calling out someone online, that same friendgroup following along and reinforcing the idea that he was doing it right), he ultimately fails anyway and loses it all over again.

In the end, he's just extremely socially awkward and anxious. It isn't in his nature to reach anyone else's expectations even if he genuinely wants to, so he'll either do what he can within his parameters (mold himself for his friendgroup of people he deems similar to him) or he'll avoid trying altogether because he knows he'll fail (what we see in milgram!)

It also shows how his yearn for a support system (t2 qna + mu's birthday timeline convo) isn't particularly new from his current circumstances, or why the only person he could think of when asked who he would want to see right now was his mom (who left so long ago he barely remembers her). He has just never truly had people that genuinely cared for him no matter what he tried to do to make himself likeable.

[red-moon-at-night]

I find it so SO interesting that as soon as Kazui's breaking their marriage vows and revealing his true feelings (literally tearing apart the dove), the wife is already falling off the balcony

Her hair is fluttering in the wind. The apple fucking splatters on the ground this whole sequence is so visceral I'm spinning it around in my mind. Kazui views his truth telling as a violent act, the killing blow.

[nemesisfall]

obligatory pokemon au time!!